The GOP Mathematical Magic Trick

Here’s a hypothetical. Let’s say we send nine blondes and one brunette into a room and we ask each of them to say something really stupid. Then we conclude from the experiment that blondes are nine times more likely to say something stupid as brunettes. You cry foul? You think we rigged the statistic by creating conditions that would make the statistic come true? Well, you would be right.

Last Saturday morning on MSNBC, Chris Hayes, host of the new weekend program “Up with Chris Hayes” proved that very point when it comes to the GOP’s favorite statistic that the top 10% of wage earners pay 70% of all taxes. As Hayes noted, the statistic is ridiculous on its face since it does not take into account payroll taxes, or state and local taxes. Be that as it may, he goes on to prove the emptiness of the meme even if we zero in on Federal income tax.

He invents a fictional country named Inequalistan, a tiny little nation with a population of 10. Nine of its citizens make $10.00 a year. The tenth citizen makes $100.00 a year. Believing a progressive tax to be unfair, Inequalistan imposes a 10% flat tax on all its citizens. As a result, the country collects $19.00 per year in taxes. If you do the math, $10.00 of this revenue is coming from the rich guy. So the rich guy is paying more than 50% of all taxes.

Now here’s the kicker. As Hayes points out, this can’t be the result of “class warfare” because everyone in Inequalistan is taxed at the same rate. Hence the “unseemly burden” borne by the rich guy is the direct result of his unseemly wealth. In other words, in a society where one small class of people can so thoroughly dominate the rest of the country economically, the result of even a fair flat tax will be more money coming from that privileged class. The conservatives who gripe about the rich paying more taxes ignore the advantageous conditions that create that inequity. Or to quote Chris Hayes (the money quote, so to speak), “Conservatives are using evidence of inequality to defend inequality.”

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So the next time you hear someone say the top 10% pay 70% of taxes ask yourself why the top 10% make so much more than everyone else that they would indeed be paying 70% of all taxes. Maybe the answer is not to tax the rich less, but to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation.

Respectfully,
Rutherford

Picture credit: http://kathleenrooney.com/news/rich-uncle-pennybags/

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251 thoughts on “The GOP Mathematical Magic Trick

  1. Or we can stick with the facts and ask why over 50% of the nation pay no taxes at all? And since you brought up the state and local taxes, why don’t you include those into the equation? Do you really think that the rich pay less in local and state taxes? Really?

    What was one of the very first things that Andrew Cuomo did when he became Governor of New York? He threw out the millionaire tax because it was driving out the millionaires, which was resulting in less revenue for the state. Maryland instituted a millionaire tax too, but they haven’t repealed it yet, which is also why they continue to lose revenue.

    I’m not sure if you’ve heard of this unwritten rule or not, but it is almost universally agreed to be accurate. 10-10-80. 10% in any business organization are innovators and overachievers- they pull the company into the future. 10% are complainers- they hold the company back, typically by demonizing the innovators and complaining about things in general. 80% are followers- they will follow behind whoever they think wins the argument between the complainers and the innovators. That rule, 10-10-80, applies to more than just the business community, it applies to society too. The rich, by and large, are the 10% of innovators. I tend to think that liberals are the 10% of complainers since they feel their work is not done unless they have bitched about something, and the rest of the country is the 80%.

    The left, and this pResident in particular, have set out on the course of vilifying success. I’ve pointed this out to you before: the left works to pull everyone down to the lowest common denominator, whereas Conservatives look to bring everyone up to the highest common mark.

    Hayes is an idiot, just like the morons that watch the show in the first place…

  2. I’m curious R, when do you say when when it comes to political racism? How much is enough?

    MRC visited the Congressional Black Caucus Annual Dinner in Washington to ask attendees if the tea party is racist. The attendees are also asked about Allen West and Herman Cain and what they think of black members of the tea party. One man says they can go to hell, another lady calls them ‘oreos.’ Here’s the video.

  3. I think another pertinent question is, what has happened to the Great Middle Class in this country? Why have people moved to become part of either the poor or the rich, with fewer and fewer in between?

    In the early ‘eighties I had this discussion with an actuary who was helping me set up my investments for the future. He brought it up, actually; I didn’t know this demographic shift was happening. His take on it was that it was caused by the tax system and he went through the logic. Don’t remember it exactly, but it boiled down to the fact that all the government programs ended up being funded by the middle class, who were buckling under the burden. Many of these well-meaning programs went to supposedly benefit the poor, but ended up just making matters worse by turning them into wards of the State, which not only took care of them poorly but robbed them of their abilities to ever take care of themselves or contribute to America at large.

    R, we created this underclass. And it was all done with the best of intentions. If you want to see the ultimate result of these good intentions, just take a few days and tour southern West Virginia. I grew up there and watched the transformation with my own eyes – it went from a beautiful little farming and mining community to a perfect hellhole. It’s an object lesson for black folks or anybody else who thinks the government is his friend. I believe it was Sowell who observed that they had survived slavery, discrimination, poverty, wars and depressions, but couldn’t survive Johnson’s Great Society and the liberals’ good intentions. I have sympathy: been there, done that.

  4. Hayes is the idiot Muppet version of Maddow.

    So how about shrinking tax base or capital gains tax? As Gorilla points out, 50% pay no income tax at all. But of course, libs think that the wealthy do nothing with their money other than admire it. Too bad his analogy is so dumbed down it misses the mark entirely.

    An oldie but a goodie:

  5. I’ve always loved the formulaic fake sarcastic nervous laughter that defines the sneering MSNBC line up. The last time I saw our Muppetville resident, He did not disappoint:

  6. dup post on prior thread.

    re: Monica Lewinsky

    I hadn’t thought about her in a long time, but comments here led me to the following:

    There are five installments of her interview with Larry King. It is 2002, so I’m sure a lot has happened since then. What a nice young woman (at least then). I really hope she does well and finds some happiness; she is so far and above Bill Clinton. That sonofabitch; I had forgotten just how much he disgusted me.

  7. Every time I see Chris Hayes, I think of Dickie Dole. Who was Richard “Dickie” Dole you ask? Well, let me tell you who Dickie Dole was.

    Dickie was the 12th man on our 3rd grade little league baseball team. There were 12 players. Dickie wore black horn rimmed glasses, was a lefty, and someone effeminate.

    Back then in less politically correct times, you didn’t have to play everybody. When we would get a large lead, about the 5th inning out of 6 (didn’t have run rules then either), the Coach would shove Dickie out in right field – and invariable Dickie would wet the front of his pants.

    His parents who were of considerable wealth, moved Dickie about the sixth grade to an expensive private school, and I lost track of him. But to this day, I still picture Richard Dole at 51, with horn rimmed glasses and pee stains on the front of his pants in some office complex.

    Maybe Dickie changed his name to Chris Hayes?

  8. This post provides excellent fodder to tear apart. For now, it provides me a perfect teaching tool to both Pfesser (who makes very legitimate points above) and Rutherford, whose mind atrophied many years ago. Hard to believe a math major wrote this.

    Remember the argument over defining something as the red herring Pfesser? Rutherford and his hero Chrissie Hayes provide a text book example.

    As Hayes noted, the statistic is ridiculous on its face since it does not take into account payroll taxes, or state and local taxes.

    Is Washington arguing or debating payroll, state or local taxes and I missed that? Because I have some real bitches about sales taxes here in Tulsa. When do I meet with President Obama?

  9. I did a little calculation Rutherford as test, forgoing any deductions, dividends and the like using strictly the 2011 federal tax rates. We’ll leave Uncle Warren and his lack of ordinary income out of the equation for the moment.

    Let’s make this a little more realistic to the real world in Tex’s Inequalistan:

    10 People (salary per year)

    1 makes $100
    1 makes $50
    3 make $20
    3 make $10
    2 make $2

    I used the 2011 Tax Rates and applied them accordingly:

    $0-2 10%
    $2-10 15%
    $10-20 25%
    $20-30 28%
    $30-50 33%
    $50+ 35%

    I came up with the following paid in taxes per grouping:
    1 makes $100 = $30.8 or 51% of taxes paid
    1 makes $50 = $13.3 or 22% of taxes paid
    3 make $20 = $11.7 or 19% of taxes paid
    3 make $10 = $4.2 or 7% of taxes paid
    2 make $2 = $0.4 ~ 1% of taxes paid

    So in other words, the rich guy paid more than 50% of all the federal taxes himself. The “two rich guys” paid 73% of the total taxes. The “five rich people” paid 92% of the total federal taxes, etc…

    Chris Hayes was saying again about how we need a more progressive tax structure?

  10. PF, c’mon, the double standard is sickening. She played doctor with a married man … she was not a nice young woman. Sorry dude.

    The married man who knew better.
    The married man who was supposed to be the adult in the room.
    The married man who could have insured that it never happened.
    The married man who lied and denied when caught.
    The married man who was angry he had to confront his deep and persistant character flaw, instead of being ashamed that a girl who deserved better based on the fact that she was there as an intern had to swill his dick around in her mouth and be diddled by his fucking cigar.

  11. Saturday, welcome to the blog.

    You can list all the reasons Clinton was a scum bag until the cows come home. THAT is not my argument. I stand by my comment … if you raise your daughter to believe it is proper to stick a married man’s cigar up her vagina, then you’ve failed as a father. Case closed.

  12. “The rich, by and large, are the 10% of innovators. I tend to think that liberals are the 10% of complainers since they feel their work is not done unless they have bitched about something”

    Really? You made me blow half my bowl of cornflakes out my nose. Yeah, the conservatives on this blog never bitch about anything. Nothing but rainbow farts and candy striped middle fingers from this crew 24-7.
    So I can put you all down for lifting the cap on SS taxes. I mean since rich people have no problem paying their fair share, they just don’t want to overpay then you must be in agreement with that. Got to go to work now, help lighten that burden on the poor congressman that struggles to get by on $400,000.

  13. Rutherford,

    Saturday was me.

    I swear your template hates my computer…between the screen wrap, and having the button bar below the comment box stuck in fromnt of where I am commenting…

    R, Lewinsky was a girl, who was working for a powerful man who is also a predator. Even if everything was her idea, a scenario I find a little difficult to believe, he could have put a stop to it before it started.

    Or do you think the most powerful man in the free world was incapable of preventing a girl from sucking his dick?

  14. DR is smart to stick to SILVER

    Check out today’s financial headlines on Google

    Google News 9/28/11 HEADLINES

    US Stocks Higher As Investors Keep Watch On Europe
    Wall Street Journal – ‎25 minutes ago‎

    US stocks pushed higher for a fourth straight day as investors continued to watch developments on Europe’s debt crisis. The Dow Jones Industrial Average gained 60 points, or 0.5%, to 11249.
    ______________________________________________________________

    Stocks trim gains as worries about Europe return
    Forbes – ‎39 minutes ago‎

    An early rally is fading on Wall Street as traders worry about Europe’s ability to contain its debt crisis

  15. R –
    Never be cynical about the power of sex. This was a very asymmetrical situation. Think about it a minute: a 22 year-old girl, being shown interest by the most powerful man on the planet. Compare her experience level with his, and the fact that HE knew what was at stake – how big a deal it was. I think it was clearly established by then what kind of people he and his wife were – grasping, power-hungry and absolutely ruthless. I won’t go into the bodies (literally) they left in their wakes. And Bill had already a long history of basically committing rape on several women.

    Yes, she was no angel, but to compare the two seems to me to be completely around the bend. I can’t think of ANY possible situation on the planet where one partner held such an advantage in age, money, power.

    As for your comment about “raising” a daughter – I hope someday you have the experience of doing just that. Let me know how perfectly she follows your admonitions to be good.

  16. So I can put you all down for lifting the cap on SS taxes. I mean since rich people have no problem paying their fair share,

    By all means – when you agree to privatize SS. One quick perusal of that infestation of maggots on your blog told me all I need to know about your idea of fairness and truth, concerning matter of politics and money. The school of Chris Hayes and his bad math is apparently where you graduated. Took me 4 minutes and an excel spreadsheet to bust Chris’ hymen. Rutherford will notice in about a week. 🙂

    The days of you buying votes to steal elections and leaving people in the poor house to enslave them to feckless federal government needs to come to an end. Or we need to cut millions of you loose to the winds of wherever you land – perhaps Father Fidel, cousin Kim Jong, or Uncle Hugo.

  17. So in other words, the rich guy paid more than 50% of all the federal taxes himself. The “two rich guys” paid 73% of the total taxes. The “five rich people” paid 92% of the total federal taxes, etc…

    What a waste of time you just committed Tex. You proved Hayes’ point that the disproportionate amount of tax paid is directly related to the disproportionate wealth of those doing the paying.

    Basically, I just published a post saying 2+2=4 and all of you are piling on to prove it wrong. Now I know you guys don’t believe in science, but I thought maybe you still believed in mathematics. 😆

  18. Name a COngressman making $400,000.

    I don’t mind taking the cap off, as long as you don’t cap their benefits. See, this is the thing, you libs keep talking about SS as a benefit and in the terms of fairness. Taking money from Paul to pay Peter so Peter will vote for you is both morally and ethically wrong.

  19. Chris Hayes was saying again about how we need a more progressive tax structure?

    If you watch the video he said no such thing. He simply pointed out that the top 10% paying 70% of taxes is no accident or injustice. Forget progressive taxation. He just proved that under a flat tax, the rich would still pay the majority of the tax burden.

  20. BiW (aka Saturday) please remind me. Was Miss Lewinsky a minor when she worked as an intern?

    You wish to create a debate where none exists. Bill Clinton created the very definition of a hostile work environment. To say he had power over Miss Lewinsky is to put it mildly. No one is arguing that. HOWEVER PF called her a “nice girl”. Again, nice girls keep their legs closed especially when in the company of a married man. If the married man makes inappropriate and threatening advances, nice girls (with a bit of courage) quit their job and go elsewhere.

    I wager if the POTUS in question had been a Republican, you’d be a lot more willing to more evenly allocate blame for what happened. Let’s move from POTUS to SCOTUS for a minute. Anita Hill was a lying nutjob right? Ain’t it a shame she didn’t have a tape recorder running when perv Clarence made his remarks about pubic hairs on coke cans.

  21. First, some of that yummy, yummy “new tone”:

    http://www.mrctv.org/embed/105869

    If you watch the video he said no such thing. He simply pointed out that the top 10% paying 70% of taxes is no accident or injustice. Forget progressive taxation. He just proved that under a flat tax, the rich would still pay the majority of the tax burden.

    Rutherford,

    The point you’re purposely missing is that with a flat tax, everyone has “skin in the game”. We don’t have nearly fifty % paying nothing or worse yet, getting money back when they pay nothing.

    I know progressives have trouble with the idea, that that would mean EVERYONE is paying their fair share, and the recipient class would stop being so generous, because it wouldn’t just be other people’s money.

    Hell, a few of them might actually figure out on their own, that “general welfare” does not and never did mean “good and plenty”.

  22. Let me know how perfectly she follows your admonitions to be good.

    Oh I fully agree with you there PF. I can only strongly advise her how to handle situations .. I can’t be there in the heat of the moment. My comment to BiW assumed (sarcastically of course) that he would tell his daughter that her vagina could be a revolving door and she remains blameless.

    Sexual harassment in the workplace is a real thorny issue. Everybody advocates women being on the corporate ladder but suddenly when some guy acts like a dick, we don’t expect these women to have some balls. We suddenly assign them victim status.

    I’ll grant you that Monica faced a very tough situation. I think she talked herself into believing the POTUS was her lover as opposed to her predator. She was naive and foolish. But with all that … with all the wild imbalance in the “relationship”, Monica seemed not to care a whit about Hillary or Chelsea. Married men are “hands off” and when a woman crosses that boundary under any circumstances other than outright rape, she has failed. We can “understand” her failure but we shouldn’t deny it is a failure nevertheless. And her failure does not absolve the man.

  23. What a waste of time you just committed Tex. You proved Hayes’ point that the disproportionate amount of tax paid is directly related to the disproportionate wealth of those doing the paying.

    Make up your mind. Thick as a brick. I’ll try to make this even simpler.

    Now here’s the kicker. As Hayes points out, this can’t be the result of “class warfare” because everyone in Inequalistan is taxed at the same rate. <bHence the “unseemly burden” borne by the rich guy is the direct result of his unseemly wealth.

    The average payable federal rate on that example I just posted is 24.75% of federal taxes for the aggregate population.

    So I have two questions Harvard. Let’s throw out the “unseemingly wealth” of one making FOUR times the average wage. We’ll deal strictly with the middle and upper middle class = $20 and $50.

    (1) What should be the average federal rate, as we see here is one in four is going to Uncle Sam?

    (2) Since when did $50 become unseemly disproportionate to $20? Because contestant #2 (upper middle) is paying more tax by himself than 3 people (middle) making 40% of what he is.

    We already have a massive redistribution of wealth and progressive tax structure not with the rich but between middle and upper middle class, unless you can convince me that contestant #2 is getting more than three times the tax benefit of contestant #3, #4 or #5.

    Chris Hayes is playing nothing but a mathematical trick – and a weak one at that.

  24. Another example Rutherford – maybe you’ll figure this out yet.

    Let’s compare the middle class to the lower middle class of my example. This time three middle class – three lower middle class.

    The middle class makes twice what the lower middle class does in wages. But they pay more than 179% more in taxes. And the real fact is, the bottom people in my example pay no tax in the real world, and most likely grab a few entitlements the middle class doesn’t qualify – Medicaid being a big one.

    That’s not capitalism. It’s Western European socialism. And Obama’s current tax structure aptly demonstrates why that Obama cheerlead about “for the middle class” is the biggest lie of them all.

    I’m actually glad you wrote this. I haven’t found a better example yet you have written demonstrating class warfare in action.

    Maybe its Obama’s tribal nature coming through. Oooga Booga!

  25. Anita Hill was a lying nutjob right? Ain’t it a shame she didn’t have a tape recorder running when perv Clarence made his remarks about pubic hairs on coke cans.

    Anitia Hill was silent about her allegations until Thomas was nominated for the highest bench in the country. Anita Thomas didn’t say a peep when she was in the position to make the full force of an intrusive investigation of her claims a very real and unpleasant reality for Thomas, and instead waited until this was not a possibility, but the allegation and innuendo could linger like farts in the room after a night of chili and beer.

    And no, a law school professor made claims she could NEVER prove, and that flew in the face of the testimony and experience of everyone who has ever been close to the man. She knows the standard of proof, and the fact that as many people took her as seriously as they did when there was nothing to substantiate her speaks volumes about the people who took up her banner.

  26. How damn corrupt and dishonest are liberals you ask? Pravda corrupt. Poolman, why aren’t you bouncing off the ceiling over this shit? Here’s legitimate corruption by government. Where’s your moral outrage?

    MSM Sheep: Ignoring the Scandal of the Century

    Not only did U.S. officials approve, allow and assist in the sale of more than 2,000 guns to the Sinaloa cartel — the federal government used taxpayer money to buy semi-automatic weapons, sold them to criminals and then watched as the guns disappeared.

    http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/msm-sheep-ignoring-the-scandal-of-the-century/

  27. “Maybe its Obama’s tribal nature coming through. Oooga Booga! ‘

    C’mon man. I think you owe Mr. Lawson an apology for that shot.

  28. Why would I want rich people to give more of their money to the government? I don’t get it.

    I’m a government stooge and don’t even think it will help my life or anyone else’s.

    What’s in it for me? What’s in it for us?

    You know what would be a great experiment to end this debate?

    Let’s give the government a TRILLION dollars, wait a year, and then all of us report how much our lives have improved. That would be cool. Too bad we could never just give the government that much money. That would be crazy. Sigh.

  29. The middle class makes twice what the lower middle class does in wages. But they pay more than 179% more in taxes.

    Again, in the example (not yours) the flat tax eliminates any accusation of class warfare. Your example only proves it’s not about being rich … again it’s about the huge gap between those who have and those who have not.

    Focus on the last sentence in the piece:
    Maybe the answer is not to tax the rich less, but to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation. When we find effective ways to fight poverty and we get more people actively engaged in the economy, the huge discrepancy between the rich and not-so-rich decreases and everyone ends up paying a fairer share of the overall tax burden.

    Again, the fact that the top 10% pay 70% of the tax burden is a consequence of capitalism gone haywire. It is not a consequence of any “soak the rich” strategy.

  30. Rabbit you’ve moved the goal post. We are (or at least I am) not discussing whether our government is a worthy custodian of our tax dollars. That is a totally different discussion.

    The topic at hand is simply that using the 10/70 statistic to make me feel sorry for the rich just doesn’t cut it.

  31. R, I don’t see how you divorce the ideological difference in the purpose of the tax from what you perceive to be the wisdom of Hayes observation. I really don’t.

    The point you endeavor to make is “the rich don’t pay their fair share.” When the bulk of the income taxes paid is coming form the rich (10/70) the question is “why isn’t that their fair share?” When that percentage is zero for a near majority of the country, why is that percentage “fair” if the real issue isn’t wealth redistribution.

    In other words, it’s not about feeling”sorry for the rich.” It’s all about “fairness” which is something different to someone that views the role of governement as you do from a conservative. Haye’s dumb observation doesn’t change the import of the 10/70 meme.

  32. Focus on the last sentence in the piece:
    Maybe the answer is not to tax the rich less, but to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation. When we find effective ways to fight poverty and we get more people actively engaged in the economy, the huge discrepancy between the rich and not-so-rich decreases and everyone ends up paying a fairer share of the overall tax burden.

    R,
    Find an answer to that question that doesn’t either (a) artificially limit what people can make, or (b) simply redistribute their earnings to someone who doesn’t make as much.

    If you won’t do either, then you aren’t serious.

    But then, you aren’t serious anyway, since the spark for the discussion of taxing the rich is the government’s “need” for additional “revenue”.

    And why does the government “need” this additional “revenue”? because it wants to spend more on entitlements, which at their core, are the definition of redistribution of wealth, based on the perception that some people “need” government to play Robin Hood for them.

    A shorter version of this post would have been “Don’t you dare change the progressive income tax, unless it it to make it more progressive, you evil , greedy rich people who are stealling “the nation’s wealth.”

  33. Then tell me how you propose our government, who thinks nothing of expensing $16.00 muffins with the money taken from the taxpayers, will close the gap between the haves and have nots. One stipulation – your solution must create jobs and increase net wealth. Seems we went down this road the last three years of empty promises, and it has done nothing but increase the welfare rolls. We now have record poverty and record annual debt, and we’ve accumulated over $4.3 trillion of debt the last 32 months with nothing more than claims of “saved jobs” and prevented another “Depression” – which is nothing but speculation, as there is no way to prove that. If you believe the results of 2010 were an indication of public opinion, the public doesn’t buy the Lib argument.

    And we have a President who campaigned on halving the debt his first two years who has overseen the tripling of the annual debt. If more government spending for shovel ready projects were the solution irrespective of who is paying for it, we should be well on our way to tall cotton and improving economic conditions by now, should we not? Unemployment should not have increased over 8%? Wasn’t that the promise?

    Maybe the answer is not to tax the rich less, but to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation. When we find effective ways to fight poverty and we get more people actively engaged in the economy, the huge discrepancy between the rich and not-so-rich decreases and everyone ends up paying a fairer share of the overall tax burden.

    In the last 25 years, to the best of my knowledge, the most effective government program to decrease welfare and increase the poor’s marginal income was welfare reform act of 1996. Isn’t it you guys always bragging about Clinton’s “huge surpluses”? Tell you what. Cut the food stamp allocation by 50%, and I’ll propose loud and clear that we increase the tax burden on the rich from 35% to 39.6% (restoration of the highest marginal tax rates under Clinton) – with the rich being defined as anyone who makes more than $1,000,000.00 a year.

    Instead of giving us phony examples completely irrelevant to today’s job situation, marginal income and tax structure, why don’t you give us your suggestions for improving economic conditions to decrease poverty. If you think taxing the rich is the best solution, tell us why.

    And after you do, I will offer the historical record from the best economist of the last half century to explain why taxing the rich does nothing to create wealth for the poor, and in fact promotes more poverty and contracts the economy. The record is very clear and unambiguous for any student that would bother to review American economic history.

    I don’t think you’ve got a suggestion besides calling for some more entitlements, paid for by the sweat equity of others – and I know for a fact MSNBC doesn’t.

  34. Here “R”, perhaps you can explain this situation while you’re answering my last question.

    Coca-Cola CEO Says China Now More “Business Friendly” than the United States

    http://danieljmitchell.wordpress.com/2011/09/27/coca-cola-ceo-says-china-now-more-business-friendly-than-the-united-states/

    Do you see a problem with any of Obama’s policies in that title “R”? Do you think Chaz Maddow or Little Winkie Hayes might see a problem and offer a solution? Does Obama share any of the blame and will taxing the rich some more solve this issue?

  35. The point you endeavor to make is “the rich don’t pay their fair share.”

    On the contrary I’m arguing with those who say the rich pay MORE than their fair share. That is what the whole 10/70 complaint is about … the poor rich bearing too much of the tax burden.

  36. And why does the government “need” this additional “revenue”? because it wants to spend more on entitlements,

    Now that’s funny … I thought we needed more revenue to help bring down the debt. Silly me.

  37. Chris Hayes or not, flat tax on income is the most fair and yes, statistics can be and are often misleading. Sales and excise taxes are huge! The problem is not that we aren’t paying enough taxes. The problem lies in that ginormous sucky monster that collects them. That, and plenty of the biggest players offshore their income which avoids even a flat tax. There is no accountability. We need to be lean and responsible. Balance our budget without killing off our citizens in the process.

    Here’s legitimate corruption by government. Where’s your moral outrage?

    Tex,

    This isn’t the “scandal of the century”. This is another political bomb. Locate the source of corruption. Here’s another stalled appointment by the good ole boys keeping O from cleaning house in the ATF coming back to bite his butt. But go ahead and enjoy your moral outrage moment.

    “There are still many questions to be answered about what happened in Operation Fast and Furious and who else bears responsibility,” said Republican Representative Darrell Issa, chairman of the House Oversight Committee.

    For years the ATF has been without a director confirmed by the U.S. Senate. The position has been the source of tension between advocates and opponents of gun control.

    President Barack Obama has nominated Andrew Traver of the agency’s Chicago office to the job, but the gun industry has opposed him. Melson is a career federal employee.

    Obama will need to nominate someone to fill the U.S. Attorney’s post. Burke previously served as chief of staff to Janet Napolitano when she was Arizona governor.

    Melson was interviewed on July 4 by congressional investigators. At that time he acknowledged mistakes had been made and other law enforcement agencies had had critical information they did not share about their targets.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/30/us-usa-mexico-atf-idUSTRE77T3NT20110830

    No cooperation between agencies. Sound familiar? Even my kids used this same excuse when they were at home. Power play.

    This whole government needs more than just a tuneup and some bodywork. It needs a total rebuild. Some parts are resistant to retooling. I suspect we’ll throw a rod or bust a u-joint before the next election.

  38. “On the contrary I’m arguing with those who say the rich pay MORE than their fair share. That is what the whole 10/70 complaint is about … the poor rich bearing too much of the tax burden.”

    Then the current rates end the debate?

    Come on, R. It’s opposite sides of the same coin. That was my point.

  39. Poolman, were this a Republican Administration, you and that jackboot, lying sack of crap you fawn over at Vet’s Today would be frothing at the mouth, screaming for impeachment of Bush and his attorney general, possibly for crimes against humanity. Don’t tell me otherwise. It’s an insult.

    Here, we have a serious breach that has actually led to many Mexican and a few American deaths directly tied to the actions of the Federal Government, more specifically Eric Holder and the ATF. This is far more serious than Iran Contra, because Americans are actually being killed – and the evidence for proving as much is being stonewalled by the incompetent, liar and racist Eric Holder and his lackeys that make up the MSM.

    Not only are you a rube, you’re a dishonest shill for the Dimocratic party like those dolts you gossip with at Chatty Kitchen. Part propagandist, part hypocrite, part political hack, every charge you make must always be measured within the bounds of your “ginormous” duplicity of selective moral outrage.

    You’re very much like Rutherford, minus the credential. It’s no different than your mixed “christian” with a small “c” conclusions about abortion.

  40. Coca-Cola CEO Says China Now More “Business Friendly” than the United States

    A statement like this doesn’t tell me the US is wrong in its approach to business. We, for one, are just more regulatory. That is when we enforce them. If you know anything about Coca Cola, it doesn’t have a real good reputation. I use to have stock that I got rid of when I learned a little more about their endeavors. Globally they have committed some serious crimes and they have numerous groups opposing them.

    Here’s a somewhat tame version of their atrocities:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Coca-Cola

  41. Right Poolman. 😆 Now Coca Cola is the evil empire. I’d like to teach the world ding all people into poverty, I’d like to teach the gov to sling big business into bankruptcy…

    Best I can tell from your life’s experiences, the entire world besides you is impure, unbalanced and corrupted – except Veterans Today and Chatty Kitchen.

    We, for one, are just more regulatory. </blockquote<

    Right. So regulatory, that one out of eight dollars spent by business is compliance. Let's see if we can hamstring business to the point of all of us being regulated right out of business? How would that work for you big government guys?

    Speaking of serious crimes, how did that Sarbanes-Oxley regulation work during the financial crisis again? 🙄

    No wonder the country is going down the tubes.

  42. Tex,

    The medication you’re on needs some tweaking or just quit writing your own prescriptions! Aside from the fact we have been in the illegal gun business AND the illegal drug business all along, really makes your allegations more comical. More serious than Iran Contra? 🙄 Seriously?

    When 25 percent of your appointments are still not filled after over a year and a half, there’s a problem. I don’t think we have ever seen so much obstruction. This system is broken.

    http://hlpronline.com/2011/04/politics-and-the-federal-appointments-process/

    I sincerely hope they do get to the bottom of this investigation and figure out who is responsible. I wish they went after 9/11 with even a hint of this enthusiasm. Of course, this incident has already achieved its political purpose though it hasn’t even peaked yet.

  43. “Now that’s funny … I thought we needed more revenue to help bring down the debt. Silly me.”

    I disagree Rutherford. Bring down the debt first.

    This discussion regarding increasing the tax rate leaves out a common denominator, Expense.

    If a person receives a raise and increases his expenses, he is no better off than he was before receiving the raise.

    Corporations are racking up profit because they have curtailed expense.

    Until the government is willing to cut their expenses, they should not be entitled to more revenue.

    Why is this concept so hard for Congress to grasp? Politics maybe 😉

    When it’s all said and done, there may be no government for the people by the people but corporations will be solvent. Maybe they will jump in and take care of the poor as charity.

    Hope I’m not repeating someone’s thoughts as I haven’t read all the comments.

    We really need a CEO to run this country and his salary should be based on profits earned.

  44. I wish they went after 9/11 with even a hint of this enthusiasm. Of course, this incident has already achieved its political purpose though it hasn’t even peaked yet.

    Every time you spew nonsense like this, and expect to be taken seriously, I’m reminded of the definition of insanity.

  45. Well BIC, you’ve got to consider the source.

    “Archangel” Poolman is not the most buoyant toy in the pool. A combination of delusions of purity, combined with a false sense of piety and treasonous nature doesn’t rate highly on the scale of virtues.

    And to be honest Poolman’s sole purpose (for me) anymore is to point out the left’s vacuous nature, their selective memory and utter contempt for reasoned opinion.

    Poolman resides with Obama the Stone at the bottom of deep end – without the ability to read off the teleprompter. But he’s much better than O’Bozo in the pulpit.

    ———–

    This Fast and Furious thing is not going to pass – it’s far more egregious then Solyndra, or even libs now posing questions of suspending votes and suggestions for us becoming less democratic. Thank you Bev Perdue.

    That’s actually a little bit of true nature liberalism bubbling to the surface. The honesty was appreciated, even if the suggestion incredibly galling.

    Liberalism is falling apart at the seams – three years too late.

  46. BiW,

    It isn’t nonsense. It is fact. The Bush administration did not want to do an investigation. The families insisted. Fact.

    Or are you alluding to the recent ATF incident, whether or not it is politically charged? The criticism points to an Acting Justice Department Inspector General Cynthia Schnedar, another unfilled appointment.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/21/us-usa-mexico-guns-idUSTRE78K7EZ20110921

    Find me the letter stating these same valid concerns regarding the 9/11 investigation. Just like Monica Lewinsky. Political priorities. Insanity.

  47. I have a very dumb question.

    Let’s say I’m sitting on some under performing stock that I want to remain long on.

    I bought the stock in 2011.

    Let’s also say that my ass is on the line for some Cap Gains tax. If I sold the stock and then immediately bought it back, investing the same amount, would that off set some of my cap gains I owe?

  48. I’ve drawn so many checks, often times for a few hundred bucks, I don’t even know what I’m up. Etrade doesn’t to my knowledge keep a running tab of profit/loss when deposits/withdrawal are in the mix.

    Am I wrong? Anyone use Etrade?

    I suppose I could easily just add up all my transactions.

    You would think they would do this for you on your portfolio homepage and give you a true figure of where you stand for the year.

    I just learned today that you can click a button for any dividend paying stock you own and they reinvest the dividend for you without commission.

    Didn’t know you could do that.

    A fool and his money to be sure. But its fun!

  49. Until the government is willing to cut their expenses, they should not be entitled to more revenue.

    Well Raji, on this I agree and most reasonable players are saying that the road to recovery is paved with increased revenue AND budget cuts, not one without the other. The problem with the GOP is they have suck at the teat of Grover Norquist and refuse to budge on any revenue increases.

    If someone can prove that the debt can be paid down through cuts alone and not do damage then please have at it.

    We really need a CEO to run this country and his salary should be based on profits earned.

    That leaves Romney and Herman Cain.

  50. Mowahahahahaha! Later Red Sox.

    By the way, Paplebon’s “scary” look is beyond crusty. What a fucking goat.

    Awesome night of baseball.

    I can’t even fall a sleep I’m in such shock.

  51. We really need a CEO to run this country and his salary should be based on profits earned.

    Oh … and lets please remember, the country is not a company. Companies, especially 21st century companies have no social contract with their employees. Civilized countries do.

  52. This one is for Tex who loves to diss LBJ’s Great Society. I heard a stat today that flushes your critique down the toilet.

    The poverty rate was cut in half between 1964 and 1970 in no small part due to LBJ’s programs. The question remains why were the gains relatively short-lived.

  53. Rabbit I have an IRA with eTrade so the only thing you said that rings true to me is that reinvestment of dividends which happens painlessly.

    When I used to hold stock at Scottrade, they gave very clear reports that told you where you were up and where you were down.

    I found your question a bit confusing since you don’t pay cap gains until you sell. If you’re sitting on a stock long term, where is the problem? I may be off base but trying to avoid cap gains by buying the stock you just sold doesn’t work. The way you counteract cap gains unfortunately is to take a loss on a losing stock that you sold that hopefully wipes out the gains in the winning stock. But then you haven’t made any money at all so what is the point?

    I think Tex has played the market more recently than I have. Maybe he can give you a more cogent answer.

  54. Human nature. 6 years must be the magic number for total soul sucking dependency.

    The murder rate amongst blacks flushes everything you stand for down the toilet.

    I wonder how many dependent savages had to die tonight so that your party could have it’s precious little voting block?

    Free opiates. Free food. Fathers need not apply.

    Yeah dude, keep grasping for straws.

  55. R,

    I owe cap gains. I also own a stock that I could sell for a loss right now. But, I want to keep it, because I think its going to go up. If I sold it then buy it again, my cap gains would be lowered/wiped out but my stock could go up (I wouldn’t sell the second time if it goes up).

    Does that make any sense?

    At least my loss would have potential to make money instead of dead on arrival tax money owed.

  56. OK Rabbit, now I get your stock scenario. I can’t swear to this but I thought back in the day I had read that you can’t claim a loss on a stock you sold if you bought the same stock back right away. I wish I was 100% sure on this. (For one thing, the timing of purchase and sale of stocks can put you in the day trading category if the intervals are too small … I’m pretty sure.)

    Once Tex checks back in, maybe he can pipe in.

  57. I believe the answer is individual plays. Back when I was in the market I think I had to itemize gains on a stock by stock basis on my return. But then when you add up all the profit and loss, it still comes to net profit anyway, doesn’t it?

  58. So I can put you all down for lifting the cap on SS taxes. I mean since rich people have no problem paying their fair share,

    By all means – when you agree to privatize SS.

    Why would you want to give SS to Wall street? And that doesn’t answer the question. If asking rich people to go back to pre-2001 tax rates is class warfare, then why is it not class warfare that I pay 4% plus in SS taxes and someone making a million pays less than half of one percent. Now that’s class warfare.

  59. Because 66% of the people favor it. This is still a democracy, right?

    So if I convince 66% of the people that I need your stuff more than you do, I can have it? See, isn’t it fun to live somewhere where its ok to covet other people’s stuff?

    And no, it is a democratic republic. Yes, there is a difference.

  60. “The days of you buying votes to steal elections and leaving people in the poor house to enslave them to feckless federal government needs to come to an end”

    Actually, poor farms and poor houses were prevelant in the US up UNTIL SS was adopted. Ahh, the smell of irony in the morning.

  61. “Name a COngressman making $400,000.”

    This dude, John Fleming, right here.

    “The amount that I have to reinvest in my business and feed my family is more like $600,000 of that $6.3 million,” Fleming explained. “So by the time I feed my family I have, maybe, $400,000 left over to invest in new locations, upgrade my locations, buy more equipment.”

    Just another regular Joe, struggling to get by on 400 grand.
    http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/rep-john-fleming-field-criticism-over-600k-income-153305241.html

  62. “I don’t mind taking the cap off, as long as you don’t cap their benefits.” – Gorilla

    Glad you’ve seen the light, Gorilla. Another convert. Watch out Tex, looks like you could be losing your iron grip on this forum. 🙂

  63. “The point you’re purposely missing is that with a flat tax, everyone has “skin in the game”. We don’t have nearly fifty % paying nothing or worse yet, getting money back when they pay nothing.”

    Nobody pays nothing. If you earn a wage, you pay taxes. FICA. If you own a phone you pay taxes. If you buy beer you pay taxes. If you buy cigs,gas, airline tickets, you pay taxes. We all have skin in the game, including many who can’t even vote.

  64. “So if I convince 66% of the people that I need your stuff more than you do, I can have it? See, isn’t it fun to live somewhere where its ok to covet other people’s stuff?

    And no, it is a democratic republic. Yes, there is a difference”- BIW

    Go for it, but since most of us are in the same boat, you’ll have a hard time doing it. This is still a democratic republic, isn’t it?

  65. “Well Raji, on this I agree and most reasonable players are saying that the road to recovery is paved with increased revenue AND budget cuts, not one without the other. The problem with the GOP is they have suck at the teat of Grover Norquist and refuse to budge on any revenue increases. ” – R

    R, you haven’t been listening. We’re against raising taxes, not against raising revenue. Yes, there is a difference. Reform the tax code, removing deductions and lowering the rate, and the revenue the fed receives will go up. Works every time…

  66. BiW: “I swear your template hates my computer…between the screen wrap, and having the button bar below the comment box stuck in front of where I am commenting…

    Same here. I wish I could get rid of that damn pop-up on the right asking me if I want to follow this blog. Hell, this blog follows me!

  67. Rabbit, I jumped down. If BiW didn’t already answer, he’ll know better than me. But the repurchase of the same asset doesn’t work under the code. They have a look back period that prevents that game.

    Losses in one year can be set against gains in another though.

    As I type this, I wonder whether Rutherford grasped the reason I mentioned capital gains tax in my initial comments. That of course is the real tax rate for the super rich, not income tax.

    And one more thing, FUCK! Fuckin’ Sox. Fuckin’ Braves. I got two black eyes last night.

    Oh, make that three after PF’s so-called ass-kicking. 😆 😆

  68. G said, “We’re against raising taxes, not against raising revenue. Yes, there is a difference. Reform the tax code, removing deductions and lowering the rate, and the revenue the fed receives will go up. Works every time…”

    Damn skippy. And don’t leave out increasing the tax base which in turn generates more revenue (and generally lower expenditure).

    Again, if the object weren’t wealth redistribution the libs would speak the same language. Obama’s take on capital gains rates is a perfect example.

  69. Thorazine, do you work in a paint factory?

    John Fleming’s congressional salary is not $400k. It’s his business income that’s discussed. You don’t pay that Numb Nut.

  70. “if someone can prove that the debt can be paid down through cuts alone and not do damage then please have at it.”

    Rutherford, ask the man on the street who is already doing what the government needs to do. Damage may just have to be a consequence of budget cuts. When you cut your budget, left your house and moved, didn’t you incur damage? Haven’t we all in the past few years incurred some form of damage to our lifestyle?

    Government is still trying to prove there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

  71. Man, what a fool. He brags about shooting someone’s argument down, and in the next sentence, proves beyond a shadow of a doubt he’s a full fledged idiot.

    This one is for Tex who loves to diss LBJ’s Great Society. I heard a stat today that flushes your critique down the toilet.

    The poverty rate was cut in half between 1964 and 1970 in no small part due to LBJ’s programs. The question remains why were the gains relatively short-lived.

    I can remove half of America today from poverty. Give me a couple of trillion to give away, and I can eliminate all poverty – for a few years.

    Hey Ozzie, you flushed my critique down the toilet? We’ve still got the Great Society, do we not? We’ve had it for almost 50 years now, have we not? We’ve spent in the neighborhood of $8 trillion to eliminate poverty since ’64, have we not?

    We’ve now got record poverty, have we not? 48 million on food stamps?

    ** GUFFAW ** The circle is complete. Rutherford has morphed into Yeller Dawg.

    Next time you see them blow up another of those war zone hotels in South Chicago demolished, or see another crack baby bludgeoned to death by his multi-generational black mother with father whereabouts unknown, remember this conversation. I certainly will.

    Your Great Society destroyed black America. Have no fear. There’s a large segment of white trash in a hurry to join them.

  72. Government Rutherford and Thorazine is are still trying to prove there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

    I think they are coveting one of those $16 muffins. As long as you’ll pay for it Raji. 😉

    To a lib, envy is the most virtuous of all qualities.

  73. Ten dollars to a donut Thorazine is living with assistance off a government dole. He pays taxes on his phone bill. You pay 33% of your paycheck toward fed taxes, and pay fed taxes on your phone bill. You pay for your house. You pay for his house.

    That makes for shared sacrifice. I would have made a good lib in an earlier day. 😉

  74. Same here. I wish I could get rid of that damn pop-up on the right asking me if I want to follow this blog. Hell, this blog follows me!

    LOL.

    I’m sorely tempted to get into a screen sharing session with one of you to see what the hell you’re talking about. I get no pop-ups and my comment box is perfectly legible and easy to use.

    Feel free to contact me personally with a screenshot or something. I use Firefox both on a Vista and XP machine with no problems at all. If you guys are using Opera on a Linux machine, then I can’t help you.

  75. I am absolutely sure I can conduct a poll to get not just 66% but upwards of 90% of the American public to agree to an opinion, if you will allow me to frame the question.

    Something like “Do you believe rich people should pay more in taxes?”

    But if I rephrase the question to include “Do you believe rich people should pay more in taxes, if it would lead to the deterioration of small business and the unemployment rate doubling?”

    It’s the same people assuring me that Obama is in the same approval position as Ronald Reagan was in 1983. Or Chrissie Hayes economic examples.

  76. I think they are coveting one of those $16 muffins.

    I love how you boys attach yourself to fiction just because you heard it on Faux News. The $16 muffin is a myth. The caterer (it may have been Marriott, I’m not sure) said the $16 included facility rental, full continental breakfast, etc. The muffins alone were not $16.00.

    But please go on spouting nonsense. Just makes Obama look that more viable for a second term. 😆

  77. Well it is good to see you acknowledge that.

    Largest segment of poverty. I strive to seek truth. Now let’s see if you can muster up the courage to do the same?

    Do you want to reflect back on the success of the Great Society again as unemployment strains to reach 50% in the inner city? Or do you just want to pretend that $16 muffins gives you a great degree of confidence Obama and his minions can manage health care?

  78. Watch George Will give a review of Obama’s mythological rhetorical powers. This is too good.

    Shame you don’t listen to the “radio” show. I gave props to Will two shows ago for this analysis.

  79. So $16 muffins are a myth? As is $8.00 coffee? Somebody needs to tell the staff of the U.S. Justice Dept. Audit.

    $16 muffins, $8 coffee served in Justice audit

    Today, a spokesman for the Justice Department inspector general said, “We stand by our report.”

    Anybody remember this one? My favorite…

    http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/story?id=3603415&page=1

    So, is the WAPO also in the bag?

    Dead federal retirees are paid $120 million annually, report says

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/dead-federal-retirees-are-paid-120-million-annually-report-says/2011/09/22/gIQAMjT0oK_story.html?wprss=rss_homepage

  80. Tex, my statement followed by question which you found asinine was stated and asked sincerely. Stats showed that the Great Society worked initially. So what went wrong? I haven’t researched it but perhaps the focus went off things like HeadStart and moved more toward welfare programs? I don’t know. Bottom line is that out of the box Great Society worked. What needs to be done is figure out why and restore the balance that worked.

    I suspect that your assertion that we live with the Great Society today wouldn’t hold up to scrutiny. Something went haywire. Neither LBJ nor MLK would find today comparable to 1968.

  81. Tex, the best thing Janeane Garafolo can do for the Dem party is shut the hell up.

    Skank Garafolo is one of the few libs willing to admit the truth for the intended path of progressive politics. In fact, I admire Skank for her honesty. Wish we could find more of the real scoop here.

    How about liberal’s wishes to simply revoke the vote for a couple of years like the N.C. governor? Of course, once it got out, it was all a joke. Like $16.00 muffins.

    One question. If the muffins were basically included in the fare, I’m just wondering why $16.00 for anything exceeds the Hilton’s cost of the entire continental breakfast, which is supposed to be $14 per person?

    Reads to me like your PuffHO article (the gospel of truth) isn’t adding up.

  82. Bottom line is that out of the box Great Society worked. What needs to be done is figure out why and restore the balance that worked.

    Like I said – give me a couple of trillion to address a problem, free food, booze, smokes and gas, and for a short time, I can make it work like gangbusters. Buy a vote too.

    Give me an unlimited VISA card and I can live like a king.

    For a few years….

  83. Rutherford –
    To a non-liberal, looking in on the liberal thought process is a confusing thing. Little news flash: if something doesn’t work, it just doesn’t work, but the liberals are so bought-in to their fundamental tenets, if something doesn’t work it must because we did it wrong or didn’t give it enough time.

    The liberal thought process IMHO only looks at the surface of the lake but never sees beneath. Yes, giving people free goods and services (Of course it isn’t really free, is it? Somebody earned it.) looks like just the ticket on the surface, but it is only a temporary veneer; it doesn’t address the root cause and the root fix of “poverty.” Those can only be addressed by the carrot and the stick, and the uncomfortable truth is that it takes both.

  84. “if something doesn’t work, it just doesn’t work, but the liberals are so bought-in to their fundamental tenets, if something doesn’t work it must because we did it wrong or didn’t give it enough time.”

    But PF, if it’s done with good intentions then doing it differently could only be due to bad intentions.

  85. It’s taken three, long years. But it is becoming all too obvious that the Obama regime is Chicago style corrupted to the core – and in every facet of the administration – Eric Holder being enemy #1.

    The regime includes Nanzi Pelosi and Harry Reid.

    SOLYNDRA REDUX: Obama Gives $737 Million Dollar Loan To Solar Company Connected To Nancy Pelosi’s Brother In Law

    http://americanglob.com/2011/09/28/solyndra-redux-obama-gives-737-million-dollar-loan-to-solar-company-connected-to-nancy-pelosis-brother-in-law/

  86. “if someone can prove that the debt can be paid down through cuts alone and not do damage then please have at it.”

    Do “damage” to what? Entitlements?

    You don’t seem to understand, R… as you have been told time and time again, they don’t fall under the category of what the federal government needs to be doing, which means they are the first things to go under the knife.

    Do “damage” to the Department of Education or the Department of Endergy? Again, things the federal government should be doing, and even if they were, they have been such crashing failures, that their elimination should be viewed with delight, not anguish.

    Seriously, R. We still have the means to allow the federal government to do the duties expressly reserved to it, but it will mean eliminating the overreach, the encroachment of state authority, and the special welfare masquerading as “general welfare”.

    Because this would eliminate the Democrats’ power base overnight, I don’t expect that it will happen.

  87. “I am absolutely sure I can conduct a poll to get not just 66% but upwards of 90% of the American public to agree to an opinion, if you will allow me to frame the question.” – Tex

    Tex, if you don’t trust Gallup, stop quoting them.

  88. “if something doesn’t work, it just doesn’t work, but the liberals conservatives are so bought-in to their fundamental tenets, if something doesn’t work it must [be] because we did it wrong of government intervention or didn’t give it enough time lack of privatization.”

    There. That helps pare that ideological apple.

  89. Neither LBJ nor MLK would find today “the democratic party” comparable to 1968.

    I think it would be endlessly entertaining to see LBJ and say Sheila Jackson Lee, or Maxine Waters come face to face with each other.

    As for Dr. King, after last years’ great non-story of Spittlegate, and some of the finer moments of the CBC and the Wrong Reverend Jack-son’s career over the last two decades, he’d break out into tears, look John Lewis and the Wrong Rev in the face, say “I NEVER knew you and turn and shake the dust from his heels as he left.

  90. “Thorazine, do you work in a paint factory?

    John Fleming’s congressional salary is not $400k. It’s his business income that’s discussed. You don’t pay that Numb Nut.” – ET

    ET, I never said it was his congr. salary, I was pointing out that he whines about getting by on $400,000 after taxes (actually $600,000. He apparently pays $200,000 for groceries ???) So I was saying I needed to go to work so I could pay my taxes so he wouldn’t have to pay more and suffer further. Double Numb Nut on you. Paint factory … now there’s n idea. 🙂

  91. “One quick perusal of that infestation of maggots on your blog told me all I need to know about your idea of fairness and truth, concerning matter of politics and money.” – Tex

    R, do you think Tex is going off of memory, or do you think he’s sneaking back to my blog every once in a while? When I first popped in here to be the pea under Princess Tex’s mattress, you told me that if he “researches” your blog it means you’ve really gotten his goat. So then, what should I infer from return visits? Terminal paranoia? Infatuation? It is a thin line. 🙂

  92. Tex,

    From your link in 113…

    Liberals in America need to wake up to reality. The only real problem with Capitalism in America is government interference in free markets for the personal gain of politically connected crooks.

    For some balance, see Halliburton/Dick Cheney or maybe Enron/George Bush. Graft isn’t a partisan player.

  93. Rutherford

    I use Firefox on a Mac OX and the pop-up is in the lower right hand corner almost covering up half of the right hand columns which makes it hard to click on comments. Sometimes the big pop-up disappears and just leaves a small one stating Follow.

    The big pop-up doesn’t show up on the comment page, only on the home page. I get the small pop-up on the comment page if I click on previous history.

  94. Thorazine, what do your heroes Gore, Clinton or Obama pull down without paying more than anyone else? If they want to kick-in more, let ’em. Same goes for you. After all, that’s what 66% are in favor of. . . the other guy paying more so they don’t have to.

    Be sure to strap on a respirator at work. Maybe it’ll improve your powers of observation. 🙄

  95. Well Al Poolman, you were never much of objective journalist – or much of anything for that matter. Kind of like your stand on abortion – murky.

    Did you not forget that Slick Willie, Serial Rapist Clinton was a huge benefactor of Enron? The biggest, as a matter of fact.

  96. Thorazine, you need to put the hash pipe down, or capture a few IP addresses. I haven’t been back to the infestation of lies and rank propaganda you call home since the first evening you cursed us with your presence here.

    Gov’t dole. 🙂

    Have you met Fakename2? You guys need to merge. And it’s been years since anybody merged with her, so she may swallow you whole.

  97. Yup. Obama is corrupt. The green scam is a connected free for all.

    One after another.

    If I was a lib I’d be so pissed. Here was this one chance to show off what government spending can do for America.

    A lib wet dream. A trillion dollar chance of a life time.

    Its not even just a disaster, it was theft with malicious intent.

    Of all the business men in America, Pelosi’s family gets the hook up.

    Or Obama’s big backer.

    Libs, it doesn’t piss you off?

  98. “I am absolutely sure I can conduct a poll to get not just 66% but upwards of 90% of the American public to agree to an opinion, if you will allow me to frame the question.” – Tex

    Tex, if you don’t trust Gallup, stop quoting them.

    It’s not that I don’t trust Gallup to relay the results. I’m absolutely sure they are correct in their sampling that 2/3 of America thinks the rich should pay more taxes.

    It’s that I think most Americans, say you, Rutherford and Poolman, are too clueless to understand the ramifications of overtaxing the rich – more specifically, small business. It’s like Obamacare – what seemed great in a moment of time and polled well, later became a universal Obamanation.

    Poolman didn’t even file a federal return for seven years as small business owner. Asking him for his opinion about equitability may get you the answer you want to develop a pat answer, but asking a 2″ x 4″ would provide more insight as to why that’s a good or bad thing.

    And guys like you have made Jersey Shore a big hit.

    So you can see why I interpret poll results with a grain of salt.

  99. Okay, Tex wins the low hand. He played the abortion card first. He also apparently was at the little boy’s room and missed the nonpartisan play. 🙄

  100. asking a 2″ x 4″ would provide more insight

    Ask Tex how his camera works in his phone… or how to snorkel… or how to paint… or how to get ice cream off a bedspread…

  101. I trip on the phrase “their fair share.” It’s…antagonistic. The implication of course is that “they” are not already doing that. Is that language sincerely meant to encourage agreement and compromise?

    The spending makes me dizzy. The waste, the fraud, the freebies, the scams. The talk is invariably about the other guy’s greed. Make me wanna hollah, throw up both my hands.

    Re: peas in mattresses. Always helpful to understand what motivates someone.

  102. Ask Tex how his camera works in his phone… or how to snorkel… or how to paint… or how to get ice cream off a bedspread…

    😆 😆 You’re seriously damaging me Poolman. 😆 😆

    Two of the four oopsies are bogus charges. Sherwin Williams determined the paint a bad batch. I didn’t think it important enough to share. The new comforter looks better. I didn’t think it important enough to share either – which gave my wife a chance to gig me. She laughed all weekend at my laundromat story. Worth every penny.

    I deserve to be mocked for the camera incident, which I still find humorous, as I am my own best audience.

    Now a more serious question. A hypothetical for our resident rocket scientist(s).

    What infringes more on democratic society?

    (A) Somebody having their phone turned backwards while taking a picture and laughing at themselves while doing so after realizing that was a picture of the photographer’s iris?

    OR

    (B) Somebody stiffing the government for taxes for seven years, welshing on the home mortgage for three and walking away, requiring creditors to chase down for not paying the home bills, and using Planned Parenthood for their family’s health care needs for years?

    Should we poll that one Hickory?

  103. CHANGE ME, I STINK! Classic billboard….

    http://www.wwltv.com/news/local/Controversial-political-sign-raises-eyebrows-130727418.html

    I think Obama looks kind of messianic in a diaper. 🙂 Right before the American public brings him up for execution removal from office.

    Rutherford, do you ever dream of those glory days three years ago? When Obama was Greek god, “Opollo”, standing in front of Styrofoam Greek Columns, in front of 80,000 screaming rubes fans, prostrate at the feet of the Chosen One?

    Man, did he sink like a stone into the Mariana’s Trench. 😆

  104. And guys like you have made Jersey Shore a big hit.

    ROTFLMAO! I would wager dollars to donuts that the majority of folks who tune into Jersey Shore are Republicans. Damn I wish I could prove it!

  105. I trip on the phrase “their fair share.”

    Muffy I get where you’re coming from but I dare say you, like some of the others here have missed the point.

    This piece is not an attack against the rich not paying their fair share. This piece is an attack against those who say the rich already pay much more than their fair share, and they use a bogus statistic to do it.

  106. This piece is not an attack against the rich not paying their fair share. This piece is an attack against those who say the rich already pay much more than their fair share, and they use a bogus statistic to do it.

    To hell it’s not. That is exactly the purpose of Chrissie’s convoluted example.

    And you have the gall to accuse someone of using “bogus statistics”, when his model makes the assumption 90% of the population makes the same thing?

    😆 😆 😆

    Unbelievable Yeller.

  107. “This piece is an attack against those who say the rich already pay much more than their fair share, and they use a bogus statistic to do it.”

    As I said, a distinction without difference to your point.

  108. “That was good. I’ll tell you who would enjoy watching that even more. Pfesser – that is electrical engineering gold, right there.”

    I have one of the drawings on paper from the late ‘seventies, given to me by one of the GE engineers that put our CT scanner in. I keep it in a sheet protector filed in a 3-ring notebook with all my other valuable humor.

    Have I regaled you with the ten rules for electrical technicians?

  109. Here you go:

    Ten Commandments for Electrical Technicians

    1. Beware the lightning that lurketh in the undischarged capacitor, lest it cause thee to bounce upon thy buttocks in a most un-technicianlike manner.

    2. Cause thou the switch that supplieth large quantities of juice to be opened and thusly tagged, that thy days in this earthly vale of tears be long.

    3. Prove to thyself that all circuits that radiateth, and upon which thy shalt toil, are grounded and thusly tagged, lest they lift thee unto radio frequency heaven.

    4. Tarry thou not amongst those fools that engageth in intentional shocks, for they are surely non-believers and are not longeth for this world.

    5. Take care that thou useth the proper method when thou taketh the measure of a high voltage circuit, lest thou incinerate both thyself and thy meter.

    6. Take care thou tampereth not with interlocks and safety devices, for this incurreth the wrath of thy supervisor and bringeth the fury of the safety inspector upon thy head and about thy shoulders.

    7. Toil not thou upon energized equipment, for if thou so dost, thy fellow workers will surely buy beers for thy widow and console her in other ways.

    8. Service thou equipment not alone, for electrical cooking is a slothful process and thou mightst sizzle in thine own juices for hours upon a hot circuit before thy maker dost see fit to end thy misery.

    9. Trifle thou not with radioactive tubes and substances, lest thou commenceth to glow in the dark like unto a lightning bug and thy wife hath no further use for thee other than for thy paycheque.

    10. Causeth thou to be tagged and documented all modifications made by thee upon equipment lest thy successor of needs teareth out his hair, and babble mightily, and goeth slowly mad in his attempt to decide what manner of creature madeth such a rat’s nest in the wiring of such equipment.

  110. Al-Qaida has sent a message to the Iranian president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, asking him to stop spreading conspiracy theories about the 9/11 attacks.

    This is surreal. Stop those damn truthers, no matter where!

    Al-Qaida also accused Iran of hypocrisy over its “anti-Americanism”.

    Awwwwwwww. Who’s the true theist truthiest?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep/28/al-qaida-ahmadinejad-911-conspiracy?newsfeed=true

    I love it when the “enemy” divides and fights among themselves. 😀

  111. And you have the gall to accuse someone of using “bogus statistics”, when his model makes the assumption 90% of the population makes the same thing?

    His model is simplified so folks fooled by the stat can clearly see what is wrong about it.

    My posts get auto-cross-posted to opensalon.com (a sister site of Salon.com). Some dude went on a rant over there … a rant you boys would have been proud of. He made some comparison of taxes paid to gross adjusted income thinking that totally invalidated Chris Hayes’ example.

    I always know I’m on the right track when you boys jump through hoops to avoid the simple truth. 😉

  112. As I said, a distinction without difference to your point.

    Hardly. Are we having a problem with the English language?

    John: I say the rich are taxed too much.
    Bob: I say they aren’t.
    John: Ah so you say they should be taxed more.
    Bob: No, I think they are taxed just right.
    John: Ah but if they’re not taxed too much then you must want them taxed more.
    Bob: What about “just right” do you not understand? [scratches head and walks away]

  113. If once is a coincidence (or a joke, as she would have us believe), and twice is a trend, does that mean that three times is a multi-pronged attack?

    It’s amazing how easily the disdain of democracy purses off a lib’s lips when they are “off record” and amongst their own, taped anonymously. How dare these serfs and peasants render their voice. Hints of fascism and elitism like Dear Leader Obama occasionally seep out when the facade is dropped, in between grimaces of discussion of those ignorant religious, bitter clingers.

    I don’t think Rutherford would ever sink to the level of proposing elections be “postponed” indefinitely, but you guys tell me – does anybody here really believe stooges like Graychin, or those thugs, stooges and goons at Chatty Kitchen if given the chance, wouldn’t follow Hugo Chavez’s lead?

  114. I read BiW’s latest post. Good heavens, lady makes a kindergarten comment about some way to get Congress to behave better and BiW writes a tome complete with founding father quotes to let everyone know the country is coming apart at the seams.

    BiW, I sure hope you’re less melodramatic with your clients. 😉

    P.S. The most revealing thing I got out of BiW’s post was that the Gov of NC is a Democrat. Who woulda thunk it?

  115. I always know I’m on the right track when you boys jump through hoops to avoid the simple truth.

    A little bit of that superficial intelligentsia and covetous nature of libs seeps through again. I might have to rethink the position of our blog author and his idea of “democracy”. I sense a disturbance in the force, and bitter clinger syndrome waffling through.

    Mistaking wisdom for foolishness, they never know we aren’t jumping through hoops to avoid the truth, but making damn sure that everybody understands how utterly mindless this lib propaganda really is.

  116. OK … one more thing about BiW’s post. Boys, this has nothing to do with tampering with democracy. It was a dumb idea but the idea was motivated by the notion that our Congresscritters are totally incented by the need to be reelected and it f*cks with their judgement. So the idea was, no worries about the next election gang cos there won’t be one. Just do your goddam job and in four years we’ll see where we are.

    Is it a dumb idea? Sure it is. Is it some evil strategy to sabotage our great democracy? No.

    One thing you boys clearly inherited from your dear departed leader Richard Nixon …. extreme paranoia. 😯

  117. R: “Hardly. Are we having a problem with the English language?”

    Tigre: Nope.

    R (last line of post): “Maybe the answer is not to tax the rich less, but to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation.”

    Tigre @ 47: “Then the current rates end the debate?”

    Crickets.

    Sorry R. I thought you had a point. And I thought that point was consistent with your other comments and Obama’s claims about “fair share.” One might think that if you direct us to the Muppet at MSNBC you agreed with him.

    Let it be known that R wants to create economic conditions such that more people share in the wealth of the nation but that does not include raising income tax on the rich a/k/a paying their “fair share.” 🙄

  118. So how about factoring the 50% that pay no taxes into Hayes’ “Inqualistan” hypothetical to show how stupid conservatives are for making an observation that eludes those that push a “pay their fair share” agenda?

  119. Whoops. I see now. Conservatives must be pushing for higher taxes “on all but the wealthy” in making their observation?

  120. My Gawd Poolman. Are you really this stupid to believe that nonsense? I believe you are. You’re not only the worst propagandist I’ve ever met, you’re the absolute dumbest one I’ve ever met.

    I’m tired of you going unpunished for your lies. I’m going to call your bluff. Let’s make this very personal.

    I am willing to forgo my anonymity right here on this board and give you and your allies a personal shot at me. One condition. All you have to do is agree to my bet.

    ———–

    I will give you 10-1 odds that your information is so wrong, I am willing to stake a very large sum of money.

    I will pay you $100,000.00. I will put it in writing witnessed by everyone on this board, payable upon your documented proof.

    But if I am right and you are wrong, you will pay me $10,000.00 payable immediately. That’s the price of getting to meet me in person.

    If you don’t have that to back up, I’m willing to trade the $10,000.00 for 10 lashes with a tool of my choice to be administered by me across your rear end, where I will remove every last piece of flesh from your worthless, lying, pathetic ass, and I will do it with great glee while doing so.

    Do we have a bet you fucking, useless tool?

    How about it Poolman?

  121. Tex,

    Your Charmin squeezer is so full of shit. I went and watched the 3 Jon Stewart videos associated with the interview he references. What a twisted tale of utter bullshit he spins. Your prophet, eh? 🙄

    I wouldn’t bet you a toenail clipping, Buckwheat. The numbers are Treasury Department sourced. FLASH! Kind of in your face, eh?

  122. I hate to sound like Poolman but those flyers we dropped on Japan prior to obliterating two of their cities, sounds a lot like post-war propaganda to me. The flyers read just too much like wholesome American apple pie and Chevrolet. Quite frankly I find it hard to believe such flyers were dropped and if so, that they translated in the way Bill Whittle says they did.

  123. All you have to do is agree to my bet.

    Oh God …. not another bet challenge. This has to be the 60th one since Tex arrived at Rutherfordistan.

    If it weren’t for the fact that I know Tex has zero expectation of ever being taken up on his bets, I’d wager Tex has a gambling problem. 😀

    P.S. Since I consider Rabbit to be the official RL Blog statistician (he’s counted my follies on many occasions) I now submit to him the task of tallying all of Tex’s bet challenges. Let’s see if my guess of 60 comes close.

  124. Hey Tex etal., I bet Herman Cain (or Herb as Sarah calls him) really floated your boat when he said blacks were brainwashed into voting Dem. When I saw his statement I immediately thought of my right minded buddies on the blog.

  125. If they want to kick-in more, let ‘em. Same goes for you. After all, that’s what 66% are in favor of. . . the other guy paying more so they don’t have to.

    I was perfectly in favor of letting the Bush tax cuts end. It would have raised all our taxes back to 2000 levels. You remember 2000, low unemployment, surpluses. Ahh the horror.

  126. “But if I am right and you are wrong, you will pay me $10,000.00 payable immediately. That’s the price of getting to meet me in person” -Tex

    Really? You deem yourself worthy of an appearance fee? How Clinton of you. 🙂

  127. “If you don’t have that to back up, I’m willing to trade the $10,000.00 for 10 lashes with a tool of my choice to be administered by me across your rear end, where I will remove every last piece of flesh from your worthless, lying, pathetic ass, and I will do it with great glee while doing so.

    Do we have a bet you fucking, useless tool?” -Tex

    Exactly what brand of Christianity do you practice?

  128. Thor,

    You’re about as objective, realistic and educated as Poolman. It took 15 seconds to determine that – garden variety imbecile, incapable of supporting himself, begging for benevolent Barack to SAVE ME! SAVE ME! You need to be down at Wall Street with the rest of the potato heads.

    So like Poolman, anything you provide is not only suspect and unreliable, but more likely pure garbage.

  129. Oh Brother Rutherford,

    You know why nobody has ever taken me up on my bets? Have you been able to figure that out yet? Why I keep making the same challenges to the same people? Because they would lose and because deep down, they are pussies. And I know that. 😈

    You don’t think I’m going to bet a $100,000.00 without it being a sure thing, do you? Only a potato headed liberal takes bets without already knowing the result. I insulted a good two by four today by comparing Hickory Poolman to it. It was an awful comparison. A 2″ x 4″ offers something of worth. Poolman has no worth.

    It’s not that the moronic mofo posted a completely bogus link which the rest of lucid America laughed at, and which even Hickory is now backing off. It’s that Hickory is so hideously stupid, he didn’t even recognize the utter bullshit to begin with. Like that Veteran’s Today Jew hating mag he loves to link. Aryan Brother crap….

    Like Michael Corleone said, “Don’t insult my intelligence…”

    I thought I was being pretty damn courteous with only offering to tear the flesh from Hickory’s ass. You can’t imagine what I really would like to do to the SOB. I’ve fantasized about it. 😉

  130. I wonder if piss pot is persian?

    (ABC News) — Iran is doubling down on the conspiracy theories after an al Qaeda magazine blasted Iranian president Mahmoud Adhmadinejad’s 9/11 claims, this time suggesting the true authors of the terror publication — which often instructs readers to murder Americans — are not radical Islamists, but secret agents for the CIA.

    Sandwiched between lengthy anti-American editorials, an al Qaeda author wrote in the latest issue of an al Qaeda English-language magazine called “Inspire” that Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad continued to spread the conspiracy theory that the U.S. government was behind the 9/11 attacks because Iran was jealous of al Qaeda.

    “For them, al Qaeda was a competitor for the hearts and minds of the disenfranchised Muslims around the world,” the article says. “Al Qaeda. . . succeeded in what Iran couldn’t. Therefore it was necessary for the Iranians to discredit 9/11 and what better way to do so? Conspiracy theories.”

    Responding to the article’s assertions today, Iranian state news repeated Ahmadinejad’s arguments and said “reports released by al Qaeda are usually believed to be produced by the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA).”

    Noting the general content of “Inspire” articles, a spokesperson for the CIA told ABC News, “There are some allegations that don’t even deserve comment. This is one.”

  131. Exactly what brand of Christianity do you practice?

    The kind that would gladly carry a whip in one hand and turn your blemished dove table over, as you and your feckless brothers steal from the offerings of the poor. 😉

    You do seem incredibly generous Thorazine.

    With other people’s money.

  132. Here Hickory, be sure to thank the American “mercenaries” sometime today. You can start by saying thank you to Gorilla for helping to protect your miserable life.

    http://news.yahoo.com/yemen-says-al-qaida-linked-cleric-al-awlaki-092634554.html

    That is the one thing I will give Obama credit for – continuing the kill Al Qaeda with a no mercy policy. Of course, it also reeks of hypocrisy. Anybody remember three years ago the unjust war mantra? Have we declared war on Yemen? Apparently so.

    How much better that Bush Doctrine looks when it’s you sitting in the big chair, hey Baroke?

    In comments at Harvard Law School, Obama aide John Brennan defended the legality of the strikes, insisting that attacks were never going to be restricted to “hot battlefields like Afghanistan” and adding “we reserve the right to take unilateral action if or when other governments are unwilling or unable.”

  133. “So how about factoring the 50% that pay no taxes into Hayes [important part omitted]”

    “Everybody pays taxes.”

    He excluded everything but income tax to create this epiphany for his dumb audience. That’s the point Numbnut.

    So tell us about how that fits into Hayes’ [important part omitted]. Rutherford won’t address it.

    And what’s stopping you from paying more tax Thorazine? Pony up.

  134. “Exactly what brand of Christianity do you practice?”

    It’s called “Punitive Christianity.” My porn friends have made a lot of money producing videos of Good Christian Men (clears throat) “correcting” their errant wives with some fearsome instrument across her pulchritudinous backside (followed immediately of course by hot sex). I’ve seen several references to such things by Tex recently – see, I knew he was a closet perv! Good for you. Tex!

  135. Punitive Christianity? 😈 Being the father of two young, beautiful women, if I really practiced “punitive” Christianity, a predatory pedophile of young women masquerading as radiologist might be looking at “00” coming out the barrel of a 12 gauge when he walked out of Lynchburg Radiology Clinic. My toothy grin would be his last memory on earth before he crossed over the River Styx. Guys like that should be grateful I’m nothing but a little, meek lamb.

    However…

    …I have to admit, this “punitive” Christianity you speak becomes more appealing by the day. I’m getting to that age where it becomes less important to count toward tomorrow, and I always did envision myself going out with a real bang. 😉

    You Pfesser, talking like you know something about Christianity, is like Larry Flynt discussing the virtue of fidelity in marriage. Oh wait! I forgot. You are a Flynt disciple. Never mind.

    I’m curious. These porn kings you befriended? I’m just wondering. Exactly who are these “Good Christian Men” you helped recruit? Ron “Beached Whale” Jeremy? Nah, he’s too Jewish. Isn’t Christianity to you like garlic to a vampire?

    What I picture in the theater of my mind about your “production on stage” is a bunch of fat, asthmatic tools, wearing nothing but gold chains and gold bracelets, grimacing behind the camera – flaccid and impatiently waiting for the Viagra to kick in.

  136. My, my, my Tex. Aren’t we testy today! Can’t take a little joke? What happened, did I inadvertently out you vis a vis your favorite perversion? Sorry, it was an accident.

    Since you are so wired today, you perv you, wanna go at it again? I’m not busy.

    If R allows it, I’ll send you a link to one of the videos I ran a camera on. I think it’s pretty hot myself. The girl is not that pretty, but she is a real spanko and her co-actor is actually her boyfriend in r/l – “real life.” You can tell they are really enjoying themselves; that’s what I like about working for my friend; everybody has a good time and the porn naturally flows from it. One of the models said that very thing on her personal site and we agree: it’s a lot of fun.

    To continue correcting you:

    I’m not in Lynchburg.

    I met Ron Jeremy, but he is not into spanking and he squicks the girls out. Nice fellow though…

    We don’t ask the models their religious preferences.

    ref: 00/12 ga. Make your first shot count. I’m always armed and I never miss.

    I know about the meek part. Figured you for the erstwhile Walter Mitty on your first post at Fat Grannies. Nobody but a pussy hides behind the Internet in order to abuse women. If you lived near me, I would definitely keep my eye on the kids, since you fit the “type” perfectly.

    BTW, we are not at Fat Grannies.

    Cordially,
    PFesser

  137. “What I picture in the theater of my mind about your “production on stage” is a bunch of fat, asthmatic tools, wearing nothing but gold chains and gold bracelets, grimacing behind the camera – flaccid and impatiently waiting for the Viagra to kick in.”

    Hahahahahahahahahah!

    That’s all I see too. 😆 😆

  138. ““What I picture in the theater of my mind about your “production on stage” is a bunch of fat, asthmatic tools, wearing nothing but gold chains and gold bracelets, grimacing behind the camera – flaccid and impatiently waiting for the Viagra to kick in.”

    Hahahahahahahahahah!

    That’s all I see too.”

    **************

    You guys are showing your ages. That is old-school ‘seventies stuff. You need to get out more; your lives of chronic repression are showing badly, I’m afraid.

    Porn is mainstream now. You old guys who trudge into the video store in your raincoats are passe. Nowadays it’s slick, well-photographed, color-balanced and relaxed. Talk to your kids; they’ll show you in about three minutes how it’s done now.

  139. Now Pfesser, tsk tsk…

    Wasn’t it you bragging about your exploits of smacking around wife #1 (probably in front of the kids), while you also threatened her mother with the electric chair? You sound like a real ‘Father Knows Best’ kind of sugar daddy. And wasn’t it you that was bragging as head resident about bagging all the first year med students Johnny Wadd? Reads like a predator to me. Does wife #2, #3, #4 know any of that?

    Alexandria or there abouts is not too far. But have no fear. Unless it’s my own daughter’s a fat, old, asthmatic perv like you was bird dogging, to each their own. I wouldn’t bother to walk across the street to shoot you otherwise. My shotgun vs. your 38? I’m willing to stake some serious skin in the game you’re not nearly as good, not nearly as talented, nor nearly as tough as you’d like the rest of us to believe. I have this fuzzy feeling if that ever comes to a dual, when you see my toothy grin, your gun will have never left the holster but your pants will be soiled to the soles of your shoes Marshall Dillon. And I doubt the attending clinic will bother to clean you up.

    Nobody but a pussy hides behind the Internet in order to abuse women.

    😆 😆 😆

    You frickin’ worm and hypocrite. That’s even more pitiful that your threats of karate. Now you really have shaken me to the bone.

    If what you accuse me of is true numb nuts…this terribly abuse…

    …the best case scenario dickhead, is you’re right there with me. Didn’t you stop to think about that before you typed that spew, worm? Until I showed up, those same women you are trying to condemn me with hated your guts because you mocked them too. And that’s your only redeeming quality. I’m just your partner in crime.

    Is that what we were doing? Abusing the poor, poor little girls at Fat Grannies? 😆

  140. Rutherford –

    I may be wrong, but to my mind your idea that the Left is the champion of civil liberties and the Right is the oppressor demonstrates how one can believe the Great Lie if it’s told enough.

    In point of fact in my experience the Democrats have been much worse. Remember Ruby Ridge, Waco? Who was President then? As a dyed-in-the-wool Libertarian, I have collected numerous examples of the Federal Boys in their black ninja outfits and black ninja helicopters swooping down on citizens – sometimes doctors, including one female gp in ?Montana? who was accused of Medicare fraud. (She was not guilty, BTW and was acqitted – but not until her children had watched her thrown to the ground in their own back yard and spirited away, hands cuffed behind her back.) An FBI man and I nearly got in a fistfight at my engineering school on “Career Day” when he tried to recruit me for the FBI and I wasn’t interested. (This was right after Ruby Ridge; I think it was the, “No thanks, I have my reputation to think about” that pissed him off.)

    What am I smoking? Nothing right now. Whaddya got? LOL

  141. Why Tex, whatever is the matter? You sure are wired today!

    Don’t worry; the Little Woman will give you a good spanking when she gets home and you will feel better after a good cry. We know you like that…

  142. By the way Marshall Dillon. You provided my wife a good giggle last Saturday.

    Can I get an AMEN!!! for you suggestion I pray for some ambition? 😈

    Now we both thought that pretty humorous.

  143. Here Pfesser, let me address that question of civil liberties with Rutherford’s bogus claims about right wing jackboots. Since it uses aviation as example, you might even be interested.

    Just for you “R”, and Keith, Ed, Chaz “Maddow”, and Crazy Larry, etc….

  144. Rutherford, does the name Janet Reno ring any bells?

    Now what was the Waco body count again? 82, if memory serves. Mostly women and children. And here’s something I didn’t know until recently. Well documented and on video.

    After the buildings burned to the ground, no matter who you want to blame for fault, did you know your loving crowd led by Janet Reno’s outstanding leadership, ran the ATF flag up the flagpole at the Branch Davidian compound?

  145. We are a nation of children. Look around.

    Socialism has killed more people than war?
    My, my, my… I get it. It’s a comedy show!
    😆 I dub thee Laughterburner. 😀

    Whittle Bill and his wiffle ball wisdom – plastic with plenty of holes.

  146. He should be impeached not for gross incompetence but simple idiocy.

    Sometimes your stupidity gets the better of you. He went on to say that although the ethics class was not his favorite, the lessons it taught were valuable.

    Stick to criticizing policy Tex. When you veer off into stuff like this you make an ass of yourself. 😐

  147. 90% of Americans think the economy stinks. The only question is what are the other 10% smoking? I love stats like this.

    90% of Americans think the sun rises in the East.

    Dumb stat.

  148. Priorities…

    Federal authorities are pressuring Nashville-based Gibson Guitar Gibson Guitar

    Latest from The Business Journals

    Feds to Gibson: Hand over more wood
    Gibson cancels press conference on Fiji wood
    Gibson cancels press conference on Fiji wood

    Follow this company to hand over an additional 25 bundles of Indian wood that the company allegedly planned to use in its famous guitars.

    The complaint was filed today in U.S. District Court for the Middle District of Tennessee and mirrors a 2010 action that sought official forfeiture of wood obtained in a 2009 raid of Gibson facilities. The latter of those cases has been stayed, pending the outcome of the most recent suit.

    As has been the case in previous allegations, at issue is the classification of certain wood imported to the United States from India. Namely, a June shipment of 1,250 sawn logs was classified as “finished parts of musical instruments,” which is allowed under Indian law. In reality, according to the sworn affidavit of Fish and Wildlife Service agent Kevin Seiler, the wood was unfinished – a violation of the Lacey Act.

    The Lacey Act, originally passed by Congress in 1900, was amended in 2008 as part of that year’s Farm Bill to include protection for certain wood and endangered animal species. At its core, the Lacey Act makes it illegal to import plants or wildlife into the U.S. if those goods are harvested in a way that violates the laws of another country.

    In other words, because Indian workers didn’t create the final product, it’s not legally eligible to be exported.

    The affidavit also outlines allegations that Gibson CEO Henry Juszkiewicz understands the violations, as evidenced by the staunch defense of his company in a press conference and subsequent political fights around the Lacey Act.

    “It is clear that Gibson understands the purpose of the Lacey Act, and understands that … fingerboard blanks are not finished fingerboards and thus Gibson is aware that its order for fingerboard blanks was an order for contraband ebony wood or ebony wood which is illegal to possess,” Seiler wrote.

  149. In point of fact in my experience the Democrats have been much worse.

    Who knows? You might be right but I maintain you’ll see no relief from a GOP prez unless it’s Ron Paul and that stands zero chance of happening.

  150. Tex, what’s this man-crush you have on Bill Whittle? I’m starting to worry about you.

    The one thing I love/hate about Whittle is how he comes armed with his “facts” to destroy his opponent’s arguments.

    Whittle is ultimately an ass as each of his videos proves. There is NOTHING wrong with questioning the safety at an event where a plane plows into a crowd. To say otherwise is to be a pompous “live free or die” assh*le.

  151. If I took your brain Hickory and shoved it up a gnat’s ass, under a microscope your hemispheres would look like B-Bs in a boxcar. I think you demonstrated what a ‘fine’ student of history you were last night with that “outstanding debt” post you provided.

    What amazes me most, is undoubtedly you’re such a mindless wit, you have no sense of embarrassment, no sense of shame. And soon you will wander back with only God know’s what that you’ve dug up next.

    Disprove him Poolman. I don’t think you can. While I couldn’t vouch for history and might disagree with all of history as that much too broad a claim, I can vouch for the last couple of hundred years. I know for a fact, socialism in the 20th century killed almost twice as many as two world wars combined.

    We are a nation of children. Look around.

    The nation turns its lonely eyes to you Hickory…

  152. “Can I get an AMEN!!! for you suggestion I pray for some ambition?”

    I for one have always thought you had plenty of ambition.

    (it’s just that you chose not to act on it). 😆

  153. I for one have always thought you had plenty of ambition.

    (it’s just that you chose not to act on it). 😆

    I told my wife I had “retired” over the weekend.

    If you knew my wife this would be funnier.

    Mrs. Taylor said with this Spock eyebrow raise, “No. You haven’t.” So I told her I was “resting.” That didn’t seem to fly either. I thought medical school was pretty ambitious. For a semester. 😆

    I’m planning my extended stay with Rutherford and his wife. Right “R”? I’ll bring the big screen and a playmate for Ozzie.

  154. “Here’s an additional take on taxation that is very interesting and probably a better analysis than Chris Hayes’s.”

    God bless it Rutherford. talking taxation and economics with you is total waste of time. You are completely illiterate on the subject, which I see now is why Haye’s said something you thought so enlightening.

    What concept in the latest didn’t you understand has been raised in the numerous comments from your peeps here?

    Super wealthy don’t pay income tax because they make their money from capital investment. And gee. . . what happens when we take away the incentives to invest capital????

    I’m going out for air. 🙄

  155. Here’s an additional take on taxation that is very interesting and probably a better analysis than Chris Hayes’s.

    Oh boy. Ummm Rutherford. I was wrong yesterday. You didn’t morph into Yeller. You’ve evolved into Poolman.

    Did you happen to take a really hard look at that author you quoted as “expert?”

    If not, you might want to notice Mr. Expert’s next article is titled (drum roll please….)

    Michael Moore For President

    http://www.open.salon.com/blog/pierre_angiel/2011/09/28/michael_moore_for_president

    ROFLMAO…

  156. re: “retirement”

    My older brother’s best friend got a job in the mines after he was married. His wife was a bit on the lazy side, but had dutifully gotten up at 4 am for the first month or so and made him a hearty breakfast, to see him through a tough day of underground labor, as was the tradition among miners’ wives.

    One day she rolled over and said, “Honey, would you mind if I just slept in this morning?”

    “Why of course not, SugarPuss!”

    At about nine she woke up to find her husband still in bed beside her, snoring away.

    That ended that bullshit. LOL

    Hadn’t thought about that in years…

  157. I think Rutherford’s astute analysis is best left by simple quotation concerning taxation. GET A LOAD of this….

    Second lie. Lower Income taxes create jobs.

    The truth is exactly the opposite. The higher the tax the more jobs will be created. Those jobs open up because the rich and corporations would be forced to invest in businesses. They have to invest because they want the write offs. They don’t want to pay taxes so they invest their incomes instead. We call these loopholes.

    I guess it didn’t occur to ‘Pierre’ than maybe, just maybe, these corporations will decide alleviate burden by handing out pink slips?

    A move from 35% maximum tax to 37% will hardly affect anything. It certainly won’t bring in an additional dime from the rich. They will simply increase an investment by a tiny amount to remain untaxable. But, moving taxes for the rich back up to 90% or more would make the amount of business investments increase dramatically. Corporations and the rich would be searching everyplace to find business to start, or in which to invest in order to use the write offs.

    As a direct result unemployment would go to zero. So would the deficit and the debt, without cutting anything from the poor.

    So why not tax all of it? If 90% is good for employment, 100% should be even better.

    WE ARE DOOMED…..

  158. Pfesser… 😆 I like that. Of course, we have to be careful. I’m sure you remember the joke about the Silent Treatment?

    A man and his wife were having some problems at home and were giving each other the silent treatment.

    Suddenly, the man realized that the next day, he would need his wife to wake him at 5:00 AM for an early morning business flight.

    Not wanting to be the first to break the silence (and LOSE), he wrote on a piece of paper, ‘Please wake me at 5:00 AM .’ He left it where he knew she would find it.

    The next morning, the man woke up, only to discover it was 9:00 AM and he had missed his flight Furious, he was about to go and see why his wife hadn’t wakened him, when he noticed a piece of paper by the bed.

    The paper said, ‘It is 5:00 AM . Wake up.’

  159. I know for a fact, socialism in the 20th century killed almost twice as many as two world wars combined.

    Socialism kills? Are you including civilians in your “fact”? Approximately 70 million were killed in the two world wars, so you are claiming socialism has killed about 140 million people. How has it killed them? Starvation? No medical care? What is your criteria? How many has capitalism killed? In our “free” society where we have a right to gun ownership and the privilege to drive, would gun and vehicular deaths be categorized as capitalism “kills”? Just those two combined account for over 60,000 deaths per year.

    Maybe you should start by pointing out the real socialist societies, not those practicing state capitalism. After all, just because “socialist” is part of the name doesn’t mean the system is socialist. Just like “The People’s Republic of China” is no “republic”, naming has been used extensively this past century in order to deceive. Even Sweden, considered by some the poster child for socialism, is quite removed from socialist ideals.

    Spin, spin, spin. Round and round it goes, where it stops…

    Laughterburner with Whittle Bill. 😆

  160. re: Reno crash.

    My flight instructor was there. He flies for a local tobacco company and the owner and his son wanted to go to the races. They took the corporate jet (I’m in the wrong business) and went.

    Ron said that he was trying to get a picture of Ghost as it rounded the pylon and it just disappeared from his lens. He lowered the camera and looked up in time to see the airplane roll over on its back and head straight for the stands. “This is gonna hurt,” he told me he said out loud as the plane came straight down on them; as an aerobatic instructor and pilot he knew there wasn’t enough time or altitude for a pullout.

    He dived into the footwell of the stands as the plane hit about 40 feet away. He said his boss was not so quick-thinking and got some shrapnel in his side, as well as being covered by blood and bloody tissue. He had to throw his shirt away. Man. What a day.

    I’m going flying with him this evening, wx permitting. Great pilot and instructor.

  161. Tex, you read through that drivel? I find it maddening that this shit appeals to the moronic left. From R I only hope it’s cognitive dissonance.

    We are so fucked.

  162. So like Poolman, anything you provide is not only suspect and unreliable, but more likely pure garbage. -Tex

    So you don’t consider Cramer or “The Street” as credible sources?

    Speaking of garbage, you have yet to provide a link to the President of S & P retracting their statement about Republican’s part in the downgrade. Is that a Waste Management truck pulling up in front of your argument?

  163. The kind that would gladly carry a whip in one hand and turn your blemished dove table over, as you and your feckless brothers steal from the offerings of the poor. – Tex

    Is this a “moneychangers” reference? Which side of the barricades on Wall Street do you think Jesus would be on? Is on? I wonder what level of hell is reserved for people that spray pepper in the eyes of their savior? Of course, he probably wouldn’t get hit since he would see it coming. 🙂

  164. Speaking of Wall Street, how’s this for a conspiracy theory. A giant hedge fund chairman comes out and makes political statements that piss off a lot of his major shareholders. Some, being zealots, sell their shares in a down market even though the fund has been a good investment. They sell purely out of political spite. Then, with his share price unduly supressed, he swoops in and buys back his shares as undervalued as he can ever expect them to be. No way you say… Berkshire just announced a huge buy back. There’s a reason why Warren Buffet is rich.

  165. He excluded everything but income tax to create this epiphany for his dumb audience. That’s the point Numbnut.

    So tell us about how that fits into Hayes’ [important part omitted]. Rutherford won’t address it.

    And what’s stopping you from paying more tax Thorazine? Pony up. -ET

    FTR I think I like Numbnut better than Thorazine. It’s more endearing. I’m sorry, I didn’t realize we were actually still addressing the topic of this thread. I thought we had simply slipped back into our rhetorical Punch and Judy show. He did make a flip comment about other taxes at the start, but probably didn’t like the chart that came out with that information. I’m not all big on bashing the rich, I just don’t understand why Republican’ts are so opposed to going back to the tax structure we had under Reagan, Bush One and Clinton. We were doing just fine then. Rich people were still rich and we didn’t freak out so bad about helping people that can’t help themselves.

  166. Thorazine, you may rival Poolman yet. You absolutely have to be a government rube, or a union goon or public high school dropout.

    Would you please pull your commie red head out of your arse and go back to our very first conversation, where not only did I provide the link to the S&P chairman giving the reasons for the downgrade contradicting your baseless and lying blog facts, I provided it in video format.

    Warren Buffett is the ultimate political insider…and ultimate crony capitalist. He’s also the perhaps the biggest hypocrite – a derivative critic, who just happens to hold some of the world’s biggest derivatives.

    Completely missed the real estate and tech bubble busts…inside trading, replete with political shills.

  167. Which side of the barricades on Wall Street do you think Jesus would be on?

    One thing is for sure. It wouldn’t be the side of the den of thieves (Dimocrats), abortion mill proponents (Dimocrats), Pharisees (Dimocrats), communists (Dimocrats), or traitorous cowards (Dimocrats – see Judas Poolman).

    Is on? I wonder what level of hell is reserved for people that spray pepper in the eyes of their savior?

    You mean the 100 hundred bums anarchists making up the “massive” crowd in NYC that wouldn’t allow access to the front door when told to move? I would have saved the pepper spray and used the black jack to crack some skulls. Did you happen to see the parrot interviewed on MSNBC. Definitely! Yeah, Definitely! Most, Definitely! Uh huh, Definitely.

    You MSNBC guys and hags sure know how to dredge up the winners. 😉

  168. And what’s stopping you from paying more tax Thorazine? Pony up.

    I do. I make sure to drive over and get one more latte every week than I should. It raises sales tax revenue, gas tax revenue, tips that must be claimed on income taxes, FICA contributions and possibly tarrif revenue on imported coffee. Not to mention it tastes good. I also give to charity. But I can’t do it by myself. That’s why it says “We The People”.

  169. The tax structure under Reagan?

    Yeah, why don’t you propose we return back to that Thorazine? I do believe Obama should follow the Reagan model. Excellent suggestion – first good one you’ve made.

    When Mr. Reagan took office, the top marginal U.S. tax rate was 70%. When he left the top rate was 28%.

    It is now 35%. Get that through, will you?

  170. “What I picture in the theater of my mind about your “production on stage” is a bunch of fat, asthmatic tools, wearing nothing but gold chains and gold bracelets, grimacing behind the camera – flaccid and impatiently waiting for the Viagra to kick in.”

    Hahahahahahahahahah!

    That’s all I see too. – ET

    I see … limp people? That’s nasty, even for a Bruce Willis movie 🙂

  171. Thorazine, you are aware we now have surpassed Japan as the world’s highest industrialized corporate tax marginal tax rate? 35%? And Japan’s had such great success the last 20 years. Maybe with Benevolent Barack’s help, we can follow them over the cliff.

    And while Uncle Warren’s Berkshire Hathaway managed to pay just 20.1% in 2010 year with clever accountants and attorneys (more hypocrisy from the good, rich Dim), every small business owner in America worth his or her salt salt pays a federal rate of somewhere in the neighborhood of 35% for fed, most pay state tax, city tax, county tax, workman’s comp, and numerous fees and ancillary charges. Then you can throw in excise taxes for fuel, Obamacare, FICA matching, blah blah blah.

    And yet, you Dims are still demanding more.

    I think you would find when you tally the poll results, small business owners, the same small business owners that employ well over 65% of the nation, are paying well over 50% of their earnings toward some type of tax or regulation, and may be Obama’s harshest critics. That nasty, racist white man vote. 😉

    You think they’ve going to be pulling the Obama tax lever in 2012, do you?

  172. Tigre, another dumb-ass article where the title of the article does not reflect its contents. The title leads you to believe Buffet disagrees with Obama but clearly the bottom line is he wants to wait and see what gets rolled out.

    “I need more info” is not the same as “I don’t endorse the Buffet rule”.

    I don’t know who has less brains, the folks who write these articles or the Obama-haters who lap it up.

  173. When Mr. Reagan took office, the top marginal U.S. tax rate was 70%. When he left the top rate was 28%.

    It is now 35%. Get that through, will you?

    That’s because he left us with record deficits. Remember Bush One’s “read my lips” but then he raised taxes anyway? That was to clean up his boss’ mess. Cost him a second term, but he did the right thing. Clinton tweaked it some more, with some gentle prodding from Newt (government shutdown, which if it had been a PF movie would have apparently been titled “enter the cigar”, sounds like a kung fu movie) then we had surpluses. And BTW, Reagan lowered income taxes but he hammered us working stiffs with the FICA tax. Largest tax increase in the history of the country leveled directly at the middle class. You guys always seem to leave that part out.

  174. The other 10%? Probably union. The numbers pretty much match…-Gorilla

    Unions are still legal in this country? I think another answer would be the 10% at the right end of the graph at the beginning of this thread.

  175. R @ 239, did you see what he said about whom hew was referring to as the “rich” or did skip over that too?

    Try reading for content yourself big boy.

  176. not, you might want to notice Mr. Expert’s next article is titled (drum roll please….)

    Michael Moore For President – Tex

    Scoreboard Tex. That was flat bloody. R said no porn, but you just had to spank him anyway.:)

  177. That’s because he left us with record deficits.

    😆 😆 😆

    Poolman quality. When Reagan left office, the deficit was approximately $2.7 trillion, of which he was responsible for the accumulation of $1.7 trillion – Obama can do that in a year. 😯

    Your history is pretty foggy, drone. Reagan also created $17 trillion in new net worth in eight years. But if Obama can create an equal amount of net worth – $40 trillion to the GDP, I won’t bitch one iota about taxes. Unbelievable…..snicker.

    But lets not let economic facts get in the way of argument. Let’s just talk about election results so we can put this puppy to rest pronto.

    Reagan came within 3,000 MN votes of sweeping the entire country minus Ghetto D.C., in the most massive landslide election in U.S. history. You think El Baroke is going to be able follow suit, do you Thor? Why don’t you post that on Thor Pravda, will you?

    I love that one immutable fact, because Dims can’t spin it, can’t argue it, can’t lie about it.

    Turn on MSNBC and head back down the rabbit hole Alice to get Chaz Maddow’s weekend talking points.

  178. Would you please pull your commie red head out of your arse and go back to our very first conversation, where not only did I provide the link to the S&P chairman giving the reasons for the downgrade contradicting your baseless and lying blog facts, I provided it in video format. – Tex

    That video only shows that Cavuto can steer the conversation anywhere he wants. Their is no retracion there or any where else that speaks to the S&P statement.

    Compared with previous projections, our revised base case scenario now assumes that the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, due to expire by the end of 2012, remain in place. We have changed our assumption on this because the majority of Republicans in Congress continue to resist any measure that would raise revenues
    and…

    The political brinksmanship of recent months highlights what we see as America’s governance and policymaking becoming less stable, less effective, and less predictable than what we previously believed. The statutory debt ceiling and the threat of default have become political bargaining chips in the debate over fiscal policy.

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/text-of-sp-downgrade-of-us-rating-2011-08-05

    I believe history will refer to this as the Tea Perty downgrade, whether you choose to recognize it or not.

  179. thorsaurus –

    I am no fan of Congress and would gladly hang them all sometimes, but I don’t think anybody is playing political games. I think the Right believes that they absolutely must hold the line on further spending and fiat money-printing and I agree with them.

    All the Obama administration is doing up there with all the printing is fanning the patient with a burning fever and thinking they are really cooling him off. We need to address the root cause of this mess, and that is undisciplined spending and borrowing. It has to stop, and the sooner it stops and we all take our medicine, the better. Then we can all get back to trying to have a little something for ourselves and our kids.

  180. When Reagan left office, the deficit was approximately $2.7 trillion, of which he was responsible for the accumulation of $1.7 trillion –

    Which was a record at the time, thus, the phrase “record deficit” That’s how records are set. Or do you diss Babe Ruth’s record because Hank Aaron broke it?

  181. “Reagan came within 3,000 MN votes of sweeping the entire country minus Ghetto D.C., in the most massive landslide election in U.S. history.” – Tex

    Nixon won in a landslide too, hell of a hook to hang your Stetson on.

  182. thorsaurus – I’m no economist, but I think there are two very different scenarios here. Reagan created a deficit by shoving a massive tax cut down Congress’ throat, which resulted in tremendous economic growth.

    Bo is creating a deficit by printing money, which debauches the currency and makes people hesitant to invest, since they can’t predict what the inflation will do to their investments. This DEPRESSES the economy and, without tax relief, nobody is going to invest in creating anything. That means high unemployment, which is what we have.

    If there is something fundamentally wrong with that argument, please advise. I have lived through both eras and what is predicted is exactly what has happened.

  183. Thor – I’ll try and be more academic – I don’t think you’re here to really learn, but it’s worth this one attempt.

    Which was a record at the time, thus, the phrase “record deficit” That’s how records are set. Or do you diss Babe Ruth’s record because Hank Aaron broke it?

    Well, if Hammering Hank had broken Ruth’s record in about 1,500 at bats like Obama has been at setting record deficit spending of $4.1 billion a day, I might understand your analogy. Otherwise, your argument actually circles around the bend and shoots your own premise in the foot, because Babe Ruth’s “record” actually is far more impressive when total number of at bats taken into account vs. the number of home runs hit.

    So following along your line:

    Maybe this will help:

    Debt in and of itself is not a negative, if (and only if) your return on investment exceeds the debt plus interest accumulated on the debt. Corporations accrue debt all the time and use it to make oodles of money. The downside is that debt is a net negative to a balance sheet and is generally accompanied by a higher degree of risk and rate.

    Reagan $1.7 Trillion in deficit spending was accompanied by $17 trillion of accumulated net worth

    Obama 4.3 trillion in deficit spending (so far) = $X Net Worth/Growth

    If we half Obama for grins, taking into account that Reagan would serve two terms and assume half of his growth occurred during the 1st term (probably a little overstated, but for our purposes, it won’t matter), Obama will have needed to have produced somewhere in the neighborhood of $21.5 Trillion in accumulated “new” net worth by Jan 2013 just to match Reagan’s record of economic growth.

    Think The Won is going to get there? 🙂 I would say the odds about on par with Poolman getting a PHD in nuclear physics.

    You’re a little bit of an anomaly to me Thor. You obviously are propagandist and shill for Obama and anything Dimocratic. But you appear to want to have a serious discussion. Somebody like Poolman can’t be serious because he doesn’t have the background.

    However, having a serious discussion requires a degree of honesty in the debate. So far, I have found your arguments woefully dishonest and slanted. And I could be wrong, but I think the American public is going to come to the same conclusions next November.

    I think it is time for you serious liberals to admit that Obama’s economic policies have been an unmitigated disaster. More government is simply not the answer.

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