Three Liberal Landmines

March 30, 2014 at 6:17 am 918 comments

In the spirit of introspection, alluded to in my previous post, here are three thoughts on liberal landmines ranging from the trivial to the dead serious.

The Better Scandal

MSNBC spent the better part of the first two months of this year focused on one story: Bridgegate. Each prime-time show lead with some update on the New Jersey traffic snafu engineered by Chris Christie admin officials and appointees.  At first they tried to make hay of the possibility that an elderly woman died because her ambulance got stuck in the traffic jam caused by a bogus “traffic study”. Unfortunately, almost immediately a relative of the deceased woman said she didn’t blame Christie for the death, so MSNBC had to drop that bit of melodrama. In the backdrop was the fact that Christie was the only potential 2016 Republican candidate who was giving Hillary Clinton a run for her money. The obvious attempt of the network to discredit Hillary’s only real opposition was transparent — and disappointing to me, a long time fan of the network for their left-leaning but fair reporting.

Contrast this with Fox which for the better part of the past 18 months focused on Benghazi. Say what you will of the merits of the Benghazi “scandal”, four dead Americans including an ambassador trumps an amateur hour traffic jam any day of the week. If liberal news networks are going to go after Republicans they better come up with juicier stuff than Bridgegate.

A Drag on the Family

When conservatives compare our country to “the family” it usually sounds like grade school oversimplification.  The typical example is “why would you want your country in debt? You don’t want your family in debt do you?” I am pretty sure that many economists agree that a little debt is actually GOOD for a country while it may not be good for a family.

But I was thinking the other day about another country/family analogy and this one resonated a bit. Picture the family who is pretty normal except for that one loser who has never applied himself, never looked for a job and is always mooching off the other family members. The family either applies “tough love” and cuts him off or they go down the drain with him, constantly bailing him out.

I do not subscribe to the notion that all welfare recipients are lazy loafers, or in Paul-Ryan-speak, “takers”. But I am beginning to question whether the current welfare state discourages work. When I got laid off seven years ago, I did not apply for unemployment insurance because I wanted to start my own business and I assumed doing so would make me ineligible for assistance. When my wife applied for unemployment insurance after her layoff last year, one of my concerns was how this would affect her ability to earn money. From what I understand, she can make a small amount and still receive government assistance but a job that would pay only slightly more than the assistance we receive would make us ineligible. So living day-to-day, paycheck to paycheck, there is a disincentive to find at least a low paying job. In a sense you find yourself saying “I can’t afford to get a job”, as crazy as that may sound. And in this case we are talking about responsible people, my wife and I. If a hard-working person can’t afford to find a job imagine how a true loafer feels.

Welfare and unemployment insurance don’t allow you to live like a king (or the proverbial queen) so many conservative complaints about welfare recipients do  not resonate with me. Welfare recipients don’t live in swank penthouse apartments. But it is worth considering how government aid creates an unintentional disincentive to work.

Two approaches that come immediately to mind are workfare (not new) and mandatory health care assistance. How about the government paying your salary at a company instead of handing you a check while you’re not working? Basically you “volunteer” at a company — they pay nothing — and the gov pays you to work there. Time limits could be applied while you find a company who will pay you to work. In the area of mandatory health care assistance, how about legislation that forces any company with a health benefit plan, to continue to provide that benefit to any employee fired without cause (e.g. layoff)  for a period of two years while they search for employment.

The bottom line is liberals need to think outside the box, stop focusing on victimization of the poor, creating greater dependency, and find new creative ways to lift folks out of poverty. Creating a dependent class hurts those relegated to that class as well as the country that goes down the drain supporting them.

The New Jim Crow

The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in the Age of Colorblindness” by Michelle Alexander is a book that I shall never read. I had the distinct misfortune of seeing the author discuss her premise and one phrase she used, yes — one phrase, left me so irritated that I will not give her book a chance. In discussing the plight of young minority men going to prison for longer terms than their white counterparts (the crack vs powdered cocaine dichotomy, to name one) she said (very close paraphrase), “these young men go to jail and are labeled criminals”.

NO NO NO. They are not labeled criminals. They ARE criminals. When you break the law you are a criminal. While it is perfectly correct to make the punishment fit the crime, isn’t our time better spent getting folks to STOP committing the crime in the first place? Words have meaning. When you say someone is “labeled a criminal” the implication is that forces beyond his control have created his condition. There are folks in the ghetto who would sooner die than break the law. This notion that ghetto life ipso facto creates criminals is the most counter-productive condescension imaginable.

It reminds me of a battle I fought in the comments section of another blog where a woman said she “found herself pregnant”. Mind you, she was not raped. She was not the victim of incest. She got pregnant through unprotected consensual sexual intercourse. She willingly actively engaged in behavior that, on occasion, results in a pregnancy. Yet she “found herself pregnant” as though no action on her part was involved. A total surprise — the sperm genie visited her while she was sleeping. Puhleeeze.

The same goes for this “labeled a criminal”. Brotha didn’t do a damn thing and our terrible racist society “labeled” him a criminal. Bull crap. Liberals use language to abdicate responsibility for behavior. It is always someone else’s fault. Frankly I’m sick of it. There is this thing in business called “root cause analysis”. When you “find yourself pregnant” or get “labeled a criminal” by some evil third-party, you are not getting at the root cause. Stop unprotected screwing! Stop buying, selling and using illegal drugs! Those are the root causes of the problem.

The question that remains is, are liberals well-meaning in this obfuscation or actually more odious than the “cold-hearted conservatives” whom they regularly attack? The jury is out for me on that one. But I can tell you this much– libs need to change their language and their perspective on the “down-trodden”. Some folks get screwed over because they screwed themselves over. That is not a problem we can fix by demonizing rich white men.


About these ads

Entry filed under: Politics, Social commentary, Wordpress Political Blogs. Tags: , , , , , , , , .

Time for a Reset Bundy is a Surprise?

918 Comments Add your own

  • 1. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 9:13 am

    Crap. You are officially a conservative now. Who are we going to argue with?

    Remember, if you think unemployment checks tempt one to stay unemployed, imagine food stamps? Now we are talking some cash. And now the incentive is have more kids as well!

    Rutherford, I went an Illinois SNAP calculator and played with numbers. I promise you that more money is awaiting you guys.

  • 2. James  |  March 30, 2014 at 9:14 am

    I got as far as Benghazi and that paragraph filled me with rage making rational thought difficult. I have some experience with such things, and it still affects my emotions.

    HOW DARE YOU USE QUOTATION MARKS!?? As you wrote, do the Democrats and press not understand the difference between four dead Americans and other injured and people dying in traffic accidents ? Those men died because our own government put them in a dangerous position and lied about it. Hillary even lied to a surviving family.

    That paragraph refers to some of most sick and perverted minds I have seen on the internet or in print. The Democratic press used Bridge Gate because it was all they had. They don’t care.

    You might check NewsBusters “Bob Kerry Calls Obama a Delusional Liar, Renders Himself MSM Nonperson.” He wasn’t referring to the Benghazi SCANDAL, not “scandal”, but his description of Obama and fellow Democrats does apply to Benghazi,

    Another telling feature of our world is that the story appeared in the Daily Mail.

  • 3. parker  |  March 30, 2014 at 10:12 am

    May be duplicate comment. Prior did not post.

    Ran across this earlier tonight. Thought James might appreciate it.

  • 4. poolman  |  March 30, 2014 at 10:26 am

    I don’t subscribe to any mainstream media’s propaganda feed. And that is what it has been shown to be by many once inside these organizations. They are designed to keep us separated. They keep adding fuel to the us vs them meme. I scan the media for the latest circus or to discover their intended diversions.

    Let’s see if you can stick to your guns on this media revelation.


    Yes, dependency is not a pretty thing. When government promotes it, it lowers the bar across the entire nation. I’ve lived this generation of bell curves and bar- lowering. When high standards are lowered to be normalized, we all lose. What is so special about normal? Where is the incentive to excel?


    With the massive amount of laws we have on the books, it is impossible to not break a few. Law enforcement does not enforce all laws equally, for if they did we could all be labeled ‘criminal’.

    Some laws prohibit oral or anal sex, homosexual sex, and some even sex toys. Who enforces those?

    I see lawbreakers driving on the road everyday. Illegally driving in the HOV lane, Illegal dark front window tint, expired registrations, excessive speed violators, illegal lane changing, illegal parking etc. What about all the banks caught laundering drug money? Fined, but not incarcerated. How many bankers are in jail in this country for fraud or illegal activity? It’s been proven, yet the people generally get off.

    Some laws conflict other laws, ie: fed vs state, state vs municipal, man’s vs God’s.

    Then you have our supposed leaders, those tasked to uphold the law, involved in illegal activity on a grandiose scale. Just look to the NSA activity for starters.

    It is difficult to raise children to respect the law when their elders and leaders consistently don’t, and often are rewarded for not playing by the rules. The same difficulty applies to entitlements or privilege.

    Teach a child in the way they should go and when they are old they will not depart from it. It is important to lay down the ground rules early in life.

  • 5. Tex Taylor  |  March 30, 2014 at 10:27 am

    The question that remains is, are liberals well-meaning in this obfuscation or actually more odious than the “cold-hearted conservatives” whom they regularly attack?

    Let me ask you a fair question, Mr. Rutherford. Forget minorities for one moment. I want to talk about these so called heart filled limousine liberals always marketing themselves ‘for the poor.’ If you haven’t noticed over the years, you and I have been pretty much a constant – friends of a sort; we’ve both gone overboard in the heat of the moment to be sure and I have partial regrets over that causing an indelible stain on the relationship – passion does that unfortunately. But…

    Does it ever make you stop to think about a few things I’ve pointed out over the years about some of the white brethren of your political persuasion who have appeared here?

    To refresh your memory about one Graychin. How many times did Graychin refer to me as racist because I pointed out violent black crime statistics or black & Hispanic out-of-wedlock birth? How many times did Graychin call me an Islamophobe because I dared to point out acts of terrorism in the name of Allah? Called me a bigot because I dared to be of the opinion not all cultures equal in virtue and value?

    And yet, here’s a man that lives in a community with exactly zero black faces – gated communities where the closest minority are the Mexicans that mow the lawn and cook his Friday Night meals at El Bueno? Not a black face in the entire zipcode.

    Does it ever give you pause that maybe as an educated black man with an Ivy League degree, you’re still naive enough to believe the smoke and mirror routine about the “Left White’s” real compassion about minority in this country?

    What’s so compassionate about never providing an out, by providing just enough subsistence to create a dependency?

    Tell me. What exactly have these white liberals and academicians done to improve the lot of black America – besides telling the race hustlers what they want to hear and enriching them?

    What has Barack Obama really done? Does his simply being half black excuse his failures? Or does it make you angry to be lied to, no matter the efficacy of melatonin?

    I’m really serious about this. Give it some thought.

  • 6. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 10:32 am

    I already did my part for Scandinavia. Tough job, but someone had to do it.

  • 7. parker  |  March 30, 2014 at 11:27 am

    Nice, thoughtful post, Rutherford. Accept my apology for previous chides.

    regards: Better Scandal. A very negative concept, leading to nowhere. Cutting down your opponent does not make you taller, and real leadership does not engage in a race to the bottom. Your country’s real problem is a lack of moral integrity in its politicians and news organizations – although most are not as bad as Newscorp and its bastard offspring, Fox News, one of AU’s most damaging exports. See noblesse oblige:

    or another word might be “duty.”

    regards: “drag” – periods of bad luck happen to us all, and some end up on public assistance. It is a perfect time for the government to engage in some good works: If they create jobs for the unemployed, make half of the workday dedicated to retraining – and not in social science, psychology or “counselling.” HVAC, bricklaying, electrician’s helper, electrician, drywall, carpenter. Doubt “community organizer” would qualify.

    regards: Jim Crow – agree, but in US, criminal sentences are extremely long and could be reduced because the expense is enormous. In US in 1800’s a long sentence would be four years. Any longer and they just hanged you.

    You touched nicely on “root causes.” Changing evanescent things like culture is very hard, but failing that, the rest doesn’t matter. Long sentences, harsh penalties, death penalty don’t fix the problem, because unless the culture in some of these areas is changed, the next generation is going to make exactly the same mistakes again. It takes real leaders. MLK Jr had what it takes and minced no words about bastardy, “living in sin,” having high standards for oneself, obligation to honor one’s parents, etc. The whiteys that cheered his demise were fools. They are now reaping the rewards of his assassination.

  • 8. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 3:02 pm

    “It takes real leaders. MLK Jr had what it takes and minced no words about bastardy, “living in sin,” having high standards for oneself, obligation to honor one’s parents, etc.” -Pfarker

    Spoken by the man that almost daily mocks the blue print MLK got his standards from.

    Laughable, mate.

    “God is a fairy tale and Christian morality is prudish”. Followed by “the demise of this country is fading belief in Christian morality”.

    Celebrating the irony of religion by way of Celtic Pagan Solstice Parties might be fun but it doesn’t replace the hole you dug.

    Impossible to square oneself without a level.

  • 9. poolman  |  March 30, 2014 at 3:30 pm

  • 10. James  |  March 30, 2014 at 3:31 pm

    I like it Parker. Good work dead rabbit. The world needs more Scandinavians.

    I’m checking out for now. The Sprint Cup race is on and Jimmy Johnson is leading,

  • 11. Huck  |  March 30, 2014 at 4:52 pm

    “The bottom line is liberals need to think outside the box, stop focusing on victimization of the poor, creating greater dependency, and find new creative ways to lift folks out of poverty. \”

    This is never going to happen, because, quite simply, liberals WANT people to be dependent on them.

    They know that without dependent victims they will never win another election.

  • 12. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 6:19 pm

    Very cynical take Huck. I have more to say on this later.

  • 13. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 6:29 pm

    James, you had a very traumatic war experience and it’s never my intention to trigger those memories. Whether you like it or not Benghazi is spun from both extremes.

    Right now I’m reading “The Benghazi Hoax” by the liberal leaning Media Matters. Here is my pledge to you. I will read it with a critical eye and if they don’t make their case I will state so here in these pages.

    I do hope you read the rest of my piece. I think, for a change, there might be some things here you and I will agree on.

  • 14. El Tigre  |  March 30, 2014 at 6:52 pm

    Huck’s right. Modern liberalism requires the victim and an oppressor. Victimization and redistribution is what makes liberals feel benevolent protectors as well.

  • 15. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 6:53 pm

    Regarding the prison system — a total clusterfuck. It’s now profit driven. The poor don’t get the same justice as the rich. We incarcerate more than any other developed nation. All this deserves its own blog post and someone else can write it.

    My interest is root cause. Focusing on how we punish distracts from crime PREVENTION. Making sentences more palatable concedes that these folks are lost causes who will commit crime regardless.

    Let’s stop the crime by creating a society of opportunity that discourages desperation.

  • 16. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 6:57 pm

    “This is never going to happen, because, quite simply, liberals WANT people to be dependent on them.” -Hucking

    I don’t think its true of liberals. Most liberals either are liberal because of shallow reasons (its really unhip not to be) or completely naive how the world really works.

    Now liberal politicians? Hucking is dead right. They recruit people for food stamps in Mexico for shit’s sake. Liberal politicians live and die on dependency. It’s why I loath them from the pit of my stomach and why no liberal will ever have an honest conversation about urban America.

  • 17. James  |  March 30, 2014 at 7:08 pm

    Thanks Rutherford. Yes, I read the rest of what you wrote and agree with much of it, at least partially.

    As rabbit wrote, you are sounding more conservative.

    Another changeling is France. The FN party is gaining strength and shifting conservative parties a bit further to the right. They are winning elections and say they love Ted Cruse Other movements are gaining strength in several European countries.

    Bill Maher exposed several liberals for their hypocracy. He read a quote they interpreted to be racist because Maher said Paul Ryan Then, he sprung his trap. The quote was from Michele Obama. I wish we had cable.

    A letter to the editor I wrote is in Vietnam Veterans of America. I nearly threw the magazine away before I saw the letter.

    The left is besieged now, and it is a good thing.

  • 18. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 7:12 pm

    Rabbit went where I wanted to go with one exception. Yes we have to differentiate between plain folk and politicians. I don’t believe the average liberal Joe matches Huck’s cynical take. Politicians are another breed.

    But here is where Rabbit goes wrong. GOP POLITICIANS want corporations and the military industrial complex dependent on them.

    All politicians are drug dealers. The only difference is the clientele and the drug of choice.

  • 19. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 7:20 pm

    James every now and then Maher, a basic asshole, says something brave. I watched that segment where Maher sprung the “Michelle trap”. Comic Kamau Bell’s response was quite telling. He basically said blacks can only be honest about blacks with other blacks. He said it with a laugh but it’s true. And it’s sad.

  • 20. Rutherford  |  March 30, 2014 at 7:22 pm

    Rabbit the only problem with your food stamp comment is that most of the folks on food stamps are the WORKING poor. What does that say about our employers and earning a decent wage?

  • 21. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 8:25 pm

    Rutherford…..families with a mother and father make up only 8% of food stamp recipients. Single mothers make up 42 percent of all food stamp families.

    For the sake of argument, I will just accept your GOP comment ( you do need to explain yourself more later). Who cares?

    Democrats need personal dependency and that destroys families and leaves thousands of kids shot dead every year. It also skews elections and creates situations where people vote for free stuff.

    An informed and free people have the power to destroy lobby groups and oligarchy. Even the “Military Industrial Complex”. The Military Industrial Complex doesn’t vote. People do.

    Can big business pour money into elections and skew things? Yes. But, considering the entire country is linked up via social networks, each one of us now a media conglomerate and have the power of information at our finger tips, nothing should be able to stop free people with morals. Nothing.

    Free people with family values are the enemy of liberal politicians.

    I don’t care if Wallmart is the GOP (look at their lobby record by the way….warm and toasty when it comes to dependency). Shit don’t compare to the destruction and misery progressives have brought upon this country.

    Liberalism is a cancer. Its the dark side of the force. And you even feel it’s magnetic pull as that voice in your head says why should she take that job. I’ve been there myself.

  • 22. dead rabbit  |  March 30, 2014 at 8:36 pm

    “GOP POLITICIANS want corporations and the military industrial complex dependent on them.”

    I can’t let it go. Of course the military is dependent on government? Wtf?

    As for corporations, both sides compete for the money. More like the other way around….people running for office tend to be dependent on corporations.

    As for the GOP wanting business dependent on them….that’s a weird thing to say. Business funds the government. Its where all our stuff comes from.

    If you think a man running a business who wants the government to stay out of his way is seeking “dependence” when he hopes for that liberty then you have a very odd interpretation of the word.

    Nah man….your throwing smoke bombs.

    Liberal politicians killed the family and survive on the dependent and victim class. Make more victims. Make more dependent people. Win more elections.

  • 23. Huck  |  March 30, 2014 at 9:39 pm

    “Yes we have to differentiate between plain folk and politicians.”

    I thought my mention of winning elections implied such a differentiation.

  • 24. Huck  |  March 30, 2014 at 9:42 pm

    “GOP POLITICIANS want corporations and the military industrial complex dependent on them.”

    Is that why Democrats have never bailed out any corporations and have cut the military budget without being forced to with sequester?

    Oh wait…none of that is actually true, is it?


  • 25. Tex Taylor  |  March 30, 2014 at 11:46 pm

    Bears repeating the scorecard:

    The Bush administration task force “obtained over 1,300 corporate fraud convictions, including those of over 130 corporate vice presidents and over 200 CEOs and corporate presidents.”

    “Clinton’s DOJ prosecuted over 1,800 S&L (savings and loans) executives, senior officials, and directors, and over 1,000 of them were sent to jail.”

    But despite having “promised more of the same,” especially in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis, the Obama administration’s DOJ has not brought criminal charges against a single major Wall Street executive.

    That head is still deep in the sand.


    P.S. Mr. Rutherford.

    Don’t you epitomize one of the many perceived problems with Obamacare as enrollee? Its basic premise is that the young and healthy would subsidize the new system to make it both affordable and cheaper in the aggregate

    How do you and your wife make it either?

  • 26. James  |  March 31, 2014 at 9:03 am

    Yes, hard-working families survive on food stamps, and some are traditional two-parent families. Many are not.

    How did they get that way? They made bad choices. They didn’t study in school, and they did not prepare themselves with the skills they need to earn a middle class income. Some have bad habits or they don’t manage their money well. As a result, they are not asset producers as businesses are. They are dependents, and as such they must survive on what the government gives them.

    They are natural pets of whichever political party promises more. Therefore, Democrats need them to stay in office. Of course, my description doesn’t apply to everyone. Many people are in their positions because of bad luck or location, but I know people as I described, and they surely are not unique.

    Our son and his well-paid fellow computer workers in Silicon Valley discuss politics. He has noticed they agree with many conservative principles, while still voting Democratic. They cannot defend many Democratic policies because they are ignorant and have internalized their political allegiance. Low information voters is another term for ignorant voters.

    Vallery Jarret said in an interview that the administration has been asking entertainment writers, actors, sports figures etc. to insert administration policy ads in their shows. For example, Grey’s Anatomy which our daughter likes, had a sick man who’s girl friend said he should have sought treatment sooner. He replied “that was before ObamaCare.” Rachael Ray apparently shilled for ObamaCare and created a mini back lash.

    The administration is using entertainment because it knows many of its constituents are ignorant.

    Businesses also get subsidies from the government, but Democrats are more interested in ignorant voters because they outnumber business executives.

  • 27. muffy  |  March 31, 2014 at 9:54 am

    Tex @ #325 – The ACA was also supposed to insure the uninsured.

    Because you and me were living like kings.

  • 28. James  |  March 31, 2014 at 10:05 am

    Rutherford, please read “US consulate attack in Benghazi: a challenge to official version of events” by Chris Stephen of the Guardian. Monday September 9, 2013.

  • 29. muffy  |  March 31, 2014 at 10:09 am

    “The question that remains is, are liberals well-meaning in this obfuscation or actually more odious than the “cold-hearted conservatives” whom they regularly attack? The jury is out for me on that one.”

    The jury eh? Who are you to weigh the hearts of men?

    This is how liberals fix the little problem of Biden and Reid and LBJ being the bigots they really were and are. You all somehow know their hearts.

    So much for introspection.

  • 30. Tex Taylor  |  March 31, 2014 at 10:47 am

    So far, about 4 of every 5 people enrolling have qualified for tax credits to reduce the cost of their premiums.

    Yep, Muffy. Living like kings and queens, we are. Those tax credits must be another of those “free things” libs are always talking about.

  • 31. Tex Taylor  |  March 31, 2014 at 1:37 pm


    We may be old, but we ain’t dumb. Speaking of rigged like we have many a time before…did you see this?

    The one thing it doesn’t provide is names. I would be very interested in who benefited..

  • 32. Rutherford  |  March 31, 2014 at 5:39 pm

    Muffy sometimes you are one weird chick. I’ve never seen you bat an eye when Rabbit calls libs evil. He can see into hearts and I can’t?

    Besides you’re arguing about what I didn’t say. The jury is out means I can’t see into liberal hearts. I can’t swear to their intentions. All I can do is observe when I think they’re off track.

  • 33. James  |  March 31, 2014 at 6:40 pm

    It depends on one’s definition of evil.

    The liberals I met during the Vietnam war were self absorbed with little concern for human life out side of their chosen affiliates. I thought I was sick to believe they were evil and over time associated with liberals to change my mind.

    Many liberals are nice people, but a percentage represented by some on the other site fit my definition of evil. Some may believe they are doing the right thing, but when the results kill or otherwise hurt people good intentions are not enough to make them good people. I relearned a truth they taught me when I stepped off the plane in April, 1970.

  • 34. muffy  |  March 31, 2014 at 7:30 pm

    Rutherford there are two kinds of people that watch MSNBC. People who want to hear non-stop judgmental carping about their political opponents because it makes them feel better about themselves. And people who want to know what the morons over at MSNBC are yammering about now.

    I can’t help it if libs are everything they say they hate.

    PS…the jury is out implies that such a thing is knowable, but hasn’t been decided yet. It does NOT mean that you realize that you can’t judge motives, only actions. I know you think that you can, or you’d probably stop worrying about them.

    But for a lib to stop worrying about motives is a direct violation of about half the rules for libtardom right there.

  • 35. muffy  |  March 31, 2014 at 7:33 pm

    So the Redford/Sarandon death row ripoff is 4 for 4 on innocent people wrongly convicted.


  • 36. an800lbgorilla  |  March 31, 2014 at 8:36 pm

    This kind-of destroys R’s meme…

    WASHINGTON (AP) — Republicans are the party of the rich, right? It’s a label that has stuck for decades, and you’re hearing it again as Democrats complain about GOP opposition to raising the minimum wage and extending unemployment benefits.

    But in Congress, the wealthiest among us are more likely to be represented by a Democrat than a Republican. Of the 10 richest House districts, only two have Republican congressmen. Democrats claim the top six, sprinkled along the East and West coasts. Most are in overwhelmingly Democratic states like New York and California.

    The richest: New York’s 12th Congressional District, which includes Manhattan’s Upper East Side, as well as parts of Queens and Brooklyn. Democrat Carolyn Maloney is in her 11th term representing the district.

    Per capita income in Maloney’s district is $75,479. That’s more than $75,000 a year for every man, woman and child. The next highest income district, which runs along the southern California coast, comes in at $61,273. Democrat Henry Waxman is in his 20th term representing the Los Angeles-area district.

    House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi’s San Francisco district comes in at No. 8.

    Across the country, Democratic House districts have an average per capita income of $27,893. That’s about $1,000 higher than the average income in Republican districts. The difference is relatively small because Democrats also represent a lot of poor districts, putting the average in the middle.

  • 37. dead rabbit  |  March 31, 2014 at 9:22 pm

    Democrats are so vile, they think unleashing illegal alien criminals on us is a smart political calculation. I despise liberalism .

  • 38. James  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:36 am

    A nurse revealed an ugly secret when Obama was an Illinois state senator. Aborted babies which survived the procedure were left in corners to die. Legislation was proposed to deal with the situation, and Obama was one of the most vocal and mostly the only person to oppose the legislation.

    “The world was on fire and no one could save me but you
    Its strange what desire will make foolish people do…
    What a wicked game to play, to make me feel this way
    What a wicked thing to say, you never felt this way.”

    Chris Isaak “Wicked Game.”

  • 39. James  |  April 1, 2014 at 9:23 am

    Rutherford, “Cia officer confirmed no protests before misleading Benghazi account given” The Washington Times Monday March 31, 2014.

  • 40. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 11:01 am

    James, this is nothing but a phoney, nothingburger scandal manufactured by Fox News and the unAmerican Darryl Issa…just like the IRS, who won’t produce subpenaed documents until—you guessed it—after the next election.

    Seriously dude…what difference at this point does it make?

  • 41. Tex Taylor  |  April 1, 2014 at 1:03 pm

    Seriously dude…what difference at this point does it make?

    Besides slamming Rutherford for abject ignorance? Not much I can see. However, I’m still going to keep reminding these self-identifying rubes who put Obama in office just how wrong they were twice. Obama is no mediocre President. He’s the sorriest excuse for President this country has ever seen. A rank joke.

    The Dissing of the President

  • 42. an800lbgorilla  |  April 1, 2014 at 4:44 pm

    The obvious attempt of the network to discredit Hillary’s only real opposition was transparent — and disappointing to me, a long time fan of the network for their left-leaning but fair reporting.” – R

    And in just three words the credibility disintegrates. MSDNC is many things, but fair, balanced or legitimate it is not.

    The rest of this is interesting and mildly surprising considering the source. Talk is cheap though. If this is what you believe and espouse, then what are you going to do about it?

  • 43. dead rabbit  |  April 1, 2014 at 5:15 pm

    So Rutherford, you in the end zone spiking the football with President Obama over the success of Obamacare?

    Huge success. You should write a blog on it.

    Ha ha.

  • 44. Rutherford  |  April 1, 2014 at 5:17 pm

    James let me repeat again. Obama opposed superfluous legislation. Leaving babies to die was already illegal. He saw no reason to put another law on the books for an already prohibited practice.

    If you really think Barack Obama wants babies to be “put in a corner” to die, then your view of the man is beyond twisted. You need to check yourself or stop reading World Nut Daily.

  • 45. muffy  |  April 1, 2014 at 6:07 pm


    The law did not require doctors who perform abortions to care for those who survived. Instead, the law required that a second doctor be present at the abortion to provide such care if the abortionist determined beforehand that the fetus was “viable.” Thus, the law provided little protection for those who were not deemed “viable” in the “judgment” of the abortionist. Consequently, aborted infants in Illinois sometimes lived for hours after birth while being abandoned to die without any care or comfort provided to them.

    All of the legislation in question was applicable to humans who are “born alive” after “complete expulsion or extraction” from their mothers. Hence, these are not fetuses but newborns. Notice in the following statement about this issue how the Royal College of Obstetricians uses the word “fetus” before birth and the word “baby” afterwards:

    If the fetus has had a lethal injection, it will normally die. However, there are some instances when there are signs of life at birth. All babies must be treated with dignity and respect. Palliative care should be provided till the baby dies where relevant.

    In sum, Obama voted against three bills stating that anyone “born alive at any stage of development” is considered a “person” under Illinois state law including those born as a result of “abortion.” He did this in the face of sworn testimony from Illinois nurses who witnessed aborted newborns living and being neglected for up to eight hours after birth. These are the straightforward and unadorned facts of the matter.

  • 46. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 7:16 pm

    “He saw no reason to put another law on the books for an already prohibited practice.”

    I remember when you scoffed at this argument when we used it in the gun control debates.

  • 47. Rutherford  |  April 1, 2014 at 7:19 pm

    Well Gorilla for starters I’m hoping the Republicans give me a good excuse not to vote for Hillary in 2016.

    But it’s kinda funny your saying talk is cheap. What is a blog other than talk? Unless of course you’d like me to burn down the nearest abortion clinic. Sorry, I don’t roll that way.

    Oh, and yes there was a time when MSNBC was a better source of the truth than Fox News. Not so much lately.

  • 48. Rutherford  |  April 1, 2014 at 7:22 pm

    Rabbit, too early to call the game on Obamacare. You’re just as foolish to rejoice in its “failure” as I would be to spike the ball.

  • 49. Just a Lurker  |  April 1, 2014 at 7:26 pm

    “Obama’s critics are free to speculate on his motives for voting against the bills, and postulate a lack of concern for babies’ welfare. But his stated reasons for opposing “born-alive” bills have to do with preserving abortion rights, a position he is known to support and has never hidden.
    – by Jess Henig”

    “While we don’t have a record of Obama’s 2003 comments on SB 1082, he did express his objection to the 2001 and 2002 bills.

    Obama, Senate floor, 2002: [A]dding a – an additional doctor who then has to be called in an emergency situation to come in and make these assessments is really designed simply to burden the original decision of the woman and the physician to induce labor and perform an abortion. … I think it’s important to understand that this issue ultimately is about abortion and not live births.

    Obama, Senate floor, 2001: Number one, whenever we define a previable fetus as a person that is protected by the equal protection clause or the other elements in the Constitution, what we’re really saying is, in fact, that they are persons that are entitled to the kinds of protections that would be provided to a – a child, a nine-month-old – child that was delivered to term. That determination then, essentially, if it was accepted by a court, would forbid abortions to take place. I mean, it – it would essentially bar abortions, because the equal protection clause does not allow somebody to kill a child, and if this is a child, then this would be an antiabortion statute.”

  • 50. El Tigre  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:08 pm

    Sorry. Not feeling much introspection from R here. Seems more admitting, or, more accurately readmitting, some of the flawed logic and unhelpful caricatures of the left that we’ve seen already (while renewing others).

    Maybe I expected too much in thinking of a reexamination of the proper role of government or political philosophy — or hell, an examination of it at all.

  • 51. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:18 pm

    “I’m hoping the Republicans give me a good excuse not to vote for Hillary in 2016.”

    And thus begins the extended framing process that ultimately concludes with Rutherford again voting for a democrat and blaming it on republicans

  • 52. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:20 pm

    “You’re just as foolish to rejoice in its “failure””

    Yeah..rejoicing is what he does here when he talks of copays, deductibles and epipens….

  • 53. Rutherford  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:25 pm

    Tigre, you go in ready to be disappointed. I wasn’t expecting a positive review from you regardless of what I wrote.

  • 54. muffy  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:28 pm

    JAL – The only one I see speculating on motives here with regard to the babies-not-babies dying in the corner is Rutherford. James just said that Obama opposed the law, which he did.

    No abortion shall be performed or induced when the fetus is viable unless there is in attendance a physician other than the physician performing or inducing the abortion who shall take control of and provide immediate medical care for any child born alive as a result of the abortion.

    Obama’s perspective is essentially the same as Dr. Gosnell’s. The Gosnell defense hinged upon the witnesses to the babies-not-babies out of the womb, and only one of the many witnesses was a doctor. By design. This law would have put a second doctor in the room.

    Doctors are frequently called to the stand to give expert testimony….

  • 55. Rutherford  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:29 pm

    So Huck, two things. First, nice way of avoiding the fact that the GOP has twice in a row nominated unappealing candidates.

    Second, if you really think Rabbit (or any of you really) wanted ACA to work you’re fooling yourself. All of you have been actively rooting against the law since its inception.

  • 56. muffy  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:32 pm

    “And thus begins the extended framing process that ultimately concludes with Rutherford again voting for a democrat and blaming it on republicans.”

    Because Romney would have been worse.

    That’s a quote.

  • 57. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:33 pm

    “Second, if you really think Rabbit (or any of you really) wanted ACA to work you’re fooling yourself. All of you have been actively rooting against the law since its inception.”

    Nice way of avoiding all of the problems that DR expresses repeatedly.

    “First, nice way of avoiding the fact that the GOP has twice in a row nominated unappealing candidates.”

    In retrospective comparison to the Barack Obama that you see before you today–April 1, 2014–what was so unappealing about Mitt Romney?

  • 58. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:42 pm

    Rutherford…why don’t you just admit the obvious–and logical?

    You don’t find Republican candidates appealing because you’re a Democrat.

    Oh wait..I know why you don’t do that. Because you know we will ultimately expect you to defend your choice later. And you can’t…

  • 59. El Tigre  |  April 1, 2014 at 8:53 pm

    Sorry R. Just callin’ likes I sees them. And no, I didn’t come in expecting to be disappointed in the least.

    It would help if the discussion had more analysis.

    For example, “I am pretty sure that many economists agree that a little debt is actually GOOD for a country while it may not be good for a family.”

    What do you mean by this, especially when we’re dealing trillions? What debt? Is all debt “GOOD” for the country? If so, how? What are you advocating?

    I see that you claim conservatives as oversimplifying something, then don’t address it. Rather, you take the oversimplified analogy and apply it to a stereotype as though saying something about what the left perceives as a protected class must count for something.

  • 60. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 9:01 pm

    I can’t help but notice that Obama picked April Fools Day to declare his signature legislation a success…..

  • 61. Huck  |  April 1, 2014 at 9:07 pm

    “a little debt”


    And therein lies the problem…..

  • 62. an800lbgorilla  |  April 1, 2014 at 9:14 pm

    Too bad he wasn’t a math major…or an honest actor…

    A triumphant President Barack Obama declared Tuesday his signature medical insurance overhaul a success, saying it has made America’s health care system ‘a lot better’ in a Rose Garden press conference.

    But buried in the 7.1 million enrollments he announced in a heavily staged appearance is a more unsettling reality.

    Numbers from a RAND Corporation study that has been kept under wraps suggest that barely 858,000 previously uninsured Americans – nowhere near 7.1 million – have paid for new policies and joined the ranks of the insured by Monday night. [...]

    Like everything else from this Administration, more lies, wrapped in untruths, smothered with more lies…

  • 63. El Tigre  |  April 1, 2014 at 9:21 pm

    “Second, if you really think Rabbit (or any of you really) wanted ACA to work you’re fooling yourself. All of you have been actively rooting against the law since its inception.”

    Damn right we were because it can’t “work.”

    Your concept of “working” is itself the problem. Or are you still clinging to the free lunch Obama promised?

    You should be horrified that Obama is claiming it as a success with a totally made up 7.1 million figure to boot. how that doesn’t bother you mystifies me.

    Not really. The truth is you’ll root for it no matter how much of a failure it is or how many people it hurts.

  • 64. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 12:36 am

    The ease with which leftists, especially Obama and his groupies, lie is mind boggling. I knew the ACA claims today were a mountain of dung. Little did I know it was reaching to the heights of Everest…

    If you apply that math to the RAND figures, you get this: of the people who have paid their first month’s premium on the Obamacare exchanges, and are thereby enrolled in coverage, 76 percent were previously insured, and 24 percent were previously uninsured.

    RAND: Only One-Third Of Obamacare Exchange Sign-Ups Were From The Previously Uninsured

  • 65. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 8:12 am

    I think this April Fool’s propaganda/lie orchestration is going to back fire badly this time.

    Sure, President Obama desperately relies on an ignorant population. And sure, bull shit like yesterday works for guys like Rutherford, incapable at even seeing that while he counts as one of the 7 million, he is actually fucking anti-matter for the government scheme. He might make a great stat for an afternoon lie, but Rutherford tallies not Plus 1, but minus 20.

    “Yeah…..I got Obamacare bitches!”

    Yeah! Death spiral bitches.

    There are too many on the losing end of this scheme. At the very least, good socialism is able to create a situation where it is perceived that more winners are created then losers before it’s inevitable demise a generation or two later. Obamacare doesn’t do that.

    It’s not just socialism. Its very, very bad socialism.

    Obama’s normal lie strategy wont work. It is an absolute torpedo into the side of the middle class and a toothless joke for the lower class.

    Jay Carney should quit right now. Even the state media will be forced to question that insulting garbage they pretended was some sort of victory for the American people.

    Women can’t be so helpless and dependent that free birth control is all it takes for them to salute the asshole liars on the quarterdeck and come aboard a ship that is sinking in port, can they?

  • 66. James  |  April 2, 2014 at 8:19 am

    Ha Ha Huck.

    Thanks Muffy. I didn’t have time to write anything beyond memory . As Lurker wrote this was as much about abortion as it was live births

    ..Obama’s views are public record as noted. He either didn’t think or care about the implications, or he is so callous that he, not I needs to talk to someone.

    I for one knew the ACA law would fail because I read the bill I also heard our Senator Tom Harkin and also Obama say that this was part of the road to single payer insurance. It would take ten or twenty years to achieve.

    Ezekial Immanuel one of the designers, said it was fair to neglect old and very sick people in favor of younger and healthier patients because the discriminated against were once young and healthy. Obama also said it might be better for an old person to take a pill than to get full treatment.

    I also knew about the British and Canadian systems which have problems.

    Our daughter and her co- workers will pay an extra $5,000. this year, and she may not be able to keep her insurance. Obama and the Democrats lied to us, and they are lying now. Their enrolement figures are suspicious, and include other than first time insurance purchasers. Many people are suffering for the good of a relatively few.

    This bloated monstrosity will add to our deficite as the CBO estimated, and it will hurt full-time job creation. Why would one not oppose such a law? We didn’t hope it would fail, we knew it would fail.

  • 67. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 8:20 am

    By the way, I can not believe the new all time low that was set between a president and his people on April Fools afternoon.

    Maybe I’m being silly, but considering that was one of the most brazen acts of arrogance in terms of propaganda I have ever seen, I can’t believe they chose April Fools Day to do it.

    You know there was a discussion about that.

    My only guess is they wanted to get the lies out before the backlash is unleashed today. With some of the respected studies looming, its better to just lie to the people now in the hope Johnny Ignorance goes back to his life convinced everything is OK because dear leader told him it is. Health Insurance is boring as fuck after all.

  • 68. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 10:44 am

    Well said, my man….

    The Rights’s 20 Rules of Racism

  • 69. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 2:59 pm

    I read that the 7 million number is based on total enrolled. That can’t be true can it? They count dependents in that number?

    If so….if you subtract the Rutherford’s, who come on board with expensive preexisting conditions, the kids who generate nothing to support the scheme, the people who didn’t get to keep their insurance and the people who never made a payment…..seriously….what are we left with?
    No wonder the rest of us are getting screwed so bad. This is very inefficient communism.

    This really is a trap set to hurt people with a goal of single payer. Liars.

    I despise lying liberals. And all of them are.

    Rutherford cares more about us wanting to be correct then the fact we are correct.

    Sucks living in the crystal ball of a conservative alarmist back in 2008.

  • 70. El Tigre  |  April 2, 2014 at 3:05 pm

    Again, Rabbit, wait until the policies purchased through the exchange reflect the reality of the enrollment. Holy shit. We’ll never hear from Rutherford again.

    (well, we’ll probably never hear from him after the midterms anyway. It’s always been about cheerleading and affirmation not politics or policy).

  • 71. Rutherford  |  April 2, 2014 at 4:15 pm

    The short answer Rabbit if you were paying attention is yes the 7.1 million are total folks who signed up for a plan but who may or may not have paid the first premium.

    I have not paid the first premium because I haven’t been billed. The o-care web site does not do billing. The only stat Obama can tout is sign ups through the web site. They can only quote paid folks using downstream data from the insurance companies.

  • 72. Rutherford  |  April 2, 2014 at 4:15 pm

    Hey you know what Tigre, fuck you.

  • 73. Huck  |  April 2, 2014 at 4:22 pm

    “I read that the 7 million number is based on total enrolled. That can’t be true can it? They count dependents in that number?”

    We have no idea what is being counted.

    People who couldn’t keep their existing plan?
    People previously uninsured?
    People who paid their first premium?
    Young, healthy people?

    Nobody knows.

    In fact, it was just a couple weeks ago the administration was telling us it had no idea how many people were enrolled, and wasn’t even real clear on how they might go about finding out.

    And then…like magic…a number came out of thin air…..7.1 million. That .1 was a real in-your-face move, too. Not only did they meet their goal…they EXCEEDED it, bitches!

    Without even counting yesterday, Barack Obama has lied so much I don’t know how anyone can believe a word the man says. I’m talking outright LIES.

  • 74. Rutherford  |  April 2, 2014 at 4:55 pm

    I plead guilty of lack of rigor in the post. Apparently Tigre wanted a research paper complete with footnotes.

    I HAVE heard economists say that some gov debt is good. I didn’t take the time to find references.

    Again it is amazing how Tigre focuses on where I differ with GOP analogies but ignores where I find the analogies may have some traction.

  • 75. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 5:21 pm

    “I have not paid the first premium because I haven’t been billed’. -R

    Well….we have…..your welcome.

  • 76. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 5:22 pm

    “Without even counting yesterday, Barack Obama has lied so much I don’t know how anyone can believe a word the man says.” -Hucking

    Yesterday was a whopper though.

  • 77. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 5:53 pm

    “I HAVE heard economists say that some gov debt is good.” -R

    So is having a glass of red wine a day. What’s your point, chowda-head?

  • 78. Rutherford  |  April 2, 2014 at 5:56 pm

    Oh please Rabbit. My health care is more expensive than yours but there are folks with more expensive health care than mine and I don’t mind sharing their burden.

    And by the way that has ALWAYS been the foundation of group health insurance. The insurance company’s burden spread among those enrolled. Whatever the Detroit (or whatever) school system takes out of your check helps others. It always has.

    If you don’t want shared burden in society get off the grid, grow your own food, and heal thyself when you get sick.

  • 79. Rutherford  |  April 2, 2014 at 5:57 pm

    The point Bunny was that some GOP analogies work and some don’t.

  • 80. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 6:41 pm

    Debt is only good, Mr. “R”, when the debt borrowed is used to create a rate of return greater than the interest paid on the debt – No matter whether private or public.

    Reagan’s debt could be argued beneficial because his administration produced $17 trillion of new net worth over eight years accumulating $1.8 trillion in debt – a nice return.

    Obama’s $7.1 trillion of debt has produced little or nothing except for the very rich, and certainly not enough to offset middle class wage reduction. The aggregate country has actually grown poorer over the last five years.

    Now that may seem unfair on my behalf, but I would remind you Mr. Reagan also inherited a deep recession. :neutral:

  • 81. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 6:44 pm


    I’m glad you got insurance. I really am after what you and your Mrs. have dealt with over the last couple of years. I was concerned when your wife lost your job not because of a lack of cash, but exposure to huge medical risk.

    However, that doesn’t change the fact this monstrosity is bad for the country.

    Don’t take my undying criticism of Obama my wish to inflict bad will on guys like you – even if you did vote for this scum bag (twice). :smile:

  • 82. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 6:45 pm

    her job… :oops:

  • 83. James  |  April 2, 2014 at 6:45 pm

    I agree with Rutherford. I don’t remember where I heard it, but I know some economists think a little debt is good. That doesn’t apply now. We have much more than a little debt.

    Our daughter had no voice in the debate because Democrats railroaded and lied about ObamaCare. Shared sacrifice should be agreed through debate and votes. That didn’t happen.

    Thus, our daughter will have to pay $5,000 extra for the same insurance policy she has had since she began working for the small company If we weren’t available to help for our grand daughter, the parents would be paying an extra $6,000.00 for child care.

    Your shared sacrifice is a good way to look at it except for one thing. Shared sacrifice implies mutual agreements or at least some contrary discussion. Such sharing is accepted when people buy insurance policies. This is different. ObamaCare is closer to theft.

  • 84. El Tigre  |  April 2, 2014 at 6:52 pm

    “Hey you know what Tigre, fuck you.”

    I’ll accept that. I like to see you’re at least minutely engaged in something I’ve said.

    If you’re upset about my comments concerning your soon to be ballooning premiums and deductibles, I recall the sympathy lavished on me when I told you about the whooping increase I just dropped on me and my family. The one you now think is “subsidized” and apparently not the fault of Obamacare.

    R, you’re fucked on with Obamacare. You need to be concerned. . . very concerned. . . and not exclaiming “I just got covered, BITCHES!!!”

    If you’re upset about my cheerleading comment, please prove me wrong. I ain’t looking for footnotes or a thesis. Just reasoned and informed comments — particularly when you accuse your own customers of rooting for Obamacare to fail for political gain rather than its effect when it appears the opposite is true with respect to you. Introspection requires some looking within.

    Stated differently, I’m rooting for you to have an epiphany. You need a good epiphany. The fruits of your political bent have met their day of reckoning, and it ain’t good.

  • 85. muffy  |  April 2, 2014 at 7:35 pm

    “If you don’t want shared burden in society get off the grid, grow your own food, and heal thyself when you get sick.”

    I have a better idea. Two political parties – two publics. You share the sacrifice with yours, I’ll share the sacrifice with mine. That way you won’t have to be burdened with accepting the sacrifice of racist, women-hating mean cold hearted people who have car elevators and put their dogs on top of their cars. And obstruct things.

  • 86. muffy  |  April 2, 2014 at 8:25 pm

    “By the way, I can not believe the new all time low that was set between a president and his people on April Fools afternoon.”

    With Obama & Biden at the helm, every day is April Fool’s Day.

  • 87. Tex Taylor  |  April 2, 2014 at 8:28 pm

    With Obama & Biden at the helm, every day is April Fool’s Day.

    And Ground Hog Day…every day, a repeat of the horror of gross incompetence.

  • 88. muffy  |  April 2, 2014 at 9:06 pm

    And…bend over, it’s Valentine’s Day!

  • 89. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 9:18 pm

    “And…bend over, it’s Valentine’s Day!”-Muffy

    Lol….That cracked me up. Come on Muffy….Valentine’s day is supposed to be romantic.

  • 90. muffy  |  April 2, 2014 at 9:27 pm

    Mm hm…it’s supposed to be.

  • 91. Huck  |  April 2, 2014 at 9:32 pm work for AAA right? So I assume all of the people calling you for emergency service are AAA members?

    When someone is stuck on the side of the road, are they allowed to call you as a non-member and sign up at that moment for membership and roadside assistance?

    Do you offer assistance to non-members that haven’t signed up for AAA?

  • 92. dead rabbit  |  April 2, 2014 at 9:47 pm

    Do you offer assistance to non-members that haven’t signed up for AAA?

    They will if someone else has a card. Meaning, you can use your road service insurance for anyone….a stranger even.

  • 93. muffy  |  April 2, 2014 at 10:06 pm

    Tigre @#84 – that’s got to be one of the best replies to one of Rutherford’s “Fuck Yous” that I’ve ever read.

  • 94. parker  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:12 am

    Rutherford – good article in Forbes explaining Bitcoin to the 76% who don’t have a clue about it.

    They math is beyond your posters and is irrelevant. That’s not the real story. The real magic behind any cryptocurrency is its ability to act as a financial lubricant, eliminating for all practical purposes the “friction” inherent in financial transactions. And friction is a good term for it – no matter which way the money transfers, a fraction goes to fuel the system that makes the transfers possible – think credit card companies, banks. Think The Goldman Sachs.

    No more.

    Electronic currency is as disruptive to the fat cat bankers and financial houses as Lutheranism was to the Catholic church, and for precisely the same reason: it eliminates the need for a “middle-man” between the players – be they priests or, in cryptocurrency’s case – credit card companies, banks, governments. You can see why they hate it so vehemently: it makes their existence irrelevant, at least financially speaking. You want to deal with your trading partner – or your gods – you can do it directly, without the broker in the middle handling the technical stuff.

    This technology will come. It may be Bitcoin; it may be something else; but it will come. And the really exciting part is that, more than any development in the past 1000 years, it has the ability to nearly eliminate poverty – by eliminating governmental manipulation of the fruits of people’s work.

  • 95. an800lbgorilla  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:47 am

    Some more of that nothing burger…..

    The North Carolina State Board of Elections has found thousands of instances of voter fraud in the state, thanks to a 28-state crosscheck of voter rolls. Initial findings suggest widespread election fraud.

    * 765 voters with an exact match of first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in N.C. and the other state in the 2012 general election.

    * 35,750 voters with the same first and last name and DOB were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in both states in the 2012 general election.

    * 155,692 voters with the same first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state – and the latest date of registration or voter activity did not take place within N.C.

  • 96. an800lbgorilla  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:53 am

    Dear lord… Note the dates:

    The Environmental Protection Agency has been conducting dangerous experiments on humans over the past few years in order to justify more onerous clean air regulations.

    The agency conducted tests on people with health issues and the elderly, exposing them to high levels of potentially lethal pollutants, without disclosing the risks of cancer and death, according to a newly released government report.

    These experiments exposed people, including those with asthma and heart problems, to dangerously high levels of toxic pollutants, including diesel fumes, reads a EPA inspector general report obtained by The Daily Caller News Foundation. The EPA also exposed people with health issues to levels of pollutants up to 50 times greater than the agency says is safe for humans.

    The EPA conducted five experiments in 2010 and 2011 to look at the health effects of particulate matter, or PM, and diesel exhaust on humans. The IG’s report found that the EPA did get consent forms from 81 people in five studies. But the IG also found that “exposure risks were not always consistently represented.”

    “Further, the EPA did not include information on long-term cancer risks in its diesel exhaust studies’ consent forms,” the IG’s report noted. “An EPA manager considered these long-term risks minimal for short-term study exposures” but “human subjects were not informed of this risk in the consent form.”

    According to the IG’s report, “only one of five studies’ consent forms provided the subject with information on the upper range of the pollutant” they would be exposed to, but even more alarming is that only “two of five alerted study subjects to the risk of death for older individuals with cardiovascular disease.”

  • 97. Tex Taylor  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:24 am

    They math is beyond your posters and is irrelevant.

    We can put that to the test if you like. LOL. For one thing, deductive reasoning seems to be beyond you. Something simple like – where there’s a creation (universe), there’s a Creator.

    P.S. – Nothing will eliminate poverty. Guaranteed. Barnum was right…

  • 98. Tex Taylor  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:28 am

    Speaking of deductive reasoning…here’s something I’ve suspected for a long time from simple observation. Bring on the meat…Hooray!

    A new study from the Medical University of Graz in Austria finds that vegetarians are more physically active, drink less alcohol and smoke less tobacco than those who consume meat in their diets. Vegetarians also have a higher socioeconomic status and a lower body mass index. But the vegetarian diet — characterized by a low consumption of saturated fats and cholesterol that includes increased intake of fruits, vegetables and whole-grain products — carries elevated risks of cancer, allergies and mental health disorders.

    Vegetarians were twice as likely to have allergies, a 50 percent increase in heart attacks and a 50 percent increase in incidences of cancer.

  • 99. James  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:45 am

    A survey conducted by the American Health Institute shows the average company of a thousand or more employees will spend up to an average of $5,000 per employee on ObamaCare. This may signal the end of company-provided health insurance.

    Heck of a job.

    Two of my mother’s cousins were Seventh Day Adventist vegetarians. Both had gall bladder surgery.

    Isn’t the EPA another example of evil people?

  • 100. El Tigre  |  April 3, 2014 at 9:27 am

    “I agree with Rutherford. I don’t remember where I heard it, but I know some economists think a little debt is good.”

    James, I don’t know what you’re agreeing with Rutherford about. Some debt is good for a family too depending on the type and purpose of the debt. An affordable mortgage would be an example. A vacation would not. On a national or international level, I can see some good reasons to have debt — none of which apply to the metaphor Rutherford scoffs at.

  • 101. Tex Taylor  |  April 3, 2014 at 9:52 am

    I don’t know why this concept of debt is so difficult for Ivy Leagues and other pointy heads to understand.

    Tigre’s analogy is a good one.

    Most of us take on debt with a mortgage because we believe two things whether we recognize it, or not – assuming we weren’t trust fund babies. We’re making the assumption that the house will hold its value compared to inflation; that our savings could be used elsewhere to bring a higher rate of return than our mortgage rate; or, that it’s more economically beneficial to own and build equity rather than to rent.

    When you consider America’s biggest line item expense when extrapolated out a few years will be “INTEREST PAID”, the only explanation I can hypothesize in citizens not screaming from the rooftops about gross mismanagement and overspending, is that they are mostly stupid and unteachable, or so apathetic and without hope to be useless.

    I’ve got three friends (and their wives) as we speak in Panama right now listening to sales pitches from the economically literate why it might be best to forgo their U.S. Citizenship and move their interests to Panama.

    From strictly a capital retention viewpoint, it’s a no brainer for them to go.

    How did we get to this point where many of America’s brightest are actually giving serious thought to leaving the land of the free? That’s the question all of us ought to be asking ourselves. I’d be curious to what liberals like “R” and “Just a Lurker”, the only libs left with the guts to take the heat here, think of that. And I don’t mean that as insult but as how they arrive at the conclusion America’s best days are ahead of us…

  • 102. James  |  April 3, 2014 at 11:11 am

    el tigre, I was agreeing with Rutherford that debt is sometimes not harmful, but I also wrote that we are beyond that point. I was ignoring Rutherford’s metaphor.

  • 103. El Tigre  |  April 3, 2014 at 11:12 am

    Tex, I represent some uber-wealthy (some with assets exceeding $100 million). Capital flight is real, not hypothetical. Why the left thinks confiscation is the only means to tap the resource for societal benefit is due entirely to its economic illiteracy — and of course class-envy/guilt.

    The depths of ignorance in the lefty’s concept that “coming from the government” = free (or alternatively, if it comes from one’s own employer it’s a “subsidized”) is maddening. It leads to statements like, “economists agree that some debt is a GOOD thing,” without for a moment asking oneself, “what about the unpaid debt we’ve already incurred? Am I to believe that heaping debt upon debt is a good thing base on some platitude I heard somewhere the origins or context I don’t understand?” Sophistry always picks it up from there.

    And that is how Obama has the temerity to offer his childish statements that Ryan’s proposed budget as a “stinkburger” and a “meanwich.” Comments fit for a 5 years old — which is how he views his mindless adherents.

    Here’s something I would like R to think consider in his reevaluation of what makes people tick:

    I grew up very modestly. I have extraordinarily wealthy clients that have had en entirely different and privileged existence than myself, Some earned it, others not. I don’t resent them nor do I have to resist the temptation to.

    Here’s what I see:

    MOST wealthy folks do, in fact, work very, very hard.

    MOST wealthy folks did not acquire their wealth by talking it from someone else.

    MOST wealthy folks care a lot about other people.

    MOST wealthy folks don’t turn their noses up at those that don’t have their resources.

    MOST wealthy folks are very charitable and feel a great sense of satisfaction from lending a hand up.

    MOST wealthy folks want to see others succeed.

    MOST wealthy folks are good people with good hearts.

    I know that he typical liberal, who is tirelessly pressed to believe the exact opposite, is dead wrong.

    I wonder if R would give some thought to why that is in any respect; be it how I am wrong, why he agrees but holds the views of economics he does (e.g. “forced charity” as he puts it) or how the politics of his party see and insist that are so different from what I observe.

  • 104. muffy  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:25 pm

    Can’t we just blame the shooter for one day?

  • 105. Alfie  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:40 pm

    Hey I’m leaving a comment from London (see feed meter thingie) should I use my usual name?
    Seriously though I love Rutherfords comment that rabbit should go heal thyself,the abomination kind of takes the RIGHT away from him.
    Society’s take on its rights and responsibilities are certainly skewed and because of that we are collectively screwed.

  • 106. Alfie  |  April 3, 2014 at 5:43 pm

    Love big govt. to prevent 210 fatalities per annum from back over accidents starting in 2018 cars in the USA will be required to have rear view cameras. Ring those tills baby

  • 107. muffy  |  April 3, 2014 at 6:19 pm

    Alfie and Stinky are the same person. I’m sure of it.

  • 108. El Tigre  |  April 3, 2014 at 7:56 pm

    I had Stinky pegged for R’s alter ego.

  • 109. muffy  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:15 pm

    Well clearly any new commenter must be a recycle of a previous visitor since no one new ever reads the blog.

    Tigre re: #103 – nice. Very real. It doesn’t occur to me to resent wealthy people either. It bugs me when people think entertainers are the be all end all though.

  • 110. muffy  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:18 pm

    I just remembered how much I enjoyed Stinky barging in here and calling us all a bunch of morons. Moron is a personal favortite of mine. I like big dummy too.

  • 111. El Tigre  |  April 3, 2014 at 8:19 pm

    Lol. True.

  • 112. El Tigre  |  April 3, 2014 at 9:13 pm

    Muffy, you have a special wit.

    Well hell, all of the regulars and even the host do too. But you play harder than the boys. That’s cool.

  • 113. muffy  |  April 3, 2014 at 9:34 pm

    I’m a big fan of the repartee around here. (thanks btw and back at ya)

  • 114. an800lbgorilla  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:46 am

    I know that he typical liberal, who is tirelessly pressed to believe the exact opposite, is dead wrong.

    I wonder if R would give some thought to why that is in any respect; be it how I am wrong, why he agrees but holds the views of economics he does (e.g. “forced charity” as he puts it) or how the politics of his party see and insist that are so different from what I observe.” — Tigre

    I tried to answer this for you…

  • 115. Tex Taylor  |  April 4, 2014 at 8:23 am

    Interesting, Gorilla. I would like to think Rutherford is in the beginnings of a personal epiphany of sorts. Indoctrination without exposure to truth from a young age would surely be difficult to overcome.

    But I also want to believe Mr. Rutherford smart enough to recognize what is becoming all too obvious – simple observations like outcome based results?

    Anyone read about the Mozilla Executive who was forced to resign because he dared have a different viewpoint about marriage – an opinion that ten years would not even have been questioned – the same one Obama campaigned as believing too as recently as 2008?

    Still think it’s us Christians that demand a ‘theocracy’ and are the tyrants, Rutherford? Ask Anita Bryant…

  • 116. parker  |  April 4, 2014 at 8:34 am

    Rutherford – There’s a good article in Forbes that describes your POV perfectly, and why the nutty Right in America is completely unable (thank the gods) to convert its culture war into votes.

    on another point: @103 – I also have some experience with high-net-worth individuals, and in my experience every line is correct. The undergrads at my B-school bathed in the socialist foolishness and believed every word of it. But what they could never wrap their brains around was that the money they want to redistribute must be created – yes created, not just printed – and it is the productive people who create it. Read that “wealthy.” And when you attack them from every direction, they just fold up like a flower and take their money elsewhere.

    It’s called synergism. It is in the parasite’s best interest to keep the host healthy, for when the parasite kills the host, the parasite dies, too.

  • 117. parker  |  April 4, 2014 at 8:40 am

    Anita gets pied.

    I never much agreed with her shove-my-opinion-on-you attitude, but the Lady showed style with her comment: “At least it was a fruit pie.” LOL

  • 118. Huck  |  April 4, 2014 at 10:01 am

    “Anyone read about the Mozilla Executive who was forced to resign because he dared have a different viewpoint about marriage – an opinion that ten years would not even have been questioned – the same one Obama campaigned as believing too as recently as 2008?”

    Yeah, that was wrong. There’s even a lot of gay people who are not happy with what happened here.

  • 119. an800lbgorilla  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:14 am

    This is what Hope and Change have gotten us…. The great uniter my ass….

    DETROIT (WWJ) – As a 54-year-old Roseville man clings to life in the hospital following a brutal mob beating on Detroit’s east side, many are starting to wonder if the whole thing was racially motivated.

    As first reported by WWJ Newsradio 950, an 11-year-old boy suffered a broken leg on Wednesday when he was hit by a pickup truck after walking into the street near Morang and Balfour. The driver, Steven Utash, immediately got out of his truck after hitting the boy and was viciously attacked by 10 to 12 men. The beating was so brutal, Utash was rendered unconscious.

    Utash’s son Joseph told WWJ’s Gary Lundy Thursday night that his father remains in a medically induced coma, nearly unrecognizable due to his injuries. He also said his wallet was stolen from his truck.

    “If it went on any longer, my dad wouldn’t be in the hospital right now, he would be in the morgue. The way he looked, I am surprised that he is alive,” he said. “He has bruising over his face, his eyes are swollen, I believe it’s his left eye that is completely swollen shut. He also has a big, huge knot on his forehead like he got hit with an object, not a fist.”

    Joseph Utash said he was working with his father in Detroit just hours before the attack. Both of the men are tree-trimmers, working in the city for years now.

    “I came home from work and it was on the news, my dad’s pickup truck, and I was just like ‘Oh my god.’ Then I heard that he hit a kid and I was like freaking out that my dad hit a kid. And then I heard that bystanders just beat him up and I just, I called my mom immediately,” he said. ”From what I’m hearing is he tried to fight back, but trying to fight back against 11 people fighting you, that’s 22 fists coming at you at once, you can’t really do much.”

    Detroit Police Sgt. Michael Woody said Steven Utash was not at fault for the accident.

    “Our preliminary investigation shows the child stepped in front of his vehicle,” Woody said. “He did exactly the right thing. He stopped his vehicle, he got out and he tried to render aid to a small child. He did exactly what he was supposed to do… It was a small child and it was an accident; is what it was.”

    State Rep. Alberta Tinsley Talabi (D-Detroit), told WWJ Legal Analyst Charlie Langton the incident appears to have racial overtones, adding, “it’s wrong.”

    Joseph Utash said although it was tough to stomach, he watched video of the incident.

    “As my dad’s truck was coming down the street, the kid stepped right in front of my dad’s truck. My dad had absolutely not one chance in the world to try to swerve out-of-the-way or stop,” he said. “He got out of the car to check on the kid and before he even got up to the kid, he got assaulted by 11, 12 people. They jumped all over him and beat him up. While they were jumping him, somebody else jumped in the truck and stole his belongings. They took his wallet, his cellphone, everything out of his truck.”

  • 120. an800lbgorilla  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:18 am

    Consider this from the 2008 VP debate:

    IFILL: Let’s try to avoid nuance, Senator. Do you support gay marriage?

    BIDEN: No. Barack Obama nor I support redefining from a civil side what constitutes marriage. We do not support that. That is basically the decision to be able to be able to be left to faiths and people who practice their faiths the determination what you call it.

    The bottom line though is, and I’m glad to hear the governor, I take her at her word, obviously, that she think there should be no civil rights distinction, none whatsoever, between a committed gay couple and a committed heterosexual couple. If that’s the case, we really don’t have a difference.

  • 121. an800lbgorilla  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:29 am


    Since 2008, the number of people who call themselves middle class has fallen by nearly a fifth, according to a survey in January by the Pew Research Center, from 53 percent to 44 percent. Forty percent now identify as either lower-middle or lower class compared with just 25 percent in February 2008.

  • 122. James  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:35 am

    104 forced charity is robbery at gun point.

    115 Human-caused global warming skeptics are also victims of the same liberal theocratic thinking,

  • 123. Tex Taylor  |  April 4, 2014 at 12:28 pm


    There’s one facet of your personality that you don’t recognize in your profound arrogance, because you always think that vast superior intellect of yours makes you the most interesting man in the world – even when this white piece of trash can make you a bumbling idiot seeking help from the FBI.

    So because you have this blind spot and being a good Christian man that I am, I want to help you out before it’s too late.

    Man, nobody likes you. :smile:

  • 124. an800lbgorilla  |  April 4, 2014 at 12:34 pm

    Bonnie M. Youn, who Obama’s White House touts on its website as “a recognized Asian American & Pacific Islander (AAPI) community leader in Georgia,” was indicted on three criminal charge counts in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Georgia Atlanta Division on April 1, according to publicly filed court documents.

    The first indictment count alleges Youn committed perjury with regard to an alien illegally in the United States. The second indictment count alleges that Youn violated a federal immigration law that prohibits bringing illegal aliens into the United States and harboring them, alleging she did so “for the purpose of commercial advantage and private financial gain.” The third indictment count alleges Youn illegally tampered with witness testimony, specifically alleging she influenced the illegal alien—whose identity is kept anonymous in the indictment—to provide false information about employment in the United States to federal agents.

  • 125. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 5:15 pm

    Well I’m guessing G is disappointed that Fort Hood Shooter Redux turned out not to be Muslim. Would have been another nice pin in the Obama antiterrorism balloon.

    Oh well. Can’t win ‘em all.

  • 126. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 5:57 pm

    Why would you even say something like that?

  • 127. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    You know who would have stepped in front of that bullet to save your ass? G.

  • 128. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 6:32 pm

    What does that have to do with anything? Totally irrelevant. I wasn’t commenting on G’s heroism. I was commenting on how G rejoices in Obama’s failures. If Lopez had been Mohammed, G would have been the first to snark “war on terror over? Yeah right.”

  • 129. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 6:37 pm

    Now let’s get G’s opinion on how multiple deployments of a thinly staffed military can break a man.

    All the more reason to bring back the draft. If we’re gonna have a permanent war stance (contrary to Obama’s stated policy) then let’s staff for it.

  • 130. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 6:43 pm

    While I’d still love to hear G’s comments on multiple deployments, I correct myself. From what I read Lopez only served 4 months in Iraq.

  • 131. Tex Taylor  |  April 4, 2014 at 6:50 pm

    Just heard it wasn’t traumatic head trauma…or even PTSD related.

    Sounds to me like a “disagreement.” We can still rag on Obama about the failed economy – abysmal numbers once again. I guess Obama can brag that the economy has added 323,000 ‘food service jobs’ during this tenure – most part time.

    Draft? What service are you going to provide, “R”? You could work with war hero Graychin and his made up medals? :smile:

  • 132. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:16 pm

    “Well I’m guessing G is disappointed that Fort Hood Shooter Redux turned out not to be Muslim. Would have been another nice pin in the Obama antiterrorism balloon.

    Oh well. Can’t win ‘em all.” Rutherford

    Personally, I fully admit that I rather it be the attack of an enemy instead of an inside job by a treasonous pussy who couldn’t handle life. (The last attack wasn’t an inside job…it was well known dude was a radical stink beard).

    While I know that the war takes a toll, I feel the need to point out that the majority of combat vets are NOT mentally defective. Repeat. The majority of combat vets are NOT mentally ill.

    My brother had to explain away his service for 20 minutes once in an interview. Hell…I was hired under the promise that I wouldn’t “recruit” kids.

    The minority of mentally ill soldiers mixed with the notion by well meaning libs that every vet is in dire need of help before he hurts himself or someone else, sucks.

    Fact of the matter is that an amazing amount of people are able to keep the fort down after a traumatic experience, whether from a combat zone or a car accident. Do they lose sleep at night? Fuck yeah they do. And then get up and be good men

    Conceal Carry…..ridiculous you can’t on a base.

    Some people are calling for all military personnel to be locked and loaded. Not needed. Most aren’t combat trained (contrary to how many vets portray themselves).

    Gorillia might chew me out on this one, but my (limited) combat training experience has led me to believe it is not the same as civilian and police training in terms of gun safety/procedure. Hell…even the standard “wedge” formation while on patrol goes against gun safety 101 requirements.

    But, there is no reason a solider shouldn’t be able to make the CHOICE to conceal carry on base. In this regard, he carries with the mindset of a civilian…aware of all the laws and responsibilities that come with making the decision. So stupid someone wasn’t armed to stop that piece of shit earlier.

  • 133. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:24 pm

    Rutherford the ultimate chicken hawk, calling for a draft when he has no son and can’t pick up a sack of potatoes.

  • 134. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:29 pm

    Pegging the shooter is the first thing you go to Rutherford, and usually as far as you take it. What religion is he? What color is he? What political party is he? What conservative principle or representative can you blame for the shooter’s actions? You can’t wait for the label shit to come out so you can trot it out and hang it on somebody.

    Right about now you’re competing with President Stinkburger Meanwich on who can get smaller.

  • 135. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:36 pm

    Draft. :roll: Idiots trying to make sense of crazy.

    It sounds to me like the military wasn’t able to help this guy any more than anyone else was.

  • 136. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:39 pm

    Don’t forget rabbit now our daughters could get drafted.

    Forward. Yes we can.

  • 137. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:45 pm

    “Don’t forget rabbit now our daughters could get drafted.”

    They come for our girls and I know at least 3 Dads that will recreate Ruby Ridge.

  • 138. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 7:46 pm

    Make that 4. I didn’t count Tex Taylor.

  • 139. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:12 pm

    Hey Rabbit — chicken hawk, Dick Cheney — you don’t seem to give a flying fuck that he got thousands of your brothers killed in a fake war.

    Watch who you call chicken hawk my friend. The fact is the draft would keep military intervention in check. That’s why I champion the draft — cos it would keep your boys OUT of war.

    BTW without it, it’s your boys who will do the fighting, not those of all the noble rich that Tigre lectured me about.

  • 140. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:15 pm

    Au contraire Muffy. The shooting is several days old and I haven’t pinned it on anyone. I just couldn’t resist taking a well deserved smack at Gorilla.

  • 141. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:18 pm

    Muffy you’re a puzzle wrapped in an enigma. You oppose women serving? Are you one of these selective feminists who want equality to a point?

    Oh I forgot. You’re not a feminist. You’re a conservative. :lol:

  • 142. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:20 pm

    One more week until I take possession of my dooms day preper cabin!

  • 143. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:21 pm

    BTW while it would terrify me to see my daughter drafted, equality is equality. Unless she winds up a 4F like her father, if she has to go she has to go.

  • 144. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:23 pm

    “BTW without it, it’s your boys who will do the fighting, not those of all the noble rich that Tigre lectured me about.” -R

    Noble rich make noble officers and have for two thousand years, jerk.

  • 145. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:23 pm

    You got a guest room? 30’s in April I swear to God the world is coming to an end.

  • 146. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:24 pm

    Not just yo pick on G — hey Poolman was Fort Hood another false flag event?

  • 147. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:26 pm

    Rabbit the stats don’t back your assertion. The current armed forces are disproportionately middle, lower middle class and poor.

  • 148. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:30 pm

    ” equality is equality” -R

    Yeah….equality is equality until a female is all that’s left to drag my two hundred plus pound ass out of harms way. Then your equality doesn’t feel so fucking liberating.

    But it doesn’t surprise my of your willingness to give up your only daughter to the blind experiments of the cold and great social laboratory.

  • 149. Rutherford  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:35 pm

    Hey don’t blame me for feminism. I happen to believe that families were more functional when roles were clearer, men were primary bread winners and women made sure Jr didn’t turn out a criminal. But that opinion is considered Neanderthal nowadays. Even conservative Muffy would scold me for it.

  • 150. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:41 pm

    Rutherford, you mean the majority of the armed forces represent 90% of the American population? (Or, to be more Occupy like, 99%)?

    I am shocked. Dude…you got me.

    Despite the numbers…..uh stupidly being in your favor….

    Considering the military doesn’t take high-school drop outs and led by an officer corps of colleges grads….I promise you there is actually less poor in the military then the general population.

    Fly over American and the South? You bet. But dirt poor? Nope….liberal fantasy.

  • 151. dead rabbit  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:51 pm

    “But that opinion is considered Neanderthal nowadays. Even conservative Muffy would scold me for it.” -R

    I guess the difference between you and I is I don’t give a damn about where my opinion stands with the self appointed arbitrators of discourse. So I draw a line when it comes to things like drafting our mothers and sisters. You worry about what people might think of you and offer your daughter to Ares.

  • 152. muffy  |  April 4, 2014 at 11:58 pm

    Your main concern seems to be how the shooting reflects on Obama. Not that you’ve ever defended his drone killing tendencies.

  • 153. muffy  |  April 5, 2014 at 12:23 am

    R, you most certainly are to blame for the phony feminism that bears rotten fruit like women on the front lines or other situations not designed to preserve lives.

    It’s pretty apparent to me that you don’t know what liberation is.

  • 154. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:12 am

    Noble rich?

    Read again, man-boy.


  • 155. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:22 am

    You know R, from what I can tell, you are noble rich. Looking for signs of your economic growing up, no evidence around here from what I’ve seen. Introspection ain’t your bag.

  • 156. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:23 am

    “economic adversity”

  • 157. Tex Taylor  |  April 5, 2014 at 7:37 am

    Rutherford, you do realize while I don’t consider you a Neanderthal by any stretch, you do chew around the edges of male feminist – a byproduct of a failing society?

    I am convinced of all the following:

    Want to help destroy a nation? Emasculate masculinity; blend gender roles; manage by idiocies like ‘diversity'; refuse to demand assimilation into a common, proven culture. Current management is facilitating them all.

    And these stupid, man haters representing the Democratic Party and found in large numbers in higher ed are cutting the throats of women in the succeeding generations. Feminists don’t care about women – they care about self. They use their gender to control, just like Bill Clinton used his gender and position to seduce a star struck, stupid girl named Monica Lewinsky. These misandrists don’t do it for sex – they do it for power; they do it for position.

    Frankly, Barack Obama is the most cowardly President America has ever had of recent memory. And that is now being demonstrated on the world stage.

    Will you be honest enough to admit that Barack Obama’s weaknesses are similar to Clinton, but Obama is not nearly as clever as Clinton? Let us be honest, “R?” Barack Obama is an immoral man without a rudder – a flim flam. Every opinion is based on political expediency and self-aggrandizement. I doubt Barack Obama stands for anything but Barack Obama.

    Obama is not transparently immoral like ‘Parker’ but narcissistic like ‘Parker’ – that’s a lethal combination of weak and wicked and that too is a byproduct of why this nation is struggling. When a nation is led by hedonistic lusts, solipsistic and arrogant and these are the features we elect as leaders…

    Why are we surprised we are in decline?

    And Putin, a man far more clever than I realized until recently, uses these weaknesses to manipulate, even going so far as to use America’s now hedonistic culture to his advantage.

    To be fair, I have this gut feel that many people calling themselves Christian today are allowing themselves to be hoodwinked by Putin, just like you were hoodwinked by Obama.

    Pat Buchanan has an interesting take today about whose side is God on, but Buchanan also eventually gets it wrong about Putin for different reasons.

    I promise you that these “feminists”, Obama, and even men like Pfesser Parker are tools for evil – too ignorant, blind and arrogant to recognize they are doing their part to destroy. They are weak.

    I’m now convinced that America is quickly going to have to change, or it is going to fall…setting the stage for some really horrific times, perhaps in our lifetime.

    Is that the world you want to leave to your daughter?

  • 158. Tex Taylor  |  April 5, 2014 at 8:04 am

    By the way, Muffy. Our world needs more Margaret Thatchers and fewer Barbara Boxers. And you are a wonderful complement to the Boy’s Club here.

    If you are anything like you represent yourself, I wish America had a whole bunch more of you. I do not kid you when I tell you that you read with so many of the same characteristics of why I love my wife, respect my wife, admire my wife. That wit is truly biting and a wonder to behold. Remember those synergies they talked about in school? That’s what good women are to men.

    I’m talking about teaching our children. All of them.

    I remind my daughters often of how blessed they have been. I think my wife is a wonderful role model for young women. She’s brilliant, yet humble. Men may be the designated protectors of which too many have shucked their responsibility, but real women are what builds and sustains generations. Real women have insight that men not capable, talents that men don’t possess. Reading you reminds me of that fact.

    One thing I have learned through experience. There’s a cross over in sexes. Boys may need strong mothers more than they need strong fathers. Girls need their fathers to love them more than I ever realized until I had grown daughters of my own.

    Rutherford. You make sure your own daughter understands how proud you are of her and how much you love her. She will be so much better prepared if you can do these two things.

  • 159. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 8:52 am

    Tex, your last post could be part of a high school commencement speech.

    139 I agree with Rutherford. If women are equal citizens, the draft is part of citizenship. Lowering standards so women can serve in certain jobs like combat hurts everyone. I met many women in the service who were strong and capable.

    I oppose the draft for one reason. It is unfair. I also agree that the volunteer force diffuses public involvement and concern for our foreign policy which can lead to war.

    I will support the draft the day Obama’s daughters and the children of other priveleged classes take basic training and are assigned jobs with no consideration of their status in life.

    I am old enough to have been drafted and watched the favoritism. One problem with our current system is to save money we have kept our forces smaller than their mission requires. People serve multiple tours in war zones and other difficult areas because we don’t have enough soldiers to do it any other way. Stress is one of the results.

    The same storm which affected Rutherford gave us three inches of snow and wind early yesterday. We got home last evening, and we still had some patches for skiing. It is 22 this morning. An Omaha television meteorologist plans to stick a fork in an ice cream cake next week–the symbolic end of winter.

  • 160. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 8:52 am

    It has nothing to do, Rabbit, with what people think of me. I try to avoid hypocrisy. To say your daughter is a mans equal in every way but draw the line when she comes in harms way is hypocrisy.

    Rabbit how do you feel about female cops?

  • 161. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 8:57 am

    No Muffy I haven’t defended Obama’s drone killing tendencies.

    And I think both Fort Hood shootings have nothing to do with Obama but I know conservatives will use ANY current event to piss on the man. I’m surprised Limbaugh hasn’t blamed the Washington mudslide on Obama.

  • 162. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 8:59 am

    The difference between Putin and Obama is striking. Putan came up through the KGB and the Russian political system which could get on killed or imprisoned if bad judgement or bad luck interviened.

    Obama was the pampered son of comfort who’s mother and father basically abandoned him. He was taught to get along and make as few waves as possible while affirmative action took him to places he didn’t really earn. Obama has few core beliefs beyond what is good for Obama and the destruction of what he regards as our colonialist society. He was a rabble rouser, a community organizer with a large cheering section.

    Putin is a hard man. Obama is soft.

  • 163. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 9:01 am

    On this combat women issue Muffy you’re playing the dolt. Men, feminist or not, DON’T want women on the front-lines. I don’t either but women made this bed for themselves. Your peeve is not with me. It’s with your sisters.

  • 164. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 9:10 am

    James you’ve touched on a fact that merits mention–the draft itself ain’t fair.

    But then what is? Life ain’t fair.

  • 165. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 9:12 am

    MSNBC is rejoicing this morning in the free elections in Afghanistan. I ain’t buying it. Am I too cynical?

  • 166. dead rabbit  |  April 5, 2014 at 9:46 am

    Rutherford, you do realize that there is law in place that protects women because they are women.

    For instance, in terms of lethal force in self defense situation, unarmed women are always deemed less of a threat then unarmed men. Always. Even women who are bigger then a man. That gun better not come out.

    Does the military demand the same amount of strength from women in order to serve? Why not?

    The bed hasn’t been made, as much as you half wits pretend it to be. And you know it.

    Its different when a man punches a woman then if a man punches a man. When that changes, and it better not, the bed has been made. And at that moment, your daughter can be drafted.

    Sometimes I feel sorry for you (and I am not trying to be a dick here) because your disability robbed you of some of the traditional responsibilities that come with being a man. Its all an abstract for you.

  • 167. Tex Taylor  |  April 5, 2014 at 9:55 am

    Blaming Obama for anything may be true – he’s a pathetic man and easy target married to an entitled hatemonger – Cruella DeVille, raised by an entitled bag. Probably will skin Bo the dog (good gawd, what an ego) for its fur coat.

    But it’s no different than what you scabs did to George Bush, Rutherford.

  • 168. Huck  |  April 5, 2014 at 10:03 am

    “BTW without it, it’s your boys who will do the fighting, not those of all the noble rich that Tigre lectured me about.”

    The draft didn’t change that.

    “Watch who you call chicken hawk my friend.”

    As should you, the supporter of a man who tried to extend the Iraq war even after Bush negotiated our withdrawal and who has sent tens of thousands of men into a combat zone of a war he is on record as supporting.

    You have no room to get pissy over someone tossing around the term “chicken hawk”, pal.

    “I’m surprised Limbaugh hasn’t blamed the Washington mudslide on Obama.”

    And I’m surprised Harry Reid hasn’t blamed it on the Koch Brothers.

    “To say your daughter is a mans equal in every way but draw the line when she comes in harms way is hypocrisy.”

    I don’t recall anyone here ever saying that…including you. Females are not equal to males “in every way.” And that does not mean they are less than, either. It just means they aren’t the same as.

    “MSNBC is rejoicing this morning in the free elections in Afghanistan. I ain’t buying it. Am I too cynical?”

    They want to tout Afghanistan as a success story so when Obama pulls out he can have a “mission accomplished” carrier party.

    “Your peeve is not with me. It’s with your sisters.”

    I’m guessing her sisters are conservative. Feminism comes from your sociopolitical side of the street, bub.

    “Life ain’t fair.”

    Store this one away, boys. We can use it at least 100 times in each blog post from here on out.

  • 169. Huck  |  April 5, 2014 at 11:55 am

    I may as well start us off…

    “James you’ve touched on a fact that merits mention–the draft itself ain’t fair.

    But then what is? Life ain’t fair.”

    The guy who defended ObamaCare as a part of “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness” is now in favor of forcing conscripted men (and women, if he had his way) to put their lives at risk in wars because “life aint fair.”

    The guy who wants DR to pay more for epipens so women can get free birth control pills now says “life aint fair.”

    The guy who wants those evil rich people to “pay their fair share” now says “life aint fair.”

    The guy who wants to see people make a living wage by burger flipping now says “life aint fair.”

    The guy who didn’t vote for Mitt Romney because he saved a few companies by outsourcing some jobs now says “life aint fair.”

    Oh, you’ve stepped in it now, my friend.

  • 170. muffy  |  April 5, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    “No Muffy I haven’t defended Obama’s drone killing tendencies.”

    You just did. You’re so defensive about Obama that you went on the offense and stuck up for Obama against an attack that hadn’t even been launched on his credibility regarding his war on terror – which largely consists of drone attacks on suspected terrorists and whoever happens to be standing too close to them at the moment of the drone strike. Who else are you defending – the drone?

    You also threw in a thinly veiled accusation of Islamaphobia.

    I suppose you don’t think you support Obama’s extreme position on abortion either.

  • 171. muffy  |  April 5, 2014 at 12:19 pm

    Sorry Huck, I wrote my comment as yours came in. I’m all for a change of topic to “Life ain’t fair” coming from Rutherford. Hell yeah I am.

  • 172. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 12:34 pm

    Life is unfair through perversity and chance. The draft is unfair through design.

    We lived in tents in the wilderness during field training which was mostly construction work since the field training site was new and not finished.. Female medics trained as we did except that they didn’t .

    While we slept in our double person tents on hot sand, the women returned to their rooms on the base at night. They did build a token tent which men helped raise when they had trouble.

    We all punched in our resume lines and prepared for the next challenge, but to me the women’s meant less than ours.They were tough enough to do what we did, but they didn’t.

  • 173. muffy  |  April 5, 2014 at 12:39 pm

    (Tex, yes, kids thrive under the roofs of present and engaged fathers and strong mothers.)

  • 174. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:33 pm

    Rabbit you’re not being a dick but you are being stupid. Up until I got laid off I very much fulfilled the main responsibility of being a man — primary bread winner of the family to the tune of 6 figures.

    I’m not being a dick here but of everyone on this board Rabbit you need to lose a leg or two in an accident so you figure out what a man really is. You place WAY too much emphasis on the physical. Your “abilities” are on loan dude and could leave you in a second. You need a change of POV.

  • 175. poolman  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:35 pm

    Wonderful 70 degrees here on my patio, James. The only skiing we do is on the water. It was chilly the past few days, I had to go back to long pants and long-sleeved shirts. At least in the early mornings.

    I don’t think the draft will be an issue in our remaining lives. The military has been perfecting killing methods and machines for quite some time now. Machines don’t have the emotions that humans have, so it isn’t a difficulty to produce a killing instinct. There is no PTSD. In a sense, we’ve all been drafted into this modern world of virtual and real warfare. The only reason to draft humans is because machines don’t feel pain or bleed or die like we fleshly beings do. And that is important to leaders. You can’t effectively torture machines either (though I have heard saws cry out under the finger of a few less than talented carpenters), a prime component of our modern war tact. Yeah, satan approves of us and cheers our warmongering nation.

    The focus has been toward stealth, like weather modification. We have seen the results of these man-made ‘natural’ disasters as of late. It is also more politically motivated.

    It was Malaysia that was unable to agree to the terms of the TPIP and TPP during the recent negotiations, which to us peons are mostly secretive. The reason they are secretive is because global industry is effectively usurping the rights of peoples in nations and states in the name of free trade. The new trade rules being negotiated are designed to supersede those existing on the books in the lands that these international industries choose to operate.

    And then they ‘lose’ a 777! Amazing coincidence?

    Then add the Freescale/Rothschild connection to that mix…

    As to Rutherford’s snark regarding the latest Ft Hood shooting, it appears to have been a ‘normal’ event ‘triggered’ by ‘abnormal’ behavior. Let the puns fall where they may. But then, that is the key to our modern warfare. Natural and normal are being controlled today. That means they are neither. And that is my take away.

  • 176. poolman  |  April 5, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    Your “abilities” are on loan dude and could leave you in a second.

    Dude, you are sounding more spiritual today. Sounds like you are ripe for some evangelizing. Maybe there has been some authentic introspection taking place. lol (I also think the new emoticons suck)

  • 177. Huck  |  April 5, 2014 at 2:17 pm

    ” I very much fulfilled the main responsibility of being a man — primary bread winner”

    Why is that a man’s responsibility when women are equal to men?

    How can one hold the position “equal pay for equal work” AND “it is the man’s responsibility to be the primary bread winner”?

  • 178. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 2:46 pm

    R, I understand the reaction, but you unwittingly made DR’s point.

  • 179. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 3:45 pm

    How can one hold the position “equal pay for equal work” AND “it is the man’s responsibility to be the primary bread winner”?

    I’ve already stated that my view of gender roles is more traditional. That doesn’t mean I can’t recognize that I am out of step with the times we live in.

    You guys also seem to have a problem with holding seemingly contradictory thoughts in one’s head at one time. It’s called complexity. Life is not black and white.

  • 180. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:04 pm

    your disability robbed you of some of the traditional responsibilities that come with being a man.

    Let’s explore this further, especially since Tigre seems to think I made your case DR. (Tigre baffles the shit out of me often.)

    Let’s enumerate the list of responsibilities that my disability robs me of.

    If I’m out in public with my wife and a man insults her, I can’t beat the shit out of him. Is that one?

    I can’t coach little league. Is that one?

    Like a good many men, I’m a 4F so I cannot serve in the armed forces. Is that one?

    Remember now, we’re talking responsibilities.

    Let me enumerate what I can do — financially contribute to the welfare of my family (already mentioned and oddly discounted by Tigre).

    Be a supportive husband and father.

    Be a role model for my daughter on how to live an honest decent life.

    Not ditch the family when times get rough (and times have gotten plenty rough).

    Words matter Rabbit. What responsibilities do I not understand or not commit to based on being disabled? Hell, with the possible exception of unemployment insurance (my wife’s idea, not mine) I’ve never taken a single handout from anyone.

    Or perhaps Tigre’s point is that if I have to ask the question, then I don’t understand the “responsibilities” of a man.

    Seriously Rabbit, I’m not pissed off. Of all the folks on the board over the years you have been the one most obsessed/disconcerted by my disability. I get that. You’re a physical guy. Your physique matters a lot to you. I’m just telling you, the muscles and the macho is not worth a damn to your wife and boys. It’s how you show you love them that matters — that is what makes you a man. That is how you fulfill your responsibilities. And no, I’m not lecturing you — cos I know you already know this. You just can’t let go of the trappings of “manhood”.

  • 181. Rutherford  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:18 pm

    I’ve never taken a single handout from anyone.

    I take that back. My Dad left me a shitload of money and I feel guilty as hell having it because I didn’t earn a dime of it. I never asked him for a dime when he was alive — I’d sooner lose the home I loved than to ask him for financial help and I did lose the home I loved. . We’re using the money now to make our lives better (like paying off lots of debt and replacing cars on the brink of extinction) But every dime I spend comes with a tinge of guilt — a tinge of unworthiness.

    My dad was a man and not because he was able-bodied. It was cos he worked his ass off to see that I never needed for anything — and it was because he always led me to believe I could be every bit the man he was. Frankly, I fell short but it had nothing to do with leg braces and a cane.

  • 182. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:21 pm

    You poor thing, poolman. How do you suffer the chill so? You sound like our son in California when he jokes he had to wear a jacket to withstand the chill,.

    I agree about the draft. We don’t need large armies as we once did, though ours now is stretched too thin for what we ask of it.

    Not much changes. Liberals as a group hate the military and come close to believing entering the service is a sign of a mental disorder. Years ago, they marginalized soldiers and veterans with the fear they were dangerous damaged goods to justify their own hatred of the system which used them.

    Employers were afraid to hire veterans.PTSD was a theme of seventies and early eighties movies and television shows not to foster help, but to paint veterans as potentially violent people who were inferior to the majority who escaped serving.

    Attacking the military is less politically correct now, but those people still use the blood of anyone, including soldiers to further their agendas. Once you accept that premise you understand why liberals are evil people.

  • 183. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:31 pm

    My family taught me how to be a man, and ancient history confirmed their teachings. A man with his superior physical strength is the hunter and protector. Hunting and protecting in this age may be more cleverness and determination, but it is still the same basic drive. The average mother is the glue which holds the family together, but the father has different skills to teach his children.

    Equal pay for equal work is right because it is fair. It has nothing to do with male or female roles no matter who runs the family.

    Rutherford, when you die and mourners visit, someone will surely say “there was a man.”

  • 184. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:40 pm

    Another part of being a man, at least near here is secretly gauging other men as physical opponents. Can I “take” him or not?

    I am old but fit. I’m still strong and fast. I also know things. I could “take” Obama and Biden in an exhibition wrestling match. They would probably have more endurance than I but they wouldn’t be able to use it.

    I’m not bragging. Its part of being a man.

  • 185. James  |  April 5, 2014 at 4:52 pm

    176 “Only know you’ve been high
    when you’re feeling low
    Only hate the road when
    you’re missing home

    Staring at the bottom of your glass
    Hoping one day you’ll make a dream last
    But dreams come slow and
    they go so fast.

    Only know you love her when
    you let her go”

    Passenger “Let her go.”

  • 186. dead rabbit  |  April 5, 2014 at 5:08 pm

    “Your “abilities” are on loan dud” -R

    Well……I can’t not deny your psychoanalysis of me is correct.

    As for you….I’ve never heard a father offer his daughter up for draft in a combat. Quit being phony.

  • 187. Huck  |  April 5, 2014 at 5:31 pm

    “You guys also seem to have a problem with holding seemingly contradictory thoughts in one’s head at one time. It’s called complexity. Life is not black and white.”

    Oh, we’re fine with it. You, however, call it “hypocrisy” when we display it. Which is why I was pointing out yours.

  • 188. dead rabbit  |  April 5, 2014 at 6:39 pm

    Ha ha…..James… sure you don’t have some Lithuanian blood in you?

  • 189. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 10:22 pm

    R @160:

    “It has nothing to do, Rabbit, with what people think of me. I try to avoid hypocrisy. To say your daughter is a mans equal in every way but draw the line when she comes in harms way is hypocrisy.”


    “You guys also seem to have a problem with holding seemingly contradictory thoughts in one’s head at one time. It’s called complexity. Life is not black and white.”

  • 190. El Tigre  |  April 5, 2014 at 10:49 pm

    R, I don’t what you’re blathering on about in reference to what I said. You got caught up defending your “manhood” and forgot what the discussion was about. Here’s a hint: it wasn’t your earning capacity or sense of duty to provide for your family financially — it was the draft applied to our mothers and daughters. Men as protectors. And DR needs to lose limbs to feel what its like to be weak and dependent then he’ll understand what to means to be a man. WTF??

    It ain’t complexity, R.

    You’re baffled by what I say because you don’t give it any thought.

    And I am baffled by you because I to often mistakenly think you believe in something.

  • 191. Tex Taylor  |  April 6, 2014 at 5:01 am

    Unemployment pay ain’t a handout, “R.” That’s like saying the corporate portion of your SS contribution is a handout. Believe me, over a period of 25 years, you paid for unemployment, one way or another. Your wife would have been a fool not to seek it and neither do I begrudge you it. If you want to know the real truth, I have never respected you more for the crappy job you took – those cheap shots were a ruse. Real men can put their ego in check and bare injustice. That makes you better than me in some respects.

    Neither is inheritance a handout. In this case, I consider it the final act of a real man taking care of his family – your father. Use the funds wisely and take care of your own daughter – that’s part of being a man.


    Manhood is physical prowess only in the sense of combat and protection. Do I consider Rabbit and Gorilla real men? Yes, I do. Do I feel they would put family before self? Yes, I do. Bravery and valor are part of being a real man.

    However, there are even more visible characteristics of strong men – and it’s not physical. Billy Graham is now infirm – wheelchair bound. Yet, I consider Billy Graham one of the strongest men on the planet.

    I prefer to view manhood like this, for what it is worth…

    Does a man stand for righteousness? Do they treat their wife and with honor, do they respect their parents, do they share in the responsibilities of family, are they are willing to take a stand and share the gospel of their faith while admitting their own weaknesses? Granted, there are physical, mental, and emotional changes that take place as a boy transitions through adolescence and into adulthood, but the main criteria for true manhood is the measure of the heart, a measure of the soul – not the body.

    There are men who live as boys, and there are boys who live as men. The issue isn’t so much age or physical prowess as it is the measure of how one thinks and where they stand.

    For example, Pfesser thinks of himself as a strong man. I think Pfesser is a boy in a man’s body with the mind of a child – carnal knowledge; a check mark in the liability column of humanity. Wasted gifts and wasted talent…And in fairness, I share many of his failed traits.

    Do you know something, “R?” And I don’t pick on you by using you as example because without you, I wouldn’t have met many of these fun people, you included. You secularists have no comprehension of what Fear of the Lord means. I don’t think you understand that wisdom trumps intellect every time.

    The ignorant and superficial Oprah Winfrey once stated that is what turned her off from the message of God – fear of the Lord. What a complete fool. If God is God and He did what He did. If the Lord can make all of creation with a word and judges the immortal soul. Yet, He is willing to sacrifice of Himself to save us, even if I am incapable of understanding much of it? Then only a fool does not respect that kind of authority – that unimaginable, incomprehensible measure of true power, His restraint included.

    Personally “R”, like all of us I think you have both aspects of a strong man and weak man having nothing to do with the physical. I think physically you are the bravest of us all, contrary as that might seem to the irrational world we live. But you too often think as a child – like a reed in the wind, you are easily swayed by evil that preys upon your emotions, your ‘feelings.’ Your reasoning is too often shallow and you are too often blind to real truth. You often cannot differentiate between evil and good.

    That’s your real weakness, IMO.

    I consider you physically strong and spiritually a wreck.

    By the way, I certainly don’t provide myself as the measure of the how and the where you should strive. In many ways, I have become pathetic – so apathetic and cynical to be almost useless.

    The world challenged me and I turned my back on it. So consider this message partially a message introspection and self help.

  • 192. El Tigre  |  April 6, 2014 at 8:07 am

    “Neither is inheritance a handout. In this case, I consider it the final act of a real man taking care of his family – your father. Use the funds wisely and take care of your own daughter – that’s part of being a man.”

    That is the damned truth.

  • 193. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 9:00 am

    I don’t know rabbit. I have found our name in Estonia with only one letter variation .Is it a coincidence of spelling or something else? Estonia is next to Lithuania. What if we were distant cousins? We definitely are if you have blue eyes… Cousin rabbit. I like that. Ha!

    I agree El Tigre. Your family built that, not the government. The inheritance and how you use it is one more refutation of the Obama socialist philosophy. It also shows how much of a man you are.

    Your arguments on this thread are mostly weak and contradictory because deep in your heart you know you are wrong about something you internalized years ago. Its hard to feel a piece of your identity disintegrate with no one left on the blog who feels your pain while people like us continue our attack on the remains of your ideology.

    You might as well be a Lithuanian forced to renounce your religion for Christianity. You may submit to baptism but you still worship the old gods just to be safe.

  • 194. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 9:26 am

    We have touched this here.

    On Twitchy “Actor Zach Braff surprised ‘liberal Jewish gun-hater’ like him has so many Texas followers.” shows the difference between liberals and conservatives. As others wrote, Zach confuses bigoted liberality with more tolerant conservatives who can disagree without despising the person.

    Liberals are bigots and racists.

  • 195. poolman  |  April 6, 2014 at 10:00 am

    Rutherford, you should never feel guilt using the money dad intentionally left you. It is a blessing. Every time it it used, it should cause you to smile and think lovingly about your dad. You should only feel guilt if you piss it away.

    As you said earlier, our abilities are on loan. It’s the same with anything. It’s all on loan. We may think we own stuff, but we really only get to steward stuff. Use it all wisely, there will be an accounting.

  • 196. poolman  |  April 6, 2014 at 11:30 am

  • 197. parker  |  April 6, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    R@181 – Family has obligation. Your dad wiped your arse when you were a stripling; I don’t know if you did the same for him before he died, but I’m sure you were willing, if required.

    Every man wishes to pass some part of himself on to his offspring to pave their way a little, in the same fashion that one generation feels obligated to pass some of its work down to the next. If it didn’t, there would never be any progress of man. Same for a family.

    Fuck the gods; it’s humans who need the help. When I do a favor for the devout and they offer to pray for me, I tell them, “Don’t do any useless silliness like that; when you find a man who needs help, you help him, and we’ll be square.”

    Your father helped advance HIS family; use his gift wisely and endeavour to do the same thing with your children, and I’ll venture that he’d say, “We’re square, Matt.”

  • 198. El Tigre  |  April 6, 2014 at 12:46 pm

    PF, Tex has you totally pegged. You’re one giant arrogant douche.

    I’m not a religious man, but I know for certain that you should accept the prayers, especially if they’re for some form of humility. It can’t hurt — and you can’t get any worse.

  • 199. Tex Taylor  |  April 6, 2014 at 1:05 pm

    PF, Tex has you totally pegged. You’re one giant arrogant douche.

    Ah, don’t be too harsh on old Parker, my younger friend.

    Guys like Parker know how to keep the SS in Pfesser and Progressive. :wink: The same level of jackboot that demanded that CEO from Mozilla be fired for not marching to the gay marriage tune, but without the chops to pull off doing much collateral damage unless I’m party to the PF estate orgy.

    Parker and millions like him are living proof of the prediction made 20 years ago by a really smart guy named Josh McDowell. Wrote a book called the ‘New Tolerance.’ I was reminded of that this morning and posted about it on another site. I need to pull that book out and reread it, because I’m now remembering enough that McDowell couldn’t have been more prescient about what would transpire in America and how it would happen quickly.

  • 200. El Tigre  |  April 6, 2014 at 1:53 pm

    Someone predicted this shit? Dickweeds like PF being given an expression of sincere gratitude in a most personal way being told, “fuck off idiot, repay your cosmic debt by being magnanimous, like me.” Then walks off feeling big about themselves?

  • 201. Tex Taylor  |  April 6, 2014 at 1:54 pm

    Heh! I didn’t want to let great news pass without making reference to the POS David Letterman being put to pasture. Maybe he can venture off to Fat Grannies for company.

    Top 10 Reasons David Letterman Is Retiring

    10. Can’t tell Cheney jokes anymore without angina pains

    9. Interns can no longer find it

    8. Last good idea was Calvert DeForest

    7. Never, ever, ever, ever, ever getting the Tonight Show

    6. The ‘80s were a long-ass time ago, bro

    5. Syphilis

    4. Wants to devote few remaining years to stalking Palin

    3. Stupid Grandpa Tricks

    2. Outlasted Leno, so hey, WTF

    1. Dude is old as $#!+

    ~ Jim Treacher

  • 202. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:13 pm

    How is the draft unfair? By draft I mean the most up to date variant we could possibly have if it were to be enacted.
    Post Civil War the draft had been brutally fair,the lottery system that didn’t give a shit when it picked your number. Vietnam era exemptions were overdramatized in my opinion and really only a thing secondary the shift in population makeup . This would be true today I think as well. Anything being unfair about it though I’m not getting.

  • 203. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    “We’re using the money now to make our lives better (like paying off lots of debt and replacing cars on the brink of extinction) But every dime I spend comes with a tinge of guilt — a tinge of unworthiness.”

    Quite possibly the worst waste of your inheritance imaginable. Not the part about making your lives better – that’s putting the money to good use. But the guilt is a waste. My dad would be disappointed. There’s joy in giving. Don’t deprive him of that whatever form you believe him to be now.

    You might want to stop misusing the word “rejoice,” Rutherford. You’ve done it twice or more in this thread. You’re also mixed up about feeling humbled. Humbled is good. What is a gift but that which you haven’t earned? Shower the people!

    I’m telling you now. You’ll honor your father more by being thankful and happy that he got to experience the joy of giving and the peace of knowing he was able to make your life better.

  • 204. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:18 pm

    I have dismissed my short held belief Rutherford was actually politically conflicted. In the recent past I indeed felt I was seeing him have a series of epiphanies but I can’t buy that any longer.
    No I think Rutherford is at best and worse firmly stuck in a liberal/ progressive morass based on a mix of ideology and high doses of emotional desire. A mix leading to disappointment dude.

  • 205. Tex Taylor  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:20 pm

    Dickweeds like PF being given an expression of sincere gratitude in a most personal way being told, “fuck off idiot, repay your cosmic debt by being magnanimous, like me.”

    LOL! LOL! Classic. Mr. Magnanimous.

    No, McDowell’s premise for his book (1999 by the way – not as long ago as I thought) was that by the new definition of ‘tolerance’, any claims to exclusivity, say in McDowell’s example of Jesus Christ’s claims to exclusivity of salvation, would become to be seen as intolerant and ultimately a threat that had to be first privatized, silenced and eventually eliminated.

    As I noted earlier today elsewhere, I’ve since realized Christianity is only the loudest, largest voice that needs to be muted for these small ‘c’ Communists to succeed. You don’t necessarily have to be “religious” to be a threat to their end goal – you certainly would be, Tigre. Gorilla, James and probably Huck too.

    They pick their enemies carefully. Don’t tell me most of these irreligious jackboots, especially white academia, have any real love for black or Islam. But both can be used as fodder toward a larger goal and both scare the hell out of white liberals.

    But I’m really talking systemic, planned machination. Black Conservatives must be savaged; conservative women must be demonized; home schooling ridiculed and downplayed; boys in public schools must be marginalized and doped. McDowell hinted in so many words that the worst institutionalized bigots in America would be race and gender advocates.

    These thought police tried like hell during the Iraq War to do the same to our military – mercenaries and baby killers, no blood for oil chants begin to rear their ugly head for a short time. But that had run its course unsuccessfully after Vietnam and was quickly and loudly quelled even by members on the Left.

    And let me add while Rutherford and I have had our beefs over the years, he is one of the true ‘tolerant’ people I’ve met. Jim Duggan was cut from the same cloth. But that has not been my common experience with the Left and militant small ‘l’ libertarians like Pfesser. They are making a concerted effort to redefine traditional norms for a very specific reason – any deviation cannot be tolerated.

  • 206. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:23 pm

    Rutherford in the coldest and perhaps meanest manner I have to add on to the inheritance guilt thing.
    Passing things onto ones offspring is an act of love and duty and it is one you are perhaps closer than others here of performing yourself.

  • 207. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:25 pm

    Pfarker you light up my life.

  • 208. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:27 pm

    @205 yes a variation just this past few weeks is how the liberals went ballistic on Rep Paul Ryan’s statement about the work averse types yet gave Kobe Bryant a pass on his statement about the Miami Heat being lock step morons with their hoodies in support of Trayvon Martin.
    Both guys full statements and context were 10000 % correct but one was a white (R) so that one gets the public shellacking.

  • 209. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:29 pm

    #204 – I agree with you Alfie.

  • 210. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:30 pm

    LOLOL @ Magnanimous, like me.

  • 211. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:32 pm

    I hate the rights crowing and twisting of data this past week as much as the lefts inane twisting of the same data re ACA sign ups .
    FACTS TRUTH ETC seems clear,the majority of those signed up were not uninsured before. A heavy amount of sign ups with a hefty amount being previously uninsured actually ended up on Medicaid. That numbers mostly from the left don’t add up.
    The laugher of the week was a line in a story from a O bot that ACA was never meant to eliminate uninsured. WHEN THE FUCK WAS THAT A PRIMARY PLATFORM PLANK???!!!

  • 212. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 2:42 pm

    Yes, this (Tex @ #205) has been on my mind, fellas. The Gathering. The Conjuring. Progs are fixing to use women to place Hillary in the white house and the damage they’ll do to women will pale in comparison to the damage to blacks in recent times. No pun intended – it will be awful and irreparable and when people stop caring about real mysogyny because of it – well woe is me.

  • 213. Tex Taylor  |  April 6, 2014 at 3:14 pm

    Ironic about Hillary, isn’t it Muffy?

    These feminists? Empowering women? Guffaw! Who is the stronger woman? Hillary groveling to Slick Willie so she become future Senator and player? Or Jenny Sanford who instructed Mark Sanford to take a hike for his extracurricular dalliances to protect her children from a scumbag?

    This is prime example how pathetic this country has become.

    Can you, offhand, think of a more cowardly, self-absorbed. self-serving woman than Hillary Clinton? She’s no better than those duplicitous shrews at NOW.

    Hillary may be a more empty suit than Zero if he weren’t the invisible President. She’s smarter than Zero, but without the charm. I grant her that. But she’s equally as devious and transparently as arrogant and that makes Hillary even more dangerous than our current dismal failure who can’t find both butt cheeks with two hands.

    Which is it? Was Hillary so stupid to not recognize her serial philandering husband was jiggling the house girl 30 years his junior? Or was Hillary so bankrupt for political expediency’s sake to voluntarily run interference for Slick Clinton’s escapades fighting the vast right-wing conspiracy?

    And since we all know Hillary Rotten is not stupid…

    Either way, Hillary is not fit hold any position of leadership. Her entire track record is one of both corruption and ill gotten gain. Her time as Sec. State was a disaster. How’s that Reset Button looking now, Madam Sec.?

    How’s it feel to have Vladimir Putin’s size 11 sickle boot up your beefy ass?

  • 214. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 4:02 pm

    I do think the difference in how Hillary and Jenny Sanford handled their respective cheating husbands speaks volumes.

    What bothers me more than anything is the expectation that she’ll not only allow herself to be used as a woman – she’ll perpetuate it. And again, it will hurt us all to equate fabricated mysogyny with the real deal.

    I don’t think a person has to be religious to consider that a grave sin – making false accusations. At the very least it’s a real shame.

  • 215. muffy  |  April 6, 2014 at 4:08 pm

    This is going to play like that old Indian aphorism about the blind men and the elephant. Much like “what difference at this point does it make?” where libs cheered “that’s tellin’ ‘em Hill” …

  • 216. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    202, Alfie, the draft during the Civil war was obviously unfair because one could buy his way out. Some men enlisted and deserted multiple times to get land which was used to bribe enlistees.

    The lottery system was brutally fair as you noted.

    Vietnam, not so much. I remember some pro football players got medical exemptions for something like flat feet .I remember, because it made my mother mad. Draft boards treated people unequally through their discretion. The government assigned them numbers and it didn’t care where they came from.

    For example, I was drafted because the man ahead of me dropped out and couldn’t be found. After a few weeks, they took me. I protested because I had already talked to the Air Force. The Army and Air Force fought over me for two weeks before the Air Force got me. Another unfortunate went in my place.

    Bill Clinton and others I knew got college deferments and never served. George W Bush did serve in the Texas Air National Guard, and I suspect people pulled strings to get him in. Openings didn’t seem available but his father, a Navy pilot was a war hero. Others faked illnesses and body damage to get deferments. I knew two men who did it. Others became ministers to get religious exemptions. Mumammad ali became a Muslim minister and evaded the draft though he may have become a minister anyway.

    Women were exempt.

    Champagne units offered cushy assignments to the connected. I suspect Al Gore may have been such a unit, though he served as a reporter in Vietnam. Colon Powell wrote in his autobiography that “I am angry that so many sons of the powerful and well placed and many professional athletes (who were probably healthier than any of us) managed to wrangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units. Of the many tragedies of Vietnam, this raw class discrimination strikes me as the most damaging to the ideal that all Americans are created equal and owe equal allegiance to our country.”

    I could go on, but you get the idea.I intend no disrespect, but you weren’t there, Alfie. I was. The Vietnam era draft was as unfair as today’s would be. People don’t change.

  • 217. Alfie  |  April 6, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    I have a question for Rutherford and any other anti- Citizens United types.
    Is there no correlation to that which Citizens is based in and the lynching of the Mozilla CEO?
    I find it an interesting that a corporate entity can be attacked via its people but somehow shouldn’t be able to speak up for any people.
    I also share the view that the Left has shown another angle of its ugly side and revealed yet another liberal land mine. Arrogant obsession to dogma not based in reality.
    When a portion of an element of population less than 4% ( perhaps 1%?) makes policy some folks build camps and say the world is ending sadly it doesn’t apply equally.
    PS fuck Firefox et al.

  • 218. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 6:06 pm

    213, those organizational feminists proved themselves to be whores when they failed to condemn Clinton’s predatory sex practices. I suspect Hillary would have sold her wares on a street corner to get what she wanted.

    204, the thought police made a last stand during the first Gulf War. The public treated our military well and were reluctant to protest because they know what had happened to Vietnam era veterans. A man wrote a book claiming the mistreatment had never happened. Veterans had faulty memories. Jerry Lembcke “The Spitting Image: ?” repeated the story later on.

    Fragging happened in Vietnam. I have the skills to repeat the process now, but I never would, because God said it is a sin, and I have a grand daughter to care for. Calling Hillary and her allies whores, bigots and socialists is as far as I will go.

  • 219. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 6:37 pm

    On military and liberals James you overstate the case based on terrible past experience. Current liberals support Vietnam vets as a protected hiring class. Current liberals are very concerned about PTSD.

  • 220. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 6:39 pm

    Thanks for your kind words James regarding “manhood”.

  • 221. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 6:45 pm

    Rabbit I’m not offering her up. If she volunteered I’d say she was out of her mind. If she got drafted I’d be beside myself. But you cannot pay lip service to equal rights without equal obligations.

    Hell, they should draft my ass. I could be a radio operator like my Dad was. He didn’t see combat. (He was stationed in Germany during the Korean War.)

  • 222. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 6:54 pm

    Huh? Tigre I didn’t say Rabbit needed to know how it feels to be weak and dependent. I DON’T FEEL WEAK AND DEPENDENT AND NEVER HAVE.

    It would take the loss of a leg or two for Rabbit to figure out being able-bodied ain’t all that.

    As for being protector of my daughter you’ve got a stupid double standard at play. What kind of Dad is a protector if he’s ok with his SON being drafted. We shouldn’t want any of our children in harms way.

    Are you such a numbskull that you’d be brimming with pride if your son got drafted, cos he’d be doing his manly duty?

  • 223. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 7:02 pm

    I’m not done reading comments yet but I thank Rabbit for triggering some of the most thoughtful comments I’ve read in a while.

    Doesn’t a good discussion of how we should conduct our private real lives trump political debates any day of the week? It’s a harder discussion but more fulfilling than arguing over people and things over which we have little if any control.

  • 224. El Tigre  |  April 6, 2014 at 7:31 pm

    R, I wont comment because you didn’t read what I wrote or apparently remember what you did again. Sometimes wonder if your real handicap is reading comprehension or blindness.

    Show me where I said I was okay with my son being drafted let alone brimming with pride?

    Your kneejerk comment is plain stupid.

  • 225. Rutherford  |  April 6, 2014 at 8:32 pm

    Tigre makes a good point about offered prayers. I never scoff when a believer sincerely tells me I am in their prayers because despite my belief system I know this is their deepest show of empathy.

    On a humorous side note, whenever my wife’s community church newsletter sends out prayers for the afflicted, they die soon thereafter. Makes one question Tigre’s “can’t do any harm” premise. :-)

  • 226. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 11:05 pm

    219, Yes, Rutherford, I overstated it a little. In the 1980’s the University of Michigan, I think made political correctness speech rules which a court refused. One of the protected groups was Vietnam era veterans.

    My wife and I were in Staples fifteen years ago. They were selling business signs saying the buyers were in compliance with civil rights laws. A list of the protected included Vietnam era veterans.

    I agree, some liberals support help for veterans and service people, but non- legislators while less vocal still dislike our service people. They can be found on blogs and in private life.For example, relatively few high ranking entertainers visited our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan,. Robin Williams a liberal was there several times, and he made our niece part of a show in Afghanistan. He also kissed her on stage and wrote her a nice note.

    He criticized his fellow stars for not bothering and acknowledged politics surrounding their lack of participation. Jessica Simpson is another entertainer who visited the troops, but I believe she is fairly conservative.

    I don’t the think the Obamas or Hillary give a fig about our service people. Joe Biden probably does.

  • 227. James  |  April 6, 2014 at 11:18 pm

    Last year, the American Legion asked me to give a speech in each county town to commemorate Memorial Day, My theme was “Will you remember me?” Others had to read my speech because we were sort of on call for our daughter’s possible induced labor. We were waiting from day to day. In the end, we were free, and I read the speech in our home town.

    The commander asked me to give another speech this year, and if I am lucky they will have forgotten since we are gone so much now. Just in case, my next speech will be Tough Enough based on the Estonian band Vanilla Ninga song. This blog gave me the idea.

  • 228. Tex Taylor  |  April 7, 2014 at 12:33 am

    Vanilla Ninga?

    James, I read that wrong at first glance. I thought it read the band Vanilla Nigga and started to laugh out loud.

    I thought WTH does that represent? Is that like the rap version of Ebony and Ivory, or something?

    So I looked it up. I’ll take all four. Sounds like that Amadeus song from years ago. :smile:

    Make a great name for virtual blog band here, Rutherford ‘Demi Moore’ Lawson as lead vocalist and song writer. I can write the chorus.

  • 229. Tex Taylor  |  April 7, 2014 at 12:43 am

    I can still remember dancing to this with a blond haired beauty down on 6th Street in Austin, TX. Must have been around 1985, right before I met Mrs. Taylor. We were both in a wedding and fell into lust after too much champagne. I can’t even remember her name. LOL That’s what happens when you get old – an incredible ability to purge….

  • 230. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 7:00 am

    Tigre the argument has been about drafting girls and you said that it is evidence of my lack of manhood that I would not be a protector of my daughter. No one here has brought up an objection to drafting boys.

    So I was asking you are you any more a man for letting your son get drafted than your daughter getting drafted.

    Can I now infer that any support of the draft suggests a lack of manhood based on not fulfilling the protector of your children role?

    I have to do a lot inference with you cos 50% of your comments are cryptic as hell to me. I honestly think it’s the lawyer in you.

  • 231. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 7:06 am

    Hillary Clinton clearly struck a deal with the devil long ago. Bill could take a dump on her face on live TV and all would be forgiven if her political future was intact or even improved by it.

    By the way Tex I disagree that she was a disaster as SoS. She was the very definition of nothing burger. It was all about photo ops. I still say Kerry is doing a better job.

    To say Hill was a disaster is to suggest she actually DID something.

  • 232. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 7:07 am

    Muffy I am honestly curious. Could you give an example of what you define as real mysogyny vs fabricated?

  • 233. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:27 am

    “Tigre the argument has been about drafting girls and you said that it is evidence of my lack of manhood that I would not be a protector of my daughter. No one here has brought up an objection to drafting boys.”

    Still can’t read.

    All I mentioned was your half sequitur didn’t match what DR was saying. He was talking about another “obligation” men have, i.e. to physically protect women, something you know about only in the abstract. He was saying that is why you have a pajama-boy outlook you have (paraphrase) — it’s something that you’ve been excluded from.

    Now look at your response. You don’t address DR’s point or the dumb “equality” argument you setout. Instead, you make the point by pointing to other obligations men have — ones that you take pride in fulfilling. You acknowledge gender roles exist and are beneficial. But discount entirely one of the most significant. Protector. Physically. Your tangent doesn’t go to that point.

    These are my questions: should a man be permitted to hit a woman? Does a man have any “obligations” when he sees woman being beaten? Are those the same as woman has to a man in your view? Why? Apply that to the draft you propose as a measure of “equality.”

    Suffice it to say that the inferences are what you supply to my comments, not what I imply. I’m usually just calling bullshit.

    As I said, I think your logic is always so scattershot because you don’t believe in anything. It’s frustrating trying to break through to you. You’ve conditioned yourself to avoid the debate because you either don’t believe in what you’re saying or don’t know enough about it.

    I also agree with DR that you seem to lack some life experiences that make your comments on certain topics incredibly naïve. You not only lack street sense, you discredit it. At the same time, you claim to have superior perspective on other experiences beyond your ken when it comes to matters like feminism, urban race relations, the poor etc. etc. etc. — always replacing actual experience/knowledge with empathy/sympathy based on what you imagine them to be. Then you stubbornly hold to your beliefs.

    And all of this is why I said from the outset your were incapable of the type of introspection that might lead to an epiphany.

  • 234. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:38 am

    “So I was asking you are you any more a man for letting your son get drafted than your daughter getting drafted.”


    “Can I now infer that any support of the draft suggests a lack of manhood based on not fulfilling the protector of your children role?”

    No. But I wonder what you mean by “children” — are those that choose to enlist voluntarily still “children” in need of “protection” too?

    p.s. I never commented on the draft. FWIW, I don’t think women should be subject to the draft. We’re better served if they are not. One reason is the gender roles you claim to acknowledge in the raising of children. If a choice has to be made, children need their moms. I also don’t believe that women, as a class, are “equal” when it comes to warfare.

  • 235. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:44 am

    BTW, so there is no mistake, I believe your are a man for all of the reasons you said, and others you didn’t. I also believe you have proven yourself honorable and strong.

    So there.

  • 236. James  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:47 am

    Tex, I play “Tough Enough” for our nine month grand daughter. She has learned to wave her arms around and move to the rhythm. They called themselves Vanilla Ninga because all had light hair. They became so popular a company in Estonia named an ice cream flavor after them.

    One of the women quit to have a baby. Another finished law school, and a third became a writer and TV producer. I think the light brown- haired woman moved to Los Angeles and joined a band.

  • 237. Tex Taylor  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:02 am

    She was the very definition of nothing burger.

    I don’t think so, R. Agree she did nothing in the way of accomplishment as even she couldn’t list one, but Hillary was #2 in groveling during the Apology Tour of Barack Obama about mean old, bad boy, imperialistic America. Hillary played no small part in leading the perception America damaged goods and weak.

    Remember? How Mr. Obama, Nobel Peace Prize Winner, was going change the world by handing everyone a Coke? The reset button Clinton couldn’t even spell right? Hillary Rotten is inextricably tied to the massive foreign policy failures of the Obama administration, doesn’t matter whether she was truly a lap dog, or not. I just can’t picture Hillary as some potted plant doing Obama’s bidding. Her ego is every bit as large as Obama’s. Obama is perfectly happy to receive adulation and let others do the work. Hillary played no small part in formulation of the dismal failure.

    R, I want some introspection from you about how you have “inextricably” tied yourself to the party most damaging America.

    America has become such a visible den of theft and immorality and sophistry around the globe, enemies wishing to do America great harm are now posing themselves as moral arbiters. How twisted has it gotten when a former KGB agent is now looked upon as peace maker? Are you beginning to understand?

    Putin is more clever, radical Islam more clever, China more clever than the arrogant, decadent Left ever understood. Wouldn’t you agree?

    And lets not kid ourselves idiots calling themselves Christians who might happen to read this. Don’t let our mistrust and disdain of Obama color our judgement like the Left foolishly does in its discernment of good and evil.

    Just because Obama an empty suit and immoral man doesn’t make Vladimir Putin to be adorned with sainthood either. Vladamir wears a cross on his chest to front the hammer and sickle on his back. He’s not to be trusted.

    Pull your head out of the sand, Pharisees. Like Obama, don’t listen to what Putin says. Watch what he does.

  • 238. James  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:13 am

    231, Hillary was a disaster because she didn’t do anything when we needed action. The State Department allegedly lost money during her tenure.

    An antidote to the open sewer in Washington DC was the American Country Music Awards show. One highlight was a Shakira, Blake Shelton duet. Stevie Nicks and Lady Antibellum sang “Rianna” well too.

    I loved the music, but as Waylon Jennings once sang, “Did Old Hank really do it this way?”

  • 239. Tex Taylor  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:13 am

    I don’t want women in the draft for one simple reason. Men work better together when not distracted. And there is nothing more distracting to a group of men than a set of curvy hips in their midst. Chivalry is great – but it has no part in war, and in fact becomes a liability inhibiting effectiveness of a war machine.

    A soldier’s premise may be to serve, but ultimately a soldier is there to destroy, if necessary.

    Let’s get back to being politically incorrect and letting the military do its job without interference of becoming an academic sociology test. We’re not Israel. Israel has physical limitations in numbers.

    There’s plenty of men here to go to war and pick from.

  • 240. James  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:20 am


    Empathy/sympathy are wonderful emotions. They also are wonderful weapons to understand what an enemy is thinking and to mess with his/her mind. Turned backward, they are instruments of emotional damage which can hurt more than a blow to the face.

  • 241. James  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:23 am

    Ben Folds and William Shatner “In Love” is a musical example of the miss -use of empathy/sympathy.

  • 242. James  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:34 am


    Tex, another thing you only hinted at is the combination of propinquity, occasional fierce emotionality associated with danger and run of the mill emergencies. Love and fraternization develop with more problems, including greater loyalty to the emotional partner than to the group. Then, come the babies.

    Love is a beautiful thing, but our TI’s told us “If the Air Force had wanted you to have wives, it would have issued them.”

  • 243. an800lbgorilla  |  April 7, 2014 at 10:50 am

    “Well I’m guessing G is disappointed that Fort Hood Shooter Redux turned out not to be Muslim. Would have been another nice pin in the Obama antiterrorism balloon.”

    Because this was somehow better?

    A threat is a threat, and this guy wasn’t the poster child that you on the left have been gleefully tweeting about. PTSD? Four months on the FOB doesn’t get you there.

    How do I feel about multiple deployments? Hmmmm, I’ve done four deployments:

    The last was 15 months in the heart of the Sunni triangle during the Surge in Iraq…as a civilian…who volunteered. I didn’t have to be there and could have left at any time, but I believed in what I was doing and what we were doing. Doesn’t mean I didn’t have complaints about how things were done.

    My other deployments, while in the service, were 12 months and two six month deployments.

    This doesn’t count the multiple times I’ve visited the Middle East for multiple other reasons, both professional and personal.

    I’ll hold the invective because I know R was trying to get a rise out of me.

  • 244. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 4:07 pm

    Ohhhh Tigre you were looking for an epiphany!

    Introspection leads to two things, rejection of some ideas and confirmation of others. If you thought my introspection was going to transform me into Charles Krauthammer then I’m sorry to disappoint you. :-)

    P.S. I know I am naive about some things but frankly I wouldn’t want the experiences that have made some of you so cynical. With few exceptions I don’t see many dreamers among you and I find that sad.

  • 245. an800lbgorilla  |  April 7, 2014 at 4:42 pm

    (Politico) — Here’s an example of how political marketing works in the Internet era…

    At 9:00 a.m., publishes an “exclusive first look” at a new video from the Democratic National Committee, in which Vice President Joe Biden urges Dems to stand up for voting rights.

    At 9:04 a.m., the Democratic National Committee’s communications director retweets MSNBC’s tweets about the article and, over the course of the next hour, tweets more links to the MSNBC article. Other DNC operatives do the same.

    At 9:23 a.m., the Democratic National Committee sends a blast email to reporters promoting the piece. There’s no additional language here: just an embedded video and the text of the article, copy and pasted.

    In other words, the DNC had a video it wanted to promote. But knowing how often reporters overlook or ignore press releases, the DNC likely figured the video would have more reach — and seem more legitimate — if a news organization was already reporting on it. In MSNBC, a liberal outlet, it found a receptive audience.

  • 246. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 4:55 pm

    Ahhh but James wouldn’t Bing and Bowie be an example of excellent musical empathy?

  • 247. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 6:07 pm

    G, thanks for the restraint. But you kinda avoided the question. If you were content with your multiple deployments should that be the norm for all enlisted? Is that the ideal model for our military?

    Second, you’re not really gonna bitch about MSNBC when Fox was fed story lines by the Bush admin for years, are you? Holy cow, pot meet kettle.

  • 248. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 6:07 pm

    “Ohhhh Tigre you were looking for an epiphany!”

    No. As I said, I don’t think you have the capacity to engage in introspection.

  • 249. Rutherford  |  April 7, 2014 at 6:09 pm

    But Tigre you missed the point. Introspection doesn’t necessarily have to result in total reversal.

  • 250. dead rabbit  |  April 7, 2014 at 6:31 pm

    Content? He manned the fuck up. He wasn’t content.
    Purring Persian cats and burping babies are content.

    What’s wrong with you, man?

  • 251. eltigre100  |  April 7, 2014 at 7:31 pm

    I read what you wrote.

    I am also familiar with your dramer missive. Too bad you can’t realize them through your politics. . . Unless dystopia is your dream.

  • 252. Just a Lurker  |  April 7, 2014 at 7:44 pm

    A little late for the party regarding Rutherford’s “manhood” discussion.

    I respect Rutherford as a man for not being afraid or threatened by surrounding him self with people who have different opinions or beliefs. He does not ban those with opposing views from his blog. He does not resort to a nasty name calling temper tantrum when some one has an opinion he does not share. He is able to listen to others and gives thought to their opinions. He is open to changing his opinion when he finds reason. He can admit to being wrong. He is able to criticize or disagree with his party. IMO he does not think the USA would be “perfect” if there were no conservatives or Republican party. He is not so arrogant as to believe his ideals or views are completely right and the only way to run this country.

    He does not mock those who believe in a god or who turn to a book to tell them what to think. Nor does he push his beliefs on them.

    Rutherford has put up with some very nasty negative abusive comments yet he has not allowed them to turn him into a hateful negative man.

  • 253. an800lbgorilla  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:08 pm

    Lurker, go fuck yourself….


  • 254. Just a Lurker  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:18 pm

    Thank you for making my point. And you may go fuck yourself as well.

  • 255. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:21 pm

    I believe JOL is hitting on Rutherford.

  • 256. an800lbgorilla  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:30 pm

    I was joking dickweed…

  • 257. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:31 pm

    JAL, what does any of what you respect Rutherford for have to do with his “manhood.” Couldn’t he be a woman and possess all those fine attributes you find so estimable?

  • 258. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:41 pm

    Begging your pardon Rutherford we just assumed when you announced your introspection tour that you were going to write about it. I’m with the “I don’t see it” crowd.

    “I know I am naive about some things but frankly I wouldn’t want the experiences that have made some of you so cynical. With few exceptions I don’t see many dreamers among you and I find that sad.”

    Says the man so obviously living the dream.

    Most of us here are working towards a dream or living in a dream we’ve already commited to so don’t give me any of that crap about not seeing many dreamers here. What you don’t see here among your loyal readers are many flakes.

  • 259. dead rabbit  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:48 pm

    “With few exceptions I don’t see many dreamers among you and I find that sad.’

    Dreamers don’t do shit.

    Now pipe dreamers…you are all just low hanging fruit for con men.

  • 260. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 8:59 pm

    ”Muffy I am honestly curious. Could you give an example of what you define as real mysogyny vs fabricated?”

    Sure, I’ll play along.

    Honor killings, sex slave trade, female genital mutilation, Uday and Qusay Hussein’s rape rooms, 14-year old Malala shot in the head for seeking education, 8 year old child bride in Yemeni dying of internal injuries on her wedding night, sex selective abortion CRISIS in Asia and India …you know, stuff like that.


    “Binders of women,” girls denied enrollment in the Boy Scouts of America, Gloria Allred, paying for Sandra Fluke’s gender reassignment surgery…you know, stuff like that.

  • 261. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:03 pm


  • 262. Just a Lurker  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:26 pm

    Muffy – so you don’t care for my using the term “manhood”. Fine. Yes, of course, it can apply either gender. It describes a person who is mature confident and secure in themselves.

    800 G – Well, I’m not joking. However, I don’t believe “dickweed” is the appropriate insult. Unless you are grade school level.

  • 263. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:33 pm

    JAL – I don’t have a problem with the term. I put it in quotes because you did.

    I just don’t get why you “respect Rutherford as a man for…etc.” when all of those attributes can apply, as you say yourself, to either gender.

  • 264. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:57 pm

    Well this whole manhood thing just reminds me of that old Greek aphorism about the two fighting cocks and the eagle.

    TWO GAME COCKS were fiercely fighting for the mastery of the
    farmyard. One at last put the other to flight. The vanquished
    Cock skulked away and hid himself in a quiet corner, while the
    conqueror, flying up to a high wall, flapped his wings and crowed
    exultingly with all his might. An Eagle sailing through the air
    pounced upon him and carried him off in his talons. The
    vanquished Cock immediately came out of his corner, and ruled
    henceforth with undisputed mastery.

    There you go Rutherford you clever old cock.

    PS…not for nothing but I don’t think it’s very manly to use the phrase “au contraire” though. :lol:

  • 265. Just a Lurker  |  April 7, 2014 at 9:57 pm

    Muffy am missing your point?…should I have said for the “man he is” to make it easier for you to understand. Otherwise I can’t help you. You will have to work it out for yourself or accept it as one of life’s mysteries you just have to learn to deal with, sweetheart.

  • 266. Tex Taylor  |  April 7, 2014 at 10:02 pm


    Your double standards are a sight to behold. If Rutherford just happened to not be aligned with your flavor of politic, you’d be singing a different tune.

    Why don’t you step up and do something unusual?

    Like admit Barack Obama isn’t the “man” you thought he was going to be. And if you were really honest, you could “man up” and go one step further and finally admit he’s not just the man you thought he was going to be.

    He’s a disaster in which your incredibly poor judgment of character and talent was unable to discern not once, but twice.

  • 267. muffy  |  April 7, 2014 at 10:10 pm

    JAL – easy there tiger. I’m just trying to keep the conversation lively.

    PS…yes I think my point was lost but it was a teeny little point not worth quibbling over anyhow.

  • 268. El Tigre  |  April 7, 2014 at 10:13 pm


  • 269. Rutherford  |  April 8, 2014 at 4:04 am

    So Muffy can I paraphrase? Real mysogyny involves irreparable damage while fabricated involves getting ones feelings hurt. :-)

  • 270. Rutherford  |  April 8, 2014 at 4:08 am

    LOL Muffy about au contraire. If you had a dime for every time my wife tells me “that was pretty gay Matt” you’d be a rich woman. :-)

  • 271. Rutherford  |  April 8, 2014 at 4:21 am

    Lurker thanks for the kind words. I must admit I’ve resorted to nastiness on the blog (just look at my gratuitous attack on Gorilla).

    Still I wish you were around more. The lone liberal thing gets old. Heck, I’ve resorted to introspection even if Tigre is not impressed.

  • 272. an800lbgorilla  |  April 8, 2014 at 5:50 am

    Oh yes, Lurker, hang out more. More mindless dribble back with nothing but feelings is exactly what R needs…

    Liberals aren’t use to this. Usually, they collect a bunch of low information frauds to shout down any alternative views and prevent the possibility that someone might randomly generate an independent thought.

    Liberals are many things, tolerant is not one of them…

  • 273. an800lbgorilla  |  April 8, 2014 at 6:09 am

    Lurker, since you seem to want to have a conversation, maybe you can explain how Obama is helping the average American advance?

    Curious why March hourly wages fell, and why the weekly number continues to trend at a near-recession level, and certainly one that does not support a 2% inflation growth case? Here’s why: in March the best paying industry groups – information, financial activities and manufacturing (which actually saw a drop of 1,000 jobs in the past month) – added a cumulative total of… 2,000 jobs among them. Where was the bulk of the job gains? At the worst paying sectors of course.

    Education and Health: +34K
    Leisure and Hospitality: +29K
    Temp Help: +29K
    Retail Trade: +21K

    And that’s why there is no inflation (at least according to whatever the Fed’s preferred inflationary indicator du jour is): because the jobs that are “added” to the economy, have virtually no wage and/or purchasing power growth. But at least the “recovery” continues.

    Pelosi says we’re now fixed, which of course, is a bald faced lie. But then again, we’re pretty much use to all liberals lying, either directly (Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Holder, etc, etc, etc) or indirectly (you, R, or any other low information twit who just parrots what you’re told to parrot)…

  • 274. Tex Taylor  |  April 8, 2014 at 6:57 am

    You know what, Gorilla? Something I came to realize long ago.

    Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Holder are obvious reprobates. They aren’t just bad – they’re wicked. But they aren’t really what ails America – they’re a monument and testimony to our country’s imminent failure.

    It’s the typical Obama voter like JAL that is killing us. I don’t single them out but to use as example. I guarantee JAL doesn’t see it that way, though. Critical thinking was long ago cast to the winds in this country. And I’m not sure millions like JAL are capable enough to even understand what you’re saying. Classic reactionary – ‘D’ good, ‘R’ evil. ‘D’ means taking care of the poor, little man (cough cough), social justice, rights like having an abortifacient available.

    We opponents of Obama should admit that we started losing this battle long ago when we let the Left take over the media, take over our public schools, take over our government institutions, take over our entertainment.

    I don’t mean to sound arrogant and I don’t claim to have all the answers. But a very hard choice is coming for those of us who haven’t succumbed to the lies and the distortions.


    Two years ago, people like Lurker were using ‘GM Lives’ as a talking point of Obama’s rousing success, parroting imbeciles like Joe Biden for justification of Obama’s reelection.

    Success to JAL, Thor, the insufferable Graychin, etc…was sticking the American public with a $16 billion loss, only to now find out two years later, GM purposely chose to ignore a problem actually killing people. Now the Congressional Democratic dog and pony show starts, once again in the name of looking out for the little man and the unions.

    Men like our blog host chose to ignore Mitt Romney’s lifetime of successes because he was white, rich, privileged, and male. Those traits immediately eliminated Mitt Romney as possible President. And Obama was….

    Well Obama was black and a Harvard graduate, with a gift of reading prepared speeches and pandering for votes.

    How do you possibly overcome that lack of insight and inability to discern success from failure, with more than half the country believing it? How do you overcome that kind of prejudice if our elected are too gutless to even make mention of the obvious?

    A few days ago, a black mob damn near beat to death one white man who stopped because he had hit a 10 year black kid playing a dangerous game of jumping out in front of cars off the curb.

    Last night on FOX News, I heard a debate that I could not believe. The debate was whether the beating was racially motivated. And not a one of them, Bill O’Reilly included, had the guts to state the obvious.

    Our party for whatever it is, is a party led by cowards and politically correct.

  • 275. El Tigre  |  April 8, 2014 at 8:29 am

    “Heck, I’ve resorted to introspection even if Tigre is not impressed.”

    Yeah. Real martyrdom, R.

    You have a funny definition of “introspection.” We’ve all been waiting for it, and here it’s been achieved?

  • 276. James  |  April 8, 2014 at 8:36 am

    246, Yes. Rutherford, they would.

    I agree with Lurker’s description of Rutherford. Unfortunately, Rutherford is often politically wrong, and he has so internalized his ideology and biases that it is hard to emotionally accept the truth, even when intellectually, it is too obvious to ignore.

    Its nice to read you again Lurker. The two worst insults one can hurl today are “liberal” and “progressive.”‘

    Regarding the black mob and the knock out games, black racism doesn’t exist because blacks are a powerless minority. Even if it did, the fascists would destroy anyone who pointed it out, just as they do with opponents of gay marriage.

    Another insult worthy of liberal and progressive is coward.

  • 277. James  |  April 8, 2014 at 8:41 am

    Rutherford, we agree Hillary is not fit to be president. What does that mean for the next election?

    Will you vote for someone else, or will you vote for Hillary and rationalize that her opponent is worse than she is? What is your definition of “worse?” What about you, Lurker? What do you think?

  • 278. Huck  |  April 8, 2014 at 10:57 am

    “Will you vote for someone else, or will you vote for Hillary and rationalize that her opponent is worse than she is?”

    We already know the answer to that.

    Rutherford has stated numerous times that he is waiting for the GOP to give him “a reason not to vote for Hillary.” That right there says it all. His default position is to vote for Hillary, even though he knows she is a reprehensible person who is not qualified to lead our nation and has no business thinking about doing so.

    Alternatives would be…”waiting for the GOP to give me a reason to vote for anyone” or “waiting for Democrats to give me a reason not to vote GOP”

    But we’re not hearing any of those.

    Mark my words..Rutherford’s vote for Hillary Clinton is already in the bag.

    He likes to claim he’d have voted for Huntsman had he got the nomination…but we all know that’s bullshit. Had Huntsman done so, the dirt diggers would have turned up, or fabricated, some reason to disqualify him in the eyes of the Rutherfords of the country.

    I don’t really blame him. Rutherford’s an unapologetic liberal democrat. The idea that he would ever vote for anything but is foolishness. My only gripe is that he tries to get us–and perhaps himself–to believe there was a chance he wouldn’t, and that it’s our fault when he doesn’t.

  • 279. Huck  |  April 8, 2014 at 10:59 am

    “…and that it’s our fault when he doesn’t.”

  • 280. El Tigre  |  April 8, 2014 at 11:32 am

    “My only gripe is that he tries to get us–and perhaps himself–to believe there was a chance he wouldn’t, and that it’s our fault when he doesn’t.”

    The term now is not rationalization, it’s “introspection,” Huck.

  • 281. Tex Taylor  |  April 8, 2014 at 11:58 am

    The term now is not rationalization, it’s “introspection,” Huck.

    LOL! How Lib. We’ve gone from cognitive dissonance, to rationalization, to introspection. Like from infanticide, to abortion, to reproductive rights.

    Huck is right, of course. Rutherford would cast the ‘D’ vote now if he could, I don’t care whether it is Christie or anyone else. So would Lurker and the rest of the bunch. It’s in their DNA – reflexive instinct.

    But Huck, I do consider it somewhat a sign of resignation, even maturity, that at least that Rutherford no longer parrots the daily lib meme routinely without a degree of reservation. Heck, even some of tweets have been of a scolding nature directed at sleazebags like Bill Maher.

    That’s a degree of progress, though nothing life changing.

  • 282. parker  |  April 8, 2014 at 8:51 pm

    re: “au contraire” and manhood.

    That says it all, doesn’t it? If you are educated, thoughtful, or can use words from another language, you’re not a man.

    Welcome to the blog, Sarah.

  • 283. El Tigre  |  April 8, 2014 at 9:10 pm

    PF wants your approval R. Please indulge. It’s getting weird.

  • 284. James  |  April 8, 2014 at 9:46 pm

    Hello Parker, Oui, c’est bizarre.

  • 285. James  |  April 8, 2014 at 9:56 pm

    Eric Holder a’ Texas Rep “vous ne voulez pas aller buddy.”

  • 286. muffy  |  April 8, 2014 at 10:01 pm

    Ouch. That’s showing me the schlagfertigkeit, you old fossil.

  • 287. Huck  |  April 8, 2014 at 10:31 pm

    Any comments from Lurker or Rutherford on what is said in the video?

  • 288. Rutherford  |  April 9, 2014 at 4:16 am

    James my worst nightmare is Hillary vs Ted Cruz. I may have to just sit it out or move to Canada.

  • 289. Rutherford  |  April 9, 2014 at 4:22 am

    Maybe I give you guys too much credit. When you say I will vote reflexively you paint me the idiot. Not very nice at all.

    Sadly votes are confidential so you won’t even believe I voted for Christie after I do it.

  • 290. Rutherford  |  April 9, 2014 at 4:24 am

    How’s Jeb lookin to you guys after he said illegally crossing the border is an act of love?

  • 291. Alfie  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:28 am

    How’s Jeb looking to you guys after he said illegally crossing the border is an act of love?
    He’s not looking any better or worse for me regards that snippet. I would also add that I wouldn’t be a likely Jeb voter for a number of reasons.
    As far as the depths of that comment it is in fact a statement with a lot of truth tied to it. The thing is any US elected/appointed official needs to be more concerned wight he word illegal. Too many folks of both parties are too willing to take the path of least resistance on that and change the word illegal in same way or another. SOVEREIGNTY MATTERS and every nation that has forgotten or significantly altered that has faltered.

  • 292. Alfie  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:31 am

    @289 Rutherford the proof is in the pudding. If you pony up a string of posts pushing Christie or the points he pounds then all would be forgiven. The thing is he won’t be pushing too much that you won’t see in say a Walker or Ryan run and you wouldn’t go there.
    Your best best is sitting it out or having an indie left be there for you. The thing is unless Al Gore or someone like that mans up you gots Hill

  • 293. an800lbgorilla  |  April 9, 2014 at 7:08 am

    He’s pulling for Liz Warren. Not enough fail with Obama, so he needs to double down…

  • 294. Tex Taylor  |  April 9, 2014 at 7:59 am

    Not enough fail with Obama, so he needs to double down…

    ** GUFFAW **

    Got to admit, Gorilla. Lizzie has got the transparent, opportunistic lying down to a fine art, high cheek bones and all. She’s as close to the female Obama as one can get. Don’t believe Lizzie, she will Sioux.

    Nah, R. I know you’re not an idiot. But I also know you’re a cradle to grave Dim. You don’t know anything else and your Ted Cruz comment demonstrates you’re still carrying forth with the Journolist meme – I’m surprised there hasn’t been a great deal of Koch Brothers discussion round these parts.

  • 295. parker  |  April 9, 2014 at 8:55 am

    G’day, R.

    Are you a man yet, or are you still using them big words? You blackfellas don’t really know what those words mean, anyway. After all, with all that Haaaahvahhhhd book-l’arnin’, you might start getting ideas.

    But cheer up, old man – them Real ‘Merkins (and merkins they are, too) like Sarah will take care of you. She’ll come ridin’ in on her allosaurus, and the day is saved!

  • 296. James  |  April 9, 2014 at 9:04 am

    Thanks for your answer, Rutherford.

    Betsys page has some information you should read. Chicago Magazine investigated crime statistics Rahm Emanuel’s administration reclassified murders as death investigations or as less serious crimes apparently to lower Chicago’s murder rate. They did this for several murders before a news conference touting the lower numbers.

    Law enforcement and families of victims are angry.

    The White House admitted that a gender gap of 77 cents is not accurate and is not about discrimination, but they will continue to lie about it.

    ObamaCare was supposed to virtually end Medicare Advantage, to save money on ObamaCare. I selfishly thought that was a bad idea, but six weeks later, Obama has folded.

    Most people who have missed the insurance purchase deadline will not be able to buy insurance until January 1,2015. Will not be able to buy anything before that date, even if they go outside of the exchanges.

    Harry Reid and Chuck Shumer who have been vocally criticizing the Koch brothers both accepted contributions from them.

    These are just a few examples of the corrupt party Democrats have evolved into.

    I respect your choices, but could you consider the implications of voting against a candidate who while representing what you find repugnant would through his/her defeat allow in another who would continue what we have now? Court appointees, bureauocratic appointments and regulations, our foreign policy and defense spending are just a few effects attached to a president. Anther is justice through investigation of wrong doing.

    If Hillary doesn’t run, which Democrat, independent, or Republican could you support who would have the will and votes not to perpetuate what we have now? Why?

    We all should ask and answer these questions, and those too thoughtless or ignorant to even know their candidates should not be allowed to vote.

  • 297. James  |  April 9, 2014 at 9:19 am

    Ha Ha Muffy! I am older than dirt, but I’m not under it yet.

  • 298. Tex Taylor  |  April 9, 2014 at 9:29 am

    Hey Parker. I got an “evolution” question for your imbeciles scholars that still believe in spontaneous generation of life. :smile:

    You’re probably not gifted enough to understand genetics, but MHC (Major Histocompatibility Complex) was determined sometime back to be perhaps the most conserved gene since you burst from the amino muck (snicker). You know, that gene that prevents organ transplants and the like?

    I got one question. Why is it that porcine’s MHC has proven to be more compatible with man than your ancestors, the Great Apes? Xenografts demonstrate this time and again – pig vessels good; ape vessels bad.

    Is the ‘Tree of Spontaneous Life’ got the wrong limb for us and Porky Pig your nearest relative?

    I got about a million questions for you atheistic evolutionists nobody can answer ‘scientifically.’ Dwell on that and the bitcoin investment and get back with me.

  • 299. an800lbgorilla  |  April 9, 2014 at 10:09 am



    “I’m sorry, we are no longer accepting that kind of insurance. I apologize for the confusion; Dr. [insert name] is only willing to see existing patients at this time.”

    As a proud new beneficiary of the Affordable Health Care Act, I’d like to report that I am doctorless. Ninety-six. Ninety-six is the number of soul crushing rejections that greeted me as I attempted to find one. It’s the number of physicians whose secretaries feigned empathy while rehearsing the “I’m so sorry” line before curtly hanging up. You see, when the rush of the formerly uninsured came knocking, doctors in my New Jersey town began closing their doors and promptly telling insurance companies that they had no room for new patients.

    My shiny, never used Horizon health card is as effective as a dollar bill during the Great Depression. In fact, an expert tells CNN, “I think of (Obamacare) as giving everyone an ATM card in a town where there are no ATM machines.” According to a study 33% of doctors are NOT accepting Medicaid. Here in Jersey, one has a dismal 40 percent chance of finding a doctor who accepts Medicaid – the lowest in the country.

  • 300. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 10:13 am

    “Maybe I give you guys too much credit. When you say I will vote reflexively you paint me the idiot. Not very nice at all.

    Sadly votes are confidential so you won’t even believe I voted for Christie after I do it.”

    I’m pretty sure the regulars here know you wouldn’t lie about your vote. Especially if it was Christie – the man won your vote already for a number of reasons all having to do with his embrace of Obama.

    “How’s Jeb lookin to you guys after he said illegally crossing the border is an act of love?”

    Makes we wonder if the natural-born citizen clause for holding office should be extended out to voting. Admittedly a knee-jerk.

  • 301. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 10:15 am

    @#297 – James you weren’t the old fossil I was referring to it was the guy in the kangaroo suit.

    Come to think of it – you are both the same age…has Captain Kangaroo ever mentioned the reason he was able to avoid the draft?

  • 302. James  |  April 9, 2014 at 11:35 am

    My mistake, Muffy. For curiosity’s sake, I looked the original Captain Kangaroo and military service. Ten men who were US Marines or reservists are:

    The first Bozo the Clown:
    Don and Phil Everly
    Bob Keeshan Captain Kangaroo
    Drew Carey
    Pat Robertson
    Lee Travino
    James Carville
    Gene Hackman
    Lee Marvin

  • 303. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:05 pm

    Great James. Now you’re just running interference.

  • 304. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    Can’t imagine why anyone would want to go there.

    “But I have to tell you that for me to really be affected by what happened, I’d have to have respect for the people who voted in that way,” Holder told ABC News. “And I didn’t, so it didn’t have that huge an impact on me.”

  • 305. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:12 pm

  • 306. Tex Taylor  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:19 pm

    Darrell Issa says emails suggest Elijah Cummings prompted IRS targeting of True the Vote

    Busted…another race hustler and thief.

  • 307. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:42 pm

    Why would anyone want the Ways and Means commitee to STOP investigating this? Why are Cummings et al so pissed off if they’re not in it up to their fucking eyeballs?

    I actually never imagined it went beyond the IRS.

    If Holder won’t investigate – and we know he won’t investigate – the IRS targeting of conservative groups, can anyone else force the issue or can these SOBs keep stonewalking forever?

  • 308. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 6:45 pm

    “I still say Kerry is doing a better job.” -R

    A potted plant would do a better job, I get that. But how is Kerry impressing you?

  • 309. muffy  |  April 9, 2014 at 7:00 pm

    (Stonewalling, not stonewalking, obvi.)

  • 310. Huck  |  April 9, 2014 at 7:46 pm

    “Maybe I give you guys too much credit. When you say I will vote reflexively you paint me the idiot. Not very nice at all.”

    You’ve voted for Barack Obama twice, so I’d say you’ve painted yourself the idiot.

    “Why would anyone want the Ways and Means commitee to STOP investigating this? Why are Cummings et al so pissed off if they’re not in it up to their fucking eyeballs”

    Because its a big nothingburger. It’s all fabricated by the evil, unAmerican Issa and Fox News. Just ask Rutherford.

  • 311. Tex Taylor  |  April 9, 2014 at 8:47 pm

    Come on, Huck. Rutherford has got some legitimate standing on certain issues – a better handle than you certainly do.

    Like Dennis Miller is fond of saying. Obama’s overseen the fastest increase in industry in American history.

    The grievance industry. :wink:

  • 312. James  |  April 9, 2014 at 9:31 pm

    307 I imagined it went to the White House. I still do. Congressional interference was a mild to me also.

    The House can send Lois Lerner to jail on contempt charges if the Holder people fail to act. The Justice Department shows little inclination to investigate, because I think they know where the trails lead.. Lois’ refusal to testify indicates she probably knows a lot more than she has told us.

    Justice will not be served until/unless we elect the other side, even if they are imperfect,

    Kerry has bungled Syria, Ukraine, and Israel-Palestine. He is worse than a potted plant because a plant does nothing but sit on a window sill and grow.

    Running interference is sporting. Rutherford’s views are about as defenseless as Ukraine is against Russia.

  • 313. poolman  |  April 9, 2014 at 11:30 pm

    Amadeus, Amadeus, rock me Amadeus… That brings back some ancient memories.

    I really have difficulty coming up with decent things to discuss among political wonks or anyone who thinks politics has any redeeming qualities. It has been such a let down to learn how

    Are any politicos worthy? I know we keep bashing the left and the left returns the same, but seriously, are there ANY worth their salt? I get that this administration is the pits and there has never before been revealed the depth of deceit and corruption, but is there something worth saving, or should we throw out the baby with the bathwater.

    I haven’t the patience to wait for this to turn around. I have grandkids coming up into this shit storm we have manifested for them. I tell them straight out they cannot trust anyone or anything that represents itself as government. That if it governs, it lies, steals and cheats. You cannot put your trust or faith in any of it. My progeny will not expect anything from those that rule. I won’t have them naive to the evils of our system.

    And there are plenty waking up. It is a pleasure to be able to discuss reality with so many of our youth and other folks becoming aware.

  • 314. poolman  |  April 9, 2014 at 11:35 pm

    Looks like I left a few things dangling in the last post. Sigh. It’s been a long day.

  • 315. Tex Taylor  |  April 10, 2014 at 4:57 am

    Here’s a great blog post. Would be interested in your assessment, Mr. Rutherford. I don’t put you in this company – but you are ultimately responsible with your vote.

    MOBZILLA. The Purging of Brendan Eich


    With Barack Obama providing the template of how to do it. Barack Obama has indeed been successful at “radical transformation” of the country…

    …if mob rule was the new order. America is now eating its own.

    Hope you Obama voters are still feeling real smug, because your time is coming.

  • 316. an800lbgorilla  |  April 10, 2014 at 6:12 am

    R, your nothing burger is starting to get a little crowded. So, if Cummings is involved, then it explains the stunt he pulled the other day trying to paint Issa and whole IRS scandal poorly. He knew he was about to be exposed, and was hoping to head it off by making the GOP look like bullies. But, this has come out:

    New IRS emails released by the House Oversight Committee show staff working for Democratic Ranking Member Elijah Cummings communicated with the IRS multiple times between 2012 and 2013 about voter fraud prevention group True the Vote. True the Vote was targeted by the IRS after applying for tax exempt status more than two years ago. Further, information shows the IRS and Cummings’ staff asked for nearly identical information from True the Vote President Catherine Engelbrecht about her organization, indicating coordination and improper sharing of confidential taxpayer information.

    Chairman of the House Oversight Committee Darrell Issa, along with five Subcommittee Chairmen are demanding Cummings provide an explanation for the staff inquiries to the IRS about True the Vote and for his denial that his staff ever contacted the IRS about the group.

    “Although you have previously denied that your staff made inquiries to the IRS about conservative organization True the Vote that may have led to additional agency scrutiny, communication records between your staff and IRS officials – which you did not disclose to Majority Members or staff – indicates otherwise,” the letter to Cummings states. “As the Committee is scheduled to consider a resolution holding Ms. Lerner, a participant in responding to your communications that you failed to disclose, in contempt of Congress, you have an obligation to fully explain your staff’s undisclosed contacts with the IRS.”

    And so Cummings is throwing ANYTHING against the wall to see what sticks:

    Rep. Elijah Cummings is pinning the McCarthyism label on Rep. Darrell Issa in the ongoing fight between the two Oversight Committee leaders about the IRS targeting scandal from last year…

    “We oppose Chairman Issa’s efforts to recreate the Oversight Committee in Joe McCarthy’s image, and we reject his attempts to drag us back to that shameful era in which Congress tried to strip away the constitutional rights of American citizens under the bright lights of hearings that had nothing to do with responsible oversight and everything to do with the most dishonorable kind of partisan politics,” said the report for committee Democrats, which was released early to POLITICO Pro Tax.

    Issa is not on a witch hunt, he’s targeting what has been proven to be a corrupt, partisan office guilty of targeting, intentionally, peoples freedom of speech and assembly. Anyone who embraces the tenets of the first amendment should be appalled at what Obama’s IRS is doing. Likewise, they should be just as appalled–if not more so–at Holder’s refusal to do anything about it.

    Ex-IRS official Lois Lerner talked about taking a job with President Barack Obama’s nonprofit advocacy group Organizing for Action (OFA) while she had official oversight at the IRS over nonprofit tax-exempt groups.

    The revelation was made Wednesday in the House Ways and Means Committee’s referral letter to the Department of Justice (DOJ) to prosecute Lerner on criminal charges. Ways and Means voted to refer Lerner to DOJ.

    Even as the IRS faces growing heat over Lois G. Lerner and the tea party targeting scandal, a government watchdog said Wednesday it’s pursuing cases against three other tax agency employees and offices suspected of illegal political activity in support of President Obama and fellow Democrats.

    In one case the Office of Special Counsel, which investigates federal employees who conduct politics on government time, said it was “commonplace” in a Dallas IRS office for employees to have pro-Obama screensavers on their computers, and to have campaign-style buttons and stickers at their office.

    In another case, a worker at the tax agency’s customer help line urged taxpayers “to re-elect President Obama in 2012 by repeatedly reciting a chant based on the spelling of his last name,” the Office of Special Counsel said in a statement.

    OSC said it is seeking “significant disciplinary action” against that employee.

    Another IRS employee in Kentucky has agreed to serve a 14-day suspension for blasting Republicans in a conversation with a taxpayer.

    “They’re going to take women back 40 years,” the IRS employee said in a conversation that was recorded. The employee also said that “if you vote for a Republican, the rich are going to get richer and the poor are going to get poorer.

  • 317. Tex Taylor  |  April 10, 2014 at 6:36 am


    Every time one of these race hustler/grievance hustlers like Cummings makes some comment about Jim Crow or McCarthy era style politic, I think Republicans should retort by talking about O.J. Simpson style politics from the Left – liars and deniers, whitey haters.

    Remember, Cummings is the one that accused the Tea Party of screaming nigger at him during the signing of Obamacare.

    When Andrew Breitbart offered a $10,000 dollar reward, followed by a $100,000 reward for any proof of anybody doing so, no one could come with the evidence and the issue slowly died.

    This Cummings POS has been riding MLK legacy for 40 years – he’s a nothing burger like Je$$e Jackson in trying to co opt the MLK legacy as he too was some hero, all for personal gain. And the filthy bastard has made a small fortune doing so – the definition of ingrate.

    I’ve had it with these black racists. Fuck ‘um. Start fighting fire with fire.

  • 318. Huck  |  April 10, 2014 at 7:47 am

    Its become so painfully obvious what went on…

    The Tea Party and the GOP kicked the living shit out of Democrats in the 2006 midterms. That is an undeniable fact. It obviously scared the hell out of every Democrat in Washington, so they needed to try and stop the growing tide any way they could. And they did that using the IRS. They used the IRS to try and silence grassroots Tea Party groups and they used to it illegally gain valuable information about the bigger Tea Party groups.

    I also have no doubt that this goes all the way to the top. Powerful people know that there is information out there that would expose their corrupt activity and it scares the piss out of them. That’s why they have been fighting so hard to keep it secret.

    I asked Rutherford long ago…if this is all just nothing, then why won’t the administration turn over the stuff being requested? He never did answer that, except to claim that the sinister Issa had it and pretended he didn’t. Now we’ve got an IRS chief in contempt because she refuses to answer questions…documents that are still being withheld…and new light that top congressmen may have been conspiring with the IRS.

    Still think this is all nothing?

  • 319. Tex Taylor  |  April 10, 2014 at 9:21 am

    I’ve asked Rutherford and numerous other leftists around the globe, if there’s nothing to the IRS scandal, why are people taking the 5th then, Huck. Like you, I’m ignored – and in part, it’s because Rutherford has been abandoned to us wolves. No doubt a more rushed life/work life, it gets overwhelming to answer all of us. I’m not casting blame.

    However, my real questions are ignored anymore and have been for at least two years – only the superficial pap gets a response. I’m sure partially out of boredom and perhaps a little grudge of past grievances. But I honestly believe it is in large part is that Rutherford has no answer, nor a legitimate defense, nor a willingness to provide further excuse.

    While Rutherford has mellowed to a degree, I believe most of mellowing is quietly masking the failure of his ‘religion’ – leftist politic.

    The bottom line is this – I mean this with all my being.

    I believe we’ve come to a Rubicon crossing as a nation. I can’t go on this way anymore for the sake of country, sake of family, sake of friends.

    If one half, perhaps more than one-half the country can ignore the rule of law, ignore the Constitution, have no accountability for mass failures including the reelection of cosmic failure, campaigns, governs, and wins by covetous, then what?.

    What are the rest of us prepared to do about it? How long will it get to the point we tolerate it and discuss the problems without solution, instead of taking the initiative to act? In my own world, I already have to a degree. But I’m willing to go all the way only if millions are willing to go to bat. Sacrifices need to be made – real sacrifices. Most of us seem reluctant to act – perhaps we also lack character?

  • 320. James  |  April 10, 2014 at 9:39 am

    I agree, Poolman. Politics is as sickening as cleaning a sewer. We have to “wallow in the mire” because politics run our government.

    I feel as ambivalent as you do, but the reality is two ideologies are at war, and though both are imperfect, the outcome will profoundly alter our country. You have to pick a side. The other side is no longer hiding its disdain for freedom, truth and law.

    As Tex noted Amadeus and Tough Enough by Vanilla Ninja sound similar. The song also unwittingly describes our current struggle.

    “Baby only the strong will survive
    all the mysteries of life
    Only fantasy keeps you away
    in the lonely fields of those broken shields

    So keep on kicking
    The bomb is ticking
    Don’t stop, don’t be a runaway
    Go for the fire

    Baby are you tough enough
    Just keep on living
    and don’t start giving
    the devil good reason
    to get you in the seasons of heart break
    Baby are you tough enough?”

    The strongest side will win, and the eventual winner is in doubt, but we have no hope if we don’t “keep on kicking.”

  • 321. James  |  April 10, 2014 at 10:55 am

    You describe our situation well, Tex. I hope it doesn’t but it may come to violence. I think we are as prepared to act as any people who feel their freedom is threatened.

    I hope you have time to watch part of The Battle for Sarajevo Part 1 Bitka Za Sarajevo on YouTube.

    I am a Ukrainian has gone viral on YouTube.

    Video I am A Ukrainian (USA remix)

    I don’t have much use for Alex Jones, but he shows a video similar to another I saw which uses scenes in the United States with the Ukrainian dialogue.

    Letter to Ukraine ViKA She is a Ukrainian pop singer who has put herself at some risk for producing videos like this. She has the character you fear we may lack,

    I am not alone on VIKA’s YouTube channel. It shows her waving a Ukrainian flag as she sings.

    These people and others are like us. They wanted to be left alone to raise their families and live good lives. Something pushed them over the edge, and they became revolutionaries. I don’t know if they considered the implications of their actions, but they were so desperate they were willing to bear the cost.

    Various government agencies are arming themselves. Maybe it standard operating procedure for legitimate reasons. Or maybe our leaders fear we might one day tell them we have had enough.

  • 322. an800lbgorilla  |  April 10, 2014 at 11:32 am

    Anyone interested in some revisionist history? I would LOVE to hear R explain this to us…

    What Holder said:

    “And since the day I became Attorney General in 2009, I have been proud to stand alongside you in supporting efforts to advance the cause of justice that has always been at the center of this Administration’s work.

    I’m pleased to note that the last five years have been defined by significant strides and lasting reforms – even in the face of unprecedented, unwarranted ugly and divisive adversity. And if you don’t believe that, you look at the way …forget about me… forget about me , you look at the way the Attorney General of the Untied States was treated yesterday by a House committee. Had nothing to do with me what Attorney General has ever had to deal with that kind of treatment? What President has ever had to deal with that kind of treatment. Last summer, after a narrowly split but divided Supreme Court struck down a key part of the historic Voting Rights Act of 1965, my colleagues and I took action – by challenging specific laws, in North Carolina and Texas, that could disproportionately restrict access to the ballot box among some populations.”

    What the Obama Regime is reporting:

    And since the day I became Attorney General in 2009, I have been proud to stand alongside you in supporting efforts to advance the cause of justice that has always been at the center of this Administration’s work.

    I’m pleased to note that the last five years have been defined by significant strides and lasting reforms – even in the face of unprecedented [????] adversity. [????] Last summer, after a narrowly split but divided Supreme Court struck down a key part of the historic Voting Rights Act of 1965, my colleagues and I took action – by challenging specific laws, in North Carolina and Texas, that could disproportionately restrict access to the ballot box among some populations.

    There’s no paraphrasing here. This isn’t some tweak to context. This is the absence of information to specifically give the impression that something was not said, when in fact it was.

    How’s that for transparency?

  • 323. an800lbgorilla  |  April 10, 2014 at 11:47 am

    This woman is insane…

    The deportation of foreigners living illegally in the United States is similar to the forced internment of ethnic-Japanese Americans in World War II, according to Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi.

    “I’ll be very honest with you: Looking at the numbers at some point, in terms of how people are treated and deported and families separated and the rest, this has a scent of Japanese internment,” Pelosi told a Politico reporter. “It’s really a black mark,” said Pelosi.

    Roughly 110,000 ethnic-Japanese immigrants and their American children were detained during World War II after Japan’s sneak attack on Americans in Pearl Harbor.

    Pelosi also urged Obama to stop enforcing immigration law, and to stop removing foreigners who try to live in the United States illegally.

    “I believe that if [immigration] status is the violation, then that should not be even in the scheme of things as to whether somebody would be deported or else you would be deporting 11 million people, which doesn’t make any sense,” Pelosi said in the softball interview.

  • 324. Huck  |  April 10, 2014 at 2:14 pm


  • 325. dead rabbit  |  April 10, 2014 at 4:46 pm

    MSNBC and Obama has failed Rutherford.

    So Rutherford has taken the coward’s way out.

    What a fucked world. Liberals are such the establishment, so much “the man” they actively conspire with the government to trample on the rights of Americans.

    And the rest of them are apathetic, selling out every fake ass ideal they used to pretend meant something to them.

    They are fascists and fascist sympathizers.

    Nothingburger. Come to find out they are referring to we the people with that stupid term.

    Wait until you one day feel the wrath of the Nothingburgers. Grease Burns hot, bitch.

  • 326. James  |  April 10, 2014 at 6:09 pm

    I’ve noticed more than normal angry comments on news blogs. Some also refer to revolution. We have done the same here.

    The stand off between the government and a Nevada ranching family continues with heavy arms and troops. Today, twenty cowboys re took some of the cattle back.

    This is how revolutions and protest movements begin, with flash point stand offs which come at the right time. Its how the Tea Party and final part of the Civil Rights movement began,

  • 327. dead rabbit  |  April 10, 2014 at 7:06 pm

    This is the headline over at MSNBC:

    Republicans can’t quit the IRS Scandal.

    That’s the angle Rutherford is getting.


    We are talking about the first amendment and so called liberals care more about well…..does anyone know what they stand for?

    These are people who say they hate guns but were aghast that the Republicans asked for documents for why in bloody hell we purposely released a bunch weapons to brutal killers in Northern Mexico. They all got up and walked out in protest.

    Protest of what?

    Who are you people?

  • 328. Alfie  |  April 10, 2014 at 10:01 pm

    @326 sort of…
    Well regards the story of the Bundy v BLM thing I agree those threads are definitely awash with anger,ignorance and spin spin spin.
    I find the story to be very indicative to how pathetic America and its citizens are becoming.
    I have also been following a number of stories in the areas of urbanism and health care and along with the recent test balloons regards illegal immigration I am totally not looking forward to the next two election cycles.
    In both covert and overt ways the left is moving to firm up all the false wars on etc.

  • 329. Huck  |  April 10, 2014 at 11:00 pm

    Obama’s “Mission Accomplished” banner is going to be raised on the carrier USS Sebelius.

    She’s going to be replaced by the bitch who orchestrated the shutdown.

  • 330. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 3:51 am


    Thought police on patrol

  • 331. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 3:57 am

    G WTF are you talking about? What the Obama “regime” said where? What are your two sources?

  • 332. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 3:59 am

    NM G your comment on my stupid app didn’t show the links.

  • 333. parker  |  April 11, 2014 at 4:05 am

    Rutherford – You mentioned about a young woman who “finds (her)self pregnant,” and how that’s really nobody’s fault but her own. You know, of course on a very rigid, fundamentalist level, that’s true, but never deny the power of sex. It is evolution’s most powerful and irresistible invention.

    Interestingly, 71% of twenty-somethings who “find themselves pregnant” did so unintentionally. If you think that, when the urge hits, everybody just needs to think rationally and make sure they are safe before they pull their pants down, clearly you don’t remember being in your ’20s.

    And that, my friend, is why Americans need to be sure they keep abortion safe and legal. Pregnancy happens.

  • 334. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:19 am

    G on Hardball the Holder quote was shown in full.

    BTW asshole Louie Gohmert could tell me the sun was shining and I’d be insulted. He’s a supreme moron.

    Your problem is if they are on the right you won’t repudiate them. Doesn’t matter how they conduct themselves.

  • 335. an800lbgorilla  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:21 am


    According to an analysis of recent salary information from the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, the group pays women 70 cents for every $1 a male employee works.

    Where’s the intellectual giant Lurker? Maybe she can tell us how bad the GOP is waging a war on women again….

  • 336. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:27 am

    Ehhh Rabbit what happened after Waco? Other than loon McVeigh, not a goddam thing.

    Keep hoping for revolution. You want fucking Egypt? I’ve got news for you. Americans are too stupid to come up with anything better than what we have. Contrary to your paranoia the country’s model put in place by the founding fathers is still intact. You’d be a fool to cheer on its demise.

  • 337. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:28 am

    Sorry that last comment at Rabbit should have been directed at James.

  • 338. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:33 am

    Abortion should NEVER be post-facto birth control Parker.

  • 339. Rutherford  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:35 am

    G you can’t have it both ways. Do women make 70 cents for every male dollar or don’t they?

  • 340. an800lbgorilla  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:45 am

    What did Gohmert say that was wrong? Holder clearly doesn’t care about being in contempt because, as Gohmert rightly pointed out, he done NOTHING to rectify why he was found in contempt.

    I’m not repudiating Gohmert because he was right. And don’t give me some bullshit about the standing of the office, or some such, because Holder and Obama have destroyed that notion long ago. When the Chief Executive of the Nation–sworn to uphold the Constitution and the laws passed by Congress–and his Chief law enforcement officer blatantly refuse to enforce the law, and then go on to regularly break the law, the standing and dignity of the office go down the drain in a clockwise motion.

    But how typical of you. Instead of condemning the DOJ for not accurately recording the words of the AG, which is probably important, you attack Gohmert for making your pal look like an ass. Is your bar for dignified action that low?

    Watch out…….you might trip……

  • 341. an800lbgorilla  |  April 11, 2014 at 5:46 am

    R, you’re idiot.

    The DSCC pays women 70 cents to every dollar they pay their male employees.

    The national gap is 93 cents to ever dollar.

  • 342. an800lbgorilla  |  April 11, 2014 at 6:19 am

    The quintessential liberal….

  • 343. parker  |  April 11, 2014 at 8:08 am


    Since I think you can rationally discuss the abortion question, (a rarity if there ever was one), I’ll ask you a serious question, and it is not designed to score points; I want to know what you think: If abortion is not primarily birth control (which I think is how it is usually used, at least in US, don’t you?), then when should it be available?

    Throughout the world, abortion appears to primarily be a birth control apparatus. Women and girls get preggers; that’s the reality, and many make the judgment that they just cannot carry the pregnancy – for whatever reason: they already have a litter; they cannot bear the financial burden; they cannot care for or feed more. Is it reasonable for them to abort? If not, then when?

    So, back to the original question, Rutherford, when should AB be available to a woman?

  • 344. James  |  April 11, 2014 at 9:21 am

    Rutherford, right now, we are in a pressure cooker with a growing level of frustration and anger. The United States has a long history of revolts of one form or another. The Whiskey Rebellion and Culpepper’s revolt are two. Another was a coup attempt to remove FDR with the help of the American Legion which did not cooperate.

    During the Farm recession, some farmers and survivalists advocated and prepared for violence. Timothy McVeign, Waco, and Ruby Ridge were indirectly connected

    . Further back during the Depression parts of the Midwest were in virtual rebellion with some judges nearly lynched. Armed farmers set up check points to prevent other farmers from delivering livestock to market. My father rode with a young man who needed to sell hogs to survive. Armed men stopped their truck. My father pulled a shot gun from his coat, and their truck was allowed to pass.

    The Baltic nations revolved from Soviet control in 1987 after the government banned a music concert. Maybe two million people held hands and formed a line through Latvia, Estonia, and Lithuania. They called it the Singing Revolution,

    The Norweigian Sami revolted after the government proposed a dam which would destroy reindeer herding grounds. They used the national media, law suits, and non- violent and violent protest. At one time, a tenth of the Norweigian police force was trying to control the disturbances, and if an agreement had not occurred, the Army was going to be deployed.

    Most violent revolutions fail, as the Waco and McVeigh people did. They didn’t find enough people to identify with their cause. Ukraine succeeded because the protesters, cause resonated with the majority of the people. They need simple concepts virtually anyone can identify with,. Watch a version of ” I am a Ukrainian”. on YouTube. Then you will understand my point, The same was true of Egypt.

    Americans are nothing more than transplanted Europeans, Africans, Asians etc. We are as smart and as stupid as they are because we are them. If they can do it, so can we.

    Progressives are slowly dismantling our unique political system, but as you write, it still exists, It is only a feeling but I think something is happening here. All we need is a proper spark to set something off. I favor a voters’ revolution. I think we need one to survive as the nation we grew up and which helped make the world safer than it would have been without us.

    if you look at the videos of Sarajevo and Ukraine that I posted, you will know I favor a relatively peaceful voters’ revolution like the Tea Party or civil rights movement. I think over 100,000 people died in Sarajevo. That speaks to a level of public desperation and anger we have yet to see in the United States. I have been in street protests before, and I could do it again. So could some of the posters here.

    I am convinced that if ballots and marches don’t fix our problem, bullets will, and that would be tragic.

  • 345. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 11:01 am


    I know you’re ignoring me anymore, but perhaps you should read this, then rethink this statement.

    Contrary to your paranoia the country’s model put in place by the founding fathers is still intact. You’d be a fool to cheer on its demise.

    Eric Holder in hot water with federal judge over drug sentencing guidelines

    When men can unilaterally either make up law or ignore law like Holder, the country’s model, however wonderful, ain’t working. Eric Holder should be in prison – he should have been over Marc Rich. Once again, Eric Holder the coward is hiding behind his race to mask his incompetence and corruption.

  • 346. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 11:12 am

    Gorilla, ** guffaw **

    Talk about having your ass handed to you for national viewing – a Larry Flynt associate to boot. LOL! Quintessential…undoubtedly.

    Hey, but I meet these people everyday, even in Oklahoma minus the Hustler history. I kid you not. The Tea Party is what ails us, make up facts as they go along, and invariably I piss them off so bad, they storm off in a huff when I start asking questions.

    Of course, they generally aren’t running for Congress.

  • 347. dead rabbit  |  April 11, 2014 at 12:27 pm

    Holder the pussy…..they always hide behind their slightly darker skin. So pathetic and played out.

    Does it work still?

  • 348. Just a Lurker  |  April 11, 2014 at 12:39 pm

    800 lbs – Unfortunately, men will be men no matter which side of the aisle they may sit on. Some are more willing to recognize their faults and make change.

    According to Forbes the pay gap varies from state to state. The biggest gaps are in the red states.

    Your stating women are paid 93 cents seems to apply only to younger women.

    “But for young women, the wage gap is even smaller – at 93 percent – meaning they caught up to their same-aged male counterparts by roughly the last week in January of this year.”

    If you are comfortable with employers paying women less to do the same work as you how do you know the employer is paying you what you’re worth?

  • 349. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 1:25 pm


    Has it ever dawned on you more women in red states also stay home with their children, where often two incomes not required, then return to the workforce? If I return to the workforce, should I demand the same pay as the most experienced woman?

    Red state women also have more children – or should I say children in wedlock? I can list numerous reasons where the data you’re using is flawed.

    I can assure you that most often, women today with the same experience and the same occupation with the same responsibility are making the same as men. I know this because I used be over several of both genders and there was no discrepancy unless there was a notable difference in performance – and certainly not in starting pay upon entrance from college. In fact, any discrepancy between genders had to be documented as to why as dictated by the EEOC. Human resource departments run scared to do otherwise.

    If there is a war in America today, it’s on the white male – Conservative, white male to be more specific. The same white Conservative males that put men on the moon who have been stupid to tolerate your totalitarian nature. And the blowback will be glorious when it finally blows.

    If I were you, I’d stay out of the way of the hurricane, being people like you did your small part to create it. I can’t think of a more deserving person to be delivered to the cosmos of the winds of change than people like you.

  • 350. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 1:31 pm

    P.S. JAL,

    Can you find somebody besides a hardcore feminist with a history of misandry next time to provide better proof?

    You are a large critic of FAUX News and other more conservative sources. I in turn, am a believer that the guest authors of the Huffington Post (PuffHO) are leading proponent of Leftist bullshit (like you).

    Get something more credible and get back with us…

  • 351. muffy  |  April 11, 2014 at 1:50 pm

    Tex I tried to read your link @#345 but I had to stop after the first line.

    “Attorney General Eric Holder is the nation’s chief law enforcement officer…”

    What comes to mind is, “Apres moi, le deluge.”

  • 352. Tex Taylor  |  April 11, 2014 at 1:58 pm

    Though I had to look that up :) – you’re absolutely right.

    What does it matter? should be the Democratic motto.

  • 353. muffy  |  April 11, 2014 at 2:01 pm

    “Does it work still?”

    Personally I no longer play along. When people don’t have self-respect they have no business demanding respect from others. Not to mention that it is powerfully hypocritical to demand respect when you treat others with contempt.

  • 354. muffy  |  April 11, 2014 at 2:14 pm

    G @#342 – LOL! That guy is straight from Central Casting. For when you need that extra dumb Dem for your television interview scene.

    Greta: “You must have a potato in your ear.” :lol: Greta PWNED the big dummy. I bet she misses the courtroom.

    Baffoon: …blah blah…tea party…blah blah…
    Greta: What about the tea party?
    Baffoon: I think they need a war on them.

    Some funny comments from the thread worth noting too –

    “He will still pull in at least 40% of the vote. Doesn’t matter if he rapes a goat on live TV.”

    “This is Harry Reid and Alan Grayson’s Love Child.”

    “He reminds me of the politician in central Louisiana in the mid 1960′s, who during the Democrat primary said, that sure he tells lies, but at least he is honest enough to admit that he is a liar.”

    “What is wrong with Virginia lately? Where are they finding these cretins?”

    “Virginia is for Inbreeding.”

  • 355. muffy  |  April 11, 2014 at 2:15 pm

    “Though I had to look that up…”

    Not familiar with that old French aphorism?

  • 356. James  |  April 11, 2014 at 4:31 pm

    Its already pouring and the forecast is for more deluge

    . Lack of self respect is not a problem, in my opinion. The problem is people who respect themselves with out basis. The lying bastards are so self confident they spin fanciful stories hard for a carrot to believe.

    Lurker, I agree with Tex. Prove us wrong with documentation. I’m not comparing you to a carrot but on this you seem very gullible.

    Better yet, listen to Bob Dylan’s “The Times, They are a Changing.”

  • 357. Alfie  |  April 11, 2014 at 8:12 pm

    @ JAL I think you to a degree and the sources you used definitely captures an eternal truth in the wage gap discussions. All sides see what they want in common stats.
    For me it is pretty clear that areas where the economy dictates wages said wages are more in line with each other gender wise. Areas where demographics and history have dictated certain paths the differences still persist.
    I think making too much of this issue without confessing to the existence of some basic common ground stats makes for folly.

  • 358. Huck  |  April 11, 2014 at 9:44 pm

    Everyone is missing a key part in this equal pay for equal work argument.

    The whole thing is supposedly about “equal pay for doing THE SAME JOB.” And that last part is the key.

    Lets see a shred of proof that a woman doing THE SAME JOB as a man AT THE SAME PLACE is making even 1 penny less.

    And if anyone finds that proof, then the people running the company are breaking a law that has been on the books for a half a century.

    This is all a bunch of bullshit.

  • 359. muffy  |  April 11, 2014 at 10:13 pm

    Are you all cabin-y now rabbit?

  • 360. Tex Taylor  |  April 12, 2014 at 3:16 am

    Don’t know if any of you have been following the honorary award offered then rescinded to Ayaan Hirsi Ali by Brandeis University, assisted by CAIR…but I read this today and thought it clever:


    Four Feminist Gender Studies Teachers sit down to play:

    Blanche, Dorothy and Sophia are tenured veterans. Rose is a novice.

    Rose: I bid two diamonds.

    Dorothy: You can’t say diamonds, dear. It represents greedy, corporate vulture capitalists. You say Solyndras.

    Rose: Ok, then I bid two clubs.

    Sophia: Clubs are exclusionary and misogynist. You have to say communes instead.

    Rose: Every commune I ever heard of had one guy having sex with all the girls and taking advantage of their dim bulb, no bra mentality.

    Blanche: Yeah, but they’re our type of guys. Then it’s ok.

    Rose: Forget it, I’ll just bid two sp….

    Dorothy, Blanche, and Sophia: NO!!!!!!

    Dorothy: You never, ever, ever, say that word. It’s racist. You say “cards of color”.

    Rose: Color? When we played poker or gin we used to say we had “color” when we had face cards, jacks, kings, queens.

    Blanche: We never say queens, either. We say transgender royalty.

    Dorothy: And kings and jacks are too…Crusades. Offensive to Islam. We say Daddy Dhimmi and Dhimmi dummy.

    Rose: Ok, cards of color, communes, solyndras,. What do I say about these bleeding…hearts?

    Sophia: Are you from Fox News?

    Rose: Not YOU bleeding hearts, these…darned hearts.

    Dorothy: They’re called liberals. Nobody ever bids them any more.

    Rose: Communes, solyndras, cards of color, and liberals. How will I ever remember what trump is?

    Blanche: Racism trumps everything, silly.

    Rose: What?

    Sophia: No matter what is bid, no matter what cards you hold, if you want to win the hand you yell RACISM!!! at the top of your lungs.

    Rose: Where in heaven’s name did you learn to play this idiotic game?

    Sophia, Dorothy, Blanche: Brandeis.

  • 361. Huck  |  April 12, 2014 at 9:07 am

    I think honorary degrees are crap.

  • 362. dead rabbit  |  April 12, 2014 at 9:23 am

    Muffy. I was informed two days ago that the brother of the former renter has claimed “squatters’ rights”. Whatever the fuck that means.

    Police are informed and don’t care. My wife’s uncle (who I am buying the place off of) is going through the legal steps of evicting him.

    As you can imagine, my take on this matter would much more colorful in a private realm.

    The scary part was I was supposed to go up Friday with 5 other friends and brothers, armed to the teeth. We were going up to shoot. The working stiffs were not picking up their phones and I was paranoid something bad was going to happen if they showed up. They finally got the message. (Of course this made them want to go up even more).

    I went jogging and stewed on the matter for a while. I have transformed my very aggressive state of mind to the something akin to the tranquility of that song you posted.

    We will get him (and his wife) out.

    What an awesome “bug out” retreat. The world hasn’t even collapsed and I have lost it to a marauder. LOL.

    I do have a support network up their as well (some who also would be fine with frog marching his ass out).

    Ultimately…its just a dumpy trailer in woods of a rural ghetto. I’ve spent less on it then people do cars. I’m trying not to let it bother me.

    I think I will be in there within a month.

  • 363. James  |  April 12, 2014 at 10:11 am

    That was not a bug out retreat. It was a strategic decision which saved you all a lot of trouble.

    You don’t need my advice, but here is something I learned. Be ready, but never make the first move if you can avoid it. Self defense does wonders in court or at work.

    I like the song too. Another calming song is Amazing sami song in Sweden’s Got Talent. It made a judge and some of the audience cry.

  • 364. Tex Taylor  |  April 12, 2014 at 10:43 am

    Honorary Degrees are crap. But commencement speeches are not.

    All over this country, anyone deemed not Leftist enough is being shouted down, offers rescinded, faculty protesting in mass. It’s epidemic – higher education has become a den of thieves and jackboots. Leftists are bordering on lawlessness and fascism, as are the homosexual militants. It’s the ‘New Tolerance.’

    I don’t know why Republicans don’t band together and start their own secular, non-profit, affordable regional colleges to combat this small ‘c’ Communist shit instead of wasting money on Karl Rove’s mega donor junk which does little to get people elected.

  • 365. dead rabbit  |  April 12, 2014 at 12:24 pm

    James… are right. I call it a bug out retreat in jest. Just a little hunting parcel. Not worth me making the first move.

    Hell….technically, its not even mine yet. I haven’t signed anything. Just gave a relative 2 grand down payment.

    I will be mildly bummed if i don’t have it by Turkey season.

  • 366. dead rabbit  |  April 12, 2014 at 12:33 pm

    Rev. Sharpton……the left’s appointed voice of black people……wanted to profit from the murdering of black people and cash in on the cocaine epidemic of the 80s.

    Holy shit liberals are twisted.

    Anyone with a brain already new Sharpton was a murderous gangster and a lethal danger to the black community. Exactly the kind of person liberals prop up to lead the black community. They even make him a prime time talking head!

    You people a pathetic.

  • 367. Tex Taylor  |  April 12, 2014 at 1:37 pm

    Ranchers & Militia 1; Fed Jackboots 0

    I have no idea if this rancher is guilty of what is charged. If so, he should pay. But the Federal Gov’t is out of control and thuggish, and these folks just taught the American public a valuable lesson.

    If thousands are willing to put it on the line to fight back, we will win.

  • 368. Alfie  |  April 12, 2014 at 2:21 pm

    Dear Rutherford in case you have not seen this I offer it now. J Chaits fantasy piece that so completely captures your mood and articulates your core beliefs regards the GOP,Barack Obama and politics in general.

    Sadly it fails to reach the even handedness some credit it in my opinion but that must be because I’m a rampant blatant racist. He hints at things but right down to his sources the failures are still epic.
    Anyway no matter my presentation here Rutherford you will find it a good read.

  • 369. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 6:23 pm

    You willfully choose to ignore history Gorilla. Richard M. Nixon destroyed the dignity of the presidency and then Clinton buried it. So please don’t lay that on Obama.

    Besides, dignified people DO give the OFFICE its due. Goehmert and Joe “you lie” Wilson are not dignified.

  • 370. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 6:25 pm

    BTW as a military man I assume you address your seniors as “Sir” not asshole regardless of how much you disrespect your superior.

  • 371. Alfie  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:12 pm

    Rutherford read the linked article. You bring up three points found within its 6000 words in two sentences.

  • 372. El Tigre  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:14 pm

    “Besides, dignified people DO give the OFFICE its due. Goehmert and Joe “you lie” Wilson are not dignified.”

    That’s ’cause they’re racists.

    (so says the Keith Olberman lackey :roll:)

  • 373. an800lbgorilla  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:25 pm

    When I was in the military, yes. Now asshole will often do…

  • 374. James  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:26 pm

    Rutherford, you are partly right. Officers are “sir” Enlisted people are called by their rank.

    Joe Wilson could have been dignified by saying “Mr. President, ‘you lie’ In that manner, he would have been giving the office its proper respect and by describing Obama’s actions apart from the office he would have accurately described Obama’s actions.

  • 375. an800lbgorilla  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:27 pm

    R, if they are right, how are they not dignified?

  • 376. James  |  April 12, 2014 at 7:28 pm

    I also like lying bastard.

  • 377. dead rabbit  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:02 pm

    One of the most iconic political lies by a president on sweeping legislation that we had to pass before we could know what’s in it and, years later, a reminiscing Rutherford is miffed that the liar was called a liar without his proper title.

    Yeah…..we’re fucked.

  • 378. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:09 pm

    OMFG I asked my daughter today “when you grow up do you feel free to be a housewife if that is what you want to do?”

    Her reply: “What’s a housewife?”

    I guess feminism has won the day. Now women not only don’t feel trapped in the role, my daughter’s generation doesn’t know WTF it is.

  • 379. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:11 pm

    Guess it depends on your source G. “My gang” says the national gap is 70. Someone is mistaken or lying.

  • 380. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:15 pm

    Parker if I dig down deep, abortion should be available when the mothers life is in danger. DONE. Not incest, not rape, not being horny.

    Two ways to deal with “unwanted pregnancy”: real birth control and adoption. There are more childless couples out there than you can imagine who desperately want a child.

  • 381. an800lbgorilla  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:23 pm

    Also, I don’t ignore anything. I believe Obama to have far exceeded Nixon in his corruptness, and therefore want his legacy to be judge as such.

    But Nixon and Clinton are beside the point. Why can you not deal with Obama by Obama’s actions? Why this constant need for straw men?

  • 382. Tex Taylor  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:35 pm

    Parker if I dig down deep, abortion should be available when the mothers life is in danger. DONE. Not incest, not rape, not being horny.

    Gee Parker. Since Rutherford and I have finally met eye-to-eye on one of those ‘defining issues’ like abortion, does that make Rutherford an inferior too?

    Eric Holder is an asshole, R. The lame, feckless SOB ignores the rule of law and plays the race card when busted. You know that deep down too. Eric Holder is a stinking piece of dog shit and a disgrace to the office.

  • 383. El Tigre  |  April 12, 2014 at 8:48 pm

    Holder is a fucking disgrace.

  • 384. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 10:52 pm

    Tex judging by how seldom I comment I appear to be ignoring everyone but I assure you I read every comment, especially yours.

    I wish I were a better student of history as I am reasonably sure the DoJ has always been selective about enforcement.

    Whether you like it or not, the fact that new uproar over this, coincidental with black leaders makes the race police sensitive. You should also acknowledge that while Holder went there, Obama does not confront race directly in his public comments as POTUS, not including the Skip Gates incident.

    Remember the “race speech” predates his presidency and was forced by Wright being an asshole.

    On a separate note I’ve been meaning to send you a personal note lately. Maybe I’ll get to it tonight.

  • 385. Rutherford  |  April 12, 2014 at 10:58 pm

    Tex you lost me. The “dream” to land a man on the moon was Kennedy’s and NASA’s heyday was during the Johnson admin. The fact that we got on the moon during Nixon is the same as our getting out of Iraq under Obama. Obama just fulfilled Bush’s timetable.

  • 386. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:03 am

    “Obama does not confront race directly in his public comments as POTUS, not including the Skip Gates incident.”

    George Zimmerman begs to differ…

  • 387. James  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:59 am

    So does the white police officer who arrested Henry Louis Gates in his own home after reports of a break in.Accounts varied about the level of confrontation. After admitting he didn’t know the facts, Obama said the Cambridge police department acted stupidly.

    Remember, Obama leads from behind. He farms out racist tendencies to others. For example, he didn’t even know what was in his own ObamaCare law. Others wrote it, so this would not be an example of Obama’s racism, merely his tacit approval.

    In 2009, the Commission on Civil Rights said that ObamaCare was filled with race based incentives, including giving preferential treatment for minorities and rural people for scholarships. It also had sections factoring in race when awarding business contracts, scholarships, and grants.The law had provisions for companies and schools who trained or employed minorities.

    When Gov. Jan Brewer of Arizona signed a law defending the state’s borders, Obama insinuated that the law was racial profiling which would harass minority people

    In March, 2010, the administration filed a brief with the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals which supported the University of Texas’ using racial preferences when admitting students.

    The administration supports illegal voting and immigration which would help Democrats win elections.Eliseo Medina a former member of Obama’s National Latino Advisory Council said in 2009 that reforming immigration laws would create millions of new voters for the Democratic party.

    Rutherford is right that Obama has made few overtly racist statements, but the president sets the tone of an administration. His support of proven racist Eric Holder and implied approval of folks like Al Sharpton fosters a patina of racism.

    Citing other presidents is irrelevant. They are gone, Obama is still here.

  • 388. James  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:09 am

    Yes, Rutherford, space was Kennedy’s brain child. It was like Moses’ not getting to the promised land though others did. He also canceled a replacement to the space shuttle.

    Obama basically followed Bush’s Iraq time line but he made changes.

  • 389. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:42 am

    Rutherford the DoJ has been a very selective and activist entity. Not be a partisan prick but this seems especially true during (D) admins

  • 390. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:49 am

    Tex I disagree with your scorecard. I think you have the Feds 0 correct but they are still playing the game. Rancher specifically Bundy is 1 but I think he is destined for a series of naughts. Ranchers plural are 0

  • 391. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:50 am

    “Obama basically followed Bush’s Iraq time line but he made changes.”

    Like asking for it to be extended.

  • 392. poolman  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:58 am

    I’m good with sending BoBo into space. “To infinity and beyond.”

  • 393. poolman  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:15 am

    Rutherford, ask your daughter if she knows what a domestic engineer is? I think the term ‘housewife’ is old school and was considered sexist and therefore dropped from our common language a generation ago. Homemaker is another that has been used from time to time, but lacks the dignity of other ‘professional’ career names/choices.

    I actually believe housewives are the backbone of a strong society and because so many woman chose not to be one is a primary reason we are in such a piss poor state today. There is no better or equal substitute for a parent when it comes to raising children.

    To believe we have advanced beyond that is a dangerous and false presumption. The family has been fractured and the facts point to intended consequences.

  • 394. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:20 am

    @ pool man for what its worth I agree with you on #393 however the word has been essentially eliminated from our culture for a lot more reasons than feminism.

  • 395. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:32 am

    “The family has been fractured and the facts point to intended consequences.”

    A really old guy who was in my MA cohort theorized that this fracture began with the invention of central heating and air.

    He said that before then, everyone in the family used to huddle in the same room to get warm/cool and it maintained their family bonds. But when the climate control vents appeared in every room in the house, people didn’t have to be in the same room to maintain their comfort—or their family bonds.

    It’s not what he chose to do his MA research on…but I think it would have been an interesting study.

  • 396. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:37 am

    Tex you lost me. The “dream” to land a man on the moon was Kennedy’s and NASA’s heyday was during the Johnson admin.

    The dream was a conglomeration of thousands of minds, long before JFK rose to prominence. JFK was the mouthpiece for a nation and a call to action. A campaign speech when people actually believed what they were hearing in a better day and the people giving the speech actually meant it.

    But the actual work, the planning, the building, the implementation and facilitation were by white men, many military. We weren’t reading the Book of Genesis from space in the name of multiculturalism, Rutherford. There was no “diversity is our strength” plan in place. The most qualified people were chosen.

    I know it’s asking people to much to learn history (not you). But if bleeding hearts with phony intent demanding others do their bidding, utilize their own riches, and do virtually all the work for the poor, poor like Big Gov., I’ll Supervise Lurker doubt what I just wrote, tell them to pull out Apollo 13 (the way most people learn history these days) and watch closely and count the number of ‘diverse, gender oriented’ faces.

    Forty years ago, America decided to declare war on her most talented demographic – jealousy, envy, covetous the reason. I’ll let the results speak for themselves what has followed in our wonderfully diverse space administration as but one example.

    Anybody that doesn’t understand this country in free fall to irrelevancy for a multitude of reasons, is either too young to know better or too stupid to be of use.

    P.S. – The Democratic Party, now in to its sixth year of power, has run out of excuses for its abysmal failure and come full circle in the blame playbook. When the charges of racism didn’t stick, your party took other paths…war on women, obstacles to progress, war on people of color, greed of the 1%. For a short time, all of them worked. But they’re not working now because the useful idiots have grown despondent.

    So were back to racism being the cause of Obama’s failure. Have you not noticed the last few weeks, the grievance industry crawling out of the woodwork? Even Hank Aaron is now out calling Republicans the KKK.

  • 397. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:38 am

    “too” to learn history. :oops:

  • 398. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:56 am

    The progressive agenda fundamentally rests on the notionthat ordinary men need brilliant people to tell them what to do. It depends on the idea that left to themselves the great unwashed would merely swill beer, drive pickup trucks and believe in superstitious nonsense like good and evil, right and wrong, God and the devil. And how much better it might be if we instead listened to the enlightenment of the Great and the Good. ~ Richard Fernandez

    Tell me he’s wrong, “R.” :smile:

  • 399. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 10:56 am

    @ Huck timelines exist though that radio and television served as common space synergizers.

  • 400. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 11:36 am

    In looking at the Sebelius resignation I am having a hard time accepting the Obots insisting that 7.5m sign ups for a mandated program somehow surpasses the most optimistic estimates. How the hell can that be true? You hold a gun to a nation,you transfer people from insurance or uninsured pools onto Medicaid and you find that number to be joyfully high?

  • 401. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 11:38 am

    A veteran Justice Department lawyer says that Attorney General Eric Holder has politicized the department in a way he hadn’t seen before. In short, “Holder is the worst person to hold the position of attorney general since the disgraced John Mitchell.”

    Now in his sixth year as attorney general, Holder has increasingly tilted the department in an ideological direction. It’s one thing to emphasize President Obama’s legal priorities. It’s quite another to decide not to enforce certain federal laws — such as the ban on marijuana — or urge state attorney generals to refuse to defend local laws on same-sex marriage. Legal changes are achieved through legislation, not through a sudden whim not to enforce them. No other attorney general has acted in this manner.

    Holder clearly believes he has the inherent power to politicize his department. When House Judiciary Committee Chairman Bob Goodlatte asked him last week whether he believed there were any limits to the administration’s prosecutorial discretion. “There is a vast amount of discretion that a president has — and more specifically that an attorney general has,” Holder responded.

    But courts have frequently disagreed with Holder’s interpretations of the law.


    That’s not a Republic, Rutherford. Discretion in application of law is necessary accomplice to Totalitarianism.

    I keep throwing this up in your face not to associate you with abuse, but in the hopes you will be fair in your assessments. Sometime, I think you too easily sway Left with the rest of the reeds. I think you better than that.

  • 402. James  |  April 13, 2014 at 11:52 am

    391 “You are correct sir.”

  • 403. James  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    390 The ranchers haven’t won yet as Alfie wrote. Like Ukraine they have breathing room because someone decided the risk of violence would bring adverse publicity and an explosion of related protests.

    400 If the administration says it it is probably false.

  • 404. El Tigre  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    “You hold a gun to a nation,you transfer people from insurance or uninsured pools onto Medicaid and you find that number to be joyfully high?”

    More incredibly is not that they say it and applaud themselves for an abysmal failure claiming it a success, its that they do it without concern that they will be eaten alive by their own.

    These are strange times.

  • 405. El Tigre  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    Obama doesn’t need to directly confront race. He has put in place a machine that does it for him. His silence and warm embraces of Sharptons, Van Joneses, Martins, Holders, etc. is all that is required. The media and drones got it from there.

  • 406. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:14 pm

    Rancher specifically Bundy is 1 but I think he is destined for a series of naughts. Ranchers plural are 0.

    Maybe so, Alfie. It’s a 15 round battle, no doubt.

  • 407. El Tigre  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    R, there has never been a DOJ that acts like this. The refusal to enforce laws is rare indeed. This DOJ offers it as an agenda is outright totalitarianism (or as you said, much needed dictatorship). You not having a problem with it (or presuming that it is just SOP), speaks volumes. None of it good.

  • 408. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:22 pm

    To Tex cause you’re a Western kind of guy and to James secondary to your agricultural background…
    I personally spent a few years in Colorado so I got exposed to how the West feels about D.C. and on a number of issues I side with them. That said I can’t sign on to the Bundy cause,I just find him specifically wrong and bad for the folks doing the right thing.
    That said back to you two,you no doubt have seen closer than most the feds various agencies overreaching on private lands have you also seen where the public lands issues have benefitted from keeping development etc off the chart?
    As a east coast guy I for one want us all to learn from our (northeasters) mistakes and try to keep some of what made our country special around,wildlife and resources wise ya know?

  • 409. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:45 pm

    You need to talk to my father-in-law about the Gestapo tactics of the EPA, Alfie.

    My straight and true father-in-law was pretty much marched into their kangaroo court in Dallas, TX, some years back in the mid 90s. I opened up the Tulsa World to read the headlines XYZ Propane fined by EPA. My wife was aghast. The court found my father-in-law liable for an $11K fine, reduced from the original $27K they threatened. They had offered $2K initially after he protested – which he refused to pay a dime.

    Four separate lawyers came to four separate findings trying to decipher the requirement. Think IRSS.

    His sin wasn’t anything environmentally damaging, mind you. No, Father Bob hadn’t attached two supplemental forms necessary for EPA requirement.

    True story.

    If you were familiar with the Waco story more than the MSM ever led America to believe, and mind you I initially sympathized with the government, you would realize contrary to the claims of the ATM, the ATM were no delivering angels but a band of jackboots with badges.

    I’ve always wanted our media to explain why the BATF/FBI flag hung on the Branch Davidian flagpole after the tragedy. Reads like a “victory celebration” to me.

    No explanation has ever been forthcoming.

  • 410. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 12:47 pm

    Sicking dogs on the protestors. Shades of ’63…

  • 411. Just a Lurker  |  April 13, 2014 at 1:15 pm

    “If there is a war in America today, it’s on the white male – Conservative, white male to be more specific the same white Conservative males that put men on the moon…”

    I know for a fact there were white Liberal males working on that program. As well as women, blacks/people of color, people of all religious beliefs and political views, sexual orientation and a few chimps too.

    One of the reasons you won’t see anything but WASP faces is that blacks/people of color, women etc. were not ALLOWED to be part of the exclusive white man’s club.

    In 1960, I worked with the test engineers for company that was developing a Saturn IV engine. We would climb on the roof of our office to watch some of the earlier launches at the Cape. Unfortunately, it was just a black speck and a vapor trail in a blue sky.

    And you played what part in putting man on the moon??

  • 412. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 1:28 pm

    In case there is actually anyone who thinks Obama won the FP battle on the Syrian Front…

    think again.

    “Both sides in Syria’s bloody civil war said Saturday that a rural village fell victim to a poison gas attack, an assault that reportedly injured scores of people amid an ongoing international effort to rid the country of chemical weapons.
    The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, an activist group that relies on a network of on-the-ground volunteers, said the gas attack happened during air raids that left heavy smoke over the area. It reported that people suffered from suffocation and breathing problems after the attack, but gave no further details.

    State-run Syrian television blamed members of the al-Qaida-linked Nusra Front rebel group for the attack, saying they used chlorine gas to kill two people and injure more than 100. It did not say how it confirmed chlorine was used.”

    This, just as the situation in Ukraine, is the result of years of failed leadership by Barack Obama. Time and time again, our worthless president has slept through 3am phone calls, and his snoring has awoken The Bear and its cubs. Even dumbass Hillary Clinton saw this coming and tried to warn the country.

    History will not be kind to this idiot we have twice elected…nor should it be.

  • 413. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    Oh…and expect more of these to happen soon.

    “The TV report also claimed the Nusra Front is preparing for another chemical attack against the Wadi Deif area in the northern province of Idlib, as well as another area in Hama. The government station did not explain how it knew the Nusra Front’s plans.”

    Smart power in action.

  • 414. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 3:53 pm

    I know for a fact there were white Liberal males working on that program. As well as women, blacks/people of color, people of all religious beliefs and political views, sexual orientation and a few chimps too.

    One of the reasons you won’t see anything but WASP faces is that blacks/people of color, women etc. were not ALLOWED to be part of the exclusive white man’s club.

    Really? I don’t believe you. In fact, I would go so far to say you’re entirely full of shit, Lurker, lying through your teeth. Just like I always find you full of shit as your misandry reference chock full of factual errors about salaries once again proved. That or you are simply stupid because you just contradicted yourself in the same post without realizing it.

    Let’s deduce, something you may be incapable of since you can’t deduce Obuma is a massive failure by any measure.

    If you didn’t see anything but White, hairy faced faces, then it boils down to a simple fact – especially considering this was the time your feckless government was doing everything in its power to promote civil rights and multiculturalism.

    There weren’t anything but the exclusive WASPs to advertise on the big stage, dummy. Chimp was advertised. :wink:

    So prove it to me…show me all these diverse crowds. Sweeping the floor and changing the hand soap doesn’t count.

    How did I contribute to putting men on the moon? Not a bit, being I had just turned nine years old.

    About the same thing you contributed…blowhard.

  • 415. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:03 pm

    By the way, Lurker. I’m having a little problem with your biological math. In 1960, I was in the neonatal unit if I wasn’t in my mother’s womb.

    Now just assuming you were “working” on the Saturn IV rocket, that would certainly have to assume you weren’t some young neophyte freshly minted from college with a “science” degree – unless your work consisted of mail service as I suspect?

    Let’s say you were in your late 20s and a prodigy (cough cough). You want to tell me you’re also 80+ years old right now, Great Grandpa Lurker, with the accolades to execute rocket science, hey? Uh huh.

    I smell the stench of ‘hyperbole’ in your midst, “scientist.”

  • 416. eltigre100  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:15 pm

    Lurker, unsung hero of the space race. JAL ain’t no male WASP.

    So what role should’ve brought you notariety but for the white man?

  • 417. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:15 pm

    :lol: I’m afraid this charge of sexual harassment was too incriminating for even a crooked justice to implement ‘men are all predators.’

    This gal must be nuts…be forewarned; the video is “soft porn.”

  • 418. poolman  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:20 pm

    I’ve always wanted our media to explain why the BATF/FBI flag hung on the Branch Davidian flagpole after the tragedy. Reads like a “victory celebration” to me.

    It was a conquest. That is the perfect example of what this unholy beast is capable of. It actually still does much of the same around the globe on a daily basis with little or no media coverage. At least when this event was ongoing and during the duration, the media did film the aggressive acts by our government against these citizens. That is some real footage everyone who didn’t live through should watch.

    The flag thing makes it a game. “Our team holds this ground, see our banner?” Like a-Q in Libya. Like gangs and tagging. It’s a taunt. Sometimes it’s a false flag. Like a-Q in Libya.

  • 419. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:45 pm

    “The people running the company are breaking a law …”

    Fine Huck they are breaking an existing law. That means it is STILL going on. You and yours don’t protest to have these existing laws enforced. You just claim “the problem is bullshit.”

    In one of her old jobs when she was single my wife knew FOR A FACT that the man she replaced earned more than she did for the sane job. When she asked why she was told “he has a family, you don’t.”

    So can YOUR bullshit that the problem doesn’t exist. It does.

  • 420. dead rabbit  |  April 13, 2014 at 4:47 pm

    “Great Grandpa Lurker, with the accolades to execute rocket science”

    Man…that cracked me up. And I needed a laugh.

    Not very fun at the rabbit house hold. Lots of screaming at one another. Not cool.

    Marriage is hard. Sometimes it feels like my wife and I speak different languages.

  • 421. eltigre100  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:13 pm

    I know a lot of women and minorities that got preferential treatment and pay too. Usually was to avoid HR problems and lawsuits that R doesn’t seem to think exist, Even when someone with IBM receives an absolute statement of liability on behalf of the company, according to R’s wife.

    Question for you, “why is it that another law how long the exact same conduct ?” Is that all you know?

  • 422. eltigre100  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:15 pm

    Try that again. Why is it that we need another law outlawing the exact same conduct?

  • 423. eltigre100  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:16 pm

    And as we all know, life ain’t fair, right R?

  • 424. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:32 pm

    “R, if they are right, how are they not dignified?”

    What do accuracy and dignity have to do with each other?

    “I would humbly ask the esteemed Attorney General if our contempt charge mattered much to you?”

    THAT is how Goehmert could have conducted himself with dignity. There was a time in this country when words mattered. Shit, even the British do it better. At least they preface their insults with “the right honorable …”

    Our discourse has gone in the gutter. Goehmert is probably rude to everyone so I don’t even need to play the race card.

  • 425. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:38 pm

    Rabbit the Wilson lie wasn’t a lie. Where does it say illegals are getting Obamacare anymore than some might already be getting Medicaid?

    In other words did the ACA legislation ever say illegals could get Obamacare? No. So Wilson was out of line.

    And the fact that he pulled this stunt however coincidentally with the first black POTUS was not cool. He’s not just an ignoramus, he’s a political ignoramus.

  • 426. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:40 pm

    In my opinion G the notion that you think Nixon pales in comparison to Obama seriously calls your judgement into question. It’s not straw men — it’s providing evidence that you are not a credible witness.

  • 427. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:42 pm

    Ok Huck you got me on Zimmerman.

  • 428. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:48 pm

    Tex I can’t speak to the “brilliant” men part but I can say there is an assumption in liberalism that left to their own devices the great unwashed will NOT do the right thing.

    It’s something I was thinking a day or two ago — would slavery have ended of its own accord eventually without the civil war? The Korean and Vietnam wars did not end communism. It died a natural death with nonviolent help from Ronnie and Gorby.

  • 429. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:51 pm

    Alfie there was nothing close to a gun held. There was every reason to believe the 7M sign up goal would not be reached.

    Now if you want to argue about the real significance of the 7M, that is another argument entirely.

  • 430. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:55 pm

    Tigre your comment about Obama and his “machine” sounds straight out of the MSNBC talking points about Chris Christie.

    You are learning well Grasshopper.

  • 431. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 5:58 pm

    So back that statement up. What differs Obama from Nixon?

  • 432. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:04 pm


    Liberalism is the great masses of low information voters in large part. Want proof?

    This midterm, when many fewer vote than in a Presidential election year, it is probable your party gets its ass handed to them as it did in 2010.

    In a Presidential election year, the less informed come crawling out of the woodwork. The Obamaphone, the Rock the Vote, the free rent and gas crowd, the 47% Romney offended, the grievance hustlers…

    You know that. Now, that’s not to say Libs don’t have their intelligent group. But for the most part, the Democrats are the Big Tent Party of institutional grievance. Right now, many of them are eating their own.

  • 433. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:07 pm

    Please. Holder has shown nothing but contempt for Congress. Even hus response, “buddy”. Buddy? Buddy! Fuck you clown. He’s the only AG to ever be held in contempt, for a reason. How does he deserve dignity at this point?

  • 434. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:07 pm

    Your gang lies, so…..

  • 435. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    “Fine Huck they are breaking an existing law. That means it is STILL going on. You and yours don’t protest to have these existing laws enforced. You just claim “the problem is bullshit.””

    It’s the fucking Civil Rights Act that would be being violated, asswipe. That would put its enforcement in the lap of your chum Eric Holder and his boss Barack Obama. You guys do remember what law enforcement is…right?

    I seem to recall you stating that Obama doesn’t like to double up on law creation where a law already exists. Did the first black president/constitutional scholar/former editor of the Harvard Law Review forget the contents of the Civil Rights Act?

    “In one of her old jobs when she was single my wife knew FOR A FACT that the man she replaced earned more than she did for the sane job. When she asked why she was told “he has a family, you don’t.””

    That isn’t gender-based wage discrimination, is it? The answer wasn’t “because he’s a man, you aren’t.” That answer suggests a single man would have made less than that married man…or that your wife with a family would have made as much.

    I’ll also point out that your wife replacing someone else probably would not have begun that job with the same proficiency as the person being replaced, which would be another legal justification for starting with a lower wage.

    Anecdotes aren’t data. Obama tosses out this 77% figure that even Lurker’s links show is bullshit. I never said it doesn’t go on. I did assert that it doesn’t go on anywhere near the extent that is claimed by our Liar-in-Chief.

    You’re thinking with emotion again, Rutherford. Just like you and your fellow liberals always do. Pull your head out of your heart.

  • 436. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:13 pm

    “Sometimes it feels like [we] speak different languages.”

    Rabbit it took you this long to figure that out?

  • 437. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:15 pm

    “In other words did the ACA legislation ever say illegals could get Obamacare? No. So Wilson was out of line.”

    Until they are all given amnesty and made citizens. Then he will be right on the money.

  • 438. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:16 pm

    To be very clear my wife’s salary issue did NOT occur at IBM. It was in the banking industry before we got married.

    Beyond that Tigre I don’t understand your question.

  • 439. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:18 pm

    Ok Tigre I read your rephrase. Fine, no new law needed. Now let’s move on to enforcement.

    Ahhh no need cos Huck says the problem is billshit.

  • 440. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:20 pm

    BTW Tigre do you know the need for Lily Ledbetter act? If you didn’t know you were being screwed within a certain period of time you were out of luck.

  • 441. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:21 pm

    “Alfie there was nothing close to a gun held”

    The gun to which he is referring is called “The Law of the Land”. It’s the mandate that was upheld by the United States Supreme Court when the Obama Administration decided it was a tax…after they told everyone it wasn’t a tax, and claimed people were “reaching” when they told him it was a tax.

    Good god, man. Are you tired today, or what?

  • 442. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:21 pm

    G why don’t we start at conspiracy to cover up an actual crime?

  • 443. muffy  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:21 pm

    Holder is disdainful of the law, and that’s on Holder. Holder’s a major racist and a cranky baby.

    It’s all politics. This guy (link) talks to this woman this way not because she’s a woman but because she’s a Republican.

    I’m sick to death of paying attention to the left’s obsession with race.

  • 444. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:24 pm

    Tex you confuse dumbness with laziness. Libs are lazy as all fuck and only get excited by the big show.

    It’s pathetic. Republicans win midterms by default. They don’t even have to work for it.

  • 445. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:24 pm

    Rutherford, you’re starting to piss me the fuck off by misquoting me. I made myself extremely clear in the above post.

    You suddenly want to enforce a 50 year old federal law?…fine. Then do it and stop all this “we need congress to act and the GOP are a bunch of women-hating meanie-heads” horseshit and tell Eric Holder and his boss to do their fucking jobs for once.

  • 446. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:27 pm

    “Buddy” was sinking to Gohmerts level. I’ll grant you Holder could have taken a higher road.

    But you’re wrong about Louie G. And your head is in the sand if you can’t acknowledge the decline in our public discourse.

  • 447. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:28 pm

    “Libs are lazy as all fuck…”

    Store this one right under “life isn’t fair”, boys.

  • 448. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:31 pm

    “And your head is in the sand if you can’t acknowledge the decline in our public discourse”

    Dude, 18th and 19th century US politicians used to call each others wives whores and drunks. “Buddy” and “you lie” aint shit.

  • 449. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:34 pm

    Huck there are laws against jaywalking and it hardly constitutes a “gun”. Most of the folks who signed up for Obamacare did not do so because they were afraid of breaking the law. And clearly the admins worry that the 7M goal would not be met speaks volumes about how confident they were in the coercive nature of “the law of the land”.

  • 450. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:38 pm

    Huck here is where you go wrong. Not a single conservative talking head is saying “there’s a problem and it’s Obamas fault for not enforcing current law.”

    Instead they say there is no problem and the stats are a lie. You fell into the same trap.

  • 451. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 6:40 pm

    I didn’t intend my comment to stretch back to the 1800’s.

  • 452. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:23 pm

    R, have you not considered the source of the decline? How is it dignified to have a senator publically villify individuals who have broken no laws or committed no crimes? This conversation demonstrates the hypocrisy you apply to others versus what you and yours do on a daily basis.

    You make no sense: a dignified liar is better than undignified honesty? And you want to lecture me on the nature of our discourse?

    Again I ask, differ Nixon and Obama for us.

  • 453. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:24 pm

    Ok. Fast and Furious? Benghazi? Solindra? IRS? Where should I stop?

  • 454. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:28 pm

    Rutherford I am pretty sure the Administration fears of upwards of 7 M speaks more to their knowledge that the system was not working properly and that Americans kind of suck at deadlines,witness your local central branch of the USPS on Tuesday night.
    That the Administration was privy to the fact that the majority of sign-ups were laterals into Medicaid speaks volumes to my point that the crowing is misplaced.
    The gun to the head is real,many don’t respond well to it others are actually probably linked to the myriad of exemptions in place which are at a min. technically illegal in spirit if not letter of the law.
    Please please please don’t think next April will be anything but appropriately deemed a gun to the head,remember I live in the state that has penalized people all ready.
    PS if you haven’t read the article by Chait seriously you will love it. Points within have manifested in this very thread.

  • 455. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:29 pm

    I confess Harry Reid’s thuggishness sometimes amuses me but I’m wrong to defend it.

  • 456. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:30 pm

    You’re confusing (or perhaps deliberately conflating) incompetence with crime, G.

  • 457. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:33 pm

    I can say there is an assumption in liberalism that left to their own devices the great unwashed will NOT do the right thing.
    It’s something I was thinking a day or two ago — would slavery have ended of its own accord eventually without the civil war? The Korean and Vietnam wars did not end communism. It died a natural death with nonviolent help from Ronnie and Gorby.

    Theres a classic example of the differences between conservative and progressive and obviously Liberal thought. (Liberal in the international sense not American)
    Progressives firmly believe they know what is right and how to get people to do it. This is true regardless of how often they are proven wrong.
    Would slavery have ended without the Civil War. Absolutely!
    Neither the Korean or Vietnam wars were designed to end communism.

  • 458. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:35 pm

    The stats are a lie and that has been proven many times. Just ask Lurker, she’ll give you some links. In fact, the only thing that hasn’t been proven—even once—is that they are not a lie. The fact that the stats are a lie makes it a minimal problem. The fact that it’s a minimal problem highly suggests that it is one that could be handled with proper enforcement of existing law.

    But then that doesn’t make for good sound bytes, does it? You can’t turn out lazy liberal voters by simply saying we have an issue that could be handled with proper law enforcement. Especially when the loudest voice is the guy who’s job it is to enforce the law.

    Isn’t it interesting that the only reason Obama thinks its a problem is because he uses false figures? When he pays women 88 cents on the dollar to a man working for him, that isn’t a problem..because “the national average is worse”…except that it isn’t. Equally interesting is that we don’t see you raging about him doing it, or insisting that he enforce the law in his own house, while simultaneously trying to tell everyone else what needs to be done.

    Hell, your wife was given a better excuse than the one Obama’s mouthpiece essentially told every woman that works for him. They pretty much got told “suck it could be worse.” Next you guys will be telling us he pays them less because the GOP doesn’t give the executive branch enough money. (Mark my words on this one).

    Jaywalking isn’t federal law enforced by the IRS with increasing and substantial penalties for multiple violations. Do I need to repost Sheldon’s reductio ad absurdum clip for you?

    Since we have no idea who signed up for ObamaCare, you are not in any position to speak to the motivations of those who signed up for it. Because of your lack of organization regarding the law…you forfeit that. I can just as easily claim that “most of who signed up for it” are the 6.5 million who lost their existing insurance because of it. And while I am not doing that, there’s not a thing you or Alfie can do to prove it wrong if I was.

    “I didn’t intend my comment to stretch back to the 1800′s.”

    Where does history begin for you? How can you talk about “decline” when you don’t have a set baseline from which to begin?

  • 459. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:42 pm

    “Neither the Korean or Vietnam wars were designed to end communism.”

    Nor was the Cold War bloodless. You can ask the proxies of both sides all about it.

    But then, maybe he wasn’t intending his comment to stretch back to the Cold War.

  • 460. Huck  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:44 pm

    “You’re confusing (or perhaps deliberately conflating) incompetence with crime”

    It’s sad that this is actually a mark of progress for Rutherford. He is finally admitting that the Obama presidency has been rife with incompetence.

  • 461. poolman  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:51 pm

    Marriage is hard. Sometimes it feels like my wife and I speak different languages.

    Yes, yes it is. And yes, you do speak different languages. But hang in there. I can attest that after 37 years your interpretation skills vastly improve.

  • 462. an800lbgorilla  |  April 13, 2014 at 7:56 pm


  • 463. dead rabbit  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:00 pm

    We could just as easily have some nanny liberals convincingly crowing about how the system is set up against men. (And they would if they thought it expedient.).

    Speech after speech about the “glass floor”. A world where women, without college degrees, seem to get entry level jobs in air conditioned offices that have “bagel Tuesdays”.

    Men on the other hand, taking on back breaking and dangerous work, fighting off the brutal elements for the same money.

    We could get speech after speech about the lack of college attendance for men. How the educational system as a whole is disadvantageous for boys.

    But we don’t (thank God) despite the reality that when it comes labor, we men shovel the shit that is used as fuel to heat those cozy cubicles.

  • 464. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:03 pm

    Alfie, not end, but surely stop the spread. Did we need to worry about stopping the spread of a nonsustainable economic system?

  • 465. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:07 pm

    FINALLY? I deemed Obama incompetent in many ways in these threads long ago. Pay better attention.

  • 466. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:11 pm

    LOL Poolman I’ve only got 13.5 years under my belt but you are very right.

    I spent the first year of my marriage keeping my mouth shut until I could measure what words would get me into trouble.

    Now I sometimes “go there” just for sport. LOL

  • 467. Rutherford  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:14 pm

    Rabbit if there are inequities against men why shouldn’t they be addressed?

    Sometimes I don’t think you guys even want to strive for “a more perfect union”.

  • 468. dead rabbit  |  April 13, 2014 at 8:46 pm

    I think improvements could be made in school.

    But….for the most part…..your Nanny always seems to make it worse. I’d rather nature and culture pick the winners and losers then you and your asshole friends. And trust me, somebody will still be shoveling shit. I would rather not have your elites bestowed with power to pick who gets the shovel.

    In fact…a man can work his way up from the shit shovel. I did exactly that. I’m just pointing out women often times luck out and never start so low to make a decent buck. If we are playing violins, lets hear them all.

    Honestly, culture often times mimics necessity. There simply aren’t enough women strong enough to do a lot of work out there that needs to be done. Just as it is a huge detriment for a business to have a chunk of their workforce constantly checking out for the most noble act in all of humanity, giving birth and nurturing a baby.

    Your elites are corrupt. Why do always want to give them more power?

  • 469. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:23 pm

    @464 I don’t think it appropriate to say we were engaging in a battle of economic ideology post WWII. I think hindsight can be a damning thing and we see that regards the Cold War. Day in day out though the very real concerns of trade,security and spheres of influence ruled.
    I think to a degree we see that today. We are not in a war with folks who hate our freedoms and money no matter how’ hard that drum is beat. We are in a war with people who view our actions and intents as a threat therefore they react and when dominoes drop well….

  • 470. Alfie  |  April 13, 2014 at 9:24 pm

    FWIW Huck I am pretty confident who makes up the 7 M and the motivators behind their signing up.

  • 471. Tex Taylor  |  April 13, 2014 at 11:44 pm

    Lazy and low information aren’t mutually exclusive, Rutherford. GG…

    In fact, more often than not, they correlate well.

  • 472. Huck  |  April 14, 2014 at 12:10 am

    Alfie, I need to make it clear that I am not doubting you in the slightest. My point was, simply, that you can’t prove it. I can’t prove anything either, so I’m not saying you’re wrong.

    Nobody can prove any of it. All we have is “WOOHOO 7.5 MILLION, GOOD GAME WE WIN!!!111″

    “FINALLY? I deemed Obama incompetent in many ways in these threads long ago. Pay better attention.”

    My bad. I guess your vote to re-elect him threw me off.

  • 473. El Tigre  |  April 14, 2014 at 2:10 am

    “BTW Tigre do you know the need for Lily Ledbetter act? If you didn’t know you were being screwed within a certain period of time you were out of luck.”

    Yeah. We had this discussion. I educated you on what the Act was since you started out thinking it meant something more.

    And yeah. If you don’t figure out you got screwed within a certain period of time you’re out of luck. It’s called the statute of limitations and it applies to all laws, civil and criminal. You’re surprised by this?

    So, maybe you’d spend a minute and find out what whom the Act has purportedly “helped.” If you think Obama has done something with Lily Ledbetter, you’re not just a fool, you’re a damn fool.

  • 474. parker  |  April 14, 2014 at 7:45 am

    Alfie @ 469 – right on the money. And it is the implication of that observation that is important: could many Americans be (being) used by their government as …. what was that phrase …. “useful idiots,” jerked around by catch-phrases and patriotic jingoism, so they provide the people’s approval to feed your military-industrial complex the money and dead bodies it requires in order to prosper?

    There’s a great quote by C.S. Lewis, if I remember … here it is: No, it was Sinclair Lewis – ” When Fascism Comes To America It Will Be Wrapped In The Flag And Carrying A Cross ” 1935

  • 475. parker  |  April 14, 2014 at 8:09 am

    Rutherford@380 – been busy, but managed to scroll back to your answer. Fair enough.

    re: concept that the Great Unwashed Masses will not do the right thing without force. I disagree, but whoever brought that up struck the essence of Liberal thought.

    Seems to me that over long periods of time Humanity lurches toward greatness by fits and starts – and in my view, it is made possible entirely by technology. (Think Maslow’s triangle). The Internet is the latest and by far most significant technological boon to freedom, because it makes it now impossible for oppressive governments to hide the beauty of freedom from anybody. People see it, and they WANT it. Why do you think the Great Firewall of China is so important to those bureaucrats?

    Along that line, would slavery have ended? Yep, just like picks and shovels left Yancoal years ago – humans are not efficient diggers; Caterpillars are. And secondly, as people’s lot improves generally, they (see Maslow) begin to cast about for wrongs to right. Can’t do that when you are scratching for your next meal, but when THAT is secure ….

  • 476. parker  |  April 14, 2014 at 8:19 am

    Rutherford – Oh, I forgot: If you want to sic your your grade-school “researcher” on it, this should make life easier:

    Search terms: lewis flag cross fascism – 22 pages on Google

    Search terms: Maslow triangle – > 28 pages

    It’s easier, though, if one just knows some things to start with.

  • 477. James  |  April 14, 2014 at 8:34 am

    Fascism is already here. It came wrapped in promises and gauzy ideals ignorant voters bought. Read this morning’s Betsy’s Page.

    Joe Wilson said “You lie!” As I wrote before had he said “Mr. President, you lie” he would have expressed respect for the office while still describing Obama’s behavior. “You lie” is a generic sentence with no specific description. Assuming Wilson was wrong about his specific charge, he was still right. Obama does lie. The proof cannot be hidden.

    This is irrelevant, but it is better than the filth coming out of Washington and our elite “betters.”

    I read an article explaining how closely connected Russian and American tech companies are. I also read that Catherine the Great was a friend of John Paul Jones, and she worked hard to convince France to support our American Revolution.

    It was 82 on Saturday. Severe thunderstorms developed fifty miles east of us. Yesterday began at 58 with some thunder. We had more thundershowers and heavy cold rain as the temperature fell into the thirties with a north wind gusting to nearly 50 MPH. The dry slot remained a few miles south of us as the deformation zone approached. Heavy sleet showers turned to west snow with flakes the size of half dollars.

    The wind was still gusting to nearly fifty miles per hour so as the temperature reached freezing, we had near blizzard conditions. I skied into open country and as I turned to go back a gust nearly blew me over. Climbing back up while on skies is tricky.

    We have two inches of snow on the ground, and it is 26 with wind gusts to near 40 MPH. I plan to ski again before we return to Omaha,.

    Our grand daughter said “Da Da” to me last Thursday. After she called me “Da Da” she said the same to her swing,.

  • 478. Tex Taylor  |  April 14, 2014 at 8:41 am

    Sinclair Lewis, hey? Ironic that our boy man Dominionist feared fighter would pick Sinclair to so readily admire…like Christopher Hitchens, Sinclair died a most gruesome death like Hitchens.

    Being Christopher Hitchens never struck me as particularly happy or hopeful but as rather a bitter, resentful, dour, heavy drinker type, at the end, appearing bereft of all hope. The 60 Minutes interview was most painful to watch.

    See if Hitchen’s death sounds familiar.

    After an alcoholic binge in 1937, Sinclair Lewis checked into the Austen Riggs Center, a psychiatric hospital in Stockbridge, Massachusetts, for treatment. His doctors gave Lewis a blunt assessment that he needed to decide “whether he was going to live without alcohol or die by it, one or the other.” Lewis checked out after ten days, lacking, one of his physicians wrote to a colleague, any “fundamental understanding of his problem.”

    Apparently, Sinclair’s alcoholism wasn’t the only fundamental misunderstanding. He died a wretched man, mostly forgotten until the militants dug up a few old quotes. A proud man; a fool, and dead.

    You should have stayed with your first choice, C.S. Lewis – an atheist who took a sojourn to disprove God and came back perhaps the 20th century’s best Christian author:

    “A proud man is always looking down on things and people; and, of course, as long as you are looking down, you cannot see something that is above you.” – C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity

    Your most obvious fatal flaw, ‘Parker.’ A profound arrogance, that most people recognize but a shield to mask the misery.

  • 479. muffy  |  April 14, 2014 at 10:21 am

    “Parker if I dig down deep, abortion should be available when the mothers life is in danger. DONE. Not incest, not rape, not being horny.” -R

    “Rutherford@380 – been busy, but managed to scroll back to your answer. Fair enough.” -Pf
    :lol: So that’s what a rational discussion of abortion looks like.

    PS…no need to work so hard, Pfaker. You’re not pfooling anyone. :)

  • 480. El Tigre  |  April 14, 2014 at 2:32 pm

    Great ad:

  • 481. El Tigre  |  April 14, 2014 at 2:37 pm

    However, this is one of the best ever:

  • 482. Tex Taylor  |  April 14, 2014 at 2:41 pm

    Dartmouth: Raising the next generation of Leftist Totalitarians.

    Get a load of this shit – the first paragraph will tell you all you need to know about these poor little buttercups attending school at $60K a year. They’re so put upon, these feminists. I thought it was so bad, at first I thought it was satire. But it’s not.

    Hey Rutherford. You’re a good Ivy boy. What the hell is Gender Theory and Transformative Justice, by the way? :lol:

    Obama gobbledygook, I guess? I hope I die before assholes like this step into some position of authority.

  • 483. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 3:01 pm

    Tigre you are right. Ledbetter herself is still unhappy.

  • 484. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 3:12 pm

    Tex I haven’t read the article but I know Dartmouth has a history of racial discord. Maybe you’re just seeing the pendulum swing back, albeit vis-a-vis gender not race.

  • 485. an800lbgorilla  |  April 14, 2014 at 3:24 pm

    To continue the discussion of dignity…

    Washington, D.C., federal judge rebuked U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder on Thursday for overstepping his authority and disrespecting the judicial process.

    “I regret that, before we voted on the amendment, Attorney General Holder instructed assistant United States attorneys across the nation not to object to defense requests to apply the proposed amendment in sentencing proceedings going forward,” Judge William Pryor Jr. said at a public hearing, according to the National Review. “That unprecedented instruction disrespected our statutory role ‘as an independent commission in the judicial branch,’ to establish sentencing policies and practices under the Sentencing Reform Act of 1984.”

    Eric Holder pointing at GohmertA day earlier, U.S. Rep. Louie Gohmert, R-Texas, accused Holder of ignoring subpoenas issued by the House Judiciary Committee.

    Obama’s procrastinator-in-chief had been expected to appear before the Sentencing Commission to defend his breach of protocol, but he never showed up. Since the sentencing guidelines themselves were never at issue, the commission unanimously passed the amendment to reduce non-violent drug dealers’ prison terms by 17 percent. But Holder’s attempts to sidestep the constitutional process remain a sticking point for Pryor and other critics.

    “The law provides the executive no authority to establish national sentencing policies based on speculation about how we and Congress might vote on a proposed amendment,” Pryor said, according to The Blaze. “We do not discharge our statutory duty until we vote on a proposed amendment, and Congress, by law, has until Nov. 1 to decide whether our proposed amendment should become effective.”

    When fellow Commissioner Jonathan Wroblewski tried to defend Holder by calling his behavior was lawful and respectful, Chief Judge Rosario Hinojosa rebuffed him, accusing Holder of setting “a dangerous precedent.”

    “For those committed to the rule of law, the question…it’s whether the Attorney General, the chief law enforcement officer in the United States, is committed to following the law as it exists, or instead, as he wants and speculates it might become,” Georgetown law professor William G. Otis said in a statement, National Review reported.

    Rest assured, Holder’s role as an administration lightning rod will not soften any time soon.

  • 486. Tex Taylor  |  April 14, 2014 at 3:50 pm

    Tex I haven’t read the article but I know Dartmouth has a history of racial discord. Maybe you’re just seeing the pendulum swing back, albeit vis-a-vis gender not race.

    Read it for a good laugh – at least I had a good laugh. I provided that especially for you. Not as insult, but I thought you might appreciate imbeciles trying to sound intelligent and enlightened, being I do find you a capable writer even if you’re an Obuma twit. :smile:

  • 487. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 4:06 pm

    Grammar is not your strongpoint G. This has nothing to do with dignity.

    If you want to continue to highlight how Holder is overstepping his bounds be my guest.

  • 488. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 4:10 pm

    Tex I had to chuckle yesterday as Michael Eric Dyson spewed some of his hyper intellectual word salad on Face the Nation and left Bob Schieffer speechless. I know Bob was dying to ask “WTF did you just say?”

  • 489. an800lbgorilla  |  April 14, 2014 at 4:10 pm

    Logic isn’t yours. You continue to fail to demonstrate how and why Holder should be addressed in any dignified manner, especially in light of his actions.

  • 490. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 4:18 pm

    Because everyone deserves a modicum of respect in a public hearing. Even folks on the stand in an actual trial are not allowed to be badgered.

    It’s one reason why you guys have had a field day with Hillary and “what difference does it make?” No matter her intent, she lost her cool and stepped in it.

  • 491. an800lbgorilla  |  April 14, 2014 at 5:09 pm

    Respect is earned and I would have agreed with you when he first came into office. 6 years later and multiple law and constitutional violations later, the bemefit of the doubt is lost. Fuck him and his pride. The man is fucking scum.

  • 492. Rutherford  |  April 14, 2014 at 6:37 pm

    Good lord. The over the top language. Ok let me go there again — you revere a man who based on recently declassified documents should be labeled a war criminal.

    This is my fantasy: Cheney: I want you to pardon my buddy Scooter.
    Bush: you’re lucky I don’t have you perp-marched on the evening news. Now get the hell out of my office.

  • 493. an800lbgorilla  |  April 14, 2014 at 6:55 pm

    Again, explain. What war crimes?

  • 494. dead rabbit  |  April 14, 2014 at 7:42 pm

    I think Rutherford is outraged over Cheney’s drone assassinations.

    Or am I confusing him with someone else.

    Yeah….come on Rutherford….I get it….the water boarding that led to the death of OBL….you don’t like it. Is that what you are referring to?

    Please do tell….

    My Great Uncle died from war crimes. He was executed. Gun to the head. An unarmed villager. Killed by Russians.

    I have another Great Uncle who died by the hands of Germans although I know a lot less of the details.

  • 495. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 3:36 am

    This “Blood Moon” was quite spectacular. I am glad I got up to see it.

    I can certainly understand why it in antiquity these events created fear in men. Not as spectacular as a solar eclipse or the comet 15-20 years ago, but beautiful nonetheless.

    Is there anything more beautiful than the heavens on a dark night?

  • 496. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 4:23 am

    Now I can’t go back to sleep. Saw this in response to an MSNBC bozo that called Conservatives “hicks” on Twitter:

    E·lit·ist (n.): A person who thinks he can control the economy, weather and human nature but doesn’t know how to change the oil in his car.

  • 497. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:32 am

    I woke up to see, since it was only an hour before I normally get up for work, but it was rainy here so no joy. Too bad, I’m sure it was impressive.

  • 498. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:36 am

    It was spectacular – but colder than hell. Sunday afternoon watching Bubba win the Masters, I was sitting in my recliner wearing shorts and a t-shirt.

    15 hours later, I was bundled up with a headband covering my ears walking the dog.

    I’m really ready for Spring. I’ll bet this freeze just killed every damn flower on my azaleas which were close to blooming. Dogwoods too. Glad I didn’t plant tomatoes yet.

  • 499. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:42 am


    R isn’t going to provide evidence of anything. He makes these outlandish accusations that are about as deep as his dick is long and then wonders back to the phone bank.

    He can’t differentiate Nixon and Obama, though he claims the former is worse than the latter. His defense of Obama of late has been incompetence vice corruption, which I’m not entirely sure is better considering the time and investment the left has made in telling us how much smarter BO is than you, me, and everyone else. But somehow, being Jimmy Carter is better than Richard Nixon. What’s hilarious in that is that when you compare the Administrations of Nixon and Carter, their accomplishments, their failures, Nixon comes out far ahead in accomplishments.

    Obama is like the love child between the worst we have to look at: the incompetence of Carter and the corruption of Nixon. I could ask who’s the daddy in that conjugal visit, but I think its pretty obvious that corruption drives Obama’s actions, but the end results demonstrate total incompetence.

    Yes R, you can be a stupid crook….

  • 500. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:52 am

    And yet ANOTHER example of the corruption of the Obama Regime. A government of the people, for the people, by the people…

    Not in this pResidency…

    Like all mergers, the proposed $45.2 billion Comcast CMCSA +1.5% merger with Time Warner Cable TWC +1%—the largest and second largest cable providers in the nation—has its advocates and critics. There are certainly important questions about what impact the merger would have on consumers—but there are equally significant issues associated with the highly politicized approval process.

    The Obama Department of Justice, led by Eric Holder, must review the merger and decide whether to approve or block it. Unfortunately, the Obama Administration and Justice Department have a long track record of pushing the rule of law aside and making decisions based on politics. Will the proposed Comcast merger with Time Warner Cable receive the scrutiny it deserves, or simply be fast-tracked for approval based on politics?

    Let’s look at some history—which is detailed in a new Frontiers of Freedom report. In 2009, the Obama Administration gave Solyndra, a failing California solar panel firm, a $536 million “loan.” Shortly thereafter, Solyndra was fully bankrupt. Prior to the loan, Solyndra executives and board members gave generously to Barack Obama, including Tulsa oil billionaire and Obama bundler George Kaiser, one of Solyndra’s main investors.

    UnitedHealth Group is expecting higher earnings thanks to ObamaCare. After United supported passing the plan, one of its subsidiaries, Quality Software Services, Inc. won a contract of $90 million for the rollout of UnitedHealth’s Executive Vice President Anthony Welters and his wife are significant Obama donors and bundlers. The Administration did not perceive any conflict of interest in providing the nation’s largest health insurer with the keys to

    If money buys favors from the Obama Administration, a lack of it produces the opposite.

    In 2011, AT&T T +0.45% announced it would seek permission from the government for a $39 billion merger with T-Mobile. Processing the application was expected to take at least twelve months. But within five months, the Department of Justice announced it had filed a lawsuit blocking the friendly merger.

    Enter AT&T CEO Randall L. Stephenson, well known to be a free market Republican favoring pro-growth tax reform and opposing Obama-style redistributing income from the working class. Mr. Stephenson has a long history of Republican giving, and averaging the three election cycles between 2006–2010, AT&T employees supported Republican candidates by 60%.

    Key government players during merger talks were Federal Communications Commission Chairman Julius Genachowski and Renata Hesse, now Deputy Attorney General for Anti Trust at DOJ, and of course, Attorney General Eric Holder, who runs the most blatantly politicized DOJ in history.

    FCC Chairman Genachowski is a longtime technology advisor for Barack Obama, serving on his transition team. Obama appointed him FCC Chairman in 2009. He and his wife, another Obama appointee, are long time Obama donors. Ms. Hesse, then in charge of the AT&T merger at FCC, has donated more than $6K to Obama for America. In a policy forum last year, Ms. Hesse stated the Obama Administration’s approach to antitrust was “vigorous enforcement.” But does that apply evenly across all merger applications?

    On February 14, 2014, Comcast announced intent to acquire Time Warner Cable in a deal worth $45.2 billion—$6 billion more than the AT&T/T-Mobile deal. This merger would also result in an approximate 40% market share. Overseeing this application at DOJ will be vigorous enforcer Deputy AG Hesse. As with AT&T, will the FCC and Department of Justice deny the Comcast merger, and in record time?

    If AT&T is “red,” Comcast and Time Warner Cable are deep “blue.” In 2012, Comcast employees donated $465K to the Democrat National Committee vs. $114K to the Republican National Committee and supported Obama over Republican Mitt Romney by nearly four to one. Time Warner donations were $442K Obama and $28K Romney.

    Comcast also has two Obama cronies working the merger. CEO Brian Roberts is an Obama golfing buddy whose political giving is 90% Democratic. Overseeing the merger is Comcast Executive Vice President David Cohen.

    Cohen and his wife have given upwards of $500Kto Obama while raising another $2.2 million. During a Democrat fundraiser at Cohen’s house, President Obama quipped, “I have been here so much the only thing I haven’t done in this house is have Seder.”

    Obama once publicly stated, “we’re gonna punish our enemies and … reward our friends.” Executive Branch action on the Comcast/Time Warner deal will demonstrate if this caveat applies to merger policy. A number of Congressional Committees will review the merger, including a Senate Judiciary hearing on April 9.

    In addition to analyzing financial details of this merger, Administration history of crony capitalism screams for Congressional inquiry to determine if the Executive gives preferential treatment to corporations with friendly donors. Merger approval or denial should be based on objective analysis, not which political party enjoyed the loudest clink in its campaign jar.

    If that’s the case, no matter what merger wins, consumers will always lose.

  • 501. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:15 am

    Another Day. Another Democrat pleads guilty. This one is especially satisfying – an Obama lackey on the border.

    Former Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino (D) — he stepped down a couple of weeks ago — has pleaded guilty today to federal charges of money laundering, according to the McAllen Monitor.

    Just 17 days after stepping down as sheriff and three days after his former chief of staff entered a related plea, Treviño stood before U.S. District Judge Micaela Alvarez and pleaded guilty for his part in laundering campaign contributions that were tied to a convicted drug trafficker. Testimony in court this morning suggested that the amount of money laundered could be anywhere between $70,000 and $120,000.

    Trevino presided over a sheriff’s department that has been accused of a wide range of corruption. The Hidalgo County Sheriff’s department falsified crime statistics to serve both Trevino’s and the Obama administration’s political interests. In an exclusive hidden-camera video, a crime analyst with the Hidaldo County Sheriff’s Department admitted that she and others within the department including Trevino himself change the way in which crimes are classified in order to improve the overall statistics.

    ♫ Lupe, Lupe ♫
    What are you going to do?
    Five big black men
    Have taken a liking to you. :smile:

    An Obama/Holder pardon is surely forthcoming…

  • 502. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:40 am

    Some perspective for R on the “dignity of the office”…

    Last week, the president’s lap dog blew his dog whistle (a dog whistle, if you didn’t know, is coded language intended for a special constituency).

    Speaking to the National Action Network, Atty. Gen. Eric H. Holder Jr. said, “The last five years have been defined … by lasting reforms even in the face of unprecedented, unwarranted, ugly and divisive adversity.” He continued: “If you don’t believe that, you look at the way — forget about me, forget about me. You look at the way the attorney general of the United States was treated yesterday by a House committee…. What attorney general has ever had to deal with that kind of treatment? What president has ever had to deal with that kind of treatment?”

    Now, bear in mind the audience. The National Action Network is Al Sharpton’s plaything, often providing the shock troops Sharpton needs for rent-a-mob protests, shakedown operations and MSNBC photo ops. Holder didn’t say criticism of him and Obama is racially motivated, but the notion the audience (or the media) would take it any other way doesn’t pass the laugh test.

    For the record, there’s nothing special about the rough time Holder has received. Forget Harry Daugherty of Teapot Dome fame or John Mitchell, who went to prison. Ed Meese’s critics had “Meese Is a Pig” posters printed up. Janet Reno and John Ashcroft never got cake and ice cream from opponents.

    The best recent comparison is probably Alberto R. Gonzales, George W. Bush’s second attorney general, because like Holder, he was a fairly incompetent partisan loyalist with a thin skin. Gonzales was treated brutally by Democrats. Some even tried to impeach him. I don’t recall Gonzales insinuating that such efforts were anti-Latino.

    Holder has deserved all he’s gotten. He earned his contempt of Congress citation by refusing to provide documents on the disastrous Fast and Furious operation that left an American dead from a gun given to Mexican drug gangs by the U.S. government. If anything, Holder deserves more grief, particularly from a media that seem to have forgotten his efforts to surveil journalists’ phone records and name Fox News’ James Rosen an unindicted co-conspirator in an espionage case.

    Even inside the White House, Holder is considered too political. “Holder substitutes his political judgment for his legal judgment, and his political judgment isn’t very good,” says an unnamed White House official, according to the Washington Post’s David Ignatius.,0,3023814.column#ixzz2yxD7T4ra

  • 503. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:52 am

    Of course, I’m sure R will tell us all how Attkisson doesn’t know what she’s talking about…

  • 504. James  |  April 15, 2014 at 8:43 am

    Rutherford Lilly may be unhappy because she is “living a lie” Powerline Sept 20 2008.

    ” For decades, the Supreme Court has recognized that the limitations period in a Title 11 case can be extended or tolled in such circumstances. Tolling is available when in other situations, the plaintiff has no reason to suspect discrimination at the time of the disputed event.

    But Ledbetter did not argue that the limitations period should be in her case, and for good reason, Ledbetter testified that she knew by 1992 that her pay was out of line with her peers. In 1995, she spoke to her supervisor abut the problem telling him that “I knew definitely that they were all making a thousand at least more per month and that I would like to get in line.” Yet Ledbetter waited until 1998 to file her EEOC complaint,.

    This delay is particularly difficult to understand given that fact that , in 1982, she had filed a sexual harrasment complaint with the EEOC. That dispute was settled without litigation shortly thereafter. Had Ledbetter followed the same course with her pay claim, she would have had her day in court, and Good Year would have had a fair chance to defend itself,That this did not occur is Ledbetter’s fault.,

    Ledbetter testified under oath that she knew she was earning less than her male counterparts. Three years later, she said she learned this through an synonymous note. her lack of knowledge countermanded the statue of limitations through tolling,

    In the words of Joe Wilson “You lie.”

  • 505. James  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:00 am

    Tex my sympathies. You have gotten some of the cold air which gave us a snow storm. Omaha’s early morning commute yesterday was a mess with three people dead. It is 20 this morning with milder weather forecast, especially next week,

    Obama and his minions are far worse than Nixon. For example, Nixon had enemies lists as Obama has, Though he may have fantacized doing it , Nixon did not use the IRS to attack political enemies.

    We know Obama is destroying this country as it was. We don’t know that incompetence is responsible,. If you read Obama’s history and about his mentors, our trajectory seems to be on track., Obama may be incompetent, but those behind him are not. This is by design,

    We need to show no deference to criminals who hide behind the honor of their offices,. One can respect the office while excoriating actions of people who don’t deserve to hold positions of power,

  • 506. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:24 am

    Ah shoot James,

    We had it easy compared to you blokes. We didn’t get any ice or snow. I had to laugh Sunday night. Down here, we have a color coded country map transposed on the screen if there are weather warnings – probably the same in NE/IA. I’m sitting in shorts and a t-shirt with the house at 74 degrees and the ceiling fans running.

    I thought this was at first a typo when the warning map flashed on the screen.

    On side of the state (mine), we were all under a tornado watch and it was 85. On the west side of the state, they were under a winter storm warning with possible white out conditions. LOL. WTH?

    In fact, I don’t think it got any colder than 34 degrees last night if my thermometers are right which still comes pretty close to hitting a record low.

    But that could be a killer for our flowering plants since we had zero breeze.

  • 507. parker  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:24 am

    regards Nixon and Obama. It’s an even race as to who caused the greatest damage. The American left focusses on Watergate, but Watergate was trivial when compared to Nixon’s abandonment of the Bretton Woods Accord, thus freeing his and all subsequent administrations to buy votes with printed money. Obama’s socialism can be combated on some level; debasement of the currency is extremely difficult to deal with; it has brought down country after country, and there’s no reason the believe that America fare any better than the rest.

  • 508. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:25 am

    “Is there anything more beautiful than the heavens on a dark night?”-Tex

    It’s awesome.

    I got up all excited to see the moon and saw nothing but a blizzard. I think we might have more then 3 inches of snow right now. It was 15 degrees this morning. Not getting over freezing.

  • 509. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:31 am

    One word: Petulant

    Neurosurgeon Ben Carson says the White House wanted him to apologize for “offending” President Obama after he famously delivered a conservative message at the National Prayer Breakfast last year.

    Carson, the former director of pediatric neurosurgery at Johns Hopkins Hospital, recalls the events surrounding his 2013 speech in his new book, One Nation: What We Can All Do To Save America’s Future. The Daily Caller obtained an advance copy of the book, which is set for release May 20.

    “He did not appear to be hostile or angry,” Carson writes of Obama, “but within a matter of minutes after the conclusion of the program, I received a call from some of the prayer breakfast organizers saying that the White House was upset and requesting that I call the president and apologize for offending him. I said that I did not think that he was offended and that I didn’t think that such a call was warranted.”

  • 510. El Tigre  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:46 am

    Wasted breath James. All of what you said is the SCOTUS opinion in the underlying case. Obama and his minions shout “LIlly Leadbetter” because it sounds like something — a victim who’s wrong has now been set right along with all of other oppressed women out there.

    So long as know one spends time thinking about it, then Obama can sell it as something bigger than it was. And, as always, he can take the lack of investigation by his followers to the bank. Just like $.77 for every dollar, Obamacare, Unemployment, economy, GM, global warming. . . just keep shouting “republican injustice” or “victory” and they’ll accept it without question.

  • 511. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:28 am

    “We know Obama is destroying this country as it was.”

    Well he did promise fundamental change….

    We now have a press that is attacked by the bully pulpit and spied on when it doesn’t fall in line.

    We have the IRS attacking opposition groups and taking the tax returns of people whose parents were overpaid by Social Security decades ago.

    We have a national mandate for every man, woman, and child to purchase a particular service, regardless if they want it or not.

    We arm Mexican drug dealers while trying to limit arms to Americans.

    We ask the United Nations if we can go to war instead of Congress.

    We have an Administration that openly defies the rule of law.

    And we have a president who thinks he’s smarter than everyone else in the room until something fucks up and then he has to read about it in the morning paper.

    And we have an electorate that has been so dumbed down and made so servile and dependent that it re-elected him because the other guy put a dog on the roof of his car and had a dancing horse.

    That’s change you can believe in, folks….

  • 512. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:35 am

    “and they’ll accept it without question”

    And there lies the problem we sometimes compartmentalize.

    The debate has been won, and it doesn’t matter. You can see it here with Rutherford and I see it with other libs.

    Shoulder shrugs. We now even see apathy towards what used to be liberal Doric columns if it in any way tarnishes “team”.

    They believe in nothing except winning election via freebies and division.

    Obama…soon Hillary……winners for sure. But every single principle held by libs have died on the vine.

    Why do you think its so hard for Rutherford to make a meaningful comment not alone his blog. He’s got nothing.

    I have about 6 more years in me….and then…well…..

  • 513. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:37 am

    The 1980’s called. But it was at 3:00 am so Obama was asleep….

    “WASHINGTON, April 14, 2014 – A Russian attack aircraft repeatedly flew near the USS Donald Cook in international waters in the Black Sea on April 12, a Pentagon spokesman said today.
    “The aircraft did not respond to multiple queries and warnings from Donald Cook, and the event ended without incident after approximately 90 minutes,” Warren said. “This provocative and unprofessional Russian action is inconsistent with international protocols and previous agreements on the professional interaction between our militaries.”

    Two Russian aircraft were present, but only one took part in the provocative actions, Warren said. The aircraft flew from near sea level to a couple of thousand feet, he added, but never overflew the U.S. Arleigh Burke-class destroyer.

    “The Russian plane made a total of 12 passes,” he said.
    Warren said he does not think this is an example of a young pilot joyriding. “I would have difficulty believing that two Russian pilots, on their own, would chose to take such an action,” he said. “We’ve seen the Russians conduct themselves unprofessionally and in violation of international norms in Ukraine for several months, and these continued acts of provocation and unprofessionalism do nothing to de-escalate the situation in Ukraine, which we called on the Russians to do.””

  • 514. poolman  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:44 am

    Yeah, because we still have enough integrity to justly criticize others. :roll: lol

  • 515. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:50 am

    Oh and

    “…A U.S. military official also said that a Russian Navy ship, a frigate, has been shadowing the U.S. warship, remaining within visual distance but not close enough to be unsafe. The official was not authorized to discuss the incident publicly so spoke on condition of anonymity.

    Warren said that he is not aware of any official communication or protests by the U.S. to the Russians about incident[s].
    The USS Donald Cook is now in port at Constanta, Romania.

    Romanian President Traian Basescu visited the ship Monday and said a second U.S. Navy warship — a frigate from the Navy’s Sixth Fleet in the Mediterranean Sea — is also heading to the Black Sea.
    The U.S. frigate, which has not yet been identified, is expected to arrive in the Black Sea in the next two weeks. According to a U.S. military official, the frigate is likely to replace the USS Donald Cook, which is expected to return to the Mediterranean Sea.”

    Good thing that bloodless Cold War is over.

  • 516. poolman  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:51 am

    Tex, I have ripe tomatoes already. More than we can eat. Of course we had one plant survive the ‘winter’ and it has some serious fruit on it. It is also 6 feet tall and takes up a five foot wide trellis. We have probably ten tomato plants besides that one. Still harvesting strawberries. The snow peas are done after a very impressive run.

    A chilly 53 on the patio this morning. I think we’re only going to be in the upper 80’s instead of the 90’s today.

  • 517. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:55 am

    Another media outlet points out that a frigate is “less armed” than the destroyer it is replacing.

    Because we wouldn’t want to provoke anyone….

  • 518. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:07 am

    And before Rutherford comes in here with his “what should they have done, shot it down?” and “are you in favor of provoking a war?” bullshit….

    All of this just shows—again—that Obama is not mentally equipped to play chess at this level. Move after move makes him–and us–out to be weak and cowardly.

    Just like his meaningless red lines, he sends a warship into the region, only to have it run off by the very person he is trying to intimidate.

    This is dangerous, because it emboldens Putin. But what makes it even more dangerous is that our allies in and out of the region see it. It will cause them fear. And fear makes people do dangerous things.

    Peace through strength works. But only if everyone thinks you are smart enough and potentially willing to use it. Barack Obama has shown repeatedly that he is neither. And that is why we are in the situation we are in today.

    You liberals better get your shit straight…because if you don’t, tomorrow will only be worse. And it will take a lot more than drones or waterboarding to fix it.

  • 519. El Tigre  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:32 am

    “You liberals better get your shit straight…because if you don’t, tomorrow will only be worse. And it will take a lot more than drones or waterboarding to fix it.”

    Never. They are getting precisely what they want. Remember: They are “dreamers.” Reality is an obstacle to overcome with wishful thinking and an optimistic, unquestioning attitude that all other posses their values — or will posses them once they see what dreamers they are!

    Ignore all of the damage and the fact that they haven’t figured out that their strategy of decree towards their own and appeasement of their enemies has resulted in the opposite of what they dream about. It’s bumper sticker politics with the mentality of a love struck teenage girl.

    If you can dream it, you can live it! You’ve just got to believe in your own virtue and ignore the wreckage. That’s all.

  • 520. poolman  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:32 am

    Drones and waterboarding exacerbate the problem, not fix it. Since we have employed drones and waterboarding we have increased our enemies and provided tremendous incentive for recruitment. Of course no one listened to this advice when it was delivered over a decade ago. No one in the business of war is having financial woes in our current ‘war on everything’ environment.

  • 521. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:39 am

    WASHINGTON — The Census Bureau, the authoritative source of health insurance data for more than three decades, is changing its annual survey so thoroughly that it will be difficult to measure the effects of President Obama’s health care law in the next report, due this fall, census officials said.

    The changes are intended to improve the accuracy of the survey, being conducted this month in interviews with tens of thousands of households around the country. But the new questions are so different that the findings will not be comparable, the officials said.

    An internal Census Bureau document said that the new questionnaire included a “total revision to health insurance questions” and, in a test last year, produced lower estimates of the uninsured. Thus, officials said, it will be difficult to say how much of any change is attributable to the Affordable Care Act and how much to the use of a new survey instrument.
    A major goal of the law is to increase the number of people with health insurance. The White House reported that 7.5 million people signed up for private health plans on the new insurance exchanges and that enrollment in Medicaid increased by three million since October. But the administration has been unable to say how many of the people gaining coverage were previously uninsured or had policies canceled, so the net increase in coverage is unclear.

    Health policy experts and politicians had been assuming that the Census Bureau would help answer those questions when it issued its report on income, poverty and health insurance, based on the Current Population Survey. The annual report shows the number of people with various kinds of health insurance and the number of uninsured for the nation and for each state.

    Census officials and researchers have long expressed concerns about the old version of insurance questions in the Current Population Survey.

    The questionnaire traditionally used by the Census Bureau provides an “inflated estimate of the uninsured” and is prone to “measurement errors,” said a working paper by statisticians and demographers at the agency.”

    TRANSLATION: Uninsured wasn’t as uninsured as we thought it was.

  • 522. muffy  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:48 am

    Huck @ #155 – excellent summary.

  • 523. poolman  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:50 am

    Expecting the DNC to ‘get their shit together’, or even asking the same of the GOP, is a futile notion. They are gangs with plenty of spoils and void of integrity. Just as kids need adult supervision to learn right from wrong, politicians need supervision to be forced into doing the right thing. Our blind trust in our political system and leaders has led us into this present dark abyss. There is nobody around strong enough or with better means to reach in and pull us out.

    Time for a reset.

  • 524. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    Tex, I have ripe tomatoes already. More than we can eat. Of course we had one plant survive the ‘winter’ and it has some serious fruit on it.

    No doubt, there’s some advantages to living in the Valley of the Sun. :smile:

  • 525. muffy  |  April 15, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    I meant #511. I don’t like that I inverted those numbers. I even checked it and typed it immediately. :eek:

  • 526. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 12:57 pm

    How, convenient…

    WASHINGTON — The Census Bureau, the authoritative source of health insurance data for more than three decades, is changing its annual survey so thoroughly that it will be difficult to measure the effects of President Obama’s health care law in the next report, due this fall, census officials said.

    The changes are intended to improve the accuracy of the survey, being conducted this month in interviews with tens of thousands of households around the country. But the new questions are so different that the findings will not be comparable, the officials said.

    An internal Census Bureau document said that the new questionnaire included a “total revision to health insurance questions” and, in a test last year, produced lower estimates of the uninsured. Thus, officials said, it will be difficult to say how much of any change is attributable to the Affordable Care Act and how much to the use of a new survey instrument.
    Continue reading the main story
    Related Coverage

    Iris I. Burnell, a tax preparer in Washington, says she has been talking to clients about the tax implications of health coverage under the Affordable Care Act.
    Tax Preparers’ New Role: Health-Coverage AdvisersAPRIL 14, 2014

    “We are expecting much lower numbers just because of the questions and how they are asked,” said Brett J. O’Hara, chief of the health statistics branch at the Census Bureau.

    With the new questions, “it is likely that the Census Bureau will decide that there is a break in series for the health insurance estimates,” says another agency document describing the changes. This “break in trend” will complicate efforts to trace the impact of the Affordable Care Act, it said.

    A major goal of the law is to increase the number of people with health insurance. The White House reported that 7.5 million people signed up for private health plans on the new insurance exchanges and that enrollment in Medicaid increased by three million since October. But the administration has been unable to say how many of the people gaining coverage were previously uninsured or had policies canceled, so the net increase in coverage is unclear.

    Health policy experts and politicians had been assuming that the Census Bureau would help answer those questions when it issued its report on income, poverty and health insurance, based on the Current Population Survey. The annual report shows the number of people with various kinds of health insurance and the number of uninsured for the nation and for each state.

  • 527. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 3:26 pm

    Got to throw the occasional bone to our bartender and admit though ObumaHolder the most visibly corrupt, damaging and crooked, let me admit to you “R”, The “Repugs” have their share of pond scum.

    Headline: BANANA REPUBLICANS: New Head Of Virginia GOP on Eric Cantor’s Payroll

    Cantor always came across as the proverbial greasy elitist to me – never did care much for him.

  • 528. El Tigre  |  April 15, 2014 at 3:50 pm

    Ain’t that some shit.

    Frog March him too.

  • 529. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    Sorry Rabbit recently declassified documents show what was always suspected by the left … torture didn’t do shit. Zero Dark 30 is fucking fiction.

    Cheney lied us into an unnecessary war perhaps as Rand Paul implied, influenced by a Haliburton profit motive.

    Cheney was and remains a malignant tumor on the body politic.

  • 530. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 4:46 pm

    Yup snow in mid April. Nothing to see here. Just move on.

  • 531. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 4:58 pm

    G I already answered your damn question. Nixon actively engaged in the cover up of a CRIME and received bipartisan rebuke for it.

    Solyndra, Fast and Furious and Benghazi don’t rise to the level of crime and the ONLY ones desperately trying to prove otherwise is Darrel Issa and his GOP scandal chasers.

    Even the IRS affair doesn’t have enough meat for the PTB to do much but turn a lady over to justice dept for taking the fifth.

    So G, either Obama is not Nixon or we have the absolute worst prosecutorial congress in the history of the United States.

    Not for nothing but Carter kept us OUT of war, a too short respite from a constant state of war since WWII. He also has the guts to call out Netanyahu for the belligerent dude that he is.

    G you are so clouded by irrational hate that you cannot possibly judge Obama sensibly.

  • 532. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:09 pm

    G you’re repeating yourself. What, at least 3 comments about Holder being a cry baby. Ok, we get it.

  • 533. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:13 pm

    Regarding Obama and the press we’ve already acknowledged this is not the most transparent admin evah.

    G you’re like a madman shouting at a shadow. I see Obama waaaaaay more clearly than you see him (or Cheney).

  • 534. El Tigre  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:29 pm

    “Yup snow in mid April. Nothing to see here. Just move on.”

    Huh? In which location mentioned doesn’t this occur?

    Is this more of your dumb anecdotal evidence of global warming — that hasn’t been occurring for a decade as admitted by anthropogenic warmists?

  • 535. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 5:49 pm

    Sorry Rabbit recently declassified documents show what was always suspected by the left … torture didn’t do shit. Zero Dark 30 is fucking fiction.

    Do you know something the interrogators didn’t, Rutherford? Because they say interrogation did work. And that was with those 183 ‘brutal’ 10 second water boardings of KSM. Lame…

    By the way. If Zero Dark 30 was totally fiction, why did the Obama Adm. howl so upon its release? Because Obuma did wait 132 days or thereabouts to finally give the order making him look lame.

    GM Lives and Osama is dead! Hooray!

  • 536. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:06 pm

    ** Guffaw **

    Study finds signs of brain changes in pot smokers

    Do imbeciles really believe weed is good for you? Told you so…expect a generation of brain dead adults on the horizon. Upside for you, Rutherford.

    Millions of new Obumba, Hillary Rotten voters.

  • 537. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:12 pm

    My first inclination was to concede there is, in fact, a legitimate ethical argument to be made against water boarding and that the effectiveness is indeed controversial.

    But then I read your other comments, remind myself just how ignorant you are…..and it pains me to say it… are beneath me.

    Didn’t Prince, from the Midwest, have a song called Sometimes in Snows in April, dunce?

    I lift my leg and piss on this blog like a German Shepard or….more accurately….sniff the blog turd like one would.

    I’d be better off playing Angry Birds. This place sucks because the blog host is a moron.

  • 538. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:17 pm

    Right about now is when I (again) ask Rutherford to take a moment to look at the current situation in the Middle East and think about what Iraq under Saddam would look like today.

    Given the history, is there any reason to believe the people of Iraq wouldn’t have followed the suit of those in Egypt…Yemen…Tunisia…Libya…Syria?

    Given the history, is there any reason to believe that Saddam would not have reacted in an extremely violent manner…probably mirroring his northern neighbor?

    It’s hilarious the clarity with which Rutherford believes he views it all. Cheney is a war criminal because some terrorists got water poured on their face and because he (perhaps) fabricated a pretext for us to go in and remove a war criminal who had tortured, raped, slaughtered, and gassed his own people (and his neighbors) for decades.

    The world is a better place with OBL gone. And kudos to Obama for getting him.

    But you know what?….the world is a better place with Saddam Hussein gone, too. And until you recognize that…you aren’t seeing anything very clearly.

  • 539. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:24 pm

    Another issue upon which we agree Tex. I view this new pro-pot push with great skepticism. Always beware when the selling point starts “it’s not as bad as …”

  • 540. Rutherford  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:25 pm

    Fuck you too Rabbit.

  • 541. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:29 pm

    I seriously doubt that…..

  • 542. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:31 pm

    “Always beware when the selling point starts “it’s not as bad as …””



    Are you fucking joking?!?!?!?!?


    That’s your selling for the re-election of Barack Obama and you’re already laying the foundation for it to be your selling point in the election of Hillary Clinton.

    OMG….I am literally (in the Bidenesque sense of the word) laughing my ass off right now…..

  • 543. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:37 pm

    It’s also the selling point in your clear thinking regarding Cheney and Obama….

  • 544. an800lbgorilla  |  April 15, 2014 at 6:58 pm

    Breathtaking stupidity. I’m delusional? You’ve demonstrated once again how illogical and partisan you are.

  • 545. muffy  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:14 pm

    Rutherford, if you find these questions too personal then just consider them rhetorical and don’t bother answering. I’m just curious about some of your recent remarks.

    When you mentioned that your health insurance was the second largest monthly expense – does that include your tax burden?

    I assume when you had health insurance through your employer it was not the second highest monthly expense after housing, is that right?

    You said you were saving $500 a month on health insurance through the exchange. Are you comparing that to what it would have cost you to keep the same insurance you were on before? When Cobra runs out they tell you what it will cost to keep the insurance but pay the whole cost yourself – is that the figure you’re using for the $500 savings figure?

    What’s your yearly deductible on your new insurance?

    Lastly, is your position on the April cold snap that “something’s wrong but [you] have no idea what it might be?”

  • 546. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:51 pm

    Always beware when the selling point starts “it’s not as bad as …”

    It’s a lot worse that not as bad, Brother “R.” It’s being parlayed as being “good for that which ails us…”

    I don’t give a damn if somebody smokes weed for recreational use – as long as they don’t get behind a wheel, operate in the general public like operating a backhoe or a fair ride, and leave it in the house. Don’t get the crap around me or my kids. You demand it for cigarettes. I don’t want to smell the ganja as it smells like shit.


    The argument for legalization I absolutely disdain as I disdain all things based on a false premise and a pack of lies. Medical use. Pffft…My ass. These dopehead shops out in Colorado are high value targets as far as I’m concerned. McVeigh picked the wrong building.

    If THC has some beneficial medical aspect, and I don’t doubt it does because most of our medicines are derived from nature like plants (like the periwinkles growing in my lawn), then refine the THC in pill form or injection form where it can be monitored for purity and control.

  • 547. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 7:58 pm

    This is great stuff off Twitchy. These Libs are getting busted faster for mendacity than I can keep up.

    Read Donna Brazille, Hillary Rotten Lip Licking Lackey and Liar, lie to Donna Brazille. LOL! Imbecile…

  • 548. Huck  |  April 15, 2014 at 8:29 pm

    “If THC has some beneficial medical aspect, and I don’t doubt it does because most of our medicines are derived from nature like plants (like the periwinkles growing in my lawn), then refine the THC in pill form or injection form where it can be monitored for purity and control.”

    I was watching a CNN piece a couple weeks back while I was on a night shift work break at a hospital and it mentioned a strain of weed that has been developed that (supposedly) has the medicinal properties of pot but absolutely will not get a person high.

    Of course, I also think the intoxicating qualities can be beneficial for some…and with that said…i concede that far too many are abusing the “medical marijuana” system.

  • 549. Alfie  |  April 15, 2014 at 8:49 pm

    Re the Black Sea news. It seems there is something to be said for both sides regards the deployments. On one hand the seaborne units for the missile defense lite program are now on station. They have firmed up leases and deployments in Rota Spain. The USS Donald Cook which I’ve actually visited stateside before,is one of the four Arleigh Burke class destroyers that makes up the system.
    The USN has rotated out a number of destroyers, all of the Burke class, into the Black Sea.At least two are in the eastern Med right now,Truxton and Ramage. During the Olympics in Sochi the 6th Fleet flagship the Mt Whitney and a frigate were in the BS for security ops.
    I can’t yet pinpoint the possible frigate that will rotate out the Cook. I know it is an Oliver Hazard Perry class frigate that is indeed less formidable than a Burke class destroyer.

  • 550. Alfie  |  April 15, 2014 at 9:56 pm

    Anyone else see the CBO confession that ACA savings essentially false due to what plans are actually in effect? It is believed that by 2016 plan cost will skyrocket.
    On note of previous in case anyone cares I’m going with one of these three,Taylor,Elrod or Kauffman,all FFGs in eastern Med. Of note the Taylor has been there before w/ the Whitney and embarrassingly ran aground.
    Interestingly Huck the Russians are mad at Turkey because Ankarra moderates the Montreuix treaty thing and Russia alleges they are turning a blind eye to USN “overstays” in Black Sea .

  • 551. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:00 pm

    “Always beware when the selling point starts “it’s not as bad as …” -R

    Fucking Classic.

  • 552. Alfie  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:01 pm

    Rutherford I have to know the extent of your Jimmy Carter praise. 1.what war did he keep us out of? 2. Iran,Panama,Afghanistan which was his best FP play?

  • 553. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 10:54 pm

    “Russians are mad at Turkey” -A

    Have the Russians ever not been mad at Turkey?

    It aint Peter or Moscow….deep down they see Constantinople as their capital.

    Considering how sick of stink beards I am…..even Turkish ones …..I’d almost wouldn’t mind an Orthodox mass in the Hagia Sophia, considering their plans to be assholes and make it a mosque again.

  • 554. dead rabbit  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:08 pm

    “because he [Cheney} (perhaps) fabricated a pretext” -Hucking

    We can’t let him go on that stupidity. Nobody “fabricated” anything. The entire world, including Democrats in Congress, thought S.H. had chemical weapons. S.H. pretended he had chemical weapons!

    The fact is that it was a classic war. People on both sides didn’t understand one another. We didn’t get how important the posturing from S.H. was. He didn’t get how paranoid we were post 911. Comparable to World War I, even.

    It’s fair to lambast Bush for starting a war on false intelligence. It’s also ok to arm chair quarterback a world with or without S.H.

    It’s ignorant to say the Vice President lied us into the war to. This makes Rutherford a dunce.

  • 555. Tex Taylor  |  April 15, 2014 at 11:54 pm

    Didn’t some imbecile ‘mediocre’ President once tell us a few years back that al Qaeda was on the run and decimated?

    Unsettling video shows large al Qaeda meeting in Yemen

    GM Lives! Just not the drivers of their vehicles.

    So let’s talk about WMD.

  • 556. dead rabbit  |  April 16, 2014 at 12:11 am

    Stink beard pep rally.

    Well…boys…..I’m going to my cabin (unarmed) …..and meeting my …cough….err….. tenant.

    If you don’t here from me by Friday….I’m a dead dead rabbit.

    I’m banking on the mere sight of me….mixed with my foul mood as of late….makes him move out. Not going to say anything to him. Just take a tour of the shit hole.

    Sorry James. Can’t stand it any more. First move.

  • 557. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 6:57 am

    Sometimes, not often, the WSJ does a better job of summarizing my own conclusions better than I do (in writing). I guess that is why they are called ‘professional’ journalists.

    Rutherford, I don’t want to insult you personally. I don’t even want to pile on since you’re last man standing. Lurker is useless to you, because he or she is so transparently dishonest, they’re more court jester than ally to you.

    There’s a chance, an outside one, you’ve finally come to an impasse and decided that you’ve been hoodwinked. You won but it didn’t work out like you dreamed.

    I understood in 2008 – lifetime of surrounding by like mind. I gave up on you in 2012 because I no longer felt you were making any attempt at pursuing truth and had become a cheerleader for dishonest brokering. And I still don’t think you were truthful in the time leading up to the 2012 election.

    But if you’re really interested in what my beef is with Obama, and the Democratic Party in general, read this article. I wish I had written this…

    Coalition of the Disappointed – Obama fires up racial and gender resentments to get out the vote.

  • 560. James  |  April 16, 2014 at 8:52 am

    507 Parker, it is a matter of opinion.

    Maybe you are right that abandoning Breton Woods Accord was a greater sin than Obama’s accelerating our trip to socialism, but my opinion differs. Our currency may have been debased, but the US is still functioning, and many of us are still living well. Once a crash happens, a majority of us will suffer. Obama’s policies chooses winners and losers.

    Obama’s IRS scandal explores the border of fascism, because IRS practices single out perceived enemies for special sanctions. For example, Ron Paul is ordered to release the names of his donors or face fines. Even if the IRS requirement is legitimate, the request combined with what we already know destroys trust in our government and its institutions. That and the lies about ObamaCare are just two dangerous developments the Democrats have given us.

    Rutherford Paul Woodward and an AP reporter were guests on network Fox News on Sunday. The Ap reporter said the liberal press is not paying attention to the scandals because there is little information. A couple of panelists called her on it and noted that if Republicans had been the evil doers, networks would have covered the stories with the intensity they reported the missing air liner when little new information was available.

    Woodward agreed and said his list of suspicious actions is probably longer than theirs. He said Republicans should be more focused. The press is also at fault.

    Benghazi while not directly affecting us is grounds for impeachment
    because it is the result of a failed military policy tied to the Arab Spring which Obama to wanted to show he had won the war against terror, The policy was based on a lie, and when it unraveled, the administration lied some more.

    I was once tortured, and I have a slight VA recorded disability to show for it. Waterboarding is not physical torture. It is psychological torture, and its survivors have fewer physical reminders than I do.

  • 561. James  |  April 16, 2014 at 9:06 am

    Good luck rabbit. You know better than I how to handle it,.

    I am sure those folks are harmless. If It was I, I wouldn’t go alone, and I would carry a hidden camera or tape recorder. I would be friendly and I would take note of any household items I could use as a weapon if it turned ugly.

    Who knows? You might even decide you like each other.

    550, I saw that, Alfie.

    If Cheney lied, so did Bill Clinton Kerry and most of the Democrats

    Go back further and remember when Carter angrily said the Soviets had hood winked him, and he advocated greater military spending to replace his policy of weakening us. I believe Carter unwittingly contributed to our present difficulty with Islamic Jihadists.

  • 562. an800lbgorilla  |  April 16, 2014 at 9:44 am

    “Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.” Marine General Mattis

  • 563. James  |  April 16, 2014 at 11:06 am


  • 564. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 12:31 pm

    Live by the sword, die by the sword.

    Humans got to sleep. Is that a weakness or a strength? Design flaw? I think not. Download time.

    Can a paranoid have a restful nap? Is security something we can purchase? How much baggage are we carrying? Locks and fences, walls and doors, real and imagined – protection or prison? We all live in fantasy. Our perceived reality is as it merges with all others within our ‘conscious’ lives.

    It’s been said, ignorance is bliss. Time and distance can either reveal greater truth or further solidify a myth. Today, there is both the largest explosion of knowledge and the greatest disinformation campaign ever in recorded history.

    It’s been said, opinions are like assholes, everyone has one. Both have purpose, yet they are often misused. Most should remain private. People speak out of the fullness of their hearts. Money is our loudest idol. I’m off to gather mo

  • 565. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 12:45 pm

  • 567. dead rabbit  |  April 16, 2014 at 2:05 pm

    He doesn’t give a shit.

  • 568. an800lbgorilla  |  April 16, 2014 at 2:11 pm

    At all?

  • 569. El Tigre  |  April 16, 2014 at 2:14 pm

    You’re right.

  • 570. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 3:40 pm

    At all? I’ve never received an answer as to why people were dressing their nothing burger by invoking the 5th Amendment.

    Why are Eric Holder, Elijah Cracka Cummings, and Lois Lerner not in a federal pen would be my next question.

  • 571. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 3:48 pm

    Remember When Progressivism was all about equity and fairness as mentioned numerous times on this very blog? Me neither…

    Former Enron Adviser Paul Krugman Strikes Again

  • 572. El Tigre  |  April 16, 2014 at 3:58 pm

    “At all? I’ve never received an answer as to why people were dressing their nothing burger by invoking the 5th Amendment.”

    Yes you did. You cannot overcome MSNBC’s lack of interest in it, so. . . “it doesn’t matter.”

    Can we please get back to the discussion of grievances created by identity politics that R does wish to participate in? This other stuff is no fun and doesn’t feel like it’s helping Obama.

  • 573. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 4:48 pm

    Yes you did. You cannot overcome MSNBC’s lack of interest in it, so. . . “it doesn’t matter.”

    Heh! ** Guffaw **

  • 574. Rutherford  |  April 16, 2014 at 5:01 pm

    Huck I’m not suggesting Saddam was some hero but our country has a long history of tolerating and sometimes supporting bad actors.

    You and Alfie have better FP chops than I do. Do you believe Iran would be the same threat today if Saddam’s Iraq still existed?

  • 575. Rutherford  |  April 16, 2014 at 5:11 pm

    Ahhh from that Mattis quote I see G that you finally agree with me. :-)

  • 576. Rutherford  |  April 16, 2014 at 5:18 pm

    James I’m sorry but a failed policy does not rise to the level of high crimes and misdemeanors. Benghazi was a tragedy but it simply is not impeachable.

    Aren’t you aware that Ambassador Stevens himself sent mixed messages about the need for greater security?

    I know you hate this but the best adjective to describe Benghazi is muddled.

    P.S. I have not forgotten my pledge to you to review Media Matters Benghazi Hoax. I’m almost done with it.

  • 577. El Tigre  |  April 16, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    “I know you hate this but the best adjective to describe Benghazi is muddled.”

    I think Hillary said it better R.

  • 578. an800lbgorilla  |  April 16, 2014 at 6:37 pm

    R, I always have a plan…

  • 579. parker  |  April 16, 2014 at 8:39 pm

    James: “Waterboarding is not physical torture. It is psychological torture, and its survivors have fewer physical reminders than I do.”

    They may have fewer PHYSICAL reminders, but one wonders if some would trade their emotional scars for yours.

    So, what kind of – let’s call it “coercion” – is allowed? Is, say, breaking a bone not allowed, even though it heals, but near-drowning sensations that scar one’s psyche and bring about a lifetime of nightmares – not?

    The real question, it seems to me, is: what things are OK on this slippery slope; what things are not, and where do you draw the line between OK and not-OK?

  • 580. Alfie  |  April 16, 2014 at 8:51 pm

    @ Rutherford re Iran:
    My take is that Iran did not see Hussein as the modifier to their policies after their war as has been presented in the past. I think Iran would have still followed the path that has brought them and us to the point we are today.

  • 581. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 8:52 pm

    It isn’t torture when we do it. Like the Nixon, it isn’t illegal if the president does it crap. We’ve been riding the slippery slope for some time now.

  • 582. dead rabbit  |  April 16, 2014 at 9:00 pm

    “You and Alfie have better FP chops than I do. Do you believe Iran would be the same threat today if Saddam’s Iraq still existed?”

    A valid question. But then I remember your leftist dunce-ology about the war being due to “Cheney’s lies” and well…..

    Ps….Benghazi makes me want to puke because of the lies…….the lies Rutherford….the movie….the useful idiot Rice on every TVs channel spreading falsehoods…..and Hillary telling us it doesn’t matter.

  • 583. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 9:03 pm

    Cheney was convicted of war crimes in Malaysia in 2012. Coincidentally, they’re still missing a 777.

  • 584. Alfie  |  April 16, 2014 at 9:30 pm

    583 we haven’t had to do this for a while but that turd grenade needs to be countered.
    The tribunal in question has zero standing,the whole thing was a mockery. Under no condition does the thing mean anything.
    To even hint A begets B is really illogical.

  • 585. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 10:18 pm

    My bad. I forgot to premise it with… Although they don’t have the western stamp of approval,…

  • 586. poolman  |  April 16, 2014 at 10:19 pm

    Oh, and coincidences aren’t supposed to follow logic, right?

  • 587. Alfie  |  April 16, 2014 at 10:28 pm

    The kuala lampur tribunal has no stamps,it is a private NGO that wanted some headlines.
    As for coincidences etc in the context presented yes logic would need to be present.

  • 588. dead rabbit  |  April 16, 2014 at 10:54 pm

    You are such a moron. And you are legion. Millions of you.

  • 589. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 11:17 pm

    near-drowning sensations that scar one’s psyche and bring about a lifetime of nightmares – not?

    Are you parroting Leftist bullshit to create a stink, or are you really that confused and uninformed while parroting MSNBC bullshit? There’s well documented evidence, including video, showing KSM was “tortured” for all of 10 seconds at a time. To read this horseshit, some of you make it sound like we pushed three mass murderers into a coma 183 times. A slap in the face would have been more emotionally trying.

    Imbeciles that can’t discern between real torture and psychological enhanced techniques bewilder me – but not nearly as much as political expediency of apparent sympathies for scum like the master planner of the murder of 3,000 people on a Tuesday morning 13 years ago. That’s enabling real murder with pretentious piety. It’s nauseating. It’s stupidity at its worst.

    I’m no longer confused why America is so lost. We’ve got a zillion amoral people playing sympathy for the devil of the world’s smallest fiddle. We’ve finally hit critical masses of dumbasses.

    SOBs like KSM should have been skinned alive. They should have pulled his head off with a tractor after they extracted every bit of information. That’s what that mofo deserved and would have gotten by The Greatest Generation before they tossed his corpse to the dogs or shipped his headless corpse home to crawl to Allah.

    We’re not better because we pretend to be good. What the hell happened to the practice of justice in this country? We don’t even recognize the enemy anymore. The Tea Party is most wanted.

    It’s like asking our soldiers to play nurse maid in a war – a recipe for crisis, a guaranteed loss. Kill the bastards before they kill you and your children given half a chance to saw your head off like Daniel Pearl.

    This phony passivity is nauseating and exactly what thugs like Vladamir Putin use against us – Obama the dullest figurehead and useful idiot.

    Wake up people, before it is you that has a blade to your throat while your wife savaged. Our enemies understand only one thing. Strength. Human nature remains the same.

  • 590. Tex Taylor  |  April 16, 2014 at 11:23 pm

    Perhaps this is why Vladamir Putin laughs at us while his pisses on our leg?

    Please tell me you’re a little bit embarrassed, old friend.

  • 591. Rutherford  |  April 17, 2014 at 3:33 am

    Rabbit don’t call me a dunce while being one yourself. Cheney did not stop at chemical. He implied Iraq had nukes which they most certainly did not.

    The man was and is deranged. 9/11 made him shit his pants so he got a bunch of our men killed for nothing.

  • 592. Rutherford  |  April 17, 2014 at 3:53 am

    I swear this iPhone app will be the death of me. I cannot easily copy/paste and hyperlinks don’t activate. So I can’t touch them to go to them and I can’t easily copy/paste them into a browser.

    Developer needs his ass kicked for ruining what was once a great app.


  • 593. Rutherford  |  April 17, 2014 at 4:11 am

    Muffy the savings only comes to fruition at end of year, ie annual expense. At first blush deductible goes up and premium goes down but even with greater med expense by end of year I’m saving money.

    Prior to losing company subsidy groceries were highest expense next to rent. We had a VERY sweet insurance plan through IBM prior to layoff. Now the burden is almost devastating. Using the exchange has eased the pain SLIGHTLY.

  • 594. Rutherford  |  April 17, 2014 at 4:12 am

    No Huck it was my selling point on Romney vs Obama. LOL

  • 595. parker  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:02 am

    Let me rephrase the question to James, who has real life experience.

    re “torture:”

    What things (torture methods, coercion, whatever you want to call it) are OK on this slippery slope; what things are not, and where do you draw the line between OK and not-OK?

    You will notice that is phrased as a question – because that is what it is – a question.

  • 596. James  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:09 am

    Parker, I don’t give a damn about their emotional scars if they are guilty. The men who were water boarded or otherwise harassed were guilty of crimes against the US, At least the men cited as “tortured” were guilty. They committed evil acts, and if they bear emotional scars, good. I hope they wake up in the night in cold sweats.

    I’m not advocating gratuitous mistreatment which doesn’t work, but if it works, use it, and try not to leave visible marks. I cope with my scars, Let them cope with theirs,

  • 597. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:19 am

    “No Huck it was my selling point on Romney vs Obama. LOL”

    Silly me…I thought that matchup was all about Obama’s re-election…

  • 598. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:23 am

    “The man was and is deranged. 9/11 made him shit his pants so he got a bunch of our men killed for nothing.”

    Must be time again to dig up all those Clinton Administration quotes regarding the dangerous Saddam Huseein.

  • 599. James  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:43 am

    rabbit I draw the line with physical beatings, including electric shocks or something else terribly painful. Brief waterboarding does not cross the line. I think mind games work better than physical suffering.

    A person is likely to say anything the interrogator wants just to ease the pain. One might threaten with a harmless sample which creates only a few minutes of pain such as pulling fingers too far apart, I think imagination and threats of real torture work better than the actual deed.

    Anticipation and imagination play with the mind. Anticipation of slow drowning after a water boarding sample is a good terror inducing action, I think,

    One should convince the prisoner he is on his side and is saving him from a terrible fate–a variation of good cop, bad cop. The questioner should know a little of the prisoners’ background so they can relate to each other as people on some level If not for the war they might have been friends.

    During WW11, a missionary in Japan questioned Japanese prisoners who’s code of honor dictated they were better dead then captured. He knew the country and its people because he had lived there. Many of the prisoners wanted to share what they knew because they had bonded with their interrogator.

    I read several interrogators in Afghanistan used a variation of the missionary’s methods with some success.

    Occasional, unpredictable sleep deprivation which follows no discernable pattern combined with the Theme from Barney or eight hours of Sami chants which drain the soul should be used, if they are proven to work. Eivor’s Trolubunden is a good example of the use of music as a weapon. Sami and early Scandinavians believed that someone could capture a soul with music. Bad music may not capture souls, but it can play with minds

    Those are my thoughts and my line, rabbit. They may be wrong, but they are mine,… ,

  • 600. James  |  April 17, 2014 at 9:22 am

    Rutherford, you disputed me when I wrote that liberals in general don’t like military people. I wrote that political correctness keeps them from overtly expressing their views.

    Please explain Veterans and White Supremacy by Kathleen Belew in the New York Times April 15. Or New York Times finds no connection to Jihad , yet Op-ed finds Extremist pattern among Vets News Busters April 17.

  • 601. Tex Taylor  |  April 17, 2014 at 9:36 am

    Rutherford, you still aren’t getting what Cheney said about Saddam right. It was no different than what Hillary Clinton said – who also voted to go to war. It was the pursuit of fissile material – not holding a nuke, dimwit. Does your memory work? Why do you think Israel blew Saddam’s reactors to hell more than 30 years ago? Now why do you clowns and dunces on the Left think the idea so farfetched that Saddam was holding fissile material?

    Remember James Woods, the actor? He’s a damn good actor too. But you don’t see him in movies much anymore because he committed the egregious sin of not being Lefty. Did I mention Woods also scored 800 on one portion of the SAT? That’s another reason he’s not a Lefty. :smile:

  • 602. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 9:39 am

    …or the 2009 DHS report that labelled vets as potential terrorists.

  • 603. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Wow…our biggest geopolitical threat (al Qaeda) is holding huge meetings and Obama does nothing because he is too distracted with the bloodless Cold War that’s been over since the 1980s.

    But he’s not as bad as the other guy because that guy hated Big Bird and had binders full of women….

  • 604. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    Rest easy, America…we’re in the best of hands….

  • 605. Alfie  |  April 17, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    Huck you’re so right. Parker are there other lines? Is it safe to use a reasonable person spiel or do we have to use all the cultural points as well. For example if I made you sleep in an occupied k9 kennel no big deal but a jihadist…

  • 606. Tex Taylor  |  April 17, 2014 at 12:56 pm

    Now Huck. You’ve been terribly unbecoming with Dear Leader lately. You know he’s combating much closer threats to home to save us from ourselves.

    Like ranchers and the Tea Party. Let’s be fair here.

  • 607. Tex Taylor  |  April 17, 2014 at 1:09 pm

    Wow…our biggest geopolitical threat (al Qaeda) is holding huge meetings and Obama does nothing because he is too distracted with the bloodless Cold War that’s been over since the 1980s.

    Of course. There wasn’t an American in attendance. :wink:

  • 608. poolman  |  April 17, 2014 at 5:09 pm

    From legion, we millions, the moron mass to all state sponsored indoctrinators,

    All-in-all you’re just another brick in the wall.

  • 609. poolman  |  April 17, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    95 today. I just picked a big red tomato off the vine, sliced it, sprinkled the slices with some sea salt and black pepper. Yummmmm… tasty, warm tomato.

  • 610. poolman  |  April 17, 2014 at 5:50 pm

    I thought they weren’t going to allow anymore POTUS selfies. I guess that didn’t fly. Pals? More like partners in crime.

  • 611. poolman  |  April 17, 2014 at 5:58 pm

    Is there a difference between Miss America and the presidency, other than the obvious 1 year reign.

  • 612. James  |  April 17, 2014 at 6:25 pm

    Miss America is better looking.

    It is 51 today with warmer weather forecast next week. We will be home for a week, and I will start to plant our garden. We usually don’t see 95 until July,.

    Ace of Spades linked to a story by Major Garrot about Obama’s 77 cent wage gap. It was a lie, and the president knew it. The administration was trolling to publicize the issue for ignorant voters,

    A top White House adviser told me last week’s pay gap dust up was a ‘perfect’ example of stray voltage.This time, it was premeditated.” The theory of stray voltage came from former senior adviser David Plouffe. Controversy breeds attention, attention provokes conversation, and conversation embeds previously unknown or marginalized ideas to the public.

  • 613. Huck  |  April 17, 2014 at 7:14 pm

    Yes…we must ignore Obama’s lies because, like a child, he is simply lying to get attention.

    But he’s not as bad as the other guy who gave a woman cancer.

  • 614. dead rabbit  |  April 17, 2014 at 8:25 pm

    James, I think you confused me with Parker earlier and directed a comment at me that you meant for him.

  • 615. parker  |  April 17, 2014 at 10:35 pm

    James@596. I think your answer shows what the problem is: “They are guilty.” Guilty in whose eyes?

    If Americans invade my country and I snipe several of them from ambush, am I “guilty?” The Germans thought so, when the French Maquis started shooting THEM, and started lining up 50 French and shooting them anytime that happened. Who was guilty there? The Maquis?

    I agree that the Saudis are religious nuts. No problem there. But when the US supports the sheiks that oppress and starve the population while they live in solid gold luxury, maybe doing anything you can to get the Yanks out of Riyadh looks pretty good to them – including knocking down a few buildings. Of course, I don’t think it was justified, but I can surely see how some of those nuts might disagree.

    Sometimes you need to see yourself as others see you. The last time the Swiss went adventuring in a foreign war was in the 1500’s or thereabouts. Nobody is knocking down their buildings, or even trying. (Yes, I know about the armed Swiss citizen and all the Swiss security apparatus.)

    Maybe Americans need to climb down off their high horses and seriously think about why the world hates them, and perhaps they wouldn’t have to be always printing money to cover all their unnecessary wars. Maybe they could even go back to actually making stuff, instead of destroying it.

    Just a thought…

  • 616. dead rabbit  |  April 17, 2014 at 11:28 pm

    Saudis starve their people? I assume that was a metaphor.

    Saudis pay their people handsomely to be chained.

    The problems found within Saudi society ain’t America’s fault. Or Australia’s.

    If it wasn’t for us they’d be led by Viceroys Uday and Qusay.

  • 617. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 5:43 am

    There’s no end to examples of how bad Obamacare is, but this is a good one…

    A New York woman suffering from a neurological disease that has required four brain surgeries has been dropped by all of her doctors and denied medications due to her Obamacare plan.

    “I’ve been vomiting. I lost 22 pounds. The pain is unbearable,” said Margaret Figueroa, 49, on Wednesday. “My medication helps me function during the day.”

    Figueroa suffers from a disease known as Arnold Chiari Malformation and Syringomyelia. Even though the Obamacare plan she purchased assured her that she was covered, her insurance card was denied when she went to fill her prescriptions. Then she learned that none of her doctors accept her Obamacare plan. Figueroa says she cannot find a doctor who accepts her Obamacare plan; indeed, there are only six doctors in all of Staten Island who take her plan, none of whom she’s been able to get appointments with.

    Figueroa’s congressman, Rep. Michael Grimm (R-NY), intervened to help her obtain some of her vital prescriptions. Grimm says he’s already received calls from at least a dozen Staten Island residents facing the same problem with Obamacare’s “narrow networks” – extreme restrictions to doctor and hospital access imposed by Obamacare.

    “Even though the insurance company cashed your check, it doesn’t mean it (the policy) has been implemented,” said Grimm at a Wednesday press conference with Figueroa. “That’s the problem – that the back end of Obamacare hasn’t been fully built. You can go on the front end of an application and look at a list of plans, but what they don’t tell you is that many of those plans don’t have doctors yet.”

    Figueroa is not alone.

    As Breitbart News reported in January, the Washington Post warned that “Obamacare’s narrow networks are going to make people furious – but they might control costs.” Breitbart News contributor Scot Vorse learned the hard way about Obamacare’s narrow networks when the nearest dentist who accepted the mandatory dental plan he was required to purchase for his children was over 100 miles away.

    Obamacare’s narrow networks have also shut out access to top cancer centers. The Associated Press says just 4 of 19 nationally recognized comprehensive cancer centers offer Obamacare access through all insurance plans in their state Obamacare exchanges, and a McKinsey and Co. study revealed 38% of all Obamacare plans only allow patients to pick from just 30% of the largest 20 hospitals in their areas.

    Experts say the narrow network horror stories will only grow as more and more Obamacare customers attempt to use their Obamacare insurance only to realize its harsh realities.

    Obamacare remains deeply unpopular nationally. The latest USA Today/Pew Research poll finds that just 37% of Americans now support Obamacare.

  • 618. Tex Taylor  |  April 18, 2014 at 6:01 am

    I love to comment using Facebook on these Leftist sites with these small ‘c’ communists coming unglued at their failures. LOL. I’ve never read the Left more enraged in this country than I have the past couple of weeks. Rubbing salt in their wounds is a treat. You wouldn’t believe the crap I get in response. All kinds of threats…

    Let’s knock off the doublespeak and get it on.


  • 619. Tex Taylor  |  April 18, 2014 at 6:02 am

    Hum. Don’t know what happened to my link.

    Woman cited for accosting GOP office worker

  • 620. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:07 am

    Sorry rabbit.

    Parker, All that matters is guilty in “my” eyes. Even Hitler and Stalin as you implied, at one level felt they were doing God’s work and believed they were empowering their people. Had they won, they would have been nominated for the equivalent of saint hood. The same applies to jihadists.who blow up people. They believe their cause is just.

    If they hurt “me” their cause is unjust. I don’t care what they think. I care that they and their heroic efforts to create justice for themselves are stopped.

    In such a situation, two ideologies and world views cannot both win if they are in conflict. One will eventually win, and the guilt will be transferred to the loser.

    Sometimes seeing ourselves as the world sees us is an effective strategy we can use to our advantage.

    I don’t care if the world hates us. I care if the world doesn’t fear us and their lack of fear becomes disdain, We don’t have to exert our power through military invasions. Bribery and intimidation are also effective, Russia in Ukraine demonstrates that power trumps good will, So does the first of the Ukrainian revolution,

    We are waging a similar battle for the soul of our country. Right now, the left and liberal press is becoming unhinged because it knows the tide of battle has turned. It isn’t because the right has become effective. The left is doing it to itself. The right is also becoming more angry with talk of revolution or insurrection as it watches progressives destroy our country.

    Obama’s intentional lies about the $.77 pay gap are the latest example Another is threats against Tex. when he pokes them on social media.

  • 621. parker  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:27 am

    R – Nice, commonsense article in Forbes about the tort lottery in America:

    You might say, “Who cares?” but remember, the monies paid in runaway-jury cases ultimately come from you, the consumer. The Long Island obstetrician, paying $176,000 in premiums every year, will NOT charge you and your wife the same fee to deliver your baby as will the OB in California, who “only” pays $50,000. He doesn’t pay his malpractice insurance; YOU do.

  • 622. parker  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:37 am

    James – I appreciate your candor. A rarity, at best.

    My point – a question really – is, do we in the West really want to go down that road? And if we do, shouldn’t we not be hypocrites about it, and just say: “I’m bigger than you and I’m going to stomp your arse to get my way, because I can,” instead of preaching to the world how holy and right we are? Nobody believes that rubbage, except Americans, anyway. Just fooling yourselves.

    I don’t know where the line is, either. The general consensus is that torture is torture, whether you leave scars or just terrorize people by near-drowning. There is no question that it DOES work to some degree, but is it worth it? John McCain, who suffered considerable torture, says it’s not. You say it is. I wonder, though, how much you really gain by behaving exactly like your enemy.

  • 623. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:57 am

    It amazes me how ignorant some are, and yet that ignorance does not preclude them from hitting “post comment”…

  • 624. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:28 am

    A yes, PF goes exploring for a the out of control verdicts.

    The article is flawed from top to bottom but I’m not going to bother with you about it. You really don’t get it no matter how much you of courtroom experience (yeah, they really show to someone that knows better).

    As P&S caps, I am reminded of one of the cases I handled as a young clerk where a family man was burned over 90% of his body from a defective industrial petroleum valve. It was horrific. He was a family man with young children and writhed in agony struggling to survive his injuries. No amount of morphine was sufficient. Years and years of surgeries and rehab. He’s deformed and will experience incredible pain the rest of his life.

    Fortunately, dumbfucks like you think they have found a solution through legislative damages caps because P&S is “subjective.” Wouldn’t want a “runaway jury” sneak past every tier of appellate review to hold on to an unjust verdict — so let’s eliminate the awards altogether.

    Now, back to your war on the domionists that are taking over the country. . .

  • 625. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:30 am

    “You really don’t get it no matter how much you lie about your courtroom experience (yeah, it really shows to someone that knows better).”

  • 626. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:35 am

    James @620 — precisely.

  • 627. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 1:57 pm

    Thanks, Parker and El Tigre..

    I’d like to see a better world as you do, but we must live with what we have. More of life than we know is biologically based. From baby eagles to national empires, power is the final arbiter.

    I don’t think the West has any choice but to take that road. If we don’t Russia, China, Islam or another group will happily take the road. I don’t think that based on history, life would be better for the majority of the world. As Chris Rea sang it would be “The Road to Hell.”

    Hypocracy works because it is more diplomatic than rubbing nations’ faces in our throwing our weight around. For example, Russia is inciting rebellious activity in Ukraine while they threaten to invade, not for aggressive reasons but for humanitarian concern for bullied Russian language speakers.

    ” A spoon full of sugar helps the medicine go down. ” “Smile when you say that pardner.” demonstrate the power of deception and hyprocacy. It is a face saving device for other nations who chose to accept our help. By including others, we let them own part of our empire building. The Romans followed that course as they changed Celts, Briits, North Africans, and others into Roman citizens .

    If you will recall, I believe psychological torture combined with unpredictable and novel physical attacks work with a good cop, bad cop giving the prisoner a case of the Stockholm Syndrome. I watched it in basic training. Recruits tend to identify with their oppressors, the TI’s.

    McCain was subjected to the outer limits of torture. That is different from what I describe. Mind games have a better chance of success.

    “How much do you really gain by behaving exactly like your enemy?” Victory.

    I’m not suggesting we do this, but dental work has a good torture potential, even if it is unintentional If, for example one injects Lidocain as far down the throat as possible in someone able to fight the gag reflex, anesthetic leaks out and runs down the throat. Moreover, the swallow. reflex is impaired.

    Another option is several hours of oral surgery without anesthetic.

    I believe the bad guy did a root canal on Dustin Hoffman’s character in Marathon Man.

  • 628. Rutherford  |  April 18, 2014 at 2:53 pm

    I’m just catching up on this Bundy thing and I have a question for you lovers of the rule of law.

    Bundy is from what I can see, a criminal. He owes the government lots of money. So how many of you rally around him? I need to review the comments thread cos I know some of you weighed in already before I knew anything about the story.

  • 629. Rutherford  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:03 pm

    Gorilla you prove yourself daily to be more of an ass and not a very bright one either.

    You seek out Obamacare horror stories and ignore the positive ones. Obamacare is far from ideal. Like every social program it will evolve and become more effective.

    Your horror stories make you look silly. If you weren’t so selective in what you spew I might take you seriously. As it is you’re a partisan hack.

  • 630. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:17 pm

    Pray tell, what are the good ones?

  • 631. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:19 pm

    I think you miss the larger, fundamental structural issues that are apparent from each of the nothing burgers. You know, like the ability to travel with your insurance in the US… Or maybe access to a doctor and/or hospital… or drugs….

  • 632. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    And why aren’t you demanding Chelsey abort?! Isn’t that her responsibility as a woman?

  • 633. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:35 pm

    “Like every social program it will evolve and become more effective.”

    What the fuck are you talking about?????

  • 634. an800lbgorilla  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:47 pm

    About as effective as Obama’s “economic policies”…

    #1 According to an analysis of U.S. government numbers conducted by Terrence P. Jeffrey, there are 86 million full-time private sector workers in the United States paying taxes to support the government, and nearly 148 million Americans that are receiving benefits from the government each month. How long can such a lopsided system possibly continue?

    #2 Ten years ago, the number of women in the U.S. that had jobs outnumbered the number of women in the U.S. on food stamps by more than a 2 to 1 margin. But now the number of women in the U.S. on food stamps actually exceeds the number of women that have jobs.

    #3 The U.S. government has spent an astounding 3.7 trillion dollars on welfare programs over the past five years.

    #4 Today, the federal government runs about 80 different “means-tested welfare programs”, and almost all of those programs have experienced substantial growth in recent years.

    #5 Back in 1960, the ratio of social welfare benefits to salaries and wages was approximately 10 percent. In the year 2000, the ratio of social welfare benefits to salaries and wages was approximately 21 percent. Today, the ratio of social welfare benefits to salaries and wages is approximately 35 percent.

    #6 While Barack Obama has been in the White House, the total number of Americans on food stamps has gone from 32 million to nearly 47 million.

    #7 Back in the 1970s, about one out of every 50 Americans was on food stamps. Today, about one out of every 6.5 Americans is on food stamps.

    #8 It sounds crazy, but the number of Americans on food stamps now exceeds the entire population of the nation of Spain.

    #9 According to one calculation, the number of Americans on food stamps is now greater than the combined populations of “Alaska, Arkansas, Connecticut, Delaware, District of Columbia, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Kansas, Maine, Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Utah, Vermont, West Virginia, and Wyoming.”

    #10 According to a report from the Center for Immigration Studies, 43 percent of all immigrants that have been in the United States for at least 20 years are still on welfare.

    #11 Back in 1965, only one out of every 50 Americans was on Medicaid. Today, more than 70 million Americans are on Medicaid, and it is being projected that Obamacare will add 16 million more Americans to the Medicaid rolls.

    #12 The number of Americans on Medicare is projected to grow from a little bit more than 50 million today to 73.2 million in 2025.

    #13 Medicare is facing unfunded liabilities of more than 38 trillion dollars over the next 75 years. That comes to approximately $328,404 for each and every household in the United States.

    #14 If the number of Americans enrolled in the Social Security disability program were gathered into a single state, it would be the 8th largest state in the entire country.

    #15 In 1968, there were 51 full-time workers for every American on disability. Today, there are just 13 full-time workers for every American on disability.

    #16 It is being projected that the number of Americans on Social Security will rise from about 62 million today to more than 100 million in 25 years.

    #17 Overall, the Social Security system is facing a 134 trillion dollar shortfall over the next 75 years.

    #18 According to the most recent numbers from the U.S. Census Bureau, an all-time record 49.2 percent of all Americans are receiving benefits from at least one government program each month. Back in 1983, less than a third of all Americans lived in a home that received direct monetary benefits from the federal government.

  • 635. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 3:53 pm

    Seriously, I want to know what social programs that have evolved to become more effective that Rutherford is talking about.

    Nothing from this administration has evolved other than it’s lies about. . . well everything.

  • 636. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:26 pm

    None of this is fixable, either.

    It’s over.

  • 637. Rutherford  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:26 pm


  • 638. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:32 pm

    and none of us are the kind of men that can fix this shit…..

  • 639. El Tigre  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:32 pm



  • 640. Rutherford  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:36 pm

    Another example of G’s mindless spewing: yes food stamps go up and employment goes down when …


    You know I rationalize my crap wages by saying I don’t even leave my home and it’s awful convenient despite the fact the job can be hellish. But then I find out that Walmart workers on their feet all day long make less than I do.

    I don’t make a living wage but I sit on my ass all day from the comfort of home. What justifies their making less?

  • 641. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:39 pm

    But then I find out that Walmart workers on their feet all day long make less than I do.

    Gosh… wouldn’t be because Wallmart fucking loves lobbying for food stamps!!

  • 642. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 4:48 pm



  • 643. Tex Taylor  |  April 18, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    Bundy is from what I can see, a criminal. He owes the government lots of money. So how many of you rally around him?

    I did.

    Let me explain. There is no doubt Bundy is on the wrong side of the law. He’s guilty as charged in a court of law, not once but twice.

    However, they have grazed cattle on that land for 200 years – before the federal gov’t took ownership. What is costing the United States over $1,000,000 for letting a few hundred cattle graze on land that goes unused?

    I’m weighing the needless regulation and loansharking of our corrupt federal government vs. a citizen. I want to know how 400 cattle feeding on grass calculates to over a $1,000,000 in cost.

    I want to know what justifies 200 armed men with automatic rifles to make the arrest. I want to know what gives the federal government right to round up the man’s cattle, then not be able to account for many of them.

    I want to know what Rutherford Lawson doesn’t understand about our concern with heavy handed tactics and government overreach. I want to know what Rutherford Lawson doesn’t understand about the law of proportionality.

    This is a government completely out of control, abusing its authority with strong armed tactics – jackboots by another name. Just like they did at Ruby Ridge; just like they did at Waco; just like the IRS does by targeting Conservative groups; just like the EPA does with small business.

    I loathe our federal government anymore, Rutherford. And not just because of Obama. Because they now consider themselves our masters instead of reasonable public servants.

    Why is you condemn business for what you perceive as unfair practices, but you turn a blind eye to an abusive practice of government against simple citizens?

    This is what people are fed up with on my side. Many times you can be quite reasonable – like you are with abortion. Now would be another time for a call of introspection.

  • 644. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 5:43 pm

    “Why is you condemn business for what you perceive as unfair practices, but you turn a blind eye to an abusive practice of government against simple citizens?” -Tex

    Rancher was wrong skin color for Rutherford and his gang.

    Plus, the rancher can survive perfectly without the government. They hate that deep down more then anything.

  • 645. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:40 pm

    Economics dictate wages and hiring. Other factors intervene, of course, but economics drives business and consumer behavior. Wall=Mart is an efficient international company. It cuts prices to as low as it can afford. It, like most businesses, pays as little as it can to maintain the talent it needs to maintain a profit.

    Rutherford, your employer apparently thinks it must pay you more to keep you. Something keeps Wal-Mart employees at their stores and away from your business.

    If you are working at home, you also have anciiary pay. You don’t have to pay for gas and auto depreciation to drive to work.

    The two wages are not unfair. They are the market place at work.

  • 646. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 8:48 pm

    Medicare is a poor example, Rutherford. it is like an undetected cancer which will eventually overwhelm its host. The number of old people on Medicare is growing as the number of young workers who support them shrinks.

    Medicare, in its present form cannot survive. Russia and several other European countries understand the bleak fate which awaits welfare states. Russians, for example give child bearing couples appliances and money to have children during child making holidays,

    Young people will not make back what they pay into the system. ObamaCare was built to take a bite out of Medicare to finance the government medical insurance policies. Medicare is trouble without change.

  • 647. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:17 pm

    Don’t trust the government or the press, Rutherford. They are not showing us the nuance.

    `Clive Bundy is no more a criminal than civil rights protesters who staged restaurant sit ins. The Bundy family has maintained their ranch for over 160 years, and during that time, they paid required grazing fees.

    In 1993, the Bureau of Land Management changed the rules on a tract of land to protect a desert tortoise. Curiously, they decided the tortoise could fend for itself in another piece of land which developers promised greater returns than ranches.

    Bundy thought he was being treated unfairly and stopped paying grazing fees. He also accused the government of violating Nevada’s state sovereignty. Bundy claims he will pay fees to Clark County.

    The government over reacted and made a mess of it. It makes one wonder if more of these actions are in our future. Are those people becoming our rulers?

    Two courts have ruled against the Bundy family, I think. I believe Bundy has a legitimate complaint, but the government has a claim too. This should go up to a higher court–maybe the Supreme Court.

  • 648. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:22 pm

    Or, they could let Bundy pay Clark County and take the money from Clark County.

  • 649. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:25 pm

    I despise Wallmart. Ultimate bait and switch. Don’t pay their employees a living wage and then lobby the shit out of the government for an expanding welfare state.

    The masses think they are getting a good deal but end up paying for those employees one way or the other, on the back end.

    Then the damn food stamps all get cashed in at Wallmart where its bonus time. Its like a terrible loop.

    Plus…..what garbage. Corn syrup riddled food, Chinese plastic shit and bad beer.

    Not to mention the insane asylum that seems to be always meandering the store.

    Ugliest women on the planet (Outside of Ireland of course) work there too.

  • 650. Huck  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:38 pm

    Bundy is going to lose because his argument is flawed on multiple levels.

    He says it is a state issue and he doesn’t recognize the federal government’s claim over the land. But the fact that he paid the federal fees to use it for years shows that he does in fact recognize its claim.

    He says it is a state issue. But the Nevada state constitution essentially gives the federal government claim over certain land…which the land in question falls under.

    He says he does not recognize the Nevada state constitution because it was passed by the Nevada Territory and not the State of Nevada.

    I do not support him nor any of his arguments. Regardless of who has claim over the land..the simple fact is that he does not. It’s not his in any way, shape or form. Let him graze his animals on his own land.

    He didn’t build that…

  • 651. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 9:47 pm

    Huck, I don’t feel informed enough to take this very far. But isn’t there a long tradition of grazing cattle on public land? In other words half of all cattle graze that way?

    You might be correct. But…if Obama can play games with rule of law, why can’t that rancher? Particularly when its so clear he’s getting fucked over.

    I’m not sure if we have reached a tipping point when it comes to rule of law. If we have….then by all means….I’m rooting for the cowboy.

  • 652. Huck  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:16 pm

    “if Obama can play games with rule of law, why can’t that rancher?”

    When we are prepared to sit back silently and allow Obama to pick and choose what laws he respects then we can go there.

    I’m not there yet.

  • 653. James  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:18 pm

    I am not a fan of Wal Mart either, but they are good at what they do.

    The Bundy family did built that The trouble is they did it on government land, The Federal government owns a large percentage of western land. Yes, there is a long tradition of grazing cattle on federal land.

    Everything was fine until the government changed its rules and favored non ranchers. Two court decisions, I think ruled against Bundy, but the BLM didn’t have to invade the ranch as if it was a foreign country.

    The government over reacted, and because of that, like rabbit, I am rooting for the cowboy.

  • 654. Huck  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:20 pm

    “isn’t there a long tradition of grazing cattle on public land? In other words half of all cattle graze that way?”

    I am not informed enough to say you’re wrong.

    But that isn’t the argument the rancher is making.

  • 655. Huck  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:30 pm

    “The Bundy family did built that The trouble is they did it on government land,”

    Right. And that, right there, is the basis for what Obama said when he said “you didn’t build that.” He couldn’t have built what he did without the federal government.

    I understand that the government changed the rules on him…and that sucks. But it’s their land. It’s no different than if you’re renting a house and the owner sells it to someone that wants to move in.

    And the guy’s arguments are—quite simply–fucking stupid. I mean really….”I don’t respect the Nevada state constitution because it was passed by the Territory of Nevada and not the State of Nevada.” What kind of cow shit is that?

    None of that is to say I’m down with the way it’s getting handled. But that doesn’t mean I am rooting for the rancher. The government’s wrongdoing doesn’t negate his.

  • 656. Huck  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:39 pm

    So I’m gonna really stir it up now…

    I can’t help but chuckle when I think…if this guy and his posse were out there screaming “Occupy BLM!” his support base would shrink exponentially.

    Yes, I know it’s a false equivalency. But it still makes me laugh.

  • 657. dead rabbit  |  April 18, 2014 at 10:57 pm

    I think you make a pretty good point.

    I’m dealing with a squatter right now. The guy has no idea how much rule of law is saving him. It scares me to think that only consequences create the buffer zone between him and I.

  • 658. Alfie  |  April 18, 2014 at 11:08 pm

    Huck it isn’t false and I’ll stir even harder. If Bundy was a black squatter in urban USA the same folks cheering rancher would be calling for his head.
    His arguments are all garbage.BLM and NPS grazing fees are the lowest in the nation.
    Bundy promised violence and then cried over the law enforcement response.
    Cliven Bundy & family played country.
    Other related tangents of this saga was the rights false claims on Reid. Yet again when there is indeed things to hang that POS Harry with the wing nuts run with a lie. ENN Solar. Some have tried to link the Bundy ranch and the solar site and Reid with the government action. Thing is ENN which likely DID get the deal they got due to Reid family power plays isn’t located on federal land or near the Bundy community of Bunkerville. It’s two hours away on 9000 acres of state & town land. Reid is also using his slimed unethical shit baggieness to try to influence the Nevada utilities to buy ENN electricity when if the plant gets built and goes online. Thing is Nevada electricity companies have a history of all ready buying more than their share of renewables.
    Lies and bullshit don’t make me feel good about my side.

  • 659. Alfie  |  April 18, 2014 at 11:15 pm

    Rabbit is he actively trying to do the whole “adverse possession” thing or is he just a nutter thinking wherever he hangs his coat is his?
    I honestly wish you the best on the matter. I had a family member who owned property and suffered the whole deal of trying to evict someone. Wow what a nightmare that was.

  • 660. dead rabbit  |  April 19, 2014 at 12:19 am

    Nah….he is just a piece of trash trying to get a few extra months of rent free. He is the brother of the former renter. That’s the only reason the cops don’t frog March him out.

    I’m enjoying the whole thing, in a sick way. Its a back woods dump that I am buying off my wife’s uncle. Outside of a down payment, I don’t stand much to lose. I don’t officially own it until he leaves.

  • 661. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 12:36 am

    All I can say is thank God for Alfie who does not knee jerk conservative. It’s one reason why when he puts me in my place I take it to heart.

    You back from London? How was it?

  • 662. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 12:57 am

    If Bundy was a black squatter in urban USA the same folks cheering rancher would be calling for his head.

    Ugh. More Barack Obama than Ben Carson. Somewhat surprising too as I think more of you than that.

    Not if the Feds had been accruing interest and fines at 20%+ for his dogs shitting on the grass, then approached the black owner with m16s and SWAT teams about loan shark restitution and a barrel to the temple, I wouldn’t.

    Now let me make an observation about your part of the globe, Alfie. One with more proof than that fallacious charge you just made.

    When I witnessed that Boston Bombing last year, one observation stood out in the days that followed. For all that Rocky Marciano talk from these supposed hardened Bean Town dock workers, prodigy of ship immigrants and Minute Men, your statehood kin have become for the most part a bunch of emasculated polo lackeys that had no problem living in a police state.

    When the time came, the “intellectuals” happily hid under their beds and in the closets while SWAT teams ransacked the neighborhood chasing one young hood. One of the most pathetic commentaries on American cowardice and wiling dupes for gentry I’ve ever witnessed.

    Massachusetts won’t go out with a bang but a bleat, a 200 year head start, political cronyism and nepotism, home of Camelot, notwithstanding.

  • 663. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:03 am

    {Giggle}. I didn’t see Rutherford’s agreement about Alfie’s observation. That figures.

    I provide exhibit #1 about my proof how right I am about federal “lackeyism.”

    Rutherford, you’d shine the barrel of the rifle that will be used to assassinate you, my man. Spit polish the new rope. I wish I could save you from yourself. :smile:

  • 664. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:21 am

    We had an experience with possible adverse possession when we let a neighbor cross our land during harvest. Our lawyer told us to be careful lest he gain a permanent right to free passage.

    My understanding of adverse possession from what he told us is it is a common law practice dating back many generations. The true owner must have a cause of action or trespass within the limits of a statute of limitations. A typical limitation is seven years if under color of title ( a deed found to be invalid) or twenty years possession if not.

    A person claiming adverse possession must show actual possession for an extended period of time and the occupier must meet all conditions at all times.

    The Bundy’s meet some of those conditions, because they have operated their ranch on that land for generations.They did build it themselves with little help from the government except for the land the Bundys rented. They would have succeeded even if they had owned the land because they built it themselves.,

    However, if the owner has granted permission to use the land, adverse possession fails. Some government land may be exempt from adverse possession,

    I don’t know how much of what our lawyer told us is accurate, but it makes sense.

    I’m still rooting for the cowboys because the government over reacted. it was like sending a swat team to evict a normal family who refuse to vacate a house.

    I’d be rooting for black inner city squatters as I did squatters in London and Wales during the 1960’s. That movement began as an attempt to control empty properties for families on council waiting lists. They obviously couldn’t stay in the empty buildings for long unless they could pay rent, etc. but I still sympathised with them.

  • 665. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:42 am

    I’m just wondering, Huck. Rabbit’s legal authority is clearly being infringed upon.

    Would you approve of Rabbit and his brothers sicking the dogs and tasering the squatter, then mowing down the squatter with automatic rifles if he still refuses to move while the squatter protects a Michigan tortoise, afterwards taking ownership of the squatter’s possessions as payment in arrears?

    Because here a few facts most not aware…

    What most do not realize is that on every rancher’s grazing permit it says the following: “You are authorized to make grazing use of the lands, under the jurisdiction of the Bureau of Land Management and covered by this grazing permit, upon your acceptance of the terms and conditions of this grazing permit and payment of grazing fees when due.” The “mandatory” terms and conditions go on to list the allotment, the number and kind of livestock to be grazed, when the permit begins and ends, the number of active or suspended AUMs (animal units per month), etc. The terms and conditions also list specific requirements such as where salt or mineral supplements can be located, maximum allowable use of forage levels (40% of annual growth), etc., and include a lot more stringent policies that must be adhered to. Every rancher must sign this “contract” agreeing to abide by the TERMS AND CONDITIONS before he or she can make payment. In the early 90s, the BLM went on a frenzy and drastically cut almost every rancher’s permit because of this desert tortoise issue, even though all of us ranchers knew that cow and desert tortoise had co-existed for hundreds of years.

    As an example, a family friend had his permit cut by 90%. For those of you who are non ranchers, that would be equated to getting your paycheck cut 90%. In 1976 there were approximately 52 ranching permittees in this area of Nevada. Presently, there are 3.

    Most of these people lost their livelihoods because of the actions of the BLM.

  • 666. dead rabbit  |  April 19, 2014 at 6:21 am

    And the Empire strikes back!

    I can tell I’m pretty ignorant on this. Who ever is the last one to stand up, grab their horn of mead and make a crafty argument-the Rabbit can be heard saying “Yeah….yeah….that’s the ticket!

    And lets be honest….nobody can do it like Tex!

    Ah…the joys of being a simpleton. I’m back to my “Fed Can Go To Hell” position.

  • 667. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 7:50 am

    Tex there isn’t anything false about my observation. The eternal truth of this issue is and always will be that the Bundys own ranch land AND the BLM and NPS control land that is OURS. Bundy chose to exceed his land’s capabilities and then that of the land he was allowed to use at a great discount. He wrapped his criminality and arrogance in Americana and people swallowed it. As for your return to the post Marathon screed I’ll have to hold back on that one whilst we still think anything of each other.

  • 668. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 8:05 am

    yes, the feds and any other government’ can go to hell.”

    The Missuri River used to wander across its valley. Iowa and Nebraska claimed land from the river bank to the middle.Over the years, our part of the river shifted west and deposited more land on the eastern river bank. This accreted land belonged to the land owners who had purchased or homesteaded the original property. They paid taxes on the new land and ,

    In time, our family and neighbors had an extra 600 acres of new land and they paid taxes on it for forty to sixty years. Most was in forest and some used to graze cattle. Some was farmed.

    My great aunt died when I was in college. The state sent the families notice that they were expropriating the land for recreational uses. Tax receipts meant nothing and taxes wouldn’t be refunded because the land had always belonged to the state of Iowa.

    They found part of an old channel which they declared to be the river bank. It didn’t matter to them that the old channel was dry except during floods, and even then, the main current was west of it A more logical claim would have been what is known as the high bank next to I 29. It was the eastern shore of the river when my ancestors were some of the first pioneers in the area to homestead and buy swamp land in 1853,. Even today, it is an obvious river bank.

    The capricious nature of the land grab which vaguely resembles favoritism against the Nevada ranchers illustrated the government didn’t care about the real channel of the river so as much as it wanted a select parcel of land for its recreational uses.

    The families fought the theft in court. My father hired a photographer to show the main channel had shifted west. A geologist also testified in the families’ favor. The families lost of course, because the judge was on the state’s side. The families lawyer said “when you pay for a crooked lawyer and a crooked judge make sure they are on your side.”

    The state of Iowa used theft of our family property as a precident to take land around the Iowa Great Lakes.

    Thanks, Tex, for doing the research none of us had the time for.

    The BlM operated like fascists with arms and statements declaring part of the Constitution void in selected areas around the ranch,Their show of force was a provocation which could have become violent.

    They could have taken the rent from the ranchers’ cattle checks as the cattle were sold at auction or private treaty. The IRS could have taken any tax refunds to pay for the grazing fees.

    Thanks again, Tex. I still support the ranchers.

    Good luck rabbit.

  • 669. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 8:36 am

    Alfie, I agree with you to a point, But I believe you are wrong to write the Bundy’s cattle exceeded the land’s capabilities. They had grazed their land for generations, and they knew its carrying capacity. There was no sign they had damaged the land through over grazing, If the government declared the land overgrazed, it was an intention to get rid of the ranchers. The desert tortoise was declared endangered, but it didn’t need to be protected on non ranch land,

    The Insomniac Range War Kirsten Durst and Lois Lerner Grass
    Roots Journal says as I wrote that the BLM has charged land developers to build on the tortoises’ habitat, thus reducing the size of the habitat and threatening the tortoise’s existance . The BLM used fees to operate a sanctuary, but when fees dwindled during the recession,managers killed the endangered tortoises.

    As I wrote before, this case is filled with nuance which needs to be decided once and for all in court.

  • 670. dead rabbit  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:31 am

    James, on what grounds could it go to a court of appeals?

    This is a classic case of somebody getting screwed by government. But….has his rights been violated?

  • 671. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:24 am

    “Would you approve of Rabbit and his brothers sicking the dogs and tasering the squatter, then mowing down the squatter with automatic rifles if he still refuses to move while the squatter protects a Michigan tortoise, afterwards taking ownership of the squatter’s possessions as payment in arrears?”

    No. Which is why I already stated “None of that is to say I’m down with the way it’s getting handled. But that doesn’t mean I am rooting for the rancher. The government’s wrongdoing doesn’t negate his.”

    “Because here a few facts most not aware…”

    And none of that changes anything. As I said before…it’s their land. As such, if they want to kick off a rancher to protect a turtle, then its is theirs to do it. The owner of the land has different priorities now.

    Read this article and take a look at some of the ridiculous arguments this guy is making…and why he is losing the legal battle.

    Here are some snippets with highlights of stuff that stands out to me:

    “Twenty-one years ago, rancher Cliven Bundy stopped paying his grazing fees.

    Bundy does not recognize federal authority over land where his ancestors first settled in the 1880s, which he claims belongs to the state of Nevada. The Bureau of Land Management disagreed and took him to federal court, which first ruled in favor of the BLM in 1998. After years of attempts at a negotiated settlement over the $1.2 million Bundy owes in fees failed, federal land agents began seizing hundreds of his cattle illegally grazing on public land last week.”

    [my commentary] So it looks like the government tried to resolve this, and those attempts failed. I am did they try to resolve it before?..what resolution offers did Bundy turn down?..could he have avoided losing his property had he made an effort to resolve the situation? These answers me anyway.

    “Bundy’s claim that the land belongs to Nevada or Clark County didn’t hold up in court, nor did his claim of inheriting an ancestral right to use the land that pre-empts the BLM’s role. “We definitely don’t recognize [the BLM director's] jurisdiction or authority, his arresting power or policing power in any way,” Bundy told his supporters, according to The Guardian.

    His personal grievance with federal authority doesn’t stop with the BLM, though. “I believe this is a sovereign state of Nevada,” Bundy said in a radio interview last Thursday. “I abide by all of Nevada state laws. But I don’t recognize the United States government as even existing.””

    [my commentary] you recognize the existence and sovereignty of the United States government? Do you, Tex? Is it OK for anyone who does not recognize that sovereignty to break its laws? Consider illegal immigration before you answer.

    The constitution of the state that Bundy does claim is sovereign says some interesting things that apply to this issue.

    “…the Paramount Allegiance of every citizen is due to the Federal Government in the exercise of all its Constitutional powers as the same have been or may be defined by the Supreme Court of the United States; and no power exists in the people of this or any other State of the Federal Union to dissolve their connection therewith or perform any act tending to impair[,] subvert, or resist the Supreme Authority of the government of the United States.”

    And just so you don’t think I am relying completely on 1 Internet article…

    “..the people inhabiting said territory do agree and declare, that they forever disclaim all right and title to the unappropriated public lands lying within said territory, and that the same shall be and remain at the sole and entire disposition of the United States…”

    How’s that for research, James? :)

    If Bundy wants to be a Nevadan and not an American..then whatever. But he isn’t respecting the law of his own state, either. He has no claim…he has no right…he has no case.

  • 672. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:32 am

    I don’t know, rabbit, because I am not a lawyer. I don’tnow if Bundy’s rights have been violated. I think a higher court should decide.

    Bundy and the other ranchers were screwed. Their history of managing the land predates the government agencies which enforce the conditions of occupancy They apparently followed the rules.. Does that give the ranchers any rights of occupancy if they are treated unfairly? Bundy believes he has inherited inherent rights granted when his family homesteaded the land in 1877. The government often grandfathers new legislation, but this time the courts and government believe otherwise.

    The government represents we citizens and manages our land. Bundy as a citizen also owns the land he grazes cattle on. Does the government have the right to capriciously change rules favoring one group over another as government agencies such as the BLM apparently did this time?

    Can the government use unnecessarily disproportionate force to enforce its claims when other methods including negotiations might work? Can victims of such over reach collect damages?

    The government could have gotten a judgement to confiscate the Bundy bank accounts and other assets. They could have put a lien on other property. Why did the government choose intimidation and threats of violence which was such a bad public relations strategy they were forced to back down?

    I don’t know the answers, and apparently none of the litigants does either. I believe a home owner evicting a family at gun point would get into trouble. A home owner has the right to be capricious as long as he/she hides any bigotry, but do these rules apply to the government?

    Those are what I consider grounds for legal action– to clarify hazy places which are in dispute. A lawyer would probably tell me I am wrong, and I don’t want to waste money asking a lawyer these questions.

  • 673. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:44 am

    Good job with the research, Huck. I like it. I agree the federal government is sovereign.

    I also think citizens have a right or should have a right for compensation if the government over steps its rights and authority. Bundy and his allies believe he does have a case based in part on his ancestors’ original agreement with the government. I think a court should decide.

    Yes, as Martin Luther King said it is ok to break laws one considers unjust as long as one accepts the punishment. That to me includes illegal immigrants.

  • 674. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:47 am

    This discussion has been fun. I wish this blog had more of them where we can argue among our selves instead of constantly pounding on Rutherford.

    Now, I have to leave to do some work.

  • 675. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:09 am

    “Can the government use unnecessarily disproportionate force to enforce its claims when other methods including negotiations might work?”

    According to the article I linked other forms of negotiation were attempted.

    “Yes, as Martin Luther King said it is ok to break laws one considers unjust as long as one accepts the punishment.”

    And in this case the punishment is seizure of property.

    If you owe the government money, they are going to come for it eventually. If you refuse to pay, the Marshal will eventually show up at your door. When he does, if your wife attempts to stand in his way, she’s going to get tasered and bitten by a dog. And if your neighbors show up with guns to protect you, then things are going to get ugly.

    “The government could have gotten a judgement to confiscate the Bundy bank accounts and other assets. They could have put a lien on other property. Why did the government choose intimidation and threats of violence which was such a bad public relations strategy they were forced to back down?”

    This is a fair point to which I do not have the answer. But didn’t the intimidation and threats of violence come after cattle started being confiscated? And who initiated those threats? They didn’t back down because of PR…they backed down because they wanted to avoid a violent escalation. You’ve got people with guns stating “we will shoot if fired upon”…doesn’t it make sense that the officials on the scene might be thinking the same thing? All if takes is 1 shot…or a car backfiring…and we’ve got a bloodbath. Talk about bad PR…

    “Bundy and his allies believe he does have a case based in part on his ancestors’ original agreement with the government.”

    A government he does not recognizing as existing. How can you claim to have a binding deal with someone you don’t think exists? That is kind of like me coming on here and saying I am going to Heaven when I die because I went to church as a child.

  • 676. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 12:39 pm

    “Would you approve of Rabbit and his brothers sicking the dogs and tasering the squatter, then mowing down the squatter with automatic rifles if he still refuses to move while the squatter protects a Michigan tortoise, afterwards taking ownership of the squatter’s possessions as payment in arrears?”

    You’ve got things a bit mixed up here, Tex.
    If we want to use DR and his situation to examine this, then let’s do it right.

    It would be DR protecting the tortoise..not the squatter. He has owned the land for a long time by now, and has decided long ago that he likes turtles and wants to protect them on his property. For 20 years he wasn’t asking the squatter to completely leave, but to simply follow his new rules for living there, and to pay him rents for the use of the property.

    But the squatter doesn’t like the new rules. He use’s the property for work. He says his great-great grandpa had a deal with DR’s great-great grandpa…and it didn’t include turtles. He says because of that deal, he doesn’t recognize DR as the legal owner of the property.

    DR tries and tries to resolve the issue…for 20 years he tries. He has offered peaceful settlements…he has won numerous court rulings. But the squatter has refused to deal..refused to recognize the court decisions…refused to pay DR what he owes him….refused to follow DR’s rules…and refused to leave.

    DR…the massive and self-admitted manly man that he is…decides he has had enough. He is going to kick the squatter out, and keep the guy’s stuff that is on his property so that he can recover some of the 20-year loss of rent and legal costs. But when DR shows up, the guy’s wife and family members intervene. They get in DR’s face…yelling..screaming..kicking at him (and who knows what else that conveniently never makes it on a viral internet video)..until he decides to use his superior strength to defend himself…only to the extent that he can get out of there without getting himself hurt or kicking the shit out of one of them.

    Then the squatter’s friends start showing up with guns. They tell DR that if he tries to use force to remove their friend..they will kill him. But what alternative, except force, have they left him with? 20 years of resolution attempts have been ignored…court decisions have been ignored…legal ownership of property has been ignored.

    Should DR just let the guy live there? Should he try other methods…even though 20 years of past history suggest those methods will also be ignored?….should he go to an even higher court…even though numerous court rulings have been ignored? Should DR’s claim over the property be voided just because his great-great grandpa made a deal with the squatter’s great-great grandpa?

  • 677. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:24 pm

    No, I don’t have anything mixed up, Huck. This is the same shit the EPA does to folks, to small business, to big business. It’s called overreach. It’s called bullying. It’s called totalitarianism.

    You and Alfie have obviously never had to deal with the Gestapo that is the Federal Government in any type of regulation or land dealing.

    This is along the same guidelines as taxation without representation under a different banner, but the penalty is the same. Government dictate laws without hearing, established a set of rules for fees, and no one is given a chance for input or anything else to provide their case – restitution seldom offered. Government dictates penalty. This isn’t representative government or a fair hearing. They’ve destroyed thousands of lives in the process.

    Why do you believe Mr. Bundy has most ranchers/farmers in America on his side? Why do you think rural America has reacted the way it has? Apparently, Alfie is of the opinion this is a bunch of typical flyover country yahoos that don’t know any better – lawless idiots and militia men. That’s baloney. Perhaps without malicious intent, Alfie just insulted some of my own family who have fought many of these same property rights battles in their kangaroo courts. I don’t think either one of you have much of a handle on what is really going on in rural America – rural America that helps feed you and keep you warm I might add.

    Ask anybody that has had to deal with mineral rights on their land about the cooperation and reasonable nature of the Federal and State governments. You’ll get one horror story after another. You ought to know that, Huck. Your local jackboots in conjunction with Fed SS have put much of the fertile valley of California out of business with their idiocy about water rights. And you’re helping to pay for it in the grocery store and elsewhere.

    I don’t dispute Bundy is breaking the current law. Said so above. What I dispute is the proportionality and fairness of the law. And don’t tell me to change the law then. They own the courts, they stack the courts with their environmental wacko pals. Thousands have tried. Virtually all have failed. I say hooray for Mr. Bundy. I’m glad somebody has said enough.

    You make it sound as if our benevolent government has patiently waited without for Mr. Bundy to be reasonable. Nothing could be further from the truth. They’ve slapped exorbitant penalty on the man as threat for years with the very intent of putting him out of business, without any form of compensation. Most folded. He didn’t.

    So I’ll ask again. How much grass does over $1,000,000.00 represent? How much water does $1,000,000.00 represent?

  • 678. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:29 pm

    I’m back for a moment. Removing tin from an old roof is tiring.

    Punishment comes with a court trial. That final trial hasn’t yet happened. The courts ruled that Bundy has to pay the fees, but this could go higher for a final decision. According to what I read, the government has not seriously attempted to take the Bundys’ money or any assets besides their cattle. If they had, this confrontation would have been more peaceful, and the government wouldn’t have had to back down.

    I believe the confrontation got ugly when hired cowboys began rounding up the cattle. One of the sons tried to stop them and was tasered, I think. I believe someone else was roughed up when he photographed the cattle in a truck. Our rural neighbors would have done the same.

    Dead Rabbit’s imaginary case is unrealistic because he is not the government. He would go to jail if he physically decided to kick the squaters out. It would be assault, because rules apply differently to private citizens. If the squatters’ friends show up with guns, he can make sure the press and law know about it. If the squatters make threats, Rabbit can press charges. Letting them do it first gives Rabbit an advantage. The government would not have to restrain itself as the BLM just demonstrated. Rabbit would have to restrain himself.

    My point of murky legality has just been supported by the lead story on Drudge. “Western Lawmakers talk Federal land take over.” Representatives of nine states met to discuss the issue. Their meeting was scheduled before the Nevada land dispute, but it was on their minds.

  • 679. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:39 pm

    Tex is right. I have already told you about our court adventures with Iowa. Did Bundy break the law because he had just had enough? Or was he a criminal who suddenly decided to bilk the United States out of money due it?

    The man who started and ran the legal proceedings which took our land was out to inspect it after the case. He had to walk across a neighbor’s land. Our neighbor approached him and ordered him off his property as he pointed a shot gun at him. The man left and never returned.

  • 680. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 1:42 pm

    Who is the aggressor again, Alfie?

  • 681. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 2:02 pm

    Tex I didn’t level an insult to anyone. My point about Bundy’s supporters is aimed at the media flame wavers and the militia types who came to support him. Bundy in my opinion is akin to any given stereotypical welfare queen to wit those like Hannity and militia patriots who can’t correctly spell “sign in here” are hypocrites.
    In this thread and other recent ones as well I’ve spoken about how idiotic the race card is. in fact I think it was this one that I brought up the incident where folks demanded an apology from Paul Ryan over his “inner city males” comment. Rutherford agreed with me that this witch hunt against Ryan was farcical.
    I could make a note that the Cattle ranchers assoc. has distanced itself from Bundy incident. I could also point out that the majority of food source cattle in the USA graze on private or state lands.
    Tex you are misreading my position completely> My only thing about the Bundy incident that matters is that which occurred on PUBLIC LAND

  • 682. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 2:06 pm

    James you are correct when you point out the states looking to take ownership of lands from the federal government. I actually support the idea but I also don’t think it should be all the land.
    I will also go on record that in my opinion the sagebrush rebellion types and their mentality is out of touch with reality. Their position is that the government and the country collectively should offer zero resistance or control of their desires. This is wrong and bad for the nation as a whole.

  • 683. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 2:10 pm

    I also would like to restate that I am on record as being against the over militarization of the police forces of this country. That is a far deeper conversation though.
    I will say though that agencies we all rely on have sound science and legal precedent for some of their policies and procedures . Again there is a deeper discussion to be had on that topic including analysis of the Bunkerville incidents and the metro-Boston post marathon actions. One would have to roll in stop and frisk and those mobile observation towers in NYC too. as well as rolling tolls technology with sensors being placed of toll roads.

  • 684. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 4:03 pm

    I could make a note that the Cattle ranchers assoc. has distanced itself from Bundy incident.

    Actually, the statement is far more sympathetic with Bundy, IMO.

    While distancing itself from the legal issues that prompted the Bureau of Land Management to round up Bunkerville rancher Cliven Bundy’s range cattle then release hundreds of them as the threat of violence loomed, the conservative Nevada Cattlemen’s Association issued a statement Wednesday that sympathizes with Bundy.

    “The situation in Nevada stands as an example (of) the federal agencies’ steady trend toward elevating environmental and wildlife issues over livestock grazing,” reads the statement from Ron Torell, the cattlemen’s group president.

    The statement adds that ranchers like Bundy, who graze livestock on multiple-use public lands, which include habitat for the threatened desert tortoise and other federally protected species, “have found themselves with their backs against the wall as, increasingly, federal regulations have infringed on their public land grazing rights and the multiple-use management principle.”

    You’d be real surprised what represents “PUBLIC LAND”, Mr. Alfie. My own experience in petroleum exploration provides one example.

    How about restricting drilling rigs from too near ‘easement'; or disallowing drilling rigs from driving over easement? It’s bullshit politics of federal agencies to prevent drilling unless they get a larger cut.

    I don’t want to start a fight with either you or Huck. But I believe neither of you have a good idea of what is going on so called ‘public domain’, much less encroachment on private land.

    If you did, I’m convinced you’d both be outraged and a little more sympathetic to the Bundy complaint. I agree with you, Bundy is breaking the law. But you are too conveniently ignoring what has transpired to this point.

  • 685. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    Tex actually I think I’m pretty clear offed earl overreach. Remember being where I am I have seen the fishing industry strangled among other things. Bottom line I know and support those who are dumped on by any and all levels of govt. I just don’t find Cliven &Co. that person.

  • 686. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 5:17 pm

    Hilarious spell check in iOS.On Federal overreach

  • 687. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 6:08 pm

    “No, I don’t have anything mixed up, Huck.”

    Actually, you did…on a pretty basic level.

    In your example you wrote that the squatter wants to protect the tortoise.

    Bundy is the squatter here. But he isn’t the one who wants to protect the tortoise. The owner is. DR would be the one protecting the tortoise.

    But I guess the entire thing is not pertinent anyway, because as James pointed out…DR is not the federal government.

    “I don’t dispute Bundy is breaking the current law.”

    Then you and I don’t have much of a dispute.

    And he is breaking it because, in his own words, he does not recognize the existence of federal government. It’s not even that he doesn’t recognize its claim over the land…he doesn’t recognize its existence. To me…that’s big.

    This guy is little different than someone crossing the border illegally. Things were different for his ancestors, too. He thinks the law is unfair, too. Does that mean he can then break that law? And that when he does there should be no consequences? I don’t think it does. We say we’re against him doing that and getting away with it because we are a nation of laws. It’s our entire argument against amnesty and our entire argument for calling them “illegal” immigrants.

    We’ve all seen that video. What didn’t make it in there? I don’t recall any sympathy here when we had video of past protesters getting tasered and beaten. They were lawless and inciteful scum who were getting what they deserved. They thought the system was unfair, too. That didn’t matter much.

    “The courts ruled that Bundy has to pay the fees”

    Which he did not pay. So why should we assume another court ruling would change that?

    “According to what I read, the government has not seriously attempted to take the Bundys’ money or any assets besides their cattle. If they had, this confrontation would have been more peaceful, and the government wouldn’t have had to back down.”

    And if they had done that the cattle would still be illegally grazing on protected federal land. The situation would only be put back to where it began.

    I’m sorry folks. I just don’t have a lot of sympathy for the guy. It sucks that the rules were changed, but the bottom line is that its not his land. It’s not just 1 side that has mishandled this affair from the beginning. I think he is just as much to blame for what is going on as the government is.

  • 688. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 6:21 pm

    I’m not seeing a whole lot of consistency of positions here.

    When Eric Holder says we don’t have to follow or enforce laws we don’t like, most of us here are infuriated. We’re enraged when lawbreakers are allowed to break the law with no consequences. We yell and scream that we are a nation of laws and we post quotes from the Constitution that says they should be enforced. Not only should they be enforced…but that the government has an obligation to enforce them. It’s an obligation that was taken on when it was sworn in. It cannot get the job without accepting that obligation.

    Other than we are now talking about a law some of us don’t like, how is this different?

  • 689. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 6:58 pm

    Actually, you did…on a pretty basic level. In your example you wrote that the squatter wants to protect the tortoise.

    I’ve often noted you concentrate much on the irrelevant meant in humor directed toward a 3rd party, in this case Rabbit, and completely miss the premise of the question, Huck. I try to ignore that I’m debating with a man that considers the U.N. model of Human Rights not moral turpitude but legitimacy of law.

    Let’s forget the tortoise analogy for your tedious, “academic” nature, teacher, and I’ll concentrate on the basics….

    but that the government has an obligation to enforce them. It’s an obligation that was taken on when it was sworn in. It cannot get the job without accepting that obligation.

    You’re conveniently ignoring the fact that government has ‘amended’ the original law with federal regulations have infringed what was understood for more than 100 years to allow grazing rights and the multiple-use management principles. This wasn’t even an issue for well over 100 years and it wasn’t even enforced until some environmental types decided a tortoise was more important the dozens of families livelihoods.

    Why was this not an issue say in 1985 and what now requires and army carrying automatic weapons to enforce those penalties in excess of $1,000,000.00?

    You’ll make a fine drone for the U.N., Huck. :wink:

  • 690. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 7:48 pm

    “I try to ignore that I’m debating with a man that considers the U.N. model of Human Rights not moral turpitude but legitimacy of law.”

    I’m glad you ignore that, because it does not accurately represent my thoughts on the matter.

    “You’re conveniently ignoring the fact that government has ‘amended’ the original law with federal regulations have infringed what was understood for more than 100 years to allow grazing rights and the multiple-use management principles.”

    No, I haven’t ignored that. That should have been clear with my multiple references to “changes” in the law.

    With that said..and in conclusion..I do admit there are multiple details about this case in which I am ignorant. And I concede some of them might change a little or a lot about how I feel about it.

    But nothing presented here—including the insults—thus far has.

    “You’ll make a fine drone for the U.N., Huck.”

    I would welcome that. I’d make a good living with which to support my family and my eventual retirement. That’s the thing about diplomats that many don’t understand…they don’t always like the policies they represent. But they do their job.

    And now I am back to watching Obama the Cold Warrior and wondering if we are sending ground troops to Poland like a Polish official said outright and Hagel hinted at.

  • 691. Tex Taylor  |  April 19, 2014 at 8:19 pm

    That’s the thing about diplomats that many don’t understand…they don’t always like the policies they represent. But they do their job.

    So did Baghdad Bob. How many atrocities have been committed from a ‘diplomat’ just doing his job?

    I would welcome that. I’d make a good living with which to support my family and my eventual retirement. That’s the thing about diplomats that many don’t understand…they don’t always like the policies they represent. But they do their job.

    Like stealing food out of the mouths of Iraqi babes, hey? Or raping the Congo women while wearing the blue helmet diplomatically? I always thought Libya and Cuba on council were wonderful human right’s representatives.

    No, you weren’t clear at all and you didn’t answer my question.

    Why was this not an issue in 1985. Why now? Why are you now lending your tacit approval to allowing armed SWAT teams to throw 57 year old women to the ground and sick dogs on unarmed protestors?

    I find it amusing after all the scolding you give Rutherford for being a Holder enabler, you’re now sounding just like a Holder enabler, Buford T. Justice style. IT’S THE LAW!

  • 692. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 8:51 pm

    Tex I was more applauding Alfies lack of predictable partisan response than supporting his conclusion. The facts on Bundy are law all these years? still foggy to me. For example was it really a complete surprise to this guy that he was breaking the law all these years?

  • 693. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 8:59 pm

    That botched comment was the result of the Kindle WordPress app. Damn I hate this. I don’t know which is worse, the Kindle app or the iPhone app. :-(

  • 694. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:05 pm

    692 Alfie, I agree the states shouldn’t have all of the federal land, but the majority of their land area is owned and controlled by the federal government. I don’t believe the states want all of the land. They want some of it, especially the areas with energy and other deposits.

    Bundy and some of his supporters remind me of the folks who preached ways of legally evading federal income taxes. The Bundys sound like people fed up with capricious government regulations. I don’t
    know if there are legal grounds If so , this case should go to court. If they broke the law, they should pay the penalty, but the rules for government behavior should also be defined.

    Huck, if the government collected the owed fees through liens etc, the cattle would no longer be grazing illegally on the land because the fees would have been paid. The government could either maintain the status quo or evict the family either physically or through penalties which would make operating the ranch financially impossible, Withholding would not let the family touch the owed money,

    Yes, we may be infuriated by Eric Holder’s refusal to obey laws or to enforce them unfairly, we are not falling to his level if we choose to disobey a law to make a political statement. I believe the Bundys. past behavior and statements indicate they are more then dead beats. We have a long tradition of civil disobedience.

    We are no longer a land of laws, so I for one am being consistent. When the government resumes its obligation to uniformly enforce our laws I will change my mind about civil disobedience.

    I do agree that the Bundys must pay what they owe It is part of civil disobedience,.

    You all probably remember the Missouri Basin flood which left some of our land under water for over five months. I don’t know enough of the facts to participate, but a large number of people believe they have legal grounds for a class action suit against the Corps of Engineers;

    The government is so much powerful than individuals that we have little recourse but civil disobedince in front of television cameras or class action law suits. There aren’t enough Bundys to go to court as Missouri Basin residents plan to do,

    I like your comment about possibly sending ground troops to Poland. Estonia, Lativia and Lituania may not be far behind. I think Estonia has a larger percentage of Russian speakers than Ukraine. Even the Fins have privately expressed unease.

  • 695. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:10 pm

    I think Finland is safe. If the Russians decided to take Finland, they would have a fight. The Fins drove out the Russian army during the Winter war and killed over 27,000 Russian troops. A Finish-Sami sniper called the White Ghost was credited with the most individual kills in a twentieth century war. I think he killed 900 Russians.

  • 696. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:14 pm

    692, Rutherford, Bundy was purposely breaking the law because he thought it was an unfair regulation change,

  • 697. James  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:18 pm

    Bundh doesn’t recognize federal suzanry over his land. He believes Nevada should control the land and has offered to pay the fees to Clark County. I think he is wrong about that, but he deserves a complete court hearing. None western states are suggesting they should have control of more of the federal land within their borders, so Bundy’s views have company.

  • 698. dead rabbit  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:21 pm

    I entered my kid in a Greco-Roman and Freestyle wrestling tournament in the sticks.

    1. I shit you not, the Dads put on singlets and wrestled. Big country dudes. The look on my face was a mixture of disgust and utter respect.

    2. My kid won the gold in freestyle. First time he ever did that.

    3. My kid had to wrestle bigger kids in Greco-Roman. Got his ass kicked (he did beat a girl).

    No biggie. He loses all the time. But this time he cried over losing. Twice! Balled his eyes out. Wtf?

    I was disgusted but didn’t know how to handle it.

    That shit is unacceptable in my eyes but apparently crying after a loss is OK by some people in this sport. I say fuck that. He’s only 4, but he has never been this way.


  • 699. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:25 pm

    Rabbit Bundy was the recipient of corporate welfare as are many farmers. The fed is his friend.

  • 700. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:42 pm

    Also help me with this because I’m trying to gauge action and reaction. I thought Fed came in with guns blazing because militias with guns blazing were already coming to Bundys aid.

    Was it the other way around?

  • 701. Alfie  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:49 pm

    London was great Rutherford. I found it very cool to be there with the family. As a vacation it was memorable.
    On the me side that sees politics and society points in everything I look at I found a lot of things that made me think the cousins have a number of things right,equally there are things they’re fucked on.

  • 702. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:50 pm

    Don’t know if I ever mentioned this but I was once a landlord. Against my Dad’s warnings I rented out my condo and it was pure hell. Tenants that didn’t pay their rent, or treated the place like a litter box or skipped out on me entirely. I finally sold the condo at a huge loss back in the 90’s.

    Good luck with your squatter Rabbit.

  • 703. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 9:54 pm

    I read the thread backwards last night and therefore missed the chronology of comments so my compliment to Alfie extends to Huck too.

  • 704. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:35 pm

    As I read through this Bundy debate I am amused a bit. Huck and Alfie, don’t you see that Bundys behavior is the natural outcome of a conservative mindset of late that promotes skepticism of the Fed government to the extreme of completely disrespecting it?

    This is what the Ted Cruz’s hath wrought. I am particularly struck by Huck’s discussion of national sovereignty. It is a slippery slope my friend from calling the President and AG criminals (a clear exaggeration) to disregarding the appropriate power of the Fed.

    Irrational conversations about our current state have emboldened folks like Bundy. It makes it harder for cool heads to prevail.

    It’s why I shake my head in dismay at Tex, James and Rabbit almost cheering on a revolution.

  • 705. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:41 pm

    James I agree with you that I’ve really enjoyed reading this Bundy debate. The comments section is far more interesting when you guys debate nuances of policy than when you simply lib-bash.

    LOL when I brought this up, having not caught up on comments, I was afraid you guys would tell me “we’ve already discussed this, bozo” but apparently there was more discussion to be had.

    Thanks for a really good read so far.

  • 706. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:46 pm

    Huck your comment about getting into heaven made me chuckle. Apparently Mike Bloomberg thinks he is a shoo-in.

  • 707. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 10:56 pm

    Tex I shall repeat to you what I said to Rabbit. From what I understand farmers get bennies from the Fed beyond belief. Perhaps James, a farm owner, can provide credible contradiction?

  • 708. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:05 pm

    James I’m sorry but (I paraphrase) “my point was just backed up by Drudge” made me chuckle.

    At least you, nor anyone else here has quoted World Net Nut Daily.

    In fact with the departure of the legendary Elric, your sources all deserve a modicum of respect. Elric used to quote some doozies.

  • 709. an800lbgorilla  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:19 pm

    I wonder if this will work…

    Organizing for Action claims there* is a Republican war on women, sends out email featuring Ted Kennedy— Katie Pavlich (@KatiePavlich) April 19, 2014

  • 710. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:21 pm

    “So did Baghdad Bob. How many atrocities have been committed from a ‘diplomat’ just doing his job?”

    Baghdad Bob didn’t commit any of them. He was released after his capture by the US and was not prosecuted by the Iraqis. So thank you for making my point.

    “Like stealing food out of the mouths of Iraqi babes, hey? Or raping the Congo women while wearing the blue helmet diplomatically?”

    No, not like them. Those are not diplomats.

    “No, you weren’t clear at all and you didn’t answer my question.”

    Then maybe you should slow down and read a bit more carefully. As usual, you seem a bit clouded with anger.

    “Why was this not an issue in 1985. Why now?”

    I don’t know why. I’ve also said that before.

    ” Why are you now lending your tacit approval to allowing armed SWAT teams to throw 57 year old women to the ground and sick dogs on unarmed protestors?”

    You mean like when I stated multiple times that I do not agree with the way the government has handled this? Or when I pointed out that there might be things in that video we did not see…such as what prompted that action?

    Really Tex, I can only repeat myself so many times before it gets really annoying. We’re there.

    “I find it amusing after all the scolding you give Rutherford for being a Holder enabler, you’re now sounding just like a Holder enabler”

    It is amusing indeed, because I find you in the same light. Someone who wants to select which laws we respect and enforce and which ones we don’t. “Oh I don’t like that law so I don’t think we need to enforce it.” If that’s not Eric Holder and Barack Obama then I don’t know what is. to him. Ask him why he was crying after he lost and explain to him that, while he should be disappointed with losing, he should not express it with crying but by channeling his disappointment into making himself a better wrestler. He might even understand what you’re talking about. And if not now, then he will later.

    Freestyle is kinda crazy. I don’t like it because I think it lacks a lot of the structure. They didn’t even have real refs where my kids did it. But I have no other experience other than HS to compare it to.

  • 711. an800lbgorilla  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:24 pm

    Better than I thought…

    How about that R, how’s that for hypocrisy? Really, Ted Kennedy is what you’re gonna go with for the “War on Women”, considering he’s most famous for killing one, and sexually harassing dozens (at least) more.

    I usually don’t comment extensively anymore because:

    1) Most of the stuff I provide speaks for itself;

    2) There’s no purpose since R will go out of his way to ignore it, even when directly asked to comment on something;

    3) I don’t have a lot of time anymore.

    The first two more than the last…

    Seriously R, at what point do you think that you need to explain yourself?

  • 712. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:29 pm

    James you lost me. You support the breaking of a law to make a political statement. What about Holder’s behavior is NOT political?

  • 713. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:42 pm

    “Hucking … Tex … advice?”

    WTF? Rabbit I know you think I’m a pussy and don’t have “a man’s perspective” because I walk with leg braces but fuck, I am the father of a competitive athlete.

    Just cos your 4 year old has a dick doesn’t mean losing doesn’t hurt. MANY little children cry when disappointed and gender has nothing to do with it.

    Stop projecting dude. You’re slowly becoming the “competition Dad” you said you didn’t want to be.

    He’s 4 years old! He’s already under more pressure than you were at 4. Oh I forgot … I guess that’s part of that growing up a man that I missed out on. :roll:

  • 714. Huck  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:48 pm

    “James you lost me. You support the breaking of a law to make a political statement. What about Holder’s behavior is NOT political?”

    It’s interesting that you make this connection, Rutherford, but then say it’s the Cruzes that have created the slippery slope to this.

    Holder and his boss took oaths to uphold the law. And I don’t recall any portion of that oath including the words “unless its a law I don’t like.”

  • 715. Rutherford  |  April 19, 2014 at 11:56 pm

    Reading Huck’s answer on crying makes me revise mine — somewhat. There is an age, probably above 4, where crying about disappointment is not the best response.

    The bigger issue is not whether the child’s crying embarrassed Rabbit (which I suspect is the motivating force here) but whether at 4 this kind of competition has a net positive effect on the child. If your kid loves wrestling and hates to lose, good for him. Then as Huck suggests, have him channel the sadness into hunger for the next win.

    But above all Rabbit — it’s not about YOU.

  • 716. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 12:03 am

    G if you’re asking for a defense of Ted Kennedy as warrior for women from me you’ll be waiting a long time.

    I am probably the only lib who partly agrees with Rand Paul vis-a-vis his comments about Clinton. If a woman tolerates her husbands serial infidelity for political gain, what else will she tolerate?

    Men in general should probably STFU about the war on women since our side (men, not lib men) does not have a great track record here.

  • 717. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 12:07 am

    By the way if you don’t think Mitt Romney didn’t shed a tear when Obama beat him, you’re crazy. Losing sucks even for grown-ass men.

  • 718. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 12:11 am

    Huck it could be argued the Obama admin and Ted Cruz both share a desire to play fast and loose with the law but I see Cruz’s attitude having more dire consequences.

  • 719. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 12:13 am

    I overcame some of my WordPress probs tonight by switching back and forth between two different functions of the app. It’s still hell.

  • 720. Huck  |  April 20, 2014 at 1:40 am

    “Huck it could be argued the Obama admin and Ted Cruz both share a desire to play fast and loose with the law but I see Cruz’s attitude having more dire consequences.”

    Color me shocked that you find the actions of a senator you don’t like more potentially damaging than those of a president you do.

    You’re still not getting it, Rutherford. While both men took an oath to uphold and respect the law….its the Executive branch that is constitutionally tasked with its execution”. When Obama and those in his administration don’t execute the law as written, they are not doing the job they swore to do.

    It baffles me how little that bothers you.

  • 721. Tex Taylor  |  April 20, 2014 at 1:48 am


    Nothing wrong with crying after losing a decision. Competition does that in a kid and generally motivates to get better. I saw college aged players bawl after losing an NCAA basketball game from the disappointment.

    Now, I find it tedious and a bore like a Huck excuse for duplicity and a lack of real life experience, somewhat like Rutherford’s Peter Pan dreams of teaching the world to sing or the U.N. legitimacy of sound judgment, when I see grown men do it for the camera in professional sports. There’s a point where maturity should outweigh the disappointment and lack of ability to discern effectiveness from fraud, good from evil.

    But your son is a long way from that. If it affects him over a period of days, that’s different. If it’s immediately after a match, it’s natural. For what it’s worth.

  • 722. Tex Taylor  |  April 20, 2014 at 2:05 am

    Really Tex, I can only repeat myself so many times before it gets really annoying. We’re there.

    As you’re often fond of explaining to Rutherford in so many words, repeating gibberish 100 times while ignoring the basic question while walking the fence so you can play both sides pretending to be wise, doesn’t make something truth. It makes you a politician, legalist, enabler of bad behavior, and duplicitous hypocrite.

    P.S. – Food for oil was the very definition of U.N. diplomacy in action. Apparently, the one thing your schooling did teach you well besides all religions are basically the same {eyeroll a hundred times quickly), should you ever be so “lucky” to be granted opportunity as diplomat (I hope your performance here isn’t indicator of your abilities), you’ll be able to play both sides poorly quite well.

  • 723. Tex Taylor  |  April 20, 2014 at 2:08 am

    From what I understand farmers get bennies from the Fed beyond belief.

    Actually, agricultural corporations may get bennies from the Fed beyond belief. The 40 acres and a mule guy generally gets the screws.

  • 724. Tex Taylor  |  April 20, 2014 at 2:52 am

    Why was this not an issue in 1985. Why now?”

    I don’t know why. I’ve also said that before. You mean like when I stated multiple times that I do not agree with the way the government has handled this?


    Apparently, your inability to answer the two most pertinent questions your now detractors posed, are nullified by your profound sense of legalism, followed by an answer of “I don’t know” and the admission you find it tedious to admit you don’t have the answers while still arguing the wisdom and merit of no definitive answer.

    Apparently, you don’t know quite a lot while acting forcefully. How’s that Ready, Fire, Aim! diplomacy working for America? :smile:

    That may pass as a fine argument in a classroom of liberal arts maybe with 18-22 year old, starry eyed dimwits without life experience believing tenured Professor Dean Wormer brilliant, but isn’t an effective paradigm of managing desperate people pushed to the brink by government overreach and thuggish tactics.

    P.S. – Cliven Bundy’s admission that he was willing to die for “disobedience” of what he perceives as grave injustice, would most certainly qualify as paying the consequences.

    If you think intimidation by government is only consequential at the end of a gun or confiscation of property, then you obviously haven’t rated government harassment and intimidation yet. If and when you do, I predict you’ll become a very loud proponent of disobedience to bad law and two-tiered enforcement.

  • 725. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 3:12 am

    Huck isn’t Holder simply the district attorney of the country? That said, don’t all district attorneys enjoy prosecutorial discretion?

  • 726. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 3:16 am

    The forty acres and a mule guy? Wow I didn’t know there were that many black farmers. :-)

  • 727. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 3:28 am

    Tex Huck hardly needs my defense (and would probably prefer not to have it) but let me take a stab at this.

    Trayvon Martin was a terrible poster boy for a worthy principle — guns in the wrong hands.

    The Newtown massacre was the wrong example to highlight a real problem — illegally obtained semi-automatics.

    Wendy Davis is a questionable role model for just about anything based on her disputed background.

    Cliven (?) Bundy is NOT the best test case for how to illustrate or react to the very real problem of gov’t overreach.

    I think that is all Huck and Alfie are saying. I think they agree with your principles here but disagree that Bundy is the horse you should choose to ride on.

  • 728. James  |  April 20, 2014 at 8:43 am

    Cliven Bundy from his words and actions is engaging in civil disobedience. He is not a criminal, though he broke a regulation after his family followed government rules until the DLM changed its policies.

    Edward Snowdon damaged the US intelligence gathering offices of our government, but he also did us a service by showing the extensive government spying apparatus which even collects our cell phone conversations.

    Both are imperfect, but they are the only horses around. As in NASCAR races, “you take friends where you can find them.” Darrel Waltrip.

    Bundy dramatizes a change in our society, and his notoriety makes him the only horse available for this issue. Obama promised to create a second paramilitary force which would be as well armed and financed as our military.

    Maybe it is a coincidence, but changes described by National Review On Line “The United States of SWAT?” tell us of changes dramatized by the cattle war.

    Dozens of federal agencies now have SWAT teams to further an expanding definition of their missions, The Department of Agriculture, the Railroad Retirement Board, the Tennessee valley Authority, the Office of Personnel Management, the Consumer Product Safety Commission, and the US Fish and Wildlife Service.

    Local police forces are also being militarized. Iowa City, for example, now has a tank.

    The article also cites examples of people who have suffered at the hands of these paramilitary units. They weren’t reported beyond local news media because there was no long standing stand off as with the Bundy case.

    Kenneth Wright of Stockton, California had a visit from the Department of Education when agents knocked down his door at 6AM, dragged him outside in his boxer shorts and handcuffed him as they put his three young children into police cars. They searched his home for two hours.The raid was intended to find information about his estranged wife who had moved out and who was suspected of college financial- aid fraud.

    A SWAT team from the Food and Drug Administration raided the farm of Dan Allgyer of Lancaster, Pa for shipping unpasteurized milk across state lines. Raw milk can be sold in Pa but not across state lines.

  • 729. James  |  April 20, 2014 at 8:52 am

    Mark Steyn on the Corner wrote about a mentally disturbed man who wandered through traffic outside of a New York bus terminal. The police opened fire and missed the unarmed man. They hit two pedestrians. One had a walker,.

    The DA charged the man with assaulting the women by creating the situation which caused the police to fire. Huck earlier wrote that we need not sink to Holder’s level and should follow the laws. I countered that we are already in a lawless society which uses selective enforcement of laws.

    Mark Steyn wrote “If this flies in New York, then there is no law.”

    Judge Antoin Scalea spoke at a Tennessee university. He answered a question by saying that perhaps some day young people ought to state a tax payer revolt That wouldn’t be much different from Bundy’s little revolt except the numbers would be larger,

  • 730. dead rabbit  |  April 20, 2014 at 9:10 am

    Asking a 4 year old not to cry when he loses might be a tall order but it’s not the Rabbit way.

    We talked about it this morning and he now has the word “dignity” in his lexicon.

    The advice that is saving me was I think from Tex. Just wait a day before sports nagging.

    I can’t wait until he loses again. I want to see how he handles it.

    We are many things……crying losers in sports is not one of them. (My wife claims I woke up crying and punching myself in the face during a stretch of unemployment-but I contest that).

    I know wrestling this young seems extreme. But it has done wonders for him both physically and mentally, so far. And he sincerely loves it being a part of his “story”.

    Happy Easter.

  • 731. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 9:15 am

    I’d also say rabbit that as long as the tears are linked to the emotions of the sport as opposed to any emotions linked to you he’s ok.

  • 732. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 9:23 am

    For the liberals and assorted moon bats that visited in the past and perhaps occasionally peek still and continuously claimed we were a homogenized echo chamber I offer the revelations of this thread.
    The headaches of the Bundy discussion has now been joined by James #729 giving me a migraine.

  • 733. Huck  |  April 20, 2014 at 10:27 am

    “I hope your performance here isn’t indicator of your abilities”

    Wow man, you are all over the place. A few comments earlier you were trying to insult me by telling me how I great I would be at it, now that you know I wasn’t insulted you’re trying to insult me by telling me how bad I am at it.

    It’s childish behavior with nothing more than an advanced vocabulary….and from the person who is most certainly the smartest one here. I was finding it humorous, but now it is just tedious. I’ll be skimming past them for a while. So I hope it’s at least fun for you, Tex.

    Yep…a denier of American sovereignty wants to engage in civil disobedience because he can no longer make his living by using someone else’s stuff…hurray!

    I’m not buying it. If it were his land I’d be right there with you guys. I don’t like the government telling me I need to get a permit to put up a damn shed on my own property any more than I would like a homeowner’s association telling me I can’t park my own car in my driveway overnight. I don’t like people telling me what I can and can’t do with my own stuff when what I want to do with it isn’t hurting anyone else.

    But it isn’t his land and it never was. So any example of people getting shit on by the government on their own land doesn’t really have an applicable place in this discussion.

    “Local police forces are also being militarized. Iowa City, for example, now has a tank.”

    Living near Los Angeles, I have seen this going on for a long, long time. LA had a tank. One night it slammed into the wrong house. Yeah, that was a mess…literally and figuratively. LA cops also have access to a lot of high-powered weaponry after they got their assess kicked by 2 guys in body armor. The guys were eventually killed, but it was a long day that exposed the weaknesses of law enforcement at that time. It’s my understanding that many other police departments also beefed up their arsenals after that incident. (that was just a side note, BTW)

  • 734. poolman  |  April 20, 2014 at 10:49 am

    Clive Bundy is a refreshing change from the usual rollovers most Americans have become. Most opponent actions go down without notice. No matter how confused he is, it is a good thing to make a stand for what you believe. And there isn’t any larger bastion of evil to stand up against today.

    When it comes to the federal government’s overreach, we find them creeping into every aspect of our lives, which was never their purpose or intent as established by of our founders. They would be on Bundy’s side. I could pull up some Jefferson quotes, among others, that fully support Bundy’s actions.

    With all our alphabet agencies employing militarized personnel and enforcement, we need to provide an equal or greater counter force. The feds are not on our side. This should be more than obvious to any unbiased observer by now.

  • 735. an800lbgorilla  |  April 20, 2014 at 12:37 pm

    But those evil Koch Brothers….

    What you won’t hear about in mainstream media is how Billionaire Tom Steyer drove the decision by promising to spend $100 million to help Democrats in the midterm election who help defeat the project.

    With the decision pushed back probably past the election, this allows the Democrats to be for or against the decision depending on their election chances and how badly they need Steyer’s support. Given that a majority of Americans want the project to go through, this is good news for vulnerable Democrats. Meanwhile, American jobs suffer, and whatever economic impact the project might have had on Russia is ignored for the sake of Obama’s political gain.

  • 736. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 1:00 pm

    Just saw a Reuters report that the ACA enrollment possibly susceptible to Heartbleed hack. Enrollees advised to change passwords.

  • 737. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 1:00 pm

    Happy Easter to all.

  • 738. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 2:48 pm

    I second the “wait a day” rule on sports nagging.

  • 739. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 5:05 pm

    The world is in a tizzy over Heartbleed. I have to wonder if it’s being overhyped.

  • 740. poolman  |  April 20, 2014 at 5:25 pm

    Glorious resurrection day to everyone! He is risen indeed.

  • 741. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 5:55 pm

    I think we will see more stuff like this ,folks getting caught with vulnerabilities and people then going full throttle in post incident CYA

  • 742. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:00 pm

    I agree Alfie and the simple truth is every “firewall” is just a new challenge for a good hacker. Airtight online security is a pipe dream. One reason why the move to online elections is fraught with problems.

  • 743. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:03 pm

    Yeah but I remember watching all the viruses and malware being announced and hyped but when you looked deeper and saw how little spread was actually happening you be like wtf is all the hype about?

  • 744. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:05 pm

    Alfie what’s your on-the-ground POV of tomorrow’s marathon? You seeing any obvious changes in security?

  • 745. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:06 pm

    Agree on the hype.

  • 746. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:11 pm

    Serious question on this day that is holy for so many:

    Is money better spent building life size replica of Noah’s Ark or feeding Kentucky’s starving and housing Kentucky’s homeless? Or is it a false choice?

  • 747. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 6:43 pm

    I’m not touching the area but my friends are busy with preparations. I see where the public face is focused on remembrance and working together stuff

  • 748. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 7:15 pm

    The KY thing is a a mixed bag. On one hand the AiG guy is a narcissist who is more charlatan than Christian IMO. Failed at getting the money to build a waste now the municipality will float a bond that unless the ark park defaults will won’t be on the hook for.
    If ark park gets built the likelihood of default is pretty high. It’s a big if though.
    62 plus million was not going to be raised in any way shape or form for social programs.

  • 749. Alfie  |  April 20, 2014 at 7:18 pm

    The flip sidle with a dash of humor is that if they build it and nobody comes you can put the homeless in the ark. On a liberal slant you put them in it and hope they stay there and continue to pour money year after year on it. On a conservative side you put the homeless and a sprinkling of illegals and hope the rains come and the ark takes all your social problems away,at least to TN or OH etc.

  • 750. Tex Taylor  |  April 20, 2014 at 9:44 pm


    There’s no need to defend Huck.

    From a strictly legal standpoint, I admitted in sentence one which precipitated this debate, Huck is on the winning side of the established law. But whose law? Huck makes a valid point we are a nation of laws that must be consistently enforced. However, that assumes that law just, equitable and dutifully enforced, does it not?

    I believe Huck’s myopia and those like him, and where I believe Huck’s analogy to Eric Holder misguided (yours too), is contained in the first three words of the Preamble of the Constitution…

    We the people…


    Do the actions of our nameless federal government pertaining to the multi-purpose role of public lands in specific reference to Cliven Bundy do any of the following?

    Establish justice? Insure domestic tranquility? Provide for a common defense? Promote the general welfare? Secure the blessings of Liberty?

    Because if the federal solution of penalty at the bad end of a barrel fails any of these, we don’t need to study Constitutional Law to determine the aggrieved. The federal government couldn’t even meet the definition which proceeds the Bill of Rights.

    Let me give Poolman some credit. In his last two paragraphs in #734, he said better or hinted to the question that needs to be answered by the critics than I did in four posts.

  • 751. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 10:10 pm

    Alfie the ark thing hits me thusly: it has been stated in these pages (not necessarily by you) that charity should be (and is) the work of the church and not the government.

    If that is the case shouldn’t conservatives and particularly religious conservatives be outraged at this expenditure for entertainment and not good works?

    Now, if 95% of the admission price to see this ark will go to homeless shelters then there is my answer. If not, I think we have a problem.

    I’ve not even touched the tax status of the ark park. That’s an entirely different question.

  • 752. Rutherford  |  April 20, 2014 at 10:19 pm

    In answer to your question Tex:

    Establish justice? Yes as we define justice within prescribed law.

    Dom tranquility? Yes for tortoises. :-)
    Common defense? No.
    General welfare? Yes for tortoises. :-)
    Blessings of liberty? I suppose not.

    So sadly the only definitive yes goes to justice. If the rule change 20 years ago screwed Bundy over he needed legal remedy. That’s how our country works.

    I’m actually a bit surprised that you have not drawn a parallel between the way Obama blinked on Bundy to the way he blinked on Assad or may presently be blinking on Putin.

  • 753. El Tigre  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:23 am

    “it has been stated in these pages (not necessarily by you) that charity should be (and is) the work of the church and not the government.”

    It has?

    I think charity should reside in individuals, like yourself. But you’ve confessed that you have none to offer.

    Someone here said the only role of a church should be to take in and distribute gifts? Who said that?

  • 754. Tex Taylor  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:38 am

    I’m actually a bit surprised that you have not drawn a parallel between the way Obama blinked on Bundy to the way he blinked on Assad or may presently be blinking on Putin.

    To address the easy one first, I think Obama didn’t read about Nevada in the paper and thus uninvolved in the decision making. He was too busy filling out his NCAA ESPN bracket. Besides, our gentry President didn’t perceive any chance of political victory – he’s not interested in domestic blood and guts – just stealing from your bank account to buy more votes.

    Obama’s disinterest in management is only exceeded by his gross incompetence when he makes the puppet master Soros’ bidding and becomes involved. Obama is bordering now on Joe Biden intelligence – selfies.

    That’s why I’ve told Republicans to shut their mouths when this court jester tags along with his insidious, overbearing, entitled matriarch and lives Camelot. It’s pennies on the dollar compared to the damage when Obama is involved in real issues facing the country, and only applicable as long as the schlub is President and not in perpetuity, thank you Unaffordable Health Care.

    As to the question of the ark, why would anyone be compelled to give the proceeds to social justice? I guess you could argue that they didn’t tithe 10% of the profits or something. :smile: When I hear the words social justice and Christ in the same sentence anymore, the antennae immediately go up that somebody is stealing from the passed pew plate again, Thank you Jesus!

    The ark builder is probably some militant atheist like PfeSSer looking to make a buck off weak minded imbeciles that find Christ’s face on their taco.

    Rutherford, if I’ve led you to in anyway believe I think (1) All people who call themselves Christian are disciples of Christ or (2) Announcing yourself Christian somehow makes on righteous, forgive me.

    The rottenest, meanest people I’ve ever met were inside a church wall.

    But as my sweet mom likes to say to her son, “Well? What better place for them to be, Tex?” LOL

  • 755. Rutherford  |  April 21, 2014 at 1:29 am

    Tigre perhaps I’m drawing a link between two separate memes?

    I HAVE been told that I have been guilty of ignoring the church’s good works. In answer to “who if not the gov’t?” I have been told “the church, among others.” And finally I have been told the govt has no business forcing charity upon others.

    So forgive me if I’ve stirred them all up into one stew.

    As for my own acts of charity I give my tiny bit every year to this and that. My wife is particularly fast at texting donations when there are natural disasters. So thanks for the gratuitous insult.

  • 756. El Tigre  |  April 21, 2014 at 7:15 am

    No gratuitous insult, R. I asked you in a prior post and you said you didn’t give to charity — time nor money. Now you say you do. Whatever.

    The point is that you have asked, “if not the government, then who?’ Well, duh. How about you? That strikes you as an insulting? It’s a legitimate question to someone that believes in “forced charity” from others but volunteers nearly nothing himself.

  • 757. James  |  April 21, 2014 at 9:09 am

    I’m beating a dead cow, but this statement provides the wrong image of the Bundy family’s economic status. I am being picky.

    “…because he can no longer make a living by using someone’s stuff.”

    The Bundys had over 900 cattle when this started. Suppose they sold 800 steers and heifers at $300. a piece.That figure approaches $250.000 per cattle crop.It doesn’t count the value of the breeding stock. I don’t know what the true value is. I am just guessing, but it shows the Bundys are likely able to make a living on the ranch,

    The Bundys also offered to pay the fees to Clark County, and they were apparently paying fees until the BLM changed the rules and favored non-ranchers. That tells me if they can afford to pay the fees and stay in business for twenty years of court disputes, they CAN make a living on someone else’s land. They don’t own the land, but the “stuff” they use, including cattle and the facilities to care for them and to maintain the land belong to the Bundys or maybe their bank if they have a large line of credit.

    I don’t know how the government lease works. I know cash rent. We rent our land to three farmers who pay us twice a year. Since it is cash rent they have the right to manage the land and crops any way they see fit as long as they don’t hurt the land. They are virtual owners who consult with us if they want to make a major change such as installing a center pivot. They pay for the center pivot. We assure them in writing that they will be able to rent the land until the pivot is paid for.

    Last week, a renter paid a contractor to clear trees from a fence line. The contractor is local and a former high school class mate. Our renter also knows the man is good, but he gets in a hurry. He wouldn’t let the contractor start work until he showed the contractor our old apple tree. Our renter told the man “don’t touch that tree. If you do, I will be gone.” The contractor laughed and said “I didn’t even know the tree was there.”

    I wrote a term paper about Interpol when I was in high school. One problem the organization had then was that criminal elements with higher budgets were better armed than Interpol. Maybe that happens with some local police forces..

  • 758. James  |  April 21, 2014 at 9:19 am

    The ark is a business project. The ark builder may have seen the movie and decided he could make some money from heightened awareness of the ark. The Black Hills Flintstones park fits the same category. It is business, not religion. I agree with Tex.

    Obviously some disasters are too big for locals to handle, but local and personal charity is more efficient because locals know the situation better than distant managers.

  • 759. muffy  |  April 21, 2014 at 9:21 am

    Rutherford made it clear that he doesn’t give of his time or money to the needy, but writes a small check to Harvard each year ($100?). Maybe hes counting that or else has become charitable recently. R likes to dish about what other people give and believe, and tries to find things for other people to be outraged about so he can pretend its equal to his lack of concern or even curiosity about how this administration abuses the people they lord over.

    You can bet they are talking about the ark on msnbc.

  • 760. Tex Taylor  |  April 21, 2014 at 9:58 am

    You can bet they are talking about the ark on msnbc.

    ** Guffaw ** :smile:

    Oh, I think “R”‘s heart is in the right place but he’s constantly bombarded with the wrong messages. It would do him good to get out to observe these charitable works that churches do for himself. I think he would be amazed at what MSNBC doesn’t know.

    Give you an example of the secular world’s marketing of faith. My wife purchased Philomena for us to watch last night. We did our Easter movies Saturday Night, so after traveling yesterday, we sat back when the kids were safely in their own nests.

    Now believe it or not, Tex’s wife actually gave some serious thought to becoming a nun year’s ago, so this is a woman very steeped in her faith. She took a different path and chose celibacy with a Protestant husband instead. :smile:

    Great movie. Fabulous acting. Hard for me to believe Judy Dench didn’t win an Oscar for best actress – these Brits are something else – her costar was every bit as good, and I didn’t know him. Best acting I’ve seen since the King’s Speech.

    This is supposedly loosely based on a real story. And in the story, the Irish nunnery basically steals the children of single teenage mothers, delivers the babies in medieval fashion, makes the single mothers work seven days a week for hard labor to pay back for the care, and sells the babies to the highest American bidder (Jane Russell was one) at a young age under coercion that the teenage mother signed contract. The girl’s parents abandon her. The Church burns the adoption papers to cover their tracks. Somehow, the girl now woman keeps her faith – the nuns both tyrants and liars.

    The journalist who helps her is atheist and wise; constant critic of God who mocks God throughout the movie for everything from earthquakes to liking sex. The adopted son turns out to be gay and died in 1995, affiliated as attorney under Ronald Reagan and George Bush, who are of course bashed for his young death because they cut off AIDS research funding because HIV a homosexual disease….

    Yada, yada, yada…

    This is how too much of the world gets its perception of the church, of its politics, of the charitable works of people of faith, etc…

    And even my wife and I hardly batted an eye we’re so used to the negative stereotypes.

    So here is my challenge to any atheist, any agnostic. Show me your own charitable works that rivals even a ‘smidgeon’ of anything the Catholic Church does, and explain to me why the most godless country in the world, Communist China, is experiencing this phenomenon.

    China on course to become ‘world’s most Christian nation’ within 15 years

  • 761. muffy  |  April 21, 2014 at 10:26 am

    “Now believe it or not, Tex’s wife actually gave some serious thought to becoming a nun year’s ago, so this is a woman very steeped in her faith. She took a different path and chose celibacy with a Protestant husband instead.”

    I haven’t seen Philomena but I know what you’re saying.

    As to Rutherford’s heart being in the right place, I assumed by “introspection” he meant he was considering turning his amazing powers of perception inward for a spell.

  • 762. muffy  |  April 21, 2014 at 10:28 am

    (The quote and the understood stereotyping in Hollyweird films are unrelated. I just thought the quote was funny.)

  • 763. El Tigre  |  April 21, 2014 at 10:29 am

    I don’t know anything about this Ark project. But I am wondering why a religious conservative is supposed to be “outraged.”

    Rutherford himself seems to be “outraged” for reasons I don’t understand. He doesn’t deny that the various religious institutions in this country dish tons of charity. At least think he doesn’t deny it. That’s above the “forced charity” he advocates. Yet he’s upset that whatever church this is isn’t charitable enough? WTF??

  • 764. poolman  |  April 21, 2014 at 10:38 am

    America is also the biggest mission field for these Chinese Christians. I didn’t read the article Tex posted, but had previously learned of the growth of Christianity in China and of us being the main mission field from one of my pastor’s sermons.

  • 765. Alfie  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:21 pm

    Actually ark guy has been discussed in these threads before. Most recently noted for his big debate versus Bill Nye. As Tex alluded to the type of person often found cloaked in piety is usually the farthest from it. Ark guy is a modern day look at all my tassels kind of nutter.sadly a community has bought into believing tacit support of this project is a winner.

  • 766. Alfie  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:25 pm

    American Christians have a long history of trying to save the yellow man. A little over a century ago the same missionary types helped to push US foreign policy near the brink of war and plunge China into a state of disarray.
    I’d warn against overenthusiasm today over China evangelism. I concede it could be a powerful thing but I also think it could be open to so much bad it’s near unimaginable.

  • 767. Tex Taylor  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:42 pm

    My real point, Poolman, preaching to the choir now…And I apologize for reading preachy.

    The harder these anti God types try to fill the void with capitalism, cronyism, communism, comfortabilism and every other ‘ism’, and most definitely freedom from religionism, all these throughout history have left people wanting and most know not why.

    And the harder the irreligious and materialists push, within a short time in the context of history, the more they so obviously fail. It will happen once again in America too – America will change or America will fall. Have no doubt as the net tightens, America will return back to a more “religious” people. As Solomon said, there is nothing new under the sun.

    Let us hope it is not too late when the time comes that she so weakened, the enemy already in the door.

    Now that I’m old, I can honestly say I too tried to fill my heart and mind with many of these worldly things. The satisfaction was fleeting – so fleeting to make me feel foolish now.

    That’s the part that has frustrated me about life…

    About the time you feel like you’re kind of beginning to figure some of life out, what is important and what is not, you’re too old to do much about it. Sigh…For starters, I wish I had been a better son, husband, and father.

    What I’m left with is the realization that whatever or however man wants to refer to it, “God” or “nature” has left an indelible mark on our hearts that cannot be wiped away or erased to search for meaning. SS probably doesn’t realize it, but he may be the one searching the hardest of all. Where is his emphasis day in and day out? That’s why so many of these hardened atheists often become the most zealous in faith.

    I will also be honest and tell you any theologian that tells you why and how God works beyond what is written and that often cryptic and I believe purposely so to encourage the search; anybody who believes himself or herself capable of trying to explain the mind of God and calling themselves Christian, is a fool and a fraud and should be summarily discarded as loon and heretic, worthy of mockery.

    Hell, I don’t blame PfeSSer for being loaded for bear. There’s a lot of woolly charlatans out there to shoot at.

  • 768. poolman  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:47 pm

    This modern trend of Chinese evangelism and Putin’s defense of Orthodox Christianity kind of eggs our face. The Christian nation we claim(ed) to be seems a bit far-fetched in today’s real world. Did we get too full of ourselves or just get lazy? Too much good life to worry, I guess. Apathy and technology win over the consumerist’s day.

  • 769. poolman  |  April 21, 2014 at 12:58 pm

    Anyone who brings attention to himself rather than directs or introduces others to the Father of all creation is a fraud. A wolf in sheep’s clothing. And there are plenty to choose from.

    I don’t blame the critics of the church, as they often haven’t seen a good representation of it. The media uses religion as it does race to keep up our dander. If it is on the news, I always go to the basic reason first. Why? Who is telling the story and who is it hurting/helping? The media has much influence over the collective. All of our institutions are built without a God factor, so they will all fall.

  • 770. Tex Taylor  |  April 21, 2014 at 1:43 pm

    I concede it could be a powerful thing but I also think it could be open to so much bad it’s near unimaginable.

    Alfie, for some of the wrong reasons I believe you reached the right conclusion.

    All those unnamed missionaries trying to help the ‘yellow’ man are exactly why Communist China is tipping toward Christian China. Though I can’t predict the when and the where, I can tell you the reason for the how. It’s called Evangelism. It is what Jesus instructed his flock to do that we now call the Great Commission. It’s what so angers the unbelievers – this message of exclusivity. Hopefully, our record as Christians is one more of peace and justice than weapon. It was supposed to be. But just like the rest of humanity, Christians are fallible people. We too make mistakes.

    This danger you contemplate will bear much poison fruit so unimaginably bitter, that even hardened cynics like you and me will not be able to comprehend the carnage. However, if I read you correctly, I believe you have your complaint pointed toward the wrong party, or at the very least, the blame of both sides for the looming battle, as if this precarious false peace is preferable to war.

    Do me a favor? Bear with me for a minute before shaking your head as this some wild eyed gobbledy gook (no pun intended) from a man indoctrinated into Christianity from a Christian mother since the cradle. Because this is important for you.

    Took her patience of over 30 years to get to that point, I might add. :smile:


    Now I am aware that most here believe this universal Armageddon is about as probable as a Hobbit leading us to the promised land.

    But I don’t think even the most die hard cynic amongst us can deny that all of us have this palpable feeling that some climax is on the horizon. China emerging as economic power, Russia apparently leaning back to motherland bear, radical Islam on the rise, Western civilization turning away from her roots led by feckless and cowardly western leaders interested only in their own skins and power. And to me personally, perhaps the clearest sign of them all. A global hatred of all that is Jew and Jerusalem. Let’s not kid ourselves, anti-Zionism is on the rise everywhere.

    So if you call yourself Christian and truly believe, you should fathom God is in the process of calling His flock home and we are marching along a path toward what was predicted both 2,500 years ago in the Old Testament and approximately 1,950 years ago in the New Testament. Those of us sane willingly admit we don’t know how long the path, but all of us feel the destination is imminent.

    And to the believer, the end result will bring a horror on a scale that the earth has never seen, nor will ever see again – so much so, that the Book of the Revelation tells us heaven takes pause.

    Now, I recognize that tilts me more toward sounding like Mahmoud Ahmadinejad than Gandhi to the skeptic; say a rational, secular player, somebody like Huck or perhaps even you Alfie.

    You are absolutely right in your conclusion that false religion is a more dangerous foe than even godless communism. But neither can you deny the persecution of Christians all over this globe. Over a million Christians have been killed just the past four or five years for no reason other than their faith. We Christians are sheltered here in America. But it’s not that way around much of the world.


    There is a misconception amongst the layman about Christianity. Christ did not come to unite nations. He came to divide. Nation will rise against nation. And if you are Christian, you are faced with a dilemma. Until Christ’s return, there will be no lasting peace. It’s a paradox that cannot be explained. You’re also faced with a more taxing question. How does a loving God allow so many people to be led astray to die in the dust of war? I believe the answer is ‘free will.’

    I really do understand the cynicism intelligent folks like Pfesser project day by day. I wish I could explain it to the layman better than I do without sounding the bore. But I can’t. I wish I could explain the Book of Job and it’s allowance. I can’t beyond the practice of Job’s faith sustained Job.

    However, there is one thing above all I do understand. Evil cannot tolerate the light of the Golden Rule. Those who learn to practice it cannot be led astray. Good does triumph over evil – eventually in full we Christians believe.

    So Alfie, having said that and believing nothing is impossible with my God, a God that doesn’t just change individual hearts but a God that moves entire nations, what if…

    A government so evil that it selectively aborts millions of little females and has starved millions more, suddenly finds itself with a populace so overtly spiritual and Christ like, communism passes without a whimper and Communist China without a bang? Or perhaps China becomes America and Israel’s new ally in a military battle of might?

    Something unimaginable ten years ago is not so far fetched, is it?

  • 771. Rutherford  |  April 21, 2014 at 3:13 pm

    Tigre I don’t give time to charity. If I ever said here i don’t give money then I must have been stoned. On the contrary many moons ago I actually spelled out who I give to and was criticized for my choices. :roll:

  • 772. Rutherford  |  April 21, 2014 at 3:22 pm

    Muffy you’re starting to piss me off like Tigre does.

    So what if I saw the ark story on MSNBC. What of it? Where do you get your news, original reporting?

    As for charity, yeah the Harvard donations got me a lot of heat here. The American Cancer Society and Red Cross donations got ignored or forgotten.

  • 773. El Tigre  |  April 21, 2014 at 3:59 pm

    “Muffy you’re starting to piss me off like Tigre does.”


    R, get mad all you want. You look nowhere else. Your world view is formed by that dumb fucking station. It decides what’s important and not important to you. It tells you what to say to defend and rationalize. Whatever claims to introspection you plan to pursue, everything is still filtered through MSNBC. You denying it is laughable. If you want to blow everybody’s mind, turn it off for a week.

    Or get mad. . . :roll:

    p.s. you said you didn’t have the money to make donations to anyone when you responded to my comment. I asked about time and you said you were a homebody.

  • 774. James  |  April 21, 2014 at 7:46 pm

    I don’t have time for this right now. If you are getting mad, Rutherford etc. lighten your moods and listen to this, or not.

    One Republic-Love Runs Out is fast- paced and it will surely approach number one. It at least refers to religion.

    “There’s a maniac out in front of me. Got an angel on my shoulder and Mephistopheles.
    My Moma raised me good, momma raised me right
    Moma said ‘do what you want, say prayers at night.
    And I’m saying them because I’m so devout.”

  • 775. muffy  |  April 21, 2014 at 8:16 pm

    Harvard isn’t a charity and they don’t need your money either, so look who’s talking?

    More MSNBC gossip. Bunch of little old ladies.

  • 776. El Tigre  |  April 21, 2014 at 8:18 pm

    James, we don’t share the same taste in music. But I must say, you’ve got to be the most on-top-of-it Vietnam vet when it comes to Alt.

  • 777. dead rabbit  |  April 21, 2014 at 11:14 pm

    James’s passion for alternative pop music fascinates me. It’s like learning about all the debauchery that goes on in an old folks home. I cringe at the thought of it but want to slap the old geezers on the back and say “atta boy” at the same time.

    James….if I find out you wear skinny jeans I’m drawing the line.

    James, an elderly farmer from Iowa is the hippest guy I know!

    Plus…he still sizes a motherfucker up to see if he can take him.

    God bless James!

  • 778. Rutherford  |  April 22, 2014 at 2:58 am

    News flash Muffy donations to higher learning are considered charitable although I get your point.

    Since your memory is so good you probably remember my motive for giving to Harvard.

    Tigre I’ve always given a bit to charity so all I can think of is that I once said I don’t have the money to give a lot.

  • 779. Rutherford  |  April 22, 2014 at 3:08 am

    For fucks sake would you PITA’s tell me what news source satisfies you? The funny thing is I am the only one here who has spoken face to face with a “news maker” Michael Steele former RNC head.

    Would you guys like me to get ALL my news first hand?

  • 780. Tex Taylor  |  April 22, 2014 at 5:24 am

    Would you guys like me to get ALL my news first hand?


    From me. That’s all the news you need to know, Brother Rutherford. You’ll feel freer in a week, I predict. :smile: Wean you off the Leftist Milk of Maddow and have you eating manly eef Jerky in a week.

    One thing for sure. Your blog will take on an incredibly different tone. You might even become Chris Hayes’ worst nightmare. The Harvard education Brother who saw the light of Taylor – kind of a Road to Damascus political conversion.

    P.S. I had to think long and hard what PITA meant. Does that mean I’m not internet cool?

    P.S.S. – Are you sure Chris Hayes isn’t Rachel Maddow in drag? He sounds like her with the same mannerisms – that grating, idiot rhythm and hand gestures too. I turned him on accidentally tonight and watched for a minute on Moonbats Spouting Nothing But Crap.

    Chris really does resemble a bit of a peter puffer to me. Do you gravitate to these prissy men, Brother “R?” I mean, I know you’re straight as an arrow you nympho, but you got these peter puffing roommates, cock stuffing TV personalities, and for variety watching, girls who look like men. :twisted:

  • 781. Tex Taylor  |  April 22, 2014 at 5:25 am

    Oops. Well, for Rutherford eef Jerky may be more appropriate. But that was supposed to be Beef, as in where’s the?

  • 782. James  |  April 22, 2014 at 8:38 am

    El Tigre, thanks.

    My wife doesn’t like my taste in music either. I am a musical gourmand. I consume anything I hear or see, and I like to read about the musicians’ career and business models. So much music is out there, and I wish I had more time to hear it all. It keeps me from getting too angry about our current events.

    My wife doesn’t like “Love Runs Out,” but it will be a top ten hit before summer ends.

    Rutherford would do himself a service by banning MSNBC and other liberal news from his house for a week. If he doesn’t like withdrawal delelerium tremons, he can spend the time he would have on Rachel Maddow on music he likes. Maybe he can watch a New Zealand band, The Baby Sitters Circus-Everything’s Gonna Be Alright”.

    Again, my wife was unimpressed. She said some of the young women in the band’s official flash mob video shouldn’t have bothered taking their tops off.

  • 783. James  |  April 22, 2014 at 8:57 am

    Rutherford, for starters, look up Betsy’s Page. Since you are a Harvard grad, today’s issue should interest you. Harvard student Sandra V.L. Korn wrote for the Harvard Crimson that academic justice should replace academic freedom.

    Betsy also links to John Curdele who discusses the Census bureau’s falsifying statistics especially when it comes to unemployment data.

    Neither of these stories will be on MSNBC. Networks don’t carry stories on News Busters with the same slant. Pj media and Sister toldjah are two other blogs.

    You asked , we told.

  • 784. James  |  April 22, 2014 at 9:09 am

    I missed your comment the first time, rabbit. Thanks for the complement. Our family is long-lived. We tend to be active until 95 to 100. Then things quickly fall apart.

    Except for my temples, my hair is still light brown, and my beard if I grow one remainsl blond, red and brown with most of the blond turning gray. I don’t need glasses.

    I don’t need medication except for the glaucoma I share with Rutherford.

    I wouldn’t be caught dead in skinny jeans.

    Everything still works.

    Considering how tough you are, your complement means something.

    God bless you.

  • 785. El Tigre  |  April 22, 2014 at 10:39 am

    “You asked , we told.”

    Hell, I wouldn’t care whether it’s right leaning or not. Just shut the damn propaganda channel off and “think” and “hear” something that has an agenda of any kind other than promoting Obama and the dems. NYT doesn’t count.

    Damn R, you went to Haaavad and have access to the internet. Go exploring for cryin’ out loud. Dig into something. Quit pretending MSNBC is a reliable source of “news” (or whatever you think is news ’cause you and I sure have different ideas of what constitute “news”). Just consider another source — another view — any view that isn’t the shallow liberal propaganda you find edifying or are just plain addicted to. I promise. It’ll fuck everyone here up completely.

  • 786. an800lbgorilla  |  April 22, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    The Internal Revenue Service has revoked the tax-exemption for a conservative charity, saying the group’s criticism of Hillary Clinton and John Kerry violated rules against political activity.

    The Patrick Henry Center for Individual Liberty engaged in “deliberate and consistent intervention in political campaigns,” according to the IRS decision released Friday and first reported by USA Today.

    The IRS said the group’s tax-exemption would be revoked as of July 1 unless the decision is successfully appealed.

    Tax-exempt groups are restricted from engaging in certain political activity, including participating in partisan campaigns in support or opposition to a candidate. is the link for Organizing for America, a tax exempt organization that is subject to the EXACT SAME RULES as The Patrick Henry Center.

    Yet, we’re to believe that there is no partisan targeting of Conservative groups by Obama’s IRS…..

    Fuck you R…

  • 787. Tex Taylor  |  April 22, 2014 at 12:30 pm

    I think Dennis Prager pens some of the best stuff going anymore.

    I dare anyone here to deny the truth of this article, you included “R.” And I used it purposely because frankly, it makes me embarrassed two of these imbeciles were from the once great state of Oklahoma. We too have become a state of politically correct pussies, too afraid to call these idiots on their idiocy.

    Academia shares much of the blame. The biggest instigators in the crime of deviancy dumb downward are parents who continue to fund these frauds.

    Apparently, these illiterate racists singing the tune of the greatness of The Constitution they hide behind, don’t understand the disconnect of their conclusion when juxtaposed as to who devised it.

    From Greatness to Whiteness

  • 788. muffy  |  April 22, 2014 at 3:14 pm

    ”News flash Muffy donations to higher learning are considered charitable although I get your point.
    Since your memory is so good you probably remember my motive for giving to Harvard.”

    Of course I know that and of course I remember. Is your less-than-philanthropic motive supposed to be helpful to your scrutiny of ark man? It was you who mused if his money wasn’t better spent on the needy.

    You caught yourself up in your own net. Even down to the tax issue you alluded to @ #751. Really, you’re giving introspection a whole new meaning. It’s not looking deeper into other peoples’ blemishes you know.

    And the ark isn’t news. It’s entertainment. Hell even the president of the network says they’re not the place to turn to for breaking news. That’s because they don’t want to report negative news about their party leaders and this administration on down is bad news.

    Try WGN to hear about what’s going on in your own backyard. For world news just about every other source is a better choice than the MSNBC drip.

  • 789. an800lbgorilla  |  April 22, 2014 at 4:56 pm

    These people are….special…..

  • 790. El Tigre  |  April 22, 2014 at 6:00 pm

    Oh, for the love of God, G.

    (it sure does raise a lot of questions. . . questions I really don’t want answered)

  • 791. El Tigre  |  April 22, 2014 at 6:16 pm

    Just saw R’s priceless tweet:

    “If we want to persuade on ACA we have to stop lying. 8 million people did not suddenly get health ins. Many already had it.”

    That’s pissa!

    Selling Obamacare requires better lies, not the truth you numbskull.

  • 792. Tex Taylor  |  April 22, 2014 at 6:32 pm

    That third egg was a little runny. Ewwwww…

    I guess I can only surmise Europe has officially gone to hell now? I have no earthly idea what I just watched

    Far from me to turn my back on naked, young women, but I believe that was one time I could have closed my eyes or skipped the “art.”

  • 793. an800lbgorilla  |  April 22, 2014 at 7:01 pm

    I thought this would be an excellent example of what we’re dealing with…

  • 794. muffy  |  April 22, 2014 at 8:16 pm

    45 people shot over the weekend here in Chi-ria. 8 dead. Warm weather to blame.

    No mention of the lack of respect for life.

  • 795. muffy  |  April 22, 2014 at 9:27 pm

    “Just saw R’s priceless tweet:”

    For the crowd that believes words change reality.

    However I’m all for the “selling” of the ACA to include some truth.

  • 796. Alfie  |  April 22, 2014 at 10:58 pm

    I have to say that often times when I see stories designed to stoke the passions of Conservatives I think that the money trail must flow from really smart humps from the Left.

  • 797. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 2:39 am

    “Leftist milk of Maddow”

    I must admit that was good. On another note Tex I think you’re making progress that you can imagine Maddow breast feeding. :-)

  • 798. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 2:42 am

    Muffy local news depresses the crap out of me. I never watch it.

  • 799. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 4:44 am

    Part of “selling” ACA is not obscuring positive results with lies. Any of you who claim there are NO positive stories are fools.

    I will concede that we are hearing lies because the true negative stories are more compelling than the true positive ones.

  • 800. an800lbgorilla  |  April 23, 2014 at 5:28 am

    Hearing lies?

    Truth is stranger than fiction when it comes to Obamacare, and every horror story you hear is real.

    The amount of damage done by this legislation far, far exceeds any anecdotal benefit that might have accidentally occurred.

  • 801. an800lbgorilla  |  April 23, 2014 at 5:37 am

    Another MSDNC quote that explains the logical failure of the left. To call the GI Bill “affirmative action” not only demonstrates monumental, and catastophic, ignorance, but demonstrates what the left wants “affirmative action” to be. The GI Bill is available to EVERY SERVICE MEMBER, regardless of race, sex, or creed. Everyone. I suppose I could throw up the stats that show that there is a disproportionate number of minorities in service, which using liberal logic, would mean that there are a disproportionate number of affirmative action GI Bills handed out. Or maybe I should find one of the many quotes where liberals have said that minorities going into the service are like slaves, to die in the stead of white people…

    This race hustle that the left pushes so hard is infuriating. Obama and the left have made race relations in this country far worse with the constant throwing of the race card into every single debate, every single criticism, every single defense. Obama and the left can’t stand on the principle of their positions, and when challenged on the results or premises of those policies, the race card is thrown because the left has no defense.

    MICHAEL ERIC DYSON: So for me, it’s very simple. Many white people are not asked to talk about their own privilege. …We’re pretending as if white Americans have not been the recipients of Affirmative Action from the beginning of this nation on down to the 20th century.

    When we talk about the G.I. bill which in majority strokes went to white Americans — there were a few other exceptions — it created the middle class, it provided opportunities for them to buy homes, to get educated and to get employment. That is an extraordinary degree of Affirmative Action. …

    So my point is simply we don’t ask white people to ask questions about their privilege, we don’t ask the degree in which they’ve been recipients of Affirmative Action in the negative, in terms of preferential treatment.

  • 803. El Tigre  |  April 23, 2014 at 7:10 am

    “I will concede that we are hearing lies because the true negative stories are more compelling than the true positive ones.”

    WTF??? These are stats not “stories.” In fact, Reid says the negative “stories” are all made up.

    We’re hearing lies because Obama is a liar and the left will accept and defend the lies.

    Now back to my MSNBC.

  • 804. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:46 am

    799, yes, there are positive effects from AFC.It doesn’t strengthen your argument.

    Some people will be better off under Obama Care than they were, but the people who lost what they had to help a relatively few should have had the information and the the chance to accept or reject such a charitable act. Instead, they got lies.

    Our daughter must pay $5,000 more insurance premiums this year, and if the employer mandate ever takes effect, she may lose her policy.

    Betsys Page, which you should read discusses the University of North Carolina system.Beginning next year, large employers must provide insurance for everyone who works over 30 hours per week. UNC has 8,586 visiting professors graduate assistants and others who don’t qualify for insurance because they are considered non-permanent employees. The AFC will require that all of those people would be covered. Administrators are considering reducing hours to avoid the coverage requirement.

    Sotamayor’s reaction to the Michigan affirmative action decision, and liberals’ reactions to the verdict with attacks on Justice Thomas once again supports my theory that most liberals are racists, or at least bigots.

    Calling the GI Bill “affirmative action” also supports my view that most liberals are secretly anti-military. Years ago, some feminists complained about the GI Bill. When prospective postal workers, for example had some points added to their test scores if they were veterans the favoritism was called anti-woman and anti-minority. They are the same people. Only the names and faces change.

    Your point that some good comes out of AFC act doesn’t mean much because it belies the forced sacrifices of others, and the financial burden ObamaCare will impose on our country and health care system. Until you address my points you are engaging in sophistry.

  • 805. parker  |  April 23, 2014 at 9:08 am

    Rutherford – I think that all members of your Congress should be required to read and memorize Thomas Sowell’s “Basic Economics.” Here is precisely why college is so expensive:

    from Chapter Two: “Since scarce resources have alternative uses, the value placed on one of these uses by one individual sets the cost that has to be paid by others who want to bid some of these resources away for their own use. From the standpoint of the economy as a whole, this means that resources tend to flow to their most valued uses when there is price competition.”

    It is not the government’s place to make college more affordable; it is the government’s subsidies – by way of cheap student loans and grants – that made it unaffordable to begin with. When one has to make decisions based on limited available resources, supply and demand work to hold down prices. When the gov’t floods the market with cheap money, prices go up. Why do you think your medical costs are so high and its quality slipping into the toilet? Albania, East Germany, here you come!

  • 806. Tex Taylor  |  April 23, 2014 at 9:19 am

    I understand the feckless Johnny Depp ‘Burning Man’ dopeheads are going to gather next to Cliven Bundy’s ranch to harass and mock the man in September. Very well. These bums are going to find out the hard way these militia types aren’t nearly as forgiving as the sympathetic Obama Cabinet Choom Gang.

    I can’t think of a better time to stampede some cattle and bring a few big trucks in to mow a herd of dopers down while rounding them up. :twisted: A horse at about 30mph makes for a formidable weapon too. The picture of some of these acid heads being dragged and stomped to death amuses me.

    Obama followers too, I might add.

    Tin soldiers and Obama coming,
    We will handle it on our own.
    This summer I hear the stomping
    Four hundred dead dopers once voted for President ‘O’.

    Gotta get down to it
    Trucks just mowed another down
    Should have been done long ago.
    What if you knew them
    And found them flat on the ground
    Militia done laid the worthless mofos low…

  • 807. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 10:18 am

    Rutherford, you wrote you would do some more research on Benghazi, but we haven’t seen any signs of what you did.

    Now is your chance. Mail online April 23, 2014 “Benghazi attack could have been prevented if US hadn’t switched sides in the War on Terror and allowed $500 million of weapons to reach al-Qaeada militants reveals damning report.

    Citizens Committee on Benghazi is a center-right organization, but its conclusions dovetail with other reports. They are more trustworthy than the administration.

    “US claims that it lacked the resources to mount a counter attack in time to save lives is false.”

    US Ambassador Chris Stevens was to be captured and traded for the “Blind Shiekh” who conceived the 1993 WTC bombing.

    I told you Obama should have been impeached. Hillary should have been too, This is covered up because of an unpatriotic press that feeds stories to the clueless millions who care about little except for the freebees

    Another bit of news comes from north Texas. The feds want to attempt another land grab. Given the arbitrary changes to AFC without input from Congress, and all of the lies, the burden of proof rests on other shoulders to show that Sami singer Sofia Jannok’s description of an occupying regime doesn’t apply to the Obama administration.

  • 808. poolman  |  April 23, 2014 at 10:36 am

    CSNY Ohio? Lol. I think you’re a little mixed up, Tex.

    I have decided this whole Cliven Bundy thing is just a test balloon. I don’t see any other reason for the press it’s still getting. Another divide issue. The media likes those.

  • 809. poolman  |  April 23, 2014 at 10:52 am

    James, the 1993 WTC bombing was done with the help of ‘our guys’. That is what came out during the trial of Zacarias Moussaoui. The FBI provided real explosives where many ‘terorists’ involved expected a drill. They were attempting to create an act with enough terror and destruction to pass the Patriot Act at that time. It was prepared many years in advance. But there wasn’t enough damage or national outrage with that event.

    Americans have no excuse for paving their own path of demise as most never learn the real truths found mostly in FOIA releases, often years or decades after the fact.

  • 810. Tex Taylor  |  April 23, 2014 at 10:55 am

    Nah Poolman. Not mixed up. Just on the other side this time.

    They’re still shooting at the same filthy anarchist scum – militia, cowboys or national guard do the shooting, makes no difference to me. :smile: Stealing a piece of shit like Neil Young’s music makes it that much sweeter.

    It is ironic isn’t that our anarchists and government have come full circle. Used to be hippies were considered the antithesis of government. Now with Obuma as President, anarchists and BO are joined at the hip and the crewcuts like me will be shooting at the government. LOL

  • 811. poolman  |  April 23, 2014 at 11:03 am

    I will have to give this administration credit for revealing the ugly underbelly of the beast. I hold it no allegiance.

  • 812. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 11:06 am

    Poolman, assuming you are correct, it is irrelevant.

    The point is a charge that the planned kidnapping was intended to use Ambassador Stevens as a bargaining piece to get the blind sheik out of jail. The commission also charges that the administration may have provided the arms to carry out the operation.

    We are no longer a nation of laws if we ever were. At best, we are an oligarchy of selective law enforcement.

  • 813. El Tigre  |  April 23, 2014 at 11:07 am

    @808, oh God it pains me, but I tend to agree.

    Especially when Poolman’s psychosis reemerges @809.

    James, again, you have hit an immoveable object. It’s all a nothing burger to him because the opposite not only degrades Bo Bo, but invites discussion of the sleaziness of the administration that he’s not prepared to defend — well, outside of unsubstantiated platitudes delivered to him by MSNBC, the Obama regime’s version of Joseph Goebbels.

    “What difference does it make now?”

  • 814. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 11:15 am

    We are two countries with conflicting concepts of reality and national purpose.Eventually, “we’ll start a fire, and we’ll shut it down.” We ” will be doing this if you ever doubt.” as one side wins and the other loses. One Republic “Till the Love Runs Out.”

  • 815. El Tigre  |  April 23, 2014 at 11:30 am

    “It is ironic isn’t that our anarchists and government have come full circle. Used to be hippies were considered the antithesis of government. Now with Obuma as President, anarchists and BO are joined at the hip and the crewcuts like me will be shooting at the government.”

    Perfect timing:

  • 816. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 3:28 pm

    G I think the days of debate with you are about over because you are deranged.

    The negative stories are also anecdotal lame brain. Neither the negatives nor the positives are “accidental”.

    There was a time when a reasonable discussion could be had with you. Lately you come off like a loon or like you’re not even trying.

    Oh and before you go there I’ll save you the trouble “Hey R, since when do you debate?” :lol:

  • 817. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 3:34 pm

    Dyson of course misses the mark by suggesting only whites benefited from the GI bill but his point still stands. Many whites take their freebies and privileges for granted. Corp welfare a key example.

    It might also be noted that blacks could probably not have gone as far as whites vis-a-vis the GI bill against the backdrop of the racism prevalent at the time.

  • 818. Rutherford  |  April 23, 2014 at 3:37 pm

    “These are stats”. Tigre you’re as stupid as G. The latest stats say ACA will reduce the deficit. Oh I forgot, those stats are lies and only your stats are the truth.

  • 819. El Tigre  |  April 23, 2014 at 4:18 pm

    The stat was the 8 million you disputed yourself, Dumb-Dumb. Not “stories.”

    And I haven’t offered any “stats.

    What’s the matter with you?

  • 820. Tex Taylor  |  April 23, 2014 at 5:00 pm

    The latest stats say ACA will reduce the deficit.

    I’m just curious. How does increasing the Medicaid roll reduce the deficit? Aren’t you intellectually curious, “R?” And healthcare costs continue to escalate…big time.

    Anybody that believes that kind of stuff can’t think past the empty suit. Rutherford, for a gifted guy with the pen, you more than make up the liability side with the inability to reason.

    You mean to tell me you still think Bongo Care benefiting the country in the aggregate? Good grief, six million policies (not people) have lost their insurance, and the shit doesn’t really hit the fan until after the election.

    At least some Dims have the sense to run scared. You head straight at the tornado.

  • 821. Tex Taylor  |  April 23, 2014 at 5:01 pm

    Policy holders…

  • 822. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 7:45 pm

    Dyson’s other point as I saw it is that the GI bill is a form of affirmative action. His shot fails because the GI bill is payment for services rendered, not a gift others deserve.

    To say otherwise implies veterans are getting something others should have. It reflects hidden anti- military bias. Otherwise, he could have made his point without that red herring.

    Yes, blacks benefiting from the GI bill might have fewer advantages than whites, but without quantification we are speculating. General racism is a different issue from benefits deriving from the GI Bill which all veterans earned.

    I agree, most of us get freebies, we probably don’t know are coming our way, but the GI Bill is not free. Veterans paid for it.

  • 823. James  |  April 23, 2014 at 7:49 pm

    Our daughter still has her insurance for now, but she must pay an extra $5,000 per year. Her plight surely is not unique.

  • 824. parker  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:24 pm

    “G I think the days of debate with you are about over because you are deranged. ”

    Who is “G?”

  • 825. Alfie  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:33 pm

    @ Rutherford you are more right than Dyson but then again he is actually talking the Code.
    The misnomer “white privilege ” thing is the kicker in the conversation. It is a false blanket used to explain away realities.
    Rutherford you are very right that post WWII GI Bill benefits could not serve as the socio-economic propellant for blacks as it did whites and that racism was the bottom line issue. Where I get miffed is that a white guy who served and signed up in all the right places for the bennies is supposed to feel guilt of some sort for his reaping “undue privilege “.

  • 826. Alfie  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:37 pm

    @ James you are correct. White, black, tan, or yellow the GI Bill Benefits are not to be seen as a freebie.
    There is data that shows societal racism did impact the effectiveness of the benefits though for blacks.
    Clearly having a housing or college loan available doesn’t mean much if you can’t spend it somewhere.

  • 827. Alfie  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:39 pm

    Not for nothing R but in a recent thread I did serve up a link to the CBO itself stating uncertainty and concern over the ACA economics specifically policy affordability and quality in the 2015-16 stretch.
    There are good and bad stats a’ comin’

  • 828. poolman  |  April 23, 2014 at 8:59 pm

    Who needs government, anyway?

    h/t American Everyman

  • 829. Huck  |  April 24, 2014 at 12:29 am

    Rutherford tweeted: “Ouch David Ignatius says (paraphrase) “Hillary, you’re no John Kerry”. I fully agree.”

    The really sad part about that statement is that Hillary can’t even reach the pathetically low bar being set by Kerry. He is also an utter failure on the foreign policy front. Syria is still using chemical weapons, Russia is still getting ready to roll over Ukraine, and the Israeli-Palestinian negotiations are still a fruitless waste of time.

    John Kerry’s big accomplishment thus far is that no diplomats have died on his watch. He has achieved nothing.

  • 830. James  |  April 24, 2014 at 8:13 am

    Re: the GI Bill.

    The law treated everyone equally as far as I know. Society didn’t. That is not a flaw of the law.It is a trait of society outside of the law.

    White Vietnam ere veterans suffered discrimination. I know because i was one of them. I dropped out to farm because of it.Later, we were placed in a population of protected minorities. At least one university made Vietnam era veterans part of protected politically correct speech,.

    I am certain that non- white Vietnam era veterans suffered discrimination because of their skin color and because they were veterans. To what degree the proportion of race and anti- veteran bias predominated is unknown until someone studies the outcome in detail.

    Therefore to state definitively that society or the law discriminated against dark skinned veterans entirely because of their race is speculation.You honestly can’t cite one without the other. In any event, it had nothing to do with the GI Bill.

    Dyson’s bias was showing,.

  • 831. Alfie  |  April 24, 2014 at 11:54 am

    Re the Census change. I wonder if the real dirty truth is that the 47 million was a lie all along

  • 832. Alfie  |  April 24, 2014 at 1:53 pm

    Just saw where Cliven Bundy is still looking to bask in the spotlight of his fame [infamy]
    I wonder if he thinks the negro should be allowed to grow and or pick cotton on public land.

  • 833. Rutherford  |  April 24, 2014 at 3:10 pm

    James sometimes I wonder why you don’t apply common sense to some of the right wing stuff you read.

    When have you ever heard of kidnappers setting a building on fire? The idea is to get the hostage alive so you have something to trade. Stevens died of smoke inhalation.

    You can’t tell if something doesn’t pass the smell test if your nose is stuffed. Take a decongestant before you read anymore right wing talking points.

  • 834. El Tigre  |  April 24, 2014 at 4:29 pm

    Okay. I’ve read enough.

    Bundy is (1) wrong and (2) nuts. He should not be cheered on.

  • 835. El Tigre  |  April 24, 2014 at 4:37 pm

    “You can’t tell if something doesn’t pass the smell test if your nose is stuffed. Take a decongestant before you read anymore right wing talking points.”


    Pot meet kettle.

    Yeah James, look where mindless adherence to political talking points got your blog host. Don’t be “that” guy. :lol:

  • 836. Tex Taylor  |  April 24, 2014 at 5:54 pm

    Did Bundy really use the term ‘negro?’ LOL. Awwww…oh boy. Fuel for the fire. No wonder folks like Rutherford think there’s a racist hiding around every corner.

    Rutherford, I swear to you on a stack of Obama stickers I don’t know these people, nor do I ever meet these people.

    And here I was lending the sympathetic ear too. Perhaps Alfie and Huck deserved to scold me. I thought Cliven was more like my cousins – good old boys that don’t give anyone a hard time. LOL

    I still agree with the premise, however.

    This crap down in Texas will definitely stoke the flames. And this time, I know the people aren’t nuts as I personally know one of the players. Randy is a man that never goes looking for trouble and just lives his life – but he’s no coward either. In fact, in a fight, he might be one of my life’s personal choices.

  • 837. El Tigre  |  April 24, 2014 at 9:08 pm

    Negro puhleeze.

    R, you plan on offering anything substantive or “introspective?” We’re at 837 and. . .

  • 838. Huck  |  April 24, 2014 at 9:44 pm

    I had to laugh when I read the news this morning.

    A guy who has made his living by using government land, and done so for free the last 2 decades, is going to tell us all about the evils of government subsidies. And that isn’t even beginning to explore whether or not he has benefited from beef subsidies.

    Personally, I think he’s much more a hypocrite than he is a racist.

  • 839. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 12:04 am

    Tigre my next post is too ambitious to spit out quickly. Gotta get time for it.

    BTW I thought you’d appreciate my stuffy nose advice to James.

    Parker, G is the 800lb Goriilla.

  • 840. James  |  April 25, 2014 at 12:11 am

    We just returned home after work last night and twelve hours today preparing and helping with an economic development meeting and dinner.

    I use common sense, Rutherford, I didn’t quote all of the commission,s charges. The kidnapping attempt failed because the organizers lost control of the attack.

    I know the administration’s explanations stink to high heaven. The administration should be forced to defend itself with documentation, but that isn’t happening. Common sense dictates that the charges have some basis in truth because I have read other accounts which support it I don’t know if the allegations are true but they do pass the smell test thanks to the administration’s reticence. Otherwise why is the administration not talking? What are they hiding?

    El Tigre, I need to watch that “mindless adherence to political talking points” or I will have to acknowledge Rutherford as my role model.

  • 841. Tex Taylor  |  April 25, 2014 at 10:01 am

    El Tigre, I need to watch that “mindless adherence to political talking points” or I will have to acknowledge Rutherford as my role model.

    LOL. Good advice for all of us.

    I generally try to invoke that 48 hour rule though I didn’t about Nevada, but Cliven Bundy went an entire week sounding like a patriot, before reverting to David Duke. :smile:

    I about croaked when I heard that ignorant crap come out of Cliven’s mouth. He never struck me as brilliant, even from the git go. But I didn’t believe him stupid either – until yesterday.

  • 842. Alfie  |  April 25, 2014 at 1:30 pm

    Fwiw my final word on Bundy is that if his actions and continued actions sully the good ranchers and the true cause of balancing state sovereignty and stewardship of lands I hope he gets a special seat in hell.
    The lefts editorializing on the news break is crazy as well. I ve seen articles stress his (R) registration among other things. I suppose it is to be expected

  • 843. El Tigre  |  April 25, 2014 at 2:55 pm

    “The lefts editorializing on the news break is crazy as well.”

    No shit. That’s their M.O. though.

    Is anybody on the left really paying attention to Bundy. I know the right is but the left isn’t — at least until now (Oooh, the “Republicans are scaaaaary racists that only Reid, Pelosi and Bo Bo can protect us from.” ).

    I don’t think Bundy captured the essence of the social injustice and conservative comeuppance that captivates the shallow liberal media and mindset — well until Bundy “negroed” his way into their wheelhouse. But I think it’s too late. It needed the racial angle from the outset to get them to care much.

  • 844. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 3:56 pm

    See Tex I told you your principles were fine but you picked the wrong horse. Hey I picked the wrong horse with Trayvon till I figured out he was a thug. Shit happens.

  • 845. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:00 pm

    As usual Tigre I don’t agree. The media paid attention as soon as guns appeared on the scene. Even you can admit the media loves violence as much as it loves racism.

    But I will say until Bundy really stepped in it, the story was tailor made for Fox News.

  • 846. El Tigre  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:22 pm

    You watch t.v. more than I do, so I defer. I just heard the right yammering on and on about it — but don’t recall a whole bunch elsewhere.

    The fact that it took Bundy so long to step in it is the only surprise. He’s an attention seeking, idiot, nut job. Basically a Nevada Joe Biden.

  • 847. El Tigre  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:29 pm

    p.s. I didn’t meant to say it wasn’t covered — just not with the fervor of the usual liberal stroke fests if they think they can validate their dumb narratives.

  • 848. El Tigre  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:35 pm

    This caption covers it:

    “Cliven Bundy Utters Racist Remark, Liberals Everywhere Rejoice”

  • 849. James  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    Bundy’s stupidity muddied the issues of government over reach and over reaction.If they had grounds, they should have put liens on the family bank accounts and tax refunds. I heard Fox reported this a little too enthusiasticly but I don’t know if it is true.

    The AP reports tensions around Ukraine are worsening. Iowa’s secretary of agriculture and I discussed Ukraine at our economic development meeting last night. I think Ukraine can be a major ag producer, and he agrees. US and other companies are loaning farmers money to up grade and to lease more land,

    Unfortunately, political strife and uncertainty are already hurting Ukraine. At least one company will loan less money to Ukrainian farmers until this sorts itself out.

  • 850. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:45 pm

    LOL Excellent quote.

  • 851. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 4:51 pm

    One of the big memes of conservatives is a “return to the good old days”. I’m a bit surprised that so few of you understand why that might send a shiver down a minority’s spine since part of the good old days weren’t all that good.

    Even if we concede that 99% of white conservatives who say it aren’t alluding to race, why would it surprise you that 99% of blacks still hear it? It’s a hot button like no other.

  • 852. dead rabbbit  |  April 25, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    I can agree with that. My partner when I worked corrections was a victim of Jim Crow. He was a very smart dude and could have amounted to much more then being my “assistant” for half the pay. Could he have risen above Jim Crow.?…I guess….but damn….nobody should have to put up with that shit. He once gave me the best tour of Richmond, Virginia. Without really playing the sappy victim….he calmly showed me all the places he wasn’t allowed to go to when he was my age.

  • 853. Rutherford  |  April 25, 2014 at 6:10 pm

    James try as you will there is no defending Bundy. The man was warned repeatedly to pay up for 20 years. He is the one who threatened violence first and then you wonder why the gov showed up prepared.

    The man deserves to be forgotten and we should all move on.