How to Implement the Repeal of DADT

The Village People promote their appearance in Allan Carr's musical comedy 'Can't Stop the Music', 1980. From left to right, they are Randy Jones, Glenn Hughes, Ray Simpson, David Hodo, Alex Briley and Felipe Rose. (Photo by Archive Photos/Getty Images)

Even if “Don’t Ask Don’t Tell” gets repealed, there is now discussion about how we implement the change in policy. This absolutely boggles my mind. What do we expect? The day after the law is repealed, normal troop formations will be replaced by gay pride parades? Soldiers will immediately doff their uniforms and put on thongs? Taps will be replaced by “It’s Raining Men”?

What the hell is wrong with our military leaders? Here’s my simple implementation plan:

1. Only the “Don’t Tell” part of the law gets killed. The “Don’t Ask” part stays in place because it’s none of your damn business!
2. Gay soldiers are to abide by the same rules as straight soldiers. You don’t sexually harass your fellow troops. You’re there to defend your country, not to hook up.
3. Everybody carry on as you did before because guess what? It didn’t matter worth a rat’s ass before and it doesn’t matter now. Just do your duty. And Bob, if you wanna write a letter home to your boyfriend Ted and you wanna tell your bunk mate about it, be my guest. If your bunk mate doesn’t like it, he can say “thanks for sharing, I’m not interested in your love life.” Done deal.

As I said in the previous article, we won’t see the end of DADT for some time now. Despite the findings of the Pentagon study, which determined this was no biggie, Republicans will drag their feet on it and Obama will push it to the bottom of the to-do stack. But once the law does get repealed (and I do believe it eventually will), the “implementation plan” will be, as my daughter’s Kindergarten teacher used to say, easy-peasy:

GET OVER IT AND GET ON WITH IT!

Respectfully,
Rutherford

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388 thoughts on “How to Implement the Repeal of DADT

  1. If I was 18, I wouldn’t serve. And it has nothing to do with the fact Rutherford would force me to take showers with known homosexuals.

    Its getting to the point where this thieving government isn’t worthy.

    Come to find out we bailed out the Europeans too. And will do it again via the IMF.

    I refuse to bicker with Liberals over the issues until we all come to terms, left and right, with the oligarchy that is running the world.

    Its time for a sledge hammer to be thrown into the propaganda screen.

    I’m not a loon.

  2. A lot of the problem is that the regressives are very hypocritical in regards to all things regarding sex.
    They love to lecture about abstinence – even though they don’t.
    They love to lecture about fidelity – even thought they aren’t.
    They lecture about homosexuality even though many of them are.

    As a result they are very insecure in thier hypocrisies. Makes for a bad mental situation that manifests itself in hate – including self hate.

  3. Huck … at least one case comes to mind of someone who lectures about abstinence AFTER she didn’t abstain. She’s the daughter of the half-Governor of Alaska.

    I think they’re called born again virgins.

  4. Rabbit, your first comment puzzles me. Unless you’ve heard something different from what I’ve heard, the fat lady hasn’t sung yet regarding the Bush tax cuts. If Congress fails to act during the lame duck session, it will be as much the fault of Republicans as Democrats. And of course the hypocrisy here is so ripe I can smell the stench from DC all the way to my home office in CT. Ya gotta find a way to pay for those unemployment benefits but you don’t need to find a way to pay for the 700 billion tax break for upper income folks. Yeah … dontcha just love the inconsistency?

    Obama has done his usual routine here, thrown the ball to the legislators to hash it out. If he’s an assh*le it can only be because he didn’t TELL them to fix this NOW.

    As for your oligarchy statement, I’m not too far behind you on that one. I think as we libs and cons battle it out we are ignoring the real “enemy” which are the global financial players who pull the strings. I’m beginning to think the overriding global policy is how can we make a quick buck. To hell with anyone who gets run over in the process.

    If this is what you’re getting at, I don’t think you’re a loon at all.

  5. I forced myself to read the Michelle Malkin article even though the woman’s nasty hatred of all things liberal has plastered a permanent smirk on what might have been a pretty face.

    “ObamaCare” is a clusterf*ck. It took me a while to get around to it but I have recently said more than once that it was the wrong thing to pursue at the wrong time. It is one of the biggest reasons we lost so many seats last month. To say it has been imperfectly implemented is to put it mildly.My only consolation is that it is a starting point and that refinement may make it worthwhile in the long run.

    Sadly, what will get in the way of improving it are vindictive Republicans and uncooperative insurance companies who have no interest in the health of their customers … it’s about making a buck. See comment 8, final two paragraphs.

    I might add that some of my fellow liberals despite getting their asses kicked still hold onto the ideal of universal health care and are blind to how it totally went against the priorities of most of our citizens.

    We need to put America back to work and then tackle health care problems after that.

  6. “Huck … at least one case comes to mind of someone who lectures about abstinence AFTER she didn’t abstain. She’s the daughter of the half-Governor of Alaska.”

    Yeah that’s just who I suspected.

    You idiots are aware that Bristol Palin is not a politician, right? What she has to say about anything matters even less than what her mother has to say about anything.

    Now I ask again. Who lectures about abstinence that doesn’t abstain? Surely you can come up with more than just 1 name when the entire conservative movement is being accused of it.

  7. Well Rutherford, did you miss me? I gave Graychin and Flake four days of marital bliss, uninterrupted. I hope they made the best of it. Now that I’m not dicking around on the net, I fell asleep at 8:30 watching a movie. Sorry I can harass all you sorry libs in the middle of the night. 😈

    Here’s the scariest story I’ve heard in years, and this one is for real. To me, it surpasses ICBM’s off the California coasts, thieving of the monetary supply, even Obama and the lib’s horrendous and catastrophic policies.

    This one is for real and I’ve been following it for about a month now. To the best of my knowledge, it hasn’t even made mention here. And you’ll just have to grin and bear it about the source, because they do a wonderful job of summarizing the fears.

    Boys, this is going to be a real problem for everybody – better hope you’re not near a hydroelectric dam, or a cat cracker, or even require a pacemaker – scary, scary stuff. Maybe it will just fly your plane into the ground. Technological warfare on the scale of biological warfare – and just as deadly. If I were you Rutherford, I’d start giving serious thought to getting your life in order.

    http://hotair.com/archives/2010/11/27/stuxnet-the-second-greatest-story-ever-told/

    Make sure to watch the video.

  8. As the Bitch lectures, I’m reminded of one William Jefferson Clinton, and then realize that all is normal.

    The hyperbole that comes from this guy is without equal. No one else even comes close to the massive amounts of exaggeration and unsubstantiated accusation. Really, is someone from the party of Kennedy (any of them) or Clinton going to lecture us on purity?

    It does not surprise me that when anyone asks him to back up his foolish commentary, he simply runs away. What a coward…

  9. I agree with your conclusion: What IS there to “implement?”! You just stop making it criminal to be gay. Otherwise, things continue as normal.

    Implementation complete!

  10. Something that seems to get lost in the DADT debate is that 58% of marines do think it will be disruptive to the business at hand…like killing bad guys.

    After all, if one hypocrite in the church preaching faithfulness while banging the church secretary, or one single mother asking teens to be wise and practice abstinence refutes the entire message, it follows that PFC Bradley Manning, gay boy extraordinaire, destroys the entire message of repealing DADT.

    Right Yeller Dawg?

    See, Mr. Manning without much experience, knowledge, or maturity, who somehow becomes a “military analyst” in between downloading Lady Gaga music while in a combat zone in Iraq, destroyed twenty years of secret cables of the U.S. State Department, two decades worth of diplomatic contacts, trust, and friendships.

    Bradley was depressed and he felt under appreciated and because his drag-queen boyfriend had recently dumped him. If we’d just appreciate homosexuality and allow its open practice, everything is going to be okay. 🙄

    I know it certainly would strengthen my resolve to kill bad guys (and avoid the shower) if I could watch two queers making it in the bunk bed first.

  11. “Ya gotta find a way to pay for those unemployment benefits but you don’t need to find a way to pay for the 700 billion tax break for upper income folks. Yeah … dontcha just love the inconsistency?”

    What do you mean “pay” for the tax break? The expiration of the break represents a tax increase. The dems, who retain control, don’t even have budget. There’s no inconsistency unless your only agenda is to spend without finding ways to pay for it. . . oh I see, that’s wrong for the dems last month. I assume this is just another MSNBC sound bite lacking any substance.

    The UI benefits will continue if the dems would get real about how to deal with the budget and its endeless spending sprees. You guys so fucking deaf its pathetic.

    A rising tide drowns the ones with anchors tied to their feet.

  12. If I were you Rutherford, I’d start giving serious thought to getting your life in order.

    Well Tex it is clear that you did get an A in at least one of your med school classes — Terminal Illness 101.

    Instructor: “Class please repeat after me. I have bad news. If I were you I’d start giving serious thought to getting your life in order.”

    🙂

  13. Tigre, you’ve been listening to too much Sarah Palin. You’re starting to spew word salad.

    The Bush tax break wasn’t paid for to begin with. Now, in the middle of a hellish economy and debt up the wazoo, we’re told by the GOP to maintain a tax break that will rob our coffers of $700 billion over the next ten years. However, we can’t extend unemployment benefits at a fraction of the cost because we don’t have a way to pay for it.

    Hey, either it’s pay as you go or it isn’t. Hear me now, you screw over the unemployed middle class while lining the pockets of the rich and you can kiss 2012 goodbye.

  14. Something that seems to get lost in the DADT debate is that 58% of marines do think it will be disruptive to the business at hand…like killing bad guys.

    Yeah let’s advance civil rights by following the lead of the most conservative minority. It’s like saying “we can’t integrate lunch counters because the country club down the road doesn’t admit blacks.”

    Marines are the super-macho branch of the armed forces. Probably a much higher instance of homophobia in their ranks … and probably a good number of closet queens in there too. I always find those who protest the loudest are the most suspect.

    Sorry … I don’t look to the Marines to call the shots on this one.

  15. Tex I don’t want to minimize the threat of Stuxnet but you know full well that we’ve been onto this kind of thing since the Y2K projects that ate up the time and effort of every major corporation around the world. In preparing for Y2K we realized just how much of our daily lives was controlled by computers. When Y2K went off without a hitch, some questioned whether the fears had been overblown. But of course, they weren’t.

    All I’m saying is, this is not new news. It’s just that we’ve seen a concrete example of the damage that can be done so we’re awake again. That’s the beauty of human beings. We forget sh*t and need constant wake-up calls.

  16. “The Bush tax break wasn’t paid for to begin with.”

    Word salad? What the hell does this mean? For real, explain please. Do you think raising taxes in this “hellish economy and debt up the wazoo” stimulates private sector hiring — the number one priority according the dems after getting their asses handed to them?

    I wish Palin would go away. But the depth of your commentary would make even Palin’s economic analysis worthy of a Nobel Prize by comparison.

    I swear, the left has absolutely no concept on how to stimulate private sector growth and job creation. All you seem to know is how to stifle it through government expansion.

    Unless you’re looking for advice on nepotism, quit listening to Bubbles Brzezinski. It’s rotting your brain. You’re starting to sound like our resident genius, Yellowdog.

  17. Damn Rutherford, I think you’ve been hanging around Yeller Dawg too much. He’s rubbing off on you.

    It’s been common knowledge for a months – including Manning’s drag queen lover. But I only brought that homo up to demonstrate how ignorant Yeller Dawg’s statement was so he’ll run off again.

    Manning is one homo I do what put in front of a firing squad, so you can now finally label me as wanting to kill a queer. 😉

    I’m indifferent to DADT…the whole argument is so specious to begin with, five years from now, they’ll be whining like Manning because they are being mistreated and misused. You watch. That’s why most are libs.

    But tell Rutherford – what does this repeal do to improve the military? Nothing. This is another non issue to appease the depraved in the name of political correctness. You think behind closed doors, Obama isn’t just as repulsed as I am at these activists? Haw! He hates their guts.

    ———–

    Remember! It’s you libs that pull things out of your ass, mainly because it’s libs that shove all kinds of things in there to begin with – and love it. OOOooo….AAAAhhhhhh

    That last one was for Flake.

  18. OH Rutherford. 🙄

    When Y2K went off without a hitch, some questioned whether the fears had been overblown. But of course, they weren’t.

    You think adding a couple of digits to a field in a database is equivalent to creating surges in centrifuges? Or stopping machinery? Maybe launching a nuke without authorization? You obviously did not read the article.

    You should have….

    I thought you were deeper than this.

  19. Something to chew on “R”. Lefties are always talking about who could possibly run and beat Obama, and I’ve listed a few that I thought possible (no, Sarah wasn’t one of them).

    And I got to thinking the other day I hear Chris Christie’s name mentioned occasionally, but I believe this guy is equally good, and I never hear his name mentioned.

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/right-turn/

    Got news for you – the talent isn’t on the Left. Never was – and that’s what make the candidacy of John McCain all the more horrid.

    You got Obama and…and…and…

    Hillary?

  20. I wish to congratulate President Obama on something besides Predator attacks.

    President Obama – if you had to screw all of us with your hideous health care, I can’t think of a better group of people to screw the most. Thank you Mr. President.

    If you could possibly get Rambo Von Graychin added in this mix, I would be most grateful and “perhaps” even vote for you (holding thumb and index finger two nanometers apart).

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/02/AR2010120200169.html

  21. Remember when Graychin announced in Nov of 2008 the Republican party would become a regional party?

    Remember when Rutherford announced in Sep 2009, that the Republicans would change or go the way of the Whigs, and he was offering friendly advice to become Progressive or go bye bye?

    Remember when Dumb Dawg continually announce the Repugs will lose the younger generation?

    WELL ****(((( G U F F A W ))))****

    Boys, your predictions are as lame as Dear Leader.

    http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2010/12/027812.php

  22. I have to come clean. Don’t Ask Don’t Tell was a nightmare for me while I was in the service. Do you know how torturous and demeaning it was hiding the truth? Staying in the closet?

    Well…I’ve had enough…and I’m coming out.

    You see, I love to fuck chicks from behind and get my dick sucked right before the fireworks. This how I say “I love you” to somebody of the opposite sex. .

    Yet, I had to act like I was some kind of criminal my entire 4 years. How is it honorable to hide the truth?

    (a) Any person subject to this chapter who engages in unnatural carnal copulation with another person of the same or opposite sex or with an animal is guilty of sodomy. Penetration , however slight, is sufficient to complete the offense.

    (b) Any person found guilty of sodomy shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

  23. D.R. 😆

    I thought #29 was pretty damn funny, but when Flake hits the board, she’s going to blow a gasket reading that (you should have added the word “GASH”). 🙂

    You better get ready for a resounding scolding and a huge dose of self-righteousness and pomposity.

  24. Do you think raising taxes in this “hellish economy and debt up the wazoo” stimulates private sector hiring — the number one priority according the dems after getting their asses handed to them?

    Tigre, clearly low taxes have done nothing for hiring either so it’s an empty argument.

    The simple bottom line that you seem to want to avoid is the GOP has no problem spending 700 billion that they could save, just to keep the rich happy and 3% richer (yeah, a lousy 3% ….. millionaires fart 3% after a meal). BUT extending jobless benefits is a major affront in this terrible deficit-ridden economy.

    Tigre, let’s face it. You just don’t want to call out your boys as hypocrites. The only argument I’ve seen on this board that moves me is that 250K is too low a threshold. Otherwise, the GOP is full of crap on this one.

  25. But tell Rutherford – what does this repeal do to improve the military?

    The purpose of the repeal is not to improve the military per se but to grant people the right not to lie about who they are.

    But since you went there … yeah, it DOES improve the military. An honest open workplace is always preferable to a workplace where people can be blackmailed for who they are, or made uncomfortable for who they are.

  26. Regarding 25, wow Tex is your memory short. Those “two digits” had folks fearful of everything from traffic chaos from date controlled traffic lights to potential nuclear accidents from date dependent systems in plants. etc. As you well know, the two digits, if ignored could bring entire systems to their knees. (By the way, the first major screwup I ever made on the job way back in 1983 was lengthening a data field without changing code in a downstream program. Brought Accounts Payable to its knees for a week before we figured out what went wrong.)

    I was not disagreeing with you about the new worm. I was simply saying our knowledge of our dependence on computers and automation is not new. But we do need a wake up call now and then to see just how severe the ramifications are.

  27. 26 confuses me Tex. Maybe I missed it but your Washington Post article didn’t mention Christie. It was all about Paul Ryan.

    As for your saying you haven’t heard Christie’s name bandied about … that’s because you haven’t been listening. In virtually every interview I’ve seen with the man he’s asked about a 2012 run and he dismisses it. Then the inevitable follow up is “how about VP”. He says he wouldn’t want to work for anybody but he also wouldn’t turn down the opportunity.

    By the way, I really like Chris Christie. He’s REAL to the core. I don’t sense an iota of pretense in the man. Heck, if Obama doesn’t get his sh*t together and start acting like the pinko Marxist that I voted for, I may have to flip the switch completely and go for Chris! 🙂

  28. Tex, the powerlineblog story is a non-starter. It was within the margin of error for Pete’s sake. At best we can now say the country is split down the middle Dem/Repub. And we kinda already knew that.

  29. (a) Any person subject to this chapter who engages in unnatural carnal copulation with another person of the same or opposite sex or with an animal is guilty of sodomy. Penetration , however slight, is sufficient to complete the offense.

    (b) Any person found guilty of sodomy shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

    Rabbit, seriously did you pull this out of your butt or were you quoting actual military rules? Because if this is how current policy reads, then your “joke” only goes to show how absurd the rules are. There is no reason for private sexual conduct to be a condition of readiness for military service so long as no one is being harassed. That would include the female soldiers who you want to get some backdoor action with. 😉

  30. Rutherford, you’re almost as full of dung as Graychin. I didn’t forget Y2K – I made a small fortune off the scare tactics – totally bogus. The biggest threat was somebody may not get their social security check.

    The rest was made up garbage and you know it. Y2K doesn’t even come remotely close to the danger this poses.

    Maybe you’re not as technically capable as I believed, because I knew Y2K was junk in 1999. And I was proven right – nothing damaged the reputation of systems analysts more than that scare tactic.

    Frankly I.T. has never recovered.

    P.S. – my link was about the Virginia Governor Bob McDonnell, not Paul Ryan. Not sure what you were viewing.

  31. Gawd Rutherford, you are clueless.

    And we kinda already knew that.

    NO, we didn’t. This is fundamental change from even two years ago.

  32. “Tigre, clearly low taxes have done nothing for hiring either so it’s an empty argument.”

    You are so breathtakingly misguided and intent on remaing that way, there’s no point in responding. I guess I should never expect a dem to stop viewing everything through the lens of class envy rather than rational economic analysis. Have you even wondered why even Obama hasn’t pushed hard for the the repeal of the tax cuts?

  33. Tigre, it all depends on what you mean by “push hard”. Obama has definitely stated publicly that we should not extend tax cuts to the top 2% of wealth in this country. Now, is he strong-arming anyone? No, not to my knowledge but then again one of my gripes about Obama is he governs like a pussy. He’s no LBJ calling in favors and playing hard backroom politics.

    This has nothing to do with class envy. Why on earth should 700 billion dollars be spent on people who have shown no inclination to hire unemployed Americans and will continue to outsource everything that is not nailed down?

  34. Maybe you’re not as technically capable as I believed, because I knew Y2K was junk in 1999.

    This coming from the man who denies any possibility of climate change and believes that Noah gathered two of every species on a big boat.

    All those years of studying science were clearly wasted on you. Then again, knowing you, you probably took as many science courses as you could so you could heckle from the back of the classroom. 😉

    P.S. Ehhhh, check your link again …. i read the first article on the page about Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan. If you wanted me to scroll down to the Bob McDonnell interview, you should have said so. You didn’t even mention McDonnell in your comment. 😐

    For those interested in what Tex meant to post:

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/right-turn/2010/12/bob_mcdonnell_interview.html#more

  35. “Why on earth should 700 billion dollars be spent on people who have shown no inclination to hire unemployed Americans and will continue to outsource everything that is not nailed down?”

    I honestly don’t know what is meant by this. Are you referring to TARP? I really don’t know what you’re getting at. We’re talking about taxation and referring to expenditures. I readily admit that I ain’t all that bright. I really don’t get your point on this.

  36. Rutherford,

    I have a new category to classify men like you and Graychin while you hammer the final nails in your own coffins from the inside, still blissfully unaware of their spectacular political failures and irrelevance as the bitterness of age sets in.

    Liberals in Twilight. 😉

  37. Rutherford,

    Continuing with the theme of Liberalism in Twilight, I wish to pass congratulations President Obama on the success of his stimulus package… 🙂

    You apparently have adopted the Graychin method of debate? When nothing is left in the tank, invoke your irreligiosity and what little you know of science to taunt?

    And it at that very moment, I am reminded of your record of success in prediction, confident I will once again be proven right in the only real choice that ever mattered.

    So if I am to error in my naivety, let me side with Jesus. I have so much more faith in his accuracy, science and prophetic nature than yours.

  38. I blame this bump in unemployment on President Obama. His laughable lack of leadership is exactly why the ass clowns are trying to settle the taxes for ’11 in December of ’10!

    Almost more then half way in this Presidency and its utterly impossible to defend him. He’s like King Midas, except every thing he has is hands on turns to shit.

    Nobody knows wtf is going on.

  39. Tigre, the hue and cry of the “don’t tax the rich” contingent is that businesses are not hiring because of tax “uncertainty”. All we need to do is reassure them that their taxes won’t go up (preferably EVER) and suddenly they’ll get up offa all that money they’re hording and start investing in hiring. I call BS. Do you understand now?

  40. Tex, now I’m the first to admit I don’t know my Bible but I honestly don’t remember Jesus taking a stand on climate change or Y2K or the computer worm. So which of his prophesies are you “siding with” exactly?

    I have to tell you my friend, and I honestly do know how well-meaning you are, but before I get to that here-after that you’re so worried about, I have to deal with the here and now. Honestly Jesus hasn’t hired me to run a webinar for Him and I don’t expect him to. Until he can pull off that miracle, I have to look elsewhere to pay the bills.

    With that said, I do quite love your new phrase “Liberals in twilight”. Makes our impending doom sound kinda warm and fuzzy. 🙂

    (By the way, your latest avatar is the least inspiring. I think my fav so far was the Jimmy Obama mashup.)

  41. Rabbit, the Obama presidency at worst is a case of misplaced priorities. I think he wanted to go down as an historic President so he tried to get legislation enacted that evaded all of his predecessors. It was a Pyrrhic victory at best.

    Perhaps one thing you guys have been saying is true … President Obama’s ego may be his undoing. 😦

  42. “R”,

    Tex, now I’m the first to admit I don’t know my Bible but I honestly don’t remember Jesus taking a stand on climate change or Y2K or the computer worm. So which of his prophesies are you “siding with” exactly?

    I have no idea what you are talking about…I was talking about your prophetic nature, or lack thereof as your predictions testify. But you go right ahead and believe global “climate change” or “global warming during the summer” is your biggest threat goofus, and I’ll go right ahead and try to convince you that you’re really, really wrong.

    ————

    So you finally realize Obama’s ego may be his undoing? You’re 24 months too late. You failed to mention his overrated “intellect” – that ain’t there either.

  43. “Tigre, the hue and cry of the “don’t tax the rich” contingent is that businesses are not hiring because of tax “uncertainty”. All we need to do is reassure them that their taxes won’t go up (preferably EVER) and suddenly they’ll get up offa all that money they’re hording and start investing in hiring. I call BS. Do you understand now?”

    No because no one said that. You’re the one with one-dimensional view of the economy. And since I am an employer, I don’t mind telling you your head is up your ass if you think the uncertainty in both federal AND local taxes (which are not just income taxes), not to mention the fucked-up situation with health care health care, access to business credit etc., has no bearing on investment and hiring.

    I now see that you’re of the opinion that businesses are designed to work for and support the government which is why you view increased tax as “an expenditure.” And of course the $700 billion (TARP??) went to Wall Street and its obscenely compensated executives, so there’s no harm in raising taxes on what you perceive to be on business owners you erroneously deem to be “the rich.” Call BS all you want. Only a lib could think that.

  44. I now see that you’re of the opinion that businesses are designed to work for and support the government which is why you view increased tax as “an expenditure.”

    Bingo Tigre. That is exactly the opinion Rutherford holds.

    Rutherford, if your BS statement were not true, how did we ever reach full employment under Bush? How did we ever reach full employment period? What is it that leads us to economic prosperity? Higher taxes? Government growth? The Nancy Pelosi school of unemployment benefits stimulating the economy? 🙄

    If the latter were true, why are we not more wealthy than ever at this minute? So where are the jobs?

    I am so tired of libs like you that are so economically disengaged and misinformed, that you honestly think the world economy is a zero sum game.

    I say this with all sincerity.

    If the world were made up of only libs, you would all live in some really pretty painted caves, perhaps having finally made it to building the canoe, vegetarians because you would have no idea how to hunt, assuming you hadn’t gone extinct.

  45. Tex and Tiger,

    Is Capitalism diseased?

    Is this the free market Adam Smith ever envisioned?

    A market hard wired to giant servers and tripping circuits?

    A global money printing organization in the form of a strange government/banking hybrid, reminiscent of Renaissance Florence- except instead of a city state its the entire West!

    Rutherford is wrong on so many levels.

    Why would he want to give money back to the hybrid?

    And why are simple millionaires the enemy? These guys are the good guys. Old school business men who, through risk and hard work, create tangible goods and services. And of course jobs.

    The argument over private sector vs government is crusty. Yet it’s still important for us common folk who desire a little dignity and money until the mad men crash the entire system.

    I just don’t have the intelligence or education to make complete sense out of the hybrid. However, I’m not blind either. I’ve never understood how 3 Card Monte works but I know its a scam.

    Nor am I being influenced by gold salesmen, Ron Paul or Wall Street conspiracy websites.

    I’m not parroting anything.

    Tex, I’m becoming radicalized! All by myself.

    Somebody tell me I’m fucking nuts.

  46. Rutherford is wrong on so many levels.

    In what way? Rabbit you are so close to “getting it” and then you fall short.

    The big international corporations and the government are in bed with each other. You think increasing taxes on the wealthy feeds the beast … the beast you identify as government. But I suspect it’s all a shell game anyway. Like you, I don’t fully understand how the shell game works but I know DC contention with big business at the end of the day is probably just posturing.

    I’m not sure capitalism works for the small business anymore and I don’t think the government is entirely to blame. The profit motive that was once the great incentive that drove capitalism has now become the “by any means necessary” end-all and be-all. The partnership with the employee … the relationship of trust that once existed is gone.

    Things are very broken but I’m sorry, you’re not gonna lay it all on liberal government. It’s way more complicated than that.

  47. And of course the $700 billion (TARP??) went to Wall Street and its obscenely compensated executives,

    That is not the 700 billion I’m talking about. I’m talking about the 700 billion that could be saved over the next ten years if companies get taxed on amounts over 250K.

    But again you miss the point. If we’re gonna play pay-go then the answer is that the Bush tax cuts expire AND we don’t fund unemployment insurance. Otherwise, we find a way to pay for both.

  48. Tex 52 is absurd. Corporations kicked ass at higher tax rates than they’re at right now. So this notion that economic boom must be accompanied by low tax is unfounded.

    What I have said before and I will repeat again is that this economic downturn is unlike others in that the business climate has changed. Corporations are more bottom line driven than ever before. They have not stopped filling positions. They’ve stopped filling positions with Americans. In a country with 9.8% unemployment, this is unforgivable. The rampant outsourcing going on today should have everyone on this blog fuming. But no, you’d all rather blame Obama.

    Elect your GOP Prez in 2012 and watch corporate America keep hiring Indians, Brazilians, Russians and Chinese in 2013 (unless they find another country cheaper). Until corporate America has a change in mindset, we are screwed, blued and tattooed. 👿

  49. Dude, you’ve had big Nanny Love your whole life.

    The weirdness I speak of is new. Its also obviously global and outside the realm of democracy.

    How in God’s name does it benefit me or society to take money away from the few people left making shit/hiring motherfuckers and give it to the beast?

    Why does that make you happy?

    Are you telling me you can tell a difference between Goldman Sachs and Obama’s boys? How? And I’m being serious? How? I want to know.

    Frank and Fanny?

    This thing was so obviously created to pop on the tax payers dime from the start. And the government was in on it with Goldman Sachs and vice versa. We’re double funding everything. Paulson gained. Goldman Sachs gained. Goldman Sach’s Wall street rivals annihilated. R.I.P. Bear Stearns or whatever their name is. We gave them our wealth. Now useful idiots like you want to give them more!

    We already paid for the bubble.

    We paid for it in full!

  50. Fact: The tax cuts haven’t created American jobs in all the years they have been in effect. It is insanity to think that all of a sudden they will. The real reason why the GOP prophets want to extend the tax cuts is just pure unadulterated greed.

    Banks created this mess. Even Fannie and Freddy had stockholders, they were not government entities. The politicians are just enablers. Look at the FED. We’ve had it for near a century. WTF! It isn’t constitutionally supported.

  51. “R”,

    Corporate rates were not much higher, and when they were, there was no such thing as NAFTA, China, and 65% hydrocarbon dependency. Corporations were far less regulated, health costs far less of an issue, and a far lower standard of living accepted as the norm.

    Here’s the facts. Our corporate tax rates are twice the average industrial world – the 2nd highest. We immediately start far behind the curve and we don’t have the productivity advantage we had years ago.

    You force executives to move to stay competitive between over regulation, outrageous corporate tax rates, government meddling creating uncertainty and risk, and burden.

    Complain all you want about executive salaries – they are an outrage. But you are wrong about everything else, and you of all people on this board short of Graychin ought to understand that. His complaints about corporations are far more legitimate than yours.

    You’re old enough to know better.

  52. How in the living hell you people think raising taxes on, say, a construction company, will cause said construction company to hire more construction workers, is beyond me.

    How in the living hell you people think giving money to a corrupt government in league with the crooks behind the largest premeditated pyramid scam and power grab in world history is beyond me.

    Starve the government and you starve the thieves. Its our labor (I think I’ve finally come to learn our “money” isn’t accurate…shows how sensico I really am in all of this) that has bailed out the banking crooks from San Fran to London so that their pyramid scam can continue.

    Am I wrong? Does the government not act as the mosquito and are not the banks the malaria? The government shakes the street down.

    I am officially nuts, I think. I’m one of “those” guys on the internet, now.

  53. Poolman, you’re even more of a misinformed loon here than you are at Granny’s blog. Reagan and Bush proved that lie of yours fatuous – we had 25 years of unprecedented growth starting 1982 – the longest period in U.S. history.

    And you’ll note the record of unemployment after tax cuts dramatically both times.

    http://www.miseryindex.us/URbymonth.asp

    In addition, while Reagan did increase the deficit $2 Trillion, during his two terms, net worth in the U.S. increased $17 trillion – in other words, if Obama could manage the same feat, our net worth would have increased almost $30Trillion the last two years. It obviously hasn’t, nor will it with the useless Obama regime.

    If you’re going to post here, you better bring something better than that feckless Alan Grayson – you’ll get shredded immediately.

    The posters here on not the masses of dumbasses you’re used to debating with useful idiots at Granny’s blog.

  54. Tex, the only advantage you have here is you haven’t been banned for your rude and vulgar persona. That isn;t the case with a few other blogs. Grayson is one of the only politicians with balls, and that doesn’t sit well with your warped Limbaugh-soaked brain.

    Capitalism has run its course. Marketing has sold us out. We are a nation of soulless consumers. Money equates to value in the USA, Inc. No money – no worth.

  55. Taxing corporations wouldn’t stop the power grab in the least, in my opinion. Just hurt common folk, once again.

    Rutherford thinks this new Gilded Age is caused by evil business men selling stuff for a profit on the quasi slave labor of the proletariat.

    The Gilded Age has nothing to do with successful production of goods, services, traditional investment or labor.

    More like fiat money on roids, synthetic demand caused by government intervention and, I hate to repeat myself, government created and backed pyramid scams.

    Bubbles are inherent to the free market and even a good thing to some extent.

    But, when Barney Frank and the boys cook economic crystal meth in the form of tampering with the housing market while Wall Street leverages and chops up the poop a thousands ways, we’re not talking about the Beanie Baby Doll craze anymore.

    Government created the bubble and backed the bankers. Simple as that.

  56. How in the living hell you people think raising taxes on, say, a construction company, will cause said construction company to hire more construction workers, is beyond me.

    I own a pool construction company in Arizona. The banks are the ones that made this industry into a real business by offering home improvement (equity) loans to consumers. They made tons of money at it and everything was booming until they pulled the rug out from lending in 2007. They were lending 125 percent of value and including the pool cost as 100 value. I could build as many pools as I could handle. I had 3 salesmen and a couple employees to help with job supervision and office work.

    Now I am operating alone and the only pools we can builtd are cash deals, as the institutions are not lending, and when they do, they are only lending up to 80 percent of equity and the pool is not included as adding any value.

    The banks made us and destryed us. We are just pawns in their game. Has nothing to do with tax rates. Business taxes have done nothing but go up steadily for the past 30 years. Obama actually cut them albeit slightly, Now I’m talking for small business. Big business just sent it all overseas to avoid paying decent wages or having to concern themselves with environment issues. Here in AZ, big business has always gotten breaks for land and taxes. They have also trashed our groundwater and much of the environment.

  57. the only advantage you have here is you haven’t been banned for your rude and vulgar persona

    NO, the one of many advantages I have here is that the blog owner is one of the few libs that aren’t gutless and fascist like your b!tches at Granny’s. And you’ll note they’re having a real difficult time banning me. Too bad for you…

    Grayson is one of the only politicians with balls, and that doesn’t sit well with your warped Limbaugh-soaked brain.

    Dickhead’s big set of “balls” can now be defined as loser – no wonder you relate. He just got his ass handed to him – or did you not notice? Even Rutherford thinks the man a lying scumbag.

    Gawd, you libs are clueless. Anybody that thinks tax rates have nothing to do with investment is so dumb, to not even rate in debate. I don’t know why I bother trying to explain to you loons. If there is anything worse than your immorality, it’s your knowledge of basic economics.

  58. Marketing has sold us out? What does that mean? Tex, where do you find these guys?

    Tex makes friends wherever he goes, don’t you know. It’s his dynamic personality.
    The American Dream – Marketing
    Tobacco – Marketing
    How much does your life revolve around consumer goods? – Marketing, baby, They got you hooked. What do you consider your goals in life? How many vacations or toys will make you happy? Yeah, you’re addicted like the rest of Amerika. I bet you even think there are real terrorists out there, too.

  59. Tex, where do you find these guys?

    They follow me around like viruses after I light their asses on fire for their abject stupidity. I had their entire room talking in tongues the first night I showed up.

    They went googling my name for ammunition, never realizing they found the wrong Tex Taylor. But the one piece of information they did find was that I posted on Rutherford’s blog.

    If Rutherford paid traffic dues, he’d owe you and me royalties. 😉

  60. Gawd, you libs are clueless. Anybody that thinks tax rates have nothing to do with investment is so dumb, to not even rate in debate. I don’t know why I bother trying to explain to you loons. If there is anything worse than your immorality, it’s your knowledge of basic economics.

    Tax rates are lower now than they have been for most of the past 100 years. Yes initially tax cuts boost the economy, but they are not sustained longterm. You really ought to get your head out of those RW media bullshit broadcasters.

  61. Tell you one thing Rabbit. I’ve discovered I have one true talent. Kind of male Ann Coulter.

    I can drop bombs on Libs with the best of them. I shine the light and these Obama roaches scramble.

    You’ll note my “dynamic personality has them “following me” around everywhere I go. Even old General Chen and I had a friendly conversation the other night. This new crop of lefties doesn’t rate with Chen and Rutherford

    We got lucky to find these two.

    And I took your advice – I took three days off and surprisingly didn’t miss it that much. If I could fill my days with something useful, I believe I could give up this bad habit. It’s hard during the winter, because life slows down.

  62. Poolman, I’ve got some really bad news for you small business owners. The smart ones already understand this.

    Taking the cumulative amount of taxes, FICA, fees and services concerning federal, state, local, and you are paying well over 50% of you earnings to your beloved government in some capacity if you make any kind of a living whatsoever.

    Taxes have never been higher for the average Joe – never.

    So when you file Chapter 7, you remind yourself of how Obama saved you….

    You and your ilk are fools.

  63. So, if you agree that business leaves America to improve the bottom line, why would a tax hike magically not play a roll in more of them leaving?

    And who cares if people or shareholders get rich in the first place? If the quality of life goes up for us workin stiffs, who gives a shit?

    I saw Ronald Reagan spark the greatest improvement in the quality of life of the common man in World History. It had nothing to do with banking pyramid scams. It had everything to do with Nanny stepping aside and letting ambitious motherfuckers get rich and hire people.

    * current CEO pay is a different story. It baffles me and I have no answer for it.

    Lastly, why would we want money becoming less efficient? How do you think your life will improve if Nanny gets more money. You yourself seem to be aware of Nanny’s complicity in this epic thievery.

    I’m school teacher these days. Department of Education has been nothing but a financial burden on the State and Local government, despite the billions of dollars the Department siphons from the tax payer. Oh yeah, they get in the way of learning.

    How does Nanny blood sucking spark more people to buy backyard pools?

    What does government do with our money that thrills you so much?

    I don’t get it.

  64. I’ve discovered I have one true talent. Kind of male Ann Coulter.
    I can drop bombs on Libs with the best of them. I shine the light and these Obama roaches scramble.

    I thought Coulter was male. Come on. You’re not seriously falling for all that hair, are you? And you can drop bombs. I’ve seen them. All over here, at the Pajama party, greenfootball, etc. Definitely bombs. Gotta hand you that. But the only light you shine is the one derived from lighting those asses. 😆

  65. How does Nanny blood sucking spark more people to buy backyard pools?

    I think our government needs to be cleaned out. Corporations are running the show. No amount of revenue will improve things. We need to extract industry from government and demand a return to the republic we started out with. What we have is a fascist kleptocracy. We need to have public funded campaigns, term limits, abolish the FED, get the contractors out of the business of government and war, reign in the military. Just those few little things.

    The wealthy will still buy swimming pools. I have been diversifying my business to take on more service and repair work for pools. That will always be needed. The work force in Amerika has been broken up into such specific and specialty factions that it has a difficult time retooling itself. Those who can adapt will survive. Others will not and must seek new jobs and training. It’s a brave new world, baby.

  66. Poolman,

    While I feel consumerism did get out of control and the common man certainly shares part of the blame for the melt down, I truly believe we learned our lesson. Just as we did after the Roaring 20s.

    Have Obama’s banking buddies learned their lesson? Well…yes. They did. Too big to fail rocks!

    So, you hate on us niggas because we are into shiny trinkets and not into sophisticated things like books on holistic medicine and Eastern Tantric Sex.

    This coming from a man who fed his family by selling an icon of leisure and material success- the swimming pool.

    As for me being some kind of metro sexual into buying shit at the mall….Even Greychin wouldn’t toss that one at me.

  67. Hey, I loves my consumer goods, too, dead rabbit. I have been guilty of maxing my credit cards in the past, for sure. It was all so innocent and slow. Like rasslin’ a snake. Before you know it, it’s got you, not the other way around. I didn’t see the significance of how it all has been played until I was caught up in the trap myself. I should have. Marketing was my college major. You can sell anything, if the packaging is right. We all got our fantasies, all we need is a little persuasion.

  68. Tex, you can’t quit outright, dude. They may hate you, but your the soul of these blogs.

    You don’t need the dumb Rabbit to say this, but I will anyways: Moderation is key.

    I hear you in the winter time.

    I swear you should join an over 50 softball league this summer. I play with my Dad still and he is pushin’ 70. And I know that you know that the girl’s under hand game is a great outlet for alpha male dorks.

    If we were buddies in real life, I’d fall for some of Poolman’s marketing he talks about and buy you a mitt for Christmas.

  69. Poolman,

    I think one of the coolest things in this American life is eyeing some new toy, packaged nice and pretty, and saving up for it. Nothing wrong with rational consumerism.

    Also, thanks to government intervention in the student loan industry under the notion that everybody needs to own a house…uh..I mean go to college full time, a tuition bubble was created. This in turn created an acceptance of debt. You can’t really have that healthy dose of fear when being under water a hundred thousand stacks is the norm right out the gate.

  70. I lucked out for my education in that my dad’s army “lifer” status and his death when I was 18 essentially paid for my college with VA and SS benefits. I know plenty with loans that are struggling to pay those back. Thank God I didn’t have to worry about that.

    I think what we have done to the education system in this land really sucks. I don’t know the answers. True teachers just want to educate. It’s their passion, and they shouldn’t have to deal with the politics of it or come out of their own pocket to equip their students.

    It is much the same with medicine. Most doctors just want to help people, yet they are forced to operate in ways that are not conducive to providing the best health care.

    Well I’m off to bed. Good chatting with you. Later.

  71. All over here, at the Pajama party, greenfootball, etc. Definitely bombs. Gotta hand you that. But the only light you shine is the one derived from lighting those asses.

    Damn, you guys really have been doing your research. I must have really lit the nags engorged butt cheeks on fire for these people to go to the trouble.

    Except I didn’t use Tex Taylor on LGF, so you’ve got me confused again. PJM I consider my “professional” thread, so I respond accordingly. I may light a few asses that read it, but my comments are both more generic, more thought out, more grammatically correct, and more impersonal in nature there.

    About that light Poolman? That “only light” is the only light I intend to light at blogs I deem littered with nothing but useful idiots from the left, Rutherford being the exception. 😉

    Most of the posters at feckless Granny’s are incapable of real discussion and remind me of a poster named Yeller Dawg here. He’s on a windup string too, so I don’t bother getting technical or detailed.

    I just like to rattle their monkey cage and watch the chimps fling themselves from limb to limb. And normally, I don’t bother sneaking back in – but it was so humorous to watch the harpies scramble, I decided to have a little more fun.

  72. One of the burdens of being a blog owner is actually looking through your SPAM before deleting all of it. It’s been harder lately because the spammers are on steroids of late. In fact, I’ve been collecting some of the more amusing fake messages for a fun post a few weeks or months from now.

    But I digress … looking through a huge load of SPAM last night, I stumbled upon the comment from poolman (complete with Alan Grayson video) and decided (good for me) that it was not a well-disguised piece of self-promotional “link to my porn site” bullsh*t.

    One of the best calls I’ve made all year! Poolman welcome to the blog. I see you know Tex. LOL Ain’t he a kick?

    I need to clarify one statement made by Tex. I don’t think Alan Grayson is a lying scumbag. I DO think that Alan Grayson is sound and fury signifying next to nothing. Too much show, not enough depth. I’d swap Anthony Weiner for Grayson any day. Weiner knows how to light the room on fire but back it up with substance.

    Again, poolman, welcome. Libs don’t last long here, I hope you’re a keeper! 🙂

  73. Rabbit, I’m no defender of the complicity between government, banking and Wall Street. There’s more than enough blame to go around.

    Still you (and Tigre) miss the damn point. Either deficits matter to you or they don’t. I’m not saying that raising taxes by 3% is going to encourage hiring. I fully agree that is counter-intuitive. But then don’t whine to me about the f*cking deficit and how the deficit is Obama’s fault and how our kids are going to be saddled with our debt. The fact is, a continuation of the 3% tax cut for the rich results in 700 billion dollars more being added to the deficit over the next 10 years. If you’re happy with that, then fine.

    You guys seem to think I’m advocating for letting the Bush tax cuts lapse. I’m advocating against rank hypocrisy. Your GOP leaders are full of sh*t. They want to protect fat cats and they’re holding ordinary people like you and me hostage to do it.

  74. Rutherford,

    Can you believe you and I actually were ahead of the curve about what defines as rich? They even used our figure too! A million bucks a year. That comes closer to being “rich”. I think we should run for office!

    Don’t worry about Poolman – he’ll stick around. I actually kind of like him, though he is a loon. Like you and Chen, he’s got a tough hide and he’s not a completely crazy – he is of the Jim Dougan mold. The site he hangs out is the dregs, even more obsessed with Sarah Palin that you are, and he needs to get over here more often. Poolman is not a pompous asshole like Graychin Von Rambo either. And he has one advantage over you – he’s not the irreligious schmuck.

    So you keep writing your posts, and Rabbit and I will keep helping promote you. I expect royalties if you ever strike it big.

  75. Yes, Rutherford, I have become aquainted with Tex and his various other handles. He’s a fiery one, for sure. I’ve got relatives and friends that are cut from the same corduroy, lol.

    I do like Weiner, as well as Sanders and Kucinich. I like Grayson, but he is not a savy politician. He doesn’t go with the flow very well. Doesn’t really know how to work the system. He was more effective in his lawyer practice fighting against military contractors, for which he has had success. He was elected on a fluke and the GOP decided to topple him with all their clout. Of course it worked, primarily because his own district is predominantly red.

    Unless my pool business picks up real fast and soon, I’ll be checking in and adding to the mix. I appreciate the hospitality and the ability to express my opinions. I wouldn’t want the Texter to get to feeling too high and mighty. Not too many mountaintops anyway in Oklahoma, but that’s OK… 😉

  76. Poolman, the real beauty in Tex’s charges of irreligiosity is that one must adhere to the Book of Tex in order to qualify as religious.. Several “believers” have had their guts spilled by Tex ‘cos they didn’t measure up.

    I find it amusing. 🙂

  77. one must adhere to the Book of Tex in order to qualify as religious

    This statement is incorrect. Being ‘religious’ is the biggest part of the problem.

    Private Graychin Rafterman is “religious”. UBL is religious; Oprah is religious.

    All three are lost causes

  78. Oh, and Tex…. Jesus was a progressive liberal. How do you justify that?

    How do you figure? Was it his loving approval of abortion that gave you that hint?

  79. Tex, all you have to do is read Matthew chapters 5 through 7 to get his ideological stance. I shouldn’t need to interpret for you. Imagine Him taking the political compass quiz and where would He fall?

    I love that you bring up the abortion issue. Typical. I didn’t dig that old dead horse out of the closet. You and Neil at Eternity Matters wear that one around your neck. The stench reaches to the heavens. I am prolife, always. But I’m sure it’s okay in your book to blast Muslim kids with DU munitions in the name of God. I find that very Christlike. Not! Hypocrisy much? 😆

  80. Anyway as someone who actually served and have many friends that are vets or serving now. DADT reversal will have its ups and downs. Those that think it is no big deal though are f@#$ing clueless. I point to the racial and sexual based issues that are constant drags on the daily life of peace and combat time duty. Open homosexuality on the bases and ships of the US military IS NOT GONNA GO OVER WELL.
    Also contrary to the good and noble embodied within many of those that serve and are homosexual and would like to do so without hiding there is something much bigger afoot with the repeal DADT crowd.
    The position is supported by those that would never serve,ever! But very much want homosexual rights agenda points accomplished,so marriage nationwide? Absolutely especially once BAQ’s start going to same sex couples to live together.

    I honestly thought I was on this thread with that. Well here it is.

  81. The “Don’t Ask” part stays in place because it’s none of your damn business!
    No Way!!!!! The military is far different from getting a job in corporate America or Walmart. Some questions MUST be asked and this is one of them. Along those lines ALL the other hot button and illegal questions MUST also be asked.
    2. Gay soldiers are to abide by the same rules as straight soldiers. You don’t sexually harass your fellow troops. You’re there to defend your country, not to hook up.
    True but…. It happens and will happen and I’d put it to folks that “open” cases of homosexual harassment has a higher order of impact on morale and effectiveness.As for the duty part,well actually many sign up for the college $$$ and stability and balk when it comes to being called on to do what one has been trained for. Its a small # and cuts across all demos but truth is truth.
    #3…
    This is just sadly ignorant to reality. I got along with the black guys in my unit. And they actively respected me. To say there wasn’t a “cracker” brigade though is crazy talk. They’re there people just like the bruthas that actively hates whitey. I’ve seen it in action. For the most part you get the job done but cohesion issues are there and they are real.
    I can also provide a number of incidents where the female issue caused more than a little unit disharmony. In one case it endangered a soldiers life as the “tuna truck” (female staffed field ambulance) was incapable of evacuating a wounded soldier. We ended up calling in a chopper.

  82. @ poolman. I personally doubt Jesus would prove to be a far right conservative on the Political Compass quiz but seriously if you think he’d be far Left or even Progressive you’re not being honest.
    The quiz is pretty bogus but from memory I can’t see where some of the social,tax and drug answers of Jesus would fail to keep him to the Right.

  83. Well it is probably kind of sinful but I revisited the PC Quiz as Jesus Christ. my score
    Economic Left/Right: 0.88
    Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.05
    This is not a Leftist spot.
    the criteria I used t answer the questions was one of absolutes and in the best spirit of Biblical teachings. What I mean from this is the answers can only be Strongly Agree or Strongly Disagree. I think that captures the spirit of the Alpha Omega. One knows where you stand with Him,He is quite clear.
    Further examples include:
    Jesus would be against abortion.
    Jesus would be for free will. This comes into play with the econ ?’s
    Jesus would obviously be very interested in fairness and honesty.
    Jesus would come to the questions from a position of Love.
    Although I feel a little shmucky doing this I believe I was brutally fair in answering,so it is what it is.
    So please don’t trash me too much for doing this. I did it in the spirit of making a point and exploring myself more than attempting sacrilege.

  84. @Alfie,

    I don’t think you are too familiar with the sermon on the mount, as it is familiarly referred. It is VERY progressive and radically liberal, even today. As far as taxes are concerned, He stated that we were to “give unto Ceasar what was Ceasar’s”, since his face was on the money. I’m sure that still would apply today. He taught to submit and obey the governmental authorities over you, claiming that the Father had set them in their positions of power and that they were used by Him to accomplish His goals. Afterall, he was not found guilty of any crime against the state as he did obey all the laws of the land that He traveled in, but the religious leaders of His day forced the state to kill him.

    As far as drugs, we are taught in the scriptures that ALL that is made by God is good and has a useful purpose. Of course, abuse is not sanctioned.

  85. Alfie,

    The only part of the Bible Poolman knows is the Sermon on the Mount. You can discard the depth of a petri dish.

    But I’m sure it’s okay in your book to blast Muslim kids with DU munitions in the name of God. I find that very Christlike. Not! Hypocrisy much?

    You’re right. God intended for you to stand around and watch your wife raped, your neighbors beheaded, your daughters given in marriage at the age of nine, and your homes exploded by the thousands as you stand around and mouth platitudes.

    You got me there Poolman. 🙄

    Do you know how dumb you libs sound when you try and quote scripture to justify your cowardice and immorality? You sound about as credible as Nancy Pelosi…

  86. I don’t think you are too familiar with the sermon on the mount, as it is familiarly referred.
    Actually I have it right in front of me,NIV and I disagree with your assertions.I also cry FOUL on how you apply your interpretations.
    I don’t see where one can call it liberal especially in the context of modern USA liberalism.
    As I stated before I set forth answering the questions with an intellectually honest heading.
    Before you criticize me further why don’t you go play Jesus and share your result.

  87. I like to think that Jesus had more in common with John Lennon

    Somehow, I imagine that were the first and last words John Lennon heard.

    Imagine no religion…♫ ♫

    Sorry to have to state the obvious.

  88. that were? 😆

    Make that was….great basketball game by the way. Have I mentioned that I hate putting out lights for Christmas? Bah humbug.

  89. It is amazing how some people can read the same thing and even the same exact words, and get so many different takes from it. Modern USA liberalism and liberal are not the same. I know our language has been twisted and true meanings are difficult to discern. A thorough study in semantics should be mandantory at grade school levels. Many words have been hijacked and demonized. Liberal is generous and all encompassing. It advocates the concept of allowing all others free will and access. Progressive advocates moving ahead. Pressing on toward a goal. Bettering oneself and one’s circumstance. Striving toward perfection, not stagnating or falling back in the same old habits of yesterday.

    Simple concepts that are apparently not easy to grasp, it seems. So true interpretation is still where the blockage occurs. You haven’t cleaned the filters well enough to receive pure knowledge. Your preconceived notions have clouded your understanding.

    And Tex, I wasn’t aware that all those things happened to you. I guess you have a reason to hate, but even that too can be alleviated. You have to get past that to actually receive forgiveness yourself.

  90. poolman words also have clear applications. When I speak of liberal,liberalism and USA liberalism I am very concise and I speak from a purely political position,as opposed to say the liberal application of ph balancers.
    Again from a political standpoint Progressives is not entirely synonymous to progress,progressing etc.
    You knew that before ya got your snark on though,didn’t ya?

  91. John Lennon and Jesus would get along just fine.

    Mmmm let’s be detached and logical here.
    Adultery,drugs and false idols. (the last usually being tossed onto Yoko or George)
    The only truth to the statement is that if on that fateful Monday evening John said “oh Jesus”…Jesus would’ve been there with him.

  92. @Alfie, words DO have specific meanings. Because they have been MANipulated doesn’t mean that their true intent and definitions have been changed. I prefer pure forms in all things. The true and real essence is what interests me, and where I attempt to live.

    Words are weapons for good or evil. I’m sure words like “Patriot Act” and “Operation Iraqi Freedom” were chosen to disguise the true intent. Or?

  93. Of course, part of the Bush tax cuts extension could be paid for with the funds that haven’t been spent from the Stimulus.

    It’s pretty clear the crap it has gone for thus far was a waste.

  94. @Alfie, I never claimed that John Lennon lived a sinless life. Only one that has ever walked this earth can claim that. But his actions and intents, especially near the end of his life emulate a true peacemaker and advocate of love and good over evil. He was willing to stand on those beliefs and it did cost him his life.

  95. poolman=Dan????
    I’m not gonna get into a words thing with you. I’ll leave it to all on the board to express where they stand on it.
    He was willing to stand on those beliefs and it did cost him his life.
    OMG! NO No No. Lennon died because Chapman was a f@#$ing nutcase. Compare and contrast all the exams and statements involved and nut + fan overwhelmingly defeats pissy anti-Lennonist
    I’m done.

  96. “Words are weapons for good or evil. I’m sure words like “Patriot Act” and “Operation Iraqi Freedom” were chosen to disguise the true intent.”

    Oh, by all means, please enlighten us as to what was the true intent.

  97. @Alfie, apparently you haven’t done any serious research into the circumstances and done a “follow the dots” exercise. Fact is Lennon was a serious threat to imperialism and the MIC because of his celebrity and sway with the public. Here nor there, that is too complex to get into on a gorgeous Saturday afternoon. Who is Dan?

    @Hucking Fypocrites, tell me what is “patriotic” about that act. It sounds good, but the intent was to usurp our rights and freedoms, which it HAS done on a huge scale. Tell me who is “free” in Iraq, besides unbridled American capitalists. Most Iraqis claim that they were better off under Sadaam, who BTW, WE put in power to begin with. Ask any of those in the concentration camps we have set up over there.

    You probably buy into the concept of “free enterprise”, “liberty and justice” for all, and “NO Credit – NO problem”, too.

    There is a video out titled “Psyops” that would benefit you sheeple. I mean that in a good way, too. 😉

  98. Poolman, you missed an earlier thread where I told the resident conservatives that if we had only named the full body scanners in the airports, Patriot Scanners, they wouldn’t have said boo about them. 😆

  99. 1. Only the “Don’t Tell” part of the law gets killed. The “Don’t Ask” part stays in place because it’s none of your damn business!

    Yes, it does matter. Military service is one of those places where many of the basic freedoms you have every right to expect as a civilian citizen go right out the window. John Q. Public can mouth off about politicians being halfwits all day long. Do it in uniform, and it is “contemptuous words”, and punishable under the UCMJ. Why? Because we can have no question that the military in this country serves civilian authority, and because such limitations are essential to maintaining good order and discipline. Allowing open service by gays will require time to

    A) Change the rules under which all members serve, and any lawyer will tell you that such statutory changes made in haste almost always results in poorly written and conceived laws;

    B) It will take time to change the culture. This is not one you should easily dismiss, R. With a volunteer military, service is the result of a contract, rather than compulsion, and whether you like it or not, the presumption under DADT was that gays would not be serving. If this was a term or condition material to you when you signed on the bottom line, you are now being subjected to a condition which you did not agree to when you entered into the contract. In addition, there are those who serve who want nothing to do with that lifestyle choice. Like adding women into active duty and combat units, and integration before then, it can be accomplished, but it will take time, and if we place a social agenda before a military that is proficient, we threaten to weaken our first line of defense so that some among us can sleep at night secure in their moral superiority at forcing a legal change to a long standing cultural and legal norm.

    C) There are serious practical considerations. Militaries do violent things, and people bleed. While the introduction of AIDS and HIV into the medical and social lexicon forced changes to even basic first aid in the attempt to prevent infection by blood-borne pathogens, the fact remains that gay males still have the highest infection rates in the US population, and that war is messy, and the potential for infecting others goes up exponentially. How do you propose to address this issue? Deny admittance to those already infected, and perhaps aren’t even aware? Regular checks for those who openly serve, and discharge for those who are infected? Or perhaps you simply favor letting them serve as long as they are able, and let the potential for them infecting others increase? The latter would be very destructive to both morale, and good order.

    2. Gay soldiers are to abide by the same rules as straight soldiers. You don’t sexually harass your fellow troops. You’re there to defend your country, not to hook up.

    In a perfect world, maybe, but not in this one. You can find members of the military who will admit to knowing that someone they served with at some point was gay, but many will also tell you that they were also very circumspect. However, the integration of women into the general military structure also lead to conditions where discrimination and harassment has occurred, and no, men have not always been doing the harassing and discriminating. Regardless of who is the malfeasor, this has lead to more resources being allocated to prosecutions and discipline than existed before. There is no reason to expect that open service by gays will lead to fewer problems, claims, and ultimately, litigation. It is also just as likely to lead to false claims, like when Neil thinks he got passed over for promotion because inspection is his favorite time. Now Neil may not be the best candidate for promotion, but thanks to the mindset that affirmative action and the perversion of sexual harassment laws have put in average people’s minds, this is a harder case to prove than it used to be, because of the enshrining of entitlement at the expense of merit. And I find it difficult to believe that this isn’t an attack on one of the last true bastions of merit in our institutions.

    3. Everybody carry on as you did before because guess what? It didn’t matter worth a rat’s ass before and it doesn’t matter now. Just do your duty. And Bob, if you wanna write a letter home to your boyfriend Ted and you wanna tell your bunk mate about it, be my guest. If your bunk mate doesn’t like it, he can say “thanks for sharing, I’m not interested in your love life.” Done deal.

    Except that before, if Bob was attracted to his buddy, Bill, he had great incentive to keep it to himself. Now, not so much. And Bill may not like being the object of Bob’s affections.

    Also, there is a reason why men and women have separate housing in the military, and it isn’t based on a certain attraction, but the potential for attraction. What do you do now,when Bob may not be turned on by Bill’s package or poop shoot, but maybe he think’s Fred’s has potential?

    I know you want to just dismiss this and move on, R, but if you don’t think that any of these are serious concerns, you’re kidding yourself.

  100. “tell me what is “patriotic” about that act. It sounds good, but the intent was to usurp our rights and freedoms, which it HAS done on a huge scale.”

    I am not a fan of all aspects of the Patriot Act, nor do I buy into all aspects of “we must trade freedoms for safety.” With that said, do you completely ignore the safety factors that are said to have motivated the Act, and that continue to motivate it?

    “Tell me who is “free” in Iraq, besides unbridled American capitalists.”

    The electorate of Iraq. Does their democracy have its share of issues?…sure. But until we see election results where candidates are getting in the 90% range of the votes, I would have to say their elections are more free than in the past.

    And if you want to argue that the US has supported Saddam in the past, that is fine. If you want to argue that the US put Saddam in power, you’re going to have to do more than just say it. Please elaborate.

    You might also do yourself a favor and not make assumptions about what I think. You’ll save yourself some future embarrassment.

  101. Cracks me up that a sales pitch man for the Government has the nerve to call us “sheeple”.

    You are the epitome of establishment.

    You are The Man.

  102. Cracks me up that a sales pitch man for the Government has the nerve to call us “sheeple”.

    What planet are you on? I want the original republic back. I been told I fall more in line with an anarchist. Words, meanings, perception, understanding. This is our downfall as a people. The dumbing down of Amerika has been quite successful, eh?

    @Hucking, Read Zbiegniew Brzezinski’s the Grand Chessboard, or the tenets of PNAC, you’ll get the big picture. The “Patriot Act” was written way before 9-11, just waiting for that “new Pearl Harbor” incident to implement.

    And as to Sadaam… 😉

  103. Poolman, you missed an earlier thread where I told the resident conservatives that if we had only named the full body scanners in the airports, Patriot Scanners, they wouldn’t have said boo about them

    Agreed. Do they even realize that dual citizen Michael Chertoff had all those applied patents and in production way before the underpants bomber did his orchestrated act?

  104. I’m not interested in watching a video. If your argument isn’t worth articulating here in text then it must not be that strong.

    The same goes for reading your recommended book. If you are unable to give your own argument here, then that tells me that it is either not very strong, or that you don’t have a very good grasp of the concepts.

  105. @ Hucking, for real? A seven minute video that summarizes the history and you aren’t willing to give it that? Sorry, I thought you had an interest in learning.

    AFA the books, the gist is that in order to expand the power and footprint of the western industrialized world domination, the citizens of such a nation had to be submissive and controlled and thereby persuaded to take aggressive action that would not be possible unless and until a catastrophic event equivilent to a “new Pearl Harbor” occured to enable the government to usurp such control over the citizens. It is really an interesting read and has been available online for free downloading for some time.

    You can lead a horse to water….

    Anyway, enjoy your evening. I’m off to enjoy mine.

  106. Got to love the year 2010. Our “anarchists” spend their free time convincing people to make government bigger.

    Then again, I’m a vegetarian who loves a New York strip medium rare.

  107. Poolman,

    Do you forget who you are talking to with your sanctimony? I’ve read enough of your screed to know a Pharisee when I read one.

    Simple concepts that are apparently not easy to grasp, it seems. So true interpretation is still where the blockage occurs. You haven’t cleaned the filters well enough to receive pure knowledge. Your preconceived notions have clouded your understanding.

    You mean simple concepts not understood that Barack Obama’s religion one of convenience and a child in the womb fully human? Oh, I could go on and on.

    You are deceived my friend. You say many of the right things, but your actions and decisions say otherwise. You come to the wrong conclusions, though you’re supposed convictions say otherwise.

    But your quite right about the word liberalism.

    Christmas lights should be banned…there is nothing more frustrating, besides liberals believing themselves righteous.

  108. Tex, a Pharisee? LOL. You’re funny. I’ve seen your posts here and elsewhere that beg me to question YOUR faith. I certainly can’t say I’ve heard that kind of language or experienced the hate, judgments, and threats from those I know as true believers. But I am judging the words, and not you personally, since I have no idea what you have gone through or where your heart is before God. That is truly where it matters. And besides, you’re on my prayerlist now, so the more I know about you, the better I know HOW to pray.

    AFA Obama is concerned, he has publicly admitted to being a born-again Christian and his family and lifestyle does not contradict that, though much of his political policies do. Politicians and soldiers are two occupations that seem to contradict the very tenets of the faith. I am not in his head or privy to the same information he is to make a judgment there. I do know that as soon as JFK stood up to the Fed, he wasn’t around much longer to do any good for anyone. That’s just fact, I won’t discuss any conspiracies, so let’s just agree that was a convenient coincidence. I am tasked to pray for my leaders and the POTUS certainly fits that criterion. So I do that on a daily basis.

    I won’t take the abortion bait yet again. I will reinterate that I am pro-life, and I am very grateful that abortions have been declining steadily year by year, even while they are still legally available. That tells me some education IS helping. The abstinence bit has NEVER worked, but that is factual and statistics prove it.

    What does greatly bother me is the way we have demonized Muslims and portrayed them as enemies worthy of annihilation. And we have “religious” leaders fueling that fire. Just because they have radicalized factions that misunderstand their own spiritual texts, we want to label them all as evil. Every other Abramaic faith has those same radical factions. That is why religion is dangerous, IMO. It MANipulates people. Anyone who kills another in the name of God in this day and age is delusional and certainly not a true believer of any of those faiths. That judgment I CAN make. I’m not saying murder is an unforgivable sin, just that a true believer that is on the true path doesn’t murder in thought or deed. Not even one “Dustin Dominiak”, whoever the heck he is.

    I am not saying I have all the answers, because I certainly don’t. I learn something new daily. I try my best to live my faith. I am the same here as I am in person, whether at home or in public. I take responsibility for all my words and actions. I love and respect others and desire to help them in anyway I can with the resources I have available to offer. Call it what you will, but my heart is open and clear before my Lord.

    I’ll will agree on the Christmas thing, too. Christmas is just a marketing ploy. Originally to patronize the pagans who were lumped together with the original Catholic church. Now for the capitalist advantage it provides. Jesus wasn’t born in the winter anyway. It doesn’t fit the scripture.

    As far as liberals believing themselves righteous – sure. Most people today are self-righteous, be they liberal, conservative, atheist, or deist. I think it is just a sign of the times. Humble doesn’t rate with societal norms.

  109. Rabbit, something has really turned your head around when you think a pool salesman/contractor is THE MAN. Unless of course you meant that as humor.

    Right now, if I were to nominate any of our denizens THE MAN it would be Gorilla who represents the military/industrial complex and BiW who probably makes out quite nicely in his law practice.

    The rest of us are all average Joe’s …. Joe the Plumber, so to speak. 😀

  110. I’ve actually seen pretty good evidence from Jews, Jewish calendars, their festivals with calculation that Christ was indeed born in Sept or Oct like Poolman said.

    This is based on the calculated birth date of John the Baptist.

    But I’ve also read an equally plausible explanation that it was John the Baptist born in the month of Sep or Oct, and Christ would have been born in the month of April, also a time that shepherds would have been in their fields . I’ll see if I can find the explanation.

    Either way, Poolman is right that December seems an unlike time of Christ’s birth.

    Most historians do seem to agree that Christ was actually born in what we now know 5-4 B.C. and more easily documented in that we know the approximate time of Herod’s death.

    Interesting discussion.

  111. I have a question for the room and there is no right answer. Just an opinion, and I would be curious what you guys and gal(s) believe.

    Who do each of you consider the most famous woman in history?

  112. I love questions like this.

    1. This one is easy. Mary
    2. Cleopatra
    3. Queen Elizabeth
    4. Thatcher
    5. Marilyn Monroe

  113. Poolman please note: You are a certified member of the tin foil hat brigade and much like Dan the alleged Christian who believes pedophilia was only a crime in first century Greek culture are on the Loon List.
    I cannot have conversations in either the “e” world or the real world with folks that embrace conspiracy theories. I know you’ll see this as no great loss for you and that’s cool. That doesn’t mean you’re not a nut. Cheers

  114. I actually think that Monroe should be 4 and Thatcher 5, now that I think of it. Monroe is like the Coca Cola logo or something.

  115. Rutherford…
    I believe you are ignorant when you state

    if we had only named the full body scanners in the airports, Patriot Scanners, they wouldn’t have said boo about them.

    Many conservatives and libertarians have had a problem with post 9/11 measures. Aligning the humorous “Freedom Fries” mentality with accepting government intrusion should be beneath you.

  116. Rutherford, shilling for the establishment has nothing to do with wealth. You try to convince us on a daily basis to make the government bigger. The Poolmans of America are the best friends of government. You both should be paid for your efforts.

    The Poolman claims to be an anarchist on the same day he argues for Government to grow and I’m the crazy one? I actually knew he thought that about himself, before he claimed it.

    Liberals love to play the Rebel without a Cause Card.

    Since when do rebels long for the teet?

    You guys constantly rip on the masses but claim you are for the little guy.

    Pretend populists, fake ass Robin Hood’s.

  117. Of course, the calendar was much different then, and that actually accounted for most people pinpointing the wrong year in terms of celestial events.

    If its all the same, I think I’ll come down on the side of the guy who actually used a computer to get the math right.

  118. Poolman please note: You are a certified member of the tin foil hat brigade and much like Dan the alleged Christian who believes pedophilia was only a crime in first century Greek culture are on the Loon List.

    I’m glad you feel more comfortable now that you think you’ve pegged me and don’t have to infect your mind with any new revelation. Human nature makes us want to label and categorize everything and everyone. Black is still black. White is still white. Good is still good, and evil is still evil. It is all a choice and I choose reality over fantasy and good over evil, whatever that reveals and wherever it takes me. Sorry, if it isn’t always comfortable. When we close and lock a door to keep us “secure”, we also eliminate our access and thereby imprison ourselves. C’est la vie.

    The Poolman claims to be an anarchist on the same day he argues for Government to grow and I’m the crazy one?

    When did I say I was for bigger government? You either misunderstood or are confusing me with someone else. Given the opportunity, I would shake this government to its core and dump all the leeches that live off of it. Pass me whatever you’re smoking, though. Don’t bogart.

  119. Who do each of you consider the most famous woman in history?

    1. Mary (mother of Jesus)
    2. Cleopatra
    3. Eve (the original woman)
    4. Marie Antoinette
    5. Mother Theresa

    If we are going with the entire history. However, women were notoriously left out of historical accounts, for the most part, in favor of men and the accomplishments of men. Men were also the recorders of history, so I’m sure there was MANipulation of fact and deed.

  120. So lower taxes? Repeal Obama Care? Eliminate the DOE?

    Are taxes and the IRS even legal? I would certainly cut them, if we could streamline government and cut back all the fat, especially the MIC, and get the no competitive bid contractors out of the mix.

    Dump Obamacare? Sure. If we could reign in Big Pharma and the insurance companies otherwise. The healthcare passed was just health insurance reform anyway. It isn’t tough enough, IMO. I was and still am for single-payer. I don’t see where insurance companies need to be a part of healthcare at all.

    Definitely dump the DOE. I mean what do they do , anyway. Homeland security is HUGE, too. I say off with their heads!

  121. Letseee… you want the government in charge of providing health care for everyone.

    Why stop there? How about government takes over food production and provides food to everyone too?

    Why not make it the duty of government to provide everyone’s housing while you’re at it?

  122. Good answers one and all – I’m still kind of chuckling at BiC’s answer, because one never knows how to take the name Madonna anymore.

    I’ll give Rutherford a chance to take a stab before commenting much further. But all of you have already enhanced what I want to say.

    And I must say I’m pleasantly surprised at the answers…

  123. Then you aren’t for smaller government at all.

    Medicare for all. If done correctly, does NOT grow government. You have just bought into the spin that the GOP and the Blue Dog Dems, along with their corporate pimps were able to convince the sheeple. What we have now costs us WAY MORE than single payer would, AND it wouldn’t cost us over 40,000 lives every year.

  124. If done correctly, does NOT grow government.

    Even if that wasn’t complete and utter bullshit, it puts waaaaayyyyy too much power into the hands of people who have proven time and again that they could fuck up a ham sandwich.

    People who cannot turn a dime delivering the mail and running trains are going to deliver health care to everyone without growing government? Did you actually read that before hitting “Post Comment”, or are you just the comedic relief in Chin and Dawg’s absence?

  125. He’s an anarchist in every way except for the fact he wants Nanny to literally stick her big meaty finger in his butt.

  126. Even if that wasn’t complete and utter bullshit, it puts waaaaayyyyy too much power into the hands of people who have proven time and again that they could fuck up a ham sandwich.

    But you’re likely good with our military’s budget and over-reach, eh? It’s okay to kill, maime, and destroy. It’s okay that much of our remaining domestic industry is someway involved in weapons and “defense” related manufacture, right?

    If the government was restructured and put on a leash that the PEOPLE (read: American citzens) controlled, administration (only) of health care could save us lives and huge money.

    It is a FACT that we spend at least twice as much PER INDIVIDUAL citizen than any nation on our health care, yet we are ranked around 37th in overall care. Health should be a lifestyle and should be a lifelong endeavor involving food, exercise, and preventative care. Not a chance for capitalism to profit and exploit, like it IS now.

    He’s an anarchist in every way except for the fact he wants Nanny to literally stick her big meaty finger in his butt.

    No, I’ll stick with a private practice doctor for any anal probing, though the thought of any anal probing doesn’t sit well with me. LOL. I don’t know what would cause you to go there, mentally or otherwise. I just think he can get his pay from money I pay into the system, without all the middlemen we have now.

    You guys are all Fox news watchers, right?

  127. Libs always lie like dogs…especially when it comes to healthcare.

    It is a FACT that we spend at least twice as much PER INDIVIDUAL citizen than any nation on our health care, yet we are ranked around 37th in overall care.

    So poorly rated that King Saud skipped Europe on the flyover and brought his entire entourage of three jets and the whole wing of a hospital to have his cancer treated in the 37th rated U.S. health care.

    It’s completely bogus bullshit statements like this that force me to mock ‘progressive’ imbeciles and never believe a word they say concerning facts.

  128. We have the best health care proffessionals in the world here. No doubt. If you got the money honey…

    Doesn’t change the FACTS. I know YOU difficulty with black and white. 🙄

  129. a video out titled “Psyops” that would benefit you

    I meant Psywar.

    Well worth the investment in time. Think of it like candy for the intellect. I realize it is a video. I think education and learning, along with truth can be found in many forms and places. I know some of you prefer not to have anything challenge your hardened and core beliefs, but a little sunshine is always good, IMO. If those beliefs are so “right and rigid”, a little fresh clear wind shouldn’t bother their structural integrity.

  130. We have the best health care proffessionals in the world here. No doubt. If you got the money honey…

    15 years ago, Levaquin was a painfully expensive anti-rejection and anti-infective drug. Most insurances tried to make doctors prescribe anything else to avoid the cost of paying for it.

    Today, it is widely prescribed and much more affordable. This is just one of many such examples.

    As for the exceptional treatment that is available, because some of the finest doctors are able to charge those who can pay, they are also able to provide their services to those who cannot, making better quality care available to those with lessor means. On the flip side, price controls without any meaningful tort reform will only serve to discourage many in the current talent pool from practicing medicine. This has already been happening, as many doctors can see what’s coming, and prefer early retirement to indentured servitude.

    Then there is the little matter of authority for what you propose, that being that the government does not possess it, despite what those noted Constitutional scholars, such as Granny Rictus Pelosi, and others have to say. But some of you are slow, and refuse to learn from the examples of other single payer systems where waits for routine procedures are interminable, where councils of faceless bureaucrats who are not accountable to anyone frequently decide that lifesaving courses of treatment are too costly, causing “needless” deaths, and these same people get to decide that you are too old for procedures that are widely available to people in the same cohort here.

    It isn’t that other nations provide care more economically; it is just that they spend the money differently, taking the choices of how they spend their money away from their citizens. Don’t even start down the road of telling me fewer people die. There are whole classes of patients in utopian health care systems who would beg to differ with you.

  131. “I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class thug for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902–1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.”

    Maj. Gen. Smedley Butler

  132. ”The world has achieved brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. We know more about war that we know about peace, more about killing that we know about living.”

    — Omar Bradley, Five-Star General, United States Army & the first Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

  133. 15 years ago, Levaquin was a painfully expensive anti-rejection and anti-infective drug.

    “It is sold under various brand names, such as Levaquin and Tavanic, the most common.”

    “Levofloxacin is associated with a number of serious and life-threatening adverse reactions as well as spontaneous tendon ruptures and irreversible peripheral neuropathy. Such reactions may manifest long after therapy had been completed and in severe cases may result in life-long disabilities. Hepatoxicity has also been reported with the use of levofloxacin.” per wikipedia*

    *I’m not always convinced with the accuracy of Wikipedia, but in this case, it seems to agree with other studies that have been published.

    Big Pharma IS part of the problem. They have done much good, but overall their profit and controls harm our healthcare system. They are profit oriented FIRST. That usually doesn’t bode well for humans.

  134. I don’t want us to mimic any other nation’s health system, although many rank much higher than we do in overall care and cost. Are any perfect? No. But France and Sweden rank VERY high with both the citizens, providers, AND statistics.

    America USED to be a leader and the envy of the world. We SHOULD be able to have the very best system of healthcare in the world. We are far from it. If healthcare is strickly profit-oriented instead of results-oriented, we will NEVER even get close.

  135. “Levofloxacin is associated with a number of serious and life-threatening adverse reactions as well as spontaneous tendon ruptures and irreversible peripheral neuropathy. Such reactions may manifest long after therapy had been completed and in severe cases may result in life-long disabilities. Hepatoxicity has also been reported with the use of levofloxacin.” per wikipedia*

    And if true, the current FDA testing standards would not have revealed this anyway. Would your answer be even longer testing periods for new drugs than we already have? Would this help people? What about other drugs that have been developed and marketed in the same time period? Zithromax, perhaps? Or would you consign people to drugs that aren’t as effective, such as Keflex, or Amoxicilin? What about those with penicilin allergies? The Myacin drugs aren’t always effective against the illnesses that they would be prescribed for in the absence of Zmax.

    As someone who has had to take Levaquin in the past for some particularly nasty infections, I understand that nearly every drug has a side effect. As a person opposed to being nannied by people whose proficiency seems to be largely confined to spending other people’s money and doing so with an exhorbitant handling fee, I would prefer to make those decisions myself, rather than have them made for me. As a diabetic, I am already familiar to neuropathy, and having my own blood be toxic to me. Such effects can be managed, and mitigated, whereas a runaway infection causes a much greater problem.

    You wring your hands and scream “Big Pharma!!!!” the same way I’m guessing you scream “BuchCheneyHaliburton!!!11!!!” on other topics. And your proposal for bringing the problem to heel is not to allow the market to decide, in the form of expen$ive law$uit$ for malfea$or$, but to give government more authority it does not possess, and try to tell us that it won’t make goverment bigger. It might sound intelligent when you’re trying to get into the hippiegurl’s pants, but it simply isn’t true. I know excutives in BIG PHARMA…I’m related to one, and they don’t worship the dollar and say screw the consumer, no matter how much you want it to be true. The downside in costs, jury awards, and bad press simply aren’t worth it.

    As for empowering government to make more of our decisions for us, this usually has the worst impact on the dignity of humanity, as collectivism has the effect of reducing each man to a part in a machine, rather than an individual with limitless potential, and it enslaves that person to the service of the state. You’ve been pretty free with your recommendations, and your contempt for other people’s potential sources. You might try to read “How Should We Then Live?” and get your learning on. The last five chapters or so will be especially instructive if you can bring yourself to read that far. You might also try to get through “Lies Your Government Told You”, if you can accept as a premise the idea that government is the last entity you should entrust with the power you propose giving to it.

  136. You might try to read “How Should We Then Live?” and get your learning on.

    I have not read that book. I do recommend his son Frank Shaeffer’s book that outlines the danger in fundamentalist groups and theology. “Crazy For God”, I think is the title.

    I prefer more natural remedies to synthetic. I feel the same way with Monsanto and GMO’s. The pharmaceutical industry has done good, but overall I don’t think they have operated in the best interest of people. Additionally, I think the FDA, EPA, along with most other federal agencies have ALL been hjacked by corporates who are PROFIT oriented, rather than working in the best interests of the citizens. Money talks, people suffer for it.

  137. As someone who has been relatively disease-free and healthy my entire life, I am probably not the one to judge the effectiveness of pharmaceuticals. I haven’t had any of the penicillins for over 20 years. I quit cigarettes over 12 years ago. I eat mostly natural and organic food, locally grown, when I can get it. My ancestors for the most part have lived long and healthy lives. At 53, I have all my original teeth and only one filling that I got when I was 12. I’m not as physically in shape as I was when I was actually doing construction work over 14 years ago, but I regularly exercise, even if it is just hiking and walking.

    Not so for the average American today. Obesity is prevalent. Diabetes and other diseases are also found in greater numbers. Processed foods and high fructose corn syrups, unnatural environments, and lack of exercise today all take a toll on our overall health.

    These are products of what we have become as a nation. True health begins with a healthy lifestyle. We do not promote that in America today.

    I hope you will take the time to view the Psywar video. I just watched it again, since I posted the link. It is very apropos to our discussion here. Meanwhile, I’ll see if I can find the book you recommended either online or in the possession of some of my friends.

  138. BiC,

    I have not read that book. I do recommend his son Frank Shaeffer’s book that outlines the danger in fundamentalist groups and theology. “Crazy For God”, I think is the title.

    I think this tells us what we need to know about “Poolman”. Frank Schaffer summarily rejected the fatherly advice given by his godly Father, even going so far to call him worse than Rev. Jeremiah “Goddamn America” Wright.

    Ronnie Reagan Jr. personified.

    The prodigal son, only this one still mouths the platitudes of liberalism and neo-paganism under the guise of righteousness. 😐 Retching…

  139. Another common ploy “progressives” (cough cough) like to use as ammunition to argue against the “failings” of American health care is the infant mortality rate. It goes something like this: America has one of the highest infant mortality rates in the industrialized world, signifying the lack of health care for the poor. Their debate is completely disingenuous and a lie, but nonetheless demonstrating that supporters of Obamacare will stoop to any depths to defend the indefensible.

    What they fail to mention is the U.S. is one of the few nations on earth that measure both stillborns and any sign of infant life in their counts. Moreso, because of our modern miracles, the U.S. will go to much greater lengths to save preemies as early as 22 weeks, further skewing the real results.

    We actually have one of the best infant survival rates in the world, including publicly funded hospitals in spite of rampant alcoholism and drug use.

    Modern day liberalism is insidious and must be exposed. Hopefully, many of us do our small part here.

  140. I have not read that book.

    Quelle suprise! Non! Ce n’est pas! Vraiment?

    I prefer more natural remedies to synthetic.

    Except that for some things, there is no “natural option” for people. Again, do we use our knowledge to alieviate suffering, misery, and death, or do we confine people to those things based on your preferences? In the good old days, people had a much shorter lifespan and suffered from many maladies that are now eminently treatable. But government interference and unrestrained growth will not improve the quality of life for anyone but those in government.

    The pharmaceutical industry has done good, but overall I don’t think they have operated in the best interest of people.

    I wholeheartedly agree. Coming up with new treatments for disease and sickness certainly was never in the best interest of the people, and it is unfortunate that they brought so many tomorrows to people who would have never met them otherwise, just like continuing to develop new antibiotics to deal with drug-resistant strains of bacteria certainly has never been in the best interest of humanity. Of course, asking the government to do it instead will almost certainly mean longer development and dubious safety benefits, but I’m sure that their motives would be beyond question, right?

    Additionally, I think the FDA, EPA, along with most other federal agencies have ALL been hjacked by corporates who are PROFIT oriented, rather than working in the best interests of the citizens. Money talks, people suffer for it.

    I think you need to set the bong down, and slowly back away.
    The FDA’s testing standards need work, as they are cutting edge for the early twentieth century. If Big Pharma held their leash, then you would find a much shorter and less extensive testing regimen, that would bring drugs to market much, much sooner than what you see now, regardless of effect. And while I don’t doubt the intent underlying the current testing methodology, I am also aware that under its guidelines, it is unlikely that asperin would have ever been sold as an over-the-counter remedy, let alone by prescription.

    And the EPA is certainly in the back pocket of eeeeeevvvviiiiillll corporations. That’s why they have done so much good work on behalf of Big Tobacco with their hopelessly flawed second-hand smoke studies that have been used to ramrod idiotic legislation through in state after state making a lawful activity illegal in public places, without regard to the property rights of the owners of those venues, or their bullheaded insistance to classify and regulate carbon dioxide as a pollutant, despite the fact that it is necessary as part of the ecosystem’s cycle, and despite the fact that doing so would stifle current industries and strangle new ones in their crib. All these corporate interests saddling government for their own nefarious purposes…except that they’re not. (Unless they are the ones government approves of, in which case waivers are available.)

  141. I think this tells us what we need to know about “Poolman”. Frank Schaffer summarily rejected the fatherly advice given by his godly Father, even going so far to call him worse than Rev. Jeremiah “Goddamn America” Wright.

    Ronnie Reagan Jr. personified.

    Really? That’s interesting, considering the fact that he filmed the video version of the book with his father.

  142. That’s interesting, considering the fact that he filmed the video version of the book with his father.

    I actually found that online and just finished watching part 1 of 10. So far, I have only found a few very minor issues that I have problems with. The narrative overall appears sound.

  143. “I know some of you prefer not to have anything challenge your hardened and core beliefs, but a little sunshine is always good, IMO.”

    You don’t know shit. Some of us are students in finals week who don’t have time to spend 7 minutes watching your videos when the main points could be summarized and read in a brief moment.

  144. Yeah BiC,

    Unless old Frank has recently changed, he’s a frequent guest of MSLSD now – saw him not too long ago bad mouthing his own father – but the coward waited until Francis was gone first.

    Not sure why precipitated a switch to the evil side, but I have found it a common malady amongst preacher’s kids and famous religious figures. Screwtape indeed is hard at work.

    I’d like to think Frank will sometime return to his senses and get his act together – that too is a common theme as the legacy gets older.

  145. You don’t know shit. Some of us are students in finals week who don’t have time to spend 7 minutes watching your videos when the main points could be summarized and read in a brief moment.

    I know you spent more than seven minutes reading and commenting about how you don’t have time to spend seven minutes watching something that answers your question and may help raise your awareness above the level it seems to be at right now. Oh I know shit. I can even smell it. Ask Tex how it gets polished, too. LOL

  146. I’m sure you’ll love this, Tex:

    Good Lord! And I liked Liam too – one of my favorite actors in fact. I’m now down to Robert Duvall, Gary Sinese, Clint Eastwood, perhaps Morgan Freeman and Denzel, and Animal Mother whose first name is Adam – his last escapes me at this minute.

    How can Liam possibly come to that conclusion? First C.S. Lewis was perhaps the greatest Christian philosopher of the 20th century and stated emphatically there is only one way; second, on the advertisement for the movie, the lion specifically states, “And lo I am with you always, even until the end of the age.” Does the idiot think Mohammud or Buddha said that? 🙄

    Does touching Hollywood immediately affect 99.9% of people and make them stupid upon contact?

    They’re worse than professional athletes comparing themselves to soldiers in battle.

  147. Huck, I do empathize at this minute. One thing I have not missed about medical school (amongst many) – final’s week. What a nightmare… 😈 I never want to study for a test again. You think it’s easy to procrastinate now – wait until you’re really old.

    Good luck in your studies.

  148. I miss finals week.

    The cramming. The fear in the air. The dummies who thought that reading your notes and outlines would save them. The ritual of setting the watch in the right place on the desk, the pencils just so, the snap of the labels on the blue books, the fine meal, finer cigar, and several hours of getting comfortably numb after finishing the last exam, the waiting for several weeks to see the grades posted in the first floor hall.

    Enjoy it, Huck. Pretty soon, the victories mean only moving on to the next case.

  149. I was just looking at poolman’s “famous women” list. It reminded me of the time Rutherford found some dude online that wrote a book slamming Mother Teresa. Rutherford, his one source in hand, then ripped Mother Teresa to shreds. I swear that was the all time low here. I felt like chopping Rutherford’ ear off with a sword.

  150. I didn’t even think of Eve or Marie Antoinette. Marie Antoinette is kind of like Marylin Monroe. Kind of a hollow fame, but fame nonetheless.

  151. BiC…Ever hear of Cooley Law School here in Michigan? The school that lets anyone in then notoriously weeds them out. They seem to get dissed by all grads from other law schools, but I like the concept.

    i took the LSAT and utterly failed one section. It was those weird logical word games. I’ve since found out there is a trick to them.

    Anyways, I did good enough to supposedly get a 75% scholarship there, all though it seemed dubious.

    I was half way through the admission process, when they wanted information on my non- judicial punishment in the service. I got busted on like 7 charges…locked up for 45 days….reduction in rank…fined…had to dig fox holes for two extra hours day.( See Rutherford….all kinds of unconstitutional shit goes down in the military…just the way it has to be)

    I sound like a jail bird when I say this. But I swear I was innocent on every single charge. And I mean completely innocent. I refused to snitch though…..so maybe that counts as obstruction of justice….one of my charges.

    Anyways…i did not feel like disclosing all that stuff. so I said screw it.

  152. BiC…Ever hear of Cooley Law School here in Michigan? The school that lets anyone in then notoriously weeds them out. They seem to get dissed by all grads from other law schools, but I like the concept.

    Yes. I got my J.D. from there in 2001. Iredell Class.
    Yes, the weeding system is very real, and very brutal to people who are used to the grade inflation practiced at most institutions of higher indoctrinations. I had a few freinds who couldn’t reconcile themselves to the fact that they really weren’t A students, so they transferred out to other schools, like DCL at the cow college across town. I also had a few friends who transferred to other schools closer to home, like Emory in the Southeast, where they found their transcripts raised by a whole grade for transfer purposes because of the grading system.
    In my Criminal Proceedure class, three of us actually earned A’s, and the professor took a lot of criticism from the administration for it…until they reviewed the blue books.

    i took the LSAT and utterly failed one section. It was those weird logical word games. I’ve since found out there is a trick to them.

    Anyways, I did good enough to supposedly get a 75% scholarship there, all though it seemed dubious.

    I was half way through the admission process, when they wanted information on my non- judicial punishment in the service. I got busted on like 7 charges…locked up for 45 days….reduction in rank…fined…had to dig fox holes for two extra hours day.( See Rutherford….all kinds of unconstitutional shit goes down in the military…just the way it has to be)

    I sound like a jail bird when I say this. But I swear I was innocent on every single charge. And I mean completely innocent. I refused to snitch though…..so maybe that counts as obstruction of justice….one of my charges.

    Anyways…i did not feel like disclosing all that stuff. so I said screw it.

  153. i took the LSAT and utterly failed one section. It was those weird logical word games. I’ve since found out there is a trick to them.

    Anyways, I did good enough to supposedly get a 75% scholarship there, all though it seemed dubious.

    You should have taken it. Its for real.

    I was half way through the admission process, when they wanted information on my non- judicial punishment in the service. I got busted on like 7 charges…locked up for 45 days….reduction in rank…fined…had to dig fox holes for two extra hours day.( See Rutherford….all kinds of unconstitutional shit goes down in the military…just the way it has to be)

    I sound like a jail bird when I say this. But I swear I was innocent on every single charge. And I mean completely innocent. I refused to snitch though…..so maybe that counts as obstruction of justice….one of my charges.

    C’mon Rabbit. I had to disclose my Minor In Possession in Saginaw. They actually laughed about it. If they were not crimes of moral turpitude, full disclosure would have been the end of it, hoss.

    Shoulda done it. 75% off tuition there is cheap at the price.

  154. You angels are going to find this hard to believe, but after reading this, I had to laugh out loud:

    I was half way through the admission process, when they wanted information on my non- judicial punishment in the service. I got busted on like 7 charges…locked up for 45 days….reduction in rank…fined…had to dig fox holes for two extra hours day.( See Rutherford….all kinds of unconstitutional shit goes down in the military…just the way it has to be)

    Sounds like you had a good start on being a politician. Can you believe I’m clean as a whistle? Not even a traffic ticket in 25 years – damn I have lived a dull life.

    My new goal is to get my face plastered on one of those “smoking gun” mug shots. I want to be famous! 🙂

  155. I don’t really care about this homo thing.. Seriously, it only brings it to light for the special interest group. I was a fan of the Village People.. YMCA.. i love that song.. use to clean house with it.. Today I clean house to this:

  156. “I know you spent more than seven minutes reading and commenting about how you don’t have time to spend seven minutes watching something that answers your question…”

    Give me a break…

    I can read through this entire collection of comments in less than 7 minutes. Snarking your lame-ass takes but a few seconds.

  157. Ater reading the link you provided, BiW, It does looks like the FDA is finally starting to do it’s job! I’ll give credit to the administration on this one. These people had been through the state and several failed inspections before any action was taken. They refused to recall their cheeses as requested by the FDA. Nine other creameries had done voluntary recalls of their own after samonella was discovered. I love the “God and guns line”. LOL. “Gummit takin’ away my rights.” Nope, not this time.

    http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2010/10/how-estrella-family-creamery-raid-came-down/

    Here’s an update:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/20/business/20artisan.html

    “When you’ve got people that make good cheese, you want them to be successful,” said Claudia Coles, the food safety program manager for the Washington State Department of Agriculture. “But our first premise is, we don’t want people marketing an unsafe product.”

    William Marler, a Seattle food safety lawyer, said it was clear that regulators tried to work with Ms. Estrella and that he was puzzled by the attitude that Ms. Estrella’s supporters appear to have toward the F.D.A. “I just don’t know how they make the leap from the government trying to do the right thing for public health to ‘they’re food Nazis in the pocket of big agribusiness.’ ”

    They even have a “Save our Creamery” website and a facebook page. You could donate to help them stay afloat while they can’t sell all there cheese.

    http://estrellacheese.wordpress.com/

  158. Poolman,

    The tainted cheese all came from the same aging cave. No batches aged in that cave were sold. No other product tested positive. The creamery was taking steps to deal with the problem and testing the product. The nature of the product (being aged and all) means that if the first attempt doesn’t work, you won’t know for several months.

    There was no need to recall all product. The other cheese was not tainted. There was no problem with it. A request is just that: a request. A request, followed by compulsion is not a request. If the FDA had the authority to do it, there would be no need to obtain a court order.

    In the meantime, a livelihood and a family business was destroyed because a hyperaggressive bureaucrat had to save the consumer from untainted cheese…consumers who also partook of a product that was already “risky” as it was made with unpasturized milk product! (gasp!)

    Now if they wanted to work with the creamery to solve the problem, that woud be acceptable. If they wanted to monitor the situation, and confirm that the product sold was not tainted, that would also be acceptable. But bringing the full force of the state against a businessperson who refused an excessive (and therefore) unreasonable request, did not make anyone any safer, but it does make unaccountable functionaries emboldened.

    Now ask yourself a question: “If the government can’t tell you that you can’t put a dick in your mouth, why can it tell you that you cannot put unpasturized cheese in it?”

  159. Give me a break…

    I can read through this entire collection of comments in less than 7 minutes. Snarking your lame-ass takes but a few seconds.

    Hucking Fypocrites, a few seconds? Funny guy. I’d say you already got more time in it than that, but then I’m slow on the keyboard and anytime I get on this damn machine, the hours dissolve away. But okay for your short attention span and your valuable time, I’ll accomodate you, here’s the cliff’s notes version…

    Pre 1958 Iraq is ruled by pro British monarchy.

    Overthrown in 58 and then ruled by Quassim who turned to USSR for financial and armament support. US didn’t like that so we sponsored Ba’ath Party (secular party as opposed to religious) and CIA backed Sadaam to assassinate Quassim. His attempt failed, so we protected Sadaam, sending him first to Lebanon, then Egypt.

    In 63 we support another coup that put the Ba’ath Party in power. Quassim and others were executed. Sadaam took over the presidency after an aging Al-Bakr stepped down in 68, assassinating a few dissidents.

    In 79 when Iran had its Islamic revolution, Sadaam, fearing religious upheaval, invaded Iran oil rich territory in 80. We back him with intelligence and arms. Britain sells him a missle system. Rumsfeld visits in 84. We’re all buddy-buddy. We sell him helicopters for $200M. We give him biological weapons traced to Maryland and he gases Kurds in Halabja in March 88. A month later Britain gives him a huge line of credit. In August 88, a ceasefire called in Iran/Iraq war .

    All was well until 90 when Iraq decides to invade Kuwait over oil slant drilling accusations and debate resulting from money Kuwait lent Iraq during war with Iran. We led him to think we wouldn’t harm him if he wanted to fight Kuwait. It was false security as we were baiting him to attack. Then we and the rest of the “world” imposed sanctions and the first Gulf war began. We made him an enemy from 90 until he was sentenced to death, a convenient 2 days before elections in November 06.

    The rest, I’m sure you can probably recall.

    BTW, I was going to link your “Give me a break…” to Van Halen’s “Unchained” video, but it would have been 5 more minutes that I knew you wouldn’t want to waste. But that David Lee Roth line “Hey, hey, hey…one break comin’ up” would have been the perfect segway. Oh well. I listened to myself. Good luck with your tests. I hope you ace them. I’m grateful I don’t have any to deal with.

  160. BiW, yeah it’s too bad they got shut down. I don’t know how long until they can get back up and running. They were first cited in February by the state and failed consistently, escalating to federal level before they were shut down in October, per the reports.

    I know little about cheese except from taste, so I don’t know if that was enough of a time table to remedy their situation. I guess if we let BP slide on regs we could have done it for these folks. Of course that was EPA and not FDA. Could have been a bit heavy-handed, I suppose.

    Maybe we’ll reach a fair balance between turning our back or taking a bribe and looking at it through a magnifying glass. I know with my own dealings with state inspectors and city inspectors, the results are 99 percent of the time in the hands of the individual inspector to render verdicts. In this cheese scenerio, it appears that MANY inspectors, state AND federal were in agreement. Too bad for these guys. I hope they survive.

  161. All was well until 90 when Iraq decides to invade Kuwait over oil slant drilling accusations and debate resulting from money Kuwait lent Iraq during war with Iran. We led him to think we wouldn’t harm him if he wanted to fight Kuwait. It was false security as we were baiting him to attack.

    Building 7 was a controlled implosion… 🙄 Steel doesn’t bend when super heated. Fidel Castro killed John Kennedy.

    I’ve met a few souls on this board I thought I had strange opinions. But not until tonight had a debated with a Troofer on the R.L. Blog.

    Where do you goose steppers dig this shit up?

  162. I know with my own dealings with state inspectors and city inspectors, the results are 99 percent of the time in the hands of the individual inspector to render verdicts. In this cheese scenerio, it appears that MANY inspectors, state AND federal were in agreement. Too bad for these guys. I hope they survive.

    But were they in agreement that the business owner wasn’t doing it their way/ wasn’t stroking their egos/ wasn’t groveling and deferring to their authority enough, or that the untainted product posed a threat.

    Government on every level is obsessed with amassing power and control and punishing those impudent enough to assert their own sovereignty and authority over their own affairs, and people like you want to keep trusting government when it repeatedly demonstrates that it eagerly abuses the power we mistakenly give it, and the usurps that which we do not.
    Just ask Paul Mackay.

    http://threesurethingsoflife.wordpress.com/2010/12/02/meet-the-parents/

  163. Most famous woman in history … that is a tough question as no one immediately popped into my head.

    My vote, an odd one I admit, would be for Helen Keller just based on the fact that by the age of 12 or 13 I think every American finds out who she was. Very interesting question Tex.

    If you limit me to pre-modern age, I’d say maybe Queen Elizabeth I or maybe Joan of Arc. Tough tough call.

    P.S. I haven’t read through the thread yet so if I echoed someone else’s opinion, it was sheer coincidence.

  164. Again I haven’t gotten through the entire thread but I just read Rabbit’s answer and Tex’s gung ho.

    Tex I hope it wasn’t a loaded question. When I think of a famous woman, I am biased toward a woman who did something of some merit. With all due respect, Mary gave birth to a baby and with the exception of the virgin nature of it (I can’t believe I just typed that), it was not remarkable. It’s like saying George Washington’s mother was the most famous woman in the world.

    Sorry … but I guess among the religious, Mary is the obvious answer. I did think of it, but discarded it for the reasons already stated.

  165. Then again …. Rabbit wasn’t specific. Perhaps he meant:

    Mary Magdalene
    Mary, Queen of Scots
    Mary Travers (of Peter, Paul and Mary)
    Mary Tyler Moore

    The list goes on and on. Rabbit forgive me if I misinterpreted you. 😉

  166. I once read an article about guys like poolman. Conspiracy theorists gain a certain feeling of security with their “stories”. They would rather have this all powerful government be responsible for traumatic events rather then completely rogue and unpredictable forces such as Saddam or Al Queda. The unknown is too scary of a thought.

    They also empower themselves with their “stories”. That way, they can use words like MANipulate and sheeple.

    That being said, I feel as wacked out as poolman. My gut tells me the bail out and world economy is a conspiracy. The difference is I don’t just fill in the details with unsubstantiated poop. I admit my ignorance. Why the fuck would America want Iraq to invade Kuwait?

  167. By the way, the latest wiki leak dump shows the world how I thought it really was. Nothing surprised me. Its a nasty, dangerous globe.

  168. Letseee… you want the government in charge of providing health care for everyone.

    OMG BiW you are still thick after all these years (apologies to Paul Simon). No one is asking government to provide health care. Supplementing payment and providing are two different things. You pull that rhetorical sleight of hand all the time and it’s getting very old.

  169. OMG BiW you are still thick after all these years (apologies to Paul Simon). No one is asking government to provide health care. Supplementing payment and providing are two different things. You pull that rhetorical sleight of hand all the time and it’s getting very old.

    When you’re the only one paying, you set the price, when you set the price, you control the transaction. It isn’t an accident that Bwarney Fwanks and others want single payer, and it isn’t out of concern for the poor, poor, taxpayers.

    Grow up, R.

  170. I love how when a Christian’s son sees the loony in his father’s belief system, Tex cries foul but when Madalyn Murray O’Hair’s child becomes born again, Tex jumps up and down with joy.

    I guess respect for one’s parents is only a requirement of Tex based on conditions. 😉

  171. It reminded me of the time Rutherford found some dude online that wrote a book slamming Mother Teresa.

    LOL … Rabbit the “dude” was Christopher Hitchens and he is (I hate to break it to you) quite famous in some parts.

    Hitchens is a mean, acerbic assh*le who can turn a phrase with the best of them and considers organized religion a complete sham. The very fact that he had the cojones to examine Mother Theresa as a woman who might be flawed, who might have ego, was quite interesting to me. Honestly, I haven’t read his book on Mother Theresa, but back in the day, I did just want to throw his general criticism on the table and of course, Rabbit, you went batsh*t crazy, seemingly forgetting that even if we accept the saintliness of Mary (mother of Jesus), Theresa was NOT Mary.

    I’ll give you this much credit, you don’t forget a thing. 😉

  172. I love all the guys calling Poolman a conspiracy theorist … this from the same crew that believed ACORN was going to destroy democracy as we know it.

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!! 😆

  173. When you’re the only one paying, you set the price, when you set the price, you control the transaction. It isn’t an accident that Bwarney Fwanks and others want single payer, and it isn’t out of concern for the poor, poor, taxpayers.

    Like I said, and you guys call poolman a conspiracy theorist.

    Poolman hit the nail right on the head. The answer was Medicare for all. Instead we’ve got this health care clusterf*ck. It’s a damn shame.

  174. Poolman hit the nail right on the head. The answer was Medicare for all. Instead we’ve got this health care clusterf*ck. It’s a damn shame.

    poolman couldn’t find a clue if it was nailed to the back of his hand.

    In one breath advocates “Medicare for all” and in the next evokes a fantasy world where it “would be done right” to prevent it from growing government.

    Uhhh, do either of you have any clue how much Medicare grew government?

    Don’t bother with the answer. It was a rhetorical question. If you did know, I wouldn’t have had to ask.

  175. Where do you goose steppers dig this shit up?

    Goose steppers, eh? Your ideas are more fascist in flavor, my friend. I’ve been researching this “shit” for more than 2 years. FOIA makes it available now. You really shouldn’t backburner your brain, Tex. It isn’t healthy and you’ll be clueless when you might need it most.

    Why the fuck would America want Iraq to invade Kuwait?

    We like bringing out our big guns and showing the world how big our dongs are. We make bullets and bombs and we like playing war. It’s taught early in our society. It’s a testosterone thingie. War is just rich people wagging their dicks. I don’t know why we do half of what we do. As I believer I have to credit it to……SATAN!

    Kuwait was baited.

  176. poolman couldn’t find a clue if it was nailed to the back of his hand.

    No, it’s your prophetess that writes shit on her hand. I use my God-given brain and rely on the guidance of the Holy Spirit. I also don’t just go to any one source for my information. You have been drinking at Murdock’s well for quite some time. Or is that Moloch’s? I can never seem to differentiate.

  177. I knew once you were forced to articulate your own argument its flaws would manifest themselves.

    “Most Iraqis claim that they were better off under Sadaam, who BTW, WE put in power to begin with.”

    “…In 63 we support another coup that put the Ba’ath Party in power… Sadaam took over the presidency after an aging Al-Bakr stepped down in 68.”

    Now unless you have something that says we helped Saddam take over in 1968, you just tore apart your own argument.

    Thanks for playing.

  178. Sorry, dates are wrong. He was actually was deputy, then VP and not official president until 79, but he was OUR guy.

    per wikipedia,

    “Army officers with ties to the Ba’ath Party overthrew Qassim in a coup in 1963. Ba’athist leaders were appointed to the cabinet and Abdul Salam Arif became president. Arif dismissed and arrested the Ba’athist leaders later that year. Saddam returned to Iraq, but was imprisoned in 1964. Just prior to his imprisonment and until 1968, Saddam held the position of Ba’ath party secretary. He escaped from prison in 1967 and quickly became a leading member of the party. In 1968, Saddam participated in a bloodless coup led by Ahmad Hassan al-Bakr that overthrew Abdul Rahman Arif. Al-Bakr was named president and Saddam was named his deputy, and deputy chairman of the Baathist Revolutionary Command Council. Although Saddam was al-Bakr’s deputy, he was a strong behind-the-scenes party politician. Al-Bakr was the older and more prestigious of the two, but by 1969 Saddam Hussein clearly had become the moving force behind the party.”

    and…

    Source: Andrew and Patrick Cockburn,
    excerpt from Out of the Ashes, The Resurrection of Saddam Hussein, 2000.
    Cited by Tim Buckley

    “Another very good example of a CIA-organized “regime change” was a coup in 1963 that employed political assassination, mass imprisonment, torture and murder. This was the military coup that first brought Saddam Hussein’s beloved Ba’ath Party to power in Iraq. At the time, Richard Helms was Director for Plans at the CIA. That is the top CIA position responsible for covert actions, like organizing coups. Helms served in that capacity until 1966, when he was made Director.

    “In 1959, there was a failed assassination attempt on Qasim. The failed assassin was none other than a young Saddam Hussein. In 1963, a CIA-organized coup did successfully assassinate Qasim and Saddam’s Ba’ath Party came to power for the first time. Saddam returned from exile in Egypt and took up the key post as head of Iraq’s secret service. The CIA then provided the new pliant, Iraqi regime with the names of thousands of communists, and other leftist activists and organizers. Thousands of these supporters of Qasim and his policies were soon dead in a rampage of mass murder carried out by the CIA’s close friends in Iraq.”

    from: http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html

    How many seconds we got now?

  179. Okay, everyone gets a short personal history. Just so you know my POV, for what it’s worth.

    I grew up as an army brat. Raised Catholic and even an altarboy – quit religion at 14. Parents ALWAYS voted republican, mom still does. Dems were wimps and communist sympathizers and, of course, anti-military. Any other group were complete loons. That went unquestioned. If you protested war, you were unAmerican. Period. I was a registered and die-hard republican from when I voted for Ford in my first election in 76.

    When the church started getting into politics with Falwell and Focus on the Family, when Pat Robinson was presidential and the whole TBN bunch were ecclesiastical about how great being American, rich, and righteous was, I was happily swimming with the flow.

    By then I was a born-again believer and living in Texas. Even though I attended in a “non denominational” church, it was very much MANipulative. I mean, the Holy Spirit was there. There were many true Christians. You know the ones, all about His work, spreading love and compassion. No gossip or condemnation. Would give you anything if they had it to give. Trying to serve.

    I volunteered in the childrens’ ministry. Ran spotlight and help set up sets for skits we’d do as a congregation. We had strong leaders and good Bible-based preaching. It was a charismatic group, for the most part. They use to tell us whom we should vote for. Essentially it was an abortion vote. That was basically the decider.

    Occasionally I protested abortion at Operation Rescue rallies. That was always fun. Showing pictures of mangled babies.
    We caught all kinds of hate. Spit on and cursed at. Death threats. Horns and screamers. Ugly, ugly reactions, yeah, we were spreading the love.

    Anyway, that is basically where I parked my brain every night at bedtime. There it was every morning, same spot.

    Meanwhile, I relocated to Arizona in 94. I had really got tired of organized religion, so we stayed away from churches for a while. Work was busy and Phoenix was way more fast-paced than Lubbock. I was selling pools in the hottest market on the planet. Vegas was kicking butt too. Money, money, money! All pouring in to our economy. Lots of foreign investments, too.

    Then 9-11 happened and we all got patriotic and shopped till we dropped. I started having difficulty with what was happening with construction materials being shipped out of country. China was supposedly buying all our steel and concrete. Shortages and costs increases were occurring everywhere. I was losing faith in my government’s integrity. I was getting lied to by the news and the politicians. I was able to pick up on specific falsehoods. Then we invaded Iraq. Then the Pat Tillman incident, which was real close to home, just started eating at me. I had changed my voting status to independent and opposed Bush in 2004.

    In 2005, I started my own business, things were on the rise. Home values doubled in 4 years from 03 to 07. Then the market fell. The bank money dried up. No more loans. Negative equity everywhere. Half finished homes scattered through acres of yesterday’s farms and sand dunes. Since then, when I was no longer working most of my waking hours, I began to research all kinds of things. I channeled my workaholic nature into reading all I can get my hands on. I’m still doing that. I learn all the time. Knowledge is power.

    So try parking your brain in a different spot every night, otherwise you are just making deeper ruts that will be harder to avoid in the future. We were not created for stagnation. Learn something from the Sea of Galilee and the Dead Sea. Though they are both fed by the same Jordan River, the first is healthy and teaming with life. Not so, the latter. The only difference is that the first has an outlet. We are vessels, meant for living water to flow in AND out of.

    Good night.

  180. Knowledge is only power Poolman only when based in truth. Otherwise, it varies from a ruse to a lie, both of which your obviously immersed in. It’s like your use of Alan Grayson as source – your argument is only as good as the source of your information. Your sources suck, therefore your reasoning sucks, leading to your decisions which suck.

    Let me demonstrate with the question I asked yesterday…take Rutherford dissing the mother of Jesus as ‘no big deal.’ A profoundly stupid statement, but Rutherford is a weak man and hostile to religion. It was expected.

    But as Rutherford’s innuendo suggests, it was a very big deal – history changing in fact. Even Rutherford can’t deny the power of the story, even if he denies its truth.

    And the reason I asked that question is to refute Rutherford’s, Flake’s and Graychin’s accusations that Christianity based on lies and misogynistic in nature.

    To point to the weakness of their accusations concerning the latter, the most revered, most famous, most beloved woman who ever lived is also the mother of Jesus Christ.

    There is no other “religion” or humanist story that has or will ever do as much to raise motherhood to its rightful place.

  181. Well, this raises an interesting question as how can Mary raise motherhood to some higher standard when she was not in the classical sense a mother in the first place. Part of the beauty of motherhood (ideally) is the consummation of a deep love with a human partner resulting in a pregnancy. Since Jesus, if we believe the story, was born of a supernatural father, he is by human standards a bastard. What you call the ultimate example of motherhood, I can only call in the most vulgar terms possible, a freak event of nature.

    But my closest pagan friend and I had a conversation this morning where she reminded me that with current medical technology, even a virgin birth is no longer unusual. Artificial insemination allows any woman to bear a child.

    I then took it a step further. If the Egyptians built the pyramids without any of the modern technology we now possess, could it not be remotely possible that Mary was artificially inseminated using some primitive method? Mmmm, interesting way to explain the “virgin” birth.

  182. Poolman, I appreciate the biographical background. If you don’t mind I’d like to understand how you reconcile your faith with science. It’s the number one question I have of most religious people.

    To give you a quick primer on me (others who know this already can skip ahead). My grandmother was an atheist in practice though not in declaration. She didn’t wear it on her sleeve. She simply did not believe in God. When my Grandfather lost his arm in an industrial accident, my Mom asked my Grandmother if she prayed for him or was even tempted to. Her response, without blinking an eye, was that there was no one to pray to.

    My mother was voraciously curious about religion and read about many of them. She came to the same conclusions as my Grandmother but with a bit more informed opinion.

    I also do not call myself an atheist. I find it arrogant. I don’t know how this world came into being. I can’t rule out a supernatural force that our science is ill equipped to understand. However, I do not believe in a God’s intervention in daily life. I do not believe in prayer. Oddly, I do believe in luck … so maybe that’s my substitution for God …. but I think all you can do is work against bad luck and take advantage of good luck and I do believe hard effort trumps luck any day of the week.

    I think the good/evil balance sheet for organized religion (all of them) is yet to be completed. I do not doubt nor deny much good that has come from organized religion, whether it be some of our higher learning institutions (Harvard, Yale, etc.) or all the charity work that is done. However, I see in stark contrast all the evil that has been done. People literally killing each other over a belief that a higher power was on their side. I have no tolerance for such foolishness and am forever baffled by how so called devout people can tolerate it.

    In any case, that’s my faith story in a nutshell, Thanks for listening …. and sorry for boring the rest of you who already know this stuff about me.

  183. You really don’t get it Rutherford. Just when I think you can’t get more confused, you surprise even me and raise the ante.

    You keep misidentifying the father of the child, focusing instead of how Mary remained a virgin because you continue to deny the divinity of Christ.

    Mary experienced childbirth like every other woman of antiquity; therefore she would have had the same experiences as any young mother – birth pains included. Jesus Christ was fully human. He would have been a normal infant and Mary probably the naive 16 year old mother who learned like the rest of women with a first born. God born into poverty, the struggles of a young couple, God making nothing easy but provided just the same.

    Jesus with skinned knees, dirty diapers, same physical limitations as any small child. And yet it was the lower echelon of the world who were brought the message of the miracle from angels. Poor shepherds in their fields, locals from a small village, witnessed the birth in a filthy cave. Then to signify Christ was for all of man, wise men from distant lands brought meaningful gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh signifying royalty, homage and death.

    The poor child who became a poor carpenter from poor people and changed the world. That is the true beauty and biggest mystery of the story of Christmas.

  184. Mary experienced childbirth like every other woman of antiquity

    But Tex, clearly she did not since every other woman of antiquity preceded her pregnancy with sexual intercourse (if you discard my admittedly outlandish theory from the prior comment).

    Where you and Poolman and I part ways (in this way poolman is very much your brother and you should appreciate it), is that I don’t believe any man on this planet ever was flawless. If sex is a sin (which I say it is NOT) there has never been anyone on this planet not born of sin.

    Did it ever occur to you why the virgin birth story is necessary? Why could Jesus not have been born of copulation between Joseph and Mary and then endowed with the spirit of the lord post-partum? The reason is simple. Shame about sex is as old as the ages. For Christ to have been born of sex not only diminishes his birth in the eyes of the repressed but it would also potentially cast sex in a more positive light than religious folks would like . Christ must be born of a virgin in order to preserve sex’s place as that dirty thing no one talks about or does (despite the existence of over a billion people on the globe who all got here the same way,)

    While I question the historical accuracy of Christ’s life, I am willing to accept the notion that he was the Martin Luther King Jr. of his day. A man of peace who preached love and like almost every other man who has done so, paid for it with his life. His life is a testament to courage and sadly a commentary on man’s evil nature in that we kill anyone who threatens the power structure.

  185. MLK worshiped the man you discount, as King was first and foremost a Baptist preacher, teaching that salvation is obtained through Christ – not Martin Luther King. In fact, I feel quite sure MLK would have called you a foolish man like I do, though you never give consideration to that fact when you hail King’s greatness.

    Did it ever occur to you why the virgin birth story is necessary? Why could Jesus not have been born of copulation between Joseph and Mary and then endowed with the spirit of the lord post-partum? The reason is simple. Shame about sex is as old as the ages. For Christ to have been born of sex not only diminishes his birth in the eyes of the repressed but it would also potentially cast sex in a more positive light than religious folks would like . Christ must be born of a virgin in order to preserve sex’s place as that dirty thing no one talks about or does (despite the existence of over a billion people on the globe who all got here the same way,)

    And your father worried about you listening to James Brown? Sex is dirty and shameful? Ever read Song of Solomon?

    It was necessary and required a virgin, because there could be no doubt the Heavenly Father the “biological” Father. I went through all of this in depth last year with Graychin Rafterman in depth – no need to rehash it.

    If Joseph was the father, there would be nothing miraculous about the birth either.

    Actually, I’ve found your incurious nature and flippancy to faith so boring and distasteful, I decided to shake the dust long ago. This is not for your benefit, but anyone else that might read it without comment.

  186. How did you make the logical leap from my calling Jesus the MLK of his day to saying that MLK did not worship Jesus? Of course I know MLK worshiped Jesus. Of course I know he would have wanted to school me in religion had he known me.

    But you make a mistake when you overestimate my reverence for MLK. I would have preferred that MLK spend less energy on faith in Jesus and more energy on faith in his wife. While I will never forgive that transvestite bastard, J. Edgar Hoover for eavesdropping on Martin, the bottom line is the dude got caught with his pants down.

    Seems a major problem with famous preachers …. can’t seem to keep their dick in their pants.

  187. Interesting topic and one I enjoy debating. I’m going to try to get some work done today, though my desire is to stay here and debate. So, sorry for this hit and run. But I’ll be back later, God willing, of course.

    The reason Jesus was “implanted” in the womb of Mary, and she was like 12 or 13 btw, was so that the line of sin that is imbedded in our genetics was not passed into the flesh that was Jesus. He was a pure flesh, like Adam was to begin with. The generational sin and tainted blood that we inherit was not included in His DNA.

    Jesus was the Word made Flesh. God in the natural realm. To experience life as a mortal would, with all the mess and pain that humans deal with, along with the urges and emotions. He came down to our level to bring us up to His.

    The deed to this world was signed over to evil as soon as Eve and Adam decided they would turn from God and be their own gods. Though we, in essence, are gods, it was the position they took that gave the deceiver his power over the entire planet.

    Jesus came to take the deed back. He was successful, but it is His body of believers that have the authority to reclaim these areas throughout the earth. That is what we are supposed to be doing, although many have been side-tracked and the spirit of darkness has blinded many.

    God is soooo huge, yet so intricate. He holds all things together by the power of His Word. Thats the motion and force and sound in ALL things. Planets to rocks.

    Google “laminin”, when you have time. Awesome.

    “He is before all things and in Him all things hold together.” (Colossians 1:17)

    Science will reveal God to us. They are not conflicting. Check this short message out:

    How BIG is God!

  188. Poolman, you need to learn the difference between supporting somebody when they are in power and putting someone in power.

    You asserted that we put Saddam in power. That is false, and your own source has said as much. We helped put the Baath party in power. Saddam did his own dirty work from there.

    You can try your revisionist history someplace else. Aint nobody here buyin’.

  189. Poolman, thanks for the thoughtful response and I will watch your video later. BTW, I will give Tex credit that he has been equally thoughtful in trying to help me understand faith. I give him a very hard time but I know he holds these beliefs in his heart and truly believes faith will enhance my life. I DO appreciate that.

    Still, I am left incredibly puzzled how someone (you) who is obviously willing to look behind the veil of what your government tells you, can buy the religious “story” lock stock and barrel despite its incredible stretch of imagination. I guess I may never understand that but I thank you again for trying to express it.

  190. Right now, if I were to nominate any of our denizens THE MAN it would be Gorilla who represents the military/industrial complex and BiW who probably makes out quite nicely in his law practice.” – R

    Who’s the Man? I’m the Man. Who’s the Man? I’m the Man.

    Wow, not quite sure how I should take that R.

    I’m just getting back on my feet- Friday I was death warmed over- so I’ve missed most of the conversation. But that said, I went back to the beginning of Poolman’s entry and have tried to catch up from there… chaos…

    Poolman sounds like one with piss poor timing. Decided to go solo at the wrong time umbre, which certainly sucks. I guess I can understand your negative view of the banks, I mean, your business is based on Daddy Bank providing the Smith’s with some cash so they can keep up with the Jone’s. Of course, I’m sure you didn’t say shit to anyone about the eeeevvviiiillllllll banks when they, at legal prodding from the likes of Barney Franks and Chris Dodd, were extending 1st and 2nd mortgages to folks who had zero qualification for the loan in the first place.

    Really?

    I might have missed it, but it sounds like you’re an Obama supporter. I find that amusing, especially after your little tirade about “marketing”. Really, can you think of a bigger bill of goods being sold than the 2008 Presidential race?

  191. Wow, not quite sure how I should take that R.

    Well, Rabbit strangely called poolman THE MAN. Now to me, the MAN is represented either by money, power (especially military might) or both. So, as our resident member of the military/industrial complex, you were nominated by me. 🙂

    Glad you’re back on your feet. Stomach flu? I hear that’s going around.

  192. Poolman, I watched your video and it raises more troubles than it answers. The image in the black hole taken by Hubbell … was that supposed to be a cross? And if so, why would the image that represents Christ’s crucifixion on Earth be millions of light years away where it is totally out of context and meaningless? It’s like people who see Christ’s face on a tree trunk or a potato chip.

    Later in the video Giglio says “God just breathes out stars. It’s crazy to think about it”. All I can say is …. yes it is. Why is God anthropomorphic in the first place? God breathes? God has lungs? The stars came out of God’s mouth like spitballs?

    You see this is probably more frightening to me than anything else. An audience of folks who don’t have the ultimate answers to the universe (NONE of us do) being lulled into this simplistic explanation that the all powerful God created EVERYTHING by doing nothing. Notice, Giglio says God created the Universe without lifting a finger. He did nothing, yet He did everything. It truly makes no sense. And maybe that’s the charm of it, it answers a seemingly nonsensical question (or unanswerable question) with nonsense. And that’s enough to satisfy. Giglio uses his numbers and scientific knowledge to come to the following end-game: I don’t have an answer so with the help of the Bible, I’m making sh*t up.

    From the little I’ve heard from you poolman, I think we share a lot of the same political leanings but on the religious front, you truly befuddle me.

  193. Poolman, you need to learn the difference between supporting somebody when they are in power and putting someone in power.

    Back in to do another hit and soon to run. I see I got a snarky response from the Huckster. Are we not the CIA? I’m confused now, or you’ll have to explain who the represent. Don’t tell me Israel, cause then we’ll get off on a whole ‘nuther tangent.

    Maybe I”ll do the long math for you. Here it will just be a few more seconds of your time. No videos, I promise.

    U.S. forces in Baghdad might now be searching high and low for Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein, but in the past Saddam was seen by U.S. intelligence services as a bulwark of anti-communism and they used him as their instrument for more than 40 years, according to former U.S. intelligence diplomats and intelligence officials.

    Connect the dots is my favorite game!!! 😀

  194. Rutherford,

    I will say this. I’ve never jumped on the bandwagon of trying to show a specific sign or signs on earth or in the first heaven trying to demonstrate God’s grand design. I don’t think man capable of doing justice, whether it be blackholes or the protein cross shaped laminin of the basal lamina. It may make for delightful debate, but cheapens the message IMHO. It is simply impossible to praise God with something worthy, but I do try because He asks me to.

    If one can’t see the design of God in our own DNA, I don’t know what more proof would be required from nature. I would think as a professional technical engineer you would see that more easily than you do – a platter of data, bits and bytes if you will read in a non contiguous fashion but millions of times more complicated that the most sophisticated artificial intelligence.

    And being we’ve recently discovered there are more than 125 trillion “switches” (synapses) in one human brain, more than there our stars in our entire universe, it only demonstrates further the wonderful complexity of the human mind.

    Because to me, life itself is a miracle and I don’t believe a blade of grass moves without its Creator’s permission.

    I think it is incredibly silly, even rebellious, to look at the sophistication and delicate balance of our universe and not recognize that where there is a creation, there is a creator.

    You believe an impersonal maker, perhaps a universe even by accident. I believe that makes you sound unsophisticated and naive. I believe a very personal God, I see his hand move daily in my own life, and One that allows me to breathe his oxygen for free and asks nothing in return.

    Must sound very hokey to you.

    But I am as sure of it as I am of anything. And that is the honest truth.

  195. Rutherford,

    I appreciate that you are willing to watch objectively and question, with a desire to learn. So many are digging the ruts in their neural pathways that they cannot “see” anything new, and sometimes the learning stops. I always check and read links and videos of those whom I believe truly are trying to educate and enlighten. So far I have read all those provided here, even the metal video by Say What?. Now those folks in that audience there are some SERIOUS worshippers, for sure. I used to work rock shows and that was some MAJOR pyro.

    The video I linked wasn’t meant to be an answer to all life’s mysteries. None of us on this planet hold all the keys. It was to show how HUGE and ever expanding the heavens are and how puny we are in comparison, but the same elements exist in all and the “glue” that holds us together (laminin) looks just like a cross, the symbol of God’s relationship to us. The galaxies are still growing and new stars are created all the time. Giglio claims God “breathes” them. It is referencing Genesis when God “spoke” these things into being and how that set all this in motion, a motion that is still occurring. Also proved scientifically.

    I am more of what used to be called a “Christian Mystic”. I believe that God has placed truth found in scripture, including the Bible among other sources, that lead us to knowledge with him. The “religion” was never intended to be a “written” accounting, rather a life style. Jesus, when he was here didn’t command anyone to worship a book. He said simply to die to self (ego), take up your cross (God-relationship), and follow me. He was the example for us to mimic.

    The scripture He referred to was not “the Bible”. The Bible was put together by men from a sampling of all the writings that were considered sacred by “religious” men. It was compiled in 1600’s. A lot of MANipulation between then and when He walked this earth. The God of the Universe cannot be contained in ANY book or idol (symbol), and cannot be adequately understood by any man. God is Spirit, not a physical entity. A really cool visual is in the first few chapters of Ezekial. Now tell me he wasn’t talking about a UFO there. All the early illustrations of “God encounters” showed UFO-type objects. They were generally referred to as “clouds”. Those folks had no other form of reference.

    Science has proven there is a water barrier around all things, even in space. Water, a seemingly simple element, still baffles science. There are so many cool things that we are discovering about it that we never knew. Water is very significant in scripture. And “living water” is also very much discussed there, too. You should google “The miracle of Water” sometime and check out some of what we are learning through experiment and discovery. Amazing stuff.

    We know from science that everything is in motion and produces a sound. Now we even have recorded the sound of the sun and stars. That is found in the verses. This laminin discovery just fits right in with what that verse in Colossians tells us.

    Anyway, I enjoy these discussions. I love being challenged and stretched. 😉

  196. Rutherford,

    I wanted to mention some interesting reading that would give some insight not found in the Bible, but doesn’t conflict with it. The fundamentalists reject these, and many only read the King James Version, so I expect I’ll get flack. But I’m used to it. Regardless, these are VERY enlightening, imo.

    The Book of Enoch (awesome account of giants and UFOs), The Book of Jubilees (referenced in the Bible), The Book of Bee, and The Cave of Treasures. These are available online.

    More about the birth of Jesus can be found in The Gospel of Mary, The Protevangelion, and The Gospel of the infancy of Jesus.

    Later…

  197. Well there was an interesting discovery made last week (which Tex will probably poo-poo … he believes science hasn’t advanced past the days of leeches 🙂 ) about bacteria that had arsenic in their DNA structure where phosphorus should have been. At least I think that is what I understood from it. It calls into question what we previously believed to be necessary to sustain life.

    While I fully support scientific discovery, I do believe there are really big questions for which we will never find the answer. I am comfortable saying “I don’t know and I never will”.

    Tex, you think that because I question an active creator that influences our every day lives that I discount the world’s complexity. If we replace miraculous with mysterious and unexplainable, I fully agree that the human mind (never even mind the universe) is unfathomable. That leads to your conclusion that only a God could have created it. Perhaps so but I’m not at all sure. And even if that were true, I wouldn’t build an entire code of morality and ethics around God as a scientific explanation of our existence.

    Maybe I’d be more comfortable with God if it began and ended with creationism. Then I could say, OK … it’s just an alternative scientific explanation for how things started, perhaps only slightly less plausible than evolution. But then we have to attach all this morality to it, and life lessons, etc etc. I guess I like my science detached from morality.

  198. Break on through you jive turkey.

    Hey Rabbit, you see what that got Jim Morrison. Well at least Charlie Crist is trying to pardon him for showing his penis on stage. 🙂

  199. NO wonder Poolman is so confused. The Bible in the 1600s? Gnostic gospels? 😆 Wonder what Poolman thinks 1st Century Christians used as gospel?

    The scientific discovery last week was interesting, but hardly earth shattering.

  200. wanted to mention some interesting reading that would give some insight not found in the Bible, but doesn’t conflict with it.

    Quite the contrary, the Gospel of Thomas says women must be converted “to men” to enter heaven. Oh, I think Christ would find there is great contradiction.

    But I am understanding how you seem to be of two worlds now.

  201. Wonder what Poolman thinks 1st Century Christians used as gospel?

    First century believers expected Jesus to return within their lifetimes to set up His kingdom on earth. That is likely why nothing was written for near 60 years into the first century. They read the “scriptures” but there was no official “Bible”. The word bible doesn’t even appear in scripture. 🙄

    Quite the contrary, the Gospel of Thomas says women must be converted “to men” to enter heaven.

    You don’t say? I have read the bits and pieces of that Gospel that are around, and don’t recall that. Hmmmm. Interesting take on the “two will become one flesh” there, eh? 😎

    I also don’t take EVERYTHING in any of these books literally. If I did both my eyes would be gouged out and I wouldn’t have hands. 😉

  202. But I am understanding how you seem to be of two worlds now.

    Amen to that. This world is not my home, I’m just passin’ through…

  203. “Before our white brothers arrived to make us civilized men, we didn’t have any kind of prison. Because of this, we had no delinquents. Without a prison, there can be no delinquents. We had no locks nor keys and therefore among us there were no thieves. When someone was so poor that he couldn’t afford a horse, a tent or a blanket, he would, in that case, receive it all as a gift. We were too uncivilized to give great importance to private property. We didn’t know any kind of money and consequently, the value of a human being was not determined by his wealth. We had no written laws laid down, no lawyers, no politicians, therefore we were not able to cheat and swindle one another.

    We were really in bad shape before the white men arrived and I don’t know how to explain how we were able to manage without these fundamental things that (so they tell us) are so necessary for a civilized society.”

    John (Fire) Lame Deer
    Lakota Sioux, 1903-1976

  204. “Right now, if I were to nominate any of our denizens THE MAN it would be Gorilla who represents the military/industrial complex and BiW who probably makes out quite nicely in his law practice.”

    Actually, I missed that, but sorry R, no.

    I don’t meet the diversity criteria to work for one of the Darth Vader firms here that would pay me a six-figure income, and seeing as I have to be home every evening to be Dad, it isn’t in the cards for me anytime soon, anyway. Modest 5 figure income and monthly student loan payments that cost me more than my house payment.

  205. I rooted for the assholes to kill the blue things in Avatar.

    Ever since the 1600’s, naïve ass clowns have been putting Native American culture on a pedestal. Shit kills me.

    The fact is, strong tribes oppressed weak tribes as Indians savagely killed one another.

    Meet the New World. Same as the Old World.

    Sure, most Indians were semi Nomadic in nature and had different views on land ownership that clashed with colonizers. But that stuff went on in Europe too. North America had the Sioux, Europe had the Cossacks.

    My family literally comes from the last village in Europe to be Christianized. Many Indians were Christianized before my people. How come chicks don’t dig me more for this? I should have been able to get laid while talking about how coyote is a trickster much more.

  206. Poolman you’ll love this Limbaugh clip played on Stephen Colbert’s show. Colbert then follows the logic to suggest since blacks picked tobacco, they should also pay white men reparations, in fact …. the blacks were in cahoots with the Indians. LOL

  207. Poolman,

    Your Christian history sucks worse than your politics. Paul wrote most of his book 15-20 years after Christ’s death. All of the New Testament was penned before 90 A.D. and is easily proven.

    I can also easily prove all of the synoptic gospels were written before 70 A.D. That’s less than one generation after Christ’s death.

    The Gnostic gospels are 3rd Century garbage of a fertile mind. You might as well read the Koran – you’ll get us much. 🙄 If you’re going to claim Christ, make sure you get the historical record correct too.

  208. I rooted for the assholes to kill the blue things in Avatar.

    You too, huh? LOL. I wanted them to butcher every one of those leaf loving SOBs…

    Ever since the 1600′s, naïve ass clowns have been putting Native American culture on a pedestal. Shit kills me.

    Isn’t that the truth – come down to Native America where I live and you’ll get a great gander of what America would like left to Indians. Peace pipes, dirt roads, casinos, and meth.

    I wonder if these feckless libs ever wonder where “savages” and scalped was coined? I wouldn’t mind taking a little lib land (say Frisco and Manhattan) to the savages.

    The fact is, strong tribes oppressed weak tribes as Indians savagely killed one another.

  209. I see El Bongo is starting to sweat 2012 after his severe ass kicking a month ago.

    All the sudden, ever one gets a tax cut. What a farce! What happened to that class warfare “R”? 😛

    Guess the schmuck got the message. Figure Graychin Von Rambo will ever get the message? You watch. Piss Yeller Dawg will come storming in here about Bongo’s strong leadership skills. 😆

  210. Your Christian history sucks worse than your politics. Paul wrote most of his book 15-20 years after Christ’s death. All of the New Testament was penned before 90 A.D. and is easily proven.

    How does that contradict what I said? Reading comprehension much?

    I can also easily prove all of the synoptic gospels were written before 70 A.D. That’s less than one generation after Christ’s death.

    That I’d go for, but still, refer to statement above.

    You might as well read the Koran – you’ll get us much.

    I have read the Qur’an, at least much of it. Got one on my desk. Your point? What do you “know” about it that the rest of us might not?

  211. Gorilla,

    It’s his one stab at “moving toward the middle” – I applaud him being 23 months too late. 🙂

    I think you’re absolutely right. Graychin Von Rafterman will end up hating Obama before it is over with – and somewhere down the line, you’ll end up hearing the word “coward” attached.

  212. That is likely why nothing was written for near 60 years into the first century. They read the “scriptures” but there was no official “Bible”. The word bible doesn’t even appear in scripture.

    60 A.D. is wrong and late…I just explained that to you.

    The Word appears in John Chapter 1 is synonymous with the Bible. The word Bible comes from the Greek word “Biblos,” which is translated “book” and was a common reference to ‘The Word’ in the 1st century during Paul’s travels…

    Semantics doesn’t impress me – like your avoidance of difficult subjects that don’t mess with your flavor of “The Word.”

  213. Hey Rutherford,

    Did you see Palin nail that caribou? Dead Eye! 😆

    I like to imagine that was some lib in those crosshairs. Say like Yeller Dawg….

  214. I wanted them to butcher every one of those leaf loving SOBs

    Spoken like a true crusader. That Bible knowledge do anything for you except cloud your thoughts and pepper your speech?

    come down to Native America where I live and you’ll get a great gander of what America would like left to Indians. Peace pipes, dirt roads, casinos, and meth.

    Yeah, I’ve seen that culture there. Hasn’t changed in centuries. Carrying on just like they always were. Good thing whitey showed up to gamble with his precious greenbacks, otherwise how would they by that crack?

    I wonder if these feckless libs ever wonder where “savages” and scalped was coined?

    The earliest North American records show scalpings were first performed from 14th century. The earliest evidence in Europe was from around 400 B.C. Hmmmm. Yeah. Let’s pin that on the Native Americans. Oh wait, Vikings were here 300 years before 14th century. Naw, they were just cannibals, surely they never considered saving any trophies.

    And savages? Yeah. Just like towelheads and n*ggers, not really human. 🙄 A lesser species meant to be dominated by whites as god intended. I’m sure women in positions of authority chap your hiney, too. Tsk, tsk.

  215. Dawg has renamed himself. 😈

    Your little facetious bleeding heart is killing me Foolman. Go back to worshiping Gaia and googling history to look the intellectual – part Jimmy Swaggart, part Michael Brady boning the neighbor, thumping a copy of the N.T. in hand while humping the Broke Back.

    Why don’t you give up your land in Arizona there Foolman, since that too was Indian land long before your sorry ass moved there? Better yet, show your generosity and give it to an illegal.

  216. You got some really interesting interpetations Tex. Paul’s Letters, not “his book” were written to the established believers that met in homes in the various cities that bear the name of the letters. Many others are referenced but not included. Most are said to be written around 54-57AD. Sorry my “near 60AD” wasn’t accurate enough for you. I was going by memory.

  217. The “Word” in scripture refers to Jesus. It ALWAYS did.

    “In the beginning was the Word…”

    “The Word became flesh and dwelt among us”

    Remember those parts. For all that “knowledge” you have, you could probably entertain a whole reservation full of halfbreeds for months. I’m sure they would be immensely amused.

    :mrgreen:

  218. Your math is also as bad as your politics, being I just told you 15 years max after Christ’s death for Corinthians…

    Do we speak of books of the Old Testament or letters? Specious statement and not impressive.

    30 + 15 = 45

    Guess you don’t need an engineering degree to build pools, hey? Can you add feet, or are your pools like a box and/or a blow up? 🙂

    I think you stay in the shallow end. Don’t dive.

  219. Damn Foolman – you speak in half-truths. Yes, that is exactly what I said: John 1 – And “THE WORD” became “FLESH” and dwelt among us.

    How do the kids say it? DUH…

    Have any other obvious revelations you wish to bestow upon the world? I’ve had mannequins that give better responses. Come on man – you’re better than this at Fat Granny’s.

  220. Poolman,

    Your New Age Indian is nothing more then the inverse of the 1950s Hollywood Indian.

    Both versions are insulting, cartoon-ish projections.

    You should be ashamed of yourself.

    I once read an awesome essay by an Indian talking about your type. I wish I could find it.

  221. Such a sweet-talker, Tex. I bet the ladies are impressed.

    So you are saying Jesus died in 30 AD? Earlier you said likely He was born in 4AD. That’s when the census was done. His ministry started when He was 30, I recall. They claim He was 33 when He was crucified, of course that is from memory, I am sure YOU know the truth. So likely 37AD plus 15 is? And the 15 came from where? Where did that get pulled from? Oh help me out here, I’m way over my head, I must have fallen into the deep end. 😆

    Seriously, If you are going to bust me on a few years nearly 2000 years ago, you better be able to stand getting razzed for your fuzzy interpretation of the very creed you profess to believe in.

    Your little facetious bleeding heart is killing me Foolman.

    “But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, ‘Raca, ‘ is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.”
    (Matthew 5:22)

    Anger management classes much?

  222. Rabbit, I’ll admit there were very savage and warlike tribes of Native Americans on this continent. But there were also plenty that were peaceful and ALL of them treated the planet WAY better than the white man has. But it’s okay now. They have been sufficiently subdued. Of course we are still denying them rights were promised them in places like Canada and Alaska and even in Tex’s own backyard. I’m sure it’s justice, though. Likely they brought it all on themselves.

  223. Speaking of ladies. I have noticed a darth of them on this blog. Of course I guess you can never really know who’s behind the keyboard for certain. Is that part of the plan, Rutherford, or just the way the grass grew? Not really important, I suppose. It just seems a little testosterone heavy. It’s all good.

  224. There’s a girl here named Graychin. 🙂

    Poolman, foolman, you read incorrectly. Reading comprehension much? Isn’t that your line. Like I said, math ain’t your bag.

    Most historians do seem to agree that Christ was actually born in what we now know 5-4 B.C. and more easily documented in that we know the approximate time of Herod’s death.

    Do you see an A.D. in there sir? No, you don’t. What I said holds and your statement from above is non sequitur.

    Peaceful native Americans… 😆 Firewater stupor, maybe. If they were peaceful, they didn’t last long.

    But I’ll admit in the 1840’s, they were brutally mistreated. And I don’t have a problem with the Indians – some of my inlaws could better be defined as squaws. 🙂 My own father is on some of the rolls. Just pulling your sensitivity string.

  225. And the peaceful tribes were continually terrorized by the war like tribes.

    Besides, how many different linguistic groups/cultures were there?

    Nice of you to play ambassador for all of them.

    Dude, even if every European came here 100 times more saintly then Mother Teresa, Indians were doomed to be decimated.

    It was a clash of microbes, misunderstandings, evil, fear, technology etc. etc. etc. You know, human stuff. And more microbes.

    You know who else benefited from the very disease they spread? Mongols, cousins of Indians.

    So if your point is that domination is a bitch, fair enough. Hell, bash Europeans. They were ruthless, no doubt. But cut the crap about us pissing on some Utopia. It was fucked up over here, too. Europeans were just better at it.

    Go visit some of the last few stone age cultures on Earth. Motherfuckers would either kill you or worship you as a god. And boy would you love the latter, with all your doors you claim to be able to open in the mind.

    As for the Indian being oppressed today, what a joke.

    Today’s Indian enjoys millions of grown ass men who get all dreamy eyed every time an Indian runs his trap.

    Its a running joke amongst Indians.

    At the local theater, you learned that Chief Snow Shoe is Great Forest Shaman. Keeper of the Great Crow Spirit. And that shit is sexy to you.

    No, today’s Indian suffers no oppression from whites. Oppression implies resistance. And Big Nanny made sure long ago to buy the American Indian’s spine. Just like they are trying now with Blacks.

    It’s genius. Liberals make blacks/indians oppress themselves by way of welfare funded victim addiction AND get their vote.

    The worst thing that ever happen to the Indian was when people like you started treating them special.

    No one in America gets their collective ass kissed more then the Indian.

    Free school for some unknown grandma’s dna?

    My buddy gets a 400 dollar casino check every two months and grew up in a Detroit Factory Town. He is as indian as Rutherford is black.

    My Mom is Polish. 3 million were put to death in the holocaust alone. It doesn’t even occur to the Polish to play the violin. We’ve been fucked over numerous times.

    Why is that? Why don’t you get all dreamy eyed at me.

    Forman Stan Sobieski is Steelmill Shaman. Keeper of Great Bowling Alley Spirit.

  226. Holy shit…my rant was way too long. All from a black berry too. That shit will take all of Hucking’s 7 minutes and could have been condensed to about 5 sentences.

  227. You guys are fun. I’ll try to keep the Indian stories and biblical history to a minimum. Doesn’t mean it won’t come back up again when the Huckster makes the circuit on another of his 8 second rides. Yee-haw. It’s all good.

    Re: the Bush v Obama popularity link. Love it. Popularity ain’t all it’s cut out to be. I just wish he’d can the bipartisan bit and kick some ass. Bi-partisan is crap anyway. Repuglians never mean it. It’s alway like Charlie Brown and Lucy and the football thingie. Entertaining at best. Dems fall for it everytime.

    Speaking of W, I got the new AARP mag with Bush’e mug on the cover next to the shitter. Seems apropos. The smeller it gets in there, the bigger he smiles at me. He’s safe for now, as I got plenty of tissue. I sure wish he goes to Europe for his book tour. Oh man. That would be my Christmas gift, I could celebrate that one for years to come. Joy to the world!

  228. Foolman,

    I see that the “hated” George Bush now being more popular than your false messiah burns your ass too. 😈 I think you need more inane profound Obama cliches.

    YES YOU CAN!

    Sweet….

  229. Kathy doing the Rickles routine. Hilarious. Too bad most of the troops don’t know Rickles. Wrong generation, for sure. But the Bristol DWTS thing was silly at best. I don’t watch that show, but talk about crazy. How did she even get there to begin with? I thought it was dancing with the STARS. What am I missing here. That poor gal is never going to have a normal life.

    So I take it you are all Palin fans here? She has definitely come a long way, eh? It only goes to show, America is the land of opportunity. If you know the right folks, I guess. Second book tour already. Not as dramatic as the first. I read the first. I haven’t read the new one yet. It is probably a best seller, too. Ah, marketing. Where would we be without your guiding hand?

  230. Actually Tex, I helped put W in office in 2000. Of course, turns out he didn’t need my help. Not with an IT man like Michael Connell. What ever happened to him? Oh yeah, he convenietly crashed his plane right before the big court testimony. Damn. These coincidences are just divine. 😉

  231. Poolman,

    You sure you ain’t one of those guys wearing whale costumes out on the wharf in San Fran?

    I could swear you read like a Nancy Pelosi rube.

  232. Royko was hilarious BIC. Being from Tulsa, my favorites were the series he did on Oral Roberts. Brutal, but hilarious.

    Lewis Grizzard was another funny one I miss.

    “Nobody.” (When asked on Larry King Live in 1991 who would be the best Democratic presidential candidate.) ~ Lewis Grizzard

    My kind of man.

  233. Tex, I did vote for Obama. Doesn’t mean he gets off light. I am not pleased with his performance, but I don’t know how much any politician CAN do in our government. They are just the public laisons. Just salesmen. Doesn’t matter who is at the helm, it isn’t connected directly to the rudder, anyway. And as with the Titanic, this behemoth can’t turn on a dime. Especially with all the other oars in the water fighting to stay the course. Armageddon here we come! Ooops…. that one slipped. Could it be……..SATAN? 😈

  234. You probably think Bush was in charge of the last administration. Funny when the 9-11 commission had him testify in private before them, he insisted on Cheney being there to hold his hand. Yeah. It sure feels like justice is being served. Get a load of his talk with the press after that meeting. “They had a lot of good questions…..I enjoyed it….” 😆 “I was impressed by the questions.” “I think they found it to be helpful” 😆

  235. Speaking of ladies. I have noticed a darth of them on this blog. …. Is that part of the plan, Rutherford?

    Ah you need to read the previous thread where the survival or lack thereof of women on this blog was discussed. A small part of the blame belongs to Brother Tex who treats liberal women far worse than he treats the men. But it takes two to tango (or not as the case may be) and sadly most women just have a low tolerance for the rough and tumble that goes on here.

    Heck, my own wife reads my articles from her RSS reader and never visits the web site because she has no interest in the comments. She hears some of them anyway ‘cos how can I resist dropping a choice Tex, Rabbit or BiW quote now and then at the dinner table? 👿

    My six year old daughter: “Daddy, what’s a liberal skank?” 😆

  236. Spare me the vestigial BDS.

    Apparently you can’t even make up your mind whether he was an evil mastermind, or if he miraculously managed to keep his drool cup out of sight all these years…which would be a remarkable feat, considering that esteemed members of the press are still spelunking in Sarah Palin’s uterus looking for proof that Trig wasn’t hers.

    But I have enjoyed watching the media elites get themselves so worked up over someone they decried in a million different ways from the minute the announcement of her candidacy was released. The hue and cry against her even now, two years after the campaign has served to make her an influential figure in politics by the very people who keep claiming their disbelief that she is. Its almost like a “Fetuses for NARAL” image.

  237. My six year old daughter: “Daddy, what’s a liberal skank?”

    NOT a BiW quote.

    Now if your daughter asked you what federalism is, and why it matters, that might be from a BiW quote, and it might also be embarassing, seeing as you have given no indication of understanding the answers to those questions yourself.

    “It doesn’t matter. It was just something thought up 200 years ago by some dead white guys.”

  238. Tex, a 1% difference in job approval is statistically meaningless. When you expect the new guy to wave a magic wand and make everything better and he doesn’t, then the old guy starts looking better.

    It’s really not that surprising. Let’s also not forget the poll you mention is being given on the heels of Bush’s nostalgia tour. And the guy is a hoot. …. so long as you can forget about the wrecked economy and the unnecessary war that killed more Americans than died on 9/11. 😐

  239. Poolman … the gang here is real interesting regarding Palin. Their collective hard-on is just beginning to sag as Palin relentlessly demonstrates her idiocy. I’ve even gotten a couple of the guys to begrudgingly admit they’re tired of her running her mouth.

    Kinda matches what is going on within the GOP as they search for ways to sideline her before she ruins their 2012 chances. The latest attempt was a push by the Tea Party of all folks for her to run the RNC. She politely turned down the suggestion (via her Facebook page of course). 🙂

    The boys here will tell you my disdain for the woman borders on manic. But then if you just search for Palin on the blog search feature, you’ll get an idea of how big a fan I am of hers. 😉

  240. Hey! NO fair. You think I’ve been alone in giving Flake a hard time? I gave Densico a hard time. Flake is such a phony she detracts from your ‘fabulous’ blog.

    Flake Fake seems to be more offended by the “language” than the innuendo. And that ain’t me…well, kind of. But I’m certainly not the biggest instigator of the sexual taboos.

    Face it Rutherford and quit lying thru your teeth. If I would have said Bush is every bit as popular and loved as Obama in Dec. 2010, you would have had me committed.

    Your denial is so thorough…

    Elric was right! 😛

  241. Regarding 292, BiW that one made me chuckle. Nah, I just reassure my sweetheart that she should be glad old BiW isn’t on her school board. Suddenly she’d be learning about the theocracy known as the USA and the unconstitutionality of the civil rights acts. 😉

  242. Okay, I admit I did accuse Flake of being Graychin with small tits, and now she claims to have big tits. So, I made a mistake! 🙂

    I apologize for guessing she’s a liberal skank instead of the more accurate and descriptive liberal lard ass. None of us is perfect. I was a whole lot tougher on Huck than I was Flake and he didn’t go to pieces.

    And try to remember, before Rabbit and myself, you had no members chump So, I consider myself a net asset – or something like that.

  243. Poolman, BiW is onto something. Palin has indeed found a sweet spot. She has found a following that loves her more as others hate her. The way to solidify her base is to criticize her. Her base is like the organism in the Andromeda Strain (one of my all time fav films). If you feed that sucker the right stuff, it multiplies like crazy!

  244. Yeah, but your clock never moves and always tilts left – therefore Mr. Elric was more right than you’ll ever know. You need to put the clock the head of it upright…

  245. Tex I love you man, I truly do, but both Huck and Alfie predate your and Rabbit’s descent upon my blog. I actually had commenters while on General Chen’s blog you swore you would never stoop so low as to visit this sorry-ass place.

    Ahhhh, the memories! 😎

  246. Palin is most conservative men’s ideal sweet piece. They would love to get her alone out in the tundra for a night. She’s got that flirt thingie down. 😉 Definitely a tease. Abstinence, my ass. 😉

    You may not shoot anything that trip. At least maybe not what you were intending. But she’s not that “I want to go steady with you” kind of gal. There isn’t really any substance there that I see. Too bad we are talking about a politician and now best-selling author. The American Dream. How to become a millionaire and live the dream life. Get your own teevee show…that ain’t workin’, that’s the way to do it….money for nuthin’….♪ ♫ ♪

    She’s got the right packaging and with Murdock’s marketing is definitely mainstream meat, if you know what I mean. Fresh, yet slighty aged and the color looks right. I just hope the voters dig deeper than that. That would be something, eh? An educated voting bloc. As if that mattered. If that’s the one that’s getting in, by hook or crook, I think is what they say. I know it isn’t by coincidence she’s where she is. There has been much planning to get her there. Maybe their investment will pay off. Time will tell.

    I’ll agree on that sweet spot. She’s an addictive elixir that has been released and is constantly injected to Amerika through the MSM. We do love our addictions. 😀

    Good night all. Peaceful dreams. Don’t forget where you parked your brain.

  247. “Back in to do another hit and soon to run. I see I got a snarky response from the Huckster. Are we not the CIA? I’m confused now, or you’ll have to explain who the represent. ”

    Let me make it real simple for you…

    We helped put the Baath in power in 1968. Saddam Hussein put himself in power in 1979. Contrary to your claim, we did not help put him there. You don’t know what you are talking about. Do yourself a favor and go enjoy a nice hot cup of STFU. Maybe put some cinnamon on top, for the holidays.

  248. Also…using someone after they are in power is not the same as putting them in power. You still haven’t proven your claim.

  249. “Modest 5 figure income and monthly student loan payments that cost me more than my house payment.”

    That is depressing……

    (And yeah, I am taking more than 7 minutes. Rabbit’s rants are worth it)

  250. Checking in after a few days of loathing R’s economic ignorance. Having had the misfortune of watching MSNBC this morning, I see that my suspicions ran true. R was just repeating without question the talking points offered by the morning geniuses with the coaching of the WH from their blackberries.

    Glad to see Tex, BiW, Rabbit (and the other forest inhabitants) have returned. With the introduction of our latest race-baiting antagonist, Poolman, the proper balance has been restored.

    R, you want to guess the direction of the stock market today?

  251. Tex I love you man, I truly do, but both Huck and Alfie predate your and Rabbit’s descent upon my blog. I actually had commenters while on General Chen’s blog you swore you would never stoop so low as to visit this sorry-ass place.

    Ahhhh, the memories!

    What was your comment traffic count then Roscoe? Four a week?

    Hey, I ain’t saying we’re that good. I’m saying we’re that entertaining between Rabbit’s humor and my big mouth. The real credit actually should go to the Rabbit. 🙂 Besides, truth be known this one still ain’t up to the General Chen’s standards. Not even close….those were the real memories.

    If Chen’s blog hadn’t died, you wouldn’t have seen me here besides the occasional snark like I provided at The Snarling Skank’s blog the other day.

    I wouldn’t get too cocky Barry Jr.

  252. What do you think of Barack Bush these days Rutherford? GITMO, FICA cuts, surges (poorly executed with promises of dates) in Afghanistan, screwing the shores of LA again (BP)

    Now. let’s talk about something important. Kathy Griffin, Libs extraordinaire and pathetic attempt at comedy recently made fun of Bristol Palin’s weight and was soundly booed off the stage.

    Now Roscoe, I know there is nothing you love more than the corner of Leg & Leg, so who do you choose to catch from behind? Bristol Palin or Griffin in bikini?

    http://althouse.blogspot.com/2010/12/kathy-griffin-joked-that-bristol-palin.html

  253. Ah Tex, my favorite master of revisionist history. As is often the case, you start with a bad premise and then fly from there. First, you’ve always connected number of comments to number of hits, forgetting that lots of people choose not to comment on articles.

    You’ve also always had a tech fetish with blogs. The more bells, whistles and gimmicks a blog had the more impressed you were. There, you’re absolutely right … I never aspired to have the “nifty” blog Chen had. I didn’t swap avatars for ad hom comments. I didn’t have animated sidebar gifs, etc. etc. And much to Chen’s credit, I did not inaugurate the WordPress Political Bloggers Alliance, without which I would have had much less traffic. So I give the General his due. However I say with all due modesty, I’m here to write. I’m not a blog hobbyist. I think Chen was both a hobbyist and a fan of blog wars (he’s still a fan of blog wars). I find blog wars incredibly juvenile. In any case, Chen was good at what he does. I think I’m pretty good at what I do. Apples and oranges to some extent.

    [End of defensive lecture] 🙂

  254. If you’re saying that Bristol Palin is more f*ckable than Kathy Griffin, I’d have to agree with that … but I would NEVER talk about a politician’s daughter in such vulgar terms. We should leave family out of it, right? 😉

  255. Haw Haw Roscoe.

    I knew that would smoke the Rutherford ass – you’re so predictable. I consider our relationship symbiotic, while you deny the truth. You accused me of revisionism, then never made mention how I “revised’ anything.

    General Chen was a kid, or at least a kid at heart. You’re an old fart like me. Don’t give me your dog doo about you haven’t enjoyed the exposure. You would not tolerate me for a NY second if you didn’t love the give and take.

    And I in return, I am thankful to you for providing an outlet to produce my venom directed at liberals, especially the horrific hack Graychin, whose swelled balloon for a head is pricked here every day.

    Hell yes it’s fun.

    Did I mention I actually think Bristol Palin is pretty? In fact, all of Palin’s girls are pretty – especially the youngest one who is going to be beautiful.

    Kathy Griffin looks like most lib women – a lifetime of a face washed with pumice and mud flaps for butt cheeks.

  256. There’s no denying the Palin girls are attractive. Hell, I’ve never said their mother wasn’t physically attractive. But Sarah does prove that beauty is only skin-deep.

    I haven’t watched anything but excerpts from “Sarah Palin’s Alaska” (aka TLC’s nine hour political ad for the Palin campaign) but I got a kick out of how she made a grand show of protecting Willow’s virginity by not allowing boys up to her room. Good move there Sarah …. one daughter and grandchild too late, but good move just the same.

    Believe me, based on all the press that Bristol got for her “heroic” out-of-wedlock birthing, we’ll see Willow with child in no time flat. This is a backwoods family if there ever was one. There’s always one sane one …. maybe Piper will grow up to be the sane one?

  257. Believe me, based on all the press that Bristol got for her “heroic” out-of-wedlock birthing, we’ll see Willow with child in no time flat. This is a backwoods family if there ever was one. There’s always one sane one …. maybe Piper will grow up to be the sane one?

    Well, in comparison to lib mothers who not only encourage their daughters that their nothing but animals in heat, but even mom may partake a little on the side with their 14 year old boyfriends. Pumice face and mud flaps aside, not many 14 year olds than can resist the older lib with mud flaps and pumice faces and these lib women hating real men are still looking for a little nookie.

    And if little lib Willow just happens to get minted, a little run down to the mill will take care of the problem in no time flat – who gives a damn anyway about a product of conception.

    Better to be back water than back door of the abortion mill in my book.

  258. Palin sure gets a lot of blog and media attention. I’ll give her that. A lot of unbridled hate and blind allegiance. There isn’t usually much middle ground there. Looks are less important to me at this juncture in my life than substance. Doesn’t mean I still don’t look. I just don’t ever judge a book by its cover. The substance below the surface in Palin’s life is not real wholesome or pretty. But hey, this is Amerika 2010. No one is interested in substance. Especially if it takes any effort to uncover.

    I read your take from the link you provided, Rutherford. I had read the references from other sources. I think it is pretty accurate. We will be debating her value and speculating her impact for years, I’m sure. That is what we do today. Talk is cheap and inflation has given it even less value.

    I, for one, know how bread gets buttered in this country. Not only that, I’ve learned to check the ingredients on the butter tub and the credentials of the one handling the knife. It is also a good idea to chew well before swallowing, just like mom always warned. A few more seconds of our valuable time on the front end could save us from indigestion a little later. And lastly, remember man does not live by bread alone.

  259. I notice there isn’t anyone talking about the fact that the GOP and Democrats found a way to compromise, and the only ones sniveling about the compromise are democrats.

    What happened to that chicken-scratch about democrats just wanting to get things done in the face of unbudging republican obstructionism?

    Looks like that has been proven to be a big load of BS…..

  260. What’s your take on the press conference R?

    How’s this for a money quote:

    This isn’t politics of the moment, this is what we can get done now.” Obama

    He said this was the case because his political position in the Congress next year was going to be considerably weaker, so he was going to take what he could now while he was in the best position.

    Sounds like politics of the moment to me…

  261. Oh, it doesn’t surprise me Poolman that you wouldn’t have a problem with Christ being left out of Christmas, being I find you if nothing else a poseur extraordinaire, and not a terribly bright one at that. And since I know Larry Fox, the leader of the parade and the one interviewed on FOX, he should know better too since his kid went to school with my kid K-12 in a Catholic school.

    Though Stewart sometimes funny, he has an incredibly superficial audience like Rutherford. Rutherford is a wonderfully talented writer, but there is little or no depth to his thinking. He’s inadequately unprepared for what awaits, and I expect you are too.

    But I think what we really ought to do is to do away with the federal holiday called Christmas, being it seems to me it has become more slogan than religious holiday.

    This too will be changed back because what Stewart didn’t tell you is that people here in Tulsa like me simply won’t go or participate. It’s a lot more than a few animals and Jim Inhofe – and Broken Arrow, a suburb of Tulsa will replace it. It already is in the process.

    I don’t get too bent with the stupidity of liberalism and paganism anymore. They get a few yuck yucks and the first thought big victory, only to get burned in the end. But I would think sometime you might look around and see who it is you’re siding with in your politics…

    Not very pretty.

    Think Obama…

  262. While we’re on the subject of ginned up Xmas outrage, here’s someone who really went off the deep end. I understood her point but she needs to get over it.

    Diversity makes America great. What a joke…the biggest lie foisted on the public yet. It’s an even bigger lie than climate change. 😈

    When NASA put a man on the moon, still mankind’s greatest technological achievement, virtually the entire cast who made it possible in less than eight years was virtually all white and male – many affiliated with the military.

    Diversity isn’t what makes America great; diversity is what keeps America from being great again and waters down the standards.

    Thankfully, all but the politically correct politicians and their toadies like Rutherford are saying bullshit on affirmative action too. Obama is without doubt the first affirmative action President and look how he’s done – completely incapable and an imbecile who has done irreparable damage to our great country. Even the Iranians are laughing at him anymore, as his days of useful idiot are over.

  263. Back to the parade for a minute.

    To demonstrate how phony this argument about “inclusiveness” is, can anybody here really tell me would there even be a parade if it were not Christmas?

    No, of course there wouldn’t be a parade.

    This argument is like Kwanzaa – complete and utter phooey….some black racist has to make a holiday up to feel included. 😆 And after a few years of reflection, the entire brouhaha fades after 75% of America laughs at their stupidty and the natural force is restored.

    It only goes to prove the real fight isn’t over a name but the message of Christmas. I just wish wienies like Poolman and Rutherford might man up for once to at least admit the obvious reasoning. Nobody is fooled by the reasons or the semantics.

  264. Oh, it doesn’t surprise me Poolman that you wouldn’t have a problem with Christ being left out of Christmas

    Actually I have a more of a problem with Christ being left out of most churches and the life of “Christians” in general. Others think He should just be left in the church. Most “Christians” have a persona for Sunday, one for home, one for work, one for when they are on the computer… Like Jethro Tull sang,

    “He’s not the kind ya have to wind up on Sundays….”

    Jesus is love FIRST, and has NEVER forced himself on anyone. Unlike most evangelicals, dominionists, and fundamentalists I know. Did you ever hear of “that still, small voice”? Or “behold, I stand at the door and knock”? I don’t think kicking the door in is His style. But you seem to know it all, so maybe you don’t really know my Lord. Plenty of fakes out there, for sure. Some look awful shiny…

    The birthday celebration is more of a modern thing, anyway. Back in Jesus’ day, infant mortality was so great, they really didn’t count children until they had made it past being weaned.

  265. Diversity isn’t what makes America great

    Ahhhh just wait long enough and Tex says something blatantly racist. Yup, as long as we keep those colored people out of the mix, we can get a man to Mars and cure cancer!

    Well I must say Tex … maybe you’ve struck upon something? The Chinese who are kicking our asses don’t have a black guy within a stone’s throw of anything. Maybe they have the secret sauce? 👿

  266. Tex, you politically correct bastard — you crap on Kwanza but you don’t dare admit what a sham the Chanukah thing is. You know full well Jews trumped up that minor holiday to “compete” with Xmas. But you’d rather die than sound like an anti-Semite. Better to crap on black people.

    Tex, if there is such a thing as reincarnation, I sincerely hope you come back as Flavor Flav.

    Flavor Flav

  267. Congratulations Poolman Swaggart. You like to quote scripture, so I’m sure you recognize Satan can quote scripture too…

    I do know this. If my party was composed of Bernie Madoff, Larry Flynt, NOW, teacher’s unions, ACT UP, Code Pink, Socialists of America, Communists of America, Gloria Steinem, Slick Clinton, Planned Parenthood, NARAL, NAMBLA, etc…

    I might choose to reevaluate exactly where my “faith” is leading me.

    You can spare me your sanctimony and sermons. I’ve heard it all…

  268. But you’d rather die than sound like an anti-Semite. Better to crap on black people.

    Kwanzaa…. LOL! What’s it celebrate again? Fruits from the local witch doctor? Didn’t it come out of the Watts riots? 😈

  269. you crap on Kwanza but you don’t dare admit what a sham the Chanukah thing is.

    Have you heard me singing the praises of Chanukah? It’s not a made up holiday like Oogie Boogie Kwanzaa, but of course it’s a ruse to compete with Christmas….

    Kwanzaa is racist to the core, though – an utter and complete sham. Therefore, it earns a higher degree of scorn.

  270. Tex, still foggy in the comprehension department, I see. As a registered Independent who will likely vote for Ron Paul if he runs again, just WHO is my party? 🙄

  271. Troofer Party…

    I thought I demonstrated twice in the last 24 hours who has the reading problem here Poolman Tilton? In conjunction with the basic mathematical problems of addition?

    You didn’t comment on your mistake, so I assumed you had no retort and realized you had indeed been a clueless buffoon. Better to remain in silence that remove all doubt, hey?

    So you shouldn’t have made this inane statement either…

    Back in Jesus’ day, infant mortality was so great, they really didn’t count children until they had made it past being weaned.

    “John leaped for joy in his mother’s womb….”

    Wrong Poolman. In fact, in Jesus day women only felt blessed when they weren’t barren. As usual, you’ve got your facts ass backwards. But your lame excuses do fit in nicely your abortion on demand wishes…how convenient for your “religion.”

  272. “R”,

    Ahhhh just wait long enough and Tex says something blatantly racist. Yup, as long as we keep those colored people out of the mix, we can get a man to Mars and cure cancer!

    I claim racism in the NBA. 😆 I don’t know why you have to keep pulling the blanket over your head…diversity is a huge weakness as this statement from you demonstrates very well:

    Well I must say Tex … maybe you’ve struck upon something? The Chinese who are kicking our asses don’t have a black guy within a stone’s throw of anything.

    Correct. Do you find diversity in the mix of China men? No, you don’t. The truth will set you free Rutherford…. 😉

    Well I must say Tex … maybe you’ve struck upon something? The Chinese who are kicking our asses don’t have a black guy within a stone’s throw of anything.

  273. You didn’t comment on your mistake, so I assumed you had no retort

    I believe I claimed :

    Seriously, If you are going to bust me on a few years nearly 2000 years ago, you better be able to stand getting razzed for your fuzzy interpretation of the very creed you profess to believe in.

    What’s a decade or two when even you could be wrong?

    So you shouldn’t have made this inane statement either…\

    Back in Jesus’ day, infant mortality was so great, they really didn’t count children until they had made it past being weaned.

    You are mixing apples and oranges again. But that seems to be your MO based on my short aquaintance with your online persona, be it Tex, KC, others. You are describing a pregnancy while I am talking about kids that were already born. Birthday. Get it? Uhhuh. Regarding kids that were actually birthed:

    “Around 25 percent of babies in the first century AD did not survive their first year and up to half of all children would die before the age of 10.”

    I did not dispute that children were considered a blessing. Really it was about all women were given credit for. Male children were the blessing. Females, not so much. They ignorantly blamed the women for the sex of the child. If you actually read the article I linked, you will see how brutally female infants were often discarded. Where’s your anger for those whities? Yeah, I though so. Your standards are as multicolored as your words.

  274. Sorry, Tigre.

    Navigating this thread is like trying to walk through the fenced yard of a dog owner without getting stepping in any congressional surprise packages. The fact that it is loading slower than a Democratic Cabinet Appointee paying their taxes doesn’t help any either.

  275. You are mixing apples and oranges again. But that seems to be your MO based on my short aquaintance with your online persona, be it Tex, KC, others. You are describing a pregnancy while I am talking about kids that were already born. Birthday. Get it? Uhhuh. Regarding kids that were actually birthed:

    Sounds to me you’re mixing your brain with your bunghole – as in trying to cover your ass Poolman Tilton when busted.

    So let’s see if can get this logic of yours straight. Women of antiquity considered their “unborn” a blessing, but weren’t attached or considered the child a child until the birth to toddler? Isn’t that what you said in conjunction with my pointing out Elizabeth carrying her child John? 😐

    Back in Jesus’ day, infant mortality was so great, they really didn’t count children until they had made it past being weaned.

    Let’s talk about another myth that lefties loosely practicing religion make today like that beauty you made from above.

    Can I remind you of the horrors and outrage of the slaughter of two year old males by King Herod, so much so it’s recorded in the Gospels with Joseph taking Christ to Egypt on account of it? Does that sound like some detached mother and father?

    What do you do? Make this junk up? Read it from nihilist site?

  276. I’m telling you El Tigre an BIC. Bristol Palin’s appearance and placing on DWTS with the outrage of loons from the Left only further documents Liberalism is truly a mental illness, and many times is accompanied by acute cases of PDS and BDS.

    You think Rutherford is crazed with hate. You ought to read this site where I badger the lefties that Poolman resides. He’s the sanest of the insane over there. It’s created by some kid for his harpy grandmother and her feckless friend.

    And every post is dedicated to slamming the Palin family. There’s multitudes of nags, hags, harpies, shrews, and Molly Ivins/Helen Thomas types that reside there. I think Poolman is like the effeminate token beta male. They allow him to remain because he rubs their feet.

  277. BiW, the real humor is that we both thought of Rutherford and his PDS issues when we saw it.

    R, I suggest a new thread before this place turns into the final chapters of the Lord of the Flies. . .

  278. http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/

    You’ll get my drift when you look at the front page. 🙂 They should rename it “Ugly She Woman Man Hater’s Club”…

    And these shrews reserve special hatred for beautiful women like Palin. It’s pitiful. The intense rage and jealousy is palpable the minute you stroll in – and they are fun as hell to torment. It’s like having 100 fat pinatas in front of you. You can’t miss.

    They finally booted me, so I just create a new socket puppet and keep drawing them for some more abuse. Somehow Poolman got caught in the crossfire and they’ve browbeat him so bad, he cowers like a kicked pup and attempts to join the fray.

    I just wish I could type faster when I enter.

  279. Doughboy Schultz is asking if this is Obama’s Waterloo…

    Watching Schultz meltdown is so damn entertaining. He’s had Adam Green from PCCC, the Socialist Bernie Sanders and some left-wingnut from grit tv, whatever that is. All of them are fit to be tied.

    This is so damn funny…

  280. BiW, the real humor is that we both thought of Rutherford and his PDS issues when we saw it.

    Its getting to the point where I don’t find it funny.

    If she does the smart thing and doesn’t throw her hat in the Presidential Nomination ring, will R and others like him continue to campaign against her like it is 2008 all over again?

    The fact that the usual suspects are still venting their spleen on her, sustaining her as a polarizing figure strikes me as an object lesson for conservatives in how to let your opponent define you…and if they can define you, they control the dialogue. Whether you love her or hate her, she’s damaged goods. Her value now is as a lightning rod. She can continue to distract and divert the attentions of the weak-mined and the venonmous on the Left. That is where she has the greatest value today.

  281. I have almost every intention of getting banned from that site so that I never make that mistake again.

    Tex, I second the directive from BiW, proceed to beat yourself…

  282. Hilarity, Tex. I love it when you can’t back up an argument and debate like an actual adult you resort to all kinds of name calling and such. Classic.

    You do realize Herod, king of the Jews, was trying to kill the Christ child when he set out killing all those kids, right? Priceless dude. PRICELESS!!

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 😆

  283. I love that you and Tex have this bond thing going on. I even love that you’ve found a kindred issue for debate, something you both apparently care deeply for.

    And while I love Tex like the internet brother I never had, I must admit that I have little patience for sermons. So, why don’t you two get a room?

    R, I’ve a suggestion for you. Create a page called the Cage for free for all debate (I know, most of your posts turn into free for all debates) that is concerned to only a couple of folks so the rest of us don’t have to sit through Bible school again.

    Please…

  284. Gorilla,

    You’re just going to have to forgive you older internet brother for this one, but I simply must answer an absolute imbecile like Poolman one last time. I’m not sure he’s lucid – too much chlorine sniffing, I think.

    You do realize Herod, king of the Jews, was trying to kill the Christ child when he set out killing all those kids, right? Priceless dude. PRICELESS!!

    Do you laugh out loud at funerals? WTH are you talking about? That was my point dummy which completely refutes your original statement!

    Do you have an older brother than goes by the name Yeller Dawg?

  285. Wow. Just tuned into MSNBC. This is priceless. The cognitive disonance surrounding their messiah seems to have reached its limits. . .

  286. I see someone posted Chen’s full name, work and address on his site. Maybe he doesn’t care…but someone should track him down and tell him. I would be horrified.

  287. QUOTE OF THE DAY: “My boyfriend, as I mentioned before, looks much more like a terrorist than either I or my son do, and he went through security with no problems. . . . The bag, and my friend, had passed through security with no issues. How is this full-body scan supposed to be making us safer if 6-inch gardening shears can still make it aboard domestic flights undetected?”

  288. Tex, that damn Margaret and Helen blog (hereinafter the Achilli Lauro blog) is proof there is no god.

    Both Margaret and Helen as pretty as Yasser Arafat too.

  289. You guys are right. They’re absolutely apoplectic on MSNBC tonight.

    Is it possible for Butch Madcow to actually be on the rag? 😳

  290. This what Poolman and his feckless dregs at Fat Granny’s think is major smackdown. 😆

    They forget, of course, everything Ann Coulter ever said about John Edwards turned out to be true – scumbag, phony, as sleaze ball, shyster. All proven now beyond a shadow of a doubt.

    Can you imagine if libs believe this is a smackdown, what a loss must feel like? No wonder they’re apoplectic on Poolman’s favorite show Keith Olbermann and Countdown to Ratings Death.

  291. Tex, don’t see how that refutes my statement at all. Moving on though, because I don’t want to upset an 800 pound gorilla looking for a place to stick that finger.

    Never laughed at funerals. Celebrated at some who wanted no sorrow and requested a joyous ceremony. They knew they were going on to Paradise. Never have liked funerals. What about those Phelps crazies protesting at funerals? Loons in my book. What get’s into folks?

    Don’t have an older brother. Just two younger ones. Neither go by “Yeller Dawg”. Guess I’ll have to find out what that’s all about. Is he a regular here?

    You consider Sharpton a hick? Interesting. I know a few that better fit that description. I’ve never been a Sharpton fan, though. Not too many celebrity preachers float my boat. I’ve even got doubts about Mother Theresa being who we all tout her to be. Maybe Rutherford had some valid info regarding her, hard to know. I had only read some interviews with folks that were involved with her and all the orphanages she set up. That was a while back, but it was quite damning. The jist was she wanted them kept that way for the media sympathy and the money draw. Hard to know with some of these celebs. I’m not the judger of the heart. Someday we’ll know.

    If you guys want McCain, you can have him. I use to think he had some integrity, but he long since lost that. The guy is just pathetic and my state just put him back up there. His daughter has more moxie than he does. Pathetic. He and Kyl are just the epitomy of dense. I used to write them all the time. They would always thank me and send me a buttload of propaganda, filling my mailbox with copy paper crap, explaining how great they were and that their proposals were really what I should support because, well because they were so much smarter than all of us that they represented. Sickening. Pompous asses. I finally quit writing and just sent them emails telling them how out of touch they are. Now I get the regular bs emails from them thanking me for my continued support. They don’t even read those things. Assholes!

  292. Poolman’s favorite show Keith Olbermann and Countdown to Ratings Death.

    Sorry, don’t watch much teevee at all. If I had a favorite show, it would likely be the Daily Show. Colbert is pretty good, too. If viewership is what you’re going for, I think Murdock’s poison is probably the most watched trash in the land right now. I got off the teevee addiction years ago. There isn’t any real news there. At least it can’t be trusted anywhere near 100 percent. Teevee’s all about ratings and advertising bucks. Who really cares about Bristol Palin, Lady Gaga, or Paris Hilton? Give me a break. You want a visual of what’s wrong with this country? Belly up to the boob tube and feast your eyes and ears on worthless gobbledygook 24/7. Grab some potato chips and a Dr. Pepper, or some processed cheese something. You are what you eat folks. Garbage in, garbage out.

  293. I use to think he had some integrity, but he long since lost that.

    So you voted for Mr. Integrity Barack Hussein Obama, hey? The same Obama that told us he never heard a word out of the irreverent Jeremiah Wright accusing the white race of introducing HIV into black neighborhoods, stood in front of Styrofoam Greek columns claiming king of the world, won’t release his supposed academic achievement, told us he’d oversee the most “transparent” administration ever, and never misses an opportunity to blame America?

    You’re confused about much.

  294. You want a visual of what’s wrong with this country?

    Then take a look at the Fat Granny’s blog. There’s a great microcosm of about everything that could be wrong. Lies, deceit, hate mongering, rank propaganda, jealousy, and abject stupidity.

  295. Yep, nearing 4 million hits over there. Too bad all of them won’t get to read all your words of wisdom. I’m sure your trail will leave an impact though. There are some fairly deep ruts.

  296. Yep, nearing 4 million hits over there. Too bad all of them won’t get to read all your words of wisdom. I’m sure your trail will leave an impact though. There are some fairly deep ruts

    Drudge can hit that in two hours. That wouldn’t make the top 1000. Insignificant with insignificant losers…you probably constitute a million of the hits.

  297. you probably constitute a million of the hits.

    Sorry. Figured you were smarter than that. Those are all unique IP addresses. I got plenty of machines, but not near that many.

  298. Just to clear the air, I really didn’t care all that much whether or not Bristol won DWTS. While I wouldn’t rule out organized Tea Party efforts to stuff the “ballot box”, it makes me sound like the ACORN hating asshats that populate this forum. 😛

    I think it is fair to say that everything Palin is designed to enhance Sarah’s standing. But you know something? I think you’ll see less Palin bashing from me because I see the tide turning. Even within the hollowed halls of the RL blog I see Palin tolerance thinning. AND finally, the GOP (and even the Tea Party itself apparently) is trying to find ways to sideline her.

    As my GOP heroine Nicolle Wallace has said, Palin will be her own undoing. 😀

  299. OMFG! Tex, you now take pot shots at old ladies? I just visited the blog and they’re on mobility scooters for heaven’s sake! ROTFLMAO … man you are really too much! 😆

  300. Okay, before Tex razzes me, which he will anyway, of course. I may have misspoke about the unique IP hits at the old lady blog. After I hit send, I thought. Hmmm. That is an awful lot of IPs in 3 plus years. Even though they are linked from plenty of leftie blogs. So I’ll guess I’m wrong. 😳

  301. I see someone posted Chen’s full name …

    Rabbit you must not have read the thread too carefully. Chen doesn’t seem to care and as I said over there, the info posted is obsolete and easily found on the Internet. It’s no biggie.

  302. For an old lady … Helen is pretty feisty!

    She IS quite feisty. Gets those conservatives really worked up. There are about 4 regular rw commenters on there that always get a rash from the other obvious dems. They are continually accussed of being trolls. We have had some interesting discussions in the two years I’ve been going there.

  303. Poolman, I may have to make an appearance over there but then again Helen and Margaret’s comment threads make mine look like puny little things … my comments would get lost in the fray.

  304. Sorry. Figured you were smarter than that. Those are all unique IP addresses. I got plenty of machines, but not near that many.

    Yeah, I see I need not correct you. Four million unique IP addresses.

    😆 😆 😆 😆 😆 :lol:.

    More like 400 unique I.D. addresses – maybe.

    If I were a betting man, I would guess your “technical expertise” Poolman stands at a few simple HTML tags. That’s what passes for expertise at Fat Granny and her hag friend.

  305. As usual, you speak out of ignorance…

    Tex, you now take pot shots at old ladies? I just visited the blog and they’re on mobility scooters for heaven’s sake! ROTFLMAO … man you are really too much!

    Never spoke to them in my life. They wouldn’t last two minutes. They hide behind grandson’s underwear and banning stick.

    I debate Mr. Poolman, the ‘HTML’ expert, and the rest of the mutts. Most of them at Fat Grannies are dumb as hell and easily befuddled; their the ones that threatened me with giving more money to the DNC. 😆 I reminded them on November 3rd they didn’t give enough.

    I encouraged them to give more, of course.

  306. “Tigre. . . you stated that Obama was the only one who kept bringing up his race. I can only guess that your attention was so invested in the GOP primary at the time that you just weren’t taking good notes on the Dem side.”

    Are you drunk posting (again)? I didn’t say that.

    I wish you had read and considered what I actually said/asked as well as what was meant.

    Direct your pretend outrage elsewhere.

    Gotta go. More later.

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