IMG_0610.JPG

To Tell the Truth

Several times today Bob Schieffer on “Face the Nation” asked the same question about the Senate intelligence report on torture. I call dibs because I thought of this same question earlier in the week.

How can the Democrats and the Republicans on the same committee look at the same evidence and come to such different conclusions?

What perhaps bothers me more than any “war crimes” we may have committed is the inability to get at the truth. Dick Cheney says the torture report is “crap”. Dianne Feinstein says it’s gospel. Is one of them a liar? Are they both lying?

This seems to be a constant nowadays. It seems that for at least 50% of news stories “reasonable people can disagree”. Maybe I’m nostalgic but I seem to remember a time when there was such a thing as facts. Now we hear stats like the unemployment rate that even I don’t believe and I’m not a crazed conspiracy theorist.

How can we get anywhere when we can’t agree on a basic set of facts?

Postscript: The Strange Parallel Universe of War

In the discussion thread of the previous essay, I suggested that war is by definition illegal. Its primary features are murder and destruction. These acts are illegal in any civilized country and immoral in most religions. But in the context of war you can kill a man if he wears the uniform of the enemy. Nowadays uniforms don’t even matter. If our spies tell us you’re the enemy, we will drone you with zero consequences.

We have “military courts”. If a soldier commits a crime, he’s tried in a military court. We are not talking military infractions such as insubordination. We are talking assault and rape. Just yesterday I saw a story about military sex offenders who never end up in the civilian sex offender registry.

In our discussion of torture we hear people say in the context of post-9/11, torture was “something else”. What context justifies rectal feeding or letting a prisoner die of hypothermia?

All is fair in love and war. When it comes to war, this should send a chill down our spine.

What do you think? The bar is open.

Advertisements

660 thoughts on “To Tell the Truth

  1. When political actors write political reports for political reasons, you get politics, which is usually not the truth.

    All Administrations are guilty of this to a degree, though some–like the current one–has taken it to a new low. I absolutely believe that Obama’s motivation for this report and for releasing it is to throw mud at the past Administration and to deflect from his vast array of failures. If that is the intent starting out–as I believe was and is the case–then the truth plays no role in this. They didn’t speak to a single CIA body–that sho8uld tell you something about the report…

  2. SMH…

    The final speaker, Reverend Jamal Bryant of Empowerment Temple in Maryland, gave a speech and closing prayer laden with political anger and racial overtones.

    “How in the world are we gonna get victory? We don’t have the money of the Koch brothers, we don’t have the backing of the Republican Party. How in the world are we going to find triumphant victory,” he asked. “Why is it that we’re working but Congress is on vacation? How in the world are gonna get justice when families are crying, but it looks like the Senate is just laughing? But we believe the only way that we’re going to prevail is our secret weapon – God has never failed us. And he’s never forsaken us.”

    But Bryant didn’t end there.

    Bryant declared Sunday “Black Solidarity Sunday” and urged the crowd to “go to church wearing black.”

    After that, he said, “I don’t want you to just go to church wearing black. When you leave church still be black. And because Hollywood didn’t get the memo, Jesus is black.”

    As the crowd cheered, Bryant started his prayer:

    Dispatch angels right now of protection around our sons from psychopathic, sociopathic police officers. I pray right now that you will convince prosecutors who have, in fact, given up the law for popularity. We pray that you will disrobe judges who are elected, but have not been appointed by your glory. We’re going to march in 2016 until we have righteous Congress people, righteous Senators, and a righteous President. God, we don’t want just black elected officials, we want a black agenda. We want to make sure that ‘our lives matter’ is not a slogan, but it is a lifestyle. Let us march on. And God, for every person who opposes justice, every person who opposes righteousness, we came to remind them – we know when they are sleep, we know when they’re awake, we know when they been good or bad, and because they been bad please send Black Jesus for goodness sake. Amen and God bless you.

  3. They also offered no recomendations, and the minority Republicans disputed parts of the report. I also believe the report was political and intended to harm the old Bush administration. . The timing was also interesting as it coincided with the Grouber testimony. Right now a threat to the AHC law is more important to most people since it affects them now.

    A made for TV movie, A Rumor of War, was based on a book . One of the characters said something like “it isn’t pretty what a wholesome 18 year old boy will do.”

  4. Right now, the majority of people are more concerned with correcting the Administration’s failings (yes, that includes the economy) than trying to follow these politically motivated attacks dem opponents. This righteous indignation shit is all too familiar when things start to suck. It never results in anything other political shrieking in the ears of the unmovable (e.g. JAL, R, FN). EIT/torture has been talked into the dirt.

    Watch. This tired old political misdirection will soon be forgotten soon and the realities of the ACA, jobs, debt, foreign policy will come back as the topics of concern.

    The black protests/disobedience has no tangible point. It is like the OWS tantrum. Yawn. I’m cant make people un-racist, I will not carry guilt for things I haven’t done, I afford you no status based “sympathy,” I just ain’t giving you my shit. So burn down your neighborhoods and create all the disruption you want. What you want from me I can’t or won’t give you. MLK would weep.

  5. I think you nailed it, Rutherford. It’s absolute lunacy, isn’t it? Have you ever seen what your own General Eisenhower thought of war?

    “I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its futility, its stupidity.

    … Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

    This world in arms in not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.

    The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some 50 miles of concrete highway.

    We pay for a single fighter with a half million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people.

    This, I repeat, is the best way of life to be found on the road the world has been taking. This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.”

    Dwight David Eisenhower, Supreme Allied Commander, World War II


    Here is the entire speech: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article9743.htm

    Pretty interesting take from the man who probably commanded more troops than anyone in history.

  6. ears of the unmovable (e.g. JAL, R, FN).

    Holy Friggin Excrement!!! Are you serious Pot?

    The ONLY person I have ever seen “move” on this blog was Pfesser who gave a second thought to abortion exceptions after reading something I wrote.

    I will add that after much gnashing of teeth I have moved SLIGHTLY on gun control.

    But YOU of all people calling anyone unmovable is the ultimate gall.

  7. The black protests/disobedience has no tangible point. It is like the OWS tantrum. Yawn. I’m cant make people un-racist, I will not carry guilt for things I haven’t done, I afford you no status based “sympathy,” I just ain’t giving you my shit. So burn down your neighborhoods and create all the disruption you want. What you want from me I can’t or won’t give you. MLK would weep.

    Yes I suppose MLK would weep. But you contradict yourself. The fact that you won’t feel guilty, won’t make people “unracist”, and won’t be sympathetic means you know exactly what the point of the protest is and that the point is quite tangible.

    Your comparison to OWS is ridiculous. OWS was completely unfocused which lead to its ultimate failure. BLM (Black Lives Matter – yes I just invented an acronym) is very clearly about the disproportionate use of force against blacks and the failure to prosecute.

    Now you can say the movement is wrong on the facts. You can say you don’t agree with the movement. But to claim there is no tangible point is pure dismissiveness on your part. You know EXACTLY what the point is.

  8. Do you know I used to watch this show when I was a kid, first showing? Damn, I’m getting old.


    Well “R”, all I can say is I finding the timing alone of the release of this report as more than suspect. We’ve been told so many bald-faced lies the last six years, who should I believe? If you like your plan, if you like your doctor, not a smidgeon of corruption, Al Qaeda on the run, the economic recovery – and that’s just a small list for Obama. Throw in Reid & Pelosi, and the rest of the miserable assholes, the racists in the CBC, there’s not a damn thing coming out of the Dimocratic Party mouth I believe anymore.

    When you don’t even interview one party member of the accused, smells like a witch hunt, hit job, pure politic. I believe this report was supposed to serve three measures. First, to hide the massive failures and corruption of the Obama Administration and get those out of news for a week or two. Second, apparently Feinstein’s ass is puckered for personal reasons at the CIA – it’s a personal vendetta with her. Third, the bitterness of the last election.

    I don’t think anybody is even paying much attention to the report. Plus, I think it makes the Dimocratic Party look angry and petty. And if you believe the polls, more people are siding with the interrogators than they are the phony a_holes.

  9. Parker, thanks for the comment on my postscript. I’d definitely like more discussion on that since the more I think about war and its “parallel universe” the more absurd it seems to me.

    Ike is a real enigma. A seasoned veteran who warned us about the MIC. Complicated man.

  10. “But YOU of all people calling anyone unmovable is the ultimate gall.”

    Be galled all you want. I didn’t say I was moveable.

    I honestly wonder whether you are able to follow a point without a “I know you are but what am I” response.

    Try reading what I wrote again. Apply it to “everyone that doesn’t watch MSNBC,” not me you reactive weirdo.

    Contrary to you bullshit efforts to justify the stupidity, these protests don’t have a fucking a point. They are the product if an entirely fake narrative that collapsed. The music stopped, the bar was drained, but drunk and horny don’t want the party to end.

    AGAIN, you trying to rationalize it (post hac) is PRECISELY what I was talking about. It will get you nowhere. This is about destruction not accomplishment.

    AGAIN, this will result in nothing. Like OWS, it amounts to a tantrum. Play along all you want. Check your privilege, Brah. Other than your sympathy, there is nothing you can or will give to them.

    AGAIN, these will peter out. Sorry you find that so difficult to accept without another “I know you are but what am I.”

  11. I would be interested, Rutherford, in what you thought the purpose of a soldier was. I’m not being flippant – that’s a real question with no perfect answer.

    But I’ll bet you vs. guys like Gorilla, Rabbit and me would have a very different conclusion of the purpose of a soldier, perhaps formed by how we all see the world and what we believe the base nature of man.

  12. “Now you can say the movement is wrong on the facts. You can say you don’t agree with the movement. But to claim there is no tangible point is pure dismissiveness on your part. You know EXACTLY what the point is.”

    This is lynchmob mentaility, Balki. But that wasn’t my point.

    White lives matter.

    Asian live matter.\

    Indian lives matter,

    All our fucking live matter.

    Now, since you are back at it, answer us this: What is it that you predict will be the result of the protest if they go as hope?

    Give us the outcome of the “tangible point” which so far is as tangible as “mean people suck.”

  13. I’ve seen you move on a lot of little things.A change leads to another. One day the slippery slope will move you into the truth, Rutherford.

  14. Hate to break it to you but “mean people suck” is very tangible. And when they suck to the degree that they break the law (or may have broken the law) they should be prosecuted.

  15. “Many of us who have spent even part of our lives working in the film industry, particularly those who have committed the unpardonable sin of not adhering religiously to the orthodox liberal line, cannot but grin at the release of the hacked emails from the bosses of Sony Pictures. We were right all along about these self-described liberals and progressives and now we have proof — they are pond scum. They are about as liberal and progressive as Attila — not that those words mean anything anyway. They’re also racist, but forget about that. It’s hardly surprising. What is surprising is that they are clueless. They don’t know what the average ten-year-old nerd knows.” ~ Roger Simon

    😈 I am enjoying watching these gentry white Leftists dance. Now remember, Mr. Rutherford, it’s been me telling you all these years there aren’t a more racist group than the Lily Lib elitist circles of academia and Hollywood.

  16. White lives matter.

    Asian live matter.\

    Indian lives matter,

    All our fucking live matter.

    BRAVO! And black folks get approached by the police more than whites, Asians, or Indians. Now you can say it’s deserved but innocent blacks have every right to complain.

    One possible result of the current brouhaha is that all police shootings will be referred to a special prosecutor.

  17. R, you just can’t follow a point. I quit.

    By all means, continue with the righteous indignation.

    Everyone lese will continue with what they were doing as well.

    Good luck with your “feels.”

    Next up, mean people.

  18. “BRAVO! And black folks get approached by the police more than whites, Asians, or Indians.”-R

    That is probably true R. Whites/Asians and Indians have learned the one rule of survival (probably from their parents) “don’t f*&k with the cops!”. Blacks need to learn that rule.Whether we like it or not therein lays the problem.

  19. “When political actors write political reports for political reasons, you get politics, which is usually not the truth.”

    Well said, Gorilla as are most of your posts.

  20. Police pay more attention to blacks because they have a reputation. They go where most of the crime is. Police, like the rest of us profile. As soon as we heard of the hostage taker in Australia, many of us suspected terrorists, and we were right. It is bad for the majority of innocents who suffer for the actions of their neighbors.

  21. I’m pretty proud of myself. I stood on two bad knees while Christmas shopping with my old, old wife at those horrible malls and I carried a J. Crew bag for an hour. And I didn’t bitch once about how bored I was. It’s a new record of sorts. I think even the Mrs. was impressed.

    It’s amazing the amount of pain the male mind can ignore if there are adult women to ogle. I didn’t even complain while we were in the women’s shoe section. My body may be falling apart, but my imagination is better than EVER!!!!! and I’m a much better flirt than I used to be. Girls used to scare me. Not anymore!!!!!

    I’ll bet those women look at me over there standing there wearing sweats, holding a J. Crew bag think me completely harmless…I know my old, old wife does. My new rule is that they’ve got to look older than my two beauties. Anything 25 and below is entirely off limits.

    Anything 35 and above, hubba hubba. Getting old is not so bad, Rutherford. 😈

    I’ve got a question for the ladies.

    Why do women primp themselves and wear nice clothing while shopping at a mall? I kind of figure those women want me to look at them when they’re all decked out, smelling good, and smiling nice. I figure if a lady is all spiffy and puts on perfume, she’d be offended if I ignored her.

  22. Raji, I took a look at that First Intercept site? Is that some Leftist loony bin? The stooges I knew in their staff section are Boners for Bomba. Looks like a place for Poolman types.

  23. “BRAVO! And black folks get approached by the police more than whites, Asians, or Indians. Now you can say it’s deserved but innocent blacks have every right to complain.

    One possible result of the current brouhaha is that all police shootings will be referred to a special prosecutor.”

    Appointed by whom?

    Changes in police training will result in changes to what happens when the training kicks in.

    “And black folks get approached by the police more than whites, Asians, or Indians.”

    Approached. Oh my. That’s horrifying.

    Black criminals could always decide to stop acting stupidly when they’re approached by the police. It might just be that simple.

  24. “The ONLY person I have ever seen “move” on this blog was Pfesser who gave a second thought to abortion exceptions after reading something I wrote.”

    Oh I think we’ve all been “moved” by something or other that you wrote.

  25. Raji, I took a look at that First Intercept site? Is that some Leftist loony bin?

    I don’t know Tex which is why I threw it out there. I had just finished reading about them in an article and took a look see. Are they just whistleblowers?

  26. I figure if a lady is all spiffy and puts on perfume, she’d be offended if I ignored her.

    Spoken like a true male 😆
    My ex used to say the same about the ladies in swimwear at the beach

  27. So the idiots at WordPress have done it again and “enhanced” the iphone app. The only improvement is I can now copy/paste without editting your cimments. On the other hand, i can’t skip a line to make a new paragraph. I see your markups but not the effect (i.e. bold never shows as bold just the code) and iphone spell check is disabled. Stupid motherfuckers!!!!

  28. Rutherford war is a human fault but it is by its very construct actually quite legal.
    As for the UCMJ there are/have been some shocking short comings and that is putting it mildly. The other side of the coin is that it serves its purpose most of the time very well.

  29. Approached. Oh my. That’s horrifying.

    Black criminals could always decide to stop acting stupidly when they’re approached by the police. It might just be that simple.

    Beyond stupid. Yes it can be horrifying to be approached by the police AND upsetting if you know you did nothing wrong. Seriously until you are stopped by a cop on a monthly basis, you need to can the flippancy.

  30. “Since the WordPress app now totally sucks I’m trying commenting on the actual web site on my phone’s browser.”

    Hah. I can’t even read this place on my phone anymore. As for the Kindle, I can read up to about 300 before it quits.

  31. “Beyond stupid. Yes it can be horrifying to be approached by the police AND upsetting if you know you did nothing wrong. Seriously until you are stopped by a cop on a monthly basis, you need to can the flippancy.”

    “Upsetting?” Oh dear. That’s dreadful.

    “Stopped by a cop on a monthly basis.” Who? What channel?

  32. Muffy all I can say is many black men complain of this harassment by police. Now I can either believe them or say they’re delusional. I choose to believe them.

    What channel? Every one but Fox.

  33. “One possible result of the current brouhaha is that all police shootings will be referred to a special prosecutor.”

    Why is this better?

  34. “Seriously until you are stopped by a cop on a monthly basis, you need to can the flippancy.”

    If you’re being stopped on a monthly basis, it ain’t just ’cause you’re black.

    What are you observing?

  35. I thought this was obvious Tigre. Local prosecutors depend on the police. There is a potential conflict of interest in a police shooting or excessive use of force.

    I believe stats bear this out regarding how many questionable uses of police force ever see the inside of a courtroom.

  36. “I believe stats bear this out regarding how many questionable uses of police force ever see the inside of a courtroom.”

    Huh?

    The issue is whether they SHOULD be seeing the inside of a courtroom.

    If you’re objective that all uses of police force require that a cop be put on trial, why not have automatic indictments.

    So, what stat are you referring to?

  37. “There is a potential conflict of interest in a police shooting or excessive use of force.”

    Just wondering. What do you think the purpose behind a gran jury is?

  38. Tigre in both the Ferguson and Staten Island cases there was skepticism about how hard the prosecutors tried to get an indictment from the grand jury. In the Staten Island (Garner) case the skepticism is deserved.

    Please correct me but isn’t the prosecutor supposed to present a one-sided case to the GJ to get that indictment? We know in Ferguson the prosecutor essentially tried the entire case in front of the GJ. Not supposed to work that way, is it?

  39. I don’t know how Ferguson compares in process or outcome. But since there was no case, what is your point? Some jurisdictions don’t even require a GJ — the prosecutor can elect not to indict.

    The prosecutor tries the case.

    Lead prosecutors are elected.

    Judge’s are elected.

    You’re just throwing shit out there. Skepticism about the outcome of a case means a special prosecutor? Get real. You know that’s lame. That’s why you reached for a non-existent stat to bolster.

  40. Tigre you’re the only one I know who can ignore common sense.

    Cops and prosecutors work hand in hand.
    Prosecutor not predisposed to indicting cop.
    Prosecutor makes GJ believe what he wants them to believe (I.e. Ham sandwich) so GJ does NOT represent an impartial solution to conflict of interest.

    There is nothing lame about it. Ferguson DA taking case to GJ was a charade. He should simply have chosen not to indict. Same for Staten Island.

  41. BRAVO! And black folks get approached by the police more than whites, Asians, or Indians. Now you can say it’s deserved but innocent blacks have every right to complain.
    One possible result of the current brouhaha is that all police shootings will be referred to a special prosecutor.
    — R

    Doesn’t it suck when science and facts screw up a perfectly good political agenda…

    With the turmoil in Ferguson (MO) the latest example, activists and many reporters would have us believe that police officers are prejudicially “trigger happy” when dealing with black suspects.
    But a scientific study from Washington State University-Spokane suggests just the opposite. In truth, according to findings from the research team’s innovative experiments:
    • Officers were less likely to erroneously shoot unarmed black suspects than they were unarmed whites — 25 times less likely, in fact
    • And officers hesitated significantly longer before shooting armed suspects who were black, compared to armed subjects who were white or Hispanic

    “In sum,” writes Dr. Lois James, a research assistant professor with the university’s Department of Criminal Justice and Criminology who headed the study, “this research found that participants displayed significant bias favoring Black suspects” in their shooting decisions.

  42. R, I know the sum total of your legal knowledge is the “ham sandwich” phrase. Now why don’t you answer my questions? Too hard?

    What you’ve said is just plain-assed nonsense. As I said, I quit. You honestly don’t get how these things work. And I’m being kind in that assessment.

  43. Police work in largest numbers where crime is worse. They also profile in those areas. They routinely stop people, many who aren’t doing anything wrong. Its for the high crime residents’ own protection.

    If adverse publicity makes cops hesitate to investigate potential crime ln lawless areas , innocents there suffer, not the people in safe areas who righteously criticize police.

    The grand jury is a gateway to sort out cases with too little basis for litigation. it saves the public the time and money it would waste on weak cases.it also protects people who might be charged when they shouldn’t be.

    Police protection, grand juries, and other parts of the legal and justice system are imperfect. Mistakes and malice happen, but it is all we have. The alternative is Ferguson-style mob rule or innocents forced to spend time and money defending themselves from baseless charges.

    Why is this so much harder to understand than Warren’s socialism?

  44. I think women don’t mind being glanced at in a non- boorish way if they think the viewer is cute. Otherwise, they are offended. Women are as shallow as men.

  45. “Beyond stupid. Yes it can be horrifying to be approached by the police AND upsetting if you know you did nothing wrong. Seriously until you are stopped by a cop on a monthly basis, you need to can the flippancy.”

    Damn straight. Want to create a powder keg? Let the cops continually fuck with somebody, like they do the blackfellas in the US every day.

    What really needs to happen is that black folks and white need to sit down and talk together, and cut the bullshit. The police need to say, “Look, Mom, it scares hell out of me to stop a young black man for ANYTHING. I never know what he’s going to do, whether he’s on crack or alcohol or god-knows-what. I have a wife and kids, and I have to survive every night of my life for twenty years of dealing with these guys, and I’m always ready for them to do something that might get me killed.”

    And the parents need to say, “Look, at least try to be courteous, like you would with white folks. And promise me that you won’t stop my kid unless he is breaking the law, exactly the same as you would a white kid.”

    Then the parents and the “black leaders” – whatever the hell that is – need to say to the young black men: “Stop being aggressive assholes with the law. White kids get off because it’s, “Yes, Sir and No Ma’am.” They keep their hands on the steering wheel. They don’t mouth off – not that there’s anything illegal about that, but it puts the cop on notice that he’s going to have trouble with you, and YOU ARE ALWAYS GOING TO LOSE. ALWAYS. Stop being a chump.”

    A little parental discipline at home would go a long way. It’s very hard for a single woman to enforce the kind of discipline on teen boys that an adult man can, and frankly, a lot of the black men are too busy finding another puss to jump to be bothered with raising the kids they already have.

    I had a friend who was married to a black woman, and they both hated black men. Her opinion was that if it weren’t for black women, the race would go extinct.

  46. Golf clap R. Your party’s political play with partial facts and a host of myths is going well.

    Oh, and Pfony libertarians in Virginia can go Pfuck themselves….

    The Taliban has called for an international investigation into the human rights standards of the United States after the Senate Intelligence Committee Democrats released a lengthy report criticizing enhanced interrogation techniques used in the war on terror.

    Under Taliban rule, Afghans were subject to public floggings or executions for “violations” such as women wearing nail polish or exposing any skin, or both teachers and students trying to learn in underground schools. Women had zero rights and weren’t allowed to leave their homes except with a male relative. Nowadays, the Taliban commits acts of violence against activist or working women, and the Pakistani Taliban shot Nobel laureate Malala Yousafzai in 2012 while she was going to school.

    “Since the inception of America’s occupation of Afghanistan, the Islamic Emirate has provided information to the international community regarding America’s barbarities and inhumane treatment of the Afghan populace. At the time, no nation dared listen to our nation’s pleas or show even slight response for fear of estranging America,” the Taliban said in a statement posted on the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan website over the weekend.

    “Now after 14 years of such barbarities, the US Senate itself has lifted the curtain off of America’s intelligence arm, the CIA, and revealed the extent of their tortuous treatment of unarmed prisoners. In reality the practices of CIA mentioned in this report are only a fraction of those committed by this agency throughout America’s occupations of Afghanistan and Iraq.”

    The Taliban said they hope the full Senate report — last week’s release was the executive summary — “is released to the public for passing judgment.”

  47. Gorilla, I heard last week four CHILDREN were beheaded for refusing to convert to Islam at the hands of ISIS. Children. Think about that – prepubescent kids, braver than but a handful of adults who were murdered by devils. Children. Like most of us raised here. Tigre’s kids, Rabbit’s kids, your kids, James’ grandkids, Poolman’s grandkids – dead at the hands of rabid murderers, beheaded. Their blood calls out to me.

    And approximately 35% of the America public thinks me a barbarian and war criminal for granting a wide latitude to American interrogators to break these demons who behead CHILDREN – breaking them using any and all means necessary? That somehow I’m immoral for believing there are some atrocities committed by men that are so insidious and wicked, they must be punished by equal brutality to send a message that humane civilization cannot and will not tolerate this kind of behavior? That somehow that demand for retribution makes me party to evil? Is that a sick joke?

    If that is so, how could any war ever be justified? Any war? Why don’t we all just lay down now and hand over our country to radicals? Do you think these rabid animals are going to spare you and your children in the event you find yourselves in the same position? Are you really that stupid?

    What’s is truly evil and immoral is to allow these kind of atrocities to go on by fanatics while browbeating our CIA for war crime interrogations. What is equally immoral is to frame the U.N. as if it were moral. If there were true justice, every captured ISIS/Al Qaeda murderer would first be interrogated to extract all information and upon completion, be put to death. You phony bastards are asking me to sympathize, to show some faux humanity for Khalid Sheik Mohammad because we must demonstrate we are better than he is?

    I would think that would be self evident.

  48. G, your study means nothing without understanding its methodology. But let’s accept it at face value. It doesn’t address what we do in the rare case that something goes wrong.

    My dear Tigre you’ve provided no information that clarifies. How bout you stop the Socratic method shit and tell me where I am wrong.

    Is there likely bias toward the police by local prosecutors? If not, why not? Is it the job of the DA to get an indictment out of the grand jury or to be objective?

    You know how these things work so tell me what I’m getting wrong and why.

  49. I think women don’t mind being glanced at in a non- boorish way if they think the viewer is cute. Otherwise, they are offended. Women are as shallow as men.

    Amen there James!

  50. “I think women don’t mind being glanced at in a non- boorish way if they think the viewer is cute. Otherwise, they are offended. Women are as shallow as men.” -James

    Amen there James!” -Rutherford

    Have mercy.

  51. “Anybody honest knows this is the truth.” -Tex Taylor, December 16, 2014 at 2:13 pm

    I think everyone knows it’s the truth.

  52. Rutherford you are in a chasm the two walls being justified and criminal. That a death can be deemed justified doesn’t negate legal action.
    As far as I see it investigate things however you want it won’t alter the gap

  53. Tex & Raji – I finished the HG trilogy last night. I enjoyed every bit of it and especially the final chapters leading to that epically breathtaking ending. Or breathtakingly epic ending. 🙂

    Raji you have a kindle – have you ever used the free 30 day trial of Kindle Unlimited? I had to in order to borrow books 2 & 3, since Prime membership limits the number of books you can check out per month. Just a suggestion, along with my highest recommendation.

  54. Wow, those are delightfully well crafted and totally believable sample conversations, Parker @ December 16, 2014 at 10:20 am. And the last bit about your black lady friend married to the white man – your experiences are so vast and eye opening! Thank you for sharing. 🙂

  55. Muffy, I have not yet looked into Kindle Unlimited. I do have Prime which does limit. I tend to spend most of my time in the Freebie section and only every now and then pay for a book. I’m looking forward to getting the Hunger Games (thanks for the heads up) which I’ll do with the Amazon gift cards I get for Christmas.

  56. [Redacted] @ 3:34 – Why, thank you for the compliment! Glad to see you’re getting out a bit more these days. The experience will teach you that not everyone in the world is narrowminded and provincial as your right-winger friends in America.

    Quite a few blackfellas here have Causasian wives and vice-versa; not rare at all. One correction, though: the man is my friend, not the lady. She came as part of the package.

  57. Young children in the Middle East protest authority by attending classes. Far too many of them lose their life in response to their protest.

    University students in America protest authority by walking out of classes, insisting on extensions for final exams, and issuing trigger warnings when they are told a simple, yet direct, “no”.

    We should be so lucky as to have such young people….

  58. “My dear Tigre you’ve provided no information that clarifies. How bout you stop the Socratic method shit and tell me where I am wrong.”

    Not again. I already have. If you want to have a discussion, you need to read what I said and answer my questions. You’ve done neither. You ignored my points entirely and just repeat your MSNBC mantra. “It’s all so unfair and a problem that you can’t substantiate as a problem.”

    Now, what are your stats? What’s your proof that the DA is deliberately tanking a case at the GJ stage rather not referring it at all or waiting for trial? I said they were elected. Stop just repeating yourself. Prove your assertion. If a prosecutor is willfully tanking a good case, he’s acting unethically. An appointed “special prosecutor” is also biased in favor of the indictment (excluding or glossing over exculpatory evidence to secure an indictment without a chance of obtaining a conviction — a huge concern to a DA — remember Trayvon?). I wonder if you even know what the function of an indictment is or prosecutorial discretion though you sling the term around.

    So, why is a GJ incapable of evaluating a case? They serve a purpose you know. And that leads to:

    What do you think the purpose of the GJ is? Why can’t they function again? Ham sandwich? The GJ stands between the DA and the bench. That’s it’s function. You presume they suffer from the same bias as the DA because. . . what? If they don’t always indict in use of force cases its proof that the fix is in? Without proof of some kind, that’s all you’ve said you know?

    Apply yourself. Back it up the fuck up with something and QUIT JUST REPEATING YOUR CONCLUSION. I don’t believe we have a runaway epidemic of racially motivated executions of blacks by cops or neighborhood patrols. You? I think you’re just swept up in the usual political manipulations like always. The usual lynch mob mentality. Prove me wrong.

    We already have from you that a white cop and black victim is standing alone proof of racist motives. I’m not going to waste my time in the face of such stupidity. So sorry, Blondie. If you want a discussion, you answering a few questions about your point shouldn’t be too taxing — unless you don’t care enough to give it thought as I suspect.

  59. Ha. Watching MSNBC “special prosecutor” routine on Sharpton’ show. Big shock. R and MSNBC. They want federal special prosecutors too. Yeah we need federal political agendas involved. More Trayvon cases!

  60. I heard last week four CHILDREN were beheaded for refusing to convert to Islam at the hands of ISIS.

    Tex, the problem with your speech is that you confuse interrogation with revenge. So does Dick Cheney. When asked to define torture, he says “making cell phone calls to your daughters to say goodbye before burning to death in the towers”. It’s all very dramatic but it dodges the question. The implication is we can do anything because of the torture inflicted on us. In other words, revenge.

  61. Quite a few blackfellas here have Causasian wives and vice-versa; not rare at all.

    . That made me chuckle. First, interracial marriage is hardly taboo anymore “in the states” and from what I’ve heard Australia is still one of the most virulently racist countries around.

  62. We already have from you that a white cop and black victim is standing alone proof of racist motives.

    Lets get this out of the way first. You KNOW I did not say that. I said, given our long history, white cop and black citizen equals immediate suspicion. The conclusion is unjustified but it springs from a soiled history. You’re nuts to deny this.

    Why is it that blacks can be suspects (profiled) based on history but whites can’t be profiled by blacks for the very same reason?

  63. I don’t play the Socratic method game. Sorry. 😆

    p.s. I asked what proof other than skin color in Ferguson and Garner. You said skin color was enough since we are “steeped in racism.” You support presumed racism like I said.

  64. “I asked in the last thread what evidence of racism other than the color of the cop and victim. No takers. ” -Tigre

    “Unfortunately in a country steeped in racist history, that’s all you need – one white and one black.

    Race hustlers didn’t come out of the blue. They tap into very real insecurities.”

    Rutherford , December 4, 2014 at 12:51 am

  65. “The background of this situation: Lawrence O’Donnell reported that after reviewing the transcripts of the grand jury, his analyst discovered that the assistant district attorneys working for Bob McCulloch gave the jurors an outdated copy of Missouri law, which stated all that was required for an officer to use deadly force is their “reasonable belief” that there was a threat.”

    In 1985, in Tennessee v. Garnerdirectly before Darren Wilson’s testimony giving the impression that all that was required under the law for Wilson to kill Michael Brown with impunity was his belief that he was in danger, without the additional requirement of probable cause for such a belief. (Copied as written.)

    The Missouri AG now proclaims that was wrong, and that the Missouri Law needs to be changed and updated to reflect the Supreme Court’s ruling.

    “O’Donnell: As I have stated on this program there should be no confusion in the criminal justice system because the United States Supreme Court clarified the proper, and legal, and constitutional use of deadly force by police, 29 years ago.”

    “And worse even still, are Officers walking the streets of Missouri – or other states – also under this incorrect impression that all they need to use deadly force is to “feel threatened”?”


    http://scholarship.law.cornell.edu/facpub/273/ Tennessee v. Garner


    “In Tennessee v. Garner, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down a Tennessee statute that permitted police to use deadly force against a suspected felon fleeing arrest.”
    https://www.ncjrs.gov/App/publications/abstract.aspx?ID=104889

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/12/04/1349421/-Missouri-AG-Confirms-Michael-Brown-Grand-Jury-Misled-by-St-Louis-DA?detail=email

  66. I never said the special prosecutor idea was original Tigre. I heard the idea and it sounded good to me.

    I keep repeating the same thing because you won’t acknowledge the truth of any of it.

    From my understanding the DA is NOT obligated to present any exculpatory evidence to GJ. Yet the Ferguson DA did just that. Why? Again, why did the Ferguson DA take it to a GJ in the first place if he didn’t think an indictment was justified?

    We know much less about what the Staten Island GJ saw so I’m left just wondering why they simply didn’t believe their own eyes.

    When folks appear to have committed a crime (Staten Island, not Ferguson) and no one gets charged, it rightly raises eyebrows. Particularly when the accused is a person with power.

    In Ferguson, the DA should simply have said “thug attacked cop and cop shot thug. Done.” I think DA actually made matters worse by taking it to GJ.

    In Staten Island the opposite holds true. DA should have said “tape tells the tale. I’m charging cop and we’ll hash it out in court.” It looks to me like in both cases prosecutors were trying to avoid accountability for a decision.

  67. Tigre, you asked another question. What is the purpose of a GJ? Based on these last two cases, damned if I know. I don’t understand why charging a “perp” shouldn’t always rest with the DA.

    So, could you answer that for me?

  68. Answer: a device to screen to screen out improper or malicious prosecutions. In other words, the GJ is to provide the check you contend you want (a check) but reject because you don’t like the outcome — and for the wrongest of reasons: presumed racist motives rather than defense by those with political agendas.

    Criminal trials aren’t a tool to test out the facts and see whether it’s possible to secure a conviction for fucks sake.

  69. p.s. historically prosecutors aren’t the only ones that can pursue indictments. citizens can present to a grand jury.

  70. There’s a huge disconnect between claiming to be anti-death penalty “because to get it wrong would be horrifying,” and being pro-prosecution for white cops regardless of whether or not it’s warranted or how horrifying it would be to get it wrong.

  71. “Again, why did the Ferguson DA take it to a GJ in the first place if he didn’t think an indictment was justified?”

    The reason you’re complaining of. WTF?

    You don’t like the “way it looks?”

    Do you have any idea how circular you reason when you get your lynchmob juices flowing? If there’s no indictment, it doesn’t matter what is done the outcome proves the process unjust to you.

    Turn of the fucking MSNBC. You’ve got no stats, nothing to prove racism and a dumb MSNBC narrative that federal involvement (and all that entails with its own motives) is the fix. . . to a problem it can’t establish. . .because. . .

  72. Damn skippy, Muffy. Rutherford sees no injustice in a wrongful prosecution and presumed racist motives over the patently obvious.

    You know what doesn’t look right? “Hands up, don’t shoot,” Holder, Obama and his advisors Sharpton descending, and lie after lie after lie to vilify this cop for a murder conviction to feed the malignant hordes of thugs Rutherford feels so much for. Twisted.

  73. Tigre @ 9:23pm – “…a dumb MSNBC narrative that federal involvement (and all that entails with its own motives) is the fix…”

    I was just thinking how stupid it would be to send the cop to federal prison and not house him in protective custody. Stupid like a fox.

  74. JAL not for nothing but the SCOTUS position didn’t set into stone things the way crazy Larry thinks it did. In fact it only established that the police officer can gut out what he/she thinks is reasonable in a given scenario.
    None of the most recent deaths (Garner,Brown,Rice) touch on this either. There is something to say about a recent case in Miami where the police gave chase to a “street artist” aka graffiti vandal and he was struck by a police car. Perhaps the best case for Larry & Co. to try to soap box on would be the Colorado case of the guy with a samurai sword. Police chased him and were firing at him,which in a reasonable persons mind might lead you to say “feet don’t fail me now”!. Still though applying the SCOTUS ruling gives the police involved an out. They reasonably believed the guy was an obvious threat to the public.

  75. Alfie, you give that O’Donnell routine too much dignity. The so-called confusion over the TN Garner case (if you read it) and Wilson are non-existent. Probable cause to purse criminal conviction for murder — with the mens rea element — ain’t the same with Wilson as the civil fleeing felon case.

  76. “[Redacted] @ 3:34 – Why, thank you for the compliment!”

    You’re welcome! Now that we’re friends tell me do your sexual partners ever mistake your pecker for a [Redacted] ?

  77. “The implication is we can do anything because of the torture inflicted on us. In other words, revenge.”

    In whose words, “revenge?” Cheney’s? Yours?

    I disagree with revenge as proper motivation for torture – or war for that matter, as you recently copped to wanting at times. I’m not sure at all that’s what Cheney was implying.

  78. The implication is we can do anything because of the torture inflicted on us. In other words, revenge.

    Perhaps your most glaring weakness amongst millions is that you confuse what justice means, and for sheer political expediency call it revenge. You cry for social justice and can’t list one sacrifice you’ve ever made to rectify it. I find you not credible concerning anything of homeland security or war – pure sanctimony, MSNBC mimicking.

    Why would you have a more accurate understanding of torture than the very soldier who killed Bin Laden? Try to listen closely and learn something.

    http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/hannity/transcript/2014/12/16/navy-seal-who-killed-bin-laden-cia-interrogations-were-not-torture

  79. Interestingly Tigre, YOU’RE the one more focused on race. Look through this thread and the last. I’ve never accused the Staten Island officer of racism. I maintain he used unnecessary force.

    Not only have I not accused Wilson in Ferguson of racism, I’ve said Brown shoulda been shot under the circumstances.

    Now I genuinely need your help cos I’m having trouble groking the GJ thing. If cases are referred to a GJ to inject objectivity into the decision to indict, then why is it the DA the person who does the referral and presents the case to the GJ? They can only work with the evidence they are presented and the DA controls what evidence they see. So how do we get true objectivity?

  80. I’m having to reach deep into my humanity to feel sympathy for Pakistan. They’ve been playing footsie with terrorists for years. They knowingly harbored our public enemy #1. Like their ungrateful neighbor, Afghanistan, they smack talk the US every time they can.

    The only reason I have an ounce of sadness is that the dead children never asked to live in an asshole nation.

  81. And Tex, why would I take the word of a navy seal over that of John McCain who was tortured? Is John a drama queen?

    For you and Muffy, when Cheney defines torture by citing 9/11 what is his motive? Isn’t he measuring our treatment of prisoners in relation to our losses? Sounds vengeful to me.

  82. Muffy, good answer. When the torture stopped (2006?) the devastating attacks did not resume. That tells us either torture is not a necessary component of interrogation OR we never really stopped doing it.

  83. 2003 I believe but don’t quote me. Whether it’s necessary is debatable but the “torture” itself doesn’t or didn’t stop the attacks. It’s a device used to get information. It’s always a last resort. It’s never punishment. And it isn’t a pleasure.

    And before you make up your mind you ought to listen for yourself to the guy who was tapped to do the deed. The Feinstein report people didn’t bother but you should.

  84. “And Tex, why would I take the word of a navy seal over that of John McCain who was tortured? Is John a drama queen?”

    I think a better question is would you take the word of a man who selected Sarah Palin for his running mate?

  85. Because a GJ is in the nature of n inquest. In most circumstances, it can subpoena information and make its own inquiry if it wants. They were created to act as a restraint on run away prosecutor (e.g. Duke Lacrosse).

    I don’t get the “objectivity” hang up you seem to have. It’s not there to render a verdict. That’s for the jury after a trial. The GJ only determines whether there’s probable cause to believe that the defendant committed the crime the prosecutor claims. It is private and anonymous in order to make it is less susceptible (no, not immune) to the influences/presumed bias you claim make the process unfair — oddly, to the State rather than accused. Very “lynchy,” Rutherford.

    The racist shit I’m talking about this movement that I said had no point, that you dispute and started this exchange. You’re not denying that’s the allegation being made by the “protesters” you support with Ferguson and NY, are you? “Black lives matter,” man.

    Stats?

  86. “I’m having to reach deep into my humanity to feel sympathy for Pakistan. They’ve been playing footsie with terrorists for years.”

    OK I don’t give a flying fuck if you added your little CYA disclaimer at the end. You deserve to be called out for that shit.

    I’m glad you were able to muster up an once of sadness for ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY dead children, Rutherford.

    That’s Sandy Hook times 6. That event left you emotionally crippled for days, and here you are now, barely able to work up an ounce of sadness for 130 slaughtered kids. One of their teachers was burned alive in front of them. And you come off with this bullshit?

    They’re fucking people, man. Their parents are people. Try to remember that.

  87. Huck, of course you are right about the loss.

    Let me just ask this. Does not Pakistan bear some responsibility for this? I heard that Pakistan has been inconsistent about the Taliban, to say the least. They encourage them in the hope of destabilizing India.

    It would be like Adam Lanza belonging to a terrorist organization sporadically supported by Washington DC. If that was the way it went down here, our hair would be on fire against our government. Shit, even with Lanza a crazy private citizen, our hair was on fire.

    So let me rephrase since my original comment was indelicate to say the least. Of course I think this is a human loss of epic proportion. But I don’t hold Pakistan blameless. I hope their citizens hold the government accountable.

  88. “In every street of Khyber Pukhtunkhwa, someone has lost a dear one today,” said Qazi Murtaza, 24, of Peshawar, whose cousin and aunt were killed in the attack. “My aunty lost her son – his funeral is tonight – and then I have to go to my uncle’s house. He lost his wife.”


    One survivor, Shahrukh Khan, 16, shot in both legs, said he managed to survive after playing dead.

    “The man with big boots kept on looking for students and pumping bullets into their bodies. I lay as still as I could and closed my eyes, waiting to get shot again,”


    They were speaking in Arabic with each other,” said Abdul Rehman, 14. “I saw them killing the students. I escaped by hiding under the chair. My best friend was also murdered, though he pleaded for his life.”


    “They literally set the teacher on fire with gasoline and made the kids watch.”


    ” ‘A lot of the children are under the benches,’ ” a Pakistani Taliban said, according to Ahmed. ” ‘Kill them.’ ”


    There they were. Children. Hiding under tables. Faking dead after being shot by madmen enraged with bloodlust. Begging for their lives as they stare at the barrel of an AK-47. And Rutherford is barely able to work up an ounce of sympathy because of some fucking policy bullshit.

    I’m sickened by your response, man. I truly am. I’d have rather you just ignored the whole thing that to come off with what you did.

  89. You know what, Rutherford. I am not even thinking about Pakistan as a country right now.

    I’m thinking about those kids. The ones who died…..and the ones that lived. I’m thinking about their parents….their loved ones.

    And I apologize for my latest

  90. And Tex, why would I take the word of a navy seal over that of John McCain who was tortured? Is John a drama queen?

    Guilty without questioning. Why haven’t loud voices who sat in those Viet Cong jails with McCain come out in agreement with him?

    Perhaps because this Navy Seal, as do all special forces, endured this same “torture”, including the boxes, waterboarding, deprivation and said this ‘inhumanity’ wasn’t irreparable and that is not torture?

    Or perhaps I’m insulted because you and your new hero McCain have said nothing about Obama’s criminality? You think McCain’s bombing from an F-4 pure, do you, when they toasted villages with women and kids? But that wouldn’t fit the holier than thou narrative, would it?

    Maybe before you take the word of anyone, you ought to think outside your sanctimonious box and reflect on the duty of the interrogators and the fear those first two years after 9/11.

    Add to the fact as we once again were reminded yesterday and Huck correctly noted, you can practically ignore the mass murder of kids by the same band of brothers that just mowed down 130 children sitting in classroom. Unlike these poor, poor abused Taliban that housed Al Qaeda, you just can’t work up much sympathy for those murdered children – or the families of 3,000 of your own countrymen.

    I watched an interrogator in righteous fury the other night who was outed and now receiving death threats thanks to a released report. And the thought crossed my mind, if there is justice this side of heaven, Feinstein goes first at Taliban hands.

  91. “I think a better question is would you take the word of a man who selected Sarah Palin for his running mate?”

    Don’t conflate making bad decisions based on bad information given to you by bad people and being a liar. They are two separate things.

    At least at the end he saw her for what she was and quit campaigning.

  92. R – I think you are being intellectually lazy about the Pakistan thing.

    To my eye, the problem is that nearly every child in this country is steeped in superstition (Islam) from the day he is born, and by its very nature, Islam robs him of rationality. His whole childhood he is taught to kill for god; then he becomes an adult with an AK-47, and it’s Katy-bar-the-door.

    The only solution is education, but like all religions, Islam recognizes that knowledge is its mortal enemy and destroys anything that leads away from Islam – like, for example, schools.

    No schools, no education, no progress, more poverty – and people in grinding poverty seek comfort in religion and superstition, spawning more violence, more superstition, more poverty, more madrasas and more Islam.


    You ever read Uncle Remus’s Tales, Rutherford?

    http://xroads.virginia.edu/~ug97/remus/tar-baby.html

    Dealing with these countries is exactly like getting involved with the tar-baby. The hardest thing in the world is to mind your own goddamned business, but we in the West need to completely disengage these people and let them have at it. It’s like ebola: the treatment is quarantine and let it burn itself out. If we ever get the cojones to ban immigration from these countries and prevent them from infecting the West (Europe is already gone.), there is a 100% chance the problem will take care of itself.

  93. Yeah, Pfesser. You took him through the tar baby bit before you started pretending to be an Australian rather than an iron-handed son of a WV coal miner practicing radiology in VA. So folksy, Broken Record — errr, Guy from “the West.”

  94. My earlier comments were careless and inappropriate. I have a reflexive reaction whenever I hear “Pakistan”. There are few countries I have a serious antipathy for. Pakistan and Afghanistan are two of them. I detest “allies” who talk smack about us when we lose lives to advance their societies. And I’ve never forgiven Pakistan for harboring the mastermind of the worst attack on our country.

  95. The media isn’t giving you any factual information. I doubt if the latest reported atrocities are even real. Like all mainstream media reporting, they are sources of state propaganda and the state is an arm of the globalists. They are designed to move forward the political agenda. Just judging from the comments provided herein, proves their tact continues to work quite successfully.

    9/11 = false flag event
    Sandy Hook = state perpetrated hoax
    Malala Yousafzai = fraud

  96. I have a reflexive reaction whenever I hear “Pakistan”-R

    I totally understand Rutherford. I blew it off at first as just another Pakistan/Taliban military incident but after reading some of the comments I wanted to read some of the reasons they were attacking so called “soft sites”.
    I never watch TV so many of the so called news events just pass me by.

    9/11 = false flag event
    Sandy Hook = state perpetrated hoax
    Malala Yousafzai = fraud

    Really Poolman?

  97. 9/11 = false flag event
    Sandy Hook = state perpetrated hoax
    Malala Yousafzai = fraud

    Really Poolman?

    Poolman, if you’re not seriously mentally ill, you are one wicked mofo. You’re utterly despicable in your slander and fraudulent in your charges. If I were king, I’d make you bury those children whose lives you just marginalized. You’re the most passive form of wicked and evil I think I’ve ever read – perhaps a more clever demon than I thought.

    Whatever you are, there is no goodness to be found in you anymore.

  98. Lordy, Lordy. The Obama descriptions of the harsh racist insults that had to endure as described in People magazine are truly rich.

    R, you’ll like this. It’s so close to the harsh racism and oppression you endured when you weren’t treated as a member of the country club. That shit never happens to white people. So humiliating. Employee. Pfffft.

    Onion Booty yesterday concerning the racially degrading episode at Target:

    “I tell this story – I mean, even as the first lady – during that wonderfully publicized trip I took to Target, not highly disguised, the only person who came up to me in the store was a woman who asked me to help her take something off a shelf. Because she didn’t see me as the first lady, she saw me as someone who could help her. Those kinds of things happen in life. So it isn’t anything new.”

    Poor oppressed thing.

    Like the UVA “rape victim, ” the overt act of racism hadn’t set in yet for Ol’ Onion Booty:

    “I thought I was undercover. I have to tell you something about this trip though. No one knew that was me because a woman actually walked up to me, right? I was in the detergent aisle, and she said — I kid you not — she said, ‘Excuse me, I just have to ask you something,’ and I thought, ‘Oh, cover’s blown.’ She said, ‘Can you reach on that shelf and hand me the detergent?’ I kid you not…And the only thing she said — I reached up, ’cause she was short, and I reached up, pulled it down — she said, ‘Well, you didn’t have to make it look so easy.’ That was my interaction. I felt so good. … She had no idea who I was. I thought, as soon as she walked up — I was with my assistant, and I said, ‘This is it, it’s over. We’re going to have to leave.’ She just needed the detergent.

    And here, all the times I was confused as an employee, and even a valet (no shit, not more than 2 weeks ago), it turns out it was because I was black. You know. Valet = black. Duh.

  99. Poolman, you really need to see someone to adjust your medication.

    (I suggest you avoid that self-aggrandizing deluded old drunken tar baby, Pfesser).

  100. Why are some of you fixated on Sarah Palin?” She is not running for office, though she has influenced elections. She has been right about several issues, including drilling for oil and Russia when Obama was wrong. Palin energized McCain’s campaign and helped take him to the top of a few polls before the crash enveloped us and McCain looked like an unstable old man compared to Obama’s coolness.

    If you remember that time, Obama and Palin were the big stars who generated excitement. For a while, one could as easily say Mc Cain dragged the ticket down.He didn’t seem to want to be president as much Palin wanted to be vice president. He, not Palin gave up on Michigan, She wanted to at least make an appearance there. McCain declared some of Obama’s weak spots off limits.

    McCain picked Palin because advisers told him to. Lieberman was a bad choice, they said. Sarah was one of the most popular, successful governors in the US. She was also a woman. She was smart and quick on her feet as evidenced during her nomination speech when the teleprompter misfired for a few moments. She carried on. Obama once thanked himself for visiting the White House. Palin so scared Democrats that one was overheard to say at the Republican Convention that they had “72 hours to destroy her.”

    McCain would still have lost if someone like Lieberman had been his running mate. I suspect Lieberman would not have become the punch line Palin , because he belonged to the club and Palin didn’t. She was a rural outsider.

    Investigators virtually ignored Obama while they sent scores of lawyers and others to Alaska to find dirt on the Palins. They filed frivilious lawsuits which threatened the family savings. They destroyed Sarah with some help from her, and she tried something else to make herself rich.

    The political witch is dead with a stake in her heart. I think many Democrats and some moderate Republicans are still afraid of her-that somehow she might be resurrected. Some may also have a regional and class bias against rural rednecks. If Clinton and Warren came from Wyoming or Alaska without the benefit of name university educations and connections, they would not be where they are today. Native intelligence and judgement counted less than connections and a friendly press.

    We need an affirmative action program to help rural rednecks improve their lives as we do for blacks, Liz’s Indian tribe, and other minorities.

  101. thisislotta, the Finish vlogger, posted on one of her sites. A Pakistani father said “My son was my life. Now, he is gone.” People are alike, and like us, if their children were torn from them, we would never recover. We would carry on, but life would be a little darker.

  102. “As for Poolman, worry not. He is not responsible for his delusions.”

    Is that a totally meaningless statement or is there something more to it?

  103. “Islam recognizes that knowledge is its mortal enemy and destroys anything that leads away from Islam”

    Complete bullshit

  104. “Why are some of you fixated on Sarah Palin?”

    Personally my aim in bringing her up was that Rutherford keeps jumping up and down citing John McCain to us with regard to this “torture report.” I merely find it ironic that suddenly he’s trying to determine the appropriate weight to give McCain’s judgment.

  105. If “they” are brainwashed with Islam from childhood, and Islam hates education, then how is it that there are any schools to attack in the first place? You don’t think the people who open the schools are Muslims too? You don’t think the teachers are Muslims? You don’t think the parents that send their kids there are Muslims?

  106. Education and Islam are not mutually exclusive. God created the universe. Gaining an understanding of the universe, including the earth and the things on it, can only be gained through education.

    Education doesn’t pull a Muslim away from God…it brings a Muslim closer to God.

    Ask one and find out.

  107. Whoops, I forgot to mention that the second Onion Booty quote was from 2 years ago on Letterman when the whole encounter was so sweet.

    Now we know it was really raaaaccccist!!!!!!

    Ah, the coveted victim status. Even the most privilege fucks in the world seek pity and political ammunition.

  108. Black Annie? LOL Who was that charge directed toward? Sony said the picture was “toxic” in those uncovered emails, so your secret is safe, Raji.

    Speaking of gutless, can you believe how gutless Sony is? Pulling the “Interview” movie on account of some nebulous threats?

  109. Speaking of bah humbug, you know you’re getting old when you wife kicks you out and sends you out on a Christmas errand to buy a KFC gift card. I kid you not. KFC!!! I honestly haven’t been in one in years. My hoodie smells like greasy fried chicken. You get about ten receipts for a $25.00 stocking stuffer.

    I told my love, “Damn, couldn’t we at least ante up to go large and get a Popeye’s fried chicken?”

    “They don’t have a Popeye’s in Stillwater. Just do as I tell you.”

    “What’s wrong? Ronald close his golden arches, or something?”

    Then I went over to Wallie Mart to buy another gift card – in the rain. Talk about moving from the frying pan to the fire. That store is insufferable when its empty. It’s an abomination at Christmas when your feet are wet. This gal in front of me had a butt like Michelle Obama – in sea green corduroy sweats. LOL I hung back about five feet, almost afraid to look.

    And Rutherford. You thought the Taylors were living large, hey? Real metrosexuals, here. 😈

  110. Amy Pascal’s racist emails are confirmation of the manipulative, exploitative relationship corporations like Sony have with Black folks.
    Demand Amy Pascal be fired from Sony Pictures Entertainment immediately.

    I kid you not. This is the email I got from ColorOfChange.org today. So now if you make juvenile jokes that reference race your job is at risk. Conjecturing which films Obama likes and then listing a bunch of black films seems to me pretty light stuff — and offensive only to the most thin skinned.

    More thoughts on Sony later.

  111. I like the irony too. Suggesting someone like her should be included in an affirmative action law was my letting off steam.

    Our grand daughter is doing fine. She is smart enough to operate electronic devices and she has removed the child protection devices on doors and put them back. She likes to dance at story time, and she engages people like a politician.

    However, our grand daughter talks but she is behind someone 18 months old. She babbles, laughs and makes her wishes known by pointing and gesturing. She also still has a small head. At its peak, it was in the bottom percentile of normal head size, but it is slowly shrinking. The last exam had her at the 2% range. Our daughter said darkly, her head is normal for a dwarf.

    She grew an inch but didn’t gain any weight this month.

    Her skull plates have not changed or shown the slightest inclination to fuse. Up until now, our grand daughters’ head while slowly retreating down the scale was growing, but it has not grown at all in the last month.

    The doctor doesn’t know what is happening, and our son in law doesn’t want to change doctors. He is also worried about his father’s declining health. He is not well enough for a trip down to see his grand daughter.

    This passivity is annoying me. Shouldn’t the doctor be researching the problem? Should she have another solution besides reviving her thoughts on MRI scans?
    I can’t find much yet, but one source used “urgent.” I can’t do much because she isn’t my kid, and her parents are already worried about her, but they don’t seem to do much.

    Frankly, until I get more information, I will remain terrified. I need to find more information.

    I am in such a mood that I am enjoying the hacking of Sony and their wimpy reaction. What bonehead thought that movie was a good idea? Now Obama is creating a new relationship with Cuba. How do those of you who voted for this man sleep at night?

  112. Is that a totally meaningless statement or is there something more to it?

    LOL you find most of my comments meaningless but to answer your question, Raji seemed to want Poolman to affirm whether he really meant what he said about false flag events and I was just telling her that similar to the mentally ill, Poolman should not be held responsible for his delusions. It was a (poor attempt at a) joke.

  113. Since I don’t believe Pools to be the evil fellow that some here think, I would like to propose an alternative explanation. I think that when an event is too horrific to fathom, the only way Poolman can process it is to deny it outright. His mass media manipulation conspiracies allow him to avoid the fact that evil can be perpetrated on a grand scale.

    Pools, serious question — are you a holocaust denier?

  114. Now I am aware that we produced a movie depicting the assassination of George W and some right-wingers got justifiably upset about it. Imagine our reaction if a foreign country produced a film, a comedy no less, about the murder of Barack Obama. We would go batshit crazy. Yet when Sony has the gall to produce a movie about the assassination of Kim Jong-Un, we are surprised when North Korea goes batshit crazy.

    As usual I’m guessing I am in the minority here, but I think Sony got EXACTLY what it deserved. Not only for its tasteless and offensive film but for also being stupid enough to have such lousy computer security that a hacker could get EVERYTHING on one fishing expedition.

    This new business of terrorist threats against theaters is of course waaaaaaaaaaaaay over the line. But the hacking — hell yeah. Maybe other studios will think twice before they produce a comedy about the murder of a current head of state — and they don’t even have the fucking brains to make the country and leader fictional.

  115. James I really feel for your frustration having to watch your granddaughter’s medical progress, powerless to intervene. Gently discuss your concerns with your daughter and perhaps propose it might be time for a new doctor. From the little I know about medicine, early intervention in ANY medical problem is always good.

    As for Cuba — I think its high time Cuba stopped being the bug-a-boo. It sounds so cold-war-ish. Then again, maybe we should ask Mitt Romney for his advice on this one? He was right on Russia.

  116. My wife just called from Omaha. Our daughter is still sick but she is at work. Our grand daughter recognized my voice and said “hi”. After a brief “conversation,” I said “Bye” and our grand daughter waved good bye. My wife may not be home before Friday because the car is acting up. I could drive down, but it wouldn’t accomplish much.

  117. Thanks Rutherford. I’ve tried gentle persuasion, but it hasn’t changed much. I need enough information to terrify them into action.

    I agree about Cuba, but it is not the president’s place to do much without consulting with Congress. I suspect he got rolled again. I also want to know Romney’s thoughts on Cuba.
    Romney was right about Russia as we know. I want to know if he would bail out Russia if it continues to panic, or if he would buy some more pop corn,

  118. It’s not just “liberal west coast folks”, R. It’s white “liberal” elitists and academia – the east coast may be worse. You think Jonathan Gruber thinks well of the black race?

    Most of these Leftists would view you as subhuman – too stupid to manage your own affairs, giving them an opportunity to use you to their advantage for political power and personal gain.

    One day, that will all slip out too. Then you’re going to face a tough personal decision. Your lifetime of indoctrination about racist Republicans? Or the truth…

  119. “Let’s not forget the added bonus for Rabbit, Tex, El Tigre, etal when the leaked emails reveal what friggin hypocrites the liberal west coast folks are.”

    Good. Now you know too. No sympathy for Sony and (to your surprise perhaps) some for the man behind whose back they hiss. Part of me wishes this would happen at the next Hollywood fundraiser –

    Hollywood Madam Pascal: “The content of my emails were insensitive and inappropriate but are not an accurate reflection of who I am. Although this was a private communication that was stolen, I accept full responsibility for what I wrote and apologize to everyone who was offended.”

    Barack: Fuck you.

    Michele: Ugly bitch.

  120. I remember Howard Cosell lost his job because he used the wrong word, and he was being complementary. As Huck wrote, “Now???”

  121. I see the First Horse’s Ass was busted for lying and playing race card as victim in People Magazine – about the only audience she’s got left. How stupid is this woman, who just two years ago relayed the same story in a much different light on a TV sit down?

    Can you imagine the unmitigated gall these class pieces of crap have trying to play themselves as victims? 😆 Good grief, they’ve lived like royalty the last six years.

    http://patdollard.com/2014/12/2-years-ago-michelle-obama-told-a-completely-different-story-about-being-asked-by-a-short-woman-to-reach-up-on-a-target-shelf-it-felt-so-good/

  122. Pools, serious question — are you a holocaust denier?

    That will get you jail time in some places, Rutherford. I don’t deny the suffering and death at all. Seriously though, it was MUCH worse in Russia with what they did to mostly Poles and we turned a blind eye. Not politically expedient for tptb apparently.

  123. Really Poolman?

    Yeah, really. That’s just skimming the surface. Check out Wolfgang Halbit (sp?) for in depth SH investigating. The ‘school’ was closed in 2008 because of asbestos. No emails or calls to or from SHE exist those years. A FEMA script of the event leaked. Too much to list…

  124. His mass media manipulation conspiracies allow him to avoid the fact that evil can be perpetrated on a grand scale.

    I don’t understand how you can arrive at that conclusion, Rutherford. The fact that the mass media IS involved in perpetrating and perpetuating evil is pretty grand a scale. I don’t think you believe evil can be perpetrated on as grand a scale as I believe it can and is. You don’t believe in witchcraft or the supernatural. That puts you at a disadvantage. I know where a third of the angelic host have been exiled and what they are capable of.

  125. The Gazebo to Nowhere was all we needed to know about Obama’s future presidency. The pattern has played out as it began when Barry was still a state senator. News reporters were more concerned about Palin’s scandals than Obama’s gazebo.

    “…that the mass media IS involved in perpetrating and perpetuating evil is pretty grand scale.” If there is an angelic host who have been exiled, they work for the progressive wing of the Democratic party, and some of them report the news.

  126. Huck raises a reasonable question about islam: “If “they” are brainwashed with Islam from childhood, and Islam hates education, then how is it that there are any schools to attack in the first place? ”

    Madrasas are not schools; they are indoctrination centres. And being “educated” in islam is not education – in any form of the word. Education is open, free, and evidence-based – not memorising the ravings of lunatics.

  127. Once again, Huck, the problem is not that these people are superstitious; superstition is a fact of life for humans; it’s woven into their genes. But it CAN be managed if you keep it out of government, and the Arabs haven’t done that.

    We’ve all seen it numerous times, but we never seem to learn: any time religion and government are mixed, the result is unfathomable misery for the governed.

  128. Tex I was serious…Don’t you remember the movie/musical “Annie”
    “The sun’ll come out tomorrow.,..”
    Apparently I’m in good company regarding a “black Annie”!

    Found some racists? No, definitely no racists. They can’t be racist, because all their tweets start with variations of: “I’m not a racist, but …”
    Do you have any examples? There’s “Not to be racist, but since when is Annie black?!”. And “I’m not racist but first the karate kid then Johnny Storm and now Annie!” And, obviously “I’m not racist or anything … But this new Annie movie is all mixed up!!! Annie is WHITE!!!!!!”
    How depressing. Whatever would Daddy Warbucks say? There is no Daddy Warbucks any more. He’s been replaced by Will Stacks, a telecommunications billionaire with mayoral ambitions, played by Jamie Foxx.
    What? This is an outrage! Not you, too. Anyway, we’re forgetting the real issue here.
    Which is? Why is anyone remaking Annie at all? It’s rubbish.

  129. Tex, a hint about buying gift cards. Your local grocery chain usually has a display rack offering a large selection of gift cards from various retail/online stores. One stop shopping.
    Yuck KFC!!!

  130. “Romney was right about Russia as we know. I want to know if he would bail out Russia if it continues to panic, or if he would buy some more pop corn,”-James

    Good one, James 🙂

    It saddens me to hear about the progress or rather lack of progress regarding your granddaughter. A second opinion is always useful as well as MRI’s that study the brain’s activity. However if your granddaughter has to be sedated for an MRI that activity cannot be monitored.

  131. Your local grocery chain usually has a display rack offering a large selection of gift cards from various retail/online stores. One stop shopping. Yuck KFC!!!

    Oh, I’ve purchased those before, Raji. But I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a KFC gift card. I’ve bought things like Applebee’s and Olive Garden from the local retailer. I don’t think my grocery stores stoop to KFC level. LOL Perhaps the strangest gift I’ve ever bought. 🙂

    My father-in-law is a good guy. Good enough that occasionally, I wish he’d offer a suggestion to life now and then. After my mother-in-law died by in ’97, my father-in-law pretty much went off the grid, never remarried though every bachelorette older than 60 in town would have hooked him, did his own thing like flying around the country in his Cessna and moving to a small condo. But his idea of a good meal went off the grid too, I think. At 85, we pretty much are out of ideas what to buy him. He’s such a simple guy with a simple life, KFC it is.

  132. Yes Rutherford, I have a problem with a black Annie or any Annie that doesn’t have red hair. Why is anyone remaking Annie at all. It’s the same problem I have with a lot of things Hollywood does. Actually if you look back into movie history it is common for Hollywood to change a character from white to black to entice a new audience.

    Annie was all about a redheaded orphan and her dog Sandy rescued by Daddy Warbucks. Do you want to see a remake of Pretty Woman starring Beyonce over Julia Roberts? The only reason for remakes of this nature is $$$

    However on the other hand I have no problem with a black Santa or a black Jesus.

  133. Thanks, Ragi. I made a lot of phone calls before someone gave me a web site with lists of conditions. None I found fit, and the closest one made chills.. Our grand daughter was eighteen months old on the ninth, and the progression of this condition is deterioration after eighteen months. Our grand daughter is doing fine, but I don’t know how definite the time line is or even if there is a possibility she might have the condition, so I am not letting it worry me much. I am more than ever determined to suggest a genetic test. One of the symptions is irreconcileable sobbing, and that is also the parents. I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.,

    I had an MRI scan for my back. It is a pleasant experience and nap inducing. If I could, I would hold our grand daughter still and ride inside with her. Putting someone under carries risks. Our son in law’s father learned that lesson twice when his hip was replaced a month ago. I’d rather ask about a genetic test and a second opinion first.

    I don’t think our move toward Cuba does much for Russia either way. If anything, it helps Russia. Cuba gets a little economically stronger, and we help preserve the regime.

    I like KFC.

    If we can have a black Annie, why not a white Micheal Jordon in a movie?

    Jesus may well have been black, or at least Semitic brown, He certainly wasn’t Germatic. white.

  134. I’m still laughing at the remake of ‘The Wizard of Oz’ with the black cast. Nothing greater than an Aunt Em in black face. You’d think these black racialists could at least come up with something original – besides slavery and raunchy. Hell, a bunch of white folk created The Lion King. LOL

    Something must have happened after Motown – we went from great music to Hip Hop & C(rap). From Smokey Robinson to Luther Campbell, from Lena Horn to Beyonce’. Gawd….it’s bleak out there.

  135. I had an MRI scan for my back. It is a pleasant experience and nap inducing.-James

    No Way Jose ! You’ll have to put me 6 feet under before I would willing get an MRI

  136. Well James, I rate it better than 2 Live Crew. 😉

    I have been keeping abreast of your family situation and don’t have much else to say or offer that hasn’t been said besides, “You’re one of the good guys and you are in my thoughts.”

  137. Raji, you must have a sentimental attachment to Annie. They are rare but there are red-headed blacks. Of course the Wizard of Oz was remade black (The Wiz).

    The only thing I could find offensive about a black Annie is the implicit message that a black audience can’t “relate” to a white Annie. That’s ridiculous or at least it should be.

  138. James I love you man but a white Michael Jordan? Jordan is a real man. Annie is a fictional character subject to artistic interpretation.

    As for MRI’s, if it’s the machine I think it is, it’s murder for claustrophobic folks.

  139. “Madrasas are not schools”

    Your logic is still not squaring.

    If Muslims only attend religious schools that perform indoctrination and not education, then why do you claim they are being killed because Muslims hate education? You don’t kill people for attending indoctrination if indoctrination is your goal.

    If these people and places are being attacked because Muslims hate education, then you have to concede that these places are performing education. You have to concede those teaching there are educators. And you have to concede those attending are being educated. And those concessions, in turn, defeat your premise.

    Actually, the group responsible for this latest attack has already given its reasoning. They said Pakistan has killed their sons and daughters in attacks on them, so they wanted Pakistan to feel their pain. This was a revenge killing, not religiously motivated.

    “the Arabs haven’t done that.”

    Taliban aren’t Arabs.

  140. Ooooo Tex, I just read something and I could feel your blood pressure rising. I’m reading this book “This Town” by Mark Liebovich (sp), basically a gossip rag about Washington.

    Guess who is a great personal (not political) fan of Barack Obama and whose wife loves Michelle? None other than Tom Coburn! When I read that I thought of you and cracked up.

  141. The move with Cuba has nothing to do with Russia. No doubt it is a beneficial first step in altering our position in Latin America. Cuba knows Maduro of Venezuela is no Chavez so making nice with the Yanqui is not a bad thing. The regime will also be able to spin and overtly manipulate this to their advantage which is why too many GOPers are having their faux strokes.
    Its a good idea,long overdue and in the best interest of the USA.

  142. Guess who is a great personal (not political) fan of Barack Obama and whose wife loves Michelle? None other than Tom Coburn! When I read that I thought of you and cracked up.

    Oh, no Dear. They make a huge stink about that here in T-Town since this is Tom’s adopted home town and the local Leftist rag is still trying to make the case that President Fidel Asshole and his Horse’s Ass wife are just “misunderstood.”

    I’m not sure how much weight you ought to put in those statements – that’s sounds a whole lot contrived to me. But if it makes you feel better, you go ahead and believe that.

  143. You know there have been recent episodes where the Russians looked like they were getting involved again with Havana but I think the cards on the table shows that was (just as the October long ago) more to the lasting benefit of Moscow.
    Streamlining remittances and getting some gringo tourists who fear Mexico is a great deal for Havana

  144. The school targeted clearly has ties with a certain side of Pakistani society. Still just like Beslan there is a distinct level of barbarism that is both stoked by and “excused” a certain Abrahamics faith….

  145. Oh I’m not saying there aren’t idiots who attack schools in the name of Islam, and they make no bones about doing it. And for the record, I’m not even saying that the sentiment Parker described is non-existent. It’s a tragic and unfortunate reality that it does indeed exist.

    But what I am saying is that its the exception and not the rule, and that there are flaws in the logic he is offering, which I have pointed out.

    And I’m sure this school was specially selected. My understanding is it is a military school, and that a lot of people who send their kids there do so because it has a higher standard of education. (so it probably costs more, which means the kids come from higher class families).

  146. The school was targeted because it is where the PAKMIL soldiers, officers in particular, send their children.

    Pfesser is an idiot, and I agree with Huck 100%. There are lots of reasons to not like radical/fundamental Islam, but to say that they are against education is ludicrous. Multiple advancements of science and medicine came out of 7th and 8th century Islam, which is what today’s radical Islam purports to replicate. The challenge to education in most Islamic states lies in socio-economics and socio-political opportunities and freedoms. Education is one of the greatest indicators of these two things…

  147. Rutherford, I wouldn’t mind seeing a movie with a black Elvis. Real or not, anyone in a movie or book is fictionalized for dramatic effect.
    Thanks for the good thoughts. Last night, my wife told me that our daughter said our grand daughter has an affinity for me that she has for no one else. That is quite a statement from her parent. So far, I can’t find a single condition that matches our daughter. The closest takes effect at about 18 months, but so far, our grand daughter is progressing fine with no “Flowers for Algernon” yet.

  148. “but to say that they (islamists) are against education is ludicrous. Multiple advancements of science and medicine came out of 7th and 8th century Islam”

    Good example.

  149. Ambulance-chaser #1: “The challenge to education in most Islamic states lies in socio-economics and socio-political opportunities and freedoms.”

    “socio-economics and socio-political opportunities and freedoms” – god, did you really say that? Spoken like a true liberal.

    OTOH, it may be that the Arabs are poor because they make poor decisions – like making little boys study the koran while rocking back and forth, instead of studying biochemistry and differential equations – and forbidding little girls ANY education, lest they get acid in the face, or a bullet through their right frontal lobes. Open your eyes, F. Lee.

  150. Cuba snookered Obama as the Gazebo to Nowhere hoodwinked Barry years ago. I earlier wrote that this has little or no effect on Russia, but aside from its improving the economic lives of some Cubans, it gives the regime some legitimacy and longevity.

    Obama said the old restrictions haven’t “worked”. They have arguably hampered Cuba’s attempts to spread its revolution through the western hemisphere. Mistreatment of the Cuban people remains, and that won’t change. They probably will stay on the Peso economy instead of the dollar as is the case now. How will Obama’s new policy “work”?

    An applicant for an administration job promised Congresspeople that Obama didn’t intend to do what he did. If those people didn’t lie, they would not be able to talk.

    Obama should have negotiated some concessions from the Cubans, but he didn’t. Once he is a civilian, he needs a friend or relative to buy his cars. Otherwise, Obama will be cheated.

    Yes, Islamists value education. They also use technology better than many of us. So called lone wolves are encouraged and nurtured through social media from thousands of miles away. Lone wolves will flourish and multiply until we destroy the source of the contagen.

    Tex, I’m glad you tolerated the Lativan song. Our grand daughter likes it. She dances and waves her arms as the Samata does.

  151. “And I’m sure this school was specially selected. My understanding is it is a military school, and that a lot of people who send their kids there do so because it has a higher standard of education. (so it probably costs more, which means the kids come from higher class families).”

    Huck – I would submit that it doesn’t matter WHY they picked THIS school. Is that supposed to be some sort of justification for indiscriminate slaughter of hundreds of children? It’s not OK, but it’s MORE OK than if these were not the kids of military people?

    What drives such murderers to such unspeakable acts? Religious zealotry and the perception that these kids will grow up, join the army, and oppose their “caliphate.” Feh. Makes me want to vomit.

  152. Spoken like a true liberal.” PFraud

    Of course, you know the Liberal Party is the Conservative Party in Australia…right….

    I’m not sure why you continue this fraud, but whatever. Socio-economics and socio-politics are real things, so what exactly is your contention with those terms? Your lack of understanding what they are?

    You’re twisting facts for an agenda, and Huck called you on it. If you want to criticize the content of education, I suppose there are points to it, but to say that the concept of “education” writ large is the antithesis of Islam is ignorant and stupid. I’m not a fan of political Islam–don’t think there’s ever confusion on that–but I don’t throw the religion under the bus.

    Besides, I’m not sure why we should listen to someone who doesn’t even know what ADF stands for…

  153. Ambulance chaser #1? F. Lee?

    Set your toddy down, moron. G ain’t no lawyer. He’s a respectable human being.

    Which also means he ain’t no arrogant, drunk, failed radiologist from West Virginia pretending to be an Australian.

    Chances are Gorilla has more first-hand experience with the people you pontificate about than anyone here.

  154. Parker, I’m as critical of organized religion as the next guy but you’ve stretched your point to the breaking point.

    Harvard- religious at its founding
    Yale – religious at its founding

    That’s just two easy low hanging fruit. Ok, they’re Christian but as has been noted, long ago Islam was the source of intellectual advancement.

    A big bravo to Gorilla (no sarcasm intended) for differentiating between political Islam and the religion/culture.

    But Parker, that does circle back to one of your points with which I agree. When you mix politics/government with religion, bad things happen.

  155. You don’t think government isn’t your religion, Rutherford? That’s as close as you get to worshiping something bigger than you.

    For a “religious” person, I’ve never understood how people could require the separation between faith and government. I understand the concept of not forcing. That is Sharia. But as my favorite 20th century philosopher once said:

    I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.

    And as I’ve often noted before there is indeed a history of bad brew of mixing government and religion when the religion becomes your government. There’s an even worse one when government becomes your religion and the religion rendered unnecessary.

  156. “Raji seemed to want Poolman to affirm whether he really meant what he said about false flag events and I was just telling her that similar to the mentally ill, Poolman should not be held responsible for his delusions. It was a (poor attempt at a) joke.” -R

    Well it isn’t funny. Try for meaningful next time.

  157. I read a really interesting comment yesterday from a very smart gal.

    She noted that she worked for a company that was so large and so established in the late 80s, that she surmised back then a great deal of time would pass before anyone notice the business model had dramatically failed, hidden from sight because of large capital reserves, position and cash flow. Sure enough over a period of a few years, the company failed, finally forced into bankruptcy – and both executive management and the business world were stunned as the collapse dramatic.

    And this gal then went on to make the same analogy to the current state of our federal government and country. Our entire system has collapsed. But America is so large, so rich and so powerful, few are noticing the extent of the collapse yet. And she used the Sony hack job as an example – how the once greatest nation on earth not only has been round housed by perhaps the most dysfunctional nation on earth, but doesn’t even have a clue how to react. We sit here paralyzed.

    I think she’s right. The government has collapsed, America’s days are numbered and the collapse will be dramatic. Barack Obama and his cabinet were not the sole cause of the collapse and perhaps it inevitable without a useful idiot like Obama leading. But Obama accelerated the demise – the wrong man at the worst possible time. We needed a visionary and got the consummate reactionary.

  158. “When you mix politics/government with religion, bad things happen.

    How do you account for the “bad thing” happening right now? Worst condition this country has been in since its inception, or do you disagree?

    Now let’s see who the denier is. Wink.

  159. Speaking of consummate reactionaries, thought some of you might find this interesting and enlightening.

    And I would remind everyone as most of us concluded long ago, Obamacare a disaster in the making. But there are at least two believing Obamacare didn’t go far enough – what we really needed as a nation was a single-payer health system.

    What many might not have known (I didn’t), one state actually implemented a single payer system – IMO, the most liberal state in the nation. Unfortunately, this week they were forced to pull the plug on their single payer experiment.

    As Vermont Goes . . .

  160. Tex I would be the first to concede total separation of church and state is not possible as religion influences the outlook of adherents who serve in government. In the case of religion’s GOOD teachings, this is a very good thing.

  161. Well it isn’t funny. Try for meaningful next time.

    Muffy, you know those rails we install on beds to keep toddlers from falling out of bed? I suggest you install one on that wrong side of the bed you keep getting up on. 🙂

    P.S. Oh no, another meaningless joke.

  162. We needed a visionary and got the consummate reactionary.

    Now you’re talking my language. I think this is a very fair statement.

    Part of that bigness is beauracracy. Studies have shown that no matter how loud the leaf level of an organization screams, the scream will be stifled by the time we get to the decision makers. In one course I took on social psychology they talked about the phenom of everyone supporting a project they didn’t believe in because they thought everyone ELSE supported it.

    The only fully effective team I ever worked on was an autonomous group of about a half dozen folks.

  163. Worst condition this country has been in since its inception, or do you disagree?

    Directed at Parker but I’m chiming in anyway.

    Worst condition? Country torn apart by civil war in the 1860’s. Bread lines in the 1930’s. Are you serious?

    But let’s run with your absurd assertion for a moment. Do you believe some decrease in religious fervor is to blame for our current state?

  164. “Was that “meaningful”?” -R

    Absolutely. Do you have any question as to my meaning with that remark?

    You want to revisit your “poor attempt at a joke” – which I thought was a fair description for it – that’s fine with me though. I took your reply indicate that your original remark was meaningless.

    Not so?

  165. “Directed at Parker but I’m chiming in anyway.

    Worst condition? Country torn apart by civil war in the 1860’s. Bread lines in the 1930’s. Are you serious?”

    But let’s run with your absurd assertion for a moment. Do you believe some decrease in religious fervor is to blame for our current state?

    Not directed at Pfibber. The quote was yours. And yes I’m serious.

    The civil war lasted 4 years? at a cost of (conservative estimate) over 600,000 deaths. It ended slavery. The sacrifices were the greatest anyone can give, and the end result was the intended goal achieved. Sorry if that wasn’t enough sacrifice to qualify as a good thing for the nation in your book. If the word “conditions” is tripping you up, I can understand that. But substitute whatever word you like – we are as torn as we’ve ever been, just not as selfless and willing to sacrifice all. Yet.

    As far as the bread lines – can you say for sure or even hopeful that we’ll get out of this mess we’re in? We’re in different lines today, but lining up for “aid” just the same. What would the lines look like if we didn’t put everything on a credit card like we do now? The national debt is real. The people in the bread lines sacrificed today for a better tomorrow. You can’t say that boomers have done the same. Today’s gluttonous grownups are sticking our kids and grandkids with the bill.

    As to “[running] with my absurd assertion – I think what you really want to do it run AWAY from it by answering a question with another question. It’s your m. o. So let’s stay with it at least until you give some thought to the question.

    How do you account for the “bad thing” happening with our country right now?

  166. Meaningless is a bit like pregnant. It’s boolean. Since I explained my meaning and with your imagination you could certainly surmise a meaning, it wasn’t meaningless.

  167. Ugh. Messed up the blockheadquotes in both comments. The first one is clear enough but as to the second one – my voice should start with “Not directed at Pfibber.” The line before that belongs up with Rutherford’s voice.

  168. “Meaningless is a bit like pregnant. It’s boolean. Since I explained my meaning and with your imagination you could certainly surmise a meaning, it wasn’t meaningless.”

    Wha??

    Saying something is a “poor attempt at a joke” is EXPLAINING ANY MEANING AWAY.

    OK then it WASN’T meaningless – what did it mean?

    “He is not responsible for his delusions.”

    For the last time What Does That Mean??

  169. Ahhhh we’ve got that pesky problem of words mattering again. Yes “condition” tripped me up. Your assertion taken literally was ridiculous.

    Now, to answer your question, you did a decent job of diagnosing our current state in your last comment. Some of it comes down to selfishness. Obviously some of it the government continuing to spend money it doesn’t have. I’d add to that a business sector that never properly adjusted to globalization.

    BUT your original comment was a reaction to my comment (echoing Parker) about religion. So I ask you again, do you believe some decrease in religiosity is to blame for our current state?

  170. In that piece Tigre posted, is Cassandra for real? Guy said he’d marry her if she had sex with him. Then she cheats on him. Guy calls off marriage and she wants to retroactively call it rape?

    That’s gotta be a parody.

  171. He is not responsible for his delusions.”

    For the last time What Does That Mean??

    Muffy have you never before heard the passive-aggressive put-down, “Don’t judge Joe, he’s not in his right mind”? That’s the meaning I was intending.

    If it needs more explanation, I can’t help you.

  172. I wasn’t diagnosing I was describing.

    I think the human conditions are the worst they’ve ever been in America. By your own grainy admission too much spirituality isn’t a root cause. You and Pfester have never even been able to come up with justification for lumping all religions together without going back over 300 years for 20 deaths which you’re forced to milk.

    Birth and reproduction – more abortions than ever. Monsters like Gosnell all but ignored by the media and the left. I posted the stats awhile back for NYC birth rates. You probably didn’t read them but you should have. More abortions than births among certain groups. Some couples are deciding against children – choosing more than ever not to start families. Do you think that mindset is on the decline? It isn’t. And those who have young children are anxious about their children’s futures now more than ever. And on the flip side far too many who can’t afford to are having babies and relying on the government and the rest of us to raise them. Generational dependency, yahoo.

    In the time of the civil war Americans worried their children would grow up without their father who was on the battlefield. Now we don’t even value fatherhood. Or even men. Did you read that link Tigre just put up? Funny – at first. And then as you go on it sinks in that every one of those women were serious. And then it ceases to be all that funny.

    Childhood – think about it. Think kids have it easier today? Carefree – that’s what we were.

    How about adolescence? Love? Sex? Aging? Death?

    Has any of these conditions deteriorated because of too much religion?

    “So I ask you again, do you believe some decrease in religiosity is to blame for our current state?

    Decrease in “religiosity?” No.

  173. “it may be that the Arabs are poor because they make poor decisions”

    Taliban still aren’t Arabs. In fact, the majority of Muslims aren’t. You’re generalizing based on stereotype.

    “forbidding little girls ANY education”

    More generalizing with words like “forbidding”.

    “Good example.”

    Actually, it is. It shows that it’s not purely Islam that is the factor in what we are seeing. If it were, then those advancements, even so long ago, wouldn’t have happened where they did.

    There’s something else going on. And probably multiple things.

    “Is that supposed to be some sort of justification for indiscriminate slaughter of hundreds of children?”

    Please give me more credit that this. Maybe to you it doesn’t matter why that target was selected. But to the people who did it, it did matter. That’s all I was saying, and I thought that was fairly obvious.


    !!!IRONY ALERT!!!

    Barack Obama, the guy who imprisoned a filmmaker and told the world for weeks that we were attacked because some guy exercised his 1st Amendment rights, said today:

    “We cannot have a society in which some dictator someplace can start imposing censorship here in the United States…. I wish they would have spoken to me first.”

  174. Childhood – think about it. Think kids have it easier today? Carefree – that’s what we were.

    You do realize you’re nostalgic for a childhood not all of us had. Mine was relatively care-free as I suppose was yours but that hardly makes it universal, even in America.

    And we must not forget that the communications revolution has altered childhood. It’s corny but there is a PSA where Matt Lauer compares navigating the Internet to crossing the street and says parents need to be a crossing guard. I would say cable and the net have altered childhood substantially.

  175. Tex that feminism thing brought back a memory. It involved a woman I knew before I met my wife. On the phone one night I savaged her then BF whom I felt had mistreated her. When the convo was over, she said I “emotionally raped” her. Until I read the story you posted I didn’t believe other women talked that way.

  176. “You do realize you’re nostalgic for a childhood not all of us had. Mine was relatively care-free as I suppose was yours but that hardly makes it universal, even in America.”

    I knew you would zero in on that. Yes. I do realize, Rutherford. There are also children in loving homes embodying a relatively carefree childhood today. That’s why I said “think about it.” I was optimistic that you’d resist the temptation to quibble first and rather reflect on the human condition of childhood along with the others I mentioned, and what role religion plays in any decline of the American empire.

  177. Muffy, just so it’s clear. I don’t think a return to faith for most people would make matters worse. How much it would help I’m not sure.

    I really focused on your childhood statement not just to ding you but to point out some of the complexities that contribute to harder childhoods nowadays.

  178. Huck@6:26 – re: irony. Right on the money.

    re: Arab accomplishments hundreds (thousands) of years ago. True enough. They also served as a repository for knowledge when the christians were rampaging across Europe and making sure science didn’t discover anything that countermanded dogma – during that time when christian religion ruled the “civilized” world. (known as the “Dark Ages.”)

    But that was a long time ago. Fast forward a few hundred years: science begins to nibble around the edges of superstition. Two of the Desert Religions see the writing on the wall and make accommodation with it: Judaism and christianity. Islam never did, and has not to this day.


    Which brings us to now. The Jews accomplish more on a good Thursday than the islamists do in a good millenium. Christians generally aren’t as smart, so they take maybe take a little longer but still give a good accounting of themselves. The Indians positively dominate mathematics at any good institution; Chinese students are legendary everywhere. Islamists grow beards, send little boys to “schools” that teach NO science – just koran – and throw acid on little girls who want to learn.

    What do the former have in common? They are believers, but do not allow their superstition to dictate their politics. The latter? You guessed it.

    Perhaps a lesson for America.

  179. Rutherford –
    The hardest thing is to make the right-wingers understand that there really is no black and white. Not all things about religion are bad. Actually, the christian gathering of people on Sundays to reaffirm their connections and receive lectures on the proper way to behave is a good thing, and in point of fact, I doubt they would do it absent some motivation, such as religion. I think Tex has a good point that the US nation is in decline – and from where I stand, it’s doing it in a headlong rush. No need to go into the mind-numbing stats about illegitimate birth in the US or the state of young black men there. Much of your problems can be traced to the lack of a guiding force, and religion certainly can provide that force.

    But the fact is that religion, by any measure, is simply superstition, and when you let that into the political process, there is always trouble. Always. And you, Mr. Lawson, can thank your Mr. Jefferson and others for observing the ultimate result of mixing religion and politics elsewhere – and forbidding in their new country.

    Depend upon it, sir: Americans have promoted the metastasis of christianity through their tax laws, and your country could be just like Pakistan were it not for the foresight of your founders.

  180. “Until I read the story you posted I didn’t believe other women talked that way.”-R

    Oh yes they do Rutherford!!1
    The scariest movie I ever watched was Fatal Attraction. I’m not sure which was the scariest, the movie or the 6 divorced women sitting with me.

  181. It’s amazing that a conspiracy rag has the gall to call itself “Veterans Today”. Dishonors veterans everywhere.

    Actually they do more for veterans than your chosen administration does, or any previous ones have. I think your mainstream media has gall to call what it broadcasts journalism or news. They’re proven liars and propaganda disseminators.

    Dishonors thinking people everywhere.

  182. @ Rutherford I have finally got my hands on a copy (digital at that) of Riley’s book. WOW! I’m only two chapters in but find it powerful and well written with good sourcing to data if one wishes to doubt or disparage the pouring truth in it.

  183. If we’re isolating decline to moral decline the USA doesn’t stand alone by any stretch of the imagination. The entire Anglosphere is in decline in that category.
    I think some of the lumping and dumping going on in this thread regards faith and state performance is out of line with deeper realities.
    International science is and has for a long time been driven by the nation that chose not to embrace the Metric System…THE USA
    This is a fact driven by a number of variables and the symbol on the roof of your chosen place of worship isn’t one of them.
    Lest we forget a number of the “knuckle dragging less enlightened faith dominant” nations have figured out everything from prosthetics unique to their culture [1], pharmaceuticals[2] ,chemicals, [2] aerospace[1] and the atom[2].
    [1] hinduism/ islam dominant
    [2] hindu,islam,buddhism

  184. The Sony CEO said they did speak to a senior adviser, but Obama said the company didn’t call him. He wished they had. Who are you going to believe?

    Scientists have shown that we are programmed for religion. I think all cultures have some sort of religion. The predilection goes back to the Neanderthals. Religion is not a blind following. It has survival value or spirituality would not have survived for thousands of years. it may be a subconscious fostered group ritual based on a childhood instinct to depend on parents for guidance and safety.

    Even atheists are religious. They worship money, their political ideologies, or themselves.

    Christians and Jews are not going to commit the widespread dangerous acts Muslims do, though they once did. Their culture has changed. A large group of Muslims are still wedded to the old drive for political and economic conquest. Religion is a vehicle for non-spiritual ambitions.

    I think religion is a greater benefit than detriment. It encourages morality and responsibility. The Sami people, for example use ritualistic chants as some Native Americans do. Community is reinforced because they don’t sing about something. They become what they are singing.

    Religion in its place benefits society..

  185. Christians and Jews are not going to commit the widespread dangerous acts Muslims do, though they once did. Their culture has changed. A large group of Muslims are still wedded to the old drive for political and economic conquest. Religion is a vehicle for non-spiritual ambitions.
    James you make a great point here and I’d love to explore it a little.

    First the dangerous acts bit isn’t inclusive of a 100% entity but that is kind of a given.
    The thinking that cultures have changed for anyone is an interesting point. Islamic culture has experienced a number of full spectrum swings in its history. It always seems to lean towards an extreme. Its swings are also very quick in historical/anthropological terms. For example mid 20th century Afghanistan had a very Western appearance in dress and manner.
    Muslims and Hindus are very much wed to a drive of political and economic conquest. This is a s you note tied to religion being a vehicle for non-spiritual ambitions. Universally that is called nationalism and that of course has various sub-categories that literally litter the historical landscape. (Nazism,Fascism,Arabism,Communism,Marxism etc etc)

  186. The scariest movie I ever watched was Fatal Attraction. I’m not sure which was the scariest, the movie or the 6 divorced women sitting with me.

    😆

    I had a stalker once. And it was just right before the Fatal Attraction movie released and just about the same time I started dating my wife. I think I’ve talked about her here. Not on the level of Glenn Close as this gal didn’t try to kill me and I didn’t have any rabbits. But she broke into my apartment and shuffled through my personals then accused me of “keying” her car, before calling a girl I was dating in Dallas and telling her we were married. That ended that. She’d show up at my apartment before I arrived home from a softball game late at night and hide in the bushes, meeting me at the door when I got home. I didn’t have the sense to be afraid. I’ve often wondered since I had some time to contemplate that movie, what I would have done had she put a pistol in my mouth for good measure.

    It was really kind of tragic because she was a pretty gal – even named home coming queen in high school. But sometime between then and her mid 20s, a screw popped loose somewhere. Whatever it was, she went from normal office worker friend at first and great coed female softball player (prettiest legs I’ve ever seen when she wasn’t sliding into second base), to woman scorned.

    I learned when some woman looks at you with far away eyes and says, “I love you” without knowing a damn thing about you besides how you throw a softball, you don’t answer back in startled fashion, “Well, I love you too.”

    Oops. Man, was I stupid. I feel a measure of guilt to this day for letting that go anywhere. Legs overruled brain, I think. At least I wasn’t married. 😈

  187. Parker, the bottom line is there is line after line after line in the multiple sources of the Islamic faith that show a reverence for education. There is NOTHING in any of those sources that show it is against education.

    How the people who practice that faith have or have not progressed as a whole doesn’t change that fact. How current individuals and micro-groups act against education does not change that fact.

    Islam is not against education. You have not proven that it is, because you cannot prove that it is. You’re offering weak circumstantial evidence that is so shoddy it isn’t even able to sway anyone in this group—and that’s saying something.

  188. I like your comment alfie.

    I’m not trying to say Christians and Jews might not some day reverse positions with stereotyped Muslims. I think our cultures are layered like onions. Newer, less internalized traits are adopted and may abruptly change a society’s beliefs and behavior, but underlying attitudes and values remain from ancient times.

    For example we know northern Europeans tend to be less publically expressive than southerners. Thisislotta, a Finish vlogger attempted to explain Finnish introversion as a feature of her native language. Expressing affection and emotion in Finish is embarrassing and awkward.

    I think it is more than that. Northern Europeans brought the old attitudes to America, and after several generations here, they remain relatively reserved. Blacks and Hispanics are different, not in a bad way, just different. I told you how an Italian woman discovered she could herd Swedes across a room at a party.

    Research shows Dutch,, British, and German farmers tend to run their businesses differently. Our area has some Czech farmers who retreated from Nebraska during the Dust Bowl. They operate almost like a tribe as families run their operations in common .

    We are so modern most of us have forgotten the stone age and neolithic ways we value during religious holidays. Christmas and other holidays are on dates established as far back as the Ice Age.

    Christmas trees may honor a red and white round mushroom which enjoys a symbolic relationship with evergreen trees.,Santa and his reindeer may be a manifestation of a drug high, and Rudolph may have been eating the magic mushroom. Reindeer seek them out as elephants go after fermented fruit. Thor, called Donner in Germany rode through the air in a cart pulled by two goats. Maybe Santa borrowed the concept.

    We decorate our Christmas trees with glass balls similar to decorations similar to what honored the mushroom and the spirit world.

    As we watch religious and other wars, I wonder how much free will we actually have. Are we merely re enacting a script written by the dead hand of ancestors ten thousand years old?

  189. As we watch religious and other wars, I wonder how much free will we actually have. Are we merely re enacting a script written by the dead hand of ancestors ten thousand years old?-James @2:43 PM

    Excellent point James. They do say history repeats itself but what version of history should we believe?

    There is a book, The Crusades Through Arab Eyes, published in 1989 which gives a different version of the Crusades from that of the West.

    “European and Arab versions of the Crusades have little in common. What the West remembers as an epic effort to reconquer the Holy Land is portrayed here as a brutal, destructive, unprovoked invasion by barbarian hordes. When, under Saladin, a powerful Muslim army – inspired by prophets and poets – defeated the Crusaders, it was the greatest victory ever won by a non-European society against the West. The Arab version of the Crusades is a heroic story of how the Muslims overcame their rivalries and united long enough to win a holy war.”

    Shouldn’t we be educated in all the versions to avoid repeating history or do we lack the free will to which James alluded?

  190. Ha Ha Raji! Tex and I must be cursed with good looks and charm.

    “Taking over this town should worry, but these problems aside I think I taught you well.
    That we won’t run.” This song alludes to a script we may be following.

    I totally agree with you Ragi. We should educate ourselves in all versions. But as you know, it is easier said than done.

    The numerous visible mutations ‘whites” have and the unusual number of European languages testify to brutality which extends back a very long time in history. Neanderthals probably muttered about the invading foreign devils. “Whites” have a natural affinity for internecine brutality. Other “races” do too but “whites” of all shades do it better.

  191. Ragnar borhallsson and Nanna Hilmarsdottir said “we’re thinking about the human being as an animal. The raw animal instinct of a human being. Its like, how bad can people be?”
    Its in the news every day.

  192. Now that we’ve got two dead NYC cops, what does Comrade DeBlasio have to say for himself? Does that make everything even? Still going to buddy up to $harpton, Comrade Asshole?

  193. The Sony CEO said they did speak to a senior adviser, but Obama said the company didn’t call him. He wished they had. Who are you going to believe?

    James I think you’ve got this backward. Sony asked for the administrations advice while they were making the movie. Press Secretary Josh Earnest was a bit squirrely about what advice the admin gave Sony.

    As for the decision to stop release, I’ve seen no evidence that Sony asked for advice on that. They made the decision primarily based on scared theaters refusing to screen it.

    So yes, if they had asked Obama he would have advised them to keep the film in circulation. If you can cite me a source that says otherwise, I’ll read it.

  194. Alfie, yes the Jason Riley book is a good read and eye opener. I owe all you guys a book review but just haven’t tied myself down to the desk to write it.

    My wife is in the hospital right now recovering from surgery to fix a “female problem”. That was the euphemism I always heard as a kid. For Tex who has the medical background, imagine a fibroid as big as a cantaloupe.

    She’s doing fine and will be released tomorrow or Monday.

  195. Damn, I WISH I had been stalked. It took me to my late 30’s to get a woman interested in me but that is also when I learned I was good at phone seduction. That was long before my tracheostomy ruined my then radio-friendly voice.

    I can hear Muffy now thinking “I can’t IMAGINE why Rutherford wasn’t reeling in the women with his charm.” 🙂

  196. I think everyone has done a good job of addressing the simplicity and error of Parker’s analysis of Islam.

    RADICAL Islam has ruined the religion and made it an easy target for irrational and unfounded criticisms.

  197. Could someone tell me why Cuba has folks panties in a knot when we have allies who don’t let women drive, make them keep their head covered in public and chop heads off as a form of capital punishment?

    Since when did we get so choosy about with whom we have diplomatic relations? Give me a huge fucking break!

  198. Bet that makes you glad you don’t have a set of ovaries.

    Damn straight Skippy. Between the monthly flow and the problems when the machine stops working, I wouldn’t be a woman for all the money in the world.

  199. Between the monthly flow and the problems when the machine stops working

    Hormonally, they are indeed some incredibly complex creatures. Guess that is what makes them so beautiful. Since neither my wife nor daughters ever had any of the “female” problems, they always told me it was “no big deal.”

    Anything that is an inconvenience, always seems a BIG DEAL to me. I complain about having to get up and night and pee now at least once. That’s a BIG DEAL.

    P.S. Wait until you see your daughter in a wedding dress, “R.” It will send shivers down your spine – about how pretty they look and how much they cost. 😀

  200. Rutherford, Sony Pictures CEO Micheal Lynton said “We definitely spoke to a senior adviser in the white House to talk about the situation. The fact is, did we talk to the president himself? The White House was certainly aware of the situation.”

    You could be right about the timing, but “the situation” tells me the conversation happened after North Korea was making threats. When the movie was still in production, this contratemps was just simmering.

    I hope your wife feels better soon. Tex is right about seeing your daughter in a wedding gown.

    Cuba is a relic of the cold war, and as such it has a history of propagating revolutionary movements in mostly Central and South America. Our restrictive actions have made the Castros less able to do the mischief they intended. Cubans are repressed and mistreated.

    Other countries like China and Vietnam made adjustments before better relations came from the US. Vietnam, for example, withdrew from Cambodia before we offered better economic terms.

    The US also has an expatriot Cuban population, many of whom lost everything to flee to freedom. They still have Cuban relatives who have suffered under the Castro regime. The Cuban-Americans are well organized and know how to persuade politicians to keep sanctions against Cuba. They have more votes than Saudi Arabian Americans.

    Obama should have negotiated some concessions from Cuba. As it is Cuba is another Gazabo to Nowhere,

  201. Anybody heard from Br’er Rabbit? His last topic was on a cancer (potential cancer, pre-cancer?) related to tobacco. Hope his absence is due to xmas commitments.

    All best to your wife, R. The holidays are no time to be confined to hospital. Be glad she’s getting rid of her ute; they are nothing but trouble after menopause. So are the ovaries – might as well do a cleanout, as my GYN neighbor says.

  202. Sorry about that. I’m fine. The dentist was wrong, my gums were back to normal after two days but I quit anyways. One of my triggers to use was the internet, so I’m avoiding it.

    I’ve just been super busy.

  203. Br’er Rabbit – re: gum disease. Don’t know what you had, but I had an infection under one gum and I couldn’t get rid of it. Antibiotics, antibiotic rinses, etc.. The gum was swollen, and instead of food sliding past it, the swollen, rounded shape funneled food between the tooth and gum. The impacted food then decayed and fed the infection, no matter what antibiotics or expensive cleaning by the dentist.

    I decided the dentist was FOS and that the problem was mechanical. To break the cycle, I bought a Water-Pic and used it every morning. Just the Water-Pic, no antibiotics, no rinses, nothing else, directing the jet between tooth and gum to gently rinse out impacted food and any pus.

    Within five days all redness was gone, within two weeks all swelling gone and no further problems. The Water-Pic rocks!

    Glad no cancer. Head-and-neck cancers are very, very ugly players. Dump that fucking tobacco, man.

  204. “The direction this is taking is a REALLY bad idea…”

    Uh yeah. I said as much. It’s predictable. No credence ever should’ve be given to these bullshit, false premise, licenses for violence bearing the imprimatur of Obama, Holder, de Blasio et al.

  205. As you said, cops’ lives don’t matter. . . well until they are there to enforce the police state for Obama’s agenda.

    So, none.

  206. Actually I was surprised this morning when I saw coverage linking the two cops’ deaths to the Brown/Garner deaths. Isn’t the evidence sketchy based on some generic anti-cop facebook posts?

    I did hear the man was deranged so we are not talking about someone sane rationally (or politically) deciding to exact “revenge”.

    My gut tells me that blaming Deblasio and Holder for this would be like blaming the GOP if some nut shot Obama or … wait for it … blaming Sarah Palin for Gabby Giffords getting shot.

  207. “I’m Putting Wings On Pigs Today. They Take 1 Of Ours……Let’s Take 2 of Theirs #ShootThePolice #RIPErivGardner #RIPMikeBrown.”

    There’s his generic anti-police post, Rutherford.

    Still surprised?

  208. Rutherford, while I have leaned toward agreement in 1 case, you have expressed, in both cases, that the officers should have been indicted and stood trial.

    Had a trial occurred, and a not-guilty verdict rendered, would you have been satisfied?

    Do you think the public would have been satisfied?

    These aren’t meant as gotcha questions, and I’m sure we all know the answer to the second one. But I don’t recall this coming up in discussions here, so I am curious.

  209. I’m glad your news is good, rabbit and that you were jolted into quitting the tobacco.

    I agree, Rutherford. The man who shot the police officers is to blame and no one else.,However, for the sake of decorum, the press, the politicians, and others who diseminated false information which inflamed mobs ignorant of facts ought to feel a little guilt and temper future comments. Those two police officers are not the only people who have been attacked during these last months.

    Remember I quoted Ragnor and Nanna of Of Monsters and Men,who often tell dark musical stories of human depravity. say.”The raw animal instinct of a human being Its like how bad can people be?” Inflaming mobs reopens old play books which ruled during the Ice Age and before, Our inner brutality lives in a flimsy prison, and it will consume the unwary and unbalanced when it escapes.. I know. I saw it.

    “Look into my eyes. Its where my demons hide. Don’t get too close., its dark inside..Its woven into my soul. I can’t escape this now…” Imagine Dragons. “Old ghosts they reappear. Mountains that are l stacked with fear We’re still the same.” Of Monsters and Men King and Lionheart which I posted. .It tells what is happening as well as any song/video,.

    I like music. Somewhere a song exists for almost any occasion,

  210. “My gut tells me that blaming Deblasio and Holder for this would be like blaming the GOP if some nut shot Obama or … wait for it … blaming Sarah Palin for Gabby Giffords getting shot.”

    Uh, no. Holder and Obama became directly involved, along with Obama’s race consultant, Al Fucking Sharpton; fanning flames, exploiting the emotions, vocally identifying with the hustlers and legitimizing their vague and profoundly destructive cause. The police have been declared entitles of racist oppression with no regard for black lives by our country’s chief law enforcement officers.

    Crosshairs Map is the same? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah. Yeah. Whatever. 😆

  211. I also agree with El Tigre. while the shooter is the only guilty one, The mood others created has become ugly. They should feel some guilt and change their ways before the next tragedy.

  212. CBS New York. New Jersey State PBA Executive Vice President Marc Kovar said in an e mail that hostility from nationwide protests have led to a “fever pitch of anti-police sentiment.” “This open hostility has created more tense encounters with officers even on routine incidents such as motor vehicle stops.”

    Another police officer was shot in Florida.

    Ferguson protesters chanted “Pigs in a blanket” after the two police officers were murdered. “Protest Flashback “What do we want? Dead cops!”

    “Killing of 2 New York officers trigger backlash”., The mob can as easily turn on the racists who unleashed this beast. They know it, and they are back peddling. We need them to shut up until they know the facts. Only one man pulled the trigger, but many people were cheering him on.

  213. DeBlasio and NYPD have more than one thing fanning the flames between the two. The interesting twist to the racial aspect implied in this matter is the idiot whacked two non whites. The two will be mourned as blue though and your average NY skell better start thinking twice because there are ONLY TWO WAYS THIS PLAYS. Either the cops start racking up points on the public or they start debating “refill on your coffee partner or take that call”? ” I think I’d enjoy another cup since you asked”. “Public? Fuck them!”
    I’m thinking plan B is how it’s gonna play and in more places than NYC

  214. I can’t remember, did thousands go on twitter rejoicing about the Gifford’s shooting?

    The crosshair computer gifs serving as a mataphor on an election map nobody saw.

    Compared to the orchestrated and obviously inflamtory division sowed 24/7 in the country by the angry left over the last few months.

    “I’m Putting Wings On Pigs Today. They Take 1 Of Ours……Let’s Take 2 of Theirs #ShootThePolice #RIPErivGardner #RIPMikeBrown.”

    Rutherford, you are either one of the most dishonest people I’ve ever come across or you suffer from an inability to discern reality to such an extent you’re mentally handicapped.

  215. “I’m thinking plan B is how it’s gonna play and in more places than NYC”

    Yup. Black community will pay dearly. Played for fools again by the left.

    Go ahead black America. Defend your own damn communities from your fatherless hordes of marauding and murderous animals.

    I say fuck it. Triple welfare. I’ll pay the taxes. Lob the fucking bridge cards from a Roman trebuchet. I don’t give a fuck. But let black America have its wish. The community protects the community.

  216. The biggest irony of this new “race war” is the self-fulfilling prophecy of black destruction..

    These militants and grievance hustlers demand that #blacklivesmatter#, then have done everything in their power to convince the rest of us otherwise.

    Do these black imbeciles think celebrating the deaths of two cops is winning them friends and empowering them in any fashion?

  217. “Do these black imbeciles think celebrating the deaths of two cops is winning them friends and empowering them in any fashion?”

    I’ve been reading comment sections—as much as I can stomach at one time, anyway—and have seen several black people calling others out for their comments.

    I don’t mention this as a case for humanity. I mention it because, in many instances, those black people were called “traitors” in later comments.

    This is going to further polarize an already polarized demographic.

  218. you have expressed, in both cases, that the officers should have been indicted and stood trial.

    I think you misunderstand. While I question the manner in which evidence was presented to the Ferguson grand jury, I agree with their decision. Wilson shot an out of control thug, stoned, and fresh from a robbery. I don’t feel that way about Garner.

    To answer your other question, I believe the “black community” would have been satisfied with nothing less than prison for both cops.

  219. Sorry, I didn’t answer your other question. I honestly don’t know how the Staten Island cop isn’t guilty of involuntary manslaughter. With that said, I usually think it is unwise to second guess a jury you did not sit on.

  220. Holder and Obama became directly involved, along with Obama’s race consultant, Al Fucking Sharpton; … Bla bla bla

    Tigre your entire speech goes down the toilet if the shooter was mentally ill. If everyone could be judged by how a lunatic hears their message folks on this very board would be liable.

    I’m sorry dude. If folks think, rightly or wrongly, that Brown and Garner represent police brutality, they have a right to peacefully protest and our political leaders are correct in defending that right. This is America.

    I vehemently disagreed with the Tea Party protests of 2009 but I don’t recall questioning their right to protest.

  221. I also agree with El Tigre. while the shooter is the only guilty one, The mood others created has become ugly. They should feel some guilt and change their ways before the next tragedy.

    Sorry this is rank hypocrisy. Years ago when I said that some conservative rhetoric was creating a climate in which Obama could get killed, I was roundly criticized (not by you James).

    You guys can’t have it both ways. Either words and rhetoric matter or they don’t.

  222. Huck’s comment deserves to be read again and again. The black opinion of what is going on is not monolithic. And yes, those blacks not jumping on the race bandwagon are gonna be called Uncle Toms.

    I honestly think Garner is an isolated and RELATIVELY rare extreme case. I don’t believe there is a war on bkack men. As I wrote months ago, I think there is a war on bkack thugs.

    I ALSO think a lot of innocent black men have to be more careful than whites because they belong to a demographic that has shamed itself … and THAT is a shame.

    And as I said before, I believe peaceful protest is the foundation of our country. Squelch it at your own risk.

  223. “And as I said before, I believe peaceful protest is the foundation of our country. Squelch it at your own risk.”

    What is and isn’t “peaceful”?

    That’s an honest question. How does one define “peaceful”? And saying “lack of violence” is not enough. Because then you must define “violence”.

    Notice that once you get beyond the first entry, things start to get a bit murky.

    Students at Oberlin College asked a professor for an extension on a final exam. He said–and I quote in full—“no”. He was called out for his “violent language”–Complete with a trigger warning, lest anyone be overcome by his vulgar display of power. A micro-aggression if there ever was one. rolls eyes

    So back to the point. Are we seeing peaceful protests? Is blocking an intersection a peaceful protest? Is screaming profanities in a cop’s face a peaceful protest? Is marching in celebration of 2 dead cop’s a peaceful protest?

    I guess that depends on who you ask. I wish I could ask that Oberlin student.

  224. Interestingly enough, here is a link defining “peaceful”.

    “free from… commotion… or disorder”
    “not argumentative, quarrelsome, or hostile”

    It would seem that the term “peaceful protest” is a contradiction in terms.

    Words only matter when we know what they mean. Something to think about 🙂

  225. Good Lawd, Rutherford. The deliberately thick/misdirection routine gets tired. 🙄

    The direct involvement of Holder de Blasio et al. is at the heart of the police reaction to the shooting. Crazy man or not, the hustlers weighed in and were stroked by the structure, led by your heroes, that is supposed to support and look after law enforcement. They spoke directly to the issue. Yeah, that makes a difference, Chucklehead. The police feel betrayed and there are consequences to that. Do you know how much elation there was by your “peaceful protestors” for the execution of the two innocent cops with families? Your lame attempt at comparison with Palin’s crosshairs map, and now tea party, is full retard.

    And for a list of shit like this from the past, read up on Sharpton. Any easily-located biographical will read like a compendium of lynch mob-fueled behavior, manufactured with knowingly false narratives by Obama’s “race advisor,” Sharpton. That’s what Obama’s ‘race advisor” does.

  226. You mean the lives of minority police officers don’t matter? Someone should shut a freeway down, or something…

    I guess there’s more truth than fiction in, “If you ain’t Black, you ain’t Jack.”

    Throughout New York, the execution-style killing of these officers in the Bedford-Stuyvesant neighborhood of Brooklyn has generated a near-universal sense of horror at the crime — and sympathy for the victims.

    But the scene outside Woodhull Hospital wasn’t entirely supportive. “You’re a bunch of killers,” a passerby told cops standing sentry there, according to one police source. And short distance from the crime scene — where a crowd was backed up by the police tape — a few members of the crowd repeated “fuck the cops” within earshot of a Daily Beast reporter.

    Others seemed less sympathetic towards the police, and even seemed to resent that the cops didn’t take as much notice of the area’s other crimes. While violent offenses are dramatically down in Bed Stuy, pockets of violence persist here.

    “Gunshots is usual for this neighborhood,” said Kenneth Otero, 30, who lives in a ninth-floor apartment across the street in Tompkins Houses, the housing projects Officers Wenjian Liu and Rafael Ramos were assigned to.

  227. Tigre, serious question.

    Do you think Rutherford is mentally handicapped and believes his own analogies?

    Or is he merely playing fantasy sports politics?

    I can’t tell.

  228. I agree, Rutherford. Peaceful protest is one of the foundations of society.The Tea Party, for instance teaches how it is done. My wife, cousins and I attended several to see what they were like and to be more warm bodies for the news media. They were more like a high school pep rally than dangerous protest. They could have blocked streets but they followed the rules and stayed on sidewalks. Moreover, they cleaned up after themselves.

    I remember once the media and liberals realized the Tea Party was more than a few malcontents. and might actually be politically dangerous, which they were, fearless leaders accused them of racism and violence. Nancy Pelosi led her delegation through a demonstration to the white house, I think, when they could have taken an underground route.
    A black former civil rights leader besmirched his reputation by lying that they had spit on him. Breitbart offered a reward for anyone who could prove the Tea Partiers had acted in a racial or violent manner. No one has collected.

    After that, liberals were so hungry for anything that linked Tea Partiers to violence or racism, they speculated before they had verified. Of course, the treatment of Sarah Palin goes without saying, but I am reminding you anyway. Some nut might have been inspired to kill her or her family during the calumny inflicted on them. Maybe fame and security saved them, Leftists did physically attract some Tea Partiers who didn’t enjoy the security of fame..

    Compare the feral creatures who are burning down their own businesses while their counterparts in the media and government egg them on. The mostly white socialists, communists and anarchists of the Occupy movement showed similar tendencies.

    The leftists are bigoted fascists who use race and economic disparity to destroy this country. Unfortunately, many blacks and some whites are too ignorant and angry to realize what pawns they are. Their masters are also ignorant, or they don’t care about the Ice age beast they are unleashing from our violent instincts.

    North Omaha was a diverse economy until blacks burned it down in the sixties. it is a festering would today with shootings and violence. Yesterday, three black men were shot and two died. One had graduated from barber college and planned to take over his father’s business. His father was paralyzed after he was shot in 2011. The reporter noted that the young man was not a gang member, and that he had no children. The family still has two parents. The reporter noted it because it is so unusual in that part of Omaha.

  229. Yes, Rutherford, the right does over react too. Comment sections of news stories are angry and imply violence.

    I think you played it well. You had few verbal weapons, and invoking Palin and Cruze was good strategy, because the two examples were equivalent to the police officers, Croatians, and other people attacked by the mob. Of course, liberal leaders and opinion makers were more proactive than their conservative counter parts. Those people should as I wrote,shut up for awhile and reflect on their contribution to the violence.

  230. Good Lawd, Rutherford. The deliberately thick/misdirection routine gets tired.

    And you call yourself a lawwwwya. Mental state matters and I don’t need 3 years of law school to know it.

    The dude shot his ex-girlfriend. Was she a cop too? He was a nutjob. Sorry Sharpton, Deblasio etal are blameless.

    Now you show me someone even reasonably sane who shoots a cop “for the cause” and I’ll be the first one to join you in condemning the race hustlers.

    Until then, you’re the one bordering on “retard”.

  231. Sorry Sharpton, Deblasio etal are blameless.

    Except the victims and their association, along with the greatest majority of Americans don’t agree with you. “What do we want? Dead cops…” Who led the parade? They got their wish. You might get a whole lot more for your bargain before its through. Those deaths won’t go unanswered.

    Calling Al Sharpton blameless is like calling the religious leaders of Iran blameless for stoking terrorism.

  232. Tigre, serious question.

    Do you think Rutherford is mentally handicapped and believes his own analogies?

    Or is he merely playing fantasy sports politics?

    I can’t tell.

    You’re an idiot.

  233. The Reverend Al Sharpton leads a march in which the crowd chants for dead cops. (Didnt Sharpton coin the nick name Gentle Giant?) . A guy executes two cops after explicitly tweeting the exact reason why.

    Rutherford is using the fact the guy shot his girlfrend as evidence he is not tied to MSNBC’s call for mob action.

    The blogger doth protests too much.

    Ferguson burnt to the ground. Cops executed point blank. White person killed with a hammer.

    Many, many, more acts of violence coming our way from the black mob.

    And there will be reciprocal violence as well.

    But our desperate blog host nervously clenching his fists still pretending that this isn’t happening.

  234. It doesn’t matter if the police killer had never heard of Ferguson or “I can’t breathe.” What matters is perception. He did express a desire for revenge, so now the liberals and race baiters are hoist by their own petard. Our feral nature feeds on dark emotions once we free it. The liberals didn’t know or care what they were doing when they started this. I suggest they take heed. There are more of us than there are of them.

    Al Sharpton said, according to Hot Air that the murders could derail the protest movement. He tried to equate the deaths of Eric Garner and Michael Brown with two police officers who were just doing their jobs.

    Obama once said “If they bring a knife, bring a gun.” It was far worse than any thing Sarah or Rush said to get themselves blamed for the Giffords shooting and mass murder.,The media didn’t make a fuss because conservatives, not liberals were their target.

    Al and the movement might as well be saying” “So I packed my bags and ran far away from all the trouble I had created with my two hands.” Of Monsters and men.

  235. “Now you show me someone even reasonably sane who shoots a cop “for the cause” and I’ll be the first one to join you in condemning the race hustlers.”

    Do you read? Seriously, Blondie. Do you have any ability to read and respond to what I wrote, or are you so locked in to MSNBC blather points that you can’t address them without being told what to say?

    Think and misdirected.

  236. “But our desperate blog host nervously clenching his fists still pretending that this isn’t happening.”

    No, he calls it peaceful protests. The cheering, actual cheering, for the cops’ deaths.

    Police have turned their backs on de Blasio and Rutherford can do is look to cover his profound, childish, and downright embarrassing displays in the wake of the Giffiords shooting having nothing in common with this. Sad.

  237. The Democratic Party hijacked the civil rights movement, first for political gain. And this? Well this is what hijackers do.

    Hope you like them words.

  238. His words certainly are pretty worthless.

    His latest cracks me up: Citing earlier examples of his own insanity and then applying it to us.

    We are acting like he was when he slandered the Tea Party demonstrations in the worst possible ways. Or…we’re blaming the rabble rousers the same way he blamed the computer gifs on Palin’s website.

    Shame on him, so shame on us.

    The differences so massive its laughable.

    He struggles with reality like a well intended but unintelligent middle school student in a social studies classroom.

  239. I don’t understand how Rutherford, if he really does disagree with us, can ignore that Bill DeBlasio implied NYC Cops (and cops in general) are racist when he told the story of what and how he instructs his own son in their dealings with NYC police.

    “What parents have done for decades who have children of color, especially young men of color, is train them to be very careful when they have a connection with a police officer,” de Blasio said. It’s different for a white child. That’s just the reality in this country,” de Blasio went on. “And with Dante, very early on with my son, we said, look, if a police officer stops you, do everything he tells you to do, don’t move suddenly, don’t reach for your cell phone, because we knew, sadly, there’s a greater chance it might be misinterpreted if it was a young man of color.”

    So what’s the implication? I find what De Blasio said here, especially considering the time and the place, despicable.

  240. What do we want? Dead cops…

    I saw that chant for the first time today. Reprehensible. I would like to know who lead that “protest”. I can tell you, it wasn’t Sharpton and damn sure it wasn’t Deblasio.

    Just as Trayvon and Brown were the wrong “icons” for civil rights, this nutjob is not representative of the movement Sharpton, Deblasio and Holder are addressing.

    This dude’s MOTHER was afraid of him. How many times do you guys need to hear HE WAS DERANGED.

    Let me say it again. If Tex Taylor and Dead Rabbit were judged by how some lunatic interpreted them, they’d both be in jail today.

    You SHOW me where Sharpton, Holder, Obama or Deblasio even HINTED at violence as a response, and I’ll gladly concede the point.

  241. The Reverend Al Sharpton leads a march in which the crowd chants for dead cops.

    Ahh Sharpton lead that protest or you just pulled that out of your hairy ass? I want to see the reliable source that puts Sharpton at the protest.

  242. You SHOW me where Sharpton, Holder, Obama or Deblasio even HINTED at violence as a response, and I’ll gladly concede the point.

    Al Sharpton even HINTED at violence? Are you for real?

    Do we need to run through Sharpton’s history, of which now invited to the White House as black representative and spokesperson, has stoked a number of riots where somebody besides blacks were actually killed and Sharpton never held accountable? Ever heard of the Crown Heights Riots, Mr. Long Island? Bet you have.

    I’ll show you for 50 years, where not just these race hustlers, but your entire political philosophy has created an environment ripe for violence and white hatred, assisted by gentry white academicians and demonic white politicians. SDS? Weather Underground? Blank Panthers, Old and New? Bill Ayers?

    Remember when you were a big fan of OWS? How about the implications six years ago that disagreement with Obama policy was racist? Or your statement because of white privilege and history that blacks can’t be racist? Or a black racist for Attorney General.

  243. Bill DeBlasio implied NYC Cops (and cops in general) are racist when he told the story of what and how he instructs his own son in their dealings with NYC police.

    Have you not been listening or is Fox not covering this? MANY parents of black boys tell them to be careful with the police. Because police are racist? No. Because they profile the same way we all do.

    Do you guys want our public servants to turn a blind eye to the concerns of all these people? Do you think that is wise public policy?

  244. I think it wise for all of America, black and white, to begin to ignore the race hustlers and scorn them – and those hustlers are predominately black, with a few token self-serving, politically expedient whiteys like De Blasio thrown in for good measure.

    Obama can set the lead tonight by publicly announcing that Eric Holder and Al $harpton are black racists and demanding Eric Holder step down immediately, explaining Holder is unfit for office and that $harpton unwelcome at the White House.

    Otherwise, I believe Obama a large part of the problem too – and most of us already know he is. Prove us wrong, Obama. Man up for once instead of being a daily coward, Mr. President.

  245. I don’t see anything wrong with DeBlasio’s admonition. Every one of us regardless of race needs to do the same thing. It has nothing to do with skin color. The implication was that white kids don’t have to behave as he advised.

    The anti-cop mood may drive the police to ” turn a blind eye to the concerns of these people.” Its bad policy, but can you blame individuals for enforcing laws selectively?

  246. Well New York’s police staff was just essentially cut in half.

    Until further notice, 2 cars, not just 1, will respond to all 911 calls.

  247. I don’t see anything wrong with DeBlasio’s admonition. Every one of us regardless of race needs to do the same thing. It has nothing to do with skin color. The implication was that white kids don’t have to behave as he advised.

    The insinuation was black profiling. Like Rudy said, math don’t lie. You’re a fool and then victim if you don’t in those holes.

    It was my observation while in Manhattan many times, blacks pushed for a race war. This was when the feckless useful idiot Dinkins was mayor, and the most common site were the squeegee men and pickpockets. Farrakhan and his goons would gather in Times Square and bully the tourists. I remember thinking, “Why would anybody choose to live in this cesspool?” I’d get off the plane and kiss the ground when I returned. Finally Giuliani cleaned it up but you can’t wash away the filth.

    The cops would sit around to make sure no punches were thrown or shots were fired and that was all they did. “Move along.” That was what you got for your $300 a night hotel room – twenty plus years ago. What a joke. I have no desire ever to go back to those nasty, rat infested holes. Move Wall Street to Dallas, or Denver, or Atlanta, or Lincoln, NE, for all I care. But get it out of NY with all that corruption.

    The only reason NY survives is all the pent up advantages. The rest of America shouldn’t be catering to that filth and we’re damn fools for doing so. And if we simply stuck together, that city would fold like a cheap towel if Wall Street and white tourism suddenly disappeared. All it takes is a movement to cut them off.

    Long overdue to start playing financial hardball with these race hustling bastards. Let them run those mouths when the food runs out.

  248. Tex I don’t get the latest rant. NYC is financial hub of the world, not just USA. It is a cultural hub as well.

    In Manhattan the center of everything and the ghetto.

    Chicago, culture and finance also, and the ghetto.

    Washington DC, historical showcase, center of government and the ghetto.

    I’d venture every city of “importance” in this country has an adjacent ghetto.

    So why don’t we gather all these black ingrates on a bus and give them their own state so all the upright white folk and self respecting blacks can live in peace. How’s that solution?

  249. So why don’t we gather all these black ingrates on a bus and give them their own state so all the upright white folk and self respecting blacks can live in peace. How’s that solution?

    I would call it a good idea. But I don’t trust your judgment. Barack Obama has to live in the black ingrate state. 😀

    P.S. – All those cities you listed? I could consider them, along with Detroit, L.A., and Philadelphia as the dregs of the earth – as I do Paris & London.

  250. NY and Chicago are only cultural hubs because of 100 year head start. Burn them down, wash out the filth, and start anew. We’ll live Naperville. 😉

    And technology makes it very easy to move the financial aspects…very easy.

    Oh, one other city. Miami, FL. What a piece of crap.

  251. You SHOW me where Sharpton, Holder, Obama or Deblasio even HINTED at violence as a response, and I’ll gladly concede the point.” — R

    Per Hiz Honor Rudy:

    “We’ve had four months of propaganda starting with the president that everybody should hate the police,” Giuliani said during an appearance on Fox News early Sunday. “The protests are being embraced, the protests are being encouraged. The protests, even the ones that don’t lead to violence, a lot of them lead to violence, all of them lead to a conclusion: The police are bad, the police are racist. That is completely wrong.”

    ALL of the facts in the Brown case fly in the face of what these idiots say, yet they continue to perpetuate a lie, lambast a system that did its job, and then cry foul when their rhetoric sparks violence.

    You’ve made the comment that Conservatives can’t blame these clowns for the violence, but not blame Palin for Giffords. Ah, yes we can, because nothing Palin ever said, nor any Tea Party event, ever implied or led to violence. The guy that shot Giffords did so because the voices in his head said it was ok. Bensley, however, shot those two cops based on lies perpetuated about the Brown and Garner cases and because Sharpton, Holder, Obama, and Deblasio equated cops with racism and brutality. I encourage you to go back and read the things you said about the Tucson shooting, and look at from the context of what is happening right now.

    Finally, four cops have been shot (three have died) in the last 96 hours, all appearing directly related to the protests to Brown and Garner. If one incident had occurred, I’d probably concede your point despite disagreeing with it, but three incidents in three completely different locations and nearly simultaneously? Come now, surely you’re not that stupid…

  252. I’m convinced cops will be much, much slower to responding to calls in high crime areas, which for a host of reasons tend to be high minority (mostly black) neighborhoods. The crime rate in these areas is about to go up, probably pretty significantly, especially once career criminals figure out that cops are not responding. This will be Sharpton, Holder, Obama, and Deblasio’s fault.

    And by the by, DeBlasio stands zero chances of being reelected, and it would not surprise me if there is a petition to recall within the next 18 months. This clown is a complete dumpster fire…

  253. Rutherford – In contemplation of Christmas tomorrow, here’s a little discussion of the essentials, and what it means to follow the teachings of the Big Guy hisself:

  254. AC1: No doubt that American officials’ ill-considered remarks have at least indirectly led to the police killings. However, officers’ safety has always to a large degree hinged upon their having the respect – even grudging – of those with whom they interact. Think of (old) England, where the bobbies weren’t even armed. No one would dare to lay a hand on an officer; these days NYC protesters punch them in the face.

    Now, however, we have videos distributed worldwide of American cops behaving like overbearing thugs. It’s pretty difficult to argue with a video, old man, and not only have the criminals lost respect for the constabulary, so have ordinary people in US.

    Perhaps DeBlasio’s siding with the protesters was inappropriate. A better course would have been to make a bland public statement about the event’s being under investigation and then INDICT AND JAIL THAT FUCKING COP WHO CHOKED THE MAN TO DEATH.

    But that didn’t happen, did it? So now the masses correctly believe that the fix is always in, and that murdering a nigger is just fine in your country.

    Which it is. And why there will be more cops killed. Depend upon it.

  255. AC2: “Do you read? Seriously, Blondie. Do you have any ability to read and respond to what I wrote, or are you so locked in to MSNBC blather points that you can’t address them without being told what to say?”

    Maybe Rutherford HAS read it, and it isn’t worthy of a response.


    R – a thought for you: Have you noticed the resemblance between Clit and Slack? The opinions are the same on every subject, and even the personality traits are identical: moments of lucidity punctuated by long stretches of lunacy. Each a straight man for the other; a tiny mutual masturbation society.

    The first thought is that they should get a room, but then it occurs: maybe in reality they are the same person – a institutionalized schizophrenic who sometimes gets off his meds and becomes his evil twin. You know, Roses are Red; Violets are Blue; I’m Schizophrenic, and So Am I.

    All best for the Holidays, R. Off to the beach with the family.

  256. A white person is more likely to killed by a black then a black by police.

    And there is plenty of video of this with potential to go viral.

    So should the right, Fox News and powerful Republicans create this daily barrage of “the negro threat” day after day after day.

    Maybe Tea Party organizers can lead marches in which the crowd yells “kill niggers!”

    White athletes can wear little symbols reminding white America of the negro threat during high profile games.

    All of this, mathematically speaking, would be more legit then what’s going on now. And all of it would be equally irresponsible.

  257. “All best for the Holidays, R. Off to the beach with the family.”

    Ahh yes. Virginia beach in December. A few drunk squids and that cold, lonely wind.

  258. Tex @ December 22, 6:10 pm

    You may find what De Blasio said despicable. but it’s the truth.

    Gorilla @ December 23 7:06 am
    “The crime rate in these areas is about to go up”

    Apparently Bratton shares your opinion and stated his opinion before the killing of two police officers.

    “New York Police Department Commissioner Bill Bratton said Monday that tensions in the city are echoing those in the 1970s — a fear he expressed only days prior to the ambush killings of two police officers.

    Only the day before the shooting of the two officers, Bratton had expressed concern that tensions and issues of “poverty, of race, of unemployment, of inequality in housing, educational systems” were escalating”

    All cities have their ghettos and a ghetto is a tinder box just waiting for any spark to set it on fire. Liberals and conservatives need to be taken out of the equation.

  259. Parker, THAT COP DID NOT CHOCK A MAN TO DEATH. Nothing personal, but I just felt like yelling. As I wrote before, I had some experience with choking. That man could not have repeated that he couldn’t breathe if he was being chocked. They were on top of him when he said he couldn’t breathe.

    He was over weight and had health problems. That and the exertion killed him, not a chock hold. The police were too slow to react to “I can’t breathe,” but that was after the head lock,

    The grand jury didn’t see an indictable offense. That is where the investigation should follow to see if the fix was on or if the decision was correct.

    Otherwise, I agree with you. Politicians, news people and others jumped to conclusions with preconceived biases favoring an agenda which now has spread across the world and threatens the safety of our law enforcement officers.

    Happy holidays. Enjoy the beach,.

    I like dead rabbit’s latest comment because its true.

  260. Drunk,

    I’ve noticed over the last two or three years during the period I have had the unfortunate chance to make your acquaintance, you get especially vile during the religious Holidays. Something missing in your life, Pfestus? Perhaps those Alaskan Dominionist bloggers ain’t inspiring you anymore and the porn business isn’t showing a profit?

    What a sad ending you’ll have. You’ll finally have earned your eternal place, and nobody here will care. Peace on earth, Pfesser. 😉

  261. You may find what De Blasio said despicable. but it’s the truth.

    Apparently, I wasn’t the only one who found it despicable. So did the NYPD and so did the vast majority of America who are demanding De Blasio resign in disgrace. But I’m glad you and DeBlasio peers – you two deserve each other, Raji.

    Not only are blacks treated with kid gloves by police as I witnessed on more than one occasion in NYC, but because of useful idiots and politically correct fools like you, cops have to endanger their own lives on account of it. Frankly, you’re not worth a cop endangering “their” lives to protect.

  262. ’m convinced cops will be much, much slower to responding to calls in high crime areas, which for a host of reasons tend to be high minority (mostly black) neighborhoods. The crime rate in these areas is about to go up, probably pretty significantly, especially once career criminals figure out that cops are not responding. This will be Sharpton, Holder, Obama, and Deblasio’s fault.

    Predictable. And deserved.

  263. Imagine what the mayor of New York tells his black son about other blacks!

    I guess the mayor didn’t feel the need to talk about that one in public, account on him being the mayor of New York and all.

    But…but..but it’s true. (No really…it is this time).

    He’s the fucking mayor if New York, Raji!

    .

  264. Hey Raji, did the smarmy bitch hear that reports are coming in that Osama Bin Laden had converted to Hinduism before he died?

    Eyewitnesses reported seeing a red dot on his forehead just before he was shot. 🙂

  265. I saw gas for $1.98 yesterday. Crazy. Price setters are running a serious campaign to pacify the American public. Nothing says ‘all is well’ like cheap gas. It certainly just gets more people out cruising and shopping, providing a temporary boost to this engineered boom and bust economy.

    I don’t see how you guys can watch mainstream media and take anything they say seriously. I can’t watch with a straight face anymore. ‘News’ programs are especially offensive. It’s torturous sitting through a thirty minute stint including commercials. I feel so dirty afterward, as if I’d spent the time watching porn. The pharma ads are all sick and promote sickness. “Ask your doctor is suicide is right for you”.

    I find little redeeming qualities within our society. The Bill Maher video parker posted may offend a lot of so called ‘Christians’, but his observations are mostly correct and well point out the vast hypocrisy and mass ignorance of those claiming to be the ‘church’. Fortunately the church, the true bride of Christ, is not what we read about or see in the main stream, preferring to run below the radar and behind closed doors.

    I blame the so called leaders. This nation has had a lot of big wigs rise up to supposedly represent Christ’s church. They were/are mostly wolves, feathering their own comfortable beds and leading many astray. They have left much damage in their wake.

  266. The city of Minneapolis will file charges against the Black Lives Matter protest in the Mall of America. I hope they recover the thousands of dollars they want to pay for the lost business income. The city warned the protesters the mall was private property, but the protesters didn’t know about private property or care

    . It is unfair of me, but my profiling is that most of them are living off the tax payers and they mainly care when the checks are late. They are entitled to others’ property.

  267. You SHOW me where Sharpton, Holder, Obama or Deblasio even HINTED at violence as a response, and I’ll gladly concede the point.” — R

    You were saying…

    The Obama administration’s Justice Department funneled at least $1.5 million in grants to a New York legal-aid group featured in a new rap video that depicts two young black men aiming handguns at a white police officer.

    Some may find the lyrics eerily similar to the social media postings of the man accused of shooting and killing two New York City police officers execution-style in Brooklyn on Saturday.

    The video for “Hands Up,” which also shows a white police officer gunning down a black motorist wearing a hoodie, contains lyrics suggesting revenge for much-publicized deaths of black men in confrontations with police.

    Credited to rappers Uncle Murda and Maino, the video is subtitled “Eric Garner Tribute,” a reference to a black man who died while being pinned and restrained on a sidewalk by New York police officers.

    The taxpayer money that went to the organization shown in the video, the Bronx Defenders, comes from a Justice Department program named for Edward Byrne, a New York Police Department officer who was shot dead at close range in 1988.

  268. Gorilla, I’m supposed to believe Obama stokes cop-hate because Rudy said so?

    I’ll look into the other cop shootings. The only one getting major press is the NYC one where the man was clearly deranged. If the other two were certified nutjobs I maintain my point.

    Now you may say that anyone who would assassinate a cop is a nutjob. But if those TWO new black panthers kill a cop then you’ll have my full attention. If someone with a clear political axe to grind kills cops, you’ve got me. The NYC dude was stark raving mad and glommed onto this Ferguson thing. He was headed for trouble regardless.

    I’ll check on the other incidences.

    Again, “what do we want, dead cops” is despicable. And if you think Obama, Holder or even the historically suspect Sharpton endorse that chant then you’re crazy.

    Finally I fully agree with you on Brown. Should never have sparked protest. Garner more understandable but no reason to suspect racism. BUT something has to be done with the perception in these communities that they are under siege. It can’t just be ignored.

  269. And a very merry Christmas to you also 🙂

    Oh, don’t lay down on me now Little Miss Smarmy with the pretentious act. So, what do you want to duke it out about? I’m just itching for a good conversation. 😈 Pfat Pfestus never sticks around long enough anymore for me to bloody his bulbous, red nose.

    So let me ask you a fair question. Do you wish the rest of us inferior, privileged white male type to leave you to the pavement apes, white academia, Pfat Pfestus and his Pfluffy wife, and Comrade DeBlasio? Is that your idea of truth and justice – Rutherford’s Paradise on Earth scenario?

  270. Hey Raji, did the smarmy bitch hear that reports are coming in that Osama Bin Laden had converted to Hinduism before he died?

    Eyewitnesses reported seeing a red dot on his forehead just before he was shot. 🙂

    You lost me. Parker posted the Bill Maher vid about Osama, not Raji.

    Aim before you shoot.

  271. “And if you think Obama, Holder or even the historically suspect Sharpton endorse that chant then you’re crazy.” -R

    If you think the left didn’t know they were creating the chant your crazy. A city needlessly just burnt to the ground in front of your eyes, man.

    What something has to be done in those communities you speak of Rutherford?

    Maybe a real push from the left stressing the importance of the traditional black family with the same gusto that they attempt to paint thugs as angels?

    Why is that, by the way…that your friends always lie about the thugs? Paint them into people they aren’t? Photoshop their faces.

    Why…I almost think that they want to strike an emotional nerve? No?

    How about the negro threat? If white leaders and media constantly refer to this problem, you would be cool with it?

    Maybe a day of rage by all Americans who have been victims of black violence march on DC? You think that would be positive? Good thing for America?

    Hey hey ho ho
    Murderin’ feral ones got to go

    Yeah baby!

    Let’s march. That might even get that lower class white vote to the polls!

  272. “Maybe Rutherford HAS read it, and it isn’t worthy of a response.”

    He did respond to it Dr. Dumbfuck, he’s just locked on stupid. And that’s more than can be said about your tired droning.

  273. My wife and I headed into Einsteins today for coffee and a bagel. There is always this lonely, little lady in there. I knew something was wrong with her – she talks to herself, out loud. Her hair is unkempt – her goods laid out on the table.

    She came up to us and asked us if we wanted some coupons – obviously a conversation starter. I was having a hard time understanding her as she spoke so quietly, but I did understand “homeless.” Heart breaking. I asked the manager of the place if he knew her story. Apparently, she is in there everyday and buys a small cup of coffee, doesn’t make trouble, and after a couple of hours leaves. Nobody knows where she goes. She showed us some pictures, but I couldn’t understand if it was her son or her husband.

    My sweet, sweet wife (you wouldn’t believe how wonderful this lady really is being married to a twit like me) suggested I buy her a gift card. I got her name and signed “from her Einstein friends.” No big deal. But I couldn’t help leaving there thinking I solved nothing – just prolonged the inevitable for a week. She’s still homeless and I don’t know what to do for her.

    For any of the assholes that hate America and are constantly finding fault with her, you ought to thank your Creator this very minute you’ve got some place to live in the most wonderful country this world has ever known, protected by people far higher caliber than you. Most of the world is hell on earth. Much of the world is in her position – too many of them. And there isn’t a country on earth that takes care of more of them than America.

    You ingrates that hate America? I would take that little woman and shove her in your place this minute if I could, leaving your sorry asses to fend for yourselves like animals.

    You suck.

  274. Rutherford on the one hand said Ferguson never should’ve resulted in “protests” (ha), then says that his heroes lending legitimacy to them is a-okay. 🙄

    DR, a day of rage. That’d be nice. Maybe we should wait for a new president to express his understanding and sympathy and an AG that will express his desire to crack down on the black crime that brought it to a head. Maybe rally around a fictionalized account of some incident that makes it righteous knowing that whatever happens there’ll be no nexus to the stoking of racial tensions.

    Remember when R was accusing the tea party of targeting blacks? Good times.

  275. You lost me. Parker posted the Bill Maher vid about Osama, not Raji. Aim before you shoot.

    Do you honestly think I would watch some irreligious video of Bill Maher left by an asshole?

    Perhaps you should take your own advice, twink. The Osama reference was pure coincidence, as I have no idea what you’re talking about. Unlike you, I don’t lie about reading all posts – there are several I skip on by. Pfat Pfestus is generally one of them as he bores me, unlike I notice the pejorative ‘Slack’ or ‘Clit.’ Classy, isn’t he?

  276. Osama is surely dead by now, whether one believes in official accounts or not. Hitler probably too. Those scapegoats have provided tremendous roi. Let the dead worry about the dead.

    Most people need a bigger god or a greater vision of what matters eternally. We are all equally responsible for today.

    I, for one, believe I was put here at this time and place for a purpose. This a journey of choice moments. Our influence affects the whole. I choose to refrain or say or write whatever based on options presented in the theater of my mind at any particular moment. Choices are all we really have. Nothing is chance. Most submit to others to make those choices for them. It is about picking sides. Inclusive vs exclusive. Truth vs fantasy. Generous vs selfish. Helpful vs hindering. Uplifting vs derisive. Good vs evil. What a person takes in isn’t evil… but we are spiritual filters too. What flows out is the fullness of one’s heart.

    Thank God, His mercy triumphs over judgment. 🙂

  277. “Something has to be done with the perception of these communities that they are under seige.”

    Yes Rutherford. Something will change after the news media and their political allies refuse to twist stories to fit their agendas before the facts are known. Democrats tell their constituents they are victims of institutionalized racism or that Republicans are waging a war on women.

    They feed on economic inequality to arouse emotions. Eventually, these negative feelings become internalized and those with a victim mentality see these events as part of an organized conspiracy.

    Tell the liberals. You are preaching to the choir here,.

  278. Rutherford on the one hand said Ferguson never should’ve resulted in “protests” (ha), then says that his heroes lending legitimacy to them is a-okay.

    I always love it when Tigre starts with “on the one hand” because it’s a preview of his inability to capture complexity.

    Tigre, NO MATTER HOW PREPOSTEROUS THE PROTEST, PEOPLE HAVE A RIGHT TO PEACEFULLY DO SO … AND EVERY PATRIOT DEFENDS THE RIGHT.

    You can defend the right to protest. You can even say that someone’s pain deserves to be expressed even if you think that pain is unfounded.

    The TEA Party skirted with racism. You can deny it till you turn blue. Still, they had a right to protest and has been noted, they protested with a bit more decorum than their OWS counterparts.

  279. Unlike you, I don’t lie about reading all posts

    Wow you’re hurtin’ today. Seriously, you got the holiday blues?

    I have said repeatedly I have trouble keeping up with the comments and I watch few of the vids cos its clumsy to do so on my cell.

    If I got Raji right, she was acknowledging that many parents have “the talk” with their black sons, like de Blasio did. You may not like it but it’s the truth. Now why did THAT make you go ballistic on her?

    WTF is wrong with you today? Seriously.

  280. R, WTF is wrong with you??? Did I say there’s no right to peaceful protest, EVER?

    There is no complexity in what you are saying. In fact, it’s moronic.

    Your heroes picked sides against the cops and have touched off the predictable consequences.

    GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOU ASS. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RIGHT TO PEACABLY ASSEMBLE AND PROTEST!!!!!!!!!!!!! ARE YOU FUCKING BLIND?????

  281. And I do deny that the tea party “skirted with” or “embraced racism.” Suck on it, Blondie.

    Now, back to your false narratives. The truth makes no difference to you. It’s all about the MSNBC cause with you.

  282. WTF is wrong with you today? Seriously.

    You. And people like you sharing the same abject stupidity of race baiting and the inferiority complex you carry that I have to share a country with and listen to their incessant grievance – liabilities and profound bleating sheep and ingrates I’m expected to tolerate and now refuse to do so, who frankly don’t deserve the country they inherited.

    Deliver us from these Fat Granny disciples. You’ve confused hurting with hacked.

    Anything else you want to know?

  283. People are BLASTING protesters for pointing out problems with the police and the justice system, and the police union rep calls for WAR ON PROTESTERS in his words.

    Cops work for the ALL THE PUBLIC – not the other way around.

    Time they start remembering that rather than shooting people in stairwells (NYPD), illegally choke holding a guy to death for selling cigarettes (NYPD), “stop and frisk” BLACK people (NYPD). As well as Gurley, Alcis, Fludd, Gray, Cuevas, Davis, Robinson, Francis, Graham, Chamberlain, Henry, Walker, Bell, Stansbury, Sprivill, Zongo, Doismond, Ferguson, Diallo just to mention a few. Most of these men were only guilty of being in the wrong place at the wrong time and meeting up with an overzealous policeman.

    Apparently, I wasn’t the only one who found it despicable. So did the NYPD and so did the vast majority of America who are demanding De Blasio resign in disgrace. But I’m glad you and DeBlasio peers – you two deserve each other, Raji. – tt

    I seriously doubt that the majority of Americans even know who is the mayor of NYC. The NYPD has been fighting with every mayor. Nothing new.


    “As I wrote before, I had some experience with choking. He was over weight and had health problems. That and the exertion killed him, not a chock hold.” James

    So Jimmy boy, If Garner is responsible for his own death. By using your own logic (blame the victim) then you caused those big bad evil monster men who allegedly nearly choked you to death. As I understand it this happened +/-50 years ago. GROW UP. And don’t bother telling me I have no idea what is like to fear for their life..


    There are those who are racist and use the racist language proudly. There are those who use the language of a racist but may not be racist. And there are those who are racist but use the language of one pretending they are not racist. There is a lot of that going on here.


    “For any of the assholes that hate America and are constantly finding fault with her, you ought to thank your Creator this very minute you’ve got some place to live in the most wonderful country this world has ever known, protected by people far higher caliber than you. Most of the world is hell on earth. Much of the world is in her position – too many of them. And there isn’t a country on earth that takes care of more of them than America.” tt

    You need to practice what you preacher, asshole. You are the most hate fill, negative person i have met in a long time. Go back and read what you have written for the last 6 years. You have on more than one occasion called for the destruction of this country. While I do understand you more than you realize; it DOES NOT give you a right or an excuse to justify your abusive verbal behavior towards those who don’t agreed with you. If we all thought the same we may very well have never crawled out of the pond scum. You don’t have all the answers or solutions.

  284. I was very thankful not to see Brown’s name on Lurker’s list.

    JAL, the Brown thing hurt us very badly. There are valid grievances that got compromised by defending that thug. It’s the FALSE claims that anger most of the conservatives here and make them turn a blind eye to legit claims.

    Brown triggered long felt tensions but he wasn’t worth it.

    And James, while I think JAL’s response to you was over the top, you’re just plain wrong about Garner. The handbook followed by the NYPD defines what the cop did as a chokehold. It doesn’t matter if it doesn’t meet your military definition. The cop was wrong and should be called to task for it.

  285. Hey JAL? Do you have any idea how monumentally stupid I find you? You don’t, do you?

    I think you’re mildly retarded. You’re so profanely ignorant, you’re hardly worth insulting. I can’t say that for anybody else on this board. And if you’re not Densico, you should be. You’re Michael Brown – the bottom of the caste. Try to remember that, mammy.

    But you’re like a pet dog – mildly amusing. Roll over, Fido. Now you can kiss my lily white ass and rim me, prissy.

  286. I seriously doubt that the majority of Americans even know who is the mayor of NYC. The NYPD has been fighting with every mayor. Nothing new.

    Mammy, here Miss Scarlett’s vittles. Those words keep ringing through my ears every time I read the title JAL. I can’t help myself. LOL

    Hey Densi, there’s a big difference about debating fiduciary contracts and having the majority of the police force turn their backs on you, you dumb dawg. Fetch!

  287. Tex, just as I got ready to respond to your “plea” for conversation, Just A Lurker posted enough ammo to keep you busy for awhile. I think this smarmy bitch will just lay low like Brer Fox 😉

  288. “And there are those who are racist but use the language of one pretending they are not racist. “. Lurker

    There are also those that are not, not racist but don’t use the language pretending they are racist as well as those who are racist but don’t use the language pretending to not be a racist who is racist on the down low. Also….there those who are blah blah blah..

  289. Just got back from the suburb I grew up in. It’s sad seeing what the new black inhabitants have done with the place. Gang graffiti all over the place. All black gang stuff.

    Apparently the block I grew up on is now uncontested Folk Nation turf.

  290. <

    blockquote>Tex, just as I got ready to respond to your “plea” for conversation, Just A Lurker posted enough ammo to keep you busy for awhile. I think this smarmy bitch will just lay low like Brer Fox 😉

    <

    blockquote>

    Oh? Did I leave you the impression I wanted to converse with you? My mistake. I wanted to insult you some more. You’ll be glad to know while smarmy, I don’t think you uranium dense like the mildly retarded manhater, JAL, who couldn’t catch a man if she were wearing a giant, pink vagina costume.

    But I’ve gone more than enough return volley to take the mildly retarded Prissy “I don’t know nuttin bout birthin’ babies” and the smarmy at the same time. 😉

    Let’s get it on!

  291. “And there are those who are racist but use the language of one pretending they are not racist. “. Lurker

    Being a female feral, JAL is easily confused – the very left most point of the Bell Curve distribution. I always like to imagine JAL as being Rachel Jeantel of Trayvon™ fame. Got the matching 300lbs leggings and the same reading skills.

    If we have our blog host get us a cursive font, everything would look code to JAL.

  292. ‘NYPD KKK’: ANTI-COP PROTESTERS FLOOD STREETS

    What’s being yelled in the streets of NY as I write. I hope you enablers are proud of your kin as you defend Comrade Deblasio and these reprobates of his – of which he’s obviously lost control.

    JAL’s people.

  293. of which he’s obviously lost control.

    This would be true. De Blasio asked the protesters for a moratorium. If what you’re seeing is live and not taped then they obviously aren’t listening.

  294. Two weeks ago my boss accidentally cc’d me on a note to her colleagues that she’d be out Monday for chemo treatments. She apologized for copying me and I wished her the best with her treatments.

    She died last Friday night.

    They’re ought to be a law against dying during the holidays. So damn gut wrenching.

    P.S. In true 21st century fashion, the home office in New Haven had a grief workshop and counselors on hand. Whatever happened to good old fashioned mourning?

  295. There’s always a rainbow somewhere shinin’.

    Looks like Pfestus the Drunk will have his holiday rained out on the beach. Short of tsunami or shark attack, I can’t think of a more fitting end to that bloviating Aussie’s vacation on the beach. Leave him plenty of time to sleep off the hangover laying around in his soiled underwear while playing Wheel of Fortune. 😈

    Merry Winter Solstice, Pfestus!

  296. It is pretty clear to me that both R and Retard (JAL) are missing the point. No one has said the police are without fault. I know I’ve said it on this forum multiple times that I just don’t like cops as I think most of them are either little dudes with Napoleon complexes, or are power hungry jerks. The point is, the protests are calling white people racists for being white, which is racist in and of itself, deny the role played by the “victim” in their own death, and do nothing to actually look at the problem and solve it.

    Stop & Frisk is a REACTION. If it didn’t work, they wouldn’t do it. But guess what, it does work because they find weapons and drugs ALL THE TIME. You will piss yourselves over the P word, but you cannot deny that profiling works, and you’re guilty of doing it EVERYDAY.

    Hmmmmm, I step outside and see clouds, hear thunder, and smell moisture, so I grab an umbrella. It’s not raining, but my checklist of indicators (PROFILE) that tell me there is a likelihood of rain have been met, and thus I prepare. Does it rain EVERY TIME? Nope, but I know that when I ignore the profile and don’t prepare, the chances of bad things (getting soaked) happening increase significantly.

    I don’t know where Retard got the list of names, probably from Gawker and tells you just about everything you need to know about that list, but in the instance of Garner and Brown, they both were confronted while breaking the law and resisted arrest. I know Retard—and probably R as well–doesn’t know what a choke hold is, this is just what they’ve been fed by the hatemongers on MSDNC, but Garner wasn’t in a choke hold. I would be curious what Retard thinks the cops should have done. Ask nicely? Taser? Pepper spray?

    I think we all agree that police brutality is bad, and should be stopped whenever it is found. But the narrative from Sharpton & Co, is that cops are racists, and whites too, and therefore we should all give blacks a pass. This of course ignores the fact that these guys were stopped not for being black, but for breaking the law. It was THEIR actions that escalated things, ultimately resulting in death.

    There are those who are racist and use the racist language proudly. There are those who use the language of a racist but may not be racist. And there are those who are racist but use the language of one pretending they are not racist. There is a lot of that going on here.

    One last thing: FUCK YOU RETARD. Opposition to your position is either openly or closet racist? Fuck you. This is why most of us despise you, because you’re a fucking RETARD. No one is being racist, but we are pointing out facts that are inconsistent with your position, and if there is anything you FUCKTARDs have learned from the Man Child, it is to sabotage any debate you’re losing with RACIST!!!!!!! Seriously, go fuck yourself.

  297. SMH…

    The New York City group that called for “dead cops” in a widely circulated video is most likely– no joke — the Trayvon Martin Organizing Committee (TMOC).

    In a piece outing “The Monsters Who Screamed For Dead Cops,” The Daily Beast’s Jacob Siegel cites a “web of circumstantial ties” to the group. The man who shot the disturbing video — showing marchers chanting, “What do we want? Dead cops! When do we want them? Now!” — told Siegel that he saw the group marching with signs reading “No Cops, No Prison.”

    Siegel produces evidence from Instagram that the TMOC marched with that sign at rallies. Likewise, he notes that a slogan being yelled at the beginning of the video, “Arms up, shoot back,” also appears on the TMOC Twitter account.

  298. Gorilla,

    Good commentary.

    When did we allow JAL and her band of bangers rate to start placing demands on the lawful? This is how insane this society has become in trying to lock themselves into the demands of political correctness run amok that the mildly retarded, infinitely ignorant JAL type demands of our intelligence and law enforcement.

    This is why 84yr old, white grandmothers are aggressively searched at airports, but a Yemeni cleric in full garb is given the once over – threat of loss of life has actually become less important than the threat of being called racist or xenophobe. I mean, is anybody here going to be troubled that the mildly retarded JAL calls them a cracka, a racist, a pinky?

    We have lost our collective minds and desperately need to ignore the mildly retarded JAL types, returning them back to their place of irrelevance. Of course cops have to profile. I have faith police are smart enough to differentiate between the law abiding, black mother carrying a sack of groceries and LaQuan carrying a revolver and 2oz of crack or Jasmine Akisha Lee hoing on 127th and Broadway.

  299. For one week a year it gets psuedo ethnic around here. Mostly because old polish relatives and friends give you food and drink.

    I just fed my two boys sauerkraut pierogies when they thought they were potato. You should have seen their faces.
    I can’t stop laughing at them.

    They weren’t amused.

  300. My sympathy to Rutherford and Tex.

    Rutherford, the last I heard, the chock hold used was not against the law. It was against regulations. And most importantly, it did not kill Garner. Maybe the cop should be called to account for using that particular chock hold, but that falls far short of a crime causing injury or death. We all watched Garner die. He repeated “I can’t breathe when he was short of breath, not when he couldn’t breath. I repeat, someone who can’t breathe cannot tell you so.

    His medical condition combined with the stress of resisting arrest killed him. Garner died because he failed to follow the instructions DeBlasio gave his son. We all make decisions which we don’t always realize may change our lives .Brown, Garner, and Trayvon made decisions which killed them. They misjudged their own capabilities and those whom they were attacking.

    Garner may not have attempted murder, but he resisted arrest. How would the police know what he could do? He was a big man with a record. As I wrote, I have been in more violent situations than he was That was child’s play for a healthy person. My only fault with the police is they didn’t react sooner when he said “I can’t breathe.” I read the police officer in charge of the operation was a black woman. How was that racist? Was it sexist? Maybe Garner was a victim of a war on men.

    JAL, in 1968, I moved to a foreign base which was badly run. It had the highest alcholism and suicide rate in the command. We lived with a lot of stress and at one point we were told to be ready to move to harm’s way within twenty four hours. We lived in six man quansite huts. On one of my first nights there, a room mate yelled “turn out the lights!” We heard noise, and we hid under our beds. In came a bunch of half drunk men who despoiled our property and left.

    They were a gang of extortionists who also smuggled prostitutes onto the base for a cut of their pay. Everyone was afraid of them. At a regular squadron meeting our NCOIC lost it, because they had broken an Airman’s jaw with a board. He shook his fist in the leader’s face and said “I will get you, if its the last thing I do!” The air man told the commander who forced the NCOIC to apollogise.

    This went on for weeks after my arrival. Everyone muttered that someone should turn them in, but it was always someone else who should bell the cat. It reminded me of an old western where bad guys moved in and cowed the townspeople. All i Knew was I didn’t want to live that way.

    We had rats and cats to eat them. They took our cat and put her in our stove. She escaped and ran under the hut with her tail on fire. They got a shovel and tried to dig her out. They killed another cat and kittens and hung them across the door like laundry on a clothes line.

    We kept our hut (hootch) locked, Late one night, a man broke into our hut through a window and let the others in to wreck our possessions. They threatened us if we told about the break in.At least this was a real crime with a witness. Three of us made a decision as fateful as Garner’s. This had to stop. We three turned them in, I was the sole witness of the break in. The other three witnessed the threats. Three other room mates wanted nothing to do with it.

    My new friends tried to talk me out of it because they knew what these men would do. I considered it, but I was afraid of future me. Could I look at my face in the mirror when I was 50? .My officers promised they would take care to protect me when I faltered and considered rescinding the charges.

    They behaved just as Hillary, Obama and the others did at Benghazi when they failed to listen or to protect the folks in harms way. My officers lied to me so something bad would happen and they could press heavier charges. Just as at Benghazi, the plan unraveled, and events spiraled out of control. Human nature kicked in. I became a pariah out of fear and because some decided these weren’t such bad guys after all. A variation of blame the victim spread like the flu.Some of the original victims joined the bad guys al a Stockholm Syndrome.

    They had an office pool in which people bet on when I would be hospitalized and another side bet on whether I would survive. Three room mates moved out. One took the key, so I couldn’t lock the door. At night, I woke to fifteen or twenty men surrounding my bed. I was terrified, but I didn’t let them know. I slept restlessly and taught myself to wake with as much anger and invective as I could. After I woke with a knife on my throat, I carried a knife and mentally rehearsed how I would use it.I slept with my hand on the knife under my pillow. Men jumped at ,me from behind doors and I taught myself to use a Karati stance without thinking. I didn’t carry a pistol for fear I would panic and prematurely shoot someone. I had to let them make the first move to claim self defense. I was utterly alone. I didn’t know until years later that I was being watched, and our fearless leaders stopped two attempted murder events. Unfortunately they had not been able to discern or prove who had actually done the deeds. After it ended, they laced my drink with rat poison. The bartender told my friend he had seen them put something in it. We had it tested on the base.

    I guess they could have blamed a tape.

    This went on for three and a half months.Afterward, I had a lot of anger, and I knew the head office felt guilty because they didn’t do a thing, even after I shook my fist in a major’s face or pounded the NCIC’s desk so hard, his coffee cup tipped over. I refused to get a hair cut, so they hid me in the x ray room when the commander came to call. I left the service with my service ribbons displayed backwards, and the hospital commander laughed about it.

    I was a token veteran guest on NPR’s Science Friday, Talk of the Nation. Several psychiatrists were discussing a planned deprogram and support operation to help veterans returning from Afghanistan and Iraq. One called me a perfect storm, just the type they were trying to help. My having had no support system, apparently , not even from God combined with the violence made me a “perfect storm.”

    So, JAL, fifty years to you is last week to me. It changes you. Twelve years later, I spoke to the Vet Center, and the counselor said I disturbed him. It was as if I was skipping a stone over my emotions.I was cleaning our combine one time, and my right hand hurt as it still does after all of these years. I thought I wished I had not stopped so soon when I strangled that man. It felt so good to feel his muscles relax and for him to lapse into unconsciousness. God, I wished I had finished the job. Those men came to a bad end, and I did put one in the hospital for four days. At least I have that.

    That time and its aftermath was the best education I could have had. I am proud of what I did. I still base my view of the world on what happened then. I made a choice that night and so did the three black bad guys who miscalculated and died. I feel little no sympathy for them. They got what they deserved. So did I.

  301. The left has tried to blame the right for violence at least since Clinton blamed Rush for the Oklahoma bombing.,Now, the shoe is on the other foot and the left wants to change the rules of discourse. Of course, it isn’t fair, but they are getting what they deserve. I am enjoying the show as long as it lasts.

  302. rabbit, you might like FLASH MOB Cracow Connection, if you are getting ethnic. They practiced for four months, and they are good.

  303. A polish flash mob? That must be a clusterfuck.

    You know the Germans invaded Poland by walking backwards. The Polish thought they were leaving.

    When I was in Ireland, I noticed two groups of women. There were these gangly, weak jawed, zitty ladies and their voluptuous, beautiful servents doning all the menial work around Dublin. It was obvious why those horrid looking Irish hated on the Polish underclass. There are 100,000 Cinderellas in Dublin alone.

  304. Nope. The Australia TDY pretty much ate all of hunting season. There are a few things still going on, but I’m doubtful I’ll get into it. Maybe some water fowl, we’ll see. A buddy of mine is getting a nuisance permit for geese on a property, so that’ll be fun. No bag limit + unplugged guns = LOTS OF BIRDS!!!

    You?

  305. You should have a Kangaroo trophy!

    Yeah…we didn’t start setting up until mid October… Setting up tree stands, addressing issuescin our living quarters etc.

    Still saw deer and managed to screw it up.

    Didn’t make it out for gun season.

  306. Thanks Gorilla for the condolences. We weren’t close but it was awfully disconcerting to wish her well with her chemo and recovery, having no idea how sick she was. I almost worry she thought I was being a wise ass. But then, if I had known she was moribund would I have just said nothing?

    Cancer is a bitch.

  307. Now that Rutherford’s ignorant mob is in full tantrum mode, it seems every savage feral one that pulls a gun on the cop becomes a martyr for the Thugs’ Rights Movement. Plus the cop becomes public enemy number one.

    Terrible. The angry libs are sabotaging the entire nation with their frothing ignorant wind up toys just because they know pretty much nobody is buying into liberal bull shit anymore.

    Race relations need to be horrible for liberals and liberals are willing to lie and incite all it takes to make sure they remain this way.

    I like how the libs here are so out of it, they defend the mayor of New York as if he doesn’t lead a city of 9 million. No, we’re told, the mayor made a good point about his son, as if he is a fucking blogger.

    He runs New York City!!!!!! He’s not on the Jenny Jones show! I don’t give a fuck about his conversations about his son. They defy reality anyways.

  308. “And there are those who are racist but use the language of one pretending they are not racist.”

    I have decided this one fits Lurker.

    Prove me wrong.

  309. It is pretty clear to me that both R and Retard (JAL) are missing the point. …

    I actually whole heartedly agree with most of what Gorilla says in this long comment. Without the N word being tossed around, racism is awfully hard to prove and I’d go so far as to say just about every name on JAL’s list did not involve a racist cop. It was folks in the wrong place at the wrong time, sometimes doing the wrong thing and a cop who could be Monday morning quarterbacked for using deadly force.

    Where I disagree with G: The NYC Police handbook (I don’t know the exact name of it) defines a chokehold as “applying pressure to the chest or neck”. By that definition, Garner was in a chokehold. I don’t give a flying fuck how G and James want to define it to take this cop off the hook. Either he didn’t know the rules or he said fuck it.

    Second, I believe that in at least 80% of stop and frisk events, nothing illegal is found and the vast majority of those stopped are black. That’s a problem.

    Third, JAL isn’t a retard because she uses bold rhetoric. By that measure everyone here should be riding on the short bus.

  310. “Now that Rutherford’s ignorant mob is in full tantrum mode, it seems every savage feral one that pulls a gun on the cop becomes a martyr for the Thugs’ Rights Movement.”

    Not sure if you’re aware, since you didn’t mention it, but 2 miles away from Ferguson, MO, a black guy pulled a gun on a cop and the cop shot and killed him. A violent protest followed, and several were arrested.

    I wonder what the closet racist Lurker thinks of this

  311. “Without the N word being tossed around, racism is awfully hard to prove…”

    Absence of racism is even harder to prove. Why, there are dog whistles and all kinds of things out there just waiting to get a racist label slapped on someone. Heck, you can even be a racist and hide it with your language. Just ask Lurker.

  312. Al $harpton uses “bold rhetoric” too. Let the Lefty, mildly retarded Lout defend this…

    Libs Lied, Cops Died

    Of course no one is supposed to call out any of the protected classes on their irresponsible rhetoric — isn’t that right, Rev. Al?

    “The blame game,” Sharpton now says, “will only lead to further kinds of venom and further division.”

    Ironic words from the tax deadbeat who invented Tawana Brawley and who has spent a lifetime denouncing “white interlopers,” “diamond merchants” and “fags.” None dares call it hate speech.

    Have you ever noticed that when these hate-mongers say, “Stop the finger-pointing,” they’re talking about you accusing them? When they accuse you — of anything — they’re speaking truth to power, and don’t you ever forget it.

    Donna Brazile tweeted: “Stop the politics.”

    So I guess it wasn’t politics when Barack Obama said the protests/riots were necessary because the “country’s conscience has to be triggered by some inconvenience.”

    Eric Holder, Obama’s attorney general, touted the riots as “momentum to a necessary conversation.”

    Holder’s idea of a conversation is himself harshly lecturing other groups of Americans on behalf of “my people,” as he describes blacks. I guess the two murdered NYPD officers are not his people.

    Then there’s the mayor of New York, Warren Wilhelm, I mean, William de Blasio. (What is it with these leftist pols and their multiple names?)

    This is the bum who was ranting two weeks ago about the “scourge” of alleged police violence. After last week’s brutal assault on two cops (a thug SEIU organizer and Ivy League grad students have been charged) he pooh-poohed one cop’s broken nose as an “alleged attack.”

    On Monday, though, Hizzoner takes the last refuge of a scoundrel. He blames the press for the violence.

    “Are you going to keep dividing us?” the city’s Divider in Chief asked a reporter.

    It gets worse with this bum de Blasio. Two weeks ago, he had the gall to say that he was worried about the safety of his half-black son, Dante.

    http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/columnists/howie_carr/2014/12/carr_finger_pointers_pushing_irresponsible_rhetoric_on

  313. Are we surprised that the TMOC are thugs? They are defending a thug.

    Do you folks realize that after all we’ve learned, even conservatives like Joe Scarborough talk about Trayvon with sympathy?

    Of all the things that get you guys riled up, the one that resonates most with me is protest on behalf of garbage. Trayvon and Brown being a cause célèbre is a travesty. It truly pains me that the plight of innocent blacks is side railed by these faux heroes.

  314. “Of all the things that get you guys riled up, the one that resonates most with me is protest on behalf of garbage.”

    People don’t pick their battles anymore. EVERYTHING is a battle. EVERYTHING is worthy of outrage. Shit, there’s people getting pissed off now that guys sit on buses and subways with their legs spread comfortably open. We’ve gone from fighting for the right to own property and vote to how someone sits is a patriarchal and oppressive micro-aggression.

    You’d think at some point people would just get tired of being pissed off all of the time. But nope. All of the special people on earth, which, as we know, is everyone on earth, need to get worked up into a frenzy every day someone doesn’t reaffirm to them how special they are.

  315. He repeated “I can’t breathe when he was short of breath, not when he couldn’t breath. I repeat, someone who can’t breathe cannot tell you so.

    Goddamit James you’re smarter than this.

    Let me repeat: “I can’t breathe” means “I am having trouble breathing”. If you wait until he stops talking, as the dumb fuck cop did, then it’s too late.

    James on this point you are truly driving me batty.

    Also, Garner was not some unknown big menacing black man. He was known to the neighborhood and the police. He saw nothing wrong with selling loosies (which doesn’t make it right) and felt the cops were hassling him. They would yell at him in the store “hey cigarette guy!” He was a known entity. They KNEW he would not get violent. They KNEW he would not and could not flee.

    That day they decided they were going to make a point and they accidentally killed him in the process. It’s as simple as that.

    I will tell you this. It has reinforced something for me. I cannot stand without locking my leg braces. If a cop ever tells me to get out of the car, I will politely tell him about my braces so Barney Fife doesn’t shoot me thinking I’m reaching for a gun.

  316. The left has tried to blame the right for violence at least since Clinton blamed Rush for the Oklahoma bombing.,Now, the shoe is on the other foot and the left wants to change the rules of discourse. Of course, it isn’t fair, but they are getting what they deserve. I am enjoying the show as long as it lasts.

    So you agree the charge is illegitimate in both cases?

  317. What gets me riled up, DR called it and r refuses to acknowledge it, is how guys like R are so easily played and have no concept of what it means when our leader pick sides:

    “I like how the libs here are so out of it, they defend the mayor of New York as if he doesn’t lead a city of 9 million. No, we’re told, the mayor made a good point about his son, as if he is a fucking blogger.”

    Rutherford just doesn’t get this. It’s the stupidity cloaked as empathy that riles me up. R actually claims the issue is about peaceful protest for fuck’s sake. You can’t be more out of touch.

    Good quotes too Tex. That’s right on.

  318. Rabbit you’re plain wrong De Blasio has to strike a balance. He’s basically saying “I feel your pain” when he tells the story about “the talk”.

    Where you might have a valid gripe is that EVERY father should have “the talk” with their son, black or white. As Raji has said, one of the lessons from Brown and Garner is don’t fuck with the police.

    This video needs to be shown every time some dude cries police harassment.

  319. The Left does not want to ever be held accountable for its actions – a concept Obama has vast expertise. “What do we want, dead cops, When do we want it, now.” Anybody here any loud condemnation from any of the grievance hustlers? I didn’t.

    $harpton referred cops as “cockroaches.” Ironically now that filthy maggot is calling those same “roaches” for protection. $harpton the tax cheat’s pleas should be ignored.

    Bill Ayers, Obama’s good buddy and campaign handler did the same.

  320. Now that Rutherford’s ignorant mob is in full tantrum mode, it seems every savage feral one that pulls a gun on the cop becomes a martyr for the Thugs’ Rights Movement. Plus the cop becomes public enemy number one.

    Not my mob but sadly you’re right.

  321. Rev. Jeremiah, Malik Zulu Shabazz and Louie Farrakhan have got to be tickled, but that small, quiet voice tells me the vast majority of blacks won’t be when this is through.

    “R”, tell me since I never put you in the same camp as I do the mildly retarded JAL. As a law abiding black man and generally decent human, “Is it worth it now in what the protests have become for the majority of law abiding blacks to be labeled as suspect no matter how unfair you find that?”

    Walking through the mall yesterday, I couldn’t help but be a little more guarded with my wife when any young blacks, male or female, walked our way. The kind of flight or fight reaction, corner of my eye reaction – and I’m too old for flight. If that’s racist, too bad. I consider it wise policy. And further, I believe most people do, including many blacks.

    The rancid defense of De Blasio and his implication that cops are racist astounds me. Had he told that story and framed it because there’s a reason to be more suspicious…and there clearly is…would have made all the difference in the world. That’s a teaching lesson, father-to-son. But that certainly isn’t what DeBlasio implied.

    The open ended DeBlasio implication that cops are out to get young black males? Anybody honest and sane can’t deny that was the implication of that speech. And while Raji may find that fair, I consider it slander.

    Anybody honest and sane that can’t understand why cops would be offended is an idiot.

  322. “Is it worth it now in what the protests have become for the majority of law abiding blacks to be labeled as suspect no matter how unfair you find that?”

    I may be misunderstanding your comment/question.

    The majority of blacks are labeled suspect long before these protests. Ultimately that is the by product of brothers and sisters giving them a bad name. One problem is blacks being isolated in this shell.

    Jews got labeled stingy profit-mongers because SOME of them were. Asians are called bad drivers cos some of them can’t drive for shit. Innocents of every race and creed get labeled with the traits of their worst comrades. And these labels always have one toe in reality.

    Where I get my dander up is when blacks are singled out for deviancy when every group has their deviants.

    And yes, as Huck suggested a few days ago, we must settle on a definition of “peaceful protest” because if we don’t, we shatter the one right that still sets this country apart and makes it that shining city on a hill.

  323. “We’ve gone from fighting for the right to own property and vote to how someone sits is a patriarchal and oppressive micro-aggression.” Fucking

    Were you serious about the open leg thing?

  324. “And yes, as Huck suggested a few days ago, we must settle on a definition of “peaceful protest”….”

    I probably didn’t make it very clear, but this isn’t at all what I was suggesting.

    What I was suggesting is that it is impossible to do so.

    Because now we have to settle on the definition of “we”. Who is “we”?

    That’s actually the most important question, because words only have meaning when 2 or more people agree on that meaning. But meaning does not require unanimity. Some are going to be left out of the group. In turn, that makes them a group, with a shared understanding of what a word means.

    Which group is right?

    (Yeah, I find the social aspects of linguistics and Goffman’s Frame theory fascinating)

  325. Huck @ 2:58 pm

    You hit the nail on the head with that post! Yep, last year was the War on Christmas, this year it’s the War on Cops or whatever else pisses us off.

  326. “Where I get my dander up is when blacks are singled out for deviancy when every group has their deviants.” -R

    I disagree. Black culture needs to be singled out for deviancy. It’s that bad. Almost all black children are born out wedlock now. That fact alone is insane.

    That being said, on a micro level, being obsessed with groups instead of an individual’s character is a horrible way to live life. Racists miss out on getting to know a lot of good people who do have different perspectives on things, sometimes in a hilarious fashion. Racists are usually pretty boring people.

  327. Yes Rabbit – Huck was serious. That’s now a complaint by the man haters of the Left and the mildly retarded JAL types – men are being uncivilized misogynists and patriarchal on subways and the like for taking up too much room by keeping their legs spread.

  328. So some more social theory because…well…I like. it. And it applies to what we’re discussing.

    The object of any movement is not to achieve its goals—it’s to survive. This is why goals are never met, but always evolving. There are very few, if any, exceptions to this.

    And it applies to overall movements, as well as entities within a movement. The Civil Rights Movement. The Equal Rights Movement. Obama/Organizing For America. MoveOn.org. The KKK. Communists. Nazis. The list really goes on and on and on.

    That doesn’t mean there aren’t movements that cease to exist, but they don’t do so willingly.

    This is why things devolve into defending thugs and making them the face of a movement, war on [fill in the blank], and manspreading.

    Because constant movement requires constant energy. And convincing people they are victims is a cheap, reliable form of energy. People might not even realize they are getting shit on. But if you can convince them they are, then they’ll get up off the couch and do something about it.

  329. “Where I get my dander up is when blacks are singled out for deviancy when every group has their deviants.”

    Oh, I knooooooooooooow. Did you hear what happened to Michelle Obama at Target? Rough stuff there. Thank God we have a first lady willing to speak up about that kind of oppression at this time. What would happen if she had stuck to her original story of the unaware old lady that didn’t recognize how important she was in. . . get this. . . asking for assistance from another human being she didn’t recognize. All we would’ve been left with is “don’t interact with black people;” that’d be racism.

    And de Blasio who talks about the oppression his racist police force exerts. Speaking truth to. . . oh yeah. Well, thank God he recognizes his position in seeking to exploit racial tensions. It was important that he do that because. . . well, forget that.

    And let’s not forget about Rutherford’s treatment at the country club. Thank God it wasn’t a cop that caught you being black within a gated area. Same for Obama. You’d both probably be shot dead on the spot.

    And two cops got shot. But you don’t have to be a lawyer to know mental state counts for. . . well it’s whatever the MSNBC thought leaders have done is not blameworthy. . . for some reason related to. . . law. . .and stuff.

  330. The object of any movement is not to achieve its goals—it’s to survive. This is why goals are never met, but always evolving. There are very few, if any, exceptions to this.

    Interesting. I’ll have to give that one some thought, Huck.

    This is means what I always witness by any movement from the Left. And they’re very successful at it to mask their monumental failures of their ideology: emotional manipulation, “Jamming” – the planned psychological attack in the form of propaganda fed to the nation via the media, and finally conversion to the cause.

    It’s also the method these grievance hustlers use.

  331. Rutherford, you cannot speak if no air is getting into your lungs. A twenty or even thirty second chock hold will not deprive one of oxygen long enough for him to lose consciousness, let alone kill him. If you don’t believe me hold your breath and count.

    At best, you might say it once with expelled air, and Garner said it more than once when no one was chocking him. The officers had thrown him down and climbed on top of him.. Garner also said it when he was not in a chock hold. Police officers had been on top of him. If the chock hold had done it, Garner would have been comatose and no one would have slammed him to the street or climbed on top of him.

    I read that Garner had been arrested for selling loose cigarettes numerous times. He also said he was getting tired of it, and said “It stops now.” A jumpy police officer could interpret that as a threat. They didn’t know what he was going to do, when he started to push them away, so they restrained him.

    Unfortunately Garner was in no condition for such exertion. I think the actionable offense was that the paramedics did nothing to help Garner at first, and I believe the police officer who broke force rules, but not the law should have been punished unless he showed he feared for his life or safety.

    Saying a police officer strangled a man to death sounds more dramatic, than that he did not receive first aid soon enough, but the tape tells us Garner was not strangled to death. He died afterward.

  332. Rutherford, since we’ll probably be pairing off in the big race war next year, let me take the opportunity now to thank you for letting me be a part of the clan. Or is it Klan? Without you, I wouldn’t have had a bunch of laughs, perhaps learned a little, and met some good people – you included.

    Merry Christmas to you and yours as I’m sure tomorrow will be busy. And I didn’t get a chance to tell you that earlier today.

    That goes for the rest of you trouble makers too. Except Pfester. He wouldn’t know Merry or Christmas so he can go howl at the moon and run around butt naked with the other Alaskan bloggers.

  333. “Rutherford, since we’ll probably be pairing off in the big race war next year”

    Damn that made me laugh out loud. Repeatedly. Don’t know why.

    Merry Christmas to friend and foe alike!

  334. I’ve grown quite weary of political discussion but I wanted to wish everyone here a very Merry Christmas and a Happy and Safe (and sane) New Year. Cheers

  335. And let’s not forget about Rutherford’s treatment at the country club. Thank God it wasn’t a cop that caught you being black within a gated area. Same for Obama. You’d both probably be shot dead on the spot.

    . I think from now on when I read Tigre I’m going to hear PJ O’Roarke in my head so I can just laugh.

    The country club story had NOTHING to do with race. He assumed I didn’t belong there because of my disability. I did NOT assume that he was clueless despite being dressed like a gardener. I gave him the benefit of the doubt. He did not do the same. No biggie. Just a matter of judging the book by its cover.

  336. Sorry for the Big Slight. I know it was hard. No one else suffers those. I can’t imagine the horror of not being recognized as a member, but we all know it was a fraction of what the Obamas had to endure. Boy the had it rough, didn’t they? The overt racism they endured. It must have been tough having all the special treatment heaped on top. Really resonates, man. You being judged as anything less than a member, by some racist anti-handicap gardener no less. Not like the Target incident, mind you. But I feel ya. Burn this bitch down! Thanks for the anecdotal proof of whatever unfair treatment you justifies the idiots supporting the “protester’s” “false but accurate” cause.

    I guess I will have “that talk” with my kids about being compliant lest they be accused of racism because they’re white.

  337. rabbit laughed at the idea of a Polish flash mob, so here one is if anyone bothers to look.

    Rutherford’s treatment at the country club reminds me of our adventure on an Italian air base. We mistakenly made an emergency landing there instead of at the Rome air port. The Italians assumed we were terrorists and were ready to shoot us down. They changed their minds, so their profiling big slight didn’t kill us.

    Merry Christmas!

  338. R: “I will tell you this. It has reinforced something for me. I cannot stand without locking my leg braces. If a cop ever tells me to get out of the car, I will politely tell him about my braces so Barney Fife doesn’t shoot me thinking I’m reaching for a gun.”

    Absolutely. US cops need some serious retraining about how and when to use deadly force.

    It’s no wonder, though, that the police are on hair-trigger edge with black men. Did you see the video of the kid pointing his (this time REAL) gun at the Missouri cop before being shot dead? Jesus! Talk about making cops paranoid.

  339. James –
    True enough that the victim in NY was able to talk, but a little googling reveals that the “choke hold” is actually a misnomer; it does not cut off a person’s wind. It’s actually quite hard to crush the trachea and block airflow. The choke hold compresses the carotid arteries and shuts off blood to the brain, which then stops the nerve impulses that control breathing. So, regardless of the details, the effect is the same, isn’t it?


    R – new rules for a new year: since you find “Clit” offensive, and we now know that Clit and Slack are one and the same, how about a compromise: one, the other, or both will be referred to as as “Click” or “Clack” or “Slit” or “Slick,” or “Crack,” or perhaps, “Slick-Crack.”

    Which do you prefer? Dealer’s choice. I like “Slit,” myself…

    Poolman, what say you? This was YOUR invention, after all … LOL.


    Oh, by the way, R – happy Holidays. Hope the new year brings you prosperity and aequanimitas. Condolences for your boss.

  340. Parker, I prefer to let bygones be bygones, since 1) Tom Magliozzi recently passed, 2) Rutherford didn’t even get the joke at the time, and 3) one person it pertained to was highly offended. The whole issue was blown out of proportion in these threads and is better left as past. Besides, this time of year is traditionally a time for new starts and positive recommitments. I offend enough people with ugly and inconvenient truths. There is no need to do so offensively. 😀

  341. Rutherford, I leaned in college and grad school that details are everything. I know how to crush a trachea. The chock hold I saw which was represented in a YouTube video showed the kind which you rightly wrote will only cut off air and blood supply.

    I don’t think the problem was due to blood supply to the brain, I think it was Garner’s poor lungs, other medical flaws, and the stress of the encounter. They exacerbated the earlier and current stress.

    The song, “I Shot the Sherrif, but I did not shoot the deputy.” applies in my opinion.

    It all boils down to Garners’ thievery and bad judgement, He should have behaved as De Blasio advised his son. Its how I behaved when I drove at 80 MPH in a 60 MPH zone. I passed a patrol car and though it was too late then, so I continued. The patrol officer started to say I was speeding. I interrupted him and said I knew. We had a minor emergency and needed to get to our kids house fast. I told him I knew I was speeding, and that I deserved a ticket.

    I had renewed my drivers license but had lost it. The patrolman saw my license had expired. He didn’t give me a ticket and after I told him I had already re newed my license, he said well never mind.

    Garner might still be alive to celebrate Christmas if he had done something like that,.

  342. Pfestus,

    I see I didn’t get my Christmas wish yet. 😈 Where is Stephen Spielberg when I need him?

    I only wish I could shred you half as well as Ms. Muffy does. It would do me proud. I’m going to kiss her when I meet her for her mastery of working over buffoons and louts, thankful she hasn’t taken me to school like she has you. Perhaps the best I have ever read at dealing with utter bores. As a man, I understand when you’re reduced to having to choose feminine vernacular again and again to patronize and insult, she whipped you. Once is shock value and perhaps effective. But over and over again is both crass and puerile. Give it up. Your claims to never losing have been reduced to dust.

    Since it’s Christmas, I’ll go light in the spirit of the season. But you really need to understand, you vastly overrate your ability to debate, reason and insult. You should find another hobby. You’re not very good at this one.

    Seasons Greetings…

  343. I had renewed my drivers license but had lost it. The patrolman saw my license had expired. He didn’t give me a ticket and after I told him I had already re newed my license, he said well never mind.

    I can only hope he would have done the same had you been black. No way to tell of course. That’s the source of the current increase in black paranoia.

  344. Hey Tigre, when you retire from Esq what do you plan to do?

    In fact, I’ll throw that question out to everyone.

    Realistically, I won’t be able to retire but if I could, I’d just blog, read, go see lectures and live a life of leisure as a faux-intellectual.

  345. I love what I do and will keep on doing it as long as I have opportunity and health. I never have found a reason to retire from anything one is passionate about as long as it is positive and constructive. The whole retirement concept is part of that carrot on a stick guide to conformity we have been indoctrinated with since youth. If you aren’t doing what you enjoy right now, change your attitude or your environment. Life is too short to wait to live it.

  346. I’ll give you one thing, Poolman. If you truly have found something you’re passionate about that can provide a living, no matter how meager or fruitful, then I am envious. You have achieved something I have not.

    Not to say I don’t have a good life. My immediate family is as good as it gets – I’m totally convinced of that. You simply can’t be married to a finer spouse, greatly adored by her kids, highly admired by her husband, much loved by her extended family, both sides. Generally money is not an issue, nor is hardship. All of us are healthy, I think. It seems we most often can do as we please.

    But…

    I will still consider my life incomplete if at my death, I still have not found more purpose to my work.

    As my oldest daughter once said to me one time when asked at 16 what she wanted to major in, “I’m interested in everything and interested in nothing.” Gulp. That sure sounded like her old man once upon a time.

    Merry Christmas to you and yours.

  347. Not sure what I’d do if I could retire. Heck, I’m getting ready to start teaching in a university classroom in January, I’m not even thinking about retirement. I’m excited about working.

  348. Well Tex, I hope you find something you are passionate about that can give you that drive to attend and satisfaction of accomplishment. I have to keep the balance between work and relations as I am a recovering workaholic who finds it difficult to delegate responsibility.

    I think you would like working productions, something I really enjoyed but could not continue and still do pools. I have a friend in charge of a big venue there in your city. It was always fun working backstage and there were lots of benefits.

  349. Good question.

    Want and plan are two different things. However, they would be the same things in differing degrees.

    1. Travel (Anthony Bourdain-style);
    2. Skydive (prolifically)

    I used to sport jump every weekend and decided it was irresponsible to continue after kids. Oh I miss it.

    I will likely work the remainder of my days.

  350. What the fuck is Sport Jump? Sound like it would make me embarrassingly defecate in my pants.

    Just when I think I have Tiger figured out he always throws a curve ball.

  351. Tonight, three generations of Taylors played charades. I haven’t played in 30 years – and the generational differences became immediately obvious.

    We paired up into two teams, made up of young and old on each. I wouldn’t know a Harry Potter character from a Babylonian character. “What is a hogwart?” “Gaw Dad, do you live in a cave?”

    I was probably the most useless dope in the entire group. There was many a kid that had a good time at my expense tonight and my mother can come up with some of the damnedest, most difficult things to describe ever imagined.

    In the last game, we were asked to place six items in the “basket” – two each of person, place, or thing. As the rounds went by, the rules became significantly harder to allow for demonstration so I wasn’t even familiar with this “new form” of charades. Virtually useless – a real liability to the team.

    My oldest nephew drew last card He stuck out his tongue in the most profane manner, he rubbed his body up and down vulgarly, he twerked – though he was doing so poorly, I couldn’t honestly tell what the heck he was doing. I thought he was ‘mooning us.’ About 30 seconds went by without correct answer.

    My little mother, now 75 and prim and proper Sunday School teacher of 50 years, sat silently through the whole, sordid display, the rest of hooting incessantly. I was sitting next to mom on the couch watching her as much as I was the booty dancing, trying not to shake with laughter, snorting because I couldn’t keep it in.

    My mother calmly goes…

    ‘Miley Cyrus.’ They won. I blurted out without thinking, “How in the hell did you know that?”

    “The women were talking about it at water aerobics, so I looked up Music Awards out on Google and watched it.” 😛

    Since my father’s death, I think my mother has cut loose. We’ve created a silver haired, internet monster.

  352. “Sound like it would make me embarrassingly defecate in my pants.”

    Lol.

    With the exception of Pfucker, I don’t think I have anyone here figured out.

  353. I agree, Rutherford. The liberal press and others are encouraging black paranoia. Garner would probably have been all right because the patrol cars have cameras. Maybe he would have gotten a ticket. As you wrote we’ll never know. Committing crimes carries risks.

    I was angry and depressed when a job counselor told me to hide my veteran status and that academia would soon crowd out non- politically correct people. I had the wrong gender and the wrong skin color.

    It was the best thing which could have happened to me. I had freedom and autonomy. Farming was often hard drudgery with some physical and economic danger. But we built something, and our children worked beside us. It rarely seemed like a job, even if we were combining on Thanksgiving or celebrating Mothers’ day by cleaning spoiled grain from a bin.

    Now that we no longer farm, we enjoy spring and fall. I don’t have aches and pains aside from those aquired when I was younger, and I don’t have a case full of medicine to take. My wife does pretty well too. We will still be helping care for our grand daughter for a time, yet. I worry about her, though she is still progressing. I saw the difference after not seeing her for a week. Aside from the worry, life is good and days are full.

  354. We are almost ready to leave for home. I am waiting for when I am supposed to file my weather report. I just found 11 Facts about Eric Garner Case the Media Won’t Tell You,” Newsmax.

    Garner had a history of more than 30 arrests dating back to 1980 on charges ranging from assault and grand larceny. At the time of his death, he was out on bail for illegally selling cigarettes, driving without a license, marijuana possession and false impersonation. Garner died in an ambulance when his heart stopped beating, not at the scene of the confrontation.

    Nine of the 23 member grand jury were non-white. To vote for a charge, they would have had to decide the officer knew he might cause Garner’s injury or death. Over a thousand complaints were filed about the choke hold which was allegedly used, even though it is against regulations but is legal.

    The man who took the video was indicted on weapons charges less than a month later.

    I didn’t know much of this until now. I think I figured it out pretty well. “How do you like me now?”

  355. James – The heart will beat for some minutes after respiration has stopped and irreversible brain damage has occurred. When did he “die?” He died about four minutes after he stopped breathing, because at that point nothing could bring him back. He didn’t die in the ambulance, when his heart finally stopped.

    No question that the man’s corpulence contributed to his demise. I believe the real issue, though, is whether the police used excessive force (Clearly, they did.), and did this one officer in particular step far beyond what was necessary in violation of policy (Clearly, he did, also.).

    Did this cop intend to kill the man? No. But did he? Yes, and inappropriately. That requires a response – at least some SERIOUS disciplinary action, even if not criminal indictment.

    Sometimes folks with Rutherford’s mindset are way off-base, IMHO, but the video is irrefutable, and the whole world watched afterward to see what happened. And nothing happened. That’s what does – and should – piss people off.


    Poolman – re: sobriquets. Points well-taken. I didn’t know about Tom Magliozzi; he, at least, deserves some respect. “Slick-crack” is SOOOOOOOO hard to resist, though, and so appropriate. Let me think about it.

  356. ‘Miley Cyrus.’ They won. I blurted out without thinking, “How in the hell did you know that?”

    OMG Tex, that has to be the funniest story I have ever heard. I do know what a “hogwart” is but I would be useless in charades.

  357. Tigre, You never cease to amaze me. I had to look up Bourdain ( added that to my list of trivia) and would agree that would be my choice of travel style.
    You need to be more explicit and describe what type of “sport jump” you are referring to and I don’t think you mean trampolines.

    The one thing I’ve learned in my 70+ years is life is short so enjoy it!!!

  358. Did he resist arrest? Yes.

    Was he breaking the law? Yes.

    If Gardner was standing in front of your business would you want him gone? Yes.

    Everything after that seems like a reasonable screw up. The guy was huge. How many times out of 100 will the takedown go perfectly on a guy like that?

    The ambulance guys lost their jobs over this. It seems like gross negligence on their part to do nothing for him.

  359. Raji by sport jumping I meant skydiving, sometimes competitively mostly just fucking around. It’s a generic term for non military jumping.

  360. Garner was a tragedy.

    If it is really necessary to distinguish what killed Garner, the man holding his neck had little to do with the Big Man’s asphyxiation. Clearly the airways were not blocked. Garner’s chest was compressed. Due to the physiology of the lungs being considered a “negative pressure” event from the bellow functionality of the diaphragm, it likely the compression on his back forced exhalation and allowing Garner to speak for a short time, but the compression compromised inhalation.

    Add to the fact Garner was morbidly obese and the heart functionality already compromised, a terrible set of circumstances occurred. A fit person would most likely not be dead. I don’t need to be a forensic expert to determine what caused death. Therefore, the real culprit of the death was not the cop holding Garner’s neck – it was the cop sitting with his knee in Garner’s back, compressing the diaphragm and chest.

    If these sanctimonious Whiskey types require their pound of flesh, fire the cops for incompetence – including the female black supervisor. That in no way makes the cops murderers. The only thing I fault the cops for is that they were far too slow in getting the man to a sitting position. That wasn’t hate – it was incompetence. Garner resisted arrest – therefore, the cops were left with no choice but to act.

    Garner did not deserve to die. I sympathize with his family and the cops involved.

    So? How does that in anyway justify two police being murdered? How does that justify the public harassment, stores looted, rocks thrown, a mayor implying NYC cops racist, threats of civil unrest, two cops assaulted? It doesn’t.

    This whole charade in NY, LA, Oakland, and Ferguson is a bunch of black racists stoked by their hatred and need for self-aggrandizement, feeding a bunch of profoundly stupid animals who America would frankly be better off without.

    In Ferguson, there was no excuse. Michael Brown was a thug who deserved to be shot dead. The only victims in Ferguson are Darren Wilson, the prosecutor and D.A.’s office, the city of Ferguson’s innocent citizens being threatened and harassed, and especially the store owners who were looted.

    They should have shot the looters on site – not with rubber bullets; with metal bullets. And a lot of it. The governor of that state was grossly incompetent and should immediately be removed from office and possible imprisoned for negligence.

  361. Tigre, my oldest daughter took one of those “sport jumps” without her daddy’s knowledge when she was a freshman in college. 😯 She said she had a “blast.”

    I was really glad to not know – but I sure would like to do that one time myself, just to feel the exhilaration and the thrill. I should have done it before my knees went kaput.

  362. It was funny, Raji. You and Muffy would have laughed yourself sick like my wife did. I always thought things like charades were for dull people. But I have to admit, last night was the most fun I’ve had in a while. And I haven’t laughed that continuously hard for a long, long time.

    I never knew my wife could cheat so well. No telling what else I don’t know. 🙂

  363. Knees are important. Lord knows I had many hard landings. A tandem jump where you’re strapped to an instructor might be up your ally. Never done it but I’ve jumped alongside a few times. Passengers usually have a blast. If there’s a t least a light breeze you won’t have to fear your knees blowing out.

    I recall very little of my first jump other than letting go of the wing strut and then hanging under an open canopy. I have a tunnel vision memory of just falling away from the plan. Once I had enough jumps to trust the equipment and pack my own chute I really began to enjoy the experience rather than just trying to conquer it.

    A couple of BASE jumps but frankly those are too risky. Not again. A couple of scares (first malfunction was at night — aye Chihuahua), but never embarrassingly defecated.

  364. That is so cool, Tigre. I always wanted to try skydiving but never got further than that. It looks like something I could easily get hooked on given the opportunity.

    When I was a kid I thought I could fly because I had so many dreams of flying. It was always there in the back of mind as a kind of secretive talent that only I knew about. Of course there was always something that seemed to hinder that ability while I was awake. I did jump off roofs and out of trees without harm or fear. I was much more limber then. I can still climb fences and jump off of them, but I am much more careful to land correctly.

  365. Put it on your bucket list, Poolman. Without the ground rush (at about 4k-5k feet), it feels like flying. Sort of like lying on a giant bowl of Jello with the ground as your only relative point of reference.


    Incidentally Rutherford, what caused you to ask the question? I assume some unflattering observation but enquiring minds want to know.

    I would add a third item. Restoring muscle cars would be a great way to spend time in retirement too.

  366. Restoring muscle cars would be a great way to spend time in retirement too.

    Since I guess I am self-imposed retirement, or mindless bum, or “Slacker” as Pfestus likes to refer to it, and I truly doubt now that all this time has passed somebody would hire me anyway and that part of life over with, let me tell you there is real truth in the restoration of things in great personal satisfaction.

    I have no muscle car. But I do have this old SUV. And even that has given me a measure of pleasure to “make it work” and keep it running. You wouldn’t want anything more hauling these adopted mutts of mine around. We look like the end-of-the-road hillbillies with these hounds heads hanging out the window, slobbering all over the side of the truck sitting in the seats like passengers, and me in grungy old sweats taking them to the park. And so much of the repair is pretty simple with some basic tools and a little common sense. It’s not very expensive either picking up after market parts. I just teach myself as I go along. I think the confidence to do as much stems from the fact there’s a car in garage that still smells new if I screw it up. Tell you what else it has done. There’s people out there having to keep their truck running like I am just to get by. I’m reminded “Before the Grace of God, Go I.”

    But I have found restoring old wood and making it pretty for the sake of making it pretty is a little simpler and just as fun – and not nearly as dirty. New wood is even better – if you can find it. I got a great degree of satisfaction putting those “real” wood floors in. And the second one turned out better than the wood floors I had paid for.

    I made a mantle a couple of years ago – nothing terribly fancy but nicer than what was up there originally – never used a router much and that was a little bit of a challenge. Had to actually go to a real saw mill which I had never done before to buy the piece of kiln dried lumber that was thick enough. Still had some of the oak bark on it. And doing that work made me feel “manly.” I guess it was the bark. 😆 Building a few cedar closets was easy, fairly cheap. The shutters were fun and look pretty, even if my wife didn’t notice them at first.

    However, for the first time in my life, I am really slowing down. I can feel myself getting weaker and I have resigned myself to all I can do is fight it – it will win. My 85lbs chubby mutt was a breeze to throw into the truck even a year ago. All the sudden, he’s feeling like lead. Thank God, the other hound that also adopted me big enough he walks into the truck. It’s disconcerting to say the least that you suddenly feel very mortal.

  367. Hope you all had a nice Christmas. I did. I’m still in afterglow. And my PJs.

    Tex, we played charades and the new version of “guess who I am” too. I had thought at first that it had the potential of going south really fast because we also included family members as subjects for mimicry, but it was hysterical.

    Someone also brought this handheld trivial pursuit game with the added element of time – sort of like a combination of trivial pursuit and Pyramid. And there were so many questions that had to do with Harry Potter it was ridiculous. But it made the teens and college sons and daughters highly prized as teammates. Lots of fun.

    But yeah, each year it gets harder to pick up the little ones. Like lifting an anvil.

    A peaceful oasis away from the news of the world for a time.

  368. “Just when I think I have Tiger figured out he always throws a curve ball.”

    Hah. I remember one time you called him a stealthy bastard.

    Tigre’s a real find. Figures he’d be drawn to Anthony Bourdain type travel. Bourdain himself has really grown on me recently. I caught an episode of “Parts Unknown” in Massachusets and it was one of the more interesting things I’d seen on television in a long time. I mean sort of riveting in an “everyday” sense.

  369. LOL @ Pfestivus. Just look at the old fossil flashing his snaggletooth grin and cussing for attention. Begging for someone to play with him. Story of his life.

    What set Pfestivus off I wonder? Too much religion? Too much peace? Too much holiday cheer? Too much family? Too many friends? Too much fun? Too many gifts? Too much joy? Too much sex? Too much holiday ham? Too much laughter? Too much love?

    Or too much booze? Too many regrets? Too many grudges? Too much rejection? Too many broken people and teeth all around you? Too much erectile disfunction? Too many innappropriate passes at the wives and daughters of friends and relatives?

    Too little purpose? Too few answers? Too little time left to make any of it right?

  370. Parker, the video I saw showed mild violence and certainly nothing life threatening.Anyone thinking that video was violence has led a sheltered life.. If the head lock had killed Garner we would have seen it on the video. If his heart stopped beating in the ambulance his sick body likely gave out from the extra stress which pushed it over the edge.i wrote that at the beginning.

    I also wrote that no one gave him help at first when he said he couldn’t breathe., and I wrote that negligence killed Garder Newer revelations such as one I posted confirm my first guesses. If the medics were fired over this as rabbit wrote, logic tells us Gardiner was still alive between the trip to the hospital and the video we saw. If he was already dead in the ambulance there would have been no reason to fire them for failure to revive a dead man.

    The hospital called me one day because I had my father’s medical power of attourney. My father had “died” with no heart beat or breathing. They weren’t exactly sure how long it had been,. They and my wife said to let him go, but my father had told me he wanted to be revived. I called my brother at work in Omaha and had to wait awhile for him to reach the phone. He told me to do what I thought was best.The doctors told me my father would be a vegitable if he indeed survived the revival attempt. I voted to revive anyway.

    The ambulance sped to Sioux City and arrived after it crashed into the median after a tire blew out. I was in the room when my father woke up. We locked eyes, and I knew he was still here. My father’s mind was fine. I think there are individual differences with mostly averages to guide us.

    rabbit summed it up well. No one has been able to prove my guesses wrong, and I have found supportive information.

    I am less sure about our granddaughter and her head. I was gone except for three hours in the last 8 to 10 days and noticed a difference in her. She is maturing and doing well. But not even the Mayo Clinic could give me hints of her prognosis over the phone. Nothing seems to fit. Maybe she just has a small head.

    Our grand daughter is another sign that humans are variable, and that includes Garner’s demise. Someone else might have survived the same treatment.

    My wife and I climbed Ben Nevis and I went up Medicine Bow Peak which as high as I want to go. I once looked up onto a tornado funnel, I respect anyone wiling to jump out of an airplane but count me out.

  371. Tigre, I thought that was what you meant. I just had never heard skydiving as sport jumping. I “jumped” once at an air show that had a platform set up with a wire. I had no intention of jumping as I was taking one of my children but once up on the platform they informed me the only way down was to jump. I had so much FUN !!!!!!! The guys at the bottom decided I was having so much fun they shot me back up the wire so I could go again and I got a card stating I was a junior jumper. YEAH !
    I get why someone wants to skydive although I probably would want to be connected to someone
    Now I’ve got to go look up “muscle car” 😉

  372. All righty,! Now I know what are the 7 best American muscle cars of all time. I have done some restoring with a friend on antique bi-planes and motorcycles which I really enjoyed. I apparently have a real knack for tying knots in fabric but I imagine today my fingers don’t have the needed flexibility.
    My body doesn’t have the flexibility for a lot of things on my bucket list (shut up Tex :lol:)

  373. With the exception of Pfucker, I don’t think I have anyone here figured out.

    It’s easy around here to make everyone cartoons but we are all very real people with interesting histories. We don’t even have Parker figured out.

    If I remember correctly Tigre was once a driver for The Cars. Now THAT’S interesting.

  374. It has always been on my bucket list. There are other things crossed off as done or forget about it – priorities change in a life time. The list is in my mind and therefore less than indelible. 😆

  375. My body doesn’t have the flexibility for a lot of things on my bucket list (shut up Tex)

    😈 That’s okay, dirty old man that I am. Between your hips and my knees, couple of old stiffs sitting around dreaming about glory days. Man, I was feeling awful this morning. Fortunately my wife bailed me out and walked the rambunctious big boy and I took Mr. Chubb – about as easy going a dog as there’s ever been. He moves at my pace. Aleve seemed to help.

  376. Incidentally Rutherford, what caused you to ask the question? I assume some unflattering observation but enquiring minds want to know.

    LOL You DO know me too well. I consider your lawyerlyness to probably be your worst trait but I was imagining you might be quite fun in other aspects of your life. 🙂

    The Cars story always stuck with me.

    Since I was asking you, I thought it would be interesting to hear from others — many of us are not as invested in the present as Huck. Many of us are working toward a day when we can do what we REALLY want to do.

  377. Someone also brought this handheld trivial pursuit game with the added element of time – sort of like a combination of trivial pursuit and Pyramid.

    Sounds a lot like the iPhone game Heads Up. My daughter and I played that while visiting my wife in the hospital. Hard to find categories where the 10 year old and I had the same frame of reference.

  378. I am so done discussing Garner. The video tells you everything you need to know. A man who was presenting no physical threat nor any attempt to flee was grabbed by the neck FROM BEHIND and forced to the ground where he was restrained for a prolonged period while he was making no attempt to break free.

    Tex has the right idea. The whole lot of them should be fired.

    I’m done.

  379. I’m tired of it too. I successfully demonstrated how the video showed why you are wrong. The man grabbed Garner from behind to restrain him efficiently after Garner began to ;push back. The dog pile was unnecessary,. One man could have held Garner with the headlock while others hand cuffed him.

  380. It’s a shame that the deaths of over 500 vets in the VA scandal didn’t get as much media attention as the death of Michael Brown got.

    Why are there no protests for those men?

  381. “Tigre what about him appeals to you more, the travel or the food?”

    I consider the food part of the experience, so I can’t say. They’re intertwined. If I had to pick, it’d be the travel. But I like people that like good food. Being chaperoned/guided by foodies is what makes Bourdain’s travels interesting.

    I’m surprised you remembered The Cars. Man, Easton was a cheapskate.


    “I consider your lawyerlyness to probably be your worst trait but I was imagining you might be quite fun in other aspects of your life.”

    I think you have me wrong here too. I value wit and consider it a priority to have fun lawyering. Humor comes before all else. Really. I work with some funny bastards on serious matters. I wouldn’t have it any other way.

    Obviously I anticipated your response. Did you anticipate the irony of my finding your worst trait being an inability to accurately size up people and their positions?

  382. I think everyone is done with Garner but for different reasons. I am like James in that the other sides abject ignorance to the facts just flops me.
    “Pig piles” or whatever you want to call it is borne from precedent setting/policy setting cases that dictates more actually = less force. This is seen in Garners initial takedown. One cop exerts x amount of force to take the big guy down. Two or more cops would’ve exerted a concerted z level of force.The only leg Rutherford & Co. have is that somehow public order should not be maintained and he tosses out a third person zero experience position of how the cop should not have initiated a police action. RUTHERFORD holds the criminal in higher regards than the public.
    Bottomline COMPLY and sue later if you think you’ve been wronged.

    It’ll be interesting how much folks jump onto the case in California where a female officer shot a guy who grabbed at her baton. She initiated non lethal action but in no small part because she is female had to escalate to shooting him.
    The thought that Garner didn’t deserve to die implies the result was the intent. So onto the trash heap with that too.
    I don’t want or support police brutality. I also don’t support hyper pro cop rhetoric and thinking that they can do no wrong. That said I expect laws to be enforced and public order & peace to be maintained for the good of all.

  383. Neil deGrasse has demonstrated himself such a poor physicist and buffoon, I’m not sure why people would give him much attention. He’s been a known Christian bigot for years – at best an agnostic. Try to think of Pfesser with a TV audience.

    However, I think you missed the most important of what makes humor most effective, Raji – timing.

    One day during the entire year, we Americans dedicate a federal holiday called Christmas. It is without debate, the most celebrated holiday in all of human history. Even pagans like Rutherford and Pfestus celebrate it. It is celebrated in China and Russia – two largely atheistic countries. In two world wars, Christmas Day was deemed a cease fire and on the battlefield even inspired soldiers of the opposing sides to trade gifts and for one brief moment – peace on earth.

    Let’s say half of Christians actually take the date for what it is. A day deemed the birth of The Christ. DeGrasse is obviously mocking the significance of the date and the significance of the man – not just any man. That means deGrasse insulted over one billion people on one of the two most Holy Days of the year for over 1 billion people of the Christian faith. Would he do that to Muslims during Ramadan? Would he do that to Jews on Yom Kippur? Would he insult the entire nation of China on a national day of significance? He never has shown an inkling to do any of that to the best of my knowledge. So why would DeGrasse choose only Christians and then on Christmas Day?

    Now to me, DeGrasse is on par with Bill Maher – a man to be mostly ignored. In fact, he’s so boorish and uninformed, apparently DeGrasse doesn’t know Sir Isaac Newton not only a famous physicist, but only penned many other famous writings – on Christian theology. Newton has been called “the greatest scientific genius the world has known.” Yet Newton dedicated less of his life to science than he did Christian theology and Christian writings.

    But let’s take a different example.

    I could write a book on my father’s screw ups – especially with mechanics. So much so, to lighten the funeral, I told a few of the lighter ones as his funeral to lessen the dread – and the crowd roared. Because I ended up using those stories to compliment my father the only way I could in conclusion. Many people told my mother and I, for the first time they had walked out of a funeral and felt positive and not empty. It was the way my mother wanted it.

    But what if I were to take the same types of stories and use them as loose ridicule to mock my father to his widow on the date of their anniversary.

    Would it still be funny?

  384. Raji Tyson has a clearly stated agenda against religion with a focus on Christianity. He deserves zero consideration except perhaps complete disdain for all he is.
    He claims the mantle of science but his sole contribution is to demean people as opposed to furthering actual science. He is sciences equivalent to any number of historians and journalists who offer nothing of substance.

  385. The dead veterans likely drew no big protests because they didn’t have faces as the recent dead black men did. Liberals weren’t as a group especially upset because since the veterans didn’t help their agenda they didn’t feel the need to create outrage. Of course, Huck already knows that.

    I thought this was funny. Blogger and commentator Eric Ericson said he was raised in the Middle East for part of his life, and he had some cultural blind spots here. He was a newly minted lawyer obligated to help some poor people as community service.

    One of his first clients was caught with drugs in his car. The packages also had his fingerprints. During their discussion, his client repeatedly said that yes the drugs were in his car, but “The Man” had planted them. “Who is the man?” You are and they are.” Ericson thought his client was crazy and asked the judge in a meeting for an evaluation.

    Why did he think the man was crazy? Because he blamed “The Man” for planting the drugs and he wouldn’t identify them except to say Ericson was implicated. The judge was amused. She asked if the client thought “The Man” including Ericson was part of the white power structure. The man nodded. Ericson started his education as a young lawyer.

  386. Thanks alfie.

    If Neil DeGrass wants to debunk Christianity, here is my shot at Santa. The Fins say Santa lives in a theme park in their Lapp capital of the far north. Many real people and legends created Santa, but his association with the North and reindeer is a major part of the story. Why?

    Consider this. The Sami, and Siberians share a culture and religion dating back thousands of years. Shamen eat magic red and white mushrooms as they joik (chant) for up to six to eight hours. After such a long time, some develop the equivalent of epileptic seizures. They also see visions, including one of reindeer circling their lodges. and sometimes going down their chimneys. The spirits and dead loved ones sometimes communicate through fire.

    In Siberia some holy men dress in red and white during the winter solsace and give away dried mushrooms as gifts. They also know that some ever greens and the mushrooms have a mutually beneficial relationship and the reindeer seek out the rush rooms growing on the tree trunks.

    Maybe Germans and others considered evergreens sacred because of the mushrooms. Donner is German for Thor who sometimes flew through the air in a cart pulled by two goats.

    I don’t know if the story could even be partly true, but that the possibility Santa and his flying reindeer might be the result of a drug high amuses me.

    It snowed two inches last night. Now, I can ski again.

  387. Thanks Tex , Alfie and James for your replies. Until this morning I did not know who DeGrasse was and after reading a bio on Wiki could not understand why he was all over Facebook as a humorist! That’s why I threw that post out there.
    Any more comments?

    “Try to think of Pfesser with a TV audience.”
    😆 😆

  388. DeGrasse is mostly charlatan, Raji – though some of the shows are pretty interesting if you find the cosmos infinitely beautiful like I do. I don’t even mind DeGrasse as a Christian bigot – I just wish he would share in mockery. In that way, I give guys like Pfestus a whole lot more credit than I do DeGrasse. At least they’re not cowards.

    Guess that should have been mother and me up above. 😳

  389. Rutherford I just finished Please Stop helping Us. I have to say for me it started strong and then dipped a tad towards the end. I liked the factoid filled nature of it and the research backing it has but was by the end rather bored and left feeling it was anti-climatic somehow.
    The hard truths dished out left me waiting for Riley to strike out at answers but he didn’t do it imo. The hard truths are no secret and it was refreshing to hear a person of color opinions upon them but I really was left with an “oh well” moment.
    I intentionally went into reading the book blind. Afterwards I unleashed the research hounds and discovered his WSJ ties and his white conservative wife. Not to sound like one of the vile race hustlers but there is a line of credibility between blacks like Riley speaking on this subject and others.
    Given the abyss between the MSNBC Toure,Coates etc. type and Riley,Steele et al I fear an honest and credible presentation is never to come to fruition. One end of the spectrum enables the victim class the other swing to the tune of that mix between “telling whitey what he wants to hear” and getting paid stating the obvious but doing little or nothing to fix it.

  390. Tyson has been exposed over the last couple months as ridiculing others to an audience he knows is—less educated—for the sole purpose of making himself look even more intelligent to that audience. And when he gets called on it, he acts like a little bitch.

    He quotes people who never said what he says they said, he removes context from quotes, and he connects quotes to false timelines. He does this to make those people look foolish, which in turn, makes him and his audience appear to be smarter.

    The worst part is, he doesn’t need these gimmicks. He’s obviously very intelligent. But he likes to be an asshole about it because he can make more money when he shares his snark with like-minded assholes who need him to make themselves feel smarter.

    I’ve lost a great deal of respect for him.

  391. The Cars were my very first “favorite group” after getting my first turntable and a copy of Candy-O to go with it as a Christmas present oh so long ago.

    I still have that record.


    Food is a part of every travel experience.

    We all have to eat. But what we eat and how we eat it can vary so much.

    I live in Southern California. I went up to Northern California for work a few months back and noticed food differences even between those 2 regions. The most striking as “fry sauce”. Down here we just use ketchup.

  392. I dunno why, but I thought Huck lived in Michigan not Southern California.

    Never heard of “fry sauce.” Not a big fan of fries though. Cheap filler. I did have to chow down on some in Brussels and Amsterdam. Street vendors and store fronts everywhere selling fries, all with dozens of sauces.

    One of my best buds sells fries by the millions of pounds. He eats them nearly every day and still enjoys them. Go figure.

    Tyson did turn into a big dick with his new found fame. I think he’s slowly becoming a pathetic caricature of himself. Huck, you sized him and his audience up pretty well.

  393. Obviously I anticipated your response. Did you anticipate the irony of my finding your worst trait being an inability to accurately size up people and their positions?

    Dunno why I found that funny but I did.

  394. The thought that Garner didn’t deserve to die implies the result was the intent. So onto the trash heap with that too.

    Alfie that is patently ridiculous. We have crimes like involuntary manslaughter to cover killing without intent. I NEVER said the cops wanted this to happen.

    So what’s next? Guy in wheelchair fat lips a cop during an arrest and the cop gets to topple his wheelchair and pin the guy to the ground?

    I find it amusing that virtually everyone was disgusted by the Garner video but with time, some folks conservative ideology has crept in to retroactively justify what happened.

    My understanding of broken windows policing is that cracking down on petty crimes reduces more serious crimes. But the crackdown should still be proportional to the crime.

  395. While I get your point Tex, Tyson is not a physicist. He is an astrophysicist and you are in ZERO position to judge his bona fides in that area.

    I’m pretty sure I’ve seen Tyson say that religion and science can co-exist so he’s no Richard Dawkins or Bill Maher.

    Yes. Timing matters and Tyson exercised poor judgment.

  396. I don’t recall being horrified by the video.The wheelchair comparison is well out of line since that describes pure police brutality.
    Garner chose not to comply with lawful orders. Out numbered and deciding to act the officer implemented a fairly routine take down. Those are feeling-less facts Rutherford.
    The thinking that the cop should’ve been more patient and waited for backup is something I’ve said all along but that doesn’t make what he did do wrong for reasons you haven’t the foggiest of notions of.

  397. Actually broken windows dictates a consistent high energy response. It’s part and parcel to universal treatment of disorder. Making up feelings and degrees of criminality is for lawyers and judges.

  398. I think some of you have had too much egg nog. Tyson bears no grudge against religion or Christianity in particular as a spiritual and moral guide. It is when he hears claims of the bible portraying scientific fact that his bowels become undone – and rightfully so.

    Anyone who believes the literal account of the Ark needs to get their head examined. As allegory it is fine. As science it is preposterous. That’s all Tyson is saying and yes he is VERY upset about movements afoot in some school districts to replace science with fantasy. I don’t blame him one bit and any sane person on this board should agree.

    With that said, Christmas Day is not the day to fight that battle unless you want to piss some folks off. Maybe Neil has the holiday Blues?

  399. The Cars were a fav band of mine back in the day. I bought all their vinyls and have their greatest hits on CD. Hell I even have their latest sans the late Benjamin Orr and its a pretty good disc. Funny thing is it’s the only album I’ve loaded to my i3’s hard drive so far. So I listen to the Cars in my car.

    Their lyrics are to die for. Look up the lyrics to “Cruiser” sometime. How can one resist “set aside the screaming fish”.

  400. Speaking of law and order, watched Hitchcock’s “The Wrong Man” yesterday. While I found the ending of the film anti-climactic, Fonda does a great job of a wrongly accused man trying to keep his cool.

    This one based on a true story. Hitch does better when he and his writers make shit up.

  401. “Tyson is not a physicist. He is an astrophysicist and you are in ZERO position to judge his bona fides in that area.”

    Tex attacked his bona fides? Seems Tex did the opposite to me. In any event, so what?

    ‘ It is when he hears claims of the bible portraying scientific fact that his bowels become undone – and rightfully so.’

    Bullsheeet. He doesn’t react to “hearing claims of. . . blah,blah, blah. He throws rocks to the delight of trained seals.

    As I said, you have an inability to accurately size up people and their positions — so your reinvent them. Tyson yet another of thousands of examples.


    Rutherford’s favorite logical fallacy: Argument from Authority. “Stating that a claim is true because a person or group of perceived authority says it is true. Often this argument is implied by emphasizing the many years of experience, or the formal degrees held by the individual making a specific claim. It is reasonable to give more credence to the claims of those with the proper background, education, and credentials, or to be suspicious of the claims of someone making authoritative statements in an area for which they cannot demonstrate expertise. But the truth of a claim should ultimately rest on logic and evidence, not the authority of the person promoting it.”

  402. I cringed when I saw the Garner vid. I’m cringing more listening to R equating the Garner take down with the significance of his crime and a guy in a wheelchair.

    For the love of God. It was Garner’s resistance that lead to the escalation, not the sale of cigarettes.

    Incidentally, manslaughter still requires intent, just a different type of intent. I’ve set this out before so I won’t bother with it again. It exposes one of my worst traits.

  403. I’m glad you liked the story, Rutherford. I also like the Cars including their “You Might Think” video. When I hear them sing “who’s gonna drive your car?” it takes me back to when our teen aged children and I were driving home from Minneapolis.

    Our son and his wife live in Silicone Valley. Since yesterday, their furnace died, a computer gave them problems bad enough to send it to the shops, and the garage door opener quit working.

  404. Another thing, one, if fast and strong enough can with a head lock, take down a bigger man for at least forty minutes. That would have been plenty of time to cuff anyone without doing anything else which could hurt a prisoner.

    I’m not really debating. I am bragging.

  405. Neil deGrasse has demonstrated himself such a poor physicist and buffoon, I’m not sure why people would give him much attention.

    And

    DeGrasse is mostly charlatan, Raji

    So yes Tigre, Tex attacked Tyson’s bona fides.

    I love how you endorse the current “Age of Ignorance” where having an opinion (everyone does) is more valued than years of hard study and practice. Yes I DO believe when it comes to matters scientific, particularly about the cosmos, Tyson speaks from authority. I’ll sooner listen to him on these matters than the guy who delivers my groceries even if my delivery guy has “logic”.

    BTW I’ve made several common sense arguments over the years that you’ve shot down based on my lack of expertise.

  406. “BTW I’ve made several common sense arguments over the years that you’ve shot down based on my lack of expertise.”

    Do tell.

  407. Still struggling with whatever you point is about is credentials and “these matters.” And your comment about “whom you’ll listen to” makes the point.

    I can only assume you didn’t bother with Huck’s links and are generally unaware of much of what he’s said having not a fucking thing to do with his “bona fides.”

    Lay some of that common sense on sense, Daddy. Hit us with that rhythm stick of knowledge.

  408. Well for starters all my arguments about guns back in the day were met with statistical refutation. I considered my arguments logical but I did indeed lack the research to buttress my arguments. I fully admit I was proven wrong.

    Tyson’s knowledge of science is not based on emotion (as were my opinions on guns). It’s based on years of study and work in the field.

    To make this simple, I’d sooner listen to you and BiC on a legal matter than I would Poolman and I’d sooner listen to Poolman on the correct amount of chlorine in a pool than I would you. Expertise matters.

  409. “Well for starters all my arguments about guns back in the day were met with statistical refutation.”

    Then it’s not common sense. It’s an ignorant and incorrect opinion.

    “Expertise matters.”

    In areas of one’s expertise. He’s not talking about astrophysics.

  410. Although I haven’t gotten into it just yet, I’ll stick to the bourbon. Eggnog is like fruitcake to me. I don’t get it.

  411. One has to be careful not to cross from theologian to lunatic. A theologian who stands by the ark story as literal truth does not have expertise. He has delusions. And he has stepped into Tyson’s area of expertise – science.

    I’ll look at Huck’s links. If Tyson has been playing fast and loose with facts then shame on him.

    I won’t rule out the possibility that being the 21st century Carl Sagen may have gone to his head but as I’ve said at the outset I’ve never found him to be as strident as a Dawkins or O’Hare or Maher.

  412. No Tex, I disagree. Anyone who protests at a funeral is an asshole, those cops included

    That was no protest. Let us remember it was your favorite mayor who called Ramos a racist…

  413. I think some of you have had too much egg nog. Tyson bears no grudge against religion or Christianity in particular as a spiritual and moral guide. It is when he hears claims of the bible portraying scientific fact that his bowels become undone – and rightfully so.

    It’s when you attempt to be most arrogant and “intelligent”, Rutherford, that you become most pitiful. It’s like the claims of Republicans going way of the Whigs.

    Whom am I to believe?

    Rutherford Lawson and the hyphenated charlatan Degrasse, caught in dozens of lies. distortions and most obviously scientific factual not factual, lately?

    Or Jesus? Apparently, Tyson wasn’t the only one feeling the Grinch at Christmas. 🙂

    Did you like the astrophysicist’s idiocy of apparently knowing very little of Newton too?

  414. “A theologian who stands by the ark story as literal truth does not have expertise. He has delusions. And he has stepped into Tyson’s area of expertise – science.”

    You are damn testament to circular reasoning, you know that?

    And Tyson is not even a physicist. He’s an astrophysicist, Gumby. Remember?

  415. Carl Sagan, you mean? 🙂 Another media made frenzy based on nothing. Rutherford, you need to learn something about science. Here’s your first lesson.

    When somebody has a TV show and the claims are made he’s made that he’s an expert?

    You can virtually count on the fact they aren’t. Kind of like all these Sports journalists being experts.

  416. Ok I read Huck’s links. Seems to me Sean Davis and The Federalist have an obsession with Tyson.

    Be that as it may, perhaps Tyson should stick to science and stay out of politics and critique of journalism?

  417. R, just a heads up. Your opinions of Tyson are as informed as your opinions of guns. Maybe you need to see what he’s saying before applying your brand of common sense infallibility to it.

  418. Your opinions of Tyson are as informed as your opinions of guns.

    But but but Neil DeGrasse-Tyson is on NOVA and Bill Moyer! That must make him an expert!!!! And his watchers EXPERTS TOO!

  419. “Yes. Timing matters and Tyson exercised poor judgment.”

    No he didn’t. He has a bone to pick with Chrisanity and wanted to be heard loud and clear. He knew it would be extra salty. So, it was perfect.

    Poor judgment? As in he picked the wrong day and that day happened to be coincidentally Christmas? Lol.

  420. True enough. I think all would hit that shit, R.

    Bourbon time has arrived on the West Coast. Maybe I’ll regale you with some Pfuckhead-like irascible drunk comments later, starting with something to address that that God awful Apple Spice video, James. 😆

    See you on the other side. . .

  421. “A theologian who stands by the ark story as literal truth does not have expertise. He has delusions. And he has stepped into Tyson’s area of expertise – science”

    Wrong.

    The ark story is more about history than it is about science. And Tyson is no historian.

    If it is about science, it would be about weather. And Tyson is no meteorologist.

    “Seems to me Sean Davis and The Federalist have an obsession with Tyson.”

    The “obsession” came about because Tyson refused for weeks to acknowledge their very accurate claims about him. They deal in the realm of social and political commentary–and Tyson chose to insert himself into their world. They didn’t breach his.

    Sometimes when you talk shit, you get your mouth dirty. Tyson was talking shit.

    “Be that as it may, perhaps Tyson should stick to science and stay out of politics and critique of journalism?”

    You can’t generate memes if you do that. You can either study the stars or become one—you can’t do both. It seems Tyson would rather be a celebrity than a scientist. When it comes to science, he is resting on his laurels. I’d be willing to bet he doesn’t have another original thought that comes out of his head for the rest of his days.

  422. You can either study the stars or become one—you can’t do both.

    Thats an interesting statement. I’m not sure I agree but I do see how celebrity can make you a less serious scientist.

    I enjoy Tyson tremendously but perhaps he is overexposed at this point.

  423. I just read these “bona fides” of the “genius” Neil deGrasse Tyson. What especially is so spectacular about him, Rutherford – that is besides he is a frequent guest on Colbert, Moyers, and Bill Mahers and he swings your way politically and lacks religion? See a pattern?

    There’s got to be a hundred thousand people that could call themselves ‘astrophysicist” – by the way, not nearly as impressive in my book as being called nuclear or electromechanical physicist.

    I absolutely love cosmology – but it was my experience in three physics classes, including one that spent four weeks on astronomical events (almost completely speculative as there is no way to test), it is not only the most abstract, but perhaps some of the easier physics material to grasp. The particle physics portion is covered in virtually all aspects of physics. I realize four weeks of astronomy in formal education hardly makes me a specialist either, but it certainly gave me a flavor in conjunction with general physics – more so than you to judge scientific bona fides, I’ll bet.

    There is absolutely nothing I can find that would distinguish this Tyson bigot as any great scientist.

  424. “I enjoy Tyson tremendously…”

    And there’s nothing wrong with that. As long as you’re realistic about what he is and is not.

    Personally, I think he was doing good things in getting people interested in science. But like you said, he is getting TOO big. It’s being more about him and less about science. And I fault him because I think that trade off is intentional. He likes the attention and the money.

    Newton would not be impressed…..

  425. I absolutely love cosmology – but it was my experience in three physics classes, including one that spent four weeks on astronomical events (almost completely speculative as there is no way to test), it is not only the most abstract, but perhaps some of the easier physics material to grasp.

    That’s the only part you lost me on. Abstract and easy usually don’t go together.

    I think Tyson serves a purpose similar to his hero Sagan which is to make science easier for average folks to understand. I haven’t read “History of Time” but I suspect that is not Stephen Hawking’s top priority.

    Perhaps in Huck’s theory, Hawking studies the stars while Tyson wants to be one.

  426. Rutherford – On the cosmology/science front, there is a good article on Salon exploring some of the bases of religiosity:

    http://www.salon.com/2014/12/21/religions_smart_people_problem_the_shaky_intellectual_foundations_of_absolute_faith/

    A couple of things I’d like to hear your thoughts on: (1) their assertion that religiosity is highly correlated with a lack of a social safety net, which I know is an ongoing concern of yours vis à vis US, and (2) the idea that, while education commonly converts believers to non-believers, it never happens the other way.

    Thoughts?

  427. Huck: “You can either study the stars or become one—you can’t do both.”

    I think Carl Sagan (a.k.a. “The Cosmic Explainer”) shewed that not to always be true.

  428. Alfie – re: Jason Riley, and his “Wall Street” ties and white wife.

    So, if you have accomplished something in life, or marry the PC-inappropriate person, you suddenly don’t have any bona fides?

    How does any of that have anything to do with whether what he says is true?


    Slick-Crack: “astronomical events (almost completely speculative as there is no way to test)”

    R: he needs to take his “three physics classes” (LOL) again – and this time not stand behind the door when the basis of all science – the “scientific method” – is discussed. The inability to grab the heavenly bodies by the nuts and swing them around does not negate the validity of infinitely reproducible observations.


    Rutherford: a fan of Greek mythology, I have settled on “Slick-Crack” to describe the Clit / Slack chimera. If you prefer summat else, pls advise.

  429. Ha Ha El Tigre. I don’t like that version either, but the Beatles “You can Drive my Car” seemed too obvious for the Cars’ drive theme.

    I’ve heard of Tyson, but if he is on cable, I will never see his show because we don’t have cable.. From what you all write, he reminds me of Bill Nye the Science guy who uses his scientific knowledge to push an agenda.

    Did he really relegate the flood story to myth? Not only is it about history, but it is also about weather as Huck wrote.. What does he think of Moses’ parting of the Red Sea? It is another event which probably happened. Science supports the possibility.

    Two scientists have written a book about the flood, and ABC News is one of several sources. “Technology/Evidence suggests biblical great flood of noah’s time happened.” Global warming was rampant 12,000 years ago, and as the ice melted ocean levels rose. A farming civilization prospered around the Black Sea. Many parts of the world suffered losses from flooding, and they carried the stories down to later generations. But the Black Sea was the grand daddy of floods, maybe like the tsunamis of ten years ago.

    The Mediterranean Sea rose high enough for water to rush through a mountain pass. Possibly a 200 foot wall of water raced through the fertile farm land and entombed villages under water to this day. Traumatized survivors fled in all directions, and they took the flood story with them.

    The Babylonian book the Gilgamesh told the flood story long before the Old Testament was written.It may have recorded other coastal inundations with the more dramatic Black Sea flood. Robert Ballard, the under water archaeologist who found the Titanic believes villages destroyed by the flood remain at the bottom of the Black Sea. The lack of oxygen in the lower levels preserves things.

    Blue eyes are the result of a mutation north of the Black Sea. Maybe mass migrations helped spread the trait.

    One can be an expert but still miss- interpret his/her knowledge,.I watched Margarete Mead on television when I was a teenager. She said animals have no self-awareness or free will. They operate on instinct and stimulus-response. 5he know far more than I will ever know, but even at my young age, I thought “WHAT!!?”

  430. Drunk, you apparently know little about science, and certainly nothing about cosmology. Perhaps not as little as you know about marriage, joy or religion, but you make statements that while sounding good to the Rutherford types, read to me you’re just dumb as hell. How in the world did you ever get into med school? Must have been the Jamaica ride.

    Once again to attempt to be clever and cute, you’ve forgotten men like Copernicus and Newton were far more like me than they were like you and would have found you far more stupid than I do. You keep using your “scientific method” for cosmology, and the rest of who know something about the field called cosmology, even the atheists, will keep laughing at your fraudulence.

    Seems you must not know what the scientific method is – common vernacular for Leftist bigots who never used it. 😈

    And anybody biased enough to use Salon for “religion” to make quotes is a major hypocrite – as Salon is as worthy to discuss “religion” as The Bible to be used for a science book in the classroom.

  431. Huck, ignore the Drunk – he’s a fraud as he apparently doesn’t understand a damn thing about scientific observation. Perhaps in his stupor, he’s still observing the “Big Bang” again and again.

    And Rutherford not a student of science, but he did stay at a Holiday Inn once. Rutherford is impressed with Chris Hayes and Rachel Maddow’s science.

    I understand exactly what you’re talking about.

  432. DR -“Poor judgment? As in he picked the wrong day and that day happened to be coincidentally Christmas?”
    Tex – “When somebody has a TV show and the claims are made he’s made that he’s an expert?”

    Huck – “He likes the attention and the money.”

    I think the three comments above are a fairly good summation of what Tyson has become regardless of who and what he is (or was) As I said, I started out not knowing who he was. My only impression of him from the comments I read on FaceBook was that the pros saw him as a humorist and never referred to his bonafides.

  433. Poolman, I just saw the Sami-flying reindeer video. I am probably the only one, but I love it. To think I share a few genes with them.

  434. Oh snap. On Face the Nation this morning Rudy said (approximately) “when Sharpton pays the 4 million dollars he owes the federal government, maybe then he can sit next to mayors and governors”.

    His advice to De Blasio and Obama: “lose Al Sharpton”. Damn.

  435. Re: the “humorist” – everyone wants to believe – does believe – that they have a good sense of humor. Statistically, of course, 50% of people have a below average sense of humor. What little I’ve heard from this wannabe Tyson, he and his audience of yukkers fall into that below average group.

  436. What little I’ve heard from this wannabe Tyson, he and his audience of yukkers fall into that below average group.

    Well, speaking as “Slick-Crack” now, that’s why Parker/Pfesser/Pfat Ass falls into #1 position of deGrasse-Tyson groupie.

    P3 is about as funny and clever as a hemorrhoid, in addition to pfrejudiced. And that’s when P3’s credit was in good standing at the bar. 🙂

    Now P3 is resigned to last guy wobbling before the bar closes demanding one more toddy, mindless lush, ogre and bore as everybody rushes out and leaves before he staggers to the parking lot.

    But I do hope P3 comes back to debate the scientific method of cosmology. 😆

  437. Since the Carl Sagan door was opened, let’s go ahead and walk through it with some quotes…

    “The idea that God is an oversized white male with a flowing beard who sits in the sky and tallies the fall of every sparrow is ludicrous. But if by God one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God. This God is emotionally unsatisfying … it does not make much sense to pray to the law of gravity.”

    “Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality. When we recognize our place in an immensity of light-years and in the passage of ages, when we grasp the intricacy, beauty, and subtlety of life, then that soaring feeling, that sense of elation and humility combined, is surely spiritual.”

    “The historical record makes clear that religious teaching, example, and leadership are powerfully able to influence personal conduct and commitment… Thus, there is a vital role for religion and science.”

    “An atheist is someone who is certain that God does not exist, someone who has compelling evidence against the existence of God. I know of no such compelling evidence. Because God can be relegated to remote times and places and to ultimate causes, we would have to know a great deal more about the universe than we do now to be sure that no such God exists. To be certain of the existence of God and to be certain of the nonexistence of God seem to me to be the confident extremes in a subject so riddled with doubt and uncertainty as to inspire very little confidence indeed.”

    When it came to some things, Sagan clearly had more questions than he did answers. He didn’t act like a trolling asshole about what others believe. He was agnostic. He placed himself among those who do not know and do not claim to know. I can respect that.

    I suspect Sagan would not have been loud about it, but would not approve of the current methods of Tyson.

  438. Seeing Tyson on Big Bang kind of reminds me of Dr. Joyce Brothers or some other pop culture guru. I’m sure he’d have appeared on an episode or two of Love Boat in the day raising his street cred on Rutherford’s list of unassailable bona fides.

  439. And Rutherford not a student of science, but he did stay at a Holiday Inn once.

    I must be in a really good mood this weekend cos some of you guys’ insults are cracking me up.

  440. “I suspect Sagan would not have been loud about it, but would not approve of the current methods of Tyson.”

    Huck, I suspect you’re right.

    P.S. To Tex in particular, what Sagan says about God is precisely why I DON’T call myself an atheist. Whether or not God exists depends greatly on how we define God.

  441. Seeing Tyson on Big Bang kind of reminds me of Dr. Joyce Brothers or some other pop culture guru. I’m sure he’d have appeared on an episode or two of Love Boat in the day raising his street cred on Rutherford’s list of unassailable bona fides.

    Exactly! ** GUFFAW ** TV guest stardom has become the scientific means of advanced achievement.

    Rutherford, if you like those NOVA shows, do me a favor. Listen to them very closely a couple of times. And you’ll find themselves repeating very elementary principles in a different flavor. Which is fine and even interesting. I enjoy them. But they are made for the very unscientific person. There’s nothing particularly profound about them and they are intended for mass consumption. That makes DeGrasse-Tyson’s mistakes even more egregious.

    I was thinking today how we as a society have placed so much confidence in science, yet our present day accomplishments pale in comparison to the discoveries made in previous generations three generations back and further – and they did much of it without the assistance of electricity, computing power and the like. We don’t know a whole lot more about the most basic element – the atom – than we did 70 years ago. Other than the semiconductor, I don’t think we are making nearly as large a strides in science as we like to think and that we are simply improving technology 75 years and more discovered. The human genome project is incredibly interesting – and perhaps that will lead to major breakthroughs one day. But right now, it’s almost more a matter of intellectual curiosity.

    If Stephen Hawkings is so magnificent, I dare anybody tell me what are his achievements that you take and do something constructive with – something predictably useful, say like Tesla’s electromagnetic principles? Or Edison? Or E=MC^2? Hawkings is a media fixture – hardly the geniuses that have held Sir Isaac Newton’s seat.

    We stand on the shoulders of giants.

  442. I wasn’t thinking of you, Rutherford. I was thinking of Tyson. I don’t know much about him. I was speculating that if he is one of many who believe the Bible is entirely myth,and that the flood and other miricles didn’t happen he is wrong.,

    .LIke you, I don’t believe in a literal ark or God’s promise that he would destroy the earth with fire next time,(He will) and that he left a rainbow as a sign of his promise I don’t know if that is correct since I heard it in a Sunday school lesson when I was little and thought “WHAT?”” as I did when Margaret Mead said animals had no free will.

    It is possible some people escaped by boat, and that might have supported the legend.

    I do believe God inspired neolithic people who were just learning to farm to write their actual and spiritual history. Underlying truth is in the Bible if you look for it.

  443. James, you’re brushing on matters of theology, which, as we now know from Rutherford, is subsumed by anyone that bears the label “scientist.”

    Hey, I’m feeling another bourbon evening coming on. I wonder if it tastes the same in Australia.

    Pfesser, when you’re binging on brown liquor during the week and angrily wagging your finger at everyone that finds you a boor, do you notice any difference based on the hemispheres when set to typing your comments? That piece of shit Salon article was doozy for a real “scientist” like yourself. I didn’t realize starting from the conclusion was in accord with the scientific method, but maybe things are just are upside down when they cross the equator, eh?


    James, how did you come across that Apple Spice video and the one about Finnish stereotypes? Just what the hell is going on here? 😆