When a Flip-Flop is Simply a Lie

Mitt Romney, assumed presidential candidate of the Republican party, is well-known for his flip-flops. In the past two decades or so Mitt has been on both sides of issues ranging from a woman’s reproductive rights to his support of Ronald Reagan to global warming. If we are in a charitable mood we can say Mitt simply changed his mind as his political views “matured”. Mitt’s latest flip-flop doesn’t leave much room for charity.

When running against the uber-rich Ted Kennedy in 1994, Romney called the notion of a blind trust “a ruse” that fools people into thinking the beneficiary has no control over his own investments. Now, in 2012 Romney uses that same blind trust to claim he has no control over where his money is invested.

Mitt’s a smart man, particularly when it comes to finances. The Mitt of 1994 was telling the truth. The Mitt of 2012 is lying, plain and simple. An objective observer would have to ask how can we believe that someone, Obama, will jump start our economy in the next four years when he hasn’t done it in the past four. That same observer would have to ask how we can trust our government to a man, Romney, who has proven his word cannot be trusted.

Postscript: It would not be fair to finish this post without remarking on the constant state of Silly Season that is this presidential race. We have over 8% unemployment. We have cities declaring bankruptcy and resorting to paying their public officials a minimum wage. We have a global financial market in turmoil that could blow up in our face at any moment. The election is less than four months away and neither candidate has offered anything of substance about how to fix our problems. When we are not hearing platitudes, we hear attacks against the opponent, often tangential to anything that ultimately matters. The President is doing, at best a luke warm attempt at defending his record. His opponent will not discuss his time as Governor of Massachusetts and runs away from any in-depth discussion of his time as a businessman, the key experience he claims makes him the candidate of choice.

As of this writing Obama and Romney are neck and neck in the polls. Virginia is one example where the president has lost ground and neither candidate is particularly appealing to the electorate.

As we look at the current campaigns, we long for an adult to offer solutions. There does not seem to be an adult to be found.

Respectfully,
Rutherford

Image: FreeDigitalPhotos.net

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556 thoughts on “When a Flip-Flop is Simply a Lie

  1. As we look at the current campaigns, we long for an adult to offer solutions. There does not seem to be an adult to be found.

    And once again, we ignore the adult in the mix – Dr Paul.

  2. So, who here is going to fill Rutherford and his posse with the litany of differing Obama statements in just the last 3-4 years?

    (incidentally, I think there just might be some “nuance” in the competing blind trust commentary you refer to as a “lie”).

  3. You write that Obama’s defense of his record is lackluster. I disagree. He is vigoriously defending his job history in the only way he can–to sling muck whenever his record is discussed. Obama is operating under a serious handicap.

  4. To be honest I am still waiting on the responses from last post to Tex’s post and Gorilla’s point by point response to the Whittle video. I will look for it here, repost it if necessary.

  5. James, you’re right and I think that’s obvious to anyone paying attention.

    Of course, after the Seals killed Bin Laden, Rutherford said Obama’s reelection was a lock so maybe that’s all there is to it. 🙄

  6. I usually hate every word that comes out of Nancy Pelosi’s vile, polished wood face. But, she made me grin today as she backed off her demands for Romney’s tax returns. Hilerious. Bundlers for team Obama former Bain. Dems demanding taxes and then shutting the fuck up about it the minute someone asks for theirs. And a president pretending like nobody notices how bad he has sucked the last 4 years. Awesome. The independents must be pretty much decided by now. How can’t they get swept up in Hope and Change Part Duex.

  7. I don’t know Tigre, I heard Romney called his wife a cunt for the dreaded “you people” remark.

  8. Rutherford your dishonesty is more on display with this post than Mitt Romneys.
    I’d also add that the context and character of Romney over a period of decades is superior to that of Obama’s in the past six.
    You’re grasping at straws buddy,go make a bed,take a nap and come back in November.

  9. Alfie, Rutherford is concerned that if elected Romney might wind up taking the same positions as Obama The Consistent and Transparent.

    Now what was Obama saying about executive privilege, gay marriage and Rev. Wright?

  10. Poolman, I have a question, I think I heard that Ron Paul needs 5 states to have his name put in for nomination at the convention, is that correct? I also heard that he is 1 state short, is that correct? And are there still some more Republican State Conventions or are they all done? Sorry I guess I should have said, questions.

  11. Sorry had to get it out of my system. You can get facebook without making your life public. This computer doesn’t have it, just DL’d the client and I can pull these up.

  12. The President is doing, at best a luke warm attempt at defending his record.

    Alfie is absolutely right on this one.

    Obama is not defending his record at all because he can’t defend his record of abject failure. And you can’t even bring yourself to admit he failed and failed miserably, Rutherford.

    It isn’t Mitt Romney who is being dishonest here. Matter of fact, since the election is just now winding up, I submit Mitt Romney has very specifically laid out his plan. And like Gorilla’s questions and my questions from the previous thread, the plan is very quietly being ignored.

    I could spend hours simply listing the lies and broken promises of one Barack Obama – a thief of future generations, as is every Leftist.

  13. “So, who here is going to fill Rutherford and his posse with the litany of differing Obama statements in just the last 3-4 years? “

    That’s asking an awful lot of just one person, Tigre. We should all share the load.

    “The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation. In instances of self-defense, the President would be within his constitutional authority to act before advising Congress or seeking its consent. History has shown us time and again, however, that military action is most successful when it is authorized and supported by the Legislative branch. It is always preferable to have the informed consent of Congress prior to any military action.” -Barack Obama, 2007

  14. It would be far easier for us to list the promises that Barack Obama has kept than to list all of his flip flops, lies, broken promises, and distortions. At the end of the discussion, I will predict with some assurance that Rutherford will rue the day he broached this particular subject.

    How about this doozy:

    The promise to reduce bills rushed through Congress and to the president before the public has the opportunity to review them, Obama “will not sign any non-emergency bill without giving the American public an opportunity to review and comment on the White House website for five days.”

    So Rutherford. Can you give us a heads up on what exactly is Barack Obama’s plan to fix the ailing economy? Is it to double down on the stimulus? How about more tax breaks for the unions? Tax the rich?

    So I guess what the Obama disciples and soldiers are saying is that it is far more important that America audit what Romney’s 2003 tax return, than to determine why Obama approves of indebting America $171,000,000.00 an hour?

    Yes, I can see our country is in the best of hands with you and your boy genius at the helm.

  15. She says “you people” but, after listaning to the audio, its doesn’t come off bad. It’s obvious she is refering to the media. It’s not a gaffe. (Of course, even if it did take a slightly awkward tone…who cares. But it doesnt. At all.) Anyone offended by that is lying. I garuntee even Rutherford won’t claim that as ammo. And he acted like a desperate house wife gossiping over speculation of a word used in another man’s marriage. For crap’s sake, if it’s that easy to outrage or make people not like you anymore, I’d be terrified to talk.

  16. Here’s what ails me, Brother Rabbit. Obama and these idiot toe suckers of his are in no particular order: demanding Romney’s tax returns, criticizing Ann Romney for “you people” or participating in dressage, etc…

    Consider what the media is not covering this week alone:

    1. Weekly jobless claims shot up to 386,000.
    2. Foreclosures are hitting our most vulnerable citizens.
    3. Factory activity contracted for a second month in a row.
    4. Home sales dropped a 5.4% — the biggest drop in nine months.
    5. Retail sales dropped for the third straight month.
    6. Consumer confidence dipped to 84.7.
    7. U.S. business inventories increased by .3%…
    8. …sales dropped .1%.
    9. Food staples are skyrocketing, due in large part to ethanol subsidies of corn.
    10. More Americans are getting federal disability than jobs.

    That’s the last four days of news. Can you see why I say even if Romney should win the election, our life won’t appreciably change until we separate ourselves from this deceitful ilk?

    I want these idiots to have absolutely no bearing on my life, my wife’s life, my children’s life. We’re doomed if we don’t split soon from these goons. I’m serious as I can be.

  17. It’s a miracle! I’m going to keep posting these because they are so delightfully effective at exposing the deceit.

    And Bill didn’t even mention how Obama miraculously got millions of dollars as community activist to “spread around” as a young man…

  18. Here Tex,

    This may help you understand that all capitalism is not alike. This agrees with my points and reflects some of your own previous gripes along with Rutherford’s. Capitalism, like religion, does not only come in one flavor. Some are very bad.

    http://c4ss.org/content/11035

  19. ABC News says Ann Romney didn’t say “you people.” However Barry did at a University of Colorado speech in April. I repeat Ann should have said “you bastards.”

    Our computer is malfuncitoning. I don’t have much times.

  20. sorry about mistyping my e mail address. Until right now our computer has been freezing and crashing every 1 to 4 minutes.

    Your latest post is biased and ignores Obama’s lies. He said for example that Obamacare wouldn’t raise our taxes. He and the democrats used subtrifuge to pass the law. And as Sarah palin warned the law has death panels. Obama lied about that too.

    You should have directed your comments at both candidates. As it is you appear to giving Obama in kind campaign help. We know you wouldn’t want to do that, or would you?

  21. My other post may not have made it through, so here it is again. ABC News said Ann Romney did not say “you people” Another source said Obama uttered the words at an April; speech at the University of Colorado.

    Now, Newt or no newt, you can continue to hold Ann in high regard. I still think she should have said “you bastards” because most are.

  22. Ron Paul’s supporters tried to get control of Nebraska’s convention votes at the recent state convention. They failed because the governor lobbied against them. The supporters believed they could have forced a fifteen minutes speech for Paul at the national convention had they been able to deliver all of the deligation’s votes.

    You are correct sir. Capitalism comes in many forms. Obama’s brand is one of the bad ones.

  23. This may help you understand that all capitalism is not alike. This agrees with my points and reflects some of your own previous gripes along with Rutherford’s. Capitalism, like religion, does not only come in one flavor. Some are very bad.

    I really hate to sound elitist Poolman, but if it wasn’t you as source, it would actually be humorously offensive to be lectured by someone with no formal education, to the best of my knowledge no practical expertise in large corporations, no knowledge of risk assessment, NPV, IRR, and host of other financial and economic measures, and frankly no degree of personal business success.

    Some of what was contained in your article may have been valid as I am a believer that the larger a corporation grows, as a general rule (but not always) the more inefficient it becomes. That’s just the nature of communication and the larger the ship, the slower the turn.

    But the premise of the listed article sure wasn’t valid. I laid down a challenge to the board if they truly believe big corporations are as bureaucratic and inept as our government.

    Very simple exercise.

    Want to bet I have no takers on the challenge and the challenge would certainly never be accepted by any big government official?

    Where did you find this? On some Ron Paul site?

  24. It is so refreshing to see Mr. Obama finally vetted properly. Can’t depend on a corrupted media like most newspapers and Rutherford stations, but I sure am thankful for the internet and WSJ for finally digging into the sordid history of Barry S.

    The claim that Obama saved GM is fraudulent. What he did was use political muscle to intervene in a bankruptcy process in order to ensure a settlement on terms favorable to his supporters, the United Auto Workers union, at the expense of taxpayers (or “freeloaders,” in the president’s parlance) and bondholders. It would be more accurately characterized as an act of larceny than salvation.

    Yesterday’s column discussed the philosophy behind Obama’s belittlement of the successful. Today we’d like to examine the psychology behind it. For it seems to us that Obama’s generalities about success being undeserved are absolutely true in one particular case: that of Barack Obama. Unearned success is the central theme of his life story.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444330904577537003820291084.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_MIDDLETopOpinion

  25. Tex big question, do I believe some opinion piece or my own ears? Now what Ann Romney might have meant by “you people,” could be subject to debate, but the fact is she did say it.

  26. The discussion about what type of capitalist is President Obama is just too crazy for words. Honestly, it is crazy, at the Glenn Beck level. Talk among yourselves until you work yourselves up, after your panic wanes finally, take a nap. It will pass.
    Terrible news this morning from Colorado, I hope no one here has lost a friend or family member.

  27. Ann Romney DID NOT say it.

    ABC News wrote “Was it ‘And we’ve given all people need to know and understand about how our financial situation and about how– you know, how we live our life.’

    Or Was it-‘And we’ve given all you people need to know and understand about our financial situation and about how-you know, how we live our life.'”

    “Our ruling after reviewing the original audio is that she did not include the ‘you'”.

    Look at the record. Obama’s style of capitalism involves special deals for friends and allies.

    Is the egg on your face hard or soft boiled, or maybe fried? Perhaps it is part of an omlet.

  28. Yes, it is terrible news from Colorado. Relatives live in the area. Many of those survivors will need counseling.

    Our daughters’ former high school classmate and some other people we know nearly bought it in the Von Maurer shooting in Omaha. I believe about nine or ten people were killed.

    Our daughter’s friend couldn’t be in crowds for months because she saw “dead people,” the faces of her murdered co workers.

    We watched two interviewed survivors. They showed their stress, though they were composed.

  29. What about Obama’s saying “you people” in April? Why was Ann so guilty of a misdeed when some accused her of saying it, when Obama’s words were the same?

    Granted, the press didn’t report it, but now you know. If you don’t believe me, look it up.

    Otherwise, you come across as a hyprocrite. We know that is not true. You must be busy eating the omlett from your face.

  30. I listened to the video again this morning and heard with my own ears, “you people.” End of discussion.
    So James, you heard Romney’s latest diversion, I still want to see his tax forms, in fact I want to see them more than ever. What is he hiding?

  31. Newton.

    No, it is not subject to debate. That is, if you have a half a brain. Matter of fact the host called Ann Romney most gracious. As a side note, I’ve toyed with you, because well…you’re stupid and helpless. But you’re also a nauseating, duplicitous hypocrite who runs with nauseating duplicitous hypocrites, and whose inability to properly absorb anything of worth or truth has run the limit of my timidity. 😉

    Here’s the direct quote:

    To Robert Roberts of ABC News, “We’ve given all you people need to know and understand about our financial situation and how we live our life.”

    Does that appear to genetic defects like you who frequent equally inane boards of stupid people like Ginormous Hips Jean to be referring to anyone but the “you media people”? Are you a licensed member of the MSM? How about Ginormous Jean and the rest of those itching, malodorous clams you squirm with? Are they professional journalists?

    So here’s my counter offer to YOU STUPID PEOPLE OF THE PROGRESSIVE MINDSET, me being one of the freeloaders according to Hussein Obama’s parlance of somebody else being responsible for any success.

    I want Mitt Romney to give every tax return to you bunch of inept, helpless, reprehensible LIARS since he turned 16 years old, with a couple of provisions:

    Barack Obama, like every President before him, opens up his entire college transcript history including his service during the Harvard Law Review President (should be easy since he is the only one to never write a review), provides explanation during an interview with say Charles Krauthammer, national broadcast, of how he and his hideous wife sat through 20 years of Jeremiah Wright sermons demonizing White America but never hearing it, and provides all documentation to Congress concerning the Fast & Furious scandal.

    Do you people approve? Because I’m guessing your Mr. Transparent President won’t. Not on his life, he won’t.

  32. I heard the conversation with my own ears too. Ann sounded as if she was starting to say “you” but she didn’t finish. It came across as “y”, and it was so brief one could miss it. Listen again, and you will understand why ABC declared Ann didn’t say “you”.

    The whole issue is stupid. Who cares, except for an Obama supporter who is looking for an issue? What about Obama’s uttering the vile word? How can you criticize Ann Romney without responding in kind to Obama? I didn’t look it up, but I assume it is true that Obama uttered the cursed word at a speech in Colorado in April. What matters is the reaction to alleged words.

    You are on stronger ground about Romney’s taxes. I can see both sides to that argument. Still Obama has hidden many secrets, including his college transcripts. One wonders what courses he took and their relationship to his current political ideology.

    I don’t know what Romney’s latest diversion is. So far it has been a campaign of diversions from both sides.

    ?Samuelsom a prize winning economic ranter, wrote that this contest is between a capitalist and a redistributionist, similar to what I wrote. That is what this campaign is about everything else is a diversion.

  33. “Granted, the press didn’t report it, but now you know. If you don’t believe me, look it up.” How do you look up something that wasn’t reported?
    Tex, please give a physical description, of say, Rush Limbaugh. I am just curious if you would be as much a stickler on his body type?

  34. One thing I heard that came out of the Zimmerman-Hannity exchange was that Zimmerman confirmed that he said “punks.” Anyone remember who it was that stated it was definitely “coons” and that there was no doubt?

    “End of discussion.”

    All form of discussion on the issue of “you people?”? Or just the challenge that she said it?

    I actually posted the interview on the last thread but we’d already migrated so it got lost in the move. Suffice to say that to my mind the worst part of the segment was that Ann failed to inspire 🙂 Then again she did say a few things worth noting for me, and they didn’t hurt her or her husband.

    Really, I thought that taking issue with her statement(s) were a stretch, and that it required a little creativity to feel genuinely insulted.

    As for me, it’s unclear exactly what Ann Romney said, but she seemed to catch on the word, or at least stumble slightly in constructing the sentence. All in all, I’m thinking that the gravity of Ann Romney’s insult has escaped me.

    Say for the sake of argument that she said “you people.”

    What did she mean by that, Newt? You said in the context of presenting the statement to the board that you “actually had a favorable opinion of Mrs. Mitt, but that has changed.” Did your opinion of Ann Romney turn on this?

    Who is “you?”

  35. I don’t have much time because our computer has been freezing every few minutes. look up twitchy or as I did obama said you people at a colorado speech in april.

    america is not about you people doing well. it is about everybody doing well.

  36. Newt, you really don’t have the power to end discussions. You can choose to drop out and ignore. But that’s about it. But, just so I can properly gage what I’m dealing with when it comes to your angle online, you are telling me that snippet of Romney’s wife ruined a previously favorable opinion of her? Were you being honest about that?

    Your independence as a free thinker is getting high jacked by cheesy politicians and their campaigning parlor tricks of spin. That sucks for you. You get caught up in the dumb dumb shit. I have a feeling you will be quite the wind up toy this campaign season. Massive grain of salt for you and everything you say from here out.

  37. Newt, why don’t you defend obama’s record instead of resorting to diversions you so hate? Who is “You?” I like that. Now, “Who are You?” by the Who is playing in my head. At least our computer is behaving itself for now.

  38. James, your ears are clearly keener or cleaner, than mine, ‘you’ and ‘y’ sound the same to be me. I have used the phrase, “you people” to groups of children and I used it in the same way as Ann Romney, to let then know, I clearly considered myself in authority over them. So I find it very strange, she directed towards potential voters.

  39. I’m checking out now to let the computer rest. This should not be the “end of discussion.” Newt raised an important issue in a way she did not intend. “You” illustrates the need of Obama supporters to change the subject from substantive issues. We must hold such people on track.

    Given the complicity of the press, it also reveals the need for Republicans to spend a lot of money to buy space for their view points.

  40. Yes, Newt, I have good hearing. One ear is bad due to a head injury, but I am the one who can hear the cell phone ringing if it is in another room. My wife still wonders how I can do it.

    I use the term “you folks” sometimes to single out a group of people I know and am talking to, but it has no racial or other connotations. Its’ sort of like “you all” my father and aunts carried from North Carolina when they moved back north as children.

  41. Here is the deal on Newt. Look at the amount of time she is spent on this topic. These 2 words, by time spent as being the measure, are the most important thing going on in the nation to her.

    These hateful people have nothing else so they are grasping at straws.Problem is this solves nothing. Will anyone be helped or hurt by her words? Will one extra job be made or lost? Will one more mouth be fed or go without because of these comments? No. It will have no impact on anyone at any level, yet she and her kind persist on going after it because of who and what they are. Let her spin her wheels on this topic while the adults move on to the more important issues of the day.

  42. I think it’s silly to focus on what Ann Romney said or how she said it. We all have things we have said that we would like to rephrase or retract.

    You people are trivial. 😉

  43. Since my hearing came up, Newt. I also have glaucoma in one eye, and cateracs in both. Both optic nerves are eroding. Yet, I still have 20/20 vision and my eye doctor can’t understand why. She says keep watch on me, but since I can see well we need to do nothing. I shouldn’t be able to see and hear as well as I do, especially since I have tiniintitis in one ear, but I do.

    As we know, I am the son of blue eyed mutants.

  44. “…this contest is between a capitalist and a redistributionist, similar to what I wrote. That is what this campaign is about everything else is a diversion.”

    So true.

    I have a happy errand to run today so I’m second-thoughting even wading back in on this. I should be on my way. On the agenda is a joy ride up to the Madison, WI area to pick up a vintage Schwinn Town & Country three-wheeler for my mom to toodle aroung on. I hope the drought hasn’t been too rough on the old homestate.

    See you people later!

  45. Later, muffy and all you people. I’m leaving for now to save our computer. Best wishes for homestead’s moisture situation.

  46. For all you dog lovers out there:

    To be sure, the dog is loyal. But why, on that account, should we take him as an example? He is loyal to man, not to other dogs. -Karl Kraus, writer (1874-1936)

  47. Tex, please give a physical description, of say, Rush Limbaugh. I am just curious if you would be as much a stickler on his body type?

    Male.

    ———-

    Why don’t you tell those cowards at Ginormous Jean’s and Fat Grannies that you frequently run with, that Tex awaits here to slap their greasy, ginormous butt cheeks with their shriveled bunch of sissy eunuchs, and that I am sure not only are they stupid and helpless, but rank cowards and dunces that couldn’t debate to save their miserable, nanny gov dependent lives in an open forum?

    Tell Ginormous Jean I called her a pathetic, old nag and has been, who should have been turned into dog food 30 years ago.

    Tell ‘um. Just like that. Tell them our gracious host, Mr. Lawson, has provided a nice forum called the Coliseum for just that purpose, where their lame asses can’t moderate or edit the responses – and I’ll demonstrate beyond a doubt just how stupid and helpless YOU PEOPLE really are.

    And I’ll ask my wonderfully talented friends here to butt out for a time to make it fair, while I take the virtual cane to Ginormous Jean & Co.

  48. I told my brother during the last batman movie, the one with the joker, that they are done so well, I could see them inspiring psyco killers trapped in a fantasy land. It does not surprize me in the least that some asshole did that. So sad, man.

    Of course, I’m sure Rutherford is passionately typing out a blog blaming the Obama administration for the killings. After all they purposely used inflammatory rhetoric bluring the line of reality with the Dark Knight franchise.

    Sick fucking world. Heartbreakingly sick.

  49. I disagree. He is vigoriously defending his job history in the only way he can–to sling muck whenever his record is discussed.

    Slinging muck is not a defense.

  50. These killers seem to have the polar opposite of my mental illness. I can’t go to lakes or dairy queens next to a main road with out gripping anxiety. This is an embarrassing admission, considering my libertarian bent. For such a libertarian, I sure don’t trust people. I took my son to a little water park next to a public beach, packed with hundreds of people, and could not stop being a life guard. I had to leave early. My 3 year old was pretty much giving me a WTF. My wife thinks I am nuts and need a therapist. It’s not normal thinking I exist to stop a trajedy at all times. My brother claims therapy would do no good since my anxiety stems from a rational premise. I know I didn’t suffer from this until a few years ago. It sucks when you in live in Michigan and can’t enjoy lakes because you are focused on a potential drowning victim, usually a child, at every second. Never in my life did I think I would ever suffer from a fucking mental disorder.

  51. I generally loathe these Batman movies – or any action hero movies for that matter. I think I’m the only red blooded American who was watching his watch the entire time through ‘The Avengers.’

    But I got to admit that Heath Ledger one was pretty damn good. These Hollywood types are so fragile in real life – Jekyll and Hyde. Guy was a good actor. I didn’t think anybody could be crazier than Nicholson as the Joker. But Ledger was much better.

  52. The independents must be pretty much decided by now. How can’t they get swept up in Hope and Change Part Duex.

    You’re missing something Rabbit. There has to be an attractive alternative to hope and change. Lord knows I didn’t like Santorum but you know the difference between Rick and Mitt? Rick was genuine. You don’t have a strong enough candidate to be cocky. Your best hope is that people stay home … that is former Obama supporters. If disgusted Republicans stay home, you’ve got a problem.

    P.S. I couldn’t agree with you more about the hypocrites in Congress. When I saw the headline that they haven’t released their returns I had to shake my head.

  53. I heard Romney called his wife a cunt for the dreaded “you people” remark.

    The comedy just never ends.

    FWIW I’d find it very hard to believe that Romney cusses his wife out. First, I think his religious background keeps him in line and second I get the vibe he’s a genuinely decent guy on a personal level. Politically he’s as fake as a 3 dollar bill.

  54. I agree Tex. Can’t stand them. I think the batman series is the only super hero thing I ever thought was good.

  55. It is a crazy world out there anymore, Rabbit. That’s why I hated that Zimmerman interview. God’s plan? 🙄 No, George. That wasn’t God’s plan, I can assure you. God had no part at all…

    I cringe when I hear crap like that. In fact, it makes me angry. It is so diametrically opposed to my faith. Of course, so is calling on slapping some ginormous butt cheeks of the masses, but I like to think that is like figuratively turning over some money changer tables. 🙂

  56. Rutherford your dishonesty is more on display with this post than Mitt Romneys.

    Au contraire. It’s one of the fairest posts I’ve ever written. As someone who has been accused of being too invested in Obama, I have to tell you Alfie, you are too invested in Romney. The 1994 quote does sound like someone who knows what he’s talking about and is legitimately busting Kennedy’s balls. The 2012 Romney is full of sh*t and you know it.

  57. Anybody else here think that Hollywood has literally run out of ideas?

    Remakes, animation and action figures. 🙄 The last good movie I actually saw with plot and a story line was A King’s Speech.

    And it had been five years before that when I saw something I thought worth watching.

  58. Rutherford, when I coached baseball, sometimes I let the kid who I was pretty sure would strike out pinch hit for the kid who has already struck out 4 times in the game. You stay home in November. You already played 9 innings. And you stunk on ice.

  59. DR, I was thinking the exact same thing (R’s reaction) when I heard of the shooting.

    “Bane,” Bain Capital,” Second Amendment, inflammatory rhetoric, e.g. “you people” got what you’re entitled to = Romney is responsible for the shootings. . . and of course Palin too.

    Go get ’em MSNBC! Go get ’em Rutherford! We need to have this dialogue! 😆

  60. This computer doesn’t have it, just DL’d the client and I can pull these up.

    For the benefit of the assembled, Noah could you provide a link? I am not aware of Facebook having a “client” you can download. As far as I know, it is web based. Please clarify.

  61. Noah, you’ve GOT to be kidding. You point to a POSTER as evidence that Obama paid millions to seal his records? So if you find someone with a poster that says Obama is really a skittle-shitting unicorn, I’m supposed to believe that too?

    Raise your game my brotha. 😉

  62. I think you underestimate Romney, Rutherford. You want to make him out to be McCain, and Romney is far, far superior in almost every regard. If Romney shows a stiff spine, I think he will utterly frustrate The One. The debates will be of utmost importance.

    I think you’re going to struggle this time, because now you’re on defense and you’re grasping. I admire your determination in the defense of the indefensible Obama, but let’s face it – the man is a charlatan, woeful liar and massive failure. Transparency and post-racial? Is that a joke? 😆

    The only way Obama wins is to divide and conquer through envy and covetousness. It’s back to class warfare, race, pandering, and platitudes. Advertising for food stamps? It’s a disgrace that hopefully this time, enough people see through the flim flam. Obama’s magic is gone (I never thought it there to begin with) and his record is a louding clanging sound in the abyss. Off the cuff, Obama is a tool with a foot in the mouth.

    I don’t know how you can’t honestly admit that. We know you’re going to vote for him, and I still give you a measure of excuse because of the obvious. But Rutherford, you’re tied to the hip of the worst America has to offer in doing so.

    Nancy Pelosi? Is there a bigger, more wretched hypocrite and dunce than Nancy Pelosi? She’s been busted so many times for lying, I’ve lost count.

  63. The SEALs? What did they do? Carry Obama’s stuff while he dispatched OBL to his 72 raisins?

    When you guys talk like this, you come off like six year olds. Just sayin’.

  64. I can lay the Obama flip-flop meme to rest with one simple observation.

    When Obama RAN for office he didn’t have a litany of contradictions dragging him down. I could easily concede that his presidency contradicted much of what was said on the campaign trail and it wouldn’t amount to squat.

    Romney is not POTUS yet. He has a history of contradictions so long if it weren’t tragic it would be pure comedy fodder. So logic would tell you, if you elected someone who TURNED OUT TO BE A FLIP FLOPPER, why in hell would you vote for someone who is ALREADY A VERIFIABLE FLIP-FLOPPER.

    C’mon geniuses … learn from the mistake we gullible liberals made. 😉

    So … your Obama flip-flop meme is hereby deemed totally off the point. Move onto something else.

  65. The SEALs? What did they do? Carry Obama’s stuff while he dispatched OBL to his 72 raisins?

    When you guys talk like this, you come off like six year olds. Just sayin’.

    Heck, what BIC said is downright gentlemanly compared to what the SEALS are saying about Obama killing Osama. They are now openly mocking Obama for even being responsible for giving the orders to kill Osama.

    I know for an absolute fact, Obama dithered for four days trying to decide what to do, while snipers lay on a ship deck waiting to shoot Somalia pirates in the head.

    I know the father of one of the shooters and he loathes Obama more than I do.

  66. the real heroes responsible for killing Osama telling B O to shove his “victory” up his ass.

    From the article: Mr Zinke, who is now a Republican state senator in Montana

    ‘Nuff said. 😐

  67. “So … your Obama flip-flop meme is hereby deemed totally off the point. Move onto something else.”

    Ready to talk about Obama’s economic successes now?

  68. Rabbit, you have the symptoms of parenthood. It gets better after the kids are grown and on their own. And I agree, you are presently in the lead for the funniest line of the day.

  69. R I have read your #90 3 times and don’t get it.

    Are you saying that we should vote for Obama BECAUSE he’s only proven to be a flip flopper after his election and therefore will be what Romney isn’t? Or are you going to vote for Romney since you know he’ll flop over to Obama’s side?

  70. Well, the decision should be easy for you, Rutherford. Let’s assume that both candidates flip floppers as you suggest.

    On one hand, we’ve got a successful business man with clean record, a Republican elected governor in one of the bluest states in the nation, who even Dim Patron Saint Bill Clinton called his resume sterling in both creating jobs and wealth. He’s both generous and approachable.

    On the other hand, we’ve got a failed community activist who oversaw a district more violent than Damascus on a given weekend, abject poverty the norm, a blank slate of personal successes riddled with utter national failures, no job creation, no wealth creation, record debt, first U.S. debt downgrade in history, with a wife ashamed of America until she gets the gift bling to travel to Monaco. Nobody is calling Barack Obama’s resume sterling anymore…not even you.

    So, when you going to get on board, putting your personal bias aside and clearly vote for the more qualified wealth creator, which you yourself have admitted it’s about the economy?

  71. Tex, regarding the Weekly Standard article, you are such a TOOL!! And what is amazing is how they can write this article and hope folks don’t actually listen.

    “Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business … you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen.”

    Somebody else invested in roads and bridges so if you’ve got a business you didn’t make the roads and bridges … somebody else made that happen.

    And the point is businesses depend on infrastructure, They don’t succeed on their own.

    Keep arguing the point Tex and keep quoting from GOP rags and reveal yourself to be a really stupid f*ck. 👿

  72. Okay. There’s just too much of this stuff to simply ignore. Coincidence? I hardly think so. But then I am labeled conspiracy nut.

    If enough people are knowledgeable about it, it may not occur. I’m good with that. Better to be called crazy than to be right and not say anything. I think that’s my new motto. 😀

  73. From the article: Mr Zinke, who is now a Republican state senator in Montana

    ‘Nuff said.

    Apparently not. It wasn’t just Mr. Zinke saying it, even in this article. And apparently you also missed Mr. Zinke’s previous title.

    SEAL.

    So if Obama a brave hero who just won the election, why aren’t the other “heroes” out their clamoring like Obama’s cabinet about how brave Obama is?

    Maybe a simpler question is, “Why do these SEALS” appear to overwhelmingly favor Republicans?

  74. “Since my hearing came up, Newt. I also have glaucoma in one eye, and cateracs in both.” J

    Start growing dope instead of corn. It’ll ease the pain in your eye and with the Bob Marley cranked, you won’t even know your cell phone is ringing, let alone care. Of course, memorizing the eye chart will no longer be an option. 😉

  75. Keep arguing the point Tex and keep quoting from GOP rags and reveal yourself to be a really stupid f*ck. 👿

    😆

    Tomahawk Dunk over Rutherford…like a good Whittle video.

    I at least give you credit for reading these articles pointing out how profoundly stupid Obama’s gaffe. Not as good as the PJ Media article which you had to avoid, but nonetheless, I could hear the shatter of a window when I cast another large rock at the Rutherford house built on sand.

    But you never answered my charges against your inadequacy from the previous thread, so I am thankful for small favors.

    Like I said. I can laugh at your struggles, and still admire the determination to not confront the failings of Obama.

  76. R was concerned that Romney was claiming private business “invested” in the roads. . . or its paid tax dollars that. . . or. . . huh?

    What was Obama driving at and why again R? What was the contention all about?

  77. Ah yes, the dems and MSNBCers already exploiting the Colorado shooting for political gain. Here we go.

    Time to leap to action R. What is Romney going to do to stop further shootings? After all, if he doesn’t speak out in favor of gun control now he’s in favor of rampage shootings and the death of innocent people.

    It’s time for a dialogue. It’s an important discussion that must take place. . . and include the genius hosts at MSNBC. 😆

  78. And yesterday, Mitt was basically giving Obama’s speech, how no one succeeds without others’ help. Got to love politics!

  79. “It’s time for a dialogue. It’s an important discussion that must take place. . . and include the genius hosts at MSNBC.”

    Yes, FOX has already informed me that the shooter has no known connections to terrorist groups. No shit? I thought Hamas was running rampant in the San Diego suburbs.

    This is the problem with having to sell air time to bring us the news. Gotta have bodies, bomb squads. Meanwhile, how long will it take for twelve people to die from guns in say … Detroit? Two weeks? And who will talk about it? Very few if any.

    Thoughts Rabbit?

  80. Yeah, here to Nagic. You can see where the weak disciples like Newton come from. One of these days, someone is going to get tired of the lying, the propaganda, the character assassinations and really go looking for blood in retaliation.

    ABC draws possible Tea Party connection with alleged Aurora shooter

    http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2012/07/aurora-abc-draws-possible-tea-party-connection-129568.html

    Absolutely reprehensible people spoon fed by a corrupt media in bed with Obama.

  81. Meanwhile, how long will it take for twelve people to die from guns in say … Detroit? Two weeks?

    Or two days in South Chicago, war zone and previous home of one Barack Obama, with some of the most stringent hand gun control laws in America.

    Of course, had they been Mexicans and armed thugs shot 71 Mexicans and a couple of border guards with automatic weapons, that’s George Bush’s fault.

    Or had the murderer being screaming Allahu Akbar like Ft. Hood, well that’s just an isolated incident.

  82. “Yes, FOX has already informed me that the shooter has no known connections to terrorist groups. No shit? I thought Hamas was running rampant in the San Diego suburbs.”

    I heard that exact same report first thing things morning by Willie Geist at R’s beloved Morning Joe.

    Now that we know it’s not Islamic terrorists, it must be the Republican’s fault.

    R, where’s the call for civility in political discourse from the right that could incite such violence? We must have a dialogue. Someone said he’s a Tea Party fanatic — dog whistles, intolerance, murder. Romney has never denounced the Tea Party so he and those that support him are to blame as much as the shooter.

    Why won’t romney accept responsibility for his hand in this tragedy??

  83. Apparently, neither is NYC 10%+ unemployment enough, but 20oz. Snapples? OMG!!!

    Bloomberg is even more of a fruitcake and jackbooted fascist than most libs I know.

  84. I actually came into possession of an interesting little book last night. The Second Amendment Primer. Lots of really useful facts, but it was an essay included in the appendix that really knocked my socks of….written more than 20 years ago by an attorney, and it reinforces a truth brought up by Nanny Bloomberg’s morning after blather.

    .”Conservatives must understand that the antipathy that many liberals have for gun owners arises in good measure from their statist utopianism. This habit of mind has nowhere been better explored than in “The Republic”. There, Plato argues that the perfect society is one in which an unarmed people exhibit virtue by minding their own business in the performance of their assigned functions, while the government of philosopher-kings, above the law and protected by armed guardians unquestioning in their loyalty to the state, engineers, implements, and fine-tunes the creation of society, aided and abetted by myths that both hide and justify their totalitarian manipulation.”

    A Nation of Cowards, by Jeffrey R. Snyder

  85. Thor, black on black crime is not a discussion the left wants to have because it’s impossible to have without recognition of the unbelievable and indisputable harm the welfare state has done to the black community. Meanwhile, your so called progressives are actually recruiting hispanics to sign up for food stamps, even working with the Mexican governemnt to do so?

    Secondly, melt the guns? George Zimmerman would have saved the day had he been in that theater. Would melting all guns? Read about the killer’s apartment. It’s rigged to blow up the entire complex.

  86. Hey Newton? I’ll take your offer and raise you $862,000,000,000.00 in ‘stimulus money’ for outsourcing from your man O’Bammy and his political cronies and bundlers.

    Don’t cry – unlike Romney’s supposed outsourcing, you got to pay for some of this too. 😉 It isn’t only jeweler whose going to share some of your wealth.

    The thought of you getting bent like a slinky while getting screwed amuses me. Don’t get your high heels caught in your hoop ear rings while reading this.

    http://obamanomicsoutsourced.com/

  87. I assume Bain outsourced some jobs. I also assume Bain saved jobs. What the hell? Its called business.

  88. This guy turned himself over to the police. Think Breznik. This was no one lunatic operation. Too much symbolism here. Think MK-Ultra. This is timed and designed to bring in the police state. The drones, the militarization of the police, the recent media coverage of the F&F debacle, the Zimmerman case.

    Welcome to the terrorist state, folks. Trust your Uncle to protect you. 😈

  89. Uh Rabbit, don’t you get it?

    They were two of a handful of companies that, according to the Los Angeles Times, “exploited the boon in high-tech outsourcing, or ‘stealth’ manufacturing,” producing components or products for American businesses including Hewlett-Packard, Cisco Systems, Sun Microsystems, and Microsoft.

    and

    In its 2001 annual report, Global-Tech noted that US outsourcing to offshore production facilities was essential to its prospects: “Household appliance companies are focusing on their primary strengths of marketing and distribution, while increasingly outsourcing product development and manufacturing…Our ability and commitment to develop new and innovative, high quality products at a low cost has allowed us to benefit from the increased outsourcing of product development and manufacturing by our customers.

    WTF Newt. This is a gotcha to you? Pathetic.

    Hey maybe you’ll find out Romney owns another car or horse he hasn’t mentioned before too. Maybe he paid no taxes? Holy shit! we might elect a guy that might not have paid taxes he doesn’t have to. . . like Buffet.

  90. What are you going to do Toolman™ if these unsubstantiated links with the murderer tied to Black Bloc Anarchists and his supposed obsession with V for Vendetta prove true?

    You’re going to look pretty damn stupid, being you were just using a gravatar of the sort.

  91. Tex, Is that how the spin is going on the right? I am not surprised. The greatest threat to the fascist state are the anarchists. Too bad he attacked a theater of civilians and turned himself over to the state so willingly. Otherwise I might take your logic with a grain of truth instead of salt.

  92. I’m getting a little agitated that my renowned electro physiologist has not bothered to get back with me this afternoon. For the first time in 25 years, my ventricular tachycardia appears to have risen its ugly head and the daily medication I take doesn’t appear to be cutting the mustard anymore.

    And I have waited seven fricking hours now to get word of obtaining a halter monitor, or to get into his office and get hooked up to an EKG to check if my guess is right. Now you know why I have been wasting the day here – all day. 😡

    So if by chance, I suddenly disappear from this board, and since I have no blog like Hippie Professor to have my friends announce my demise, and some of you cut the clapping and cheering :wink:, you’ll know that I croaked in the comfort of my office – waiting for a phone call.

    I can hardly wait for Bongo Care to take full effect.

  93. At least the conspiracy loons amongst my fellow gold bugs are coherent and have a logical motive. Gold and silver price kept down by the Fed via proxies and the ETF market. I ain’t buying it. But, at least I can follow it.

    Look at what a rambling moron poolman is. Of course, Rutherford will wink amd giggle. But fuck man. What a moron.

  94. The greatest threat to the fascist state are the anarchists.

    😈 I had no idea, even under your choice of President, that we had sunk to such depths, Toolman™.

    Did you ever reckon four years ago, as you stood in fawning adulation wetting your pants and dreaming you were indeed the generation everyone had waited for Tool™, in front of Styrofoam columns resembling something out of a Caligula orgy, that The One was actually Dear Leader Obama, and that you were so dangerous, so deadly, so insightful of the evil, that Dear Leader Obama would resort to sending state of the art praying mantis drones to your backyard?

    Ironic, hey?

  95. It’s just fucking amazing. So damned predictable too.

    How is MSNBC exploiting the tragedy for Dear Leader’s benefit? They don’t a give a shit how many people get trashed in the process either.

  96. Tex,

    The Obama I helped elect, did indeed flip flop. No argument from me. He’s hardly recognizable to me anymore. I never fawned over him, but I did respect and admire him. I also thought he had integrity. I guess I was a victim of marketing. But that was almost 4 years ago, dude. I won’t continue to be drug through that bunk. I’ve long ago stood back and taken a broader view. I don’t see him as being any worse than either Bush, Clinton, McCain, or Romney.

    Romney is a likable guy. I don’t see him standing in the way of any agenda that the fascists wish to impose. Full speed ahead.

    I just don’t understand why everyone overlooks Dr Paul. I understand the threat to those feeding off this beast, but to honest conservatives and free market enthusiasts, he should be number one.

    If being ‘inside’ hasn’t changed the man in over 30 years, you’d think he was a safe bet. But it never fails to amaze me how much bs we Americans can swallow and still claim to be aware.

    Make sure you crank that fountain of yours up. Water is soothing and calming. Maybe you need a short break next to a running brook with no internet connection. None of this is worth a stroke. Just sayin…

  97. Can that guy sue? I am so sick of this insanity. There is no way an established media outlet doesn’t know how dangerous and irresponsible that is.

  98. Poolman, I’m certainly touched by your concern. But the concern isn’t a stroke – it’s my heart bursting at the “seams.”

    What’s weird is I’ve been taking my pulse all day. 60-65 and constant. That’s why I need the fricking “Holter” monitor – I forgot it’s not “halter.” 😆

    It’s possible it’s as simple as some sort of pulmonary infection, but it would be damn nice to eliminate the heart first. I feel like I’ve wasted the whole day – wouldn’t be the first time.

  99. Re: Preying Mantis drones. That cracked me up. Talk about pulling the lever for the wrong guy for President. Dude you voted for a president that ended up unleashing the most advanced drone prototypes on your backyard! That is fucked up!

  100. Nagic @ 106

    The argument is severely flawed.

    First of all, progressives don’t argue that conservatives want NO government. Total straw man.

    Second, the author manipulates the pie chart info. He doesn’t include the VA or State dept in defense against “bands of marauders’. He/she also leaves social security in the chart, severely skewing the numbers. SS is a completely different entity and issue which, BTW, has a regressive tax structure. I don’t think it would behoove the 1% to open that can of fiduciary. Taking these points into account, the defense against marauders comes much closer to about 28%. Then ask, why the use of the “about 37% of all federal taxes” number when Zombie’s own link shows it’s about 37% of “personal income tax paid”, a far different statistic.

    Thirdly, the local vs. federal taxes angle has some merit, but even the author admits that the Federal govt does help subsidize many of these local functions. Also, the taxes collected go back out into the communities in payments to vendors, contractors, employees. When Boeing gets a defense contract, a portion of that money enters the Puget Sound economy. I once saw a graph of red and blue states showing what they paid and what was returned by the Feds. The red states were by far the larger leeches.

  101. Doubtful, but depends on how it was reported.

    Really? Couldn’t the poor guy sue for slander, Tigre? I mean, the man is 50 years old – they weren’t even close to getting the right man. Obviously, ABC Spews was trying to slander the entire Tea Party, but this guy was damaged personally.

  102. “First of all, progressives don’t argue that conservatives want NO government. Total straw man.”

    They do it by necessary implication all the time Numbnutz. You think the right doesn’t recognize that road construction is financed by the government?

    Thanks for the info Obama!

  103. Hey Thor? I know you won’t debate me about that garbage you just posted because you’re a rank coward.

    So. I know you think you’re a really smart man, I’ll make you a challenge. Go over the PJMedia board and lay that same spew, line for line and will let Zombie respond here with response. I’ll contact them myself.

    Are you man enough, because what you just posted, especially this has been long ago discounted as horseshit:

    The red states were by far the larger leeches.

    Wrong. That is pure bunk, using manipulated data to boot. I’ll give you one example. Please provide me one example of a red state “Big Dig.”

    Besides, even you were right, that would only lend support to the Left wishing to end Federal Tax redistribution. You POS are notoriously cheap and beholden to self. There is no way in hell you’re going to allow red states to receive excessive allocation of federal funds.

  104. Tex, one of the problems(among others) is that to be defamatory the story must tend to harm the reputation of of this so as to lower him in the estimation of the community or to deter third persons from associating with him. I am no expert of defamation, but I’m not sure what they said was “false” and more importantly he couldn’t be not the shooter since he isn’t dead or in custody. I just don’t think mistaken identity would get it there unless people that knew this guy believed he did it because of what was reported.

  105. Dude you voted for a president that ended up unleashing the most advanced drone prototypes on your backyard!

    I think the most advanced are the real insects with on board electronics. But hey, I’m sure they are beyond that by now.

    Rabbit, that goes along with my theory of Obama being a Trojan horse. Rutherford did not like that comment when I made it several threads back. Since Obama’s all NATOed up, it has some merit. But then you still think we’re doing Syria a real service, Libya style. Am I right?

    Did you see that FOIA docs recently obtained show we have had drone activity in the US and authorized by the FAA since 2004? Washington state was one of the first to get ‘permission’.

  106. “Did you see that FOIA docs recently obtained show we have had drone activity in the US and authorized by the FAA since 2004?

    And to think they unleashed the most advanced of it on you and your wife for potentially violating pool treatment regulations. 😆

  107. Sorry James. I think we stole all your rain.

    I just went out to put down the patio umbrellas. Felt like Gilligan in the episode where he has to put the lightning rod in the meteorite during a typhoon because it’s making the whole gang grow old overnight.

  108. “I heard that exact same report first thing things morning by Willie Geist at R’s beloved Morning Joe.” – ET

    I don’t watch the show. Is WG a politician or a “journalist”.

    Sometimes I think journalism was among the thousands of victims killed on 9/11.

  109. “Secondly, melt the guns? George Zimmerman would have saved the day had he been in that theater.” – DR

    He WAS there. Unfortunately, he was chasing a kid down in the parking lot for stealing skittles and missed the whole thing. 🙂

    Save the hate mail, ET. It was just a joke. I’m still keeping an open mind for the trial.

    How does one recruit for food stamps?

  110. And to think they unleashed the most advanced of it on you and your wife for potentially violating pool treatment regulations.

    Nah. You people made that part up.

    Sheriff Joe has plenty of normal copters for that task. He is never that subtle. I suspect it was some millionaire’s kid spying on folks for fun. Though I’m certain each of our intelligence files is chock full of interesting data.

  111. Nagic, did you catch this charge of straw man by Thor? Exactly how is it a straw men when Obama and Elizabeth Warren are quoted directly?

    There was a very legitimate point made that Thor completely missed in his defense of Obama’s charges of government leading the public good.

    Embedded in Obama’s Roanoke speech is the very clear implication that business owners are getting a free ride. I’d like to know how so? GE and Obama’s Jobs Czar Jeffrey Immelt may pay zero federal taxes, but most small businesses in this country pay the highest corporate tax rate in the industrialized world. Bob’s Roto Rooter is paying up to 35% of their income, plus another 12.5% for SS, Medicare/Medicaid, throw in workman’s comp, etc…and small business makes up 70% of the private employment in America.

    Something else Obama got wrong. Technological innovations mostly lead to new infrastructure, not the other way around. Henry Ford built his assembly line allowing inexpensive cars, leading to the creation of better roads. Edison’s light bulb led to power grids and electric lines in urban areas first, then in rural ones.

    Then there’s this little thing about where the money to build all the infrastructure came from – once again, private sources.

    One of the posters made a great point: if we’re going to use Obama’s logic about government paying for it, then using Obama’s conclusions, American taxpayers should demand that those who pay no federal taxes used to build the infrastructure should be barred from the use of roads, bridges, parks, other public areas.

    In other words, Obama is Julia in drag.

  112. They do it by necessary implication all the time Numbnutz. You think the right doesn’t recognize that road construction is financed by the government? – ET

    Sorry, I don’t think the premise is valid. Its not about all government or no government. It’s not even about big govt and small. I think the Bush era confirmed that. I think it’s about huge govt and who can funnel the most candy to their friends.

    BTW, did you see the percentage taken up by debt service? 4 point something. Either that’s an old chart or someone’s been lying to me.

    Since “get your govt hands off my medicare”, I think it is reasonable to think there are some on the right who have no idea where their taxes go.

  113. Tigre, it seems like your saying it can’t be slander if it’s dead wrong. Which to me, makes all slander kind of hard to stick.

    That being said, it seems like gross negligence of some sort. His life was temporarily in danger. Can you sue somebody for temporarily putting you in grave danger? By the way, gross negligence is my go to in terms of any kind of tort law talk. Sounds good.

  114. “while the government of philosopher-kings, above the law and protected by armed guardians” – BIW

    BiW, salient. This dovetailed perfectly with Nagic’s link which pointed out that Bloomberg is all about gun control until it comes to his own protection.

  115. Imagine the incredible bad luck of the spook running that insect drone program. Here you are, testing out your super secret, clandestine black ops doomsday machine, domestically even, and not only do you collide with a citizen, but you bounce off the vibrant bosom (trying to throw you a bone Mrs. P, if you’re looking over his shoulder) of the spouse of the greatest conspiracy theorist in the Western Hemisphere. I mean, what are the odds? 😉

  116. Lol. Thor, I never looked at it that way. From the fed side, it is indeed a massive coincidence. Of all the households for the test run….

  117. By the way, poolman’s reaction to last night’s shooting is text book. Man do conspiracy theorists abhor random acts of violence and chaos. Just too scary to contemplate that sometimes, father isn’t home. Better to have an evil abusive father then none at all. I swear their little fantasies make them feel safer.

  118. I did Tex but Thor isnt one of those that drinks the cool-aid…he is the cool-aid. So I tend to dismiss anything he says out of hand, even though I know he is coming in to save Rutherford and answering on his behalf. Rutherford has leaned on him for so long its pathetic. It is also why, I am sure, we have not seen much of Rutherford because I am holding him accountable for that post you made and the response Gorilla took the time to make and R ignored.

    I have noted though the Leftists on here get us to battle semantic points of little merit while very rarely getting into the meat of a question. This is how I know we are dealing with people with a nefarious intent, and of poor character. Most of us here are intelligent enough to know what is being said and asked as we kick around the intellectual football. I find it interesting that Thor, Newt, and Rutherford are almost always the ones to offer up dishonest arguments and to use underhanded tactics, while those of the Right bent almost never do. It is that way here, at fat granies, the kitchen, and every other Leftist blog I have ever been to without exception.

    I want to emphasize “without exception.” 2.5 years of blogging, and I have not found the exception to this rule. Liberalism is a disease. It is the vehicle by which those with bad intentions can use to gain control of the naive and the weak minded to manipulate and use for their own personal benefit. This HAS to be true for it to be so pervasive. This is why I have no compassion and no sympathy for the Left.

    Sorry, I don’t think the premise is valid. Its not about all government or no government. It’s not even about big govt and small. I think the Bush era confirmed that.

    This tells me either (A) you dont understand the Conservative party or (B) you do understand it and are making a misleading argument. IMO the vast majority of Conservatives are Reagan Conservatives. Bush and many of the Republicans today, including Romney, are not Reagan Conservatives. What Romney is though is a hell of a lot better choice than Obama.

  119. Nagic, Rutherford once took me to task for linking to an authored medical doctor review that neo-liberalism actually is a mental disease – well documented too. Rutherford’s response was the blog entry itself.

    Having said that, Rutherford is one of the few liberals I don’t think deranged. Rutherford’s philosophy is based on a lifetime of indoctrination from the cradle. Rutherford will jump on the MSNBC dogma bandwagon for a time, but he actually believes the dogma. He may be flippant in the denial and response, but I consider Rutherford honest. We had another “good” liberal that died tragically about two years ago cut from the same cloth.

    Rutherford avoided that last link demonstrating the profound ignorance of Obama, because he couldn’t reply to it without admitting Obama was full of it. It’s the games we play. 🙂

    Liberals hate it when you take their own words, and use it against them while laughing at them, as they really do believe they are intellectually superior. Or at least they are spending a lifetime trying to convince themselves of their superiority. About the only place I could find a measure of superiority is entertainment and perhaps the arts. That’s why they are struggling so with Obama’s monumental collapse. They really thought he was ‘The One’ and are shocked their ideas haven’t worked, and obviously won’t ever work. So they lash out, blaming lack of cooperation, lack of compromise, lack of money, tax returns, anything to avoid the most obvious reasons for their failures.

    Don’t know why. All they have to do is to look to Europe to recognize their philosophy is bankrupt – morally, spiritually, and fiscally. 😐

    I learned a long time ago, if you really want to get under a lib’s skin, you confront the illegitimacy and most importantly, laugh at them. But with Rutherford, I usually laugh with him.

  120. I swear their little fantasies make them feel safer.

    Like fear of kids drowning… Vigilant or paranoid? That is the question.

    As I have aged, I am convinced that moments realized are less coincidence and supernatural always influences the natural. Nothing is truly neutral or inert. But everything can be contained or released. The forces that underpin every action and event can be evidenced. That sense is virtually numb in our modern psyche.

    Back to water and drowning. Isn’t it a shame that we spend the first 9 months underwater and our being consists primarily of water, and yet we are like fish out of water the first few years of life? I’ll call it counterproductive culture shock treatment. Whose idea was that? Have you read or experienced some radical communities that start their kids in water from birthing and they progress swimmingly to crawling?

  121. “I find it interesting that Thor, Newt, and Rutherford are almost always the ones to offer up dishonest arguments and to use underhanded tactics, ”
    Like facts and common sense!

  122. I’m tired.

    I’ve had a pretty long day and I’m just tired.

    For those ‘don’t let a crisis go to waste’ types out there, tread lightly because I’m calling this as an Occupy-inspired event. I find it more than a little ironic that a guy does it at a theater showing a film based on an Anarchist/Occupy-like domestic terrorist event. I don’t know if this was in the news or not, but the guy painted his face to look like the Joker. I guess the lines for Guy Fawkes were too hard to free-hand in the mirror that morning. If someone sets their mind to killing lots of people, they’re gonna do it- and it isn’t hard.

    For those jumping up and down for restricting our 2nd Amendment rights, I’m curious if they hold the same for the rest of the bill of rights. I’ve heard some clowns say we should restrict even further how many guns you can buy in a month. My question is should we restrict how many books we can buy too? The typical response to that is guns kill while books don’t. Well, 6 million dead Jews would argue that point following the publication of Mein Kompf. Or how about the 150 million killed by communism/socialist along the lines of Tolstoy, Marx or Lenin.

    Of course, Holmes didn’t kill those people, somebody else did that. After all, he had a teacher and used the public roads to get there…

    Nothing pains me more than the loss of a child. There’s a lot more to this than what you might think.

    R, don’t write a post on this, you’re track record with tragedy is, well, tragic.

  123. For those jumping up and down for restricting our 2nd Amendment rights, I’m curious if they hold the same for the rest of the bill of rights.

    That’s a trick question, right?

    I mean, it isn’t like some of those same people aren’t for things like a return to the misnamed “Fairness Doctrine” and shutting down other speech they don’t like, and they’re indifferent to the free exercise of religion, UNLESS ITS THOSE STUPID CHRISTIANIST H8TERZ!!!!

    Freedom isn’t for pussies, and a carefully packed, bubble wrapped life isn’t much of a life at all.

  124. Ahhh yes. Victimhood. Why just wear it on your sleeve?

    Gorilla. See the above?

    I was thinking today what could we have done to prevent this. And we couldn’t have, unless there’s another shoe to drop about those closest to the “kid” recognizing the problem and not doing anything about it. And I’m not even sure what they (perhaps the parents) could have done about it, because the kid had no track record of any kind apparently.

    But when I read shit like this above, putting all our political differences aside for the minute with the Left, I recognize there are probably a heck of a lot more sick bastards like Toolman™ out there walking about than we would all care to admit. Too many to house, I would guess. I have no doubt Thor, and Rutherford, and the rest of the libs here would be equally devastated at the loss of a child.

    So I’m open to any suggestion as to how to prevent this from reoccurring, because I believe like medicine, law has a measure of prevention too. I have my own ideas, but I’ll guarantee you they will objectionable to the majority here.

    As to more gun control, about 30 years ago in Brooklyn I think, a lunatic burned 87 people to death with a gallon of gasoline.

    And we’re not going to be restricting gasoline anytime soon.

  125. @ Rutherford I am at the end of a long day and on the eve of a long and torturous weekend.

    There is no way one can spin this post to the level of one of your better ones. This post is above all an example of one of your whiniest and disingenuous partisan flak fests.

    Your view of Romney is isolated to the partisan hate cage you’ve got built up around you. I can type that with a straight face since I truly believe I have the moral high ground vis a vis my previous bestowments of Obama Pails upon myself.

    Bottomline just like all the Wonkette and Kos-tards out on the webs you too are guilty of cherry picking points without the full context.

    The Kennedy remark was specifically aimed at the controversial ownership of a building that was then leased to the Feds. This is a perfect example of exactly what a blind trust is supposed to avoid,especially the controversy . I find it highly unlikely the Teddy wasn’t involved somehow.On a side note I am fairly certain that the Kennedy trust $$$ which traces its roots to rum running and war profiteering was always “blind”.
    Romneys trust is relatively “young” It is unlikely it is very blind,it is managed by a friend. Its size and diversification into mutual funds more than anything offers its only real vision impairment. The trust was allegedly vetted by the states ethics commission.

    I’m absolutely beside myself with how the left is so busy at stoking classism,deny it and then going back to the well. This “controversy” is simply a new attempt after the Stericycle debacle.

    All in all you and anyone else can say I’m in the tank for Mitt I don’t care. I’m not in the Game for Mitt as much as I’m in it for America.

  126. So I’m open to any suggestion as to how to prevent this from reoccurring, because I believe like medicine, law has a measure of prevention too.

    The problem is obviously too much freedom.

    But don’t worry. The Usual Suspects™ will be along soon with another law or regulation for that. And then when the law-abiding people who are disarmed by that law that their killers didn’t give a shit about are killed next time, we’ll get…wait for it….more laws and regulations.

  127. Tex,

    The greater sickness isn’t even recognized here. Why would anyone bring their 6 year old to this movie? A midnight showing of the ‘Dark Knight Rises’ doesn’t sound like anything a 6 year old can deal with. That is the sickness, the real stench of death.

    There was a 3 month old there that was wounded and thankfully treated and released. What kind of parents are these? What draws people to these dark places in droves?

    So yeah, maybe one sicko pulled off a heinous crime. Best case, he’s a ‘lone wolf’. How many other ‘lone wolves’ has this ‘great’ society produced?

  128. Like facts and common sense!

    Newt, you were asked more than once to respond to either Tex’s post or Gorilla’s and you took a pass…nuff said.

  129. Also R @ # 99…
    That comment reveals one big thing to me. You seem to have more than a little of the taint that is the Government OVER the people as opposed to government by the People.
    It is the fundamental difference between you and me and I dare say a number of the thread folks.
    Even the biggest Keynesian wet dream projects of our past (TVA a good example) have dramatic flaws that would’ve proved fatal had it not been for the private sector.
    Seriously R you truly boggle my mind sometimes.

  130. Poolman not for nothing but the concept / nature of lone wolves is much larger point than apparent in your comment.
    Since I’m in a politically pissy mood I just have to use part of your comment…
    How many other ‘lone wolves’ has the Great Society produced?

  131. That comment reveals one big thing to me. You seem to have more than a little of the taint that is the Government OVER the people as opposed to government by the People.

    You just now noticed?

    Seriously, this is the prism through which he analyzes all political activity.

  132. Well tell me, Tool. In agreeing with you that questionable and negligent parenting has led to a complete structural breakdown of many segments of society, and no doubt a major cause of many of our problems, how is that in anyway related to the “victimization” of a segment that had 50% of its citizens eliminated 75 years ago in mass murder, and only through the intervention of the country you hate and its allies, not 100% eliminated.

    Or are you now a Holocaust denier too? Tell me that you are. It would explain a great many things for me.

  133. I’m hoping Gorilla is sleeping because my fellow squid seems convincingly beat and not in the mood to debate. So I throw this out there with the hope he reads it tommorow. That pussy attacked a Bat Man movie because he was emersed in the fantasy that he was joker. There is no politics in such insanity. Like you said, the dude was dressed up as joker. The Norwegian, Loughner, this piece of shit, they all have one thing in common. Depraved fantasies that manifest themselves online. Role playing weirdos. The internet is a crazy factory.

  134. By the way, the same parents taking their little kid to Rise of the Dark Knight are the ones that turn me into a wreck at the beach.

  135. Maybe I should start going to the beach dressed in a bat man suit, so I can flop in the water trying to save kids who I wrongly feel are in danger. That be great for the career and I’m sure would be well received.

  136. As well they should, Rabbit. We’ve got millions of multi-generation morons raising children these days still in state of arrested development. You probably meet a bunch of them at school and in the recesses of your unconscious mind, have stored recognition of how much stupidity is really out there.

    I think I just fired my electro physiologist after 25 years. I never even got a return phone call. Sat here until 7:00 PM. I’d feel a little more confident if my wife were in town. Gulp.

  137. Maybe I should start going to the beach dressed in a bat man suit…

    LOL. Bet you’d look hotter than hell. Massive chest and bird legs.

    You would make a perfect Batman! 🙂 Have enough to drink, and you might even be able to fly.

  138. Lol. You just know the off color purple tights would ever make my chicken legs look even more pathetic.

  139. The greater sickness isn’t even recognized here. Why would anyone bring their 6 year old to this movie?

    This is the USA. The point is we should have the freedom to do it, no questions asked. Certainly without a child being killed.

  140. Having said that, Rutherford is one of the few liberals I don’t think deranged. Rutherford’s philosophy is based on a lifetime of indoctrination from the cradle.

    I agree which is why I give him an especially hard time. thor and newt get dismissed, Rutherford SHOULD know better. He is capable of logical and critical thinking, but he chooses to ignore obvious truths for what I feel can only be selfish reasons.

    He can ignore the 2 things I have mentioned for as long as he likes. But unless I get banned I am going to daily remind him until he goes point by point and either shows us how we are wrong, or admits we are right. Ask fat granies, I have the ability to endure.

  141. “Sorry, I don’t think the premise is valid. Its not about all government or no government. It’s not even about big govt and small.”

    No shit? Where is the premise invalid. We’re in agreement.

  142. ” I find it interesting that Thor, Newt, and Rutherford are almost always the ones to offer up dishonest arguments and to use underhanded tactics,” – Nagic

    I read your link and countered it. That’s kind of what people do here when we’re not talking sports or music or baby shit or cigars or Scandinavia or flying or pools or the ultimate adolescent rush … blowing shit up.

  143. Certainly we have the freedom to take a 6 year old to a movie, Noah. That isn’t even the point. Just because something is legal doesn’t make it right. The movie got a PG-13 rating. Big deal. What does that even mean anymore? No explicit fornication?

    We don’t expect these things to happen anywhere in America. Mexico, yes. But they do happen here, and in increasing number.

    But a whole lot more people die from prescription drugs every day. It averages one person every five minutes in America. Admittedly, not as dramatic as this. But fully legal and state sanctioned. Talk about death panels…

    I know we try to legislate morality, even Hollywood pretends to care. But seriously you cannot foist that responsibility on others. That is what the biggest problem in America today boils down to. No one understands responsibility anymore. We gave that over to others to define and administer. How’s that working so far? I think it sucks. And it affects all of us. It isn’t a left only or right only disease.

    Even those tasked to uphold the laws are trained to look the other way in certain instances or regarding certain persons. Money trumps justice. Propaganda is even legal now. Like they really needed that justification.

    Okay, if you won’t fault this society, is it genetics? Alfie says it is the Great Society instead. Maybe. This all started to unravel awhile ago. That was certainly a double-edged sword.

    This shooter was an honor student and no idiot. Came from a good and stable family – at least that is how it appears. They were not poor folks. It was not a broken home.

    He started amassing weapons and ammunition 60 days ago. Why did he tell police his apartment was booby-trapped? They are claiming there is enough suspicious material in there to take out the entire apartment building. What was the point if not to raise the threat of terror?

    Yeah, he thought he was the Joker. How many other demons have we animated?

  144. “That being said, it seems like gross negligence of some sort. His life was temporarily in danger. Can you sue somebody for temporarily putting you in grave danger? By the way, gross negligence is my go to in terms of any kind of tort law talk. Sounds good.”

    That’s a good go to term. I do think you’re on to something, but there’s no reason it would need to be “gross” as opposed to regular negligence. Perhaps a species of invasion of privacy or perhaps a flexible interpretation of false light defamation.

    However, from a purely legal standpoint, the problem will always be the balancing of the harm to the victim against the First Amendment and fair commentary, particularly since it involves “journalism.” Just getting it wrong, even negligently, is not the standard (in an unintentional tort). ff it were, the chilling effect it would have on reporting, a near sacred right under the Constitution, is one I believe would control as a matter of law (without looking it up).

    Intentional infliction of emotional distress? Perhaps if there’s a legal substitute for “intent (scienter)” — like willful blindness or reckless disregard for the truth or gross negligence :wink:. I just don’t know off the top of my head.

    Moreover, proving appreciable damages (if not presumed under certain defamation causes referred to as “per se” defamation e.g. falsely accusing someone of a crime, sexual misconduct or something that affects their trade/profession), particularly with an unintentional tort like in a case like this, would be really hard, especially without a physical manifestation of them (something physical like puking or requiring medical/psychiatric treatment).

    That said, I don’t see a worthwhile claim. I think he would have had to act intentionally and probably with malice. I am no expert though.

    .

  145. ‘No shit? Where is the premise invalid. We’re in agreement.” – ET

    From the article Nagic linked.

    “Progressives critique the fiscal conservative/Tea Party/libertarian position by purposely misrepresenting it as anarchy. When fiscal conservatives say “We want smaller government,” progressives reply, “Oh, so you want no government?”

    This is the part I don’t think is valid. I’m not aware of these type of exchanges and Zombie offered none to back up his/her point.

  146. I don’t know what to say Numbnutz, other than you must read or get out of the house much. Watch 30 minutes of MSNBC when it comes to the Obama speech you defend. Prolific.

  147. Tigre, thanks for the explanation.

    Poolman, this is why your silly bull shit is such a smokescreen for real conspiracies. You are dead right about prescription medication. The governmemt is defacto drug dealing opiates on a level most people can’t imagine. Millions of oxycontin, paid for by the tax payer, unleashed on the streets. There is a Pulitzer Prize awaiting the motherfucker who blows the lid off on what’s going on.

  148. Rabbit,

    Conspiracies abound and always have. Human nature confirms it. Conspiracy theorists were never considered lunatics until society was able to make people see them that way. Heck, the founders were conspirators AND conspiracy theorists. I never take anything on face value anymore.

    The agenda right now, and as it has always been, is to control the people. The masses. We’re an armed populace, and that makes controlling us more difficult. It was designed that way, but they have just about convinced us to give that up protection for fear of say – nuclear terror – something these hand guns can’t defend against. If they convince enough of us, they will have succeeded in defeating us. Think domestic terrorism. Daily murders don’t scare away the guns, it’s those unknown and homegrown terrorists that are now the focus. How else can we justify policing every square inch of this nation? And the legal drones for ‘surveillance’ purposes? And the huge files compiled and analyzed illegally on each and every one of us? How do they stop the outrage when this fractional banking Ponzi scheme finally implodes?

    You heard the script. Fox claimed it. They want to pin this on the Occupy crowd. That’s how this is being nuanced. I don’t see the connection. If this were an anarchist’s act, he would have targeted a bank or institution associated with the government or 1 percent.

    This guy was ‘normal’ until 2 months ago. When did the promo for this movie start? I’m not that familiar with this series. Batman has evolved since I watched on TV as a kid. It has become a much darker character. But something was a trigger.

    From the Denver post… Corbin Dates and Jennifer Seeger were sitting in the second row of the theater when Dates saw someone in the front row answer a phone call during the opening credits and walk to the emergency door in the front of the theater.

  149. I like 70, Tex. Rutherford, mud slinging is a defense.

    The Obama campaign is defending its record by making Romneyites look like dispicable characters who don’t deserve our votes. That is their defense because it seems to be their most effective road to another term.

  150. “Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.”

    A squad leader in Vietnam gathered his troops together after a fellow was killed or wounded and told them why their “brother” messed up to turn himself into a casualty.

    The squad leader did it to to cope with the natural human desire to find reasons and explanations for significant events. He wanted to give his troops hope that if they were careful they would escape the fate of their wounded fellow soldiers.

    Until we know more, I believe this man was an isolated result of someone who snapped. People may use the tragedy for political reasons, but that doesn’t change the result.

    One difference is this man didn’t seem to want to die. Most shooters apparently do.

  151. dateline Albuquerque. Wife and I on a little business trip. On the flight out I had the privilege of sitting across and one row back from a 40-ish woman reading “The Progressive.” After a little over-the-shoulder eavesdropping, I just sat there with my mouth open. Christ, I had NO idea of the kind of foolishness in rags like that. Held my tongue, though, lest she thrash me with her big hair or kick me with her bird legs. How in the hell do people get so far outland? Can they be that far from the day-to-day problems of daily life that such stuff makes sense?

    I don’t know; I just don’t know. It seems that throughout history, whenever any country begins to really prosper, the collectivists come out of the woodwork and drag it to the left, after which it, of course, collapses.

    re: video @124. My 73 year-old brother called me to tell me about it. I think this old guy is a racist; after all, those two robbers had hoodies on, so they must be black.

    Been out of the loop for a day or two; is Rutherford OK?

  152. I’m hoping Gorilla is sleeping because my fellow squid seems convincingly beat and not in the mood to debate. So I throw this out there with the hope he reads it tommorow. That pussy attacked a Bat Man movie because he was emersed in the fantasy that he was joker. There is no politics in such insanity. Like you said, the dude was dressed up as joker. The Norwegian, Loughner, this piece of shit, they all have one thing in common. Depraved fantasies that manifest themselves online. Role playing weirdos. The internet is a crazy factory.” – DR

    Thanks DR, I got some sleep. Not good, but some. I can usually compartment the evil I deal with daily, but it really gets me when kids and innocents get hurt.

    Why do you take a 3 month old to a movie? Because in the transient society we live in, most folks don’t have family- and that is what it would usually take to watch a baby in the middle of the night- to let them get out. So you take it along and hope the movie isn’t too loud. Sometimes you don’t have many options. As for the 6 yr old, society- driven by the left- has pushed the marker for what is socially acceptable down and down for decades. Look at the language and subjects discussed on network television compared to, say, the 50’s or 60’s. The Gunsmoke’s and Beaver’s of the past, intent on passing on a lesson for life, are gone. Now it is CSI or Criminal Minds. How about How I Met Your Mother, etc. The question isn’t why would you take your 6 yr old to see Batman, it is why wouldn’t you?

    You want a change? Teach that life is precious. Teach that honestly is invaluable. Teach that the ‘right thing’- whether it was easy or hard- is ALWAYS the right thing to do. Stop glorifying thieves, thugs, and abusers. Teach responsibility. Teach respect. And most importantly, hold yourself accountable before you cast stones at others. That is how you will see these kinds of events end.

  153. Tex, if you want some real hilarity, here is an interview with one of the would-be Internet cafe robbers:

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/surveillance-vid-shows-71-year-old-concealed-carry-holder-opening-fire-on-would-be-robbers/

    The comments section is just priceless. I would love to make T-shirts of this guy, sell them online and send him the profit.

    ***********

    Wishing you good luck with your V-tach. It it is truly refractory they may want to put in an ICD. Doesn’t sound like you have any underlying coronary disease (you’re not a smoker, right?) so there are lots of good drugs that may just do the trick without any need for more aggressive stuff. Keep us posted.

    gorilla@209: great post. Right on the money.

  154. Obama views the people like a drug dealer views his clients. They both need one thing above all others- DEPENDENCY.

  155. I got a little better night’s sleep last night, Pfesser. Thanks for the wishes. It’s disconcerting to say the least when you close your eyes and wonder if you’ll be opening them again. 😦

    Feel better too. The reason I wanted the monitor is determine is it the heart, or possibly the lungs? I once had “walking pneumonia” that emulated many of the same symptoms V-tach presents. I’m trying like hell to avoid the EM – and don’t feel bad – just strange.

    I’ve been taking Verapamil for 25 years with few problems – it’s been pretty benign and hasn’t interfered with life in anyway except the occasional lightheaded moment – which may be the drug itself. Knock on wood. But I really am starting to get interested in possible RFA and get rid of this nonsense.

    You knowledgeable much on RFA and its success? I’d be interested in your input.

  156. Man, that was beautiful to see those two hoodies running for their lives, old man in chase. Surprised he didn’t go for the head shot.

    The comments were a hoot.

  157. Tex –
    My understanding is the best on the planet is at Hopkins; I believe his name is Hugh Calkins. I don’t have a good link to the Website, but it is at Johns Hopkins in Baltimore. The most common arrhythmia is A-fib and they do a lot of ablations there for that.

    My experience with ventricular arrhythmias is extremely limited and well out of date, so I can’t advise. Calkins has a huge arrhythmia practice there and it would be well worth seeing him, or at least exploring Hopkins’ site. They have quite a bit of patient information.

  158. You want a change? Teach that life is precious. Teach that honestly is invaluable. Teach that the ‘right thing’- whether it was easy or hard- is ALWAYS the right thing to do. Stop glorifying thieves, thugs, and abusers. Teach responsibility. Teach respect. And most importantly, hold yourself accountable before you cast stones at others. That is how you will see these kinds of events end.

    Very ideal. This sounds like we, collectively, need to do an about face. It is absolutely correct, and it is the complete opposite of what this country stands for today. Oh, we give it lip service, but in real day-to-day life, integrity has left the building.

    The world knows us by these Hollywood themes, by our celebrities, by our music, by our global bullying and meddling, by our drone strikes, by our haughtiness. This hasn’t been ‘driven by the left’. It’s where ‘we’ have arrived – no matter who’s been steering – be they right OR left.

    A responsible parent today is going against the flow. The very flow WE enabled and continue to support, directly and indirectly every day. You still choose to take a 6 year old to Batman. If that 6 year old is indeed precious, you forgo the movie. Parenting is about personal sacrifice and inconvenience for the greater good of that next generation. You boycott the batmans. You support community and ideals. You lead by example.

    Funny you don’t give the “Protocols” any merit. Forged or not, since their inception, they’ve been followed to a tee.

  159. Man, I was worried Tex and Rutherford were going to take a dirt nap on the same day like Jefferson and Adams. Rutherford, raspy voice rising above the sound of the hospital equipment, asking if Tex was dead yet. Tex is still standing tall. Now I need a confirmation Rutherford is okay.

  160. What’s up with the Drudge Report leaving that “why so serious” joker picture up? Talk about a gift for the killer. Drudge is giving him EXACTLY what he has been fantasizing about.

  161. Poolman, I sometimes like violent movies. I have no desire to see bat man now that this happened and agree the quality of movies have been horrible. But damn man. I don’t want to always be selling girl scout cookies. Everything in moderation.

  162. Alex Jones claims this latest shooting has all the earmarks of a CIA black ops event. I’ll wait to see what else emerges and how the MSM spins it. One of the questions right now is, how does a student collecting unemployment amass the sophisticated body armor, the weaponry, munitions, and bomb ingredients? Some have estimated 20K worth of stuff, and acquired in the past 60 days.

    I predict this will change your movie theater going experience from here on out. We’ll forget about LIBOR, Syria, and Iran for now.

  163. I prefer comedies. I have seen my share of violent movies. My daughter loves horror films. I can’t understand it. Violent scenes are everywhere today. Impossible to avoid. The problem is the fake stuff looks the same as the real anymore. Sometimes even more real looking than reality. We’ve blurred perspective.

    Everything in moderation is right. Others will WANT to see this movie now, BECAUSE of the event. It will be a cult classic. It’s a sick world, rabbit. I feel for you raising two boys in this chaos. My youngest has been trying to conceive for a year with no luck. It may be grace and mercy triumphing. I fear for all the youth who cannot compete against this raging beast we have unleashed. The developing human mind needs plenty of positive support.

  164. I’m not sure I understand why the automatic assault rifle (did he use extended clips too?) that the gunman carried is legal to own.

    Just for reference, I come down on the side of the old man in the cafe.

    But what’s the reasoning for being able to purchase and own such overpowering deadly automatic rifles?

    I’m very uneasy around legal guns in the home. I’m not opposed to it, don’t misunderstand. I’m just wiggy about it.

    Tex. You’re not allowed to check out for another 35 years, minimum. After that you can do whatever you like. Deal?

  165. I mean I’m uneasy around any guns. I’ve only held one in my hands I think twice. But it’s more irrational with me, like fear of heights. (Which I’m not).

    PS…Except I chickened out at the last minute on stepping out onto one of those new clear observatory rooms they put in the Sears Tower. I had every intention of walking right out onto it and suddenly at the last minute I couldn’t move.

    PSS…Rabbit I do the same thing with the kids near water – or any type of potential peril. I don’t know what that is. An overactive imagination or an uncommon level of common sense.

  166. “You want a change? Teach that life is precious. Teach that honestly is invaluable. Teach that the ‘right thing’- whether it was easy or hard- is ALWAYS the right thing to do. Stop glorifying thieves, thugs, and abusers. Teach responsibility. Teach respect. And most importantly, hold yourself accountable before you cast stones at others. That is how you will see these kinds of events end.” – G

    One of the best paragraphs I’ve ever read here. Well done G.

  167. Tex, you know I stopped reading your stuff weeks ago, but from what Pf said, I take it you’re having some heart problems? I hope it gets resolved in a positive fashion. Just because I despise some of your tactics and most of your politics doesn’t mean I don’t love you man. 🙂

  168. Had it my entire life (probably) and discovered in early adulthood. Probably lucky that it didn’t kill me during my athletic career (for real). I can remember many a time coming close to blacking out in college, but never did.

    Other than a bitch to diagnosis apparently because it came and went and every time I got a physical they told me I was healthy as a horse, it has really never affected me to a great degree after starting medication back in ’87. Until now – and I’m not sure it’s my heart today but my lungs.

    V-tach is the deadliest of the arrhythmias and what kills some of these athletes, Hank Gathers (congenital) and Len Elmore (cocaine induced) being two since I know you’re a college basketball fan.

    Thank you for your concern. Yeah, I love you too man, even if I disdain your approach, your dishonesty and your politics. Have a Bud on me, though I don’t care to share it with you anytime soon. 😉

  169. Tex, I am concerned about you, of everyone here I might be the only other person, who has had episodes of arrhythmia. I had Graves Disease years ago and that was the most troubling and frightening of all my symptoms. I hope your doctor gets it under control, so hang in there and get better soon.

  170. I worry about you too Tex, and I hope you stay well You too Newt or no newt.

    Heart arrhythmia runs in my family. I wore a portable moniter several times during the eighties. Once my heart nearly made me pass out during an historical society meeting, and we called a doctor. He told me to be sure someone drove me to the emergency room because though one type of arrhythmia was relatively harmless, I could suddenly drop dead with the other. It hasn’t bothered me much since I quit eating so much chocolate.

    Gorrilla’s 209 “life is precious” comment struck home a few minutes ago as we drove home on the interstate. We were just behind an accident which blocked the highway and brought several ambulances. Someone was life flighted too. You never know what will happen after you wake up in the morning.

  171. Tex, what all did you inhale while playing plumber?

    😆 Now, I hadn’t thought about that. You think maybe it was that greasy hamburger water? 🙂

    Actually, it was only 109 here Thursday when this all started and I was mowing the lawn of my ‘Muslim’ neighbor (that was for Poolman) who recently had emergency back surgery, sweating like a pig. I have noticed those few times I’ve developed bronchitis or something to that regard (may 2-3 times in my married life), it has always been summer time.

    I’m trying Rabbit to avoid the ER at all costs. I did that one time as a precaution because my wife dragged me up there, felt fine as soon as they hooked me up to oxygen and an IV, they wouldn’t let me go home after arrival, and I left 36 hours later with them telling me everything was fine. 😡 I told them, “Yeah, I told you that yesterday morning.”

    My insurance must be really good.

  172. “Tex, I’d offer a comment about your medical condition but you and Numbnutz gayed it all out.”

    😆

    (I was waiting for “I wish I knew how to quit you…”)

    ~

    Trixie? Where the Rutherford at??

  173. Thanks for your concern James, but I no longer have Graves, a radioactive cocktail took care of that problem years ago. But I really do sympathize with Tex, because I remember what it felt like, physically, mentally, and emotionally.
    What to think about Rutherford’s absence? Generally, I would say, no news is good news, but that does not seem to apply in this case.

  174. Good Golly Miss Molly, I’m about 200 comments behind!!!! You folks have been busy. I spent yesterday doing a lot of running around (getting the car emission tested, visiting the hardware store (YES) for a shelf support thingie, buying 25 feet of coax cable to resurrect my old ReplayTV) so I didn’t get much opportunity for reading comments much less answering.

    For those who don’t know, ReplayTV is to TiVo what Betamax is to VHS. Tivo wound up putting RTV out of business basically. The problem is, the box still works, but the TV listings that one subscribes to were discontinued (depending on what source you read). After much Internet research, persistence, and a lot of luck, I managed to get the damn thing up and running last night (got to bed at 3am). The machine is a good 10 years old, gets hot enough to fry an egg on, but it is still humming along.

    Because the TV listings service is no longer officially supported, every day that I get to use this machine is a blessing from the geek Gods. I used to get morning lib propaganda from Morning Joe while I ate breakfast in the living room. Now that my wife’s job has accelerated, and since the living room doubles as her office, I’ve been missing my MoJoe. Not anymore. I’ve got it set to record in my office and breakfast will return to its former splendor!!!

    Sorry for the mundane update, but there you have it.

  175. You’re welcome, Newt. I’m glad you are fine, now. I agree, about Tex’s situation.. it is unpleasant.Like everyone else, I hope Rutherford is all right.

  176. Since I’m way behind, one of you may already have mentioned this. Someone from ABC blamed the CO shooting on the Tea Party. 😆 You see? I held my fire this time and let someone else take turns being the fool.

    I’ve got some other observations about Colorado which I may save for a separate post.

  177. 1. Weekly jobless claims shot up to 386,000.
    2. Foreclosures are hitting our most vulnerable citizens.
    3. Factory activity contracted for a second month in a row.
    4. Home sales dropped a 5.4% — the biggest drop in nine months.
    5. Retail sales dropped for the third straight month.
    6. Consumer confidence dipped to 84.7.
    7. U.S. business inventories increased by .3%…
    8. …sales dropped .1%.
    9. Food staples are skyrocketing, due in large part to ethanol subsidies of corn.
    10. More Americans are getting federal disability than jobs.

    Excellent list Tex and I couldn’t agree with you more. What constructive statement has Mitt Romney made about these problems in the past two weeks? Not a damn one.

    Please save your selective outrage. Neither candidate is offering anything that inspires hope for a better tomorrow, It’s the most trivial juvenile election we’ve witnessed in our lifetime.

  178. Rutherford, I had never heard of a ReplayTV. Ever. But I’ve got a cool Panasonic DVD recorder that will transfer to about anything that used to record by TV listing which was really cool. Then our feckless government mandated a change to digital, and all of the sudden, the damn thing didn’t work! 😡 Nobody from the manufacturer, to the cable company, to TV Guide can tell me why either.

    Now, so that you don’t continue to expose your profound ignorance, Mitt Romney addressed everyone of those points. Every one. I got the list from a Romney propaganda site. 🙂

    So that you may familiarize yourself with Mitt’s Plan, I hope you’ve got the time to peruse through all 87 pages, some quite detailed about how Romney plans to go forward repairing Obama’s massive economy and fiduciary failures.

    When you get the chance, give me Bomba’s equivalent, will you?

    http://www.mittromney.com/sites/default/files/shared/BelieveInAmerica-PlanForJobsAndEconomicGrowth-Full.pdf

  179. By the way. I put the heart to the test. Ran on the back patio where the Mick sleeps, fans a going, 91.9 degrees, 3.8 miles in 33 minutes including cool down (Mick’s window air conditioner is on the other side of the patio). That’s a fairly slow pace for me, but that’s pretty damn hot too and no problems. YEAH!!!

    Has to be the lungs…still would have been nice to have received the monitor. Now I’ve got to find a new cardiologist. 😡

  180. Rutherford has seemed to forget that Obama is president RIGHT NOW. Fuck campaign talk. Or for that matter the campaign. Dude. We were sold a complete lemon when it comes to the stimulus. A very costly one. I don’t get your logic. One canidate is a proven failure, by said candidate’s own bench marks. Dude has squandered thousands of my son’s quid for a bill of goods never delivered. And I’m supposed to stay home because the other guy might be a turd? I got shit on my shoe right now!

  181. Tex, do you have asthma?

    I’ve always thought that a possibility, Muffy. My mother does.

    But if I do, it’s certainly not severe. I tell you true, for as much as I’ve run over the years, I really should be a much better runner than I am. I run for my head as much as my heart.

    I ran a few 5Ks at about a 23:00 pace as a younger man – but that’s about as far as I care to go. I don’t think I could do a 15K, and certainly not a half marathon.

  182. @ Tex …If you experience worse episodes when your pulmonary is challenged couldn’t that mean your foci is less simple? Peeked my curiosity.
    I think I’d say finding the physician that would evaluate with a leaning towards ablation might be in order. Is it safe to assume you’ve fortunately have never needed cardioversion or even Adenosine Rx/tx?

  183. That’s some serious running Tex. Yea, I miss the benefits – head and body. Stupid achilles.

    I have asthma, not too severe. A few years ago I started taking a beta blocker as a preventative for migraines. It made me feel very weird sometimes, like my chest was constricting. My doctor told me that beta blocker BP meds make asthma worse somehow (not always though). Maybe Verapamil does too.

  184. And then when the law-abiding people who are disarmed by that law that their killers didn’t give a shit about are killed next time, we’ll get…wait for it….more laws and regulations.

    BiW doesn’t even recognize when he’s full of shiite. In response to 9/11 we got the Patriot Act and airport flunkies crawling up your ass. Bush was President at the time. How much were you screaming loss of freedoms then? Crickets.

    Brady bill enacted when your GOP Prez got shot.

    Puhleeze!

  185. That’s a valid point, R. America was freaked out, as was Congress. I’m not saying I’m against the Patriot Act. I’m admitting I’m pretty ignorant to exactly how it empowers the governmemt. And that alone says a lot. I think there are many like me. Any conservative that says the nuts and bolts of the Patriot Act was properly vetted is lying. The discussion was never had by enough of us.

  186. The Patriot Act was written and standing by ready for a ‘new Pearl Harbor’ moment. That’s how it was able to be rushed through during the time when we were all in shock. The first WTC attack in 93 did not scare us enough to enact it. Not enough death and destruction. Poor, or inadequate planning, apparently. And the act is FAR from patriotic. Fucking doublespeak world! It takes away freedoms and gives the executive more war powers. You should read up on it. It keeps getting renewed while they put more legislation in place to control us.

  187. @258 Rutherford are you on freaking crack????

    First of all the quote you’ve included doesn’t strike a partisan bias,it states the universal truth found time and time again in the US of A. An incident occurs,the cameras roll,the politicians respond with kneejerk reflex populism and what BiW stated happens to the letter. Your Brady bill closer is proof you know it to be true.
    You didn’t know me until 2007…. can you point to a time I was all rah rah rah over the Patriot Act? From 2001 on I was very vocal in the real world about the inane nature of much of it.

    @ dr #259 I’d say many conservatives were represented via a spectrum of folks who stressed certain points. For example both pol and pundit alike pressed for the Israeli style profiling methods as opposed to the ham fisted TSA stuff we have now. Libertarians were pretty vocal all along the board to my recollection.
    The Patriot Act stands as testimony to what evil populism can and has done in American history. Aspects of the Spanish American War,the execution of the Nisei executive order and many a New Deal program,and Jim Crow are just a few other examples.

  188. I laid down a challenge to the board if they truly believe big corporations are as bureaucratic and inept as our government.

    Bureaucratic absolutely. As inept, definitely sometimes. As a corporate veteran Tex, you know this to be true.

  189. By the way, any further comments in this thread that continue to distort the “you didn’t build that” quote will be ignored by me. I went to great lengths (including bold facing for the English impaired) to put the comment in context (see comment 99). Those of you who continue to push the lie of Romney’s interpretation (and Fox’s interpretation) will get crickets from me. You’re showing yourselves to either be stupid or deceitful. You might as well just keep linking to birther articles.

  190. Ann Romney DID NOT say it.

    It’s a tough call. I played the video a few times and I thought I heard a “y” sound but I couldn’t swear to it. There is a distinct possibility that “you people” referred to the media and quite frankly I understand any political wife being pissed at the media.

  191. Barack Obama, like every President before him, opens up his entire college transcript history

    Abraham Lincoln did not graduate from college. 😉 If you want to go more recent, Harry Truman didn’t graduate from college either.

    And you know what, there was a time when asking such stupid questions of the most powerful man in the world was considered undignified. Nowadays there is no such thing as dignity.

    But “like every President before him” again shows you to be a fool Tex.

    Here’s some free advice:
    Drop the birther crap.
    Drop the transcript crap.
    Drop the Harvard Law Review articles crap.
    In fact, drop the entire ridiculous meme of the stealth Muslim who was sold to America with a false biography crap.

    You supposedly don’t like the way the man has run the country. Stick to that and let’s see how far that gets you in November. If you focus on it NOW and stay focused on it, your piss poor idea of solution (Romney) might just win the day.

  192. Ann sounded as if she was starting to say “you” but she didn’t finish. It came across as “y”, and it was so brief one could miss it.

    Yes, I think James captured what happened precisely. There was definitely a “y” sound … she probably thought better of it just as the word was coming out of her mouth.

    I’m not ready to demonize Ann Romney. So far she seems to be a gracious woman and while I might be biased, I salute her courage for dealing with a potentially crippling disability. Until she really tears her drawers, I’m not going to attack her. Hell, maybe her hobby of horse dancing can teach us a thing or two? I never heard of it until this campaign.

  193. Again, I’m still far behind on comments so if this has already been broached, forgive me.

    Has the board heard about one of the Colorado victims? She was at a mall in Canada just about five weeks ago when some psycho opened fire at the food court. She escaped with her life, and later blogged about how precious every day is.

    “The Joker” killed her on Friday. 😦

  194. My brother claims therapy would do no good since my anxiety stems from a rational premise.

    They say a psychiatrist’s most difficult patient is the paranoid schizophrenic who really DOES have someone out to get him.

  195. That’s why I hated that Zimmerman interview. God’s plan?

    I can’t believe I’m vouching for Zimmerman but the way Hannity justified that quote the next night was to say that Z felt that God saved his life. Tex, if you truly believe this was self defense then doesn’t Z have a point to give thanks to God that he was able to defend himself? (I’m not f*cking with you …. I really want to know whether you agree with Hannity’s take on it.)

    On a side note, now that I have my ReplayTV up and running in my office again, how bout I use it to record Fox every night? Give me that “balanced” view I’ve been missing? Problem is honestly, I don’t have time to watch it.

  196. My very wise wife said something to me yesterday that Roger Ebert subsequently confirmed.

    If you want to get a fictional account that accurately predicts the Colorado tragedy, rent the film “We Need to Talk About Kevin”. It’s about a sick f*ck who was sick from birth and things do NOT end well. What is most striking is that in the film the mother knows her kid is a mess while everyone else is in denial.

    Fast forward to reality — Holmes’ mother upon learning about the tragedy told ABC “they’ve got the right man” referring to her son. Makes your hair stand on end.

  197. R I have read your #90 3 times and don’t get it.

    My 90 became 91 because of approving some moderated posts.

    Tigre, let me try again using marriage as an example.

    You meet a girl whom you really dig. She tells you all the stuff you want to hear. You marry her and then she changes her tune on just about everything.

    You want a divorce and you’ve met a new girl who interests you. But your buddies tell you that this new girl has a history of changing her tune on just about everything. Do you marry the new girl knowing IN ADVANCE that she’s just like the old girl?

    You could be forgiven for the first marriage cos she didn’t flip on you until after the ink was dry. But in the second case, you already know what you’re getting into.

    You do it anyway?

  198. Dim Patron Saint Bill Clinton called his resume sterling in both creating jobs and wealth.Wrong, you’ve taken poetic license. Bill called Romney’s resume sterling but did NOT elaborate on why. YOU inserted the “creating jobs” thingie.

    Nice try.

  199. clearly vote for the more qualified wealth creator, which you yourself have admitted it’s about the economy?

    You’re on fire brother Tex when it comes to semantic distortion. Romney is a qualified wealth creator for the wealthy. He has no track record of moving the poor to the middle class or the middle class to the rich. None. And contrary to your trickle down theories, plutocracies don’t eliminate poverty.

  200. He has no track record of moving the poor to the middle class or the middle class to the rich.

    And your Messiah does? In what way is Hussein superior to Romney in wealth creation of any kind? Note, campaign fundraising does not count.

  201. Divorce? Stick with the hag or married or the other is your only option. “I know the hag I’m married to sucks and the one I might trade her for could suck too” was your point? No wonder re-read it didn’t help. That’s mighty dumb.

  202. And yesterday, Mitt was basically giving Obama’s speech, how no one succeeds without others’ help. Got to love politics!

    Newt, it’s even worse than that. He castigated Obama and then agreed with him within the same damn speech!

    I feel so bad for Romney. The man is a moderate. The Romney of the 90’s and early 00′ was the real Romney … a moderate, a compromiser. Now he’s faking “severe conservative” and he comes off looking like a big joke. I wish he had the courage to be himself but he wants the nomination and the job too badly.

  203. George Zimmerman would have saved the day had he been in that theater.Bull pucky. Someone acting in self defense does not correlate to someone acting heroic on someone else’s behalf.

    Colorado has very lax gun laws from what I understand. There’s a good chance someone in that theater was carrying and did nothing. Furthermore, Holmes was in body armor … dude even had his neck protected.

    Keep enjoying your wild west fantasies Rabbit.

  204. Tigre your dude shooting at the robbers was VERY lucky. Since he didn’t hurt them even enough to keep them down, it was his luck that they were scared sh*tless and fled. Had they been for real, they would have shot back and killed your “hero”.

    Join Rabbit for a beer while you trade wild west fantasies. 🙂

  205. This guy turned himself over to the police. Think Breznik. This was no one lunatic operation. Too much symbolism here.

    Poolman I love you in a pool construction sort of way, but WTF are you talking about?????? ❓

  206. Hey Tex … if you croak make sure your wife knows in advance to get on this blog and tell us. My wife already has instructions.

    Funny thing … I have a touch of tachycardia too. I get up to 130 sometimes. It scares some doctors sometimes but I don’t give a f*ck. I consider it my heart’s normal reaction to exertion with insufficient oxygen.

    In the hospital last week, I looked up at the heart monitor and saw a reading of 77 and I swore I must be dying. My heart almost never slows down that much.

  207. You wanna hear a sick society. I heard that some folks are “friending” every James Holmes they can find on Facebook. All these psycho killers get a fan base.

    Who knows … maybe we do need more religion. 😐

  208. Because in the transient society we live in, most folks don’t have family- and that is what it would usually take to watch a baby in the middle of the night- to let them get out.

    Lousy excuse. If you have to … then miss the f*cking movie. It’s a goddam movie. WTF are we talking about here? How bout seeing the film during the day like normal f*ckers do???? How about going when folks are not dressed up like super heroes acting like 10 year old children?

    One reason this nutjob was not immediately noticed was that others were in “costume”.

    If you can’t find a babysitter at midnight …. MISS THE F*CKING MOVIE!!!!!

    Damn …. this pisses me off! 😡

  209. Actually, more then one person would probably been needed with a conceal permit to bring Joker down. I’ve thought about it more and considering how disjointed I am when I’m actually in a movie theater once a year, along with the gas, dark, confusion, surprize and gun fire, I doubt I could have done jack shit if I was strapped.

  210. I remember my wife took my son to Harry Potter when he was like 3 momths during a matinee. Babies can sleep through anything. You don’t know the situation. Now, takimg a 6 year old is a total different story. Breaks my heart a 6 year old died.

  211. Report downplays Islamic role in Fort Hood jihadi attack

    A forensic psychologist (at least I think that was her title) who has written extensively about serial killers and mass murderers said on TV Friday that most mass murderers are simply psychotic. They throw in a political agenda after the fact to further justify what was primarily just an apolitical evil urge.

    She said specifically (and I cracked up when she said it) that Nidal was thinking “I just want to kill a bunch of my mates … oh yeah and by the way, I’ll throw in an alahu akbar while I’m at it”).

    Maybe tomorrow I’ll try to dig up her interview and post it here. She was funny as hell and very down to earth about these psychos. Not rocket science, and not a damn thing we can do to stop them 99% of the time.

  212. Alphie, I’m sure the pumdits hashed out the ups and downs of the Patriot Act. Hell, I’m sure guys like you and BiC did too. But, the rest of us normal dummies didn’t. Amd when it comes down to it, we’re all that matters

  213. Rabbit I commend you for your honesty in 289.

    Thor, thanks for the greeting. Sorry to have slightly worried some of you but things just got busy. I’m now about 60 comments behind (made a lot of progress tonight). I’m going to bed.

    I don’t know how active I’ll be tomorrow because tomorrow is the last day I can take the sociology final so I have to do some last minute cramming and then take the test. Will eat up a lot of my afternoon.

  214. Man, I was worried Tex and Rutherford were going to take a dirt nap on the same day like Jefferson and Adams.

    LOL

    Rutherford’s last words: “Tex Taylor lives.” 🙂

  215. Bull shit about Fort Hood pusy. He was a Muslim and in direct contact with Al Queda leadership. Keep dishing out the BO shit, R. Your boyfriend president down played it and, years later, here you are telling us an arab terrorist screaming Alluha Akbar while killing servicemen who was also in direct comtact with Al Queda wasn’t an Islamic terrorist. You get played for such a fool.

  216. I’m not sure I understand why the automatic assault rifle (did he use extended clips too?) that the gunman carried is legal to own.

    Congress let the assault weapon gun sale ban expire. All hail the NRA. 😐

  217. I know the hag I’m married to sucks and the one I might trade her for could will suck tooFixed it for you.

    You’ve just provided another example where plain English eludes you. Thanks for saving me the trouble of digging back into history. 😉

  218. Drop the birther crap.

    And you accuse me of taking poetic license? When have I become a birther? When was I ever a birther?

    But the transcripts are a different matter. You, that’s you RUTHERFORD, told us in 2008, 2009, and part of 2010 just how intelligent one Barack Obama is. How marvelously qualified. Then the other night you compared shoeshine’s speeches in 2008 to JFK on BIC’s blog – another knee slapper of a joke.

    Now we all know better that Barack Obama neither intelligent or talented and simply a very mastered political marketing program with teleprompted speeches; But you’ve never been able to bring yourself to admit that fact.

    So, since you puds from the Left (the same ones so stupid to not realize job creation is wealth creation for the middle class, not just the rich) are making demands of Romney’s taxes from literally decades ago, I want Barack Obama properly vetted this time. That includes his tax returns during community activist, his wife’s made up hospital job, Michelle Obama’s dubious academic and work history which will demonstrate she’s nothing but an affirmation action hack handed jobs that did nothing, etc…

    Because all of this will clearly show the Obamas liars from the start and a carefully orchestrated, decades long plan that just happened to get lucky enough to run against both a weak candidate and a bubble of government’s own making – mostly Dimocratic making.

    And it will also demonstrate, if we really need it demonstrated, just how hopelessly gullible, naive and duplicitous you are in political calculation.

  219. Mr. Rutherford, here is one reason I am serious and not just pulling your strings when I say Obama isn’t just a failure – he’s a jackbooted thug. This kind of crap has been going on for quite sometime.

    It’s an egregious use of power and more proof if we needed it, it’s a lie that Obama is a “nice guy.” No, he’s a fascist as are virtually his entire cabinet and inner circle of self-serving henchmen and women. Valerie Jarrett is bad news all the way around. Time to start vetting her sorry ass too.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444464304577537233908744496.html?mod=ITP_opinion_0

  220. Hey, I see that MSNBC’s new motto is “Lean Forward.” Now I get what Tigre was talking about the other day.

    Looks to me like Rutherford’s prized station has “leaned forward” so far, they toppled right into the bottom of the rankings abyss – right behind E! News last I looked. 😆

    How about “Failed Upward” for a motto instead, Rutherford?

  221. Rutherford, I agree with your comments about Ann Romney as a person, and also “Y”. I also didn’t know her horsemanship was akin to physical therapy.

    Zimmerman or anyone else could have been a hero had he done this: count the interval of silence as Holmes reloaded and also the duration of shooting. The average number of seconds would have to be long enough to allow a would-be hero to crawl toward Holms without being noticed. Most likely, he would have to crawl under the seats and hope shot or hiding movie goers would not be obstructions.

    Then, he would have to sneak behind Holmes and wait for the next reloading. As he was distracted, Hero Zimmerman would rush Holmes and either strangle him or sharply pull back and break his neck. He could also run at him fast enough to knock him to the floor.

    Holme’s body armor, size and strength, and his reflexes are unknown. Most likely, Zimmerman would have been praised as a dead hero, as one dead man in the Omaha Von Maurer shootings was praised. Anyone could conceive such a simple strategy.

    No heroics for me. I would have used the lulls to flee.

  222. “I’m not sure I understand why the automatic assault rifle (did he use extended clips too?) that the gunman carried is legal to own.”

    Did he have an automatic? I thought he had a semi-auto, which is of course legal to own. “Assault rifle” is a term the MSM uses to denote semi-autos that have a certain military look. As for rate of fire, etc, there are perfectly legal “sport” – read that hunting – guns which will do the same job. They just don’t look military so I guess they aren’t as scary.

  223. I agree with Tex. Obama is a fascist surrounded by fascists. Hot Air tells us Argentine President Cristina Fernandez made an other speech criticsing the media and political opponents for spreading doom and gloom stories.

    She named one of her chief critics in a speech and said he would be audited.

    Obama has an enemies list. ? VanderSloot, an Idaho businessman was listed on an Obama campaign website after he donated to the Romney campaign.

    Soon, a Democratic researcher revealed VanderShoot’s divorce records. A few days after that, the IRS told him he was being audited. Then, the Department of Labor announced it was auditing employees of his Idaho cattle ranch.

    As the writer for Hot Air noted, “not a good trend at all.”

    Obama could be a nice man. I don’t know. Al Capone was a nice man according to his brother who was sherrif across the river from our home.A few people who met him without knowing who he was agreed. He also treated his employees well.

    I mention Al Capone to illustrate the connection between Chicago politicians and the Mob. Frank Nitty took Saul Alinsky under his wing and taught him what he needed to know about life.

    Obama and many other Chicago politicians are the offspring of a marriage of professional criminals and sixties Marixism.

  224. @289 Don’t underestimate yourself. It takes only one bullet, center mass, and he is down forever. Think Trayvon. I have my Dad’s .38 special with hollowpoints. That is all the gun you need.

  225. Another fact about Affirmative Acton Michele is her job with a Chicago hospital while Obama was a state senator. After Michele left the hospital did not hire a replacement and ended the job description.

    How did Obama afford a trip to Pakistan and other nations around 1980 when he was allegedly poor?

  226. R, you forget – or ignore- the other part of my comment. The FBI told me on Friday that they classify all mass casualty events as acts of terror until proven otherwise. The Ft. Hood shooting was never classified as a terrorist attack. The Administration and the DOJ immediately classified it as a case of work place violence.

    As for intent, you’re letting your selective memory run a muck again. Hassan has stated that he intent in killing the soldiers was to protect Muslims. He was sympathetic to AQ ideology and while he had corresponded with Anwar al-Alauqi, he did not coordinate the shooting with him. He apparently did read the AQAP online magazine Inspire, which promotes jihad and provides ideas on ways and means to conduct attacks.

    Hassan clearly did this in the pursuit of jihad. Terrorism.

  227. As for the movies, I’m not disagreeing, I wouldn’t take my baby to the show nor my 8 yr old for that matter. But people do, and did, so…

  228. @ Rutherford good luck on your exam.
    Niceties out of the way I have to now say put down the crack pipe or whatever substance& paraphernalia combo you have going and wake up!

    Romney is a qualified wealth creator for the wealthy. He has no track record of moving the poor to the middle class or the middle class to the rich. None. And contrary to your trickle down theories, plutocracies don’t eliminate poverty.

    This statement can be taken a lot of ways and be the centerpiece for a serious discussion, by all means let me know if you want to go there. It must be said though that one could go to a Domino’s, a Staples, the Sealy Corp. and a number of other places and ask the employees if they’re paying their bills,catching a movie,getting it done. What am I to compare the to? A GM line worker? You can see where this has interesting potential dripping off of it.
    Perhaps we should ask the unemployed or the welfare recipients or better still go back to those earlier stated work places and ask them how they’re doing & any awareness of regulatory issues on their checks?
    Bottomline throughout his life Mitt Romney has done more to help people of every economic level than BHO. FACT FACT FACT AND COMMON SENSE.

  229. I think some folks are missing the nuances of the psycho-society influenced shit bag ala Aurora,Norway,VT etc….
    Ultimately intwined within their crazy is the delusions of grandeur that society has proven will be bestowed. One also witnesses that even with deep psychological issues the very human trait of self preservation via cowardice is at work. Of course many of these types turn themselves in. It is the same mechanism that they choose their targets by. Movie goers in a gun free zone to student retreat

  230. Alfie,

    I think Rutherford has adopted the BO axiom of economics – better to be unemployed and drawing food stamps or other government assistance if the wage isn’t a comfortable living wage.

  231. Pretty obvious at least a reasonably large number of our society have decided notoriety life’s highest calling – no matter how infamous, stupid, vulgar, and/or deadly. Sounds like this Holmes kid was certainly seeking attention after being isolated. I would guess the disappointment of not obtaining work in part pushed him over the brink – he didn’t know how to handle rejection and disappointment apparently.

    It gets back to Gorilla’s true message and the fact that once there are no clearly delineated right and wrongs, it’s almost impossible to develop a sense of shame. Almost everything can be excused in the name of celebrity.

    I surmise these folks that daily view ‘The View’, take a subscription to People Magazine, hang on Oprah and worse, or Hollywood, cheer the vulgarity of skanks like Kathy Griffin and Lindsay Lohan – never recognize that indirectly, they are contributing a huge net negative to our country.

  232. I guess I am still wondering what the legal non-military use of a semi-automatic weapon is then.

    PF if you’re suggesting that hunting is the intended use for a weapon that fires so many bullets in quick succession, then I guess I’m just having trouble picturing it.

    If the answer is to even the playing field on the illegal machine gun owners, well, I guess that makes a little more sense. Still, exchanging weapons of that magnitude might ought to to be made terribly difficult and costly perhaps.

    I heard but still don’t know for sure if the guns used in the massacre were all legal. I did hear, as referenced by Alfie, that there was a ban on all guns in the theatre and the law abiding citizens – which exclues Holmes – were sitting ducks.

  233. @ Muffy PF talked on it. “semi-auto” is kind of misnomer and brings forth a vision of something this class of firearm is not. The bottom line clear cut definition of semi-auto is that your weapon “self loads” a single bullet into the chamber every time you squeeze off a round. Prior to this there were rifles with clips but the shooter needed to be the action for the bolt/reload.So in the hunt/sport arena there are legitimate (many debate this) reasons for the action permitted by semi auto.
    You do have a valid point regard clips though. I am personally pro-semi auto but have a leaning that civilians need absolutely no more than a 20 round clip.

  234. It’s astonishing how no one touches the horse trading of powers that goes on in Chicago and that now seems to have infected the white house, thanks in part to a little bitty slip of a woman named Valerie. (Actually I have no idea if she’s petite, but I’m drawing a picture here.)

    But Blago went to prison, so it looks like this stuff is still illegal in this country. Whew.

    I feel a rant coming on. Apologies in advance.

    Valerie Jarrett worked for Harold Washington and was Mayor Daley’s deputy chief of staff, am I right? And as such she was appointed to the board of the UIC Medical Center, among other similar well-paying appointments. Michele and Jarrett reportedly met when Michele applied for a job at Daley’s office, the two women hit it off, and Michele arranged a dinner for Jarrett to meet her husband, Barack.

    Michele was selected for a position at UIC (where, recall, Jarrett served on the board). A position that did not exist before Michele assumed it and has not existed since she left. Mrs. Obama’s salary peaked at some $315K before dropping to $120K when she went down to part time to join her husband on the campaign trail. Nice work if you can get it.

    Now we pay Jarrett $172K? a year to advise the president to push for the Olympics and hire friends like 9/11 truther? Van Jones. She and Robert Gibbs reportedly clashed over Michele’s (alledged)displeasure with Gibbs, and whispers of Jarrett’s growing mistrust of Raum started circulating long before he left the white house and went on to become the Mayer of the windy city.

    Jarrett has been referred to in the past as a “slumlord,” and the feds did intervene when she ran Habitat Co. (subsidized low income housing projects). She had ties to Rezko (yes, Rutherford, that again). During the Blago trial it was reported that at the time a prominent Chicago union leader received a call from the soon to be former junior senator from Chicago suggesting (not recommending, you understand) that Jarrett would be a good fit for the vacated senate seat. Blago was reportedly interested in an HHS post in exchange for the seat going to Jarrett. It’s illegal for a president to interfere with an election or assignment, but of course allegations of election fraud by people who look like Barack will not be prosecuted in the future.

    Now maybe some of that isn’t true. I’ll grant you that the senate seat swap was a complete debacle and everyone pointed the finger at each other. Nevertheless. It smells like stinking fish heads here.

    And “you people” want to talk about dancing horses and whether Mitt is paying his fair share, and how the men that father our children and stick hate women and want sick kids to die quickly. I know I’m leaving something out. Oh yeah, we’re all racists. How could I forget that?

    So you want to stay with the woman that cheats because you somehow know that the next woman that comes along promising you a sweet life will break your heart too.

    Well it just boggles the mind.

  235. Muffy, that was no rant. Rants imply a lack of focus. That was a lazer beam smoldering on Rutherford’s buttocks.

  236. I agree, Muffy. Nice job of documenting who and how the surrounding of Obama. Virtually everyone of them are dirty, but this criminal Valarie Jarrett appears to have gotten a free pass in her personal profiteering. I think she needs some personal vetting too. 😉

    Getting back to Romney and his success turning the 2002 Salt Lake Olympics around, I’ve been meaning to ask a question to Rutherford and Thor. They both have marginalized the accomplishment because Romney took part of the billion plus allocated by our federal gov’t toward the Olympics.

    Most of that was used for infrastructure and mass transit. I believe Obama called those ‘shovel ready’ jobs, of which Romney spent less than 1% of Obama’s stimulus allotment – and showed a profit in doing so.

    So why is Romney’s turn around of the Olympics with federal monies of no worth, but Obama spending $862,000,000,000 or more than 1000% more than Romney allocated for supposed ‘shovel ready’ jobs which did nothing in the way of job creation or wealth, not loudly condemned by you two?

  237. Alfie, you have brought up a good topic for discussion. I cannot see any way to compare Romney and Obama regarding the current economic situation. Rutherford, neither man has a track record of moving the poor to the middle class or the middle class to the rich.

    Ask the general populace about their economic situation during the Bush years and they will say on the whole the economy was good although it was a fallacy built on the concept of credit. Obama with no experience inherited the house of cards built on credit and when the economic foundation washed away during the tsunami was no more effective than Bush during Katrina.

    As Gorilla pointed out running a campaign does not equate to running a country. Maybe running a capitalist venture like Bain and the state of Mass, gives Romney a leg up in running a country.

    I don’t know if Romney is the answer but the questions are not being answered under the current administration, are they?

    Good rant, Muffy.

  238. Raji,

    I have given this some thought and I can not calculate objectively one positive quality that Obama possesses or has demonstrated that I believe superior to what Romney has to offer – not one, except perhaps picking an NCAA bracket.

    I don’t even think charisma applies, because over half the country doesn’t find anything charismatic about Obama after getting a taste of his leadership and many of us never did to begin with. And even if we consider the delivery of a prepared speech, charismatic doesn’t necessarily equate to effective leader and in fact as history has recorded all too often, an immoral and/or narcissistic charismatic leader can be incredibly dangerous.

    One thing you said I would take issue with. I actually believe Bush, even with the cost of the Iraq War, good or bad still to be determined, had a pretty decent governmental approach for free enterprise business climate until they begin approval and implementation of ‘Medicare D’. Sarbanes Oxley was the only thing I would take issue with from 2001-2007. It’s a joke and outrageously unnecessary government boondoggle as is Dodd-Frank.

    It’s estimated we would have shown a $100 billion deficit in 2006 and small surplus in 2007, even with the advent of 9/11.

    The financial meltdown I believe unfairly applied to just George Bush, as that years in the making and both parties guilty of negligence.

  239. Gorilla, #311 was the best 5 of any and all minutes I’ve spent pondering the massacre in the theatre.

    My brother’s oldest boy works at the Marcus theatre in my hometown and he was working BTKR yesterday. It troubled me on and off throughout the day, not for fear that he was in danger so much as that he could have been.

    Anyway I really loved that piece and it set me rightsideup today. Thanks.

  240. I almost am starting to think we are lucky asshole chose to use a semi automatic rife. The thing jammed, as they always do. Imagine if he went with his varoius assortment of bombs and incinerated the theater?

  241. Thanks, I’m glad you enjoyed it as much as I.

    I think it fits with my earlier comment on preventing these kinds of events as well.

  242. The thing jammed, as they always do. Imagine if he went with his varoius assortment of bombs and incinerated the theater?

    Which is why I have written a letter to our great & benevolent overseer Michael Bloomberg demanding that as we limit our size of soft drinks and indoctrinate the public with zero tolerance for guns, we’ve got to put severe restrictions on fire and any flammable material, including movie popcorn and alcohol. We might be able to substitute Omega 3 fish oil instead of canola for cooking the popcorn.

    What do you think about mandated body armor and Kevlar helmets to attend a movie, and substituting non flammable greens like raw spinach for artery clogging candy? No watermelon, apple or orange sales in the lobby though, as they could be used as weapons.

    /Sarc off

    I’m almost scared to even mention, as some tin foiled lib head might form a committee to study the community benefits of my proposal.

  243. That was a good “I built it video” I also liked Muffy’s description of the merger of crime and Marxism in Chicago and the other comments.

    I am growing to hate, not Obama but the news people and voters who put him into office. That is an unhealthy attitude.

    The AP reports that the poverty rate may rise to greater than since the mid 1960’s. Maybe that will get their attention, but I doubt. Obama’s honeyed words will sooth them.

  244. Tex @333
    You may be doing a “scarf off” but my first thought was what security measures are now going to be implemented in theaters because of this massacre.

  245. Raji
    Look at the laws passed in California over the past 10-20 years. We are seeing the end result from these kind of whacked out judges.

  246. muffy opined:
    “PF if you’re suggesting that hunting is the intended use for a weapon that fires so many bullets in quick succession, then I guess I’m just having trouble picturing it.
    If the answer is to even the playing field on the illegal machine gun owners, well, I guess that makes a little more sense. Still, exchanging weapons of that magnitude might ought to to be made terribly difficult and costly perhaps.”

    I’m suggesting no such thing. I am saying that there are already extant many “sport” (usually used for hunting) models of high-powered rifles that are semi-automatic and will do exactly what an “assault weapon” will do; there is NO practical difference; they just LOOK different.

    As for the reason I or anyone else might give for owning a military-style rifle, I don’t need a reason. My Constitution says I have the RIGHT; if I choose to share my reasons, that’s MY call. (I do not.)

  247. This might tarnish a PR campaign and at least cost mo money to play down, since associations are oh, so important. Another pockmark to fill.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/us-election/9413564/US-Election-2012-Mitt-Romney-fortune-built-with-help-from-Robert-Maxwell-and-Jack-Lyons.html

    I thought this was an interesting quote, if true.

    Another British former colleague described him as “bloodless”. He added: “He was the sort of person that you would admire rather than like, and I think that continues to bedevil his political career.”

  248. Tex, that video made my week. So sexy. So unafraid to be sexy. Femininity, yet powerful as hell with the the self confidence of Mohammed Ali. Did I say sexy. Damn do I love sexy women. I’m off to watch it a 5th time.

  249. @320.

    Reason or force. That’s it? Every human interaction is one or the other. No love? No trust? No empathy? No cooperation? No faith?What a sad way to look at life.

    I wonder, when one shoots one’s self in the head, do they have to reason with their finger to squeeze, of force their finger to squeeze?

  250. Reason or force. That’s it? Every human interaction is one or the other. No love? No trust? No empathy? No cooperation? No faith?What a sad way to look at life.

    Go to an OWS rally in Oakland. Would you show any of those or be armed, or be smart and not go at all?

  251. Love, empathy, trust etc. are certainly driving forces. But, they come from within. The actions we take as a result of those would be our choices. And, just maybe, an armed citizenry would deter (or stop) some dumb ass from doing something horrible because of faith or love and remain reasonable. Persuading people to convert to Islam. Persuading the ex wife to come back…not kill her new boyfriend. I get what you are saying, but ultimatly, I still see all relationships based on the author’s dichotomy. Hell, isn’t the most disgusting relationships between a husband and a wife based on force? Come on Thor. You just now “persuaded” your wife to allow you to pee standing up. You know where I coming from.

  252. CSCO Aug 18’12 Call Strike 17 bucks. .35 cents. Its been a while since I’ve passed out some treats. Enjoy.

  253. Thor, are you an advocate of the UN and their imposed gun laws? They say Obama is going to sign it. I think it is a shame that guns are so prevalent in this world. America is probably the biggest blame for popularizing and marketing guns. As kids we got indoctrinated. We make them a part of tv and movies. They kill some 30,000 of us yearly. Water takes a tenth of that. This global governing is not for me. I’m not gonna be a pimple on the ass of this beast.

    Registering or removing guns isn’t going to remove the criminals that will be armed. It’s the state that has been criminal by removing of our rights and transferring the nation’s wealth. At this point it only an inventory list, showing the globalist information collectors, aka evil empire, what kind of arsenal they may be up against. Even then, they could still mess up.

    Let Brother Nathanael set you koolaid drinkers straight.

  254. Poolman,

    I just knew the U.N. mandate had to be the fault of the Jewish cabal somehow (slaps head).

    Has the disconnect that the U.N. always votes again Zion and “Brother Nathanael”‘s conclusion that Zion will be the enforcer ever cross wires in that “outstanding” mind of yours? 🙄

    Tool™, you desperately need to search out Neo and take the red pill.

  255. Hey Rutherford. You still winking and batting your eye lashes at Poolman? My man thinks Obama and Hillary were behind the bat man shooting. Vile and disgusting, no?

  256. Rabbit & Pfesser,

    I don’t know what it is about that little hip swivel thingy that women can do with their hips, but for real red blooded men like us, it’s like a Reese’s peanut butter cup to a rat – absolutely irresistible. I was absolutely mesmerized watching those hips with the cute grin… 😀

    I like fun women. My wife is a fun woman – usually, Mrs. Taylor is pretty reserved. But put on some dancing music with a beat? Watching Mrs. Taylor line dance last weekend and still be able to shake that little booty of hers brought back some of life’s greatest memories! For a split second, I was a 20 something again. Then we got home and I asked her to do it in a teddy, and I was cast forth to the ghost of Christmas pasts and relegated to my rocker. 😈

  257. Nagic,

    It is truly sickening the low standards or no standards that Obama is held to by the same groupies and cult members of the Dimocratic party that called George Bush a war criminal and murderer – no matter the quiet works in Africa by Bush.

    And I’ll bet you those same outraged AIDS activists will still be filling in the circle for Obama come November.

    The “AFRICAN” Americans who vote lock step for Obama? Hypocrites by their own standards of supposed moral judgment. No different than their contradiction of biblical tenets vis-a-vis Obama political expediency pledges.

    Race trumping moral and principle. And these preachers keep telling us it’s all about poverty? No, the deceit precedes the poverty.

  258. Well now I’m 90 comments behind. 😯

    Sociology final was a major PITA. Here is an example of 51 year old mental retardation. One of the questions had a four part answer. It was the same damn question that I nailed on the midterm. Today however, I blanked on one of the four parts. So get this … a question I could answer three weeks ago had me by the short hairs today.

    This is why, all due respect to Brother Tex, no middle aged man should be returning to school. The neurons just don’t fire like they used to. 😦

  259. I ended my weekend by committing hare kare over at BiW’s place. In objecting to his latest post I explicitly challenged his parenting advice and of course bought myself a world of hurt. I’ve now got a sh*tstorm coming down on me over there. Well I hope the host won’t permanently hold it against me. I thought his advice to his son (the subject of the post) sucked but I really didn’t want to offend him in the process.

    Time for bed.

  260. Ah, don’t sweat the final Rutherford. Get this…true story.

    I told you I had to take a leave of absence my first semester of medical school? My mother got sick and my youngest daughter was still living at home and not adjusting really well to me getting home at 8:00 or 9:00 at night. We really started jeopardizing the relationship because I would come home to dirty dishes or something like that and a fight would soon follow.

    I took exactly one test my first go around in 2008 – biochemistry which I was pretty good at because I had a fabulous instructor in undergraduate that taught at the med school level. I actually aced my first med school test, one of only three in the class to do it I later found out – med school went downhill after that. 😦

    So I drop out. They accept my excuse and let me back into the college in 2009.

    I come back the next year, tested over the same material, different test but same content – exact same content with the test segment actually about worth about 10 points more than the previous year.

    I get a fricking 85 on the test – about the class average! 😡 Don’t ask me. I couldn’t figure it out either. But like forgetting to put the plumbing together the other day, I could only figure my hippocampus was declining rapidly in ability to consolidate memories.

    That or I just didn’t give a hoot anymore.

  261. I agree with VDH. I don’t want to hear anything more about James Holmes, other than he has been found guilty. Expunge his name from the news. Rabbit made a very legitimate point about Drudge.

    …For months to come after his trial there will be a “new” revelation in the case—an interview, a testimonial from a former friend, a novel twist about the evidence. The net effect is that we will know more about the killer and his crime, and each day ever less about his victims.

    Tonight, I wish to know nothing about him other than the information necessary to try, convict, and punish him—and any data that might provide some sort of deterrence in preventing another such rampage.

    In comparison to those he killed and maimed, and the legions of their relatives and friends, he is nothing. We the sophisticated with university degrees are supposed to know better: that hanging such a nightmarish criminal when convicted is both barbaric on our part and offers no statistical evidence that it will deter future such killers.

    Perhaps. But society needs to be affirmed with a certainty that it has the clear sense of evil and good to try, convict, and punish the killer. Hanging Saddam or Eichmann, for all the controversies over their trials, at least offered some finality: they were evil and now are no more—and now we don’t worry whether Saddam was unloved, or the circumstances of Eichmann’s childhood.

    In other words, I don’t care a whit whether the Aurora killer was a loner. I don’t care if he was unhappy or if he was on medication. Millions share such pathologies without killing a mouse. I don’t even know whether giving him swift justice will deter the next mass shooter. Yes, give the suspect expert legal counsel; call in all the psychiatrists imaginable; sequester the jury; ensure the judge is a pillar of jurisprudence; but if he is found guilty, I would prefer the gallows and quickly so, to remind us that we live in a civilization that prefers to remember the victims and to remember nothing at all of their killer.

    http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-demons-of-the-modern-rampage-killer/

  262. “I ended my weekend by committing hare kare over at BiW’s place.”

    Since you tracked it back here, I don’t mind saying that you deserve every kick in the nuts you get. That was simply the dumbest shit I have ever read. Smug and offensive.

    Why do you give yourself license after tragedies like this to puff up, wag your finger, blame, and pontificate about the virtues of vulnerability and weakness? Seriously. Every damn time. Does your sociology course give you an answer?

  263. Rutherford 360 just in case you don’t see my comments there I’ll say this much here.
    You can’t possibly believe that BiW parenting lesson lives in a vacuum. Don’t txt and drive,don’t comment when tired.

  264. This Syrian thing sure seems to be spinning out of control with talk of chemical weapons and the like.

    I’m no prophet, but if you’re a Christian you should find one thing eye opening.

    Around 700 BC, Isaiah prophesied that in the fullness of time, Damascus, the Syrian capital, would cease to be a city and become a ruinous and useless heap of rubble. 😯

    If I’m not mistaken, Damascus along with Jericho are believed to be the two oldest continually inhabited – estimated to be between 8,000 to 10,000 years.

    In Isaiah 17:1–3 “Behold, Damascus will cease from being a city. And it will be a ruinous heap. The cities of Aroer are forsaken. They will be for flocks which lie down and no one will make them afraid. The fortress also will cease from Ephraim, the kingdom from Damascus, and the remnant of Syria. They will be as the glory of the children of Israel.”

  265. These folks controlling us can’t come up with anything new. The bogus ‘chemical weapons’ threat has reared its ugly head, this time in Syria. We know the next scene now by heart. I’ve seen that movie too.

    And how about this?

    The tragedy that played out in an Aurora movie theater Friday was ironically paralleled as a classroom learning experience in a medical school in Parker the same day.

    http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_21126462/real-life-shooting-imitates-training-exercise-at-parker

    Yeah, ironic. 🙄 Where have we seen this ‘irony’ before? Hmmmm…

  266. Yes Poolman, we have seen this irony or coincidence before. In 1989 an air liner with failed hydraulics made a crash landing at Sioux City. The procedures used to save some of the lives was studied afterward, and it may still be used for training.

    Fortutiously, the air port and other authorities had just finished drills for such a crash.

    The man air flighted from a serious wreck we saw on the interstate on Friday died.

  267. Tex@358:

    The cognitive dissonance is staggering. If Asians are our-represented in top schools vis a vis blacks by 5%, it’s racism. If blacks out-represent their race in prison, it’s …. well, racism.

    If 95% of blacks say they are going to vote for Obama, it’s …. what?

    Crickets. Couldn’t be racism, because blacks are incapable of that.

  268. I believe there is a city older than Jericoh or Damascus. It may date back 12,000 years, but it no longer exists.

    Obama seems ready to enter another war in Syria without consulting with Congress. Libya and Egypt succeeded so well, we might as well enter another war.

  269. I knew Rutherford had to be making an ass of himself somewhere. Calling BiC out as a bad parent was rich. That being said, compared to the lunacy, the dangerous scape goating and blatent attempt to stifle the expression that we saw last big shooting, he’s improving.

  270. I’m no prophet, but if you’re a Christian you should find one thing eye opening.

    One thing? You forget the more important thing. Satan is conducting the orchestra. It’s his arrangement. Know your enemy and quit listening to the prophets of Baal. Wake up church!

  271. Poolman, not sure if that was directed at me or at churches, but I always found this reasoning sound:

    The church is like manure. Spread it around, and it will give life, make things grow, and produce fruit. Keep it all piled up in one place, and it stinks to high heaven! ~ Luis Palau

    I assume this is what you were referring?

  272. James,

    I believe there is a city older than Jericoh or Damascus. It may date back 12,000 years, but it no longer exists.

    I’m sure you’re right. I’m sure they (Damascus and Jericho) weren’t the first – just the ones still around that have been continuously inhabited. There’s probably others. I remember Beirut is also considered ancient.

    It’s weird to think I walk around Boston and think, “Oh, look how old that building is. 😆 Then you look over to Europe and you think, “Wow, the Coliseum is almost 2,000 years old!”

    But if you look to Persia and the Middle East, they predate Western Civilization by thousands of years. I predict in the near future with all of this cool new technology, they are going to make some mind blowing archeological findings. Already starting to happen here and there – but with all the fraud, they have to spend years just verifying the authenticity.

    I don’t know what is going to happen in Damascus, but if my intuition is right, it ain’t good. 😦

  273. Cognitive dissonance indeed, my good doctor. And it’s staggering to me it doesn’t get called by anybody in the media. Virtually all of them are cowards.

    I decided a couple of years ago, I can deal with being called racist more than I can deal with being called a coward. So I started to speak out about the double standards. Trust me – my frustration isn’t just directed at blacks either.

    My own sister caught my wrath some years back, and it was a while that my “Baptist preacher” sister held me in good graces again. But I reminded her when she escaped with her life from a maniac, who like last Friday, a nut drove down a highway shooting people randomly and she explained,

    “God was with us…”, I asked her did that mean that God wasn’t with the victims?

    Christians need to be real careful in holding judgment. I detest the “God’s plan” stuff. Frankly, it weakens the witness of Christianity in my book and I told her so. Made her mad at me too. 😐

  274. PF, I had a different type of weapon in mind when I “opined.” Hopefully that’ll teach me.

    Splendid time eavesdropping over at BIWs.

  275. Tex, thanks for the link to Romney’s 87 page plan. I’ve bookmarked it for future analysis but a quick perusal shows two things:

    A good 50% of it is Obama bashing.

    The other 50% will not be read my most voters. At Bain, Romney never read 87 page findings … he read executive summaries … that’s why they’re written in the first place.

    Romney needs to give the American public an executive summary that they can digest easily.

  276. I put the heart to the test.So let me get this straight, you were afraid you might have a heart attack and your response was to put it to the test?

    I’m with Rabbit …. I wish you’d gotten your ass to an ER. You won’t die of a heart attack my friend, you’ll die of hubris.

  277. And I’m supposed to stay home because the other guy might be a turd? I got shit on my shoe right now!

    I just think you’ve got one lousy choice. The dude who did cheat on you verses the dude who will cheat on you.

    We need better choices. It’s one reason I wanted to see Obama primaried. I’ve pretty much determined that my vote for Obama in November will not be a vote for the man but a vote against a conservative ideology that I abhor.

  278. Note to Noah. If you were watching carefully you’ll notice I DID edit 386 because I failed to put Rabbit’s quote in a blockquote.

    Hope that’s alright with you. 😉

  279. So I take it you refuse to address either Gorilla’s rebuttal on the Whittle video or

    I’m still mulling over G’s rebuttal. As for the “you didn’t build that” … no I refuse to discuss that further. You and yours are being willfully ignorant about what was said and I’m not wasting my time arguing with a lamp post.

  280. R, your liberal idealogy was put to the test. You controled the House, Senate and Presidency. Your legislation was passed and man was it expensive. And, it failed. Big time. Epic fail. Losers deserve to lose. Sadly, with half country on welfare and millions of people who have jobs like me, but unlike me, do not understand where their pay check comes from, I don’t know how you can lose the election. Global collapse and defualt are the only way to stop your parasitical idealogy of spending money we don’t have while allowing Nanny to shove productive people around.

  281. In what way is Hussein superior to Romney in wealth creation of any kind?

    Jordan’s King Hussein died in 1999 so I don’t know who you’re talking about.

    Now if we’re discussing Barack Obama, I think you have a valid point. Obama has not done much at all to relieve poverty in this country. So flip a coin …Obama more of the same …. Romney, more of the same.

  282. This from Poolman’s Oslo tragedy link:

    While there is no doubt he carried out the attacks, the five Oslo court judges must decide if the 33-year-old should be considered criminally sane and sentenced to prison, as requested by his defence, or instead follow the prosecution’s line and send him to a closed psychiatric ward.

    Am I the only one who finds this counter-intuitive? Why would the defense want him imprisoned vs hospitalized?

  283. Breaks my heart a 6 year old died.

    I wish I had paid better attention to this comment. I completely forgot that I had read it, and when I saw the six year old’s picture on TV a day or so later I was completely unprepared and cried like a baby.

    But you know the worst thing? I watched the dude at his court appearance today and I just couldn’t hate him. He seemed so f*cking vacant like there was no one in there. I know there’s a chance he’s faking insanity. Time will tell. I can’t say I felt sorry for him … I didn’t know what to feel. He looked bewildered almost like “WTF did I do? How did I wind up here?”

    Just about every part of the body can go south but when the mind goes, that is serious trouble.

  284. I’m with Rabbit …. I wish you’d gotten your ass to an ER. You won’t die of a heart attack my friend, you’ll die of hubris.

    😆 Hubris indeed! And stupidity! 😆

    Well, by the time I had pretty much determined it may not be my heart and was obviously fairly confident of it. You also have to understand my body like I do. I have found over the years, though this sounds counter intuitive and it may not hold for everyone – with V-tach, a racing heart actually responds to exercise induced stress better than relaxation.

    It’s like the endorphins of exercise seem to be antagonistic to whatever set the problem in motion to begin with, or perhaps the stress regulates the nodes that drive the impulse and upon cool down, kind of “reboots” for lack of a better term. Strange as that may seem, stressing the heart to a “degree” seems to reestablish homeostasis.

    But then again, maybe it was arrogance and stupidity. 😉

    Look at the bright side. If Romney should win, you still get your $100.00 because Thor will have to pay you and you will have one less Romney voter. Ironically, you only lose if Obama should win and I should keel before the results tabulated.

  285. Some stats to consider:
    Gun Homicides in 2008:
    Japan 11
    England/Wales 38
    Germany 171
    Canada 196
    United States 9,484
    Brazil 34,678

    Source: United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime

    BTW, most gun deaths in the United States are suicides.

    Move along …. nothing to see here. 🙄

  286. BTW, most gun deaths in the United States are suicides.

    If you’re all for a woman’s “right to choose” (to snuff her own child), then why should it matter to you if someone uses a gun instead of pills, or drain cleaner, or a razor blade to commit suicide? Isn’t it all just retroactive abortion anyway?

    What does the UN say about stabbing homicides in those same countries, R?

  287. Rabbit, maybe the case with Nidal Hassan was overstated but Pat Brown, criminal profiler, says a lot of psychos justify their act after the fact when they really had no political motive. She does mention Hassan. Maybe she’s wrong on that one. One might argue his psychosis contributed to his affinity to radical Islam?

    See the 5:07 mark:

    http://video.msnbc.msn.com/the-cycle/48262749

  288. Rutherford @360. Since you mentioned your comment over here from BiW’s, I felt I could reply on your blog.

    I actually commend BiW for the intelligent discussion he had with his 12 year old son. Rather than pontificate his beliefs, he walked his son through his thought processes and allowed the child to form his own opinion.

    As to your other comments at BiW’s, there is no SOLUTION and there is no SAFE place. You would not allow your young daughter to be alone in a movie theater, a shopping mall or a park. because you know she’s not safe. We train our children today to be aware of their surroundings.

    Take away the guns and some other form of destruction will replace them. Holmes could just as easily used a bomb rather than fire a semi-automatic.

    FYI, competitive rifle sports are as much a part of American culture as say “Mom’s apple pie”. Guns aren’t just for wounding and killing.

  289. Everyone should read this. From one of the people in the theater.

    God is always good.

    Man is not.

    I love how we attribute the good to God and the bad to man. While I am glad that Marie survived this ordeal, I can’t bear to read her entire piece. God is NOT good when he lets a man’s mind deform to the point that he kills a six year old. God is NOT good when a woman survives a mall shooting only to be killed weeks later in a theater.

    If smoking the religious opium brings comfort at this difficult time, so be it. I’m having NONE of it. 👿

  290. PF if you’re suggesting that hunting is the intended use for a weapon that fires so many bullets in quick succession, then I guess I’m just having trouble picturing it.

    Muffy you’re being waaaaaaaaay too kind. There is ZERO reason to have a rapid fire gun (semi-automatic … who gives a f*ck .. it fires lots of bullets real fast) to kill animals.

    PF knowingly or not is a shill for the NRA and the gun lobby.

    I’ll tell you what I want to see next. I want to get beyond this second amendment debate and get down to the brass tacks that I suspect really underlie the whole problem ….. GREEN …. MONEY!!! There are big bucks in guns and I’m beginning to think THAT is at the root of our gun problem in this country.

  291. Muffy you’re being waaaaaaaaay too kind. There is ZERO reason to have a rapid fire gun (semi-automatic … who gives a f*ck .. it fires lots of bullets real fast) to kill animals.

    Its also a handy way to discourage tyrants from being tyrants…we don’t all love them and marvel at the crease of their trouser, R.

  292. So you want to stay with the woman that cheats because you somehow know that the next woman that comes along promising you a sweet life will break your heart too.

    Ideally Muffy one could go solo and dump the cheater AND not get caught up with the future cheater. Unfortunately it doesn’t work that way. We have a very narrow choice to make. To use another analogy, I’d suggest the devil you know is better than the one you don’t.

    As for Valerie Jarret, I don’t have the greatest impression of her personally but to get all balled up over Michelle getting a newly created position … c’mon. MOST folks get work through contacts. That is reality. It’s also why I had to resort to self-employment because I was piss poor at forming a network when I had the chance.

  293. From Rabbit’s article about the civilization of the gun:

    When I carry a gun, you cannot deal with me by force. You have to use reason and try to persuade me, because I have a way to negate your threat or employment of force.

    Wrong. I draw quicker than you do and I aim better than you do, You’re dead.

    End of story.

  294. Tex the Fed money Romney received for the Olympics matters only in that Romney condemns federal subsidizing of all sorts of things. The fed is too powerful and wasteful with money, remember?

    You know what? At the time John McCain condemned the money that went to the Olympics as pure pork belly for Salt Lake City.

    Why didn’t Romney who cares so much about government spending tell the fed to keep its money while he raised the necessary funds via the almighty private sector? 🙄

  295. The thing jammed, as they always do.

    According to the know-nothing media the gun jammed because the 100 round drum attached to it was not entirely compatible with that model of gun.

    Remind me again why an average citizen needs to purchase a 100 round drum?

  296. I’m noticing an odd turn in tone in some of the GOP ads … almost conciliatory. “He tried, you tried, it’s time for a change.” So compassionate. Obama did his best but just couldn’t cut it.

    Well I guess it beats attack ads.

  297. What a sad place the Left has taken this country. We are now protecting the rapist from the person they raped….

    You are so tiresome. For starters, what does this have to do with left/right? Absolutely nothing.

    Second, she violated a gag order. If you wanna get pissed, get pissed that the gag order was imposed in the first place. But once it was imposed, she was obligated to follow it.

    And of course as usual we will ignore the elephant in the room. I guess her liberal parents never taught her not to drink until she passed out.

  298. Regarding Poolman’s video — ROTFLMAO!!! It took Nathaniel a full minute and a half to diss the Jews. As I watched the first minute I wondered “when will the old bearded anti-Semite get around to blaming the Jews?” And then at 1:31 he goes there.

    Ahhhh I’ve figured it all out.

    Tex hates gun control.
    Jews love gun control (according to Brother Nathaniel)
    Therefore Tex hates Jews.

    Another revelation from Poolman!!!!

    Damn as I read this thread it gets whackier and whackier every minute.

  299. You still winking and batting your eye lashes at Poolman?

    Poolman expects the black helicopters any minute now. Sorry Rabbit I don’t lose any sleep when the Poolman goes off on one of his conspiracy trips.

  300. I could only figure my hippocampus was declining rapidly in ability to consolidate memories.

    Damn, you nailed that one. I sat there yesterday KNOWING the answer was in my head somewhere .. f*ck … I’d not only given the right answer 3 weeks ago but I peer graded six exams and had the answer reenforced over and over again. Yet try as I might, I just couldn’t pull it from anywhere. I tried going through the alphabet to see if I could stumble upon a keyword that would spark me. Nothing.

    After I submitted the exam, I went back and read the midterm and while I realized I would simply never have come up with it (brain lock), I recognized the answer as soon as I saw it.

    Depressed the hell out of me. 😦

  301. ”As for Valerie Jarret, I don’t have the greatest impression of her personally but to get all balled up over Michelle getting a newly created position … c’mon. MOST folks get work through contacts. That is reality. It’s also why I had to resort to self-employment because I was piss poor at forming a network when I had the chance.”

    On the contrary, Rutherford. Many folks do not get work that way, and the ones that do are too often the biggest mistakes. Moreover, my comment isn’t strictly about Michele’s cooked up position. It’s about insular cronyism. Grift. The practice of which skews a person’s sense of accomplishment, fair play, an equal playing field, and the American Dream.

    It isn’t right.

  302. Hey Rutherford, did you like your job? I mean did you really feel good about the thing in life that took up a large chunk of your time on the planet?

  303. Tex the first post you’ve given by Victor Davis Hanson that I can pretty much agree with.

    I still reject the death penalty on principle and I strongly suspect its uneven administration but damn some folks need a needle.

  304. Why do you give yourself license after tragedies like this to puff up

    Are you senile? I REACTED to BiW puffing up after a tragedy like this. If you’re so interested in folks not playing politics in the wake of a tragedy, tell it to BiW.

    Hypocrite.

  305. God is NOT good when he lets a man’s mind deform to the point that he kills a six year old. God is NOT good when a woman survives a mall shooting only to be killed weeks later in a theater.

    Is God good when He allows a man like Obama to become President to ruin our country by spending it into debt it can’t possibly repay? Or is God good to allow a black man to become President in the first place?

    Romans 13:1

    Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.

    You can tie yourself in knots trying to somehow implicate God in the doing of great evil, Rutherford. A paradox isn’t? A deity you reject then and only then acknowledged when wronged.

    Today, the prayer vigils around Aurora, CO, sang Amazing Grace. Are you familiar with its lyrics?

    Amazing Grace, how sweet the sound,
    That saved a wretch like me.
    I once was lost but now am found,
    Was blind, but now I see.

    T’was Grace that taught my heart to fear.
    And Grace, my fears relieved.
    How precious did that Grace appear
    The hour I first believed.

    Through many dangers, toils and snares
    I have already come;
    ‘Tis Grace that brought me safe thus far
    and Grace will lead me home.

    The Lord has promised good to me.
    His word my hope secures.
    He will my shield and portion be,
    As long as life endures.

    Yea, when this flesh and heart shall fail,
    And mortal life shall cease,
    I shall possess within the veil,
    A life of joy and peace.

    When we’ve been here ten thousand years
    Bright shining as the sun.
    We’ve no less days to sing God’s praise
    Than when we’ve first begun.

    Is there some understanding you have of God that surpasses the victims and their families? Because while you condemn, the real victims seek His comfort.

    Perhaps you should point the fingers where the blame really belongs? How about a society that tempts our young with the most “holy” of virtues called notoriety? Or finds its highest calling entertainment? Or makes reprobates like Bill Maher and Rachel Maddow celebrity? Bet you’ve never considered what is first required is a bit of self introspection?

    The philosophy you have adopted can’t hold God to blame for anything, Rutherford. Since you acknowledge no power, it is non sequitur to therefore cast blame.

  306. Obama seems ready to enter another war in Syria without consulting with Congress.

    Where did you get that idea? McCain just gave Obama a tongue lashing the other day for doing nothing about Syria.

  307. Are you senile? I REACTED to BiW puffing up after a tragedy like this. If you’re so interested in folks not playing politics in the wake of a tragedy, tell it to BiW.

    An honest conversation with my kid is “playing politics”? Talking to him about current events, and pointing out the blind spots in the arguments of the gun-fearing wussies is playing politics, but the predictable as a train schedule calls for more laws that restrict freedom, and Constitutional rights, and that will do nothing to deter criminals determined to do bad things is NOT political?

    Oh. OK.

  308. Rutherford, play anywhere you like, as long as you like, I’ll still holding you accountable for Gorilla’s post and Tex’s link.

    Your vigilance, Noah, is heroic. 🙄

  309. Global collapse and defualt are the only way to stop your parasitical idealogy of spending money we don’t have

    I do have to share a chuckle. I heard on the news today that the DNC and Obama’s campaign are spending more money on ads than they’re taking in. And I thought … “sounds like our government.” 😉

  310. he walked his son through his thought processes and allowed the child to form his own opinion.

    I guess that is where I differ. I saw clear indoctrination. But I was wrong to attack BiW’s parenting vs the general theme of the post. I had trouble separating one from the other and I also allowed my fire-tongue to get the best of me.

  311. Its also a handy way to discourage tyrants from being tyrants…we don’t all love them and marvel at the crease of their trouser, R.

    Oh thank you for going there BiW. Allow me to crush this fantasy with one blow … a comment I heard over the weekend which I will paraphrase:

    If folks really attach the second amendment to protection from tyranny then they better start buying surface to air missiles.

    In other words, all your sorry ass guns don’t amount to squat if the Pentagon decides your ass is grass. Contrary to fantasy, the citizenry can’t even come close to fighting a truly belligerent American government.

    Keep dreaming if it makes you happy.

    P.S, The great irony is that you and yours favor funding the very entity that could wipe you out in an instant of political lunacy.

  312. It’s about insular cronyism. Grift. The practice of which skews a person’s sense of accomplishment, fair play, an equal playing field, and the American Dream.

    I completely agree.

  313. Hey Rutherford, did you like your job? I mean did you really feel good about the thing in life that took up a large chunk of your time on the planet?

    At times yes, at times no. My love of job and company peaked around 1999 (I started there in 1983). The corp divorce happened in 2007.

    It’s funny that you talk about “time on the planet”. My wife has been saying “you love that blog, why don’t you find a way to make some money with it?” Damned if I know how. Still I have the hope that before I shake off this mortal coil I will eventually get paid to do something I love.

  314. Unless someone is there who witnesses it and draws faster than you…D’oh!!!

    LOL that means three of us with guns …. and then you wonder why I fear the wild west.

  315. Remind me again why an average citizen needs to purchase a 100 round drum?

    Because when the Department of freaking Education serves a warrant on your home at dawn by breaking down your door and scaring the shit out of you and tramatizing your kids, a 9mm Springfield X-D with 10 rounds or a shotgun doesn’t quiite say “FUCK YOU!” with the right inflection.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/blogpost/post/education-department-swat-team-raids-california-home/2011/06/08/AGUxlKMH_blog.html

  316. no I refuse to discuss that further. You and yours are being willfully ignorant about what was said and I’m not wasting my time arguing with a lamp post.

    Why not? First off it is not you and yours. It is a well put together logical argument against it. All the BS has been put aside, and you have been presented an argument that most of us feel represents what we think. Now if it is above your pay grade, admit your ignorance and move on. I suspect it is more to the point it is you cannot admit we are right. I can think of no good excuse why you should dodge this other than your obvious character flaws.

    http://pjmedia.com/zombie/2012/07/18/the-ultimate-takedown-of-obamas-you-didnt-build-that-speech/?singlepage=true

  317. Still I have the hope that before I shake off this mortal coil I will eventually get paid to do something I love.

    I loves building water vessels. As long as I can make a living around water, I’m a happy camper. 😀

  318. Shit, the government would find it’s self in a guerilla war that would make the IED infested roads of Iraq or the jungles of Nam a walk in the park. Don’t know if this is true but I heard the USSR sent spies to Michigan to observe hunting season. They went home shocked when they learned how many swinging dicks were not only armed but with full knowledge of the wilderness. An invasion impossible. As for your draw contest, there is only one way to find out who’s quickest on the draw. I’d rather arm wrestle or play chess.

  319. Now if we’re discussing Barack Obama, I think you have a valid point. Obama has not done much at all to relieve poverty in this country. So flip a coin …Obama more of the same …. Romney, more of the same.

    If he is the same (and he is not) then why can’t you vote for him?

    Muffy you’re being waaaaaaaaay too kind. There is ZERO reason to have a rapid fire gun (semi-automatic … who gives a f*ck .. it fires lots of bullets real fast) to kill animals.

    But there is to own one for one’s own protection.

    You are so tiresome. For starters, what does this have to do with left/right? Absolutely nothing.

    Watch the news on legislation and judicial rulings in California. Stretch your mind a little kiddo you might come up with these on your own.

    Noah, I think if anything might drive R to buy a gun, it’d be you.

    I could never get a bullet through Noah’s force field of righteousness.

    More to the point I think you have enjoyed the affirmative action slide on things a bit to long. I could give a dam what color you are and will give you no quarter because of it. You want to fall down and take the easy way out, I’ll happily past your ass to the wall for it. You want to step up and argue equitably, I will tone it down and listen to what you have to say.

    In other words, all your sorry ass guns don’t amount to squat if the Pentagon decides your ass is grass. Contrary to fantasy, the citizenry can’t even come close to fighting a truly belligerent American government.

    Keep dreaming if it makes you happy.

    True but it is better than taking you approach. Sticking your ass up in the air and saying, thank you sir can I have another. Better to go down fighting dignity in tact. (google dignity, I am sure you have no clue)

  320. Second time poster here. I wonder why Nagic can’t seem to make a point without insulting the host. I was especially surprised when he went so far on the last thread as to say that the host shouldn’t comment on his own blog. Something really off with that person. But then I’ve never had much use for bullies.

  321. actually, I just thought of an old Irish expression that Nagic reminds me of: Empty barrels make the most noise.

  322. I dont recall ever asking Rutherford not to comment. Just the opposite, it is like pulling teeth sometime to get him to respond at all. Emily, feel free to address me directly if you have a problem with me.

  323. Rutherford I’m looking for you to offer some kind of firm clarification re your stance on guns. Call me thick but from my seat you’re all over the place.Let me think aloud…
    1. You have a definite fear of guns.
    2. You seem to like the idea of near total control measures.
    3.Your feelings regards the finality of gunshots seems to be a big deal for you. Do you believe that a world without guns would actually be less violent?
    Give me something will ya?

  324. The passive-aggressive blog is over at fat grannies Emily. I think you will find it to your liking. I am quite certain Emily is Cynthia, her writing style I would recognize anywhere.

  325. You folks fail to see the Saturn effect that went down in Aurora on 7/20, or 20/7 as others see it. Armor up! This war ain’t carnal.

  326. @ Rutherford #432. I sincerely disagree.with the entire premise you’ve put forth there.
    A few of many reasons….
    The ultimate exercise of the 2nd if it ever needed to occur would not be against the Pentagon.
    Many folks under the umbrella that is the Pentagon would likely side with the citizenry in said event.
    Contrary to the rhetoric that abounds the ultimate ex/2 would not necessarily be against the federal government.
    The culture of the gun (I didn’t read the earlier linked article) that pervades America is one of a handful of things that does indeed make up our culture. Guns and cars instills and fuels that inner spirit that is uniquely American.

  327. In other words, all your sorry ass guns don’t amount to squat if the Pentagon decides your ass is grass. Contrary to fantasy, the citizenry can’t even come close to fighting a truly belligerent American government.

    Tell it to the British Government…they fought the IRA for how many years?

  328. Nope, Nagic. I don’t know Fat Granny. And you definitely did pronounce Rutherford unworthy of commenting on his own blog. Apparently because he didn’t answer your demands to your satisfaction. Of course, why would the host of a blog need to concern himself with some poster’s demands? Just silly.

  329. I withdraw my earlier question about semi-automatics in case that wasn’t clear from my last reply to PF.

    I also regret getting caught up in the gun control issue. Someone mentioned suicide and I realized that the number of suicides of people under the influence of drugs and/or alcohol wasn’t terribly relevant to the legality of either the gun or the substance.

  330. “If you’re all for a woman’s “right to choose” (to snuff her own child), then why should it matter to you if someone uses a gun instead of pills, or drain cleaner, or a razor blade to commit suicide? Isn’t it all just retroactive abortion anyway?”

    No.

  331. “PF knowingly or not is a shill for the NRA and the gun lobby.”

    Knowingly. (Or, alternatively, I just happen to agree with them. I guess that makes them – my association – a shill for ME.

    Oh, I forgot. That’s their job.

  332. “Second time poster here. I wonder why Nagic can’t seem to make a point without insulting the host. I was especially surprised when he went so far on the last thread as to say that the host shouldn’t comment on his own blog. ”

    Just speaking for myself: I have respect for R’s integrity and think it commendable that a man not only allows, but promotes people’s expressing points of view that are diametrically opposed to his – in his own house, I might add.

    But even if Rutherford were a first-class turd, I think there are still limits to how you treat a man in his own home. Although I agree with Noah at least twice as often as I do R, I – like you – still find his treatment of Rutherford IN his own home to be substandard.

  333. Hey! Good news! The P.A. from the electro physiologist’s office called and said they can hook me up with a monitor!

    81 fricking hours after I requested one.

    I told them, “No thanks…your about 75 hours too late when the abnormality was possibly presenting itself. Good thing I made it, huh?” 🙄

    This is about the quality of customer service I’ve come to expect from virtually every organization in America anymore.

    And we wonder why we are trouble as a country?

  334. Except Rutherford is the mirror image of Nagic at BIC’s blog. So I guess all is fair in love and war.

    The one thing that I always loved most about Rutherford is that not only does he let me drink in his bar with free admission and sometimes play bouncer, but after I’m done with the free drinks, he doesn’t even mind me heaving my empty bottle at the patrons, including the bartender. 😀

    Got love a guy like that.

  335. I’m probably the only one that believes this in the nation besides Penn State fans, mainly because I’m not emotional about the issue, but I think the NCAA Committee is the one that needs to be put on the death penalty. Those clowns are more corrupt than our politicians and have been for many years. You talk about political correctness and double standards in judgment.

    What just happened to Penn State University is bullshit. The administration, Joe Pa, and definitely Sandusky should be punished, and the latter will be I predict. The names should be tarnished. Anybody that was involved in that sordid affair should get whacked and their names shamed. Paterno’s legacy is ruined. The administrators are criminally negligent.

    But the former players, the alumni and fans, most of the current coaches, and most certainly the current scholarship players have done absolutely nothing wrong and do not deserve in any way to be punished. There wasn’t any mind numbing cheating going on in recruiting like SMU or Miami.

    In effect, it was a lynch mob by a bunch of gutless cowards in suits to please the clueless.

  336. Rutherford would have made a good elementary school teacher. Sometimes it cracks me up in here. All of us competing to get his attention. Yet, he rarely ignores us. Of course another way of looking at it is he is a chew toy for a pack of hyenas.

  337. Finally something I completely disagree with Tex on. I thought it was great. Sends a message to the next coward coach who thinks Saturday afternoon amature football is more important then boys getting raped. Did good people get a raw deal? Kind of. When those ex players are driving home from the daily grind they will remember the roar of the crowd when they won those games. They won’t care about a record book. If I was a Penn State fan I’d actually want the entire season shut down. Sucks for the kids with scholorships the same way it sucks when good people get laid off. They will get by.

  338. I hear ya PF…but Ive seem him in other places act worse, and that is no excuse. Sometimes I almost feel bad for a second, then I remember what his party is doing to this country and my kid’s future, and the feeling quickly passes.

    It is no longer speculation but an empirical truth that we can no longer afford the Left in this country. We have reached the point of unsustainable debt, and like any large ship, it may be impossible to stop it before the worst happens.

    I see only two possibilities of a person coming to be a Leftist. Massive ignorance as to the consequences of their agenda and actions, or intentional malice and nefarious intentions. I do not excuse ignorance, and aggressively engage the latter. I am starting to suspect the Left wants to break this country, so they can, in its weakest moment, seize the country and reform it in its own image. Whatever their motivations, it is clear they are interested more in their own welfare, and have little concern for the damage it causes.

  339. I think the entire Penn State culture is and has been corrupt. I think anything less than a total ban for 10 years would be an injustice.

  340. I told you Rabbit that most of you would be disagreeing with me on this. You’re looking at one of the biggest critics of what athletics has become in America and an ex-jock to boot. But I know rank hypocrisy and double standards when I see them.

    It has been proven time and again the NCAA Committee itself is corrupt – been following the Fiesta Bowl payouts? Racketeering, embezzlement, etc… Criminal. How about the BCS? A complete fraud.

    Having said that….

    Jerry Sandusky is a reprehensible person of the worst sense. But the people who should have been held accountable were held accountable before the NCAA announcement was ever made. I agree in removing the statue of Joe Pa. The man’s life was ruined by this and he probably died much quicker than he would have on account of it. Penn State should have immediately removed it. That is enough. The Administrators who knew have been fired, and in my opinion should be charged with aiding and abetting a crime.

    The Ex-players may have had their glory, but the currents members surely have not. And this doesn’t just impact football players but everyone affiliated with the athletic program, from the trainers, to the publishers and small business owners, to the concession stand guys. What did they do to be punished?

    This isn’t the military. You can’t hold the masses of people (and we are talking thousands) responsible for the despicable actions of a few. Punish the perpetrators severely. And leave it at that.

    This is the standard practice of the NCAA. Not a great example but let’s say some coach or alumni cheat, and instead of going after the former coach who left for the higher profile job, left the school holding the bag with the current players suffer the consequences on account of it.

    How many coaches have done that recently? Egregious as child molestation? Of course not. But definitely theft and fraud. Pete Carroll, John Calipari, Kelvin Sampson the list is almost endless of entire programs being punished on account of a few, while the crooks walk.

    That’s my criticism with the NCAA.

    Jimmy Johnson and his bunch of scumbags got my alum OSU put on probation for four years, and none of them paid so much a penny for punishment – though they had left the school several years before.

    That’s bullshit.

  341. I dont follow enough sports to know much about the corruption. I do think Penn State needs a complete reset, and I dont know how you do that without something like a 10 year period of no football program. This is probably one of the biggest black marks any college has had at least in my memory, and the mark on the institution should be as large and lasting as it is on those who were made victims by this program.

  342. The philosophy you have adopted can’t hold God to blame for anything, Rutherford. Since you acknowledge no power, it is non sequitur to therefore cast blame.

    I don’t blame you for missing my point. I’m not saying God is to blame for Aurora, Colorado. On the contrary I don’t think a God has anything to do with it one way or the other. But for those who believe in supernatural forces ruling our lives I at least look for consistency. This tendency the religious have for praising God for all their good fortune but letting Him off the hook for all the sh*t in their lives is cognitive dissonance at its most obvious.

    However you have said something that surprised me and pleased me for whatever that’s worth. You object to people saying “God spared me” or “God saved me from that tragedy” and your natural logical question is “so did God abandon those who were killed?” I was very surprised to see you go there.

    So I’m left a bit puzzled. Other than a source of comfort after the fact, do you believe God played any role in that theater Thursday night?

  343. An honest conversation with my kid is “playing politics”? Talking to him about current events, and pointing out the blind spots in the arguments of the gun-fearing wussies is playing politics, but the predictable as a train schedule calls for more laws that restrict freedom, and Constitutional rights, and that will do nothing to deter criminals determined to do bad things is NOT political?

    Let’s break that down in two pieces.

    An honest conversation with my kid is “playing politics”? Absolutely not. Your writing about it is playing politics. As I wrote over at your place, this was not some cozy human interest story written on a blog dedicated to ruminations on family. This was a political statement about your perceived weakness in gun-control advocacy written on a blog dedicated to conservative political opinion. Your conversation with your son was the medium through which to tell your political message to your reader. If you deny this, I think you’re being disingenuous.

    but the predictable as a train schedule calls for more laws that restrict freedom, and Constitutional rights, and that will do nothing to deter criminals determined to do bad things is NOT political?

    Who ever said that gun control advocacy is NOT political? El Tigre accused me of using this event for political point scoring. I did not. You opened your piece with talking about folks who did. Your piece was political. I responded to it.

    To put it in school yard jargon … between the two of us, you started it.

  344. On the contrary I don’t think a God has anything to do with it one way or the other

    Oh, you don’t eh? Coincidences don’t add up to anything except happenstance? Nobody’s setting this up?

  345. You have a profound lack of self-awareness.

    You have a profound inability to put your own biases in check. I guess that’s also a form of little self-awareness. See 470 if you need better insight into my self-awareness.

  346. a 9mm Springfield X-D with 10 rounds or a shotgun doesn’t quiite say “FUCK YOU!” with the right inflection.

    I have to assume that’s a joke. You plan on shooting SWAT team members? Planning on being at the center of another Waco BiW? Should I worry about seeing you on the news?

    BTW … you’re an attorney?

  347. Noah, I don’t know why I accommodate you but hell …..

    From the PJMedia Zombie article: When Obama implied at the Roanoke, Virginia rally that some businessmen refuse to pay for public works from which they benefit.

    The argument is over before it started because you can’t build that three legged stool Zombie talks about upon an invalid inference. Obama mentioned teachers who inspired you and folks who had your back and the American system of opportunity and an infrastructure consisting of roads bridges and the Internet. He was arguing against the arrogance of a belief in total self-sufficiency.

    But I’m glad I looked at your link because Zombie does at least deserve some credit. While he drew an invalid inference, he at least did not totally distort what Obama said. Obama never said that businessmen didn’t build their own businesses. Even Zombie was honest enough to acknowledge that.

  348. Shit, the government would find it’s self in a guerilla war that would make the IED infested roads of Iraq or the jungles of Nam a walk in the park.

    Remember, I didn’t make reference to a ground war. Until you’ve got surface to air missiles and enough folks like PF who can fly a mofo and drop some bombs, you’ve lost your battle before it even began.

  349. Rutherford, if all guns vanished from thin air except those in the hands of the governmemt, do you think the relationship we have with government would be unchanged?

  350. So I’m left a bit puzzled. Other than a source of comfort after the fact, do you believe God played any role in that theater Thursday night?

    Not that I can fathom. There are seven things listed in Psalms that specifically say emphatically God hates. One of those is the shedding of innocent blood. Satan on the other hand, was in full costume and fiddling gold…

    Why does God allow these things to happen? I don’t know. You told me once when my dog was killed and I was blaming myself for not turning around and paying more attention, sometimes it is just fate. And you were right…you actually helped me without knowing it.

    Why would it surprise you that I find our Creator loves each and every individual? But God also instructs us all the way back in Genesis 9 that, “Whoever sheds man’s blood, by man his blood shall be shed; for in the image of God He made man.” Clearly, God believes in capital punishment.

    There wasn’t a person there early last Friday that deserved to die – except the nihilist who committed that awful crime. There should be a panel of experts come in and determine the killer’s competency. If he is competent, then his guilt is already established. Try whatever we need to do make it legal and just – and make the determination of fate immediately thereafter.

    If he is found competent and since there is no debate of premeditated guilt, I would suggest we let the victim’s families take a vote with the killer bound and gagged in attendance to what we should do with him. Let him here every bit of the anger, the agony and pain he has caused, the mother’s weeping and the children’s crying.

    And I believe they would find his last minutes on earth should be spent at their mass memorial service…bound, gagged and then summarily executed at the end of the service.

    I can almost guarantee you many of these senseless mass murderers are seeking notoriety at all cost – because we have provided the perception to our children that all notoriety and fame is good with our celebrity seeking status.

    Let those who dream of such evil understand it is not and that their names will be mentioned in the same light as Hitler – despised and reviled until the end of the age.

  351. Alfie I’ll do my best to clarify but you should know me well enough by now to know I’m grey most of the time … not black or white.

    1. I don’t understand the thrill of hunting animals for pure sport. But I’d rather folks shoot animals for sport than people.

    2. I do understand hunting for food.

    3. I do fear guns because I believe too many people are deluded by the fictional images they’ve grown up with on TV. I don’t remember where I saw it, but many years ago I watched a documentary segment on a TV show where folks were being trained in self defense. It was amazing the things these folks took for granted … coming into a room gun drawn only to discover the assailant was BEHIND them after they entered the room and bang … they’re dead. When I see wannabe cowboys and wannabe policemen brag about what they’d do with a gun given the chance part of me wants to laugh and part of me cringes in horror. I give props to Rabbit for admitting he might not pull off the gun hero thing so well in that theater. And Alfie, I give major props to you for taking the time on BiW’s blog to temper the braggadocio that was going on there.

    4. I don’t have good answers for what ails us. Listening to the debate over the weekend I’m beginning to think controlling the sale of ammo might make more sense than controlling guns. No gun should ever be sold without a background check. Guns sold at trade shows should no longer fall into loopholes that exempt these background checks.

    5. I fully admit a background check would not have stopped James Holmes. As I’ve said before I consider Holmes akin to a natural disaster … a human tornado or earthquake. I’m not sure he could have been stopped … and even if an armed theater patron had shot him, he would still have gotten off several rounds based on the type of gun he was using.

    6. I believe there is a profit motive behind the gun lobbies that has nothing to do with the second amendment and that pisses me off.

    Alfie, that’s the best I can do at the moment.

    P.S. Cars kill people, knives kill people, … all diversions for folks who don’t want to talk about guns.

  352. I am quite certain Emily is Cynthia, her writing style I would recognize anywhere.

    I love it when you guys do this. In a sea of anonymity you folks think you can figure out “who people are”. It’s friggin’ hilarious. And the best part is this accusation comes from Noah who for reasons unknown has renamed himself Nagic.

    You are a master at irony my brotha. 🙂

  353. You folks fail to see the Saturn effect

    Either that was an attempt at humor or you need to give me the name of your dealer. Perhaps I should be smoking what you’re smoking?

  354. The culture of the gun (I didn’t read the earlier linked article) that pervades America is one of a handful of things that does indeed make up our culture.

    A very valid observation that I have neglected to acknowledge. Guns, NASCAR and apple pie. This may partly explain why the NRA has so successfully hijacked the issue. It plays right into the American mythos.

  355. And you definitely did pronounce Rutherford unworthy of commenting on his own blog.

    Emily thanks for the support. Actually Nagic (really Noah) has a two prong attack. My comments are unworthy because he finds me intellectually dishonest. Then he also is under the impression that I retroactively edit my own comments to improve them.

    But I don’t mind when the regular readers here make their “demands”. I’m not sufficiently famous to write a blog where I can ignore commenters and simply let them fight among themselves. So I engage and with that engagement, I sign up for the slings and arrows that might come along with that. It’s the price I pay for entering in2thefray (h/t to Alfie).

    P.S Very glad to see you’re not a one time visitor. It gets rough in here but I’m grateful for all the support I can get. 🙂

  356. This is about the quality of customer service I’ve come to expect from virtually every organization in America anymore.

    And we wonder why we are trouble as a country?

    Tex, I come from a family that views 99% of all law suits as frivolous and hence I’m not a millionaire. The way I was neglected in the hospital in 2006 — that almost damn near killed me — I could have documented and got an easy out of court settlement. To this day I kick myself for not going there. But I was too focused on getting my life back and as I said, I didn’t grow up in a “sue culture”.

  357. Except Rutherford is the mirror image of Nagic at BIC’s blog.

    I’ve admitted I overstepped today at BiW’s but it’s unfair to make this a general rule Tex. I don’t go to BiW, Gorilla or Alfie’s blog and call them a bitch.

    Now on the other hand (particularly at BiW’s) if some of his readers come at me with a knife I am damn sure gonna pull mine too.

  358. if all guns vanished from thin air except those in the hands of the governmemt, do you think the relationship we have with government would be unchanged?

    I already know I will be called naive on this one but I honestly don’t believe gun possession plays into the balance of power between the American electorate and the government. I think we have oiled this democracy of ours well enough that folks truly believe they can “throw the bums out” and achieve their political goals through peaceful elections.

    I think most Americans find their power in the ballot box, not the glock.

    P.S. A very quick anecdote. In recounting Kennedy’s assassination to me, my mother admitted that she fleetingly feared anarchy would ensue. Her love of our country was renewed in seeing the orderly change of government to LBJ. We have an amazing system here Rabbit. I think we play it cheap by believing we need guns to keep it afloat.

  359. I’ve always been on the fence with the death penalty. Black killers get it more then white ones. Chicks never hardly get it. And the thought of an innocent person getting it almost makes it not worth dishing out to even guys like the “fauxker”. Almost. So help me God, if my son was murdered by that fuck I would kill him in that court room the minute I heard life in prison. A wooden shank suit cased in my asshole would jam so hard into his neck it would come out the top of his skull. I would also eat his face and spit it on his father. I’d go to prison with a smile on my face. Hopefully join the AB’s if they would let me. It’s not right that our government would force me to get my blood justice that way. That’s why he must be killed by the state. I saw a picture of the father of the 6 year old in court today. He better get to watch fauxker die.

  360. And the best part is this accusation comes from Noah who for reasons unknown has renamed himself Nagic.

    I made that very clear in my first or second post on this board.

    I will address your no surprise non response in the morning. I am betting no one is surprised you picked one thing, and used it to dismiss the entire post and take the affirmative action pass on substantive commentary.

  361. Poolman I do hesitate to jump into the grand Aurora conspiracy but I have noticed one interesting variation in the “facts”. The official story is that Holmes paid for a ticket, entered the theater like everyone else, took a cell phone call that enabled hm to leave the theater via an emergency exit, which he propped open on the way out … and then returned to do the killing.

    Today on Hardball, a witness in the theater said that the man who got the cell phone call and left via the emergency exit was NOT Holmes. This introduces the possibility that Holmes did not act alone. Could this fellow (with a goatee according to the witness) have received the cell call from Holmes telling him to that it was time to prop the door open?

    Who knows? One thing we have learned is you don’t need to be a conspiracy wackjob to acknowledge that the FACTS seldom emerge within the first days of an incident. (Hence the embarrassing early report by ABC’s Brian Ross that Holmes was Tea Party.)

    P.S. I just learned this weekend that everything I thought about Columbine was urban legend. The author of the book on the subject debunks all of it …. no affiliation with the “trenchcoat mafia”, no victims of bullies, no nerds vs jocks. All of it BS that was floated in the immediate aftermath of the tragedy and stuck as fact even after the truth was unearthed.

  362. Interesting Rutherford. If not for the second amendment, my Dad, Grandpa, Uncle, Grandma would probably never survived the riots. I wouldn’t have been born. No bull shit. No drama. As I’ve said before, they owned and ran a bar smack dab in the middle of the 67 riot. They lived above the bar. Hell, so did I for a month or two as a baby. No guns, no dead rabbit.

  363. Noah my good man — take the affirmative action pass on substantive commentary.
    Substantive commentary on a house built on sand is a waste of my time. The fact that I even read your link puts me to bed five minutes later than I wanted. 😐

  364. Rutherford, I agree, “We have an amazing system here Rabbit. I think we play it cheap by believing we need guns to keep it afloat.” And it is just plain weird, to think our government is afraid of a bunch of undisciplined, out of shape, old farts, used to doing no more than pushing buttons on the remote, running amok.

  365. Rabbit I think you moved the goal post with 495. I thought you asked me to address the citizen’s relationship with the government in a gun free nation. Your example involves general lawlessness where the police were inadequate to protect your family. Different subject.

  366. “Persuading people to convert to Islam. Persuading the ex wife to come back…not kill her new boyfriend. I get what you are saying, but ultimatly, I still see all relationships based on the author’s dichotomy.” DR

    I agree, the attributes I listed can certainly be perverted into camouflage for force or reason, but they also can truly be just love, just trust. The author specifically uses the word “interaction” not “relationship”. He is stating the case for all human contact being for the sake of “getting” something from the other person. I reject that hypothesis.

  367. Rabbit I share your ambivalence about the death penalty. As I said earlier even though I could easily see Holmes getting the needle, I just couldn’t muster the hatred for him that I expected to. He was so spaced out in court today that all I saw was a lost soul …. a pathetic shell of a man devoid of conscience or feeling.

  368. a bunch of undisciplined, out of shape, old farts, used to doing no more than pushing buttons on the remote, running amok.

    😆 😆 Newt thanks for sending me to bed tonight with a huge smile. That’s the funniest thing I’ve read all day and perfectly captures my vision of a lot of these wannabe militiamen. 🙂

  369. Regarding 499, it was the theory of sociologist Erving Goffman that our interactions are governed by the desire to save face, our own face and that of the person with whom we interact. Of course, the current polarized political environment contradicts that .

    P.S. Yes I wrote an essay about it on my final exam. 🙂

  370. Thor, he is talking about interaction. You are talking about motivations for said interaction. Isn’t it a given that a normal person doesn’t use force on someone they love, the exception maybe childeren or mentally ill? You still desire behaivor from people you love. For instance, you want what is best for them or for those you love to be happy.

  371. Thor, are you an advocate of the UN and their imposed gun laws? – P

    I am not aware of any UN gun law. Please give me more to go on than the Pope of the Catskills or whoever that dude thinks he is. I think he’s been sucking in too many spores from his cabin’s moss roof. If the Jews ran the UN, don’t you think they would concentrate on say, oh I don’t know, ISREAL (and the fact that they seem to lose every vote like 158-2) before coming for your slingshot. 🙂

  372. Rabbit, from your article …

    “Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that’s it.”

    I believe you once stated that you were a Buddhist for a day. 🙂 Hopefully, even in that temporal sliver, you learned to recognize duality. I believe someone of Eastern persuasion would read this article and see a gaping hole where “allowing” and “disengagement of ego” had been disregarded, ignored even.

    “If you think that the Sun and the Ocean

    Can pass through that tiny opening Called the mouth,

    O someone should start laughing!
    Someone should start wildly Laughing –Now!”
    -Hafiz

  373. Agreed Rabbit. Scumbag’s acting wasn’t even worthy of a middle school play. This punk is playing the media like a fiddle and getting exactly what he wants.

    They should have plastered “asshole” in place of his face today and played it in his jail cell continuously.

    For the life of me, I can’t understand why you bleeding hearts are hesitant to put the potassium chloride to this punk, stop his heart, and give him back to the parents to bury.

    They throw him in the general populace, somebody will kill for notoriety themselves. So we’ll end up housing this scumbag at a high cost for 50 years, feed him, clothe him.

    Our society has lost its collective minds.

  374. “El Tigre accused me of using this event for political point scoring. I did not.”

    No I didn’t. You have no political points to score. I accused you of bowing up and wagging your fingers, which is exactly what you did. The usual self-righteousness and sanctimony you have displayed in the wake of every tragedy. Every damn time. Why is that?

    As I said, you were smug and offensive. You just deserve to be slapped as you are at BiC’s, Ol’ Mr.
    Plain-English/Reading Comprehension. 🙄

    (fortunately every one here can and probably has read your over-the-line b.s)

  375. “This is about the quality of customer service I’ve come to expect from virtually every organization in America anymore.”

    Get used to it. I think you will like medicine more and more. I spoke to a female doc working for the FDA yesterday at the Neurointerventional Radiologists meeting. She quit her practice and is now working for the govt. My old mentor is here; he quit last month. His old boss is here. HE quit, and parenthetically told us that we were out of our minds with our plans to market medical devices. Said his lab had been working on one product for fourteen years now and the FDA has taken the position that any new product to improve medicine would be too expensive, so they are approving basically NOTHING. Everything is moving to China now; the US represents about 50% of the market for medical devices; that means there is 50% still available overseas and China can manufacture anything you want for next to nothing. First toys, then tools, then airplanes (China now owns nearly all US aircraft light plane manufacturers), soon cars and now medical products. Sorry, Ol’ US of A…you socialists did it to yourself.

    And, of course, I quit. I think there is a pattern. Nice going. I hope none of you gub’ment types ever gets sick. Now I can concentrate on my other businesses; one thing is for sure, businesses that work over the Internet and reach the WORLD are in a lot better shape than those caught in this government’s provincial socialist clutches.

  376. @475 Rutherford. I think you would have a very, very tough time finding generals who would order their troops to attack American civilians and soldiers who would do it if ordered.

    As for flying airplanes, why would I do that? Why not just load it up, set the GPS for the target, fly it remotely at treetop level to avoid radar? Lots of smart people in this country; lots of people with rifles like my .243 “AT&T” (It will really reach out and touch someone…). Vietnam? Pfffft…..child’s play compared to what would happen here.

    Do I think this government will go after its people militarily? No, never. They don’t have to. They are doing just fine with their fascist attacks on our Constitution, turning this lovely, lovely country into a house of bondage (HT to Christian Bible).

  377. I agree with 395, Rutherford. I would feel the same about the poor lost soul as I killed him.

    Tex, 379. Our thatched roofed cottage in England was 450 years old and the church we attended was built over 1,000 years ago.As you write, we are very young in America.

    A blogger wrote that we in the “New Worlds” are rootless because we have been forced to create an empty culture and the mixing has polluted our heritage. Therefore, we have lost touch with out heritage.

    That may not be all bad. We have also mostly left centuries-old grudges behind.

    Another interesting development is the discovery of European-appearing mummies in far western China. A genetic test of the blond and red haired people shows they carried genes of Asians, West Europeans, and Indians. They may have been part of a cosmopolitan empire which traded as far away as Africa.

    One of the women was so well preserved, her face appeared on music CD packages and she was a symbol of a separatist movement by people who claim they are not Chinese.

  378. People lived as we do for thousands of years. They just didn’t write about it.

    I think Penn State’s athletic program should be crippled for as long as the child abuse occurred. The punishment inflicted may insure it will happen.

    I basically agree with Pfessor. Soldiers in Syria, Libya and other countries have refused to kill their fellow citizens. Some of them even fought against their leaders.

    However, I think some soldiers would kill their fellow citizens if their leaders convinced them the disonants were dangerous. That is why the Second Amendment is so important.

    Newt or no newt, I like your old fart comment, because it is mostly true. There are people like me who are fit and know how to kill people or animals. If motivated, they could change their quarry from deer to soldiers.

    I don’t believe it will or should happen. I’d never do anything like that, but many men and women are used to more than flipping remotes.

  379. Interesting James – I’ve been reading about the European ancestry in Asia that that has everyone up in arms.

    Pfesser, one thing I didn’t say to Rutherford and should have the other day about doing my own work? Having to pay sky high hourly rates for lousy work is not my only complaint – having to do it at their convenience is another. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve waited hours past a promised “window” with my thumb in my mouth. It’s not as big a problem today, but when I was working full time, that was a real problem. Trying to open up the house on a moment’s notice half way across town or in a meeting, hours passed the promised time.

    Not only is customer service basically a thing of the past, but promptness fell out of favor too.

    I will tell you my own father had many a fault and for a time, I really disliked the guy. But looking back, he did teach me a few old fashioned qualities – chivalry, being on time, basic common courtesy – it was Mr. this and Mrs. that, yes sir and no mam. He was stickler for being early to everything. And I like how he thinks – our own time is no more important than another person’s time.

    And to this day, if I am running so much as three minutes late, I will provide a courtesy call as to the why and when. And very seldom do I have to make the phone call.

  380. I agree with Pfesser and James, because I know this. Unless Leftists are able to accomplish their goal of feminizing and emasculating our military, you can forget the idle threat of an Obama military “junta.”

    Most of those guys you don’t want to meet in a dark alley called battle tested soldiers are sons of some of the most Conservative, Constitution loving people on the planet. I can assure you the ones I know don’t buy into the Living, Breathing Constitutional Argument. Many of them make me look like a pinko and one of the new ones will be from my district representing me starting next January when he’s not flying F16s for the National Guard. You know these guys that like to converse about 100 round clips wearing a ‘Don’t Tread on Me’ hat? They got four of those 100 round clips hanging on their garage wall – all used and a nice humidity controlled “room” for their ammunition – their own Rainy Day fund.

    Should our military decide it is time to overthrow a corrupted government, if I were you big nanny boys and girls with a ‘D’ behind your name and an American critical attitude, I’d start looking for the tall weeds. Because the Marines I know aren’t coming for Sister Mary Claire, Teabaggers, or Preacher Bob. They’re coming for Nancy Pelosi, Dickhead ‘Gulag’ Durbin and Stevie Rainbow whos has a ‘Straight, Not Narrow’ window sticker applied to the back window of his filthy Prius.

    I think Gorilla provides a pretty damn good representation of the typical “mindset” of our fighting military – and I know a bunch of them.

    They ain’t real big fans of most shysters with a ‘D’ behind their name, or the Toolman™ type, though they need not tell you that for you to understand. 😉

  381. Wall Street businessmen attempted a coup during FDR’s administration. They enlisted the help of a WW1 war hero to encourage the American Legion to help energize the military. Their plan was to meet with FDR and tell him he had to retire because of his health. If he refused, the group with the support of the Army, start a new government.

    The war hero played along until he exposed the plot. What would have happened if his aid was genuine. Would a military junta have ruled, would a civil war have begun? I don’t know. I do know if such things happen in other countries, they could happen here.

    Diane Finestien says national security leaks are likely coming from the White House. Obama has weakened our economy. Is he doing the same to our national defense?

  382. FOX was playing a speech from Obama’s appology tour. I thought the appology tour was directed at places like the middle east where American Cold War shenanigans went down. I never agreed with doing that, but I understood it. I didnt know that Obama begged France for our forgiveness! For what??? Being too loud when spending American money vacation in Paris? Was our blood in Normandy too messy?

  383. Not a fan of Ted Olsen in the least, but I thought this was an interesting article. Time Magazine blows…they get it in doctor’s office because no one thinks it’s worth stealing.

    Health Care Irony: Did Liberals Lose By Winning? (from Time.com)
    By THEODORE B. OLSON | June 29, 2012

    The Supreme Court’s decision abounds with legal and political ironies. Foremost, and central to the result, is the majority’s conclusion that the individual mandate is a legitimate exercise of Congress’s power to tax. During the legislative debate, the President and his allies were adamant that the mandate was absolutely not a tax. Had they marketed this provision as a tax, the bill would surely not have passed. So the Supreme Court saved the signature legislative achievement of the Obama Administration precisely because it was not what the Administration said it was.
    When the case got to court, the Administration invoked the federal Anti-Injunction Act, which bars suits to restrain the collection of any tax. The government argued that this law precluded the challenge to the mandate. So if the mandate was, indeed, a tax, this law would have made the case dead on arrival. But in examining this provision, the court held that the mandate was not, after all, a tax; it was just what Congress called it, a penalty. The choice of labels, the court said, cannot control as to whether the law is constitutional but does control as to whether the tax anti-injunction law applies. When I use a word, the court, like Humpty Dumpty, said, it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.
    The magic of this dueling taxonomy of the word mandate meant that because it is a penalty, the court could go forward to consider its legality, but because it is a tax and not a penalty, it is a lawful exercise of Congress’s taxing power, not an unlawful regulation of commerce as the dissenters asserted. Like Marbury v. Madison 200 years ago, in which the Supreme Court held that it had the power to decide whether laws were constitutional, this court exercised that power after dispensing with a provision that would have denied to the court the power to do so in the first place. If it was a tax, the court could not have upheld the tax. But because it was a penalty, it was lawful as a tax. Chief Justice Roberts has learned a thing or two from his legendary predecessor Chief Justice Marshall.
    Yet another irony is that five Justices decided that Congress did not have the power under the commerce clause to regulate doing nothing — not buying health insurance. But five Justices (only Chief Justice Roberts in both camps) held that Congress does have the power to impose a tax for doing the same nothing.
    Our constitutional law professor President, who insisted that Obamacare was constitutional, was right all along. But he was right because he was wrong. He was right that it was constitutional because he was wrong that it was not a tax. He either doesn’t know his constitutional law that well or his politics counseled not sharing that wisdom with Congress voting on the measure. (Love it!)
    The political irony is that the individual mandate is widely unpopular and will become more so when small businesses and individuals start to pay for it and when the tax man comes collecting the penalty (i.e., tax) from the uninsured. On the other hand, solving the health care crisis is something the public does want. If Obamacare had been struck down, the President’s re-election campaign would have targeted the five evil Republicans on the Supreme Court, as he signaled with his outburst challenging the court shortly after his team faced rough sledding in the court’s oral argument. His campaign was already fashioning a direct challenge to Mitt Romney and Republicans in Congress to come up with their solution to the health care crisis before the election. A virtually impossible and highly perilous political course.
    That avenue is now foreclosed. So by winning his case in court, the President now has to defend an unpopular law that he secured by misrepresenting what it was. And he cannot attack Republicans for not offering a solution because his solution is now the law. He got what he wished for.
    So President Obama may have lost by winning and might have won had he lost. One gets a sense from the White House spin after the argument that there was a secret longing that the court would take the bait and do precisely what the President was, in a sense, daring it to do. Chief Justice Roberts did not bite.
    Finally, the rejoicing by liberals may be short-lived. Their version of federal power was vindicated but only if they want to enact politically unpopular taxes. On the other hand, five Justices significantly reined in federal power to regulate commerce and, in another part of the court’s opinion, to exercise power under the spending clause. These authorities are much easier politically to exercise in Congress; unfunded mandates are one of the preferred ways of taxing in sheep’s clothing. The court’s decision, while reaffirming authority that is hard to use, restricted authority that is easier to use. Like the President, they may have lost by winning.

  384. The usual self-righteousness and sanctimony

    You have selective outrage. BiW started his post finger wagging at the media and then via his dialog with his son, finger wagging at gun control advocates.

    When the finger wagging matches your politics, it doesn’t offend you. As I said before, you’re not even aware when your biases influence your perceptions.

  385. Diane Feinstein is the taller of the cornerstones of monumental stupidity from California. But unlike the reprehensible and demented munchkin and man hating Babs Boxer, oh excuse me because she’s “earned it” Senator Boxer, Feinstein appears to at least make the attempt at honesty once in a blue moon – probably trying to save her soul or something.

    The answer to your question James is YES. Obama at this point of desperation values one thing and one thing only: a vote to stay in power, VISA accepted. Doesn’t matter what it takes or how much it costs in blood, if there’s a Vote for Bongo, Bongo can be bought.

    You got enough political campaign stash and wave it the face of Obama, he’d drown his water dog to swim to it.

    Can you imagine if the roles were reversed, and it was discovered Mitt Romney was selling intelligence secrets for campaign stash, the absolute outrage by the MSM? Benedict Romney – the one and only time liberals would be demanding capital punishment.

    And I understand that since Obama has gone on the attack and exposed himself as what many of us already knew, off camera Obama is a jackbooted thug, American hatin’ phony and thin skinned whiner, his favorability/likeability factor is tanking too.

    This could get interesting in the next six weeks.

  386. I used to believe Michelle Antoinette was Barry’s best fan, until she took off on one too many vacations without her man. Then it became Cher loves Obama holding up the Obama #1 big finger, but Cher couldn’t even graduate from high school, so that didn’t count for much in the national spotlight.

    But I’ve read three times this week, Hugo has become Obama’s biggest fan and is even campaigning for him. 😆

    The Obama 4-H Club:

    Hezbollah, Hamas and Hugo all Heart Obama!

  387. I saw a forensic psychologist on MSNBC yesterday, he said the shooter’s demeanor in court yesterday, most resembled someone on drugs. And he deferred judgement on rather that could be the result of a long lasting drug taken before the shooting or something given to him, to keep him calm and quiet for the court appearance. That seems a plausible explanation to me.

  388. Rather than point out everything that was wrong with that story, I’ll keep this simple for you, R.

    You’re getting ready to go to bed. Suddenly that security device you put so much stock in, your locked front door, is in splinters on your entryway floor, and guys with guns are coming through your door and are bearing down on you and your family.

    That call to 911? Ain’t gonna happen.

  389. That call to 911? Ain’t gonna happen.

    That’s when our heroic Rutherford steps into quick action.

    The submissive dog pose, belly exposed with feet in the air, followed by pulling his wife over him for protection, plus an offer of his prized signed and framed Obama poster that hangs over the mantle as payoff.

  390. That was an act. Fauxker acted EXACTLY the ways kids in my class when they PRETEND they were sleeping and coming out of a slumber (yes, they do that). Fauxker, in this case, was pretending to come out of temporary insanity. It was an act!

  391. Tex, I have no doubt Rutherford would be in a submissive position. However, I’m guessing his belly would be facing the floor while he “presents himself”.

  392. A blogger wrote that we in the “New Worlds” are rootless because we have been forced to create an empty culture and the mixing has polluted our heritage. Therefore, we have lost touch with out heritage.

    James, on a related note, I heard someone say over the weekend that late 17th, early 18th century England had two kinds of people, those who followed authority and those who rebelled. The rebellious ones all crossed the ocean and formed what would become the United States of America. It maps to our live free or die credo.

  393. I have to give Tex and Rabbit props for a vivid imagination.

    3 people by my count have come up with the same independent conclusion. Me thinks there is more truth to it than your willing to admit.

  394. You know Poolman I’m surprised that the assembled here have not lauded you for your Willy Loman blog article. The premise, if I understand it, is that CO was a government covert operation to trigger more calls for gun control.

    Considering the unanimous opinion here that Fast and Furious was a backdoor attempt to trigger more gun control legislation, I’m surprised the assembled wingnuts here have not yelled hip hip hooray for old Willy Loman. 😐

  395. @ PF #509 you’re correct. There are some laws in place that have time and again prevented the Chinese from getting their hooks into a number of things. Caterpillar is a good example and there were multiple attempts to snatch various arms of Ingersoll Rand. For cars GM is the obvious target and they’re already laying the groundwork for that domestically.

  396. Noah, if the “truth” you’re referring to is that I’d probably be dead meat in a home invasion, yeah I can admit that. I’m not so sure about the particulars spelled out in Tex and Rabbit’s scenarios though. 🙂

  397. When Obama implied at the Roanoke, Virginia rally that some businessmen refuse to pay for public works from which they benefit, he presented a thesis which, like a three-legged stool, relies on three assumptions that must all be true for the argument to remain standing:

    Explain to me how this is a false assumption. I have listened to Obama’s speech now 3 times and I feel this is an accurate interpretation.

    You said: He was arguing against the arrogance of a belief in total self-sufficiency.

    Are you making this claim on a point of semantics by setting the standard to 100% or its false? If you chose to take this path, I will be happen to generate a complete breakdown of the post, minute point by minute point, or you can take the post on honestly. I have the time and would be more than happy to hold you accountable to the post, even if we have to go one word at a time.

    Still waiting on your pondering of Gorilla’s post while you ponder your choices on this one. Based on your history here I will start my breakdown in anticipation of taking the easy way out.

  398. @ James the Business Plot with Smedley Butler had been a conversation here once before courtesy of the Poolman. I don’t think that was going to have the legs some hoped for. I dare say the Bonus Army march post WWI was illustrative of the opposite end to how the government and the citizenry may or may not act in the scenario others have spoken of here.
    I apologize for the jumble of poor sentence structure there. in a rush

  399. R @ 431 “I guess that is where I differ. I saw clear indoctrination”

    IMO we indoctrinate our children on a daily basis therefore we need to give them the tools that will help them form their own opinions in the future. I still feel this is what BiW was trying to do.

    R @ 470 “Your conversation with your son was the medium through which to tell your political message to your reader” –

    I’m not sure I understand your objection??

    Tex @ 461 😆

    Nagic, have you ever been diagnosed with ASD? (Autistic Syndrome Disorder) It would explain your extreme focus on the RL blog.

    As to Holmes, I think he should be put in stocks and the family of his victims allowed to stone him to death!!!!

  400. Alfie, I’m glad Poolman mentioned the attempted rebellion. It makes an interesting history chapter. I agree, it was ill suited for Americans of the time, but in another context, maybe it would have been more successful.

    Rutherford, the two types of British might be true. Our paternal ancestor left Britain about 1640. Some of them sided with the British and became Canadians to preserve themselves after the Revolution. Other ancestors fought the British and later in the Civil War..

    Australia was a penal colony. That past would explain a lot too.

    I don’t know if Fast and Furious was a plot to create sentiment to change our gun laws or not. I do know the operation was botched and it caused people to die. I also know the government up to the president is covering up what actually happened. Penn State might be parallel government behavior on Fast and Furious.

  401. Noah, I completely support the revelation of the identities of Romney donors so that we may better know the ideologies that fund his campaign.

    I do NOT support the harassment of those donors.

  402. “When the finger wagging matches your politics, it doesn’t offend you.”

    Whatever R. You started name-calling. It was unprovoked. BiC didn’t.

    Shit. You don’t even have a coherent position on gun rights other than “something must be done now that there’s been a shooting” and “here all of you gun-lovers think you’re John Wayne. Well that’s just marvelous. So what?

  403. Ok so lets set the stage so we don’t have to break down any unnecessary components of this article.

    1. That the public programs he mentioned in his speech constitute a significant portion of the federal budget;

    2. That business owners don’t already pay far more than their fair share of these expenses; and

    3. That these specific public benefits are a federal issue, rather than a local issue.

    Of these three premises, which do you find to be untrue?

    Of these three premises, which do you find have false conclusions?

  404. Ah, there’s the rub, Rutherford. How do you stop harassment of the donors when the specific goal of some people is to find and intimidate them so they will be too fearful to contribute money or to campaign for a candidate.

    Until you understand how to protect donors, their names must remain secrete.

  405. If the unthinkable happened to any of my loved ones I’d shoot the gunman myself, I swear. Diane Sawyer would be interviewing gun range owners talking about how I went from the shakiest gun in the Midwest to Annie Oakley in just 3 weeks. More than likely I’d be spared the call because the killer would be dead 5 times before I ever got to him.

    However…

    Where I pause is at the thought of wrongful executions, and diminished mental capacity. And because of the latter, can we completely avoid the former? Should a schizophrenic be executed?

    The case that (I think) resulted in the abolishment of the death penalty in England is positively chilling. A man is executed for the murder of his baby daughter. Turns out another tenant in the building was a serial killer and later admitted to killing the child along with the convicted husband’s wife! His own wife too. The wrongfully executed man was posthumously pardoned. 😦

    There’s another example of a man convicted of killing his wife and the Innocence Project saw to it that the real killer – a very, very bad man who killed something like 5 other women – was brought to justice after the husband’s appeals had been exhausted and the date of execution set. I’m short on the details of that case, but there are other ones anyway where DNA exhonerated the innocent and they were set free. The number of people actually executed before being exhonerated is not large, but isn’t just one too many?

  406. Noah I re-posted your nutjob gun-toting meter-phobic lady over onto the new thread. I think you’re one french fry short of a happy meal my friend. You can respond over there if you please,

  407. Muffy, I’ll take a stab. Obviously, I’m for capital punishment if it administered fairly. I think justice incomplete without it and I am a huge proponent of victim’s rights, which IMO is a travesty of justice in this country. I really don’t give a flip what drove a homicidal maniac to shoot strangers and terrorize children. I believe I can justify the punishment of one losing their life by the hand of our legal system theologically and morally.

    But I understand your concerns and they are valid ones.

    However, in the case of Holmes, it seems there are only two questions that need to be answered: (1) guilt and (2) sanity.

    The first one, there is no question. We know Holmes is guilty.

    About Holmes sanity, while I am no psychiatrist, it would appear to me that anyone who could go through the meticulous preparation required, the costuming, the clear seeking of notoriety, the police taunting, the planning, the execution, and the twisted motive for maximizing the carnage answers the second question too.

    I know few stone cold murderers I don’t think insane. Rational people don’t kill another human being without real justification like war, self defense or the protection of loved one and friends.

    Seldom do I say fry them without hesitation. Gacy, McVeigh, Dahlmer, Manson, and host of others – and now this craven coward. He could have done us a huge favor and put the gun to his temple – but he’s a punk that needs an audience. The only audience he would receive from me if I were judge and jury is people watching him die on a gurney.

    Since we are so “civilized”, stopping The Joker’s heart is satisfactory. And if our legal system not so incredibly backlogged and bureaucratic, 30 days would be more than enough time to fill out the paperwork. convene a jury, and give him his last rites.

    If the victim’s families have no huge objectives and the majority wishes for Holmes to fry, then let’s carry out the victim’s wishes and do it quickly enough that it a sign to anybody else seeking notoriety through blood sport they will be held accountable with their own life.

  408. Tex, I can agree that if the crime is murder and is not a “who-done-it” then I’m relieved there are people willing to administer the shot. I can’t stand in the way of that.

  409. Who needs a trial? He’s already convicted in public. Wild, wild west.
    Stone him! Crucify him! Nuke him! 😈

  410. Muffy, 549, you mentioned “diminished mental capacity.” It happens. While in the Air Force, I strangled a man in self defense. I was so sure he was dead, I quit too soon and he revived. My mind was operating on instinct.

    My experience made me ambivalent about the death penalty,– that and the cases of executed innocents. This man deserves to die, however. i think his death is as deserving as the death of Penn State’s athletic program. .

    A shot between the eyes works for me.

    Red State wrote that the Huffington Report described another shooting in Aurora. A man shot the mother of a pastor and approached the church with his gun ready. The nephew of the killed woman was an off-duty policeman who shot the murderer. Without his fast action others might have died.

    I wonder why the press didn’t report that incident.

  411. LOL…..Rutherford……how many calls end with a thankful and positive vibe?

    Or how many calls involve crazy shit….death and maimed people?

    Unrelated rant: I have a nephew and a niece due this Monday. So I met 3 of my brothers at a bar in my old hood. I ran into people I know there and was forced into the “bro hand shake/hug” ordeal.

    What is with that shit? I’m sick of these stupid fucking hand shakes and thug hugs. Feel like a fool.

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